I don't get the Miley Cyrus debacle from VMA's.

[Samiam]

Yes, I watched her performance.  Yes, it was gross...sexually explicit....not even sure if she sings well.  Her outfits were horrifying.  Her makeup and hair....a beautiful girl ruined.  I get all that.  If that's all the debacle was about, okay, I agree.  But people are acting is if Miley is the next Lindsey Lohan, and just turned to pure evil.

 

But here's the thing....it's SHOW BUSINESS.  It's a PERFORMANCE.   It's not by far the yuckiest  performance put on at these types of shows.  It's been like this for years.  Madonna raised eyebrows when I was a teenager, with her "Like a Virgin" performance.   Years later, Madonna and Britney Spears kissed and gyrated.  Britney, for that matter, had a similiar debacle, when she first tried to break out of that "teenager" to "adult" star..and thus wore the apparently mandated skimpy outfit while gyrating on stage.

 

So I get the performance itself was eh.   But what I don't get is the big uproar I see all over FB and the news..."poor girl is lost"..."she needs help"...etc....as if this performance is part of her personal life.   It's part of the business....to keep your name out there.

 

I mean, from what I've seen of her personal interviews, she's seems pretty grounded for a millionaire famous 19 year old raised in the public eye.  I don't read articles about her out partying all the time, aka Lindsey Lohan.   I mean, I've seen pics, etc where she goes out...that's normal for a 19 year old...but it doesn't seem excessive.

 

And the whole "she was an idol for my 13 year old daughter, my baby LOVES Hannah Montana and this performance just RUINS that."....I don't get that either...I mean, Miley hasn't done HM for a few years now..and in those years, she's done nothing but try to break away from the HM mold and show she's growing up....with alot of risque photo shoots, music about drug use, her music videos are close to R-rated,  and just overall "normal 19 year old trying to find her way" type choices.  So THIS one performance is what finally indicated that she's not exactly role model material?  I mean, why is an actor ever role model material???

 

I just don't get why this one business move, this performance, has people in an uproar about how Miley is going down the wrong road, turned evil, disappointing, etc on a personal level.

[Whereneverever]

I posted a thread just a min ago with a link to an article about different concerns about her performance. http://thoughtcatalog.com/2013/cultural-appropriation-is-a-bigger-problem-than-miley-cyrus/

 

Short version being that there were issues of cultural appropriation that most people aren't talking about at all.

[Mrs Mungo]

And the whole "she was an idol for my 13 year old daughter, my baby LOVES Hannah Montana and this performance just RUINS that."....I don't get that either...I mean, Miley hasn't done HM for a few years now..and in those years, she's done nothing but try to break away from the HM mold and show she's growing up....with alot of risque photo shoots, music about drug use, her music videos are close to R-rated,  and just overall "normal 19 year old trying to find her way" type choices.  So THIS one performance is what finally indicated that she's not exactly role model material?  I mean, why is an actor ever role model material???

 

My analysis?

 

I'm not saying actors and/or musicians should be role models. BUT, if they are being marketed as role models for young girls? And they make buckets of money from being a role model for young girls? I guess those people who invested their cash in that character feel a little betrayed.

 

I am not sure most parents really pay a WHOLE lot of attention to what their kids are listening too. Maybe they didn't know she was singing songs about drug use/shooting risqué videos/etc until now. This girl isn't even old enough to drink. Madonna was rolling around on the floor at 26 and barely flashed her underpants. Miley is wearing underpants that her butt were hanging out of. Miley was grinding on a guy almost twice her age. She looks so young that it makes him look like a creeper. I don't know. The Madonna thing was almost 30 years ago. It's clear that more outrageous=more attention and more attention=more money. So many young talents don't seem to think of their overall career in a bigger sense. 

[Mergath]

I had to google twerking.

 

I'm old.

[sparrow]

I had to google twerking.

 

I'm old.

 

This is exactly what I took away from it as well.

[I.Dup.]

I'm not sure many people that have semi-followed the trajectory of her career are all that surprised. But this was a complete train wreck, beyond what any one could have imagined. She has officially made herself look and act like a meth whore. It's sad, really.

 

It's the parents' own fault if they let these types be "role models" for their kids, and I get that she's rebelling from that (above and beyond, we get it Miley, really we do). It shouldn't be her responsibility to be our kids' role model, she has said that rather poignantly in the past. Hopefully this will be a wake up call for parents, but I doubt it.

[DianeW88]

From a PR standpoint...this stunt was GENIUS!  She's the only thing people are talking about today.  Big win for Miley and her handlers.

[Sisyphus]

I thought "twerk" was a silly way to say "work", which all the dancers at my nieces studio yell at each other while dancing. So I saw some shorts with "twerk" on them in a dance shop and mentioned to Ds they'd be cute for niece. He about died (she's 11) and filled me in. Crisis averted- I can only imagine what my sister would have said if I bought them!

 

Which has nothing to do with this thread.

[Joker]

We were watching the awards because oldest wanted to see Macklemore. I was beyond disgusted and so were my dds. I do think it was the worst I've seen so far, but maybe I just haven't watched what you would consider the worst.

[Moxie]

Yep, this stunt did exactly what it was meant to-got people talking about her. There really is no such thing as bad press.

[sparrow]

I thought "twerk" was a silly way to say "work", which all the dancers at my nieces studio yell at each other while dancing. So I saw some shorts with "twerk" on them in a dance shop and mentioned to Ds they'd be cute for niece. He about died (she's 11) and filled me in. Crisis averted- I can only imagine what my sister would have said if I bought them!

 

Which has nothing to do with this thread.

 

See, I had heard the word "twerking" and thought it had something to do with "tweeting".

 

I have become my mother.

[Moxie]

I don't understand the ugly faces. Why does she always have to look so gross with her tongue sticking out??

[kewb]

I didn't watch the show but after my facebook wall exploded with people talking about it I watched a video of her performance.  On a personal level I found it revolting.  There was nothing sexy about it.  It was shock value for the sake of shock value.  I prefer my shock value to have a point.  Clearly she is running as far away as she can from her goody goody disney image.  Certainly her right to do so.  My right not to watch, which is one of the many reasons why I do not watch award shows in general.

[Catwoman]

Does Miley Cyrus have some sort of rare tongue disorder which makes it impossible for her to ever keep it in her mouth?

[WishboneDawn]

http://www.businessinsider.com/will-smith-reaction-to-miley-cyrus-vma-performance-2013-8

 

These things pop up every once and awhile. Great publicity, especially when we keep talking about it.

 

I think all that needed to be said was communicated in the expressions of Will Smith and his kids in the link at the top of my post (having trouble with formatting on my phone).

[I.Dup.]

yes, everyone is talking about her, but it's because of what a complete joke she has become. How is that going to make her lots of money or get her jobs? It doesn't seem that Britney or Lindsay Lohan's careers have exactly exploded since they took their down turns. Sure people talk, but I don't see how this kind of thing HELPS their careers.

[Whereneverever]

http://www.businessinsider.com/will-smith-reaction-to-miley-cyrus-vma-performance-2013-8

 

These things pop up every once and awhile. Great publicity, especially when we keep talking about it.

 

I think all that needed to be said was communicated in the expressions of Will Smith and his kids in the link at the top of my post (having trouble with formatting on my phone).

The Smiths reaction wasn't to her, it was to Lady Gaga.

[Joker]

http://www.businessinsider.com/will-smith-reaction-to-miley-cyrus-vma-performance-2013-8

 

These things pop up every once and awhile. Great publicity, especially when we keep talking about it.

 

I think all that needed to be said was communicated in the expressions of Will Smith and his kids in the link at the top of my post (having trouble with formatting on my phone).

 

I've read that was actually their expressions during Lady Gaga, not Miley. Although, their faces did sum up all of the emotions we felt here while watching her.

[nmoira]

I did sort of like the teddy bears though.

Not me. I have a thing about fuzzies... Sorry if I offend anyone.

 

My take? She was trying too hard. I have nothing against raw or raunchy, but she came across more like a little girl playing dress-up and acting big than a young woman oozing sensuality. And I couldn't get over the initial costume, like a onsie over a diaper. Uck. So not my thing. And what's up with the tongue? She needs to school herself watching Audrey in Twin Peaks if she wants to play that game. (Does that date me?)

[Catwoman]

My take? She was trying too hard. I have nothing against raw or raunchy, but she came across more like a little girl playing dress-up and acting big than a young woman oozing sensuality. And I couldn't get over the initial costume, like a onsie over a diaper. Uck. So not my thing. And what's up with the tongue? She needs to school herself watching Audrey in Twin Peaks if she wants to play that game. (Does that date me?)

I felt the same way. She was trying so hard to be super-hot and super-sexy, but she ended up coming across as pathetic and ridiculous. Her entire performance was cringe-worthy.

[Mrs Mungo]

I posted a thread just a min ago with a link to an article about different concerns about her performance. http://thoughtcatalog.com/2013/cultural-appropriation-is-a-bigger-problem-than-miley-cyrus/

 

Short version being that there were issues of cultural appropriation that most people aren't talking about at all.

 

Really interesting points. Definitely something to think about. The Macklemore song had a great point. 

 

yes, everyone is talking about her, but it's because of what a complete joke she has become. How is that going to make her lots of money or get her jobs? It doesn't seem that Britney or Lindsay Lohan's careers have exactly exploded since they took their down turns. Sure people talk, but I don't see how this kind of thing HELPS their careers.

 

Because it's all about SALES not making great musicians or careers. 

http://www.buzzfeed.com/daves4/12-extremely-disappointing-facts-about-popular-mus

[Mrs Mungo]

I felt the same way. She was trying so hard to be super-hot and super-sexy, but she ended up coming across as pathetic and ridiculous. Her entire performance was cringe-worthy.

 

Maybe that's the thing I couldn't put my finger on. Pathetic...there is always that girl at the party making a scene, saying how drunk she is, usually hurting herself at some point, throwing up on some guy, etc. No guy wants to date her. She's annoying. I think THAT is what I'm connecting the performance with.

[Cindy in FL.]

Twin Peaks. I loved that show.

[Catwoman]

Maybe that's the thing I couldn't put my finger on. Pathetic...there is always that girl at the party making a scene, saying how drunk she is, usually hurting herself at some point, throwing up on some guy, etc. No guy wants to date her. She's annoying. I think THAT is what I'm connecting the performance with.

That's just what I was thinking, too!!! She's the irritating girl who wants to be popular so badly that she will do absolutely anything to get people to look at her. Except in Miley's case, she's taking off her clothes and mugging for the camera all the time, desperate for attention.

 

Maybe all that mugging was cute when she was a little girl on Hannah Montana, but now it just seems... odd. And desperate. And annoying. And kind of sad, too, because it seems like she's going to crash and burn when people get tired of her dopey antics.

[Murphy101]

Meh. I couldn't care less about it. I don't think there's anything racist about it either. It's tacky and vulgar, neither of which are new to tv, music, or young people - of any demographic. It's all publicity. *so shrugs the cynic*

[albeto.]

I'm totally Team Miley after watching that! Let me explain.

 

I think it's hard for any kid to grow up in our culture where there's this schizophrenic cultural identity that teaches kids they ought to be seen and not heard, obedient, grateful, cute, and then BAM be a responsible adult contributing to the rat race. On the one hand they're not given room to grow into their adulthood, and on the other hand they're blamed for being kids because lets face it - kids are seen as troublesome when they're not cute and, well, convenient. 

 

Miley Cyrus was raised under constant scrutiny. She was never allowed to make stupid mistakes, get herself out of a mess, or even not think ahead. She was under contract to be an actress, music performer, and all-round Good American Kid. How can that not inspire some great motivation for rebellion?

 

She's 20 years old, one year older than Lauren Bacall was when she was cast opposite a middle aged Humphrey Bogart. Her most famous line must be "You know how to whistle, don't you? You just put your lips together and blow." That was as sexually provocative as Hollywood could stand, and it's been an iconic line and image for almost 70 years. 

 

Cyrus' "crime" was to break the mold in such a way that offends "decent society" today - Her performance not only has sexual imagery, but she's also breaking the race barrier and doing that [whisper mode] black [/whisper mode] "twerking" thing.

 

I know my kids' social and emotional development won't be negatively impacted by this in any way. They're not intimidated by sexual behavior, and they're not intimidated by a perceived breech of expected racial or class segregation. They'll move on in their lives knowing the difference between twerking for art (regardless of whether or not people think that art was particularly skilled), and being responsible and respectful in their own lives when they become sexually active.

[Mrs Mungo]

Breeching expectations is very different than exploitation of a culture to suit where you are in your "art" (or marketing) right now.

[Snow]

I posted a thread just a min ago with a link to an article about different concerns about her performance. http://thoughtcatalog.com/2013/cultural-appropriation-is-a-bigger-problem-than-miley-cyrus/

 

Short version being that there were issues of cultural appropriation that most people aren't talking about at all.

Interesting article. I didn't think about that perspective.

[Catwoman]

I'm totally Team Miley after watching that! Let me explain.

 

I think it's hard for any kid to grow up in our culture where there's this schizophrenic cultural identity that teaches kids they ought to be seen and not heard, obedient, grateful, cute, and then BAM be a responsible adult contributing to the rat race. On the one hand they're not given room to grow into their adulthood, and on the other hand they're blamed for being kids because lets face it - kids are seen as troublesome when they're not cute and, well, convenient. 

 

Miley Cyrus was raised under constant scrutiny. She was never allowed to make stupid mistakes, get herself out of a mess, or even not think ahead. She was under contract to be an actress, music performer, and all-round Good American Kid. How can that not inspire some great motivation for rebellion?

 

She's 20 years old, one year older than Lauren Bacall was when she was cast opposite a middle aged Humphrey Bogart. Her most famous line must be "You know how to whistle, don't you? You just put your lips together and blow." That was as sexually provocative as Hollywood could stand, and it's been an iconic line and image for almost 70 years. [/size]

 

Cyrus' "crime" was to break the mold in such a way that offends "decent society" today - Her performance not only has sexual imagery, but she's also breaking the race barrier and doing that [whisper mode] black [/whisper mode] "twerking" thing.[/size]

 

I know my kids' social and emotional development won't be negatively impacted by this in any way. They're not intimidated by sexual behavior, and they're not intimidated by a perceived breech of expected racial or class segregation. They'll move on in their lives knowing the difference between twerking for art (regardless of whether or not people think that art was particularly skilled), and being responsible and respectful in their own lives when they become sexually active.

She's not doing anything more than desperately trying to maintain some degree of popularity in any way she can think to do it. She's not breaking any racial barriers or using "sexual imagery" or anything even remotely creative. She's not twerking for any other reason than to get attention.

 

I think you're giving her way too much credit.

 

She's nothing more than a child star who will do anything within her power to remain famous.

[nmoira]

I'm a little leary of cries of "cultural appropriation" from a generation raised on Elvis and The Beatles and the Stones. Or Paul Simon and Peter Gabriel. :) IMHO it's something we should be sensitive to by generously acknowledging influences rather than not embracing them.

[PeacefulChaos]

I thought it was raunchy and disgusting.  

It wasn't just something that was 'pushing the boundaries of being sexy' .... it was gross.   :ack2:

It wasn't the twerking.  I don't give a crap about the twerking... that's been around for awhile now, and I've seen girls of EVERY race do it just as much as any other (a racial thing?  are you flipping kidding me?   :rolleyes: ).  It was the nasty facial expressions, the foam finger... that poor foam finger.  *gag*

Overall, it was just gross.  

[liber]

Raunchy, tasteless and classless.  It was so over the top.

[RanchGirl]

It was gross in an uncomfortable, desperate way, not sexy or risque...  it made me think she is using drugs.  But I also don't understand the uproar, it's certainly not the first tacky or vulgar or drug-induced bad performance that a pop singer has ever given.  It's sad that our country is talking more right now about this pathetic girl than about what our government is doing domestically and abroad.

[Joanne]

I'm totally Team Miley after watching that! Let me explain.

 

I think it's hard for any kid to grow up in our culture where there's this schizophrenic cultural identity that teaches kids they ought to be seen and not heard, obedient, grateful, cute, and then BAM be a responsible adult contributing to the rat race. On the one hand they're not given room to grow into their adulthood, and on the other hand they're blamed for being kids because lets face it - kids are seen as troublesome when they're not cute and, well, convenient. 

 

Miley Cyrus was raised under constant scrutiny. She was never allowed to make stupid mistakes, get herself out of a mess, or even not think ahead. She was under contract to be an actress, music performer, and all-round Good American Kid. How can that not inspire some great motivation for rebellion?

 

She's 20 years old, one year older than Lauren Bacall was when she was cast opposite a middle aged Humphrey Bogart. Her most famous line must be "You know how to whistle, don't you? You just put your lips together and blow." That was as sexually provocative as Hollywood could stand, and it's been an iconic line and image for almost 70 years. 

 

Cyrus' "crime" was to break the mold in such a way that offends "decent society" today - Her performance not only has sexual imagery, but she's also breaking the race barrier and doing that [whisper mode] black [/whisper mode] "twerking" thing.

 

I know my kids' social and emotional development won't be negatively impacted by this in any way. They're not intimidated by sexual behavior, and they're not intimidated by a perceived breech of expected racial or class segregation. They'll move on in their lives knowing the difference between twerking for art (regardless of whether or not people think that art was particularly skilled), and being responsible and respectful in their own lives when they become sexually active.

 

 

I think "evil" needs to be reserved for acts, for behaviors, for character - not a stage performance.

 

I think shaking up expectations and challenging hypocrisy, conformity, and scripting is a good thing.

 

I think artists like Madonna, and even Lady Gaga are inspired (although I much, much prefer P!nk). Even when I don't personally like their antics, I admire the ovaries. They have talent.

Miley's performance wasn't womanly. By that I don't mean "nice" or "wholesome". I mean it was immature. There was no TALENT involved. It was classless. It failed to mock or challenge stereotypes or scripting in any meaningful way.

 

I'm not against porn (in theory, but I am against the porn industry). Beneath my licensing, jobs, and ethics, I'm not even vanilla.

 

But I found Miley's performance a meaningless, talentless, waste of airtime.

[KungFuPanda]

Twerking is something I'm sure that most of the black community would be HAPPY to have associated with Miley rather than their own children. It would be like getting offended that someone stole your garbage. Besides, I'm not sure she even did it right. Apparently, no amount of money is enough to teach that girl to dance. She's ALWAYS looked awkward in her body. You start out embarrassed for her, then you realize she's repeating the same 4 moves, then she just doesn't stop and you watch her insist upon hanging herself. She's just not sexy and she desperately wants to be.

[nmoira]

This is my favourite meme-y thing so far:

 

 

And Albert Brooks had the Tweet o' the Day:

 

Alan Thicke and Billy Ray Cyrus now under genetic arrest.

[idnib]

I was disgusted with the guy she was twerking with. Sorry i don't remember his name. 

 

I read today that she's not old enough to drink, he's in his forties and is married with a wife and kid. His wife was in the audience!

 

That was shocking to me and I put more of that blame on him than on her. He's the married father, after all.

 

I felt her performance was gross but what he did was more disgusting to me.

[Mrs Mungo]

I'm a little leary of cries of "cultural appropriation" from a generation raised on Elvis and The Beatles and the Stones. Or Paul Simon and Peter Gabriel. :) IMHO it's something we should be sensitive to by generously acknowledging influences rather than not embracing them.

I think that is what the author was getting at. I think that's why the author linked the Macklemore video. He is a white R&B guy, but acknowledges the roots and the fact that he has not had the same struggles.

[poppy]

I was disgusted with the guy she was twerking with. Sorry i don't remember his name. 

 

I read today that she's not old enough to drink, he's in his forties and is married with a wife and kid. His wife was in the audience!

 

That was shocking to me and I put more of that blame on him than on her. He's the married father, after all.

 

I felt her performance was gross but what he did was more disgusting to me.

 

Good gracious, it was just tacky dancing. They are show business pros.  It's like two married actor kissing in a movie. 

Actually the song 'Blurred Lines' originally went viral due to a video featuring Robin Thicke and Pharrell WIlliams  (older, married, has a kid too) scampering around with naked models. Who could not have been much older than Miley.  And obviously the song itself is deliberately skeevy ('what rhymes with hug me?'). 

 

Thing is, it's a GOOD SONG, it's well done.  And the video is just fun to watch.  Miley's performance was kind of dumb and repulsive.

 

 

By the way, talking about "I'm old"..... I saw an article talking about "The Smiths" reaction to Miley's performance, and I thought  "Morrissey was at the VMAs?"  (They mean Will Smith & family....)

[DianeW88]

This Miley thing has been in everybody's face all day.  And I've tried to come up with some sort of coherent, intelligent, opinion on it.  But when I do, it always comes down to....I just don't care enough about her to form one.

[nmoira]

By the way, talking about "I'm old"..... I saw an article talking about "The Smiths" reaction to Miley's performance, and I thought  "Morrissey was at the VMAs?"  (They mean Will Smith & family....)

 

:rofl:

[poppy]

I think that is what the author was getting at. I think that's why the author linked the Macklemore video. He is a white R&B guy, but acknowledges the roots and the fact that he has not had the same struggles.

 

I read somewhere that before hitting it big, Macklemore did music workshops for incarcerated teens.  His life experiences are so far removed from Miley Cyrus's they are on different planets.  But he is definitely not an R&B guy.  He is an MC. Big difference.

[myfunnybunch]

 

Miley Cyrus was raised under constant scrutiny. She was never allowed to make stupid mistakes, get herself out of a mess, or even not think ahead. She was under contract to be an actress, music performer, and all-round Good American Kid. How can that not inspire some great motivation for rebellion?

 

 

I dunno. I mean, I agree with the above, the part I quoted.

 

But I don't agree so much that her "crime" was offensiveness. It was a bad performance. It was disjointed, the music wasn't good, the dancing wasn't good. She doesn't have the chops to convincingly pull that off.

 

And....it's predictable. I wasn't offended or disgusted, I was just sitting there waiting for it to finish. It wasn't new or interesting. It was another ex-Disney actress trying to seem grown-up by behaving in a sexually provocative manner. Meh. Yawn.

 

But what it really boils down to is that it just wasn't good. If you're going to try to pull off a convincing in-your-face performance, you'd better be spot on, and she wasn't.

 

Cat

[nmoira]

If only I'd known... The Replacements performed for the first time in 22 years last night, and here I am talking about Miley Cyrus... 

 

Off to stream. i'm outta here...

[happi duck]

Her first costume looked like Chuck E Cheese!!! Maybe she saved up tickets!

[albeto.]

But I found Miley's performance a meaningless, talentless, waste of airtime.

 

 

But what it really boils down to is that it just wasn't good. If you're going to try to pull off a convincing in-your-face performance, you'd better be spot on, and she wasn't.

 

Cat

 

Sadly, this isn't the aspect of the performance capturing most people's attention (tweets, facebook posts, comments online, etc).

[Dandelion]

I thought it was stupid and pathetic. It was obviously all done for shock value, but there was nothing really entertaining about it. And yes, the tongue gymnastics were just bizarre.

 

As for the question/point of the OP - why are people saying Miley needs help/is going down the wrong path because of this performance - I haven't read any articles or opinion pieces that present that POV.  I also haven't spent any time on Facebook in the last few days so I've been spared the commentary there.  ;)

 

I don't feel sorry for Miley or feel like she's a poor, confused girl who needs help.  This was all an act, orchestrated for maximum effect. She and her management are getting exactly what they wanted out of this.  People are talking about her and paying attention to her - probably more than they ever have during her entire career.  As to whether this will pay off in the long run, that remains to be seen.  

[BellaStarr]

Well, all the teen girls around here today were talking about how bad her performance was and how she couldn't sing nor "twerk".  She doesn't have the body or the booty to be trying to act and dance like that.  The whole foam finger thingy they thought was disgusting.  They thought that she was trying too hard and came off looking skanky and untalented.

 

Twerking isn't a new thing, when I was a teen we called it booty shaking, and around here all the white, black, and brown girls do it.  They even do it at on the public school dance and cheer teams. 

[Dandelion]

Twerking is something I'm sure that most of the black community would be HAPPY to have associated with Miley rather than their own children. It would be like getting offended that someone stole your garbage. 

 

Speaking of that, how come no one seems to want to co-opt the White Man's Overbite dance?   :tongue_smilie:

[Maela]

I just assumed she was very high and/or drunk. I'm not opposed to raunchy or very sexual stuff, but I just kept thinking umm, Is this supposed to be cool or sexy??

 

I love the blurred lines song (and even the video), but this...hmmm...