JAWM: "Interesting" introduction at church today

[shanvan]

I realize that. I didn't mean to come across that you were saying that. This was my comment in response to the "advice" you'd received earlier in the thread. Sorry, I probably should have phrased it better.

 

I was just saying that neither party in the conversation can claim stellar social skills based on this incident, so it rubbed me the wrong way when everyone was jumping on "new mom" for her part in the faux pas. We ALL have them. There is a "stupid things I've said" type thread going presently, where we get to claim our own stupid foot-in-mouth moments.

 

Just wanted to be clear in case anyone reads your post without reading everything else. I think they were jumping on her b/c I said JAWM.

[Chelli]

Or she could be like me and when she gets nervous (visiting a new church) she just starts talking about anything and everything with no real rhyme or reason.

 

That little character trait has gotten me into more trouble than I care to mention. And of course I feel like an idiot later and hope I haven't ruined my first impression.

[LucyStoner]

Just wanted to be clear in case anyone reads your post without reading everything else. I think they were jumping on her b/c I said JAWM.

 

 

Exactly. It seems the some either don't know or don't care what JAWM is for...I take it as the OP needing a little reassurance. If I can't give that, I steer clear.

 

As for my remark about being the sharpest tool, well, personally that's my opinion of folks who spread what most medical experts consider to be faulty info around like that. Stating as fact that ADD or Autism is caused by vaccines, especially for a particular child, is something I just sort of have to laugh about. It's a glib assessment sure, but you have to be glib when you hear stuff like this often about your kid.

[shanvan]

Just because someone says something negative about their own child, doesn't mean you have to share something negative about your own. You can be very gracious toward them, without giving out any personal information at all.

 

I know what you mean about the obnoxious parents -- they're the ones who hear that someone else's kid is having a particular problem, and they launch into a big story about how incredibly perfect their own kids are, and how they would never have any problems with their own little angels. :glare:

 

A little off subject and maybe best for another thread, but...I'm trying to understand why you see it as saying something negative about a Dc if you state that he/she has _____. I just see it as a statement, not positive or negative. It isn't my Dd's fault she has trouble paying attention and focusing. If I share with another mom some of the struggles Dd has worked to overcome, why should that take anything away from my Dd? If she played well, she still played well. If she played well despite difficulties, shouldn't that be even more impressive? (Not that I was trying to impress) I guess maybe some people might think it has a negative connotation. Not that I think we should all go around introducing ourselves with a list of our diagnoses.

 

You know what's funny...I thought people would argue over vaccinations on this thread. :lol:

[shanvan]

Or she could be like me and when she gets nervous (visiting a new church) she just starts talking about anything and everything with no real rhyme or reason.

 

That little character trait has gotten me into more trouble than I care to mention. And of course I feel like an idiot later and hope I haven't ruined my first impression.

 

Well, that's the thought that crossed my mind even though her comment floored me. I've done it too--and apparently (if you read the entire thread) I did it within the very same conversation. :lol:

[shanvan]

Exactly. It seems the some either don't know or don't care what JAWM is for...I take it as the OP needing a little reassurance. If I can't give that, I steer clear.

 

As for my remark about being the sharpest tool, well, personally that's my opinion of folks who spread what most medical experts consider to be faulty info around like that. Stating as fact that ADD or Autism is caused by vaccines, especially for a particular child, is something I just sort of have to laugh about. It's a glib assessment sure, but you have to be glib when you hear stuff like this often about your kid.

 

You are correct, I was looking for reassurance. While I realize maybe I should have simply said "Thank you", I was surprised by some of the replies here.

[Catwoman]

A little off subject and maybe best for another thread, but...I'm trying to understand why you see it as saying something negative about a Dc if you state that he/she has _____. I just see it as a statement, not positive or negative. It isn't my Dd's fault she has trouble paying attention and focusing. If I share with another mom some of the struggles Dd has worked to overcome, why should that take anything away from my Dd? If she played well, she still played well. If she played well despite difficulties, shouldn't that be even more impressive? (Not that I was trying to impress) I guess maybe some people might think it has a negative connotation. Not that I think we should all go around introducing ourselves with a list of our diagnoses.

 

You know what's funny...I thought people would argue over vaccinations on this thread. :lol:

 

You may see it that way, but many people would see it as pointing out a flaw or making excuses for her. Whatever the case, it's personal and private information that the woman didn't need to know. I don't understand why it would be a good thing to share that kind of information with a stranger. :confused: Why wouldn't you want her to have the best possible impression of your dd? Why would you want to give the woman a pre-conceived impression of her?

 

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this, but I think there is absolutely no reason to point out a child's weaknesses to a stranger. And many people might view your dd differently once you told them she had ADD, while if you never told them, they would probably never even notice.

 

Please don't think I believe that there's anything wrong with having ADD -- I just don't believe it's something to publicize to a stranger. It could also be embarrassing for your dd.

[LibraryLover]

JAWM. I need to get that in my head.

[Catwoman]

JAWM. I need to get that in my head.

 

I wish I would have done that, too. :rolleyes:

[shanvan]

You may see it that way, but many people would see it as pointing out a flaw or making excuses for her. Whatever the case, it's personal and private information that the woman didn't need to know. I don't understand why it would be a good thing to share that kind of information with a stranger. :confused: Why wouldn't you want her to have the best possible impression of your dd? Why would you want to give the woman a pre-conceived impression of her?

 

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this, but I think there is absolutely no reason to point out a child's weaknesses to a stranger. And many people might view your dd differently once you told them she had ADD, while if you never told them, they would probably never even notice.

 

Please don't think I believe that there's anything wrong with having ADD -- I just don't believe it's something to publicize to a stranger. It could also be embarrassing for your dd.

 

I wasn't actually disagreeing with you, just trying to understand your POV better.

 

It just hadn't occurred to me that some might have a bad impression of a child b/c they have ____. I can see your point on the pre-conceived idea, but for some reason it hadn't occurred to me. I don't often mention it, except occasionally on WTMB (especially since it has not been officially diagnosed), so hadn't really thought it through before, which is why I was asking. I guess I was being naive in my attempt to relate. Thanks for explaining your thoughts. I get what you are saying now.

[LibraryLover]

I wish I would have done that, too. :rolleyes:

 

Often I think I am helping. lol

 

In the end, I know I really am not helping; but for some few split seconds, I think...maybe.

 

It's really the universe telling me to get a job.

[Catwoman]

I wasn't actually disagreeing with you, just trying to understand your POV better.

 

It just hadn't occurred to me that some might have a bad impression of a child b/c they have ____. I can see your point on the pre-conceived idea, but for some reason it hadn't occurred to me. I don't often mention it, except occasionally on WTMB (especially since it has not been officially diagnosed), so hadn't really thought it through before, which is why I was asking. I guess I was being naive in my attempt to relate. Thanks for explaining your thoughts. I get what you are saying now.

 

I'm glad you know what I meant. I truly wasn't trying to be snarky or mean.

 

I really think you're just a nice person and you assume the best of others, so it didn't dawn on you that some people might have a negative impression of a child with ADD. It's sad that anyone would feel that way, but it does happen.

[fraidycat]

Ok, add me to the list of socially inept at conversation today, too. :lol: I am not expressing myself very clearly, either. I apologize.

 

I AGREE with you that what she said was a little over the line. I don't entirely agree with her opinion on the subject matter. She still didn't need to "blame" you for it, and maybe she now realizes that what she said was inappropriate, too? I'm giving her the benefit of the doubt that blame was not her intent in the comment she made.

 

Just wanted to be clear in case anyone reads your post without reading everything else. I think they were jumping on her b/c I said JAWM.

 

Maybe I shouldn't have said anything at all about the next part, but I did. I do not like seeing people being called names or mudslinging about their intelligence by supposedly grown adults, especially based on one side of the story and a one-time incident. Ongoing sagas allow more room to form an opinion, even if still one-sided. One can agree that you did NOT do anything to cause your DD's ADD, without being derogatory toward "new mom". They are two separate issues.

 

She believes something she's been told or read about, and she's not the only one. It is a very widespread "belief" nowadays. She could very well think that anyone who does not believe it is "ignorant, not the sharpest, etc." The same could be said for any and all opposite-side arguments by one side about the other. (YEC/OE, politics, Unschool/Classical school etc. all come to mind here) Calling names or questioning a person's intelligence does nothing to make 'their side of the equation' seem any more "intelligent" than the person or opinion they are arguing against.

 

Again, these comments are not necessarily directed at you, and I should have made that more clear in my original post. I didn't. I'm sorry.

 

You are correct, I was looking for reassurance. While I realize maybe I should have simply said "Thank you", I was surprised by some of the replies here.

 

:grouphug: <This is probably what I should have just done in the first place.>

 

And once again, I'm sorry if I caused more harm than good with my previous posts. That was not my intent.

Edited November 5, 2012 by fraidycat

[Catwoman]

Often I think I am helping. lol

 

In the end, I know I really am not helping; but for some few split seconds, I think...maybe.

 

It's really the universe telling me to get a job.

 

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

It keeps telling me the same thing.

 

I just keep covering my ears and humming until it finally shuts up. ;)

[carina]

My first thought was, "Nice! She was able to play so well in spite of the ADD, Good job!"

 

Second thought was, I'm am massively awkward and probably would have said something equally stupid if it were me. :001_rolleyes:

 

Tomorrow's a new day!

[Denisemomof4]

Exactly. It seems the some either don't know or don't care what JAWM is for...I take it as the OP needing a little reassurance. If I can't give that, I steer clear.

 

 

:iagree:

 

Shanvan: :grouphug::grouphug:

[TravelingChris]

I find giving unsolicited medical advice totally unwelcome. It isn't just young mothers who do this. So yes, I do agree with you.

[momofkhm]

Weird, strange, pick your word - rude even.

 

I wouldn't say something like that even with someone I've known a long time. Especially not at an introduction!

[stripe]

If it makes you feel any better, I have had a few people tell me that my kids' hair is not nice and I should shave it off because then it will all grown nice and straight and dark because that's what happened to their kids. :lol: These people do not hail from the same cultures nor share the same hair types as either my husband or me. I also had an acquaintance tell me, based on my kid's hair, that it was not possible for him to be the child of my husband. :lol: Gee, thanks. My husband told me I should have told her that her husband was the dad.

[Just Jane]

My first thought was, "Nice! She was able to play so well in spite of the ADD, Good job!"

 

Second thought was, I'm am massively awkward and probably would have said something equally stupid if it were me. :001_rolleyes:

 

Tomorrow's a new day!

:iagree:

[DawnM]

YOu were more polite than I was when this subject came up in a Moms' group I was in. I went OFF on her (because she was spewing some misinformation) and it was one of those situations where it came out of my mouth before I realized it was coming......I didn't realize I cared about it as much as I did apparently. :glare: She never spoke to me again. But we weren't friends to begin with, so it wasn't a huge deal.

 

Dawn

[cave canem]

I thought the "I don't want a debate" referred to the question of whether vaccines are related to ADD.

 

I did agree that the woman was inappropriate but thought that pointing out how you gave her an opening could be helpful.

 

On the other hand, I know a woman whose 30-yo child died of cancer. Upon learning this, the woman's sister said to the woman, "Do you think this is because of that X-ray?" that the woman had when the deceased child was in utero. So, not having an opening might not stop some people.

[Parrothead]

I thought the "I don't want a debate" referred to the question of whether vaccines are related to ADD.

 

I did agree that the woman was inappropriate but thought that pointing out how you gave her an opening could be helpful.

 

:iagree:Yes, I do agree OP that woman you met was should not give unsolicited medical advice upon first meeting people. But you did give her an opening.

 

_____________________________________

 

In general I think in our culture we are too free with private information we give to strangers. We'd be appalled if someone in our family give out info to a stranger yet we think nothing of it to do it ourselves. Then we are taken aback when said stranger comments on what we've given away.

[MrsJewelsRae]

Ya, that's rude, on her part. There are no guarantees. I had natural births, I breastfed exclusively, didn't introduce solids until 9-10 months, kids never had a bottle, none of my kids are vaccinated, they each weaned between 2-3 years old, they ate homemade organic baby food, none of them have needed antibiotics, all were cloth diapered. I did whatever I could to give them the best health, as most moms do. Guess what? My dd has asthma and eczema and environmental allergies. My youngest is only 3, he has multiple anaphylactic allergies. I still believe in the reasoning behind my decisions, and I would repeat those choices for future children. But it doesn't guarantee my kids are going to be healthier than the rest. I would never think to approach a mom in such a fashion- to essentially blame her child's health problems on her ignorance or poor decisions.

[Stayseeliz]

Oh my. That's insane. My child that struggles the most with ADD only had one shot total. That's crazy.

[mom@shiloh]

This type of discussion always reminds me of times when I've "put my foot in my mouth" or said more than I should. I'm always sorry later and it makes me try harder to be careful what I say. I hope she gets an opportunity to make amends and I hope she takes it if she gets it!

[justLisa]

Wow, what a peach. I am sadly never surprised at the weird things people ask.

[justLisa]

New moms are like new converts. They are over zealous and need to be kept in a box for a while. She'll learn.

:lol: That is so true

[ereks mom]

I agree with you that her remarks were inappropriate.

 

However, I can't imagine telling a stranger--that my family might well expect to have further dealings with--my daughter's status with respect to ADD. That seems like a violation of her privacy right off the bat. Maybe this woman just thought you were open to chatting about manifold aspects of ADD as it relates to your daughter.

 

If someone thinks your daughter plays well, no need to bring up her weaknesses.

 

:iagree: Exactly what I was thinking.

[Mommy22alyns]

I agree with you, OP, and not just because it's a JAWM. That was out of line on her part. :glare:

[mommaduck]

I think you opened the door for that conversation with her by going into your daughter's issues with timing and ADD. She was responding to what you said.

 

I know this is a JAWM thread, but I don't think it should just be pushed off to social awkwardness.

[MooCow]

New moms are like new converts. They are over zealous and need to be kept in a box for a while. She'll learn.

 

 

:lol: bwhahahahahahahaha! in the words of my dd "true that"

[razorbackmama]

I've had an experience like that. I had lived in a very small town for a year or two maybe, but we didn't really know anyone (long story). I heard that the very few homeschoolers in town had a park day, so I went.

 

Keep in mind, I'd never met these women before in my life.

 

Within 30 minutes we were discussing (I use the term "we" loosely...it was mostly THEY...and me with my mouth open) eternal security, whether infant baptism was OK, and something else equally huge...it's been about 10 years so I forget what it was.

 

I kid you not, I went home that night and flat out told my husband that I was done trying to make friends in that community. Do people not understand the concept of SMALL TALK anymore?????:confused:

[joannqn]

I think you opened the door for that conversation with her by going into your daughter's issues with timing and ADD. She was responding to what you said.

 

I know this is a JAWM thread, but I don't think it should just be pushed off to social awkwardness.

 

:iagree:

 

I bet she really believes that vaccines are a contributing factor to ADD so it just spilled out when you mentioned ADD. I know I stick my foot in my mouth in a similar fashion all the time. I don't mean to be offensive; it just comes out when my particular triggers are hit. With very hard work, I've reduced the frequency of my social mess ups, but I still make them too often. If she's like me, she went home and beat herself up mentally over her social goof and wishes she were naturally talented in social skills.

[scrappyhappymama]

We make non-traditional vaccine choices in our family, but it is not something I discuss with casual acquaintances, strangers, or really anyone that hasn't expressed a strong desire to know my opinion on the subject. With like minded friends, sure! But because someone mentions a particular disorder that may or may not, but probably isn't related to vaccine reactions? No, no, never!

 

I really don't even think you were out of line so much yourself, personally. I have a son that I would describe much like your child- probably has a form of ADD or ADHD, but has never been officially diagnosed. I've certainly discussed this with other moms, in the realm of making accommodations for the needs of my particular child, especially if they've brought up educational concerns with their own children. However, I do not think that even such a conversation should open the door to intrusive medical questions and comments that imply one is responsible for causing their child's struggles. That's just rude!

[Seeking Squirrels]

I agree that was an inappropriate thing for her to say, but I would probably assume social awkwardness. Especially because she was visiting your church and therefore out of her comfort zone. I do this sometimes. I am very shy, but I recognize this and hate it. So sometimes I overcompensate when trying to force myself to say more than I really want to. Sometimes I even realize it as I am talking and I just don't know how to avoid finishing the thought.

 

And fwiw, we're quite sure DD has ADHD and she hasn't been vax'd at all.

[marbel]

I've had an experience like that. I had lived in a very small town for a year or two maybe, but we didn't really know anyone (long story). I heard that the very few homeschoolers in town had a park day, so I went.

 

Keep in mind, I'd never met these women before in my life.

 

Within 30 minutes we were discussing (I use the term "we" loosely...it was mostly THEY...and me with my mouth open) eternal security, whether infant baptism was OK, and something else equally huge...it's been about 10 years so I forget what it was.

 

I kid you not, I went home that night and flat out told my husband that I was done trying to make friends in that community. Do people not understand the concept of SMALL TALK anymore?????:confused:

 

Was that an established group where people have known each other a long time? I've had similar things happen when I am new somewhere. If they've known each other and been talking together for a long time, they've moved beyond small talk. That does make it hard for the new person, though.

[mommaduck]

I've had an experience like that. I had lived in a very small town for a year or two maybe, but we didn't really know anyone (long story). I heard that the very few homeschoolers in town had a park day, so I went.

 

Keep in mind, I'd never met these women before in my life.

 

Within 30 minutes we were discussing (I use the term "we" loosely...it was mostly THEY...and me with my mouth open) eternal security, whether infant baptism was OK, and something else equally huge...it's been about 10 years so I forget what it was.

 

I kid you not, I went home that night and flat out told my husband that I was done trying to make friends in that community. Do people not understand the concept of SMALL TALK anymore?????:confused:

 

For me, at one time, vacines would be considered small talk. It's a topic. It's not discussing my in laws or my relaionship with my brother. I had a child react. It's a current issue.

[razorbackmama]

Was that an established group where people have known each other a long time? I've had similar things happen when I am new somewhere. If they've known each other and been talking together for a long time, they've moved beyond small talk. That does make it hard for the new person, though.

Possibly, but I don't think so. The vibe I got was that they were all sharing new information with each other too and that they didn't know all THAT about each other. I was just flabbergasted that rather than talking about the basics, "Oh, so where did you move here from? What does your husband do?" etc., we were talking about huge theological issues (and more)!:001_huh:

 

For me, at one time, vacines would be considered small talk. It's a topic. It's not discussing my in laws or my relaionship with my brother. I had a child react. It's a current issue.

I think there is a way to discuss vaccines in a "small talk" way. The person in question in the OP did not do that.

[mommaduck]

So small talk means you aren't permitted to ask any questions or stat any opinions unless it's about the weather?

[razorbackmama]

So small talk means you aren't permitted to ask any questions or stat any opinions unless it's about the weather?

Sigh. No. But there is a there is a tactful way to discuss things like that with someone you've just met and there is a tactless way. The person in the OP was tactless.

[Samiam]

I've had an experience like that. I had lived in a very small town for a year or two maybe, but we didn't really know anyone (long story). I heard that the very few homeschoolers in town had a park day, so I went.

 

Keep in mind, I'd never met these women before in my life.

 

Within 30 minutes we were discussing (I use the term "we" loosely...it was mostly THEY...and me with my mouth open) eternal security, whether infant baptism was OK, and something else equally huge...it's been about 10 years so I forget what it was.

 

I kid you not, I went home that night and flat out told my husband that I was done trying to make friends in that community. Do people not understand the concept of SMALL TALK anymore?????:confused:

 

I see this as an interesting conversation. Homeschooling moms can actually hold in-depth interesting, thought provoking conversations. Sometimes I get tired of the bane, drivel of "what curriculum do you use" or the competative "my curriculum is SO much better than yours".

 

I see nothing wrong with that conversation if it was all in an adult, let's discuss calmly, tone. I'm always interested in hearing what others think, know and have to say. I might end up deciding I don't need to hear anymore from that person, in the end, but I might have learned something along the way.

[mommaduck]

Agreed that she wasn't the most tactful, but I didn't find what she said as offensive either. She asked a question based upon what was said to her and her limited experience. The IP could have used it as a golden opportunity to inform our should not have opened that door for discussion. My mother was not the most tactful. She would presume that if you brought up a subject then it was open to conversation on...she had few friends and looked for a chance to get to know someone. Yes, it's why she had few friends, but others should not assume that everyone communicates the same way, especially if they are raised all over rather culture. than in one little boxed in

[razorbackmama]

I see this as an interesting conversation. Homeschooling moms can actually hold in-depth interesting, thought provoking conversations. Sometimes I get tired of the bane, drivel of "what curriculum do you use" or the competative "my curriculum is SO much better than yours".

 

I see nothing wrong with that conversation if it was all in an adult, let's discuss calmly, tone. I'm always interested in hearing what others think, know and have to say. I might end up deciding I don't need to hear anymore from that person, in the end, but I might have learned something along the way.

Oh, it wasn't. LOL. It was in a "I can't believe you actually believe that!" tone. And again, these are people I knew for all of 30 minutes. I totally agree that homeschooling moms can (and should) be able to hold thought provoking conversations. But I guess it just seemed out of place given the situation...goodness, we didn't even know each other's names really!:001_huh: