Would you point out to a friend if you thought their child has Aspergers

[Guest]

You know, it's a weird thing. I have a child with ADHD. I know she has it, she has been diagnosed, and she takes meds. Do I want someone poking around in it? No, I do not. Honestly I just don't want anyone to talk about it. I'm not ashamed of it. But we don't dwell on it. It's just life to us. Maybe they know what's up with their kid, if anything, and it's just life to them.

 

I have another child who is, and always has been, quirky. Now we are getting ready to have her tested for ADD, LDs, and God knows what else. It is breaking me in pieces. Am I overreacting? Perhaps I am. Do I want anyone to give me their opinion? No, I don't. Not right now. I'm raw.

 

Quill, you are a sweet sweet lady! I know you would NEVER say something to hurt someone. You have always been just the nicest person here on the boards. But I honestly wouldn't bring anything up. Maybe the mom knows something is going on. Maybe they are pursuing testing. Maybe they are totally in the dark. Who knows. But just from what you've said, I'd just keep watching and wait for her to (possibly) say something to you. Then you can validate and support her feelings and thoughts.

 

Even though I know none of us mean harm, just suggesting something might be "wrong" with someone's child, harms sometimes. It just does. I don't know why we (general "we"), as mothers, are so sensitive about it, but most of us are.

 

Enough of my blabbering. I'm just at a tough spot right now with my own daughter.

 

Bless you, Quill. :grouphug:

 

:blushing: Thanks. I was feeling very misunderstood and it's really making me wonder why I come here.

 

It's weird to me. I thought my own son had something and I exhausted myself trying to understand the nature of his oddities. My biggest problem was not being heard by others that I was really concerned.

[Guest]

However, I cannot understand someone being "offended" that someone is "judging" their kid. That is totally baffling to me!

snip

I can see how it could be annoying if you've heard it 20 times already - and of course, I would never dream of saying something where the child or the child's siblings could hear it! But just to say, "I'm worried about a couple of things I notice with BooBear..." I just don't see why that would be *offensive*.

 

I would not say something and yes, it would bother me because I get it quite a bit. Offended? No. It just makes me...tired. I know my son has some quirks that I deal with day in and day out and I know that people look at him funny. Maybe she has had people say it to her? Maybe she is investigating it? I agree with the others that I would let her bring it up and would not bring it up myself.

[Nakia]

:blushing: Thanks. I was feeling very misunderstood and it's really making me wonder why I come here.

 

It's weird to me. I thought my own son had something and I exhausted myself trying to understand the nature of his oddities. My biggest problem was not being heard by others that I was really concerned.

 

I think there are a lot of moms here who have kids with "issues" and like me, they are just sensitive about it. It's okay for them to be. I don't think there's a thing wrong with you asking. I feel like I "know" you enough to know you are just concerned. I do think there's also the idea that it is offensive to bring up anything out of the norm about someone's child. And like I said, even if you don't mean harm, it's still a tender area.

 

I know what you mean about not being heard. Only a few people IRL know we are beginning the testing process with Emma. I'm at a place where I don't want to be right and I don't want to be wrong about what I think is going on. I want to know and I don't want to know. Does that make sense?

[Arcadia]

All that to say I cannot imagine why someone would be *offended* that a good friend was concerned about their child. I can see how it could be annoying if you've heard it 20 times already ......But just to say, "I'm worried about a couple of things I notice with BooBear..." I just don't see why that would be *offensive*.

 

I won't be offended but I wouldn't want someone regardless how close to tell me either unless I ask for an opinion.

 

I have a friend whose 7 year old boy was suggested to be ADHD from when he was 3. They have done testing every year on teacher's request and it has either been inconclusive or he is not ADHD. My friend is very raw whenever ADHD is mentioned.

 

No one really know how many times the parent have heard someone mentioned about their child already. It is emotionally draining. It could be special needs, it could be quirks, it could be immaturity.

 

I have a kid who has traits of selective mutism and with sensory issues. He is neither here nor there. It is so emotionally tiring to hear people's comments regardless how well-intended.

[Guest]

Only a few people IRL know we are beginning the testing process with Emma. I'm at a place where I don't want to be right and I don't want to be wrong about what I think is going on. I want to know and I don't want to know. Does that make sense?

 

Yes, it makes sense. I have BTDT.:grouphug:

[GoVanGogh]

It's weird to me. I thought my own son had something and I exhausted myself trying to understand the nature of his oddities. My biggest problem was not being heard by others that I was really concerned.

Oh, my goodness, that really struck a nerve with me tonight.

We have been in a testing/diagnosis nightmare for over a month. Our pediatrician was so dismissive and joked about our child's issue. My mother told me that I can't expect my child to be perfect in every regard. My dad joked about my two brothers having a 'similar' problem which isn't similar and isn't a problem at all to them but is to my child.

Personally, I find it all exhausting. We are pushing for a diagnosis now, but this has been ongoing since this child's birth. I want to be 'heard' when I talk about it, but I don't want others to give me their unsolicited opinions.

[Alphabetika]

No I would not. I don't buddy up with people and I don't enjoy trick or treating. I am pretty sure I do not have Aspergers. There are plenty of other explanations for the behavior in that situation.

 

 

:iagree:His behavior could have been due to many, many other factors.

[tex-mex]

I haven't read beyond the first post.

 

Forgive me if this has been said... but based alone on the ToT episode, that seems more like a 4 year old being tired. Possibly ADHD too. But yep, a 4 year old. I would wait 'til his 1st or 2nd grade teacher mentions there is a problem and even then... stay out of it.

[Spy Car]

I have several friends with children on the spectrum. Those that got early intervention are now as young pre-teens and teens much better off than those that did to get intervention until later. In one case, a child that was actually totally non verbal and was not potty trained until late is now thriving in middle school and should be able to live on his own. He now tests as not on the spectrum, although you can see signs if you know what to look for.

 

Seeing the difference that early therapy can make, I would bring up the possibility if I suspected it at all. I would rather help someone out in the long run even if it hurt in the short term.

 

If you saw someone's child had a broken leg that could be fixed but only fixed well if caught early, would you tell them?

 

An older child that it won't make a difference, I would not bring it up, but someone in an age range where help can make a huge difference, I would err on the side of being able to get help for the child.

 

:iagree:

 

Bill

[JeneralMom]

DS7 is very gifted. For a long time it was very frustrating for him to be mentally ready to do stuff but physically unable. He is also a perfectionist so will shut down if he thinks he cannot do somthing exactly perfectly the first time (so do I) - hence his problem with math. We actually had his hearing tested because we thought he was deaf (congenital deafness runs in DH's family) but it turns out his hearing is so sensitive that they had to stop the test. He gets very upset in situations where there are lots of competing noises and shuts down, so things like concerts or fairs are really hard for him.

[SKL]

No, not after just that much input. Halloween can be a very overwhelming experience if you think about it. Different kids do "overwhelming" in different ways.

 

If you observed the child a lot, I still would not say anything unless I felt the child was in danger of having important needs neglected, or if the parent expressed an interest in possible causes of the child's symptoms.

 

I have a nephew who was diagnosed with Aspergers at 15. I had known he had Aspergers since he was about 7. I just knew. I mentioned it to my mom and sister, but not to my nephew's parents. No way. When my brother mentioned the diagnosis, my sister said, "oh, we've known that for years." (My brother wasn't quite sure he agreed, still.) However, I will note that my nephew is pretty high-functioning. His mom may or may not have guessed Aspergers, but she has always seen that he needed work on the social side, and she put in a lot of effort to keep him more or less in the real world. I think if it were left up to my brother (who is probably also an Aspie), he might have needed an intervention, because my brother just chalked everything up to Nephew being too intelligent to bother.

[Heather in Neverland]

When my ds was 3yo, a babysitter (who was a woman older than me with kids older than mine) mentioned that my ds showed a lot of signs of sensory integration dysfunction. I had never heard of that. I just thought he was a "handful."

 

I got very defensive and I stopped calling her to babysit.

 

Two years later, after my ds was kicked out of two different preschools for his behavior, I stumbled across "The Out of Sync Child" at a bookstore which is all about SID.

 

When I read the description I realized instantly that it was describing my ds and I remembered what that babysitter had said. I sat in the aisle at Barnes and Noble and cried.

 

To this day I wish...

 

1. I could apologize to her

 

2. I could have those two years back and get earlier intervention for my ds

 

Just another perspective for you. :grouphug:

 

 

 

.

[Joyofsixreboot]

As a parent with a child on the spectrum, no I would not. This is not information I feel the need to freely share with everyone about my kids, unless necessary. I realize some would figure it out on their own. The parents may already know. Some of this could just be typical quirky 4yo behavior.

 

:iagree:

[Kathryn]

Good to know. I've got to say, I am totally stunned by some of these remarks. :confused: I do know it's a sensitive thing to suggest to a friend that you observe some oddities in their child - that is why I asked. However, I cannot understand someone being "offended" that someone is "judging" their kid. That is totally baffling to me! FWIW, this is not an acquaintance I just met over lunch last week. I've known this family for over a decade, including the circumstances of this little boy's conception and birth which was traumatic. It's not the first time I've ever thought he was a bit of an outlier in behavior; it's just probably the first time that I've been in a setting where I was persistently observing him. The kids were trick-or-treating, so my focus the entire night was what the kids were doing.

 

Anyway. All that to say I cannot imagine why someone would be *offended* that a good friend was concerned about their child. I can see how it could be annoying if you've heard it 20 times already - and of course, I would never dream of saying something where the child or the child's siblings could hear it! But just to say, "I'm worried about a couple of things I notice with BooBear..." I just don't see why that would be *offensive*.

 

It is also not the first time I thought a child was on the autism spectrum before the parent got a dx. In that case, it was someone I had only just met and I assumed he had probably already been diagnosed and that the mother rightfully had not mentioned it. I said nothing about it, which I think was correct. It was a few months later, though, that she had him tested upon a teacher's suggestion and learned that he had HFA.

 

FWIW, I don't get the being offended either. I'd be touched that someone cared enough to share their concerns with me. The only reason I wouldn't come right out and say something is because I've learned from these threads that other people feel very defensive about any perceived insult to their children, and apparently suggesting that their behaviors might be outside the range of normal is insulting.

 

When my ds was 3yo, a babysitter (who was a woman older than me with kids older than mine) mentioned that my ds showed a lot of signs of sensory integration dysfunction. I had never heard of that. I just thought he was a "handful."

 

I got very defensive and I stopped calling her to babysit.

 

Two years later, after my ds was kicked out of two different preschools for his behavior, I stumbled across "The Out of Sync Child" at a bookstore which is all about SID.

 

When I read the description I realized instantly that it was describing my ds and I remembered what that babysitter had said. I sat in the aisle at Barnes and Noble and cried.

 

To this day I wish...

 

1. I could apologize to her

 

2. I could have those two years back and get earlier intervention for my ds

 

Just another perspective for you. :grouphug:

 

 

 

.

 

:grouphug:

[Rebecca VA]

(Haven't read the other posts, but...) I would only dare to point out the possibility if I were someone who really understood Aspergers and had dealt with a number of Aspie kids. I would not do this if I had just read about Aspergers somewhere and thought the child might fit the symptoms. Such a presumptuous suggestion needs to come from someone with credibility.

[ereks mom]

It would depend on how well I knew the family and how close I was to the parents. I am a professional educator who has worked with many children over the years, so I recognize odd behaviors and am able to categorize many of them. On two occasions, I have spoken (gently) to families whose children I suspected of having issues, and Asperger's in particular. I did not attempt to diagnose the children, but I did speak to the parents about their children's odd behaviors, and I suggested that there were similarities to children I had known with Asperger's or mild autism. I suggested testing. One of the families was my BIL & SIL, and the other was a couple who are long-time friends (20+ years). In both cases, the parents had the children tested, and my suspicions were confirmed: each of the boys was diagnosed with Asperger's. I do not regret having mentioned my concerns to the parents, but I would not have brought up the subject with anyone who was not a close friend or family member, in spite of my experience in this area.

Edited November 2, 2012 by ereks mom

[texasmama]

Food for thought: Diagnosing a child on the autistic spectrum is an involved process, even for a professional. When considering broaching the topic with a friend/relative/neighbor, I would suggest not using labels like "Asperger's" but rather validating a parent's concerns about specific behaviors.

 

As a therapist, I did not diagnose child clients on the autistic spectrum. If I was concerned that a child exhibited some of those behaviors, I referred the parent out for testing/evaluation.

[AnIslandGirl]

How about just a gentle, "Wow, your son really seemed to have a tough time trick or treating. I have a (friend, family member etc.) who has Aspergers/ Autism and they react the same way when they have too much stimulation." That opens the door to a conversation and says that yes, you noticed their child had a difficult time, and that you are there if they want to talk about it. If they don't at least it's off your mind.

[SKL]

FWIW, I don't get the being offended either. I'd be touched that someone cared enough to share their concerns with me. The only reason I wouldn't come right out and say something is because I've learned from these threads that other people feel very defensive about any perceived insult to their children, and apparently suggesting that their behaviors might be outside the range of normal is insulting.

 

 

I did point out an issue with one baby. I approached it very gingerly. "She doesn't seem to like being in that position. Did your doctor say anything about that? [No, the doctor says everything is fine.] Was your older child in that same stage at that age? [No.] Well, of course all kids develop differently, but you might want to ask your doctor about it at your next appointment." I still think the mom was very defensive, but she did start being more aware and proactive. Turns out the child has some major issues and needed therapy early on. So I'm glad I mentioned it, but it is still an awkward memory.

 

Now I had friends ask me about my dd, but they were not so tactful. :tongue_smilie: The worst was "are you sure she's not a mongoloid?" That was 5 years ago and while my friend has no recollection of the conversation, it has obviously stuck with me! Turns out my kid has issues, but I'm the kind of parent who tends to be very aware and proactive anyway, and I have more kid experience / knowledge than most people. I've been noticing and researching my kid's "stuff" over the years and that might actually make me more defensive - I don't know. I certainly don't go around telling people my child is having trouble with math; I don't want people to form an opinion about her intelligence. A parent's silence about his kids' symptoms should not be read as an indicator that the parent has not noticed. That may or may not be the case.

Edited November 2, 2012 by SKL

[Murphy101]

When my ds was 3yo, a babysitter (who was a woman older than me with kids older than mine) mentioned that my ds showed a lot of signs of sensory integration dysfunction. I had never heard of that. I just thought he was a "handful."

 

I got very defensive and I stopped calling her to babysit.

 

Two years later, after my ds was kicked out of two different preschools for his behavior, I stumbled across "The Out of Sync Child" at a bookstore which is all about SID.

 

When I read the description I realized instantly that it was describing my ds and I remembered what that babysitter had said. I sat in the aisle at Barnes and Noble and cried.

.

 

Well yet another POV.

 

I read the book knowing we have some issues going on and it infuriated me. I HATED that book. *shrugs*

 

To the OP-

 

It IS offensive just like it is offensive to point out physical characteristics that are deemed out of the norm or odd. I wouldn't tell someone I think their kid talks weird and needs speech therapy or should have OT or whatever for some other thing I notice that seems odd. Most people would think that it is none of my business and if they wanted to make it my business they would mention it. Also, whether we agree with it or not, if you aren't a professional, they probably don't think you know squat much less enough to armchair dx from one hectic crazy Halloween night. Even a professional needs more than that.

 

There is also the issue of basicly saying to a parent that you think you know more about their kid than they do. Yeah. That almost never goes over well even when you are right. Do these parents comment on having problems with their son? Does he seem to struggle in school? If not, then I'd keep my mouth shut. If yes, then I would wait until the next trouble is mentioned and gentle ask if they have considered having him evaluated. Maybe they have and have chosen not to for now. Maybe they haven't for other reasons. Maybe they did have him evaluated and are dealing with it but have chosen not to share that with everyone else bc it is no one else's business.

 

I guess I am wondering why the OP feels a need to being it up and what she hopes to accomplish by doing so?

 

OP, let's say you do bring it up. How do you expect or hope the parent(s) will respond? How will you handle it if they basicly think you should MYOB, whether they agree with you or not, and decide to not hang out with you as much? How will you react if they know and choose not to handle it the way you think they should?

[Scarlett]

Good to know. I've got to say, I am totally stunned by some of these remarks. :confused: I do know it's a sensitive thing to suggest to a friend that you observe some oddities in their child - that is why I asked. However, I cannot understand someone being "offended" that someone is "judging" their kid. That is totally baffling to me! .

 

I am a little shocked too....I mean I do see their point but I know a young man---he is 21 now--who has Aspergers and his dad was telling me a story the other day about when this boy was about 4 and had made a big mess of some sort and the dad made him clean it up with with the vacuum and the vacuum noise terrified the child. He was lamenting how if only he had known his son had Aspergers he would have never handled it that way. :( In his case I certainly think he would have loved to have known earlier than they found out....(I think he was diagnosed when he was 8).

 

I have a quirky kid....and although I sometimes hear comments from those who know him/me well that irritate me I am never offended when someone that loves my son is concerned about him.

 

I have received a lot of good advice that I've used with him over the years.

[Murphy101]

I guess for me it is never just concern. It is an underlying presumption.

 

A presumption that I don't know enough to know whether my kid is acting odd or not.

 

A presumption that everyone who a kid who is "out of sync", should want to evaluate it. Many don't. Many decide that even if their child is marching to their own drum beat, it's likely not severe enough to need treating and will turn out okay.

 

A presumption that unsolicited advice should be welcomed. Good grief, this board and FB are full examples where even very close family can't pull that off with a good reaction outcome. I'd be very hesitant to try that with a friend that I am not sister close to.

[Murphy101]

I can't believe people are referring to children on the spectrum as broken.

 

Children with aspergers do not have broken minds that need fixed like a broken arm.

 

If you can't see why that is highly offensive, then yeah.., that explains why you don't understand why some say they would be offended.

[LucyStoner]

Only if you are personally prepared to accept, and not be offended by their reaction to your statements.

 

Autism and spectrum disorders are the diagnosis of the day. There is a lot of misinformation and stereotypes about who has it and what it looks like. Like those who assume that my son's giftedness is a just a trait of his HFA, when on average the IQs of those with HFA are pretty varied.

 

Take that I have had as many "helpful" folks tell me that's son did not have autism as I did "helpful" folks who told me he did. I am not offended by these statements but I did and do grow weary. It is presumptuous to assume that you are in the know on what the parents know. While your remarks could be helpful, they also could be considered by the family to be hurtful. You can't choose how they react or respond, so don't say anything unless you are willing to accept that they may respond in anger and things may be strained between you.

 

Also, never assume that you are the only one to have said anything. We all think we have unique observations. Believe me, we don't often do. It is excceedingly likely that a parent of a child with certain traits has been told many times before.

[wapiti]

I guess for me it is never just concern. It is an underlying presumption.

 

A presumption that I don't know enough to know whether my kid is acting odd or not.

 

This is closer to what I wanted to say. Thinking some more, feeling "offended" is probably not quite the right word, for me anyway - maybe hurt that a random person with no particular expertise would armchair-quarterback my kid's oddities, combined with the fact that various aspects of a spectrum diagnosis are controversial and circular such that even doctors disagree in some cases. Many, many 4 y.o. kids with sensory issues might appear spectrum-ish on occasion to the non-expert outside world. I've even read some non-experts (i.e., parents on-line) state that a kid with sensory issues and speech delay is de facto on the spectrum, which is simply not true. Maybe I'm oversensitive due to the fact that the diagnostic criteria are controversial (see, e.g., the controversy over the draft DSM V, though I'm not up to date on this at all) and that, just from what I've read, interpretation of the diagnostic criteria does not seem to be consistent and uniform amongst all types of doctors. I guess it boils down to the fact that the described 4 y.o.'s odd behavior while trick-or-treating would be grossly insufficient to deduce a possible cause and assume that the parents were unaware of such possible cause.

 

I wouldn't see anything wrong with suggesting that a parent look into testing for possible "developmental issues" (or something similarly vague) or even reminding the parent to ask the pediatrician, if the parent asked for advice or bemoaned the fact that they didn't know what to do. But a parent who says, "yeah, my kid acts weird sometimes," that may just be a parent embarrassed that their child stands out.

Edited November 2, 2012 by wapiti

[momto3innc]

OP--I think you sound that you are trying to help your friend, I really do.

 

Honestly? I'm not sure what I would do. Probably nothing unless we were very very close and I knew they really would be helped by saying something in a kind and gentle way.

 

I had an experience with this with my oldest. He's very bright and a bit "quirky"--mainly he just has a huge vocabulary and knows too much stuff--so he doesn't talk about things normal kids do sometimes. Add to that when he was little he was shy so he didn't like to make eye contact with people he didn't know well (fine with people he knew, now he's fine with everyone). Well, we were seeing a professional for some reading help for him and she told me I really needed to have him tested for Aspergers because she was very concerned. We ended up doing extensive testing even though in my gut I really believed he was just quirky and did not have the correct symptoms (I read several books in the process). $1500 later...he did not remotely have it. Not even close. On one hand, I feel much better that I know since he is sort of quirky. On the other hand, it's a lot of money to be out, but I was so freaked out by this lady who seemed so knowledgeable that I felt I would be doing my child a great disservice to not find out. Later, I found out she was constantly telling people their kids might have it:glare:. That probably doesn't help...just my experience.

[KidsHappen]

But I think the idea is, you are daring to say my child is not perfect, and that offends me.

 

I don't think that it is so much that someone is daring to say that the child is not perfect. After all most parents realize that their children are not perfect. I think it is more that someone it daring to say that there is something noticeably wrong with the child.

[GoVanGogh]

I don't think that it is so much that someone is daring to say that the child is not perfect. After all most parents realize that their children are not perfect. I think it is more that someone it daring to say that there is something noticeably wrong with the child.

Exactly.

And how do you know that the person has not already heard the same comment earlier in the day or three times the previous week? Maybe you just said it to the parent after they were up half the night with a meltdown situation. You could say something one day and it be a good moment to bring it up... But you don't know. More than likely, you are going to say something at the worse possible moment, because that is just the way things go. It is better to keep thy mouth shut.

 

My own experience: My child had just been evaluated for autism, but we were told he didn't have it. I hadn't shared any of that with many people. Out of the blue, a (now former!) friend told me my child reminded her of the guy in the movie, Rain Man. We were driving down the interstate, but I so wanted to just jump out of her car right then. I totally lost it. She said, "What? I thought you would want to know..." Then she cited her qualifications that she was basing her comments on. Really. I didn't care. We already had our concerns. We had already gone through the eval. I was just wanted to move on, not be told - yet again - that my child was noticeably 'different.'

[Spy Car]

I think there is a problem with "the culture of outrage" that makes people way too defensive and too easily offended when people attempt to be kind, caring, and compassionate. Good grief.

 

What are the ethics? Is ones duty not to "offend" an adult by mentioning a concern about that persons child? Or is the duty to the child, whose problems might not be being addressed?

 

Personally I don't see being quiet as an act of kindness, but rather as a type of cowardice—especially if one has reasonable belief that there is a real problem, and the parent seems either unaware, inattentive, or unmotivated to act on the child's behalf. I would sleep easier knowing I tried to reach out to a friend in a compassionate way than if I just kept silent.

 

Bill

Edited November 2, 2012 by Spy Car

[Kathryn]

I think there is a problem with "the culture of outrage" that makes people way too defensive and too easily offended when people attempt to be kind, caring, and compassionate. Good grief.

 

What are the ethics? Is ones duty not to "offend" an adult by mentioning a concern about that persons child? Or is the duty to the child, whose problems are might not being addressed?

 

Personally I don't see being quiet as an act of kindness, but rather as a type of cowardice—especially if one has reasonable belief that there is a real problem, and the parent seems either unaware, inattentive, or unmotivated to act on the child's behalf. I would sleep easier knowing I tried to reach out to a friend in a compassionate way than if I just kept silent.

 

Bill

 

:iagree:

[PeacefulChaos]

I didn't read any of the responses, but I wouldn't say anything unless asked.

[QuirkyKapers]

Overall, my inclination would be no. I wouldn't say anything. Some things I would consider would be on how good of friends we were and if we had the type of relationship that the person was open to hearing these types of things. If I was asked directly, I would suggest if there is concerns that friend get it checked out. I would also try and find out what is causing them concern. If I noticed the same things, I would tell them that and again suggest them checking it out. If they pressed me for an answer, I might tell them more specifically what I thought. I guess I just hesitate to say anything too directly since I have seen people do this and they have been wrong. It has hurt the relationship with the other party involved.

[Ipsey]

I have a friend whose son is greatly verbally delayed. I noticed he wasn't meeting mile-stones early on (and I have some training in this area), but I was too much of a coward to mention it.

 

He's in 4-kindergarten now, and struggling, and they're just getting him in with a speech pathologist.

 

His mother told me the other day that she wondered if he was behind, but she thought that it was just quiet, and no one had mentioned it as being unusual. . . so she delayed. She was beside herself.

 

I felt awful.

[Mommy22alyns]

No, I wouldn't say a word.

[Farrar]

I've also wondered this a few times about various kids I've known. One thing that makes me pause more than with other parents is knowing that these kids are all homeschooled. Therefore, there aren't "expert" teachers or school counselors who see the child and can speak up to the parents if there are concerns. I know that we tend to be an independent bunch and I do firmly believe that parents know their kids best... but my experiences teaching showed me that sometimes parents don't want to face things or need an outsider to help them wake up or see things about their child. There's a way in which behavior we deal with as parents every day can become normalized when it probably shouldn't.

 

On the other hand, I do still think someone trying to diagnose your kid is a bit offensive. Yes, it's out of concern, but I've seen people do it so rudely and I think most parents do feel like it's a judgment on them - either because they created whatever it is (as absurd as that is, I think that's a gut feeling) or because they didn't see it. Denial ain't just a river and all that. In Quill's situation, I wouldn't say anything. Four yos are whiny. ToT'ing kids are wild. It's just not enough for me. But a child I had seen more often, especially in a co-op class or regularly at a park day or something, I would broach it carefully.

[LucyStoner]

 

Personally I don't see being quiet as an act of kindness, but rather as a type of cowardice—especially if one has reasonable belief that there is a real problem, and the parent seems either unaware, inattentive, or unmotivated to act on the child's behalf. I would sleep easier knowing I tried to reach out to a friend in a compassionate way than if I just kept silent.

 

Bill

 

It is a huge leap to assume that a parent is "unaware, inattentive or unmotivated" just because they don't discuss their child's health status while trick or treating.

 

In most instances, the person is truly not sharing anything the parents have not already considered. It's not like autism is rare these days. I think the rudeness comes from insinuating that the casual (and usually inexperienced and operating off of stereotypes) observer knows a child better and is more concerned about their health than the PARENT.

 

Again, I am not offended by these comments (yeah, he has autism) but I am not informed or helped in any appreciable way by them in most cases, pre or post diagnosis. If you have a child dealing with the same, it may be more helpful. But mostly people are operating off "facts" gleaned from TV shows with a quirky character or their cousin's child or whatever. And if I confirm their diagnosis, I am under no obligation to share details of my son's treatment because that is usually what helpful and nosey types ask about next. I am not in the habit of discussing things like that with people I am not close to, nor should they have any reason to believe it is any of their business. Also the vast majority make these statements with the child age 3 or age 7 standing right there. Like the child doesn't hear or exist.

 

I would never walk up to a parent of an obese child and helpfully tell them that they should to x, y or z. I trust that the parents are smart enough to see it and act in their best interest. If they are not willing to do that, it still is a waste of my time to tell them.

Edited November 2, 2012 by kijipt

[RoundAbout]

I guess my opinion is colored by the fact that all of the parents in my circle of friends are extremely aware and proactive in getting help for their children. In most cases they mention something to me before I ever even noticed anything different with their kids. I always encourage them to go to their doctors and teachers because early evals can't hurt and could do a great deal of good.

 

I guess I should clarify that it wouldn't bother me if someone brought up something odd about my child, but the idea of someone insisting or suggesting a *diagnosis* other than a trained medical professional would irk me. I had someone who kept insisting I look into SPD for my son, when his problem was very clearly an orthopedic issue confirmed by a team of specialists. I guess I wish they had actually started a dialogue with me rather than start off with "I think your son has X." That kind of approach can actually be more harmful than taking an open ended one, because other causes might be overlooked and it might take more time to get at a real answer. That's why I urged the OP to bring up behaviors but not the diagnosis.

 

I guess I also wonder where people would draw the line. I've seen young overweight kids and also teens with horrible acne, where I felt their health and/or self-esteem could be at serious risk, but I just never felt it was my place to say anything. I assumed the family was already dealing with it (or choosing not to). I think these are more analogous than a broken bone, because like behavior issues they are on a spectrum from not too serious to very problematic.

[sbgrace]

Pay particular attention to the replies of those with autistic kids. It's one thing to look at this as "I'd want to know" when you have typically developing kids. It's another to know what it initially feels like to face that your child is possibly autistic.

 

I will say that the person who first brought it up to me...well, that's a really horrible moment I'll never forget. I threw up when she left. I'm glad it was a therapist and not a close friend or relative. I think it's better to come from a professional like a pediatrician or therapist. Even then they will not usually say "I think autism" because there are so many possibilities. They would just suggest an evaluation.

 

Anyway, as a parent with a spectrum child who believes in helping kids with interventions, I have never made a suggestion of autism when I've seen concerns unless the parent brought up the possibility of autism themselves to me. I have listened to parental concerns about x or y that I know are strong indicators of autism. In those cases, since the parent didn't say autism, I've just suggested resources to evaluate development (early intervention or schools after 3). Even then it's often not received well and I get that. Parents have to come to things in their own time and that's ok. Kids brains don't slam shut at 6 and never grow. Parents can have space to realize things.

 

Beyond that you don't know what is going on behind the scenes. They may be post-evaluation or on the road toward that already. It's painful enough to face these possibilities without feeling like the whole world is looking at your child through those eyes.

Edited November 2, 2012 by sbgrace

[GoVanGogh]

I think there is a problem with "the culture of outrage" that makes people way too defensive and too easily offended when people attempt to be kind, caring, and compassionate. Good grief.

 

What are the ethics? Is ones duty not to "offend" an adult by mentioning a concern about that persons child? Or is the duty to the child, whose problems might not be being addressed?

 

Personally I don't see being quiet as an act of kindness, but rather as a type of cowardice—especially if one has reasonable belief that there is a real problem, and the parent seems either unaware, inattentive, or unmotivated to act on the child's behalf. I would sleep easier knowing I tried to reach out to a friend in a compassionate way than if I just kept silent.

To me it isn't about offending the parent, it is about honoring them as an adult and respecting their right to privacy. How do you honestly know someone isn't doing something about it or hasn't already sought help? Do you know how exhausting it is to get help and get a diagnosis?

My own child has gone through screening multiple times over the past nine years, all with the same 'negative' diagnosis. Yes, I know he has quirks. Yes, I know he is different. It doesn't make me unaware or unmotivated because I haven't shared with you (you, in the general sense) what we have gone through to get him tested.

[Tidbits of Learning]

No,I would not based off one night that can fry adults into just going through the motions. He could be getting sick or just overwhelmed by it all. TorTing makes me mental and stressed.

[stripe]

I've also wondered this a few times about various kids I've known. One thing that makes me pause more than with other parents is knowing that these kids are all homeschooled. Therefore, there aren't "expert" teachers or school counselors who see the child and can speak up to the parents if there are concerns. I know that we tend to be an independent bunch and I do firmly believe that parents know their kids best... but my experiences teaching showed me that sometimes parents don't want to face things or need an outsider to help them wake up or see things about their child. There's a way in which behavior we deal with as parents every day can become normalized when it probably shouldn't.

 

My kids' pediatrician said many parents insist to her that that's just how their child is, they're just quirky, and decline further medical intervention. And in several threads, many parents have said they avoid check ups/ well child exams, so there is a potential for hiding from the truth.

[GoVanGogh]

My kids' pediatrician said many parents insist to her that that's just how their child is, they're just quirky, and decline further medical intervention. And in several threads, many parents have said they avoid check ups/ well child exams, so there is a potential for hiding from the truth.

On the flip side:

My child has never missed a well-child visit in nearly 11 years. He went through early childhood intervention. I have pushed for nine years, with two different pediatricians, to have more testing done. Our current pediatrician finally relented and gave us a referral, but was very dismissive - again - of my concerns. The specialist he sent us to is now charging us with medical negligence because, in her words, "any doctor would have diagnosed this issue a long time ago." In the end it appears that specialist was incorrect in their diagnosis, leaving us still without an answer.

If only it were as easy as waving a wand over a child to find the key to their brain.

[Spy Car]

It is a huge leap to assume that a parent is "unaware, inattentive or unmotivated" just because they don't discuss their child's health status while trick or treating.

 

In most instances, the person is truly not sharing anything the parents have not already considered. It's not like autism is rare these days. I think the rudeness comes from insinuating that the casual (and usually inexperienced and operating off of stereotypes) observer knows a child better and is more concerned about their health than the PARENT.

 

Again, I am not offended by these comments (yeah, he has autism) but I am not informed or helped in any appreciable way by them in most cases, pre or post diagnosis. If you have a child dealing with the same, it may be more helpful. But mostly people are operating off "facts" gleaned from TV shows with a quirky character or their cousin's child or whatever. And if I confirm their diagnosis, I am under no obligation to share details of my son's treatment because that is usually what helpful and nosey types ask about next. I am not in the habit of discussing things like that with people I am not close to, nor should they have any reason to believe it is any of their business. Also the vast majority make these statements with the child age 3 or age 7 standing right there. Like the child doesn't hear or exist.

 

I would never walk up to a parent of an obese child and helpfully tell them that they should to x, y or z. I trust that the parents are smart enough to see it and act in their best interest. If they are not willing to do that, it still is a waste of my time to tell them.

 

Your response is emblematic of the problem. I made a "conditional statement," that is "if" one saw a problem they thought might not be being addressed that it would be better to speak to the other parent in a kind and compassionate manner. Unfortunately people get hyper-defensive, and that can work against the interests of children.

 

One would hope every parent recognizes conditions or delays their children may be having, but such is not always the case. Often it is the school system and teachers that come to (utterly surprised) parents with concerns. I understand that for a parent that is totally on top of their child's situation being reminded their child is different by another parent might not make their day, but dealing with that in an adult fashion—and understanding that it takes some moral courage to advance the topic with another parent—is in the best interests of children.

 

Sitting around with unaddressed concerns while children go without support is a terrible alternative.

 

Bill

Edited November 3, 2012 by Spy Car

[Spy Car]

My kids' pediatrician said many parents insist to her that that's just how their child is, they're just quirky, and decline further medical intervention. And in several threads, many parents have said they avoid check ups/ well child exams, so there is a potential for hiding from the truth.

 

:iagree:

 

And the number of parents on this forum who (by their own admission) don't take their children for routine wellness visits with doctors is shocking.

 

Bill

[stripe]

If only it were as easy as waving a wand over a child to find the key to their brain.

 

I didn't mean to imply doctors are perfect. I've had plenty of failures with them for myself and my kids where they totally missed something or gave bad advice.

 

My point is more that some people still shrink away from a diagnosis even if a doctor raises concerns.

[GoVanGogh]

And the number of parents on this forum who (by their own admission) don't take their children for routine wellness visits with doctors is shocking.

I actually started to post about that the other day, then changed my mind. I know there have been posts in the past, asking if anyone had anything 'caught' by their doctor during a well-child visit. Many people have replied that they had. I am wondering the opposite: Anyone had anything missed?

Our (preemie) child has had a number of health problems over the years, so has had more than his share of exams from pediatricians to specialists to therapists.

I was just floored when a specialist told us that it was 'obvious' our child had never been seen by a doctor before. Her diagnosis does appear to be wrong, but it also appears that DS does have something that very well should have been caught much earlier. (Especially considering I have specifically pointed this out to our pediatrician two years in a row.)

 

I didn't mean to imply doctors are perfect. I've had plenty of failures with them for myself and my kids where they totally missed something or gave bad advice.

 

My point is more that some people still shrink away from a diagnosis even if a doctor raises concerns.

I understand.

I am just frustrated. And #%^^&@ that a doctor would charge me with medical negligence. :glare:

[bzymom]

Mom of Aspie here. I would not under those circumstances.

 

I would if it were a close family member and I had spent a great deal of time with the family. I would if asked. Other than that, nope.

 

And there will be plenty of people in their lives who will make it their job to constantly remark upon this little one's behavior, their suspicions, their diagnoses. It is not generally helpful.

[LucyStoner]

Your response is emblematic of the problem. I made a "conditional statement," that is "if" one saw a problem they thought might not be being addressed that it would be better to speak to the other parent in a kind and compassionate manner. Unfortunately people get hyper-defensive, and that can work against the interests of children.

 

One would hope every parent recognizes conditions or delays their children may be having, but such is not always the case. Often it is the school system and teachers that come to (utterly surprised) parents with concerns. I understand that for a parent that is totally on top of their child's situation being reminded their child is different by another parent might not make their may, but dealing with that in an adult fashion—and understanding that it takes some moral courage to advance the topic with another parent—is in the best interests of children.

 

Sitting around with unaddressed concerns while children go without support is a terrible alternative.

 

Bill

 

It is hardly an act of "courage" to presume to know a child better than the parent. No professional I know would offer up a diagnosis without evaluation. At most they would say, in a non-professional setting, that the parent should consider reading a certain book or seeking screening from their medical provider. Every single "courageous" and "helpful" person I know who has either asserted that my child has autism or insists that he does not has zero qualifications to make such claims and frankly more often than not, they are seriously basing their opinions sitcoms. No joke. If you can't see how rude and tedious listening to everyone's uninformed opinions are for diagnosis and treatment plans, then you are less concerned with the family and the child facing autism than you think you are. It's not an infrequent occurrence. It's not about how my day goes, it's about not talking about a child like they are only a diagnosis or that they are not there or they can't hear you.

 

Do you tell parents of fat kids to take the fruit loops out of their cart? I doubt you even tell your friends with fat kids they should get help. Is that an act of courage? If that is not acceptable, why is it acceptable to postulate a medical diagnosis without either the credentials to do so or your opinion sought?

 

If someone has a real concern and is in a position to say something effective, the time to address it is not at a social event and it is not to offer a diagnosis. I want to be clear that my opinion is not to never say anything, it is the say the right thing, not be intrusive and to be sure that you are in a position to say something helpful based on lots of information, not one night of chaotic ToT.

Edited November 2, 2012 by kijipt

[Laurie4b]

I have several friends with children on the spectrum. Those that got early intervention are now as young pre-teens and teens much better off than those that did to get intervention until later. In one case, a child that was actually totally non verbal and was not potty trained until late is now thriving in middle school and should be able to live on his own. He now tests as not on the spectrum, although you can see signs if you know what to look for.

 

Seeing the difference that early therapy can make, I would bring up the possibility if I suspected it at all. I would rather help someone out in the long run even if it hurt in the short term.

 

I tend to agree because of the immense difference that early intervention makes--starting treatment at age 4 is different than at age 7. And yet it *is* hurtful to parents to have someone observe their child is different. I would not mention Asberger's per se. I think waiting for an opening when the parents mention the behavior themselves, and asking general questions about it, to draw them out and then "Have you talked with your pediatrician about it?" is a good first step. Listening and being alert for an opening to see if they are scared, searching for info, or oblivious (and I've met parents who really didn't think something was off because it was their first child or they attributed it to being a boy when the oldest was a girl, etc.) is helpful. Being supportive is so important.

[stripe]

I am wondering the opposite: Anyone had anything missed?

Yes. Also something missed at sick appointment where the real cause of the complaint was discovered 6 weeks later at a well child appointment.

 

Many of the problems my kids have had, I had to keep pestering the doctors about, in order to have any sort of treatment for.