my child hates school

[Raising Little Shoots]

Please can I ask for some thoughts / advice / wisdom please.

My just turned eight year old hates school.

She has always hated school. I haven't taken it personally, but today she was at a woodwork class at a DIY shop & the lady asked her what was her favourite lesson . She replied none. She hates them all. Now I am taking it personally. This is my fault& I really don't know how to fix it.

Mon-Thursday mornings are pretty much the same ; math mammoth, WWE, first language lessons 3, spelling power. We spend approximately 20-30 mins on memory work. Last year we learned CC history song (ancients) this year we are learning the medieval part. She reads aloud from her mcguffey reader.

After lunch, Mon we do science, tues. She goes to grandparents while I go to work. Wed we do SOTW thur we are doing Shakespeare ( this is new this year. We are reading a child's version of a play each term - we have 3 terms.) She has begun to make a theatre for her Shakespeare lessons which I think she enjoyed.

Fri are fun days - field trips, play dates, catch up anything missed in the week, artist study, nature walk.something of that nature.

She is schooled by me, at home with 10 yo sister.

So where am I going wrong?? What could I do to improve how she feels about her work? 

I did feel the material s were a good fit for her, although I know FLL goes over her head a lot of the time...

Forgot to mention we began formal schooling when she turned six. She is very active so I get her to move as much as possible.

TIA!

[Dory]

Does she ever see you get excited to learn something new yourself? I often mention to the kids something new that I'm learning/reading about. I want them to see that a love of learning is something that they can take with them through their whole lives. I also ask them regularly if they are happy with their school and if there's anything they'd like to change. When my youngest told me that he didn't like math anymore cause he didn't like all the siting still, we brain stormed on what we could do to make it less confining for him. There will always be things that cannot be changed, and the kids simply have to learn to push through, but I don't want everything to feel like that for them. If my kid starts acting like he's lost interest in the science subject, I'll make them finish to a ok spot and then let them follow a bunny trail somewhere else for awhile.

 

I would also wonder if she has that attitude about other things.

[elegantlion]

I don't know, my son used to say he hated school. I liked learning, but was never a fan of school. I would probably discuss attitude, talk about schooling being non-negotiable, but not force her to change her opinion. I also wouldn't go out of my way to make it "fun", but I would discuss what subject are the most fun. 

 

I think kids are entitled to their own opinions, no, I wouldn't take it personally, although that can take some work. My opinion is that my son can have whatever opinion he wants about his education. However, he's not allowed to bring a poor attitude to his academics. As he got older we discussed options for subjects, doing some subjects of his choosing and letting him have more choice in planning. 

 

I would also require respect for your time and effort. I would come up with pat answers to those questions about favorite subjects. Not everyone wants the gory details of why you hate something, sometimes they're making conversation. These are the things I tried to teach ds. 

 

At 16 he doesn't hate school, not everything anyway. He's not fond a few subjects, yet can discuss them rationally and understands he has to do them anyway. 

 

Having a kid say they hate school challenges us to look at what we do and be able to explain it in child language. It's also challenged me to be more flexible. Ds does much better when I can convey WHY we study something, even if he doesn't want to. 

[KathyJo]

ElegantLion's response was much more eloquently said than my typical response of "Suck it up, Buttercup."

 

ETA: In our home, we've had seasons like this with various children. It usually has more to do with the child's developmental changes, and not necessarily anything to do with school.

[Dory]

ElegantLion's response was much more eloquently said than my typical response of "Suck it up, Buttercup."

 

ETA: In our home, we've had seasons like this with various children. It usually has more to do with the child's developmental changes, and not necessarily anything to do with school.

 

Lol, Suck it up, Buttercup has been used here too, that and put your big girl panties on and get it done.

[KathyJo]

Lol, Suck it up, Buttercup has been used here too, that and put your big girl panties on and get it done.

 

I don't think my boys would appreciate the latter. ;)

 

Not that they like being called Buttercup.

[Dory]

I don't think my boys would appreciate the latter. ;)

 

Not that they like being called Buttercup.

 

My dd tried it once on her little brother. I had to leave the room so I didn't laugh in front of him.

 

 

A thought, if she is a mover, perhaps you need to put your schedule on a bit of a rotation so that there is a different normal every once in awhile. I can't stand to have the same routine for very long. I end up hating whatever I'm doing even if it's something that I really don't dislike. I just hate too much routine. I need some in my life to get things done, and my oldest has to have a really well organized routine, so we just have a couple different routines that we cycle through to change things up a little.

[Ellie]

Maybe she's a KONOS kind of gal, or a Charlotte Mason kind of gal. Maybe it's WWE that she really dislikes. Maybe it's the 20-30 minutes of memory work. (That would have put off my dc, BTW).

[elegantlion]

ElegantLion's response was much more eloquently said than my typical response of "Suck it up, Buttercup."

 

ETA: In our home, we've had seasons like this with various children. It usually has more to do with the child's developmental changes, and not necessarily anything to do with school.

 

Oh, I use that too. Also, get your a$$ back to class - not at age 8, but now, yes.

[Raising Little Shoots]

Thanks for the replies everyone.

 

WWE - she actually got a buzz from this last week as she has started dictation (our first week back to full schooling)- & she felt proud of herself.  Memory work - well not sure what to say. It is important to *me* & it is the part of the day when I get the most movement in (jumping, clapping, actions etc) Ellie, please may I ask how you teach your dc 'facts' without memory work (or what format does your MW take)

 

Last year I had a revelation that, no, school does not have to be 'fun'. But that she actively *hates* it????

 

She does have interests - she loves to find out about animals & tell me about them for instance - but she does get the chance to do that outside of other schoolwork. I feel it is really important that she gets a good foundation in skills. I do not have the knowledge or time to be coming up with lots of unit studies or what ever to teach skills through (my own grammar, fo example is poor - so I am relying on curriculum to teach that skill) 

 

Thanks everyone for sharing your thoughtsI do appreciate them. I like the 'suck it up, buttercup'!

 

I don't think it helps that all the other HS'ers we know are unschooling....

[Mandylubug]

The 20-30 of memory work would make my girls run the other way. You say you are doing science history and Shakespeare which in itself is ok but HOW are you doing it? Are you requiring papers, tons of writing and reading independently on top of the McGuffey Reader time? You could just be exhausting her and not realize it.

 

Have you considered teaching just science for a month, then just history, then just Shakespeare or whatever. Make it where she isn't juggling so many topics?

[Raising Little Shoots]

not sure it is a developmental stage - she has always hated it! (been schooling since she was six)

[Mandylubug]

Have you considered an unschooling approach on all topics minus math and grammar? Let it be interest led. May allow her to like learning more?

[Raising Little Shoots]

see that is the thing - I do not require lots of writing

 

Science- we are using REAL science earth & space. We do not use the worksheets though - we have begun interactive notebooks - last week she drew a picture to represent what she had learned.

 

History - SOTW II - read the stories, did colouring page, looked on our globe, began our SOTW lap book, which she likes doing (& required 1 dictated sentence)

 

Shakespeare - I read aloud from some picture books about the globe theatre then we brainstormed making a theatre in which we can put on 'mini productions' of the play we are learning about. We have begun to make the theatre & have done the cutting & papier mache part & are up to painting. (plan is to read a few versions of the play, find the main narrative thread & act it out in 60 seconds with paper dolls - I got this idea from the BBC website)

 

so no, very VERY little writing....

[KathyJo]

I'll confess that we've never done a lot of memory work.  :blushing: However, all of my boys walk around all day long giving me facts they've memorized. Not all of them are the kinds of facts that I care about them memorizing, however, they do pick up a surprising amount just from reading. Around here, if a subject can be covered by reading a lot, that's how we do it. And since they go through the WTM cycle three times, and mostly read books that they're interested in reading, an amazing amount sticks.

[Mandylubug]

It sounds like you are doing a good job but I know if mine hated school so much I'd be changing something.

 

If she hates it so, what would she rather be doing? If she coukd choose to skip school work, where does her heart take her?

[KathyJo]

It sounds like you are doing a good job but I know if mine hated school so much I'd be changing something.

 

If she hates it so, what would she rather be doing? If she coukd choose to skip school work, where does her heart take her?

 

I would want to find out why, and yeah, find out what she'd rather be doing. Knowing THAT, I'd then be able to decide whether I needed to change things, or whether she just needed to suck it up.

[maize]

When I have a resistant child (young child, I would probably approach things differently with a teenager) I back off on all requirements except for the very basics, try to give them more choice, and let them have some time to engage in their own pursuits within healthy limits (around here that means primarily that their days cannot be digitized).

[Raising Little Shoots]

Mandylubug - yes, something needs to change. I am going to have a good chat with her, observe her & take it from there

 

thanks again everyone. Please keep talking to me :)

[8filltheheart]

Have you asked her what she would like to learn about? Incorporating their interests does not have to mean complicated unit studies or unschooling. It can, however, be inspiring for them. (My kids have a lot of influence over what they study, but we are very far removed from unschooling.)

 

It can be as simple as a stroll through the library's science section letting her select the books to read. Or giving her multiple titles for history or literature to choose from. It could be allowing her to choose a poem to memorize and illustrate or dramatize. There are so many ways to let them have their personalities shine forth in ways that inspire them and in no way interfere with basic foundational skills, but firmly lay a foundation bc they are engaged in learning the material.

[happypamama]

I'm sorry this is frustrating you so much!  It sounds like you've put a lot of effort into what you've chosen to use, and how you're choosing to use it, and it is very disheartening when your child just doesn't have the same love for the materials that you do.

 

I think you're right to be examining what you might need to change, if anything.  I like 8FillTheHeart's suggestion of asking her what she wants to learn.  And some choices -- even if it's "do you want to read book A or book B?," it can still feel like they have some control.  

 

What does make her eyes light up?  I'd incorporate that as much as possible.  Does she like the computer?  If so, maybe you can find some games to cover math and geography for a while, so that they're more fun.  (Sheppardsoftware.com has a lot of good stuff.)  Or if your library subscribes to Mango Language (if they do, it should be free for you), maybe she'd enjoy learning a language.

 

30 minutes of memory work seems like a lot to me.  We typically spend 5-10 minutes over breakfast doing memory work, and that's for three (sometimes four) kids.  That's still getting some science vocabulary, a few Bible verses, and some other stuff (right now, they're memorizing the books of the Bible in order) into their brains.

 

We do a lot of reading aloud, especially before about age 10, so if you're not already doing that for history (even SOTW), you might give it a shot.  Even if she is a solid reader, she might just prefer to listen than to read herself, and to a degree, I think that's very reasonable.

 

I would have no problem with just putting a few subjects on hold for a while, maybe until January or so, in order that she doesn't feel overwhelmed.  Also, I suggest this all the time, but perhaps a workbox approach might help?  I like it because it's organized, for one, but also, it is a very clear visual of what they still need to do.  Even though I'm the one who fills the workboxes each night, I think the boxes remove me from the equation a bit -- the boxes are right there for them to see, rather than it feeling like I'm pulling out book after book and piling work on them.

 

It could just be that she says she hates things because working on new material can be hard work, and some kids are resistant to that.  And then I try to make it easy when I can (like doing things orally if possible), but I also have no problem saying, sometimes, "Sorry, but this is what you need to do."

[sbgrace]

I think some kids just really want to do their own thing. Some kids forget what they enjoyed once they stop the whatever it was. Some kids are just generally negative, etc.

 

But, particularly if she's not a negative child generally, I would tinker. I could make suggestions, but my boys are likely different than her. I would say that if she really resists x or y, I would change it if I at all could. IMO, there is little that can't be postponed/ must be learned at 8. Beyond that those things that are musts can probably be changed up to make it more tolerable, even if it means it's slower or different than ideal. One specific thing--does she like the science/nature documentaries, like BBC? If so, can you pull those in and call them school? Maybe you could  make science more of an interest led nature oriented thing without more effort than your current program.

 

This is entirely a curiosity question--does she still remember the things that were memory work at 6? Do you regularly recycle memory work to keep it fresh or she just retains? I'm thinking with 30 minutes you are probably pulling in review?

[AimeeM]

I know it's popular among the homeschool crowd to propose if a child dislikes "school", you're doing it wrong.

I call foul. Not all children enjoy school. No matter what you DO, children are individuals, with their own personalities, likes and dislikes; this includes their like or dislike of academics. For some children, this is life long, for others it's only a season in their life. <---- this was my eldest; no matter how many extracurriculars I scheduled, no matter how much money I spent or how many times I changed curriculum, approach, or presentation, she simply wanted NOTHING to do with school. My middle boy, on the other hand, eats up anything academic related.

Relax. It sounds like you've done everything you can, short of saying "fine, study only what you want, when you want" (which is NOT something I recommend).

[Sisyphus]

My 12 yo Ds hates school. He does his work, willingly if not happily, but he doesn't enjoy it. I tried for years to find fun! Engaging! Child led! Stuff to use. His preference is actually Calvert, because he likes having it all laid out, check it off, done.

 

I feel like a hs failure sometime, but it is what it is. He doesn't read either, unless for school. He doesn't enjoy it.

 

He's getting an education, and he isn't unreasonable about any of this, he just doesn't like school, schoolwork, or anything except his pursuit of physical activities. It's just who he is. If tomorrow he could choose to be done with school, even knowing a 7th grade education will get you nowhere, he'd probably do it.

 

Thankfully my oldest is a passionate lover of all things academic, so there's that to fall back on.

[matrips]

My kids went through a phase of this at one time. I know, not the same. But I went subject by subject to find out why they didn't like it, listing pros and cons. End result, surprising them and me, was that they were actually fine with the subjects and materials, but they did have some suggestions. They wanted to change up the order we did things, they wanted add in a fun subject or two (even though they knew it would make the day longer; we did it on a rotation basis instead of every one each day), they wanted to have a better schedule to know when they would be done, they wanted to schedule some field trips, and they wanted a recess and snack. All in all, workable suggestions. I tried to implement them, they were happier at having a say, and they realized it wasn't really the work or books they were hating.

 

Not sure if it'll be that easy for you, but might be worthwhile to really discuss with her if you haven't.

[happyhomemaker]

Maybe you could break up the memory work into shorter segments. We do memory work, but I do our science memory stuff right before our science lesson, Bible verse and catechism before Bible, etc. We might do 20 min of memory work, but it's in chunks of 5 min or less. Freedom to choose some things- even which lit book to read next- really helped my ds who didn't like school.

 

I don't agree with changing everything just because of complaining, but it is a good idea to try to ferret out the "why" behind her feelings. It might be that she hears that her friends don't do much work and feels like it's unfair or that she is overly frustrated about some things that could indicate a problem. The former would get a "suck it up" answer- along with some explanation of different types of school, the latter needs more investigating.

 

Ds hated math in first grade. I told him to suck it up (not in those words, but still...). Then one day we talked about it and I realized he was bored out of his mind because the material was too easy. We did some skipping and switching and he was a happy camper. Not to say this will be your experience. Just to say sometimes you discover surprising things when you talk it through.

[cholderby]

It must be hard to be in school with an older sister who always knows more then you. She needs to find her "thing". Once she has found her "area of expertise", she'll hit her stride.

 

My 8yo says that he hates school all the time. He really means "I'd rather be playing video games". Then I, too, say "suck it up". :)

[PeterPan]

She is very active so I get her to move as much as possible.

TIA!

I'll go back and read the other replies to see if you added anything, but I have a few observations.  One,  you said she's very active.  You do know that adhd exists and that sometimes that's what you're seeing, right?  There's a point where it crosses over from normal to wow, there's something going on here.  And they say 80% of the time "adhd" in girls actually turns out to be CAPD, meaning even further evals should be going on.  I'm NOT saying go to the ped and put your kid on meds.  I'm saying if her behavior is not developmentally typical, there's a point where you start asking why.

 

Two, you're taking things too literally.  When she says she doesn't like school, it could be a mismatch in materials/methods/child, absolutely, but it can also simply be that it's not what she wants to be doing.  Unfortunately, the latter brings you back to point one (possibility there's a reason) and the mismatch.

 

Three, my kid spent a lot of years saying that, and there were a lot of reasons, not just one.  I suggest you open your mind up to some changes and investigating.  I'm doing a lot better this 2nd time around and my ds LOVES school, but I get it now, I get how to do it and keep him engaged and still get where we need to be.  And just as your word to the wise, almost nothing on the list you're using is what I'd use with a very active kinesthetic learner.  Not that my opinion matters, but I'm just saying having btdt, I look at your list and see a bunch of b&w dull dry workbooks for everything, bleh.  There is a certain type of dc who does well following WTM, and there are other types of kids where you need to take the ideas and concepts of WTM (that can be really good, honest!) and BUST THEM OUT.   :smash:

 

Don't get locked in a box.  I DON'T agree with the suck it up buttercup crap, because the kid is 6.  These kids are not pavlov's dogs that we put bells on and teach them to obey mindlessly.  They're HUMANS and they have opinions and souls that we can either choose to work WITH or against.  You've got to figure out what you're working with.  Maybe she's just a very stubborn child with absolutely nothing clinical or diagnosable or different going on.  But maybe she's got something going on that you could get with the program about, get diagnosed, get the evals, and learn how to connect with her better.  

 

Maybe none of that applies.  I'll go read what you said.  

[PeterPan]

...please may I ask how you teach your dc 'facts' without memory work (or what format does your MW take)

 

...She does have interests - she loves to find out about animals & tell me about them for instance - but she does get the chance to do that outside of other schoolwork. I feel it is really important that she gets a good foundation in skills. I do not have the knowledge or time to be coming up with lots of unit studies or what ever to teach skills through (my own grammar, fo example is poor - so I am relying on curriculum to teach that skill) 

 

Some kids cannot memorize without context.  

 

You're making this way too hard.  You don't have to direct the content-learning of a 6 yo, only the skills.  You KNOW this, but you're missing how easy this can be.  You set her up with either a reading log (read 1 book on a science topic and 1 book of fiction a week, log by making an illustration and writing one sentence about it, whatever).  For skills, you USE WHAT SHE'S INTO.  If she's into scanning electron microscopy of bugs (super cool, we have books on this), then you pick up that book she's reading, show her the picture, and dictate a sentence from that book!  THAT'S her dictation for the day, NOT that sample from WWE.  Bleh, pleh, puke.  

 

PLEASE change things up.  WWE was written as a convenience for people who didn't want to select models.  It's NOT some perfect, unskippable progression.  Kids do not ride on a conveyor belt filling their minds with prescribed facts: 1 can of this, 2 cans of that.  My lands!  She's a human with a soul, and she has things she's interested in.  So her dictation, readers, everything can stem from that.  It's not a unit study, because a unit study is *you* trying to drive *her* content.  She doesn't need that.  She already knows how to find the content she wants.  All she needs is for you to figure out how to work on the SKILLS in a way that is connected to what she's already thinking about.  Then you'll have the engagement you want.  

 

Blow her mind.  Try it.   :)

 

PS.  Do less school work.  You're probably doing too much and keeping her from pursuing her interests.  Do less work that is formal with her and give her more time to herself.  Call THAT school, and then she can go around saying she loves school.  She can't love school when you segregate out the stuff she self-studies and call it invalid and worthless.  So carve her more time for it, validate it as awesome, CALL IT SCHOOL, and show her that homeschooling IS the reason she gets time to pursue that interest.  Right now she thinks homeschooling is KEEPING her from that interest.

[KathyJo]

 I DON'T agree with the suck it up buttercup crap, because the kid is 6.  These kids are not pavlov's dogs that we put bells on and teach them to obey mindlessly.  They're HUMANS and they have opinions and souls that we can either choose to work WITH or against.  You've got to figure out what you're working with.  Maybe she's just a very stubborn child with absolutely nothing clinical or diagnosable or different going on.  But maybe she's got something going on that you could get with the program about, get diagnosed, get the evals, and learn how to connect with her better.  

 

First, the child is 8. Sometimes 8 year olds need to be told to suck it up.

 

Second, you can disagree with me, but to call my opinion "crap" was uncalled for. If you can't be nice, then at least don't drag me into your drama.

[LLMom]

I have been homeschooling a long time (18 years), and it use to bother me something awful to hear my child hated school.  I bent over backwards to figure out why, to change it, etc.  I finally realized that some of them just don't like it.  I now take the suck it up approach. 

[RootAnn]

FWIW, my kids really enjoy their memory work time. That said, I cover two kids worth of memory stuff in 15 minutes. (Last year, I covered three in 15 minutes, but the oldest is separated out this year & hers takes 5-15 minutes depending on if I cover her flashcards for Spanish/Latin in addition to poem, religion, logic, science, etc.)

 

My kids definitely have their "favorite" subject(s). One of my kids is more compliant and "easy" to school than the others. I've modified *how* we do certain subjects and taken their opinion into consideration in terms of materials. My dd#2 would skip math completely except for one day a week of "fun math" if I gave her the option. My dd#3 would do math, crafts/art, and memory and call it good. All three girls would exclude little brother (ds#1) from history if they had their way. There is always something they have to complain about. You can only do so much with the time, money, and effort within you. 

 

I think it is fine to have discussions with the kids about what you are doing/using. I like the "end of the year" eval Merry does. But I also agree not to take it personally if they don't like schoolwork.

 

Good luck!

[Chrysalis Academy]

My 2nd grader is very strong willed and opinionated.  She would hate school if I approached it as directively as I do with her older sister, who is much more easy-going and happy to do whatever I assign her.  I have chosen to be very flexible in honor of this - both in what we do, and in how we do it.

 

So, she has to do math.  She has to do 2 pages of MM every day.  But then, she gets to choose whether or not to do LOF.

 

She has to do writing.  We do WWE right now, and she does not love it.  We talk about why she's doing it and what she's learning from it.  I also got a different program (CAP's W&R) because I think she will like it more.  I am willing to be flexible about how she does writing, but not whether she does it.

 

She has to do phonics & spelling.  We're using LOE.  She says she hates this.  So, I"m being flexible - instead of doing every single exercise, we're just doing the phonics & spelling part.  I teach her the grammar by analyzing her sentences during writing, so we're only doing about half of each lesson.  It's the one thing she says she really hates, so I'm being flexible by minimizing the time we spend on it - but yeah, she does have to suck it up and get 'er done every day.  I work with her, she works with me.

 

She loves read alouds, but she loves  it even more when she gets to pick the book - so I give her 3 to choose from every time.

 

I had this fantasy of a world geography study we'd do this year, and she was not interested.  She's not interested in ancient history a la SOTW.  So, we're not doing that for now.  She is interested in horses, so we read tons of library books on horses.  She loves science, so we get a big stack of books from the libarary and she gets to choose one for me to read to her every day.  When she chooses, she's willing.  When I insist, she hates it.

 

 

The pattern here is, I give her choices wherever possible and I'm really flexible about the stuff that doesn't matter too much at this stage in her education (who cares if a 2nd grader studies a particular topic in history?  there is plenty of time), but I expect cooperation on the must-dos.  I don't tell her to suck it up, but I do tell her that I have to do lots of things I don't like to, also, like cleaning the bathroom.  And that you can do anything for just 10 minutes a day.  I think this is a good life lesson.  

 

[Kim in Appalachia]

my 8 year old hates school too.  And I'm sure he would hate "real" school even more.  He wants to play outside and play video games.  He doesn't want to be told what to do, by anyone.  

 

All of my kids have hated school at one time or another.  Don't take it personally, sounds like she's a normal kid. 

[kwg]

I just briefly read through the responses so sorry if this is a repeat but you mentioned that FLL seems to be going over her head.  We started The Sentence Family and it is so much fun!  My 6 year old asks to do it every day! lol.  He is young for it, so I do not worry if he "gets it" yet-tagalong with older brother - but maybe you could check that out for some fun grammar.

 

 

My kids say that hate school too.  Don't know what to tell you about that one.  The funny thing is he is regularly called  nerd or egghead (in a good way) and people are impressed with his knowledge and vocabulary. kids.

[lea1]

My two almost-eight-YO sons both say they hate school at times and they have since day 1, although one more than the other. The funny thing is that at other times he will say he really loves school, so I'm not sure what to believe. I know he loves history and we do a lot of that and he also loves to read which we also do a lot of.

 

Just a couple of days ago I told them I was starting to plan for 3rd grade, which they will start in January (for everything but Math) and I wanted to hear what they like and dislike about what we are doing now. We talked through each of the things we are using and discussed pros and cons and they both ended up saying they like what we are doing and wanted to stick with it. One of them said he didn't like how we do so much of FLL out loud. After I explained that the alternative is to do more of it in writing, he wanted to stick with FLL. I was really surprised that, after hearing how much they hate school for a couple of years now, they really don't hate what we are doing so much after all.

 

I think when they say they hate school, what they are really saying is that we hate that we can not play all day and do whatever we want, play with friends, play with Legos, watch movies, play video games, etc. If they have to do anything that takes them away from these things they love to do, then they hate it.

 

I think you should talk to her about each subject and ask her what she likes and doesn't like, discuss the pros and cons of doing it that way or using an alternative. You both might find out she doesn't hate it as much as she thinks she does.

[Garga]

My kids went through a phase of this at one time. I know, not the same. But I went subject by subject to find out why they didn't like it, listing pros and cons. End result, surprising them and me, was that they were actually fine with the subjects and materials, but they did have some suggestions. They wanted to change up the order we did things, they wanted add in a fun subject or two (even though they knew it would make the day longer; we did it on a rotation basis instead of every one each day), they wanted to have a better schedule to know when they would be done, they wanted to schedule some field trips, and they wanted a recess and snack. All in all, workable suggestions. I tried to implement them, they were happier at having a say, and they realized it wasn't really the work or books they were hating.

 

Not sure if it'll be that easy for you, but might be worthwhile to really discuss with her if you haven't.

That's exactly what I was going to say. Exactly.

[Pen]

What does she love?  Or at least like?  What does she hate about school?  What would *she* do to make school better?

[Raising Little Shoots]

Thank you again everyone for the responses. I have skimmed through them because I am supposed to be prepping for this mornings work ;)

 

Just to confirm what KathyJo said, she has just turned 8. She was 6 when she started school.

 

She does very little writing for school - we do most of FLL orally - I do the writing for her. She writes the sentence in WWE - perhaps a sentence for history (1x wk) 

 

Memory work, she probably 'enjoys' most - it is quick paced & active

 

Given her choice - I think she would play on the computer/ watch TV. She enjoys being outdoors & bug hunting :) I make time for this during the week. We go for a big family walk 1 or 2 times a week. I would like to make this happen every day, but I also work part time, so it would be difficult.

 

I have tried to follow her interests before - we looked at frogs. I read to her, she enjoyed that. We kept tadpoles (do that every year anyway) she loved that. She still didn't want to write, or do any maths surrounding frogs :) She wanted to colour in quite a 'cartoonish' print out of a frog. That wasn't really my idea of an education for a 7 yr old

 

We work as much as possible in 15 min chunks (have a sand timer) She just doesn't like it.

 

Going to chat with her this morning & will report back...

 

Thnks again for the support. It is great to be able to vent & not be told to just 'unschool' & let her do what she wants to all day...(watch tv!)

[Raising Little Shoots]

OhElizabeth

 

thanks for sharing your thoughts. Yes, I do think she perhaps is on the 'spectrum' She is very similar to myself at her age. Getting a diagnosis is tricky in the UK, because she is not in school. I am not clear what the benefit would be - I take her very much as I find her, my lovely, active, very literal child.

 

I confess to feeling somewhat berated by your comments. I care very much about the education of my daughters. That is why I homeschool. As an example, I use WWE because I can pull it out & use it, I don't have to prep ahead & plan copy work/dictation. I work part time & as much as I would *love* to follow the example you gave for c/w/dic it is too much for me right now. Life has been exhausting the last few years, with school, work & a very serious illness my husband has been through.

 

Perhaps being exhausted is making me feel a little sensitive. I appreciate that 'tone of voice' is missing from a post on a message board.

[thebacabunch]

Hang in there, mama!  Homeschool is not the easy, quick, bed of roses many think it is.  Give yourself a pat on the back.  Learning is hard and it stretches us.  A certain level of discomfort while learning is expected.  I look for this. If things are too easy and require little thought or effort I change things up for my kids.

 

If she likes to be moving, have you tried giving her an exercise ball to use as a chair?  That is a simple change that makes a big difference.  Also if she likes computer time she can do some things on the computer for school.  I love the quizlet site for some memory work.  My kids would tell everyone they don't like school.  It is the rare kid who likes it in my opinion.  If she likes to be read to I would read to her every day.  With my 8 year old I read a book to her every day.  We read a different book together every day and she reads a chapter in a book of her choice every day.  She doesn't like to write anything so we write stories of unicorns.  If  fll is over your dd's head you are at a level that is too high for her. My dd is in 3rd grade and we are on level 2 because that is where she is.  It is no big deal.  The lessons are virtually the same, but a little deeper each year.  I am curious about the 30 minutes of memory work also.  My kids love memorizing poetry and so we do that.  I don't have them memorize a lot of other things, just math facts, Latin and Greek roots, a few important paragraphs from things like the constitution,  the states and their capitals, etc.  I would have a bloody revolt on my hands, lol, with 30 minutes of memory work.  BTW, my dd is a diagnosed high functioning autistic and I am happy to share my few hits and numerous misses anytime you would like.  I have deep respect for all parents who work hard to homeschool their kids.  It is hard.   It is thankless.  You are a superhero.  (ps, WWE is a lifesaver as I don't have time to come up with my own copywork either.  It is not her favorite but I have noticed that her comprehension is so much better as is her handwriting).

[thebacabunch]

PS, I agree with the feeling you have of being berated, btw.  Some people are blessed with lots of time and really precocious learners.  I was in honors classes in silicon valley as a jr high and  high schooler and our kids do need some rigor and the unpleasantness of studying things they don't like or curriculum that isn't hand picked and rewritten for them, to have any chance of being able to keep up.  It isn't practical or realistic to do less and to be child led on the small bits they do.  I know what our kids are competing with.  They have to do things they don't like.  Period.  If we stumble across a curriculum that is a bit fun and engaging as well as teaching what they need to know we are doing well.

[thebacabunch]

Sorry, me again.  Are frogs a special interest for your dd?  You might try getting frog stickers or frog shaped gummies and using those as rewards for her work.  My dd goes through a lot of pony and unicorn stickers. 

 

[Raising Little Shoots]

thebacabunch

 

Thank you *so* much for sharing your ideas & encouragement. You have given me a lot of food for thought & I really appreciate it. I am certainly looking for some frog stickers for a start.

 

so, we have just had a family breakfast meeting. Here is how it went:

 

she just says she hates it, because she doesn't like some of it :o

 

Maths - she finds tricky. This I know. It can take 15 mins to do say, 1/8th page from MM g2. That is ok for me, we just plug on through. We use beans, abacus etc to help every day. She has to be able to move stuff still to work stuff out.

 

Memory Work - she loves :)

 for those who a re curious, here is what we are doing

 

All the world's a stage from As You Like It - 7 verses.. We are up to 3 verses at present.  She likes this - she gets to act the 'mewling & puking' infant & the creeping like a snail schoolboy :)

Months of the year (she still doesnt know them) we clap them out

some of the grammar definitions from FLL3 - 4 or 5 of them - we made up our own songs / chants & hand movements

Skip counting by 3's - she hops like a frog 

moon phases - we made a flap book type thing & just review 4 x week

review continents- the girls test each other ;)

planets - they get to say 'your anus' so they love it :o is this just my kids lol!!!!????

review previous years

takes 20-30 mins including distractions. She loves it though, so not  changing! lol!

 

Grammar - too long she says. I think the last lesson went on r-e-a-l-l-y long! so that is in her head. Will keep my eye on this. we do most of this orally & I often write for her, so will persevere.

 

timeline & history song. She loves

 

spelling ok

 

reading. she doesn't like the book - boring - mc guffey - so we will alternate - one day mcguffey, next day her choice.

 

WWE - she says hard. I am interpreting that as 'requires effort'

 

Xtra maths. ok-ish

 

Science - she loves it!

 

History - she loves

 

Shakespeare - she loves it!!! when can she work on the theatre she is making with her sister some more :) she is excited to perform the paper doll play!

 

So I guess not too bad :) I am feeling quite relieved right now.

 

Forgot to add - we generally have read aloud time on my bed for 30-60mins per night when I get home from work, then she goes off to bed. We read both fiction & non fiction. On thurs we have 'poetry supper' & read just poetry & have a special snack. She *adores* this.

[FriedClams]

I agree with earlier posters who talked about respect and politeness in her answers toward strangers.

 

One thing that may be an issue, as it was with my kids when they were younger, is that they never knew when the "school day" was over. I love the idea of constant learning, reading literature, etc.... but for them it was a never ending day. They never had a clue that they could work hard and get out to play, because there was always some other "enriching" activity to fill their time when we were done early. I thought it was wonderful, they were miserable. It seemed to them that there was always something new popping up - an academic whack-a-mole as it were.

 

So - enter the work list. I publish a list every Monday of what's due that week. Nothing gets added to it. I can erase things, the kids cannot. They LOVE having a finish line and we still get a ton of enrichment done. I don't care if they get it done in a day or 5. That's the list. We're all much, much happier. No surprises, no whack-a-mole.

[Chris in VA]

I answered on your other thread. :-)

 

So good to hear your update--I think you are doing a bang up job! 

[foxbridgeacademy]

I would put it down to the age and that her HS friends are unschooling.  It sounds like you have a fun day with lots of learning.  The memory work should be made fun (you said singing/dancing?) perfect age for that.  I would cut any Lang Arts into small increments, like grammar is NOT followed by Spelling. Start at 15 minutes per topic, spelling, grammar, dictation, vocab, whatever it is that you do.  MM is known for having a lot of problems.  Pick a few to illustrate the lesson (do these with her) then give her a few to do on her own.  If she has trouble come back and do a couple more with her.  The ones you didn't do are good to use later for review.  As for WWE, no disrespect intended but my children hated it.  We used the Workbook and they hated the literature choices mainly.  Maybe you can find something she likes to read and narrate that?  Save the WWE for only 1-2 times a week? Spelling, at that age we played "Mother May I" with our spelling words, having 2 kids helps because they get to be a bit competitive. Mine also test each other on their words (separate word lists) so I sneakily get double work out of them.

[Pen]

My comments interspersed...

thebacabunch

 

Thank you *so* much for sharing your ideas & encouragement. You have given me a lot of food for thought & I really appreciate it. I am certainly looking for some frog stickers for a start.

 

so, we have just had a family breakfast meeting. Here is how it went:

 

she just says she hates it, because she doesn't like some of it :o

 

 

 

Maths - she finds tricky. This I know. It can take 15 mins to do say, 1/8th page from MM g2. That is ok for me, we just plug on through. We use beans, abacus etc to help every day. She has to be able to move stuff still to work stuff out.

 

My ds is pretty good at math, but did not especially like MM, even though I think it is an excellent program.   Maybe something else would be a better fit for her--one of the advantages of homeschooling is to be able to find great fits, sometimes.   You could perhaps let her try out things on computer.  Mathematical Reasoning/Math Detective (possibly with computerized options if she likes computer and you do not mind it), MEP, Singapore, MUS, Teaching Textbooks.... and on and on, there are many programs with different ways of doing things that might fit her better.

 

Memory Work - she loves :)   Hurray!  and maybe she can practice saying that as an answer to "what is your favorite subject", or answer history or science which would make more sense to most people..

 for those who a re curious, here is what we are doing

 

All the world's a stage from As You Like It - 7 verses.. We are up to 3 verses at present.  She likes this - she gets to act the 'mewling & puking' infant & the creeping like a snail schoolboy :)  Lovely--this gives you more to build on in that it also means she like drama and acting which could be used in various subjects.

Months of the year (she still doesnt know them) we clap them out

some of the grammar definitions from FLL3 - 4 or 5 of them - we made up our own songs / chants & hand movements

Skip counting by 3's - she hops like a frog 

moon phases - we made a flap book type thing & just review 4 x week

review continents- the girls test each other ;)

planets - they get to say 'your anus' so they love it :o is this just my kids lol!!!!????

review previous years

takes 20-30 mins including distractions. She loves it though, so not  changing! lol!

 

Grammar - too long she says. I think the last lesson went on r-e-a-l-l-y long! so that is in her head. Will keep my eye on this. we do most of this orally & I often write for her, so will persevere.   MCT is a very sweet program to read with children as a read aloud and can work well for grammar.

 

timeline & history song. She loves  Great!

 

spelling ok

 

reading. she doesn't like the book - boring - mc guffey - so we will alternate - one day mcguffey, next day her choice.  I

 

I also think McCuffey is boring.   Can she just read from things she chooses at her level all days?  My son does this and has become a very good reader at this point, even having started with reading difficulties.

 

WWE - she says hard. I am interpreting that as 'requires effort'     WWE  is excellent, but it was not a good fit for us.  Maybe it is not a good fit for her either.

 

Xtra maths. ok-ish  Do you mean the computer thing for math facts?  Maybe try www.Sumdog.com instead.  It is way way more fun my son says.

 

Science - she loves it!  Great!!!  Now ask her to please say so when someone asks about favorite subject!

 

History - she loves  Great!!!  Great!!!  Now ask her to please say so when someone asks about favorite subject!

 

Shakespeare - she loves it!!! when can she work on the theatre she is making with her sister some more :) she is excited to perform the paper doll play!  Great!!!  Now ask her to please say so when someone asks about favorite subject!

 

So I guess not too bad :) I am feeling quite relieved right now.

 

Forgot to add - we generally have read aloud time on my bed for 30-60mins per night when I get home from work, then she goes off to bed. We read both fiction & non fiction. On thurs we have 'poetry supper' & read just poetry & have a special snack. She *adores* this.  

 

This makes me think she might like  MCT for grammar and Brave Writer for writing, and just good books (not McG.) for reading.

 

 

:hurray: It actually sounds like things are quite good and may get even better for having had this convers :hurray: ation.

 

ETA:  Zaner Bloser had decent grammar program also.

And we have more recently been using Editor in Chief, and other Critical Thinking Press materials for grammar.

[mommymonster]

On maths, because my son has a hard, hard time with his attitude (similar sounding to your daughter):

 

We started with MM, and he had a hard time on two fronts -- there was too much on the page for him and there were too many problems. We ended up switching to Singapore (which still is requiring some work). If I had to do it again, I would have covered up half the page and made him do less problems. 

 

We set a timer for me to do a lesson (5 min) and then 15 minutes for problems, with the understanding that he has to be engaged and not flopping around on the floor whining. If he keeps it together during the 20 minutes, we do a game as a "reward" -- usually Zeus on the Loose, Sum Swamp, Presto Change-o, War, or Checkers. In any case, it has improved his math attitude. Somewhat. If that fails, I resort to mini chocolate chips and mini M&Ms. I need chocolate some days to get through. Apparently, so does he. 

[Raising Little Shoots]

Pen, thank you for taking the time to make those recommendations - I shall be looking into them.