Am I to hard on my kids??

[cseitter]

I have something that I have been a little upset about the last couple of days and I don't know why. It must be that I agree with it.

My cousin told me after a week at the river that I was to hard on my kids. So let me run it down for you and get some opionions.

 

We went to my mom's and boyfriends river house for the weekend. I have 5 kids 3 of which are under 5 and my cousin has 1 who is 13. I don't own anything at this house and my cousin and her dad (cousin by marriage and her dad is my mom's boyfriend, we try to keep it all in the family LOL) have purchased everything down to the beach toys.

 

I stayed on my kids to pick up after themselves and to make sure they didn't lose anything. I don't ask my kids to do things most of the time unless they have an option to say no I tell them to do something. My cous says I am bossy.

 

I also have a 15 year old DS and we have been working really hard on getting him to do what we ask/tell him to do BEFORE he does what he wants to do. He is a very concrete thinker and if you don't put consquences for things and inforce them he thinks you don't mean it.

For instance I told him to get a wheelbarrow one day to help me get some leaves up out of the yard. He says Wait until I take this last shot (basketball) now he was all the way across the yard from the basketball. I said no come help me and then play basketball. He says just let me take this shot. I repeat again and he walks over and takes his shot anyway. I grounded him from video games for a week.

 

Well over the weekend the guys (my cousin's DH, my DH, my cousins friend who was my ds's buddy all weekend and my mom's disabled BF) were all putting up ceiling tile. I told my DS to go down stairs and ask them if they needed help. I didn't specify but he knew he was suppose to ask his father (I asked him later who he was suppose to ask and he said DAD) but instead he asked my cousin's friend. Well Chris said Nah we have nothing for you to do and my ds went off on the golf cart. So when I found out I grounded him for a week. because he specifically asked the person who he KNEW would say for him not to do anything. But I recended and took the grounding off when I remembered that I didn't specify who he should speak to.

 

My goal in parenting ultimately is if my kids are away from me that they are well behaved, respectful and help out. My cousins are the first ones to tell me my kids are fantastic away from me and can come to their house anytime

 

So if you have read this far.... What do you think given the situation? How do you feel about the Ask/Tell thing? I just feel if I ASK them to do something I should expect a NO. If I tell them there is no choice just do it.

 

Anyway thanks for listening I feel better just getting it out.

[Unicorn.]

I think you should learn to relax just a little. Your ds is 15, and is at the point where he needs a little control over his life. You should have let him take the shot, and like most teens- that would probably mean 2 or 3 more as well. It wouldn't have cost you anything to let him, and it would make him feel like he has some control in his life. As for him disobeying, I might have grounded him for the day, but not the week. I think that's a bit harsh. As for the helping, you told him to go ask if they needed help. You said he was a concrete thinker and had to be given specifics. If you want him to ask dad, then you have to specify to ask dad.

[Cera]

Let me start by saying I think most people are too easy on their kids.

 

We have a recurrent issue similar to yours with the basketball. My almost seven year old regularly tells me "just a minute" or "when I finish." We are working on changing that to "may I finish this first" or "may I have one more minute." The issue for me is that I expect my kids not to tell me no when I ask something of them (and I am trying to be willing to give them a minute if it isn't urgent and they ask nicely).

 

I do think your punishments might be a bit hard but I have never had a 15 year old boy and don't know how persistent the issues are. With the basketball I would probably just explain the difference between asking for a minute and being defiant by taking one when I had said no then let it go if it isn't a constant problem. If defiance is a regular thing I would probably double the work load once he started.

 

When it comes to helping his father it would depend on if he was intentionally trying to avoid work. If he was I would double the work load. If he was just being an oblivious teenager I would explain the issue, try to remember to be more specific about EXACTLY what I wanted him to do and then find work equal to what he missed for him to do.

[Mama Geek]

My cousins are the first ones to tell me my kids are fantastic away from me and can come to their house anytime

 

 

I think in your heart you know that this answers your question. Your ask tell policy is clear and lets your kids know what to expect. You are getting the outcome that you want for your kids even though you are having to work on something specific at this time with your son.

 

I have now and will have in the future high expectations for our dd. She is 14 months old and has been able to go out to eat with us for at least 7 months without being a much of a disturbance to others. We expect her to not scream, to sit in her high chair, and to not make a mess. She does really well and we still do small corrections most of the time when we go out. We spent about 2 1/2-3 hours with my dh's colleagues for dinner at a restaurant. We walked her around now and then when she would get tired of sitting, but everyone remarked about how well she did. I know that there are people who think that we are too hard on her, but we are getting the results that we want and she still gets plenty of love and attention.

[momma2three]

Grounding him for a whole week when he did what you told him to seems really harsh, imho.

[momma2three]

I think in your heart you know that this answers your question. Your ask tell policy is clear and lets your kids know what to expect. You are getting the outcome that you want for your kids even though you are having to work on something specific at this time with your son.

 

I have now and will have in the future high expectations for our dd. She is 14 months old and has been able to go out to eat with us for at least 7 months without being a much of a disturbance to others. We expect her to not scream, to sit in her high chair, and to not make a mess. She does really well and we still do small corrections most of the time when we go out. We spent about 2 1/2-3 hours with my dh's colleagues for dinner at a restaurant. We walked her around now and then when she would get tired of sitting, but everyone remarked about how well she did. I know that there are people who think that we are too hard on her, but we are getting the results that we want and she still gets plenty of love and attention.

 

I just want to warn you... we had a toddler girl who did really well at restaurants, too. Then we had DS... :lol: How a 14mo behaves is all in the personality... not much you can do.

[Ria]

Well, since you asked, I do think your punishment was very harsh. It would have made more sense, and accomplished more, if you'd just had him pitch in and help with something else later. Grounding for a week....wow...I would reserve that for a really serious issue. Your son is past the age of being micro-managed. Give him some slack and work with him. He's not a little kid anymore.

[brightside]

OP, I think you are doing just fine. People should just mind their own business and their own children. Your goal is to raise well behaved adults, it seems to me you are well on your way. Good Job!:thumbup:

[duckens]

I stayed on my kids to pick up after themselves and to make sure they didn't lose anything.

I'm this way, too. I'm also ridiculously neurotic about stains.

 

I don't ask my kids to do things most of the time unless they have an option to say no I tell them to do something.

Me, too. But for the age my kids are (both under age 5), we do the picking up together. (Not implying that the following is your style): Rather than saying, "Go pick that up!", I sit on the floor and say, "I need help from E .....will you put these in the toybox? I need help from C ..... will you put these where the cars go?"

 

For instance I told him to get a wheelbarrow one day to help me get some leaves up out of the yard. He says Wait until I take this last shot (basketball) now he was all the way across the yard from the basketball. I said no come help me and then play basketball. He says just let me take this shot. I repeat again and he walks over and takes his shot anyway. I grounded him from video games for a week.

This situation is tougher. Had he known ahead of time that he would be helping with the leaves? Was this a request out of the blue that he should drop everything and come running for the non-emergency of the wheelbarrow? Usually when I ask my kids to do xyz, if they say they need to do abc first, I let them. If letting them do abc first results in xyz being done within a timely manner, then my goals/needs have been met.

 

BUT

1) abc must be done promptly because I AM WAITING, and

2) if xyz is NOT done, I will be cranky because child said they would do xyz and we try to keep our word. (Plus, I let them do abc first!)

 

Other disclaimer: if your teen has a history of NOT keeping his word to do xyz after being allowed to do abc, he would lose the privilege of negotiating in this way with me. He cannot be trusted to keep his word until he proves otherwise. Not keeping one's word in a reasonable situation would lose one's video games privileges until the situation was amended. (This may be one week, this may be one day, this may be one month).

 

I told my DS to go down stairs and ask them if they needed help.

Again, another tricky situation. Maybe a better wording of the instruction is, "Go ask, 'What can I do to help?' "

 

Also, there would be a discussion after the fact about how everyone else was working, but he shirked his responsibility to do his part in sharing in the labor. It is not honorable to let everyone else work when you are off playing. Perhaps assignment of extra chores helping dad can amend this lapse, and loss of video games until he has made this right. (This may be one week, this may be one day, this may be one month).

 

 

The trickiest thing about these situations with the teen is that they come across as

1) a request or expectation being made, specifically or implied,

2) request seems to be (from teen's pov) as out-of-the-blue, and

3) swift and immediate consequences of losing one week of video games with no notice with no way to fix the situation.

 

I don't think what you are asking in any of these situations is unreasonable, but there may be better ways to negotiate to get what you need accomplished.

 

That said, :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:.

[Matryoshka]

I have now and will have in the future high expectations for our dd. She is 14 months old and has been able to go out to eat with us for at least 7 months without being a much of a disturbance to others. We expect her to not scream, to sit in her high chair, and to not make a mess. She does really well and we still do small corrections most of the time when we go out. We spent about 2 1/2-3 hours with my dh's colleagues for dinner at a restaurant. We walked her around now and then when she would get tired of sitting, but everyone remarked about how well she did. I know that there are people who think that we are too hard on her, but we are getting the results that we want and she still gets plenty of love and attention.

 

I just want to warn you... we had a toddler girl who did really well at restaurants, too. Then we had DS... :lol: How a 14mo behaves is all in the personality... not much you can do.

 

 

Ooooh, yeah, you are just asking for the bolt of lightning to smite you. ;)

 

My mom always told me what a great baby/toddler I was and how she could bring me out to restaurants and anywhere else, and everyone would comment on how well behaved I was, and she'd look over at those people with the screaming toddlers throwing their food and think to herself how those poor mothers weren't doing it right.

 

Then she had my brother. She didn't go out to eat for years. God has a sense of humor. :D

[jujsky]

I think removing a privilege for a day (no video game or no TV) would have been a more reasonable punishment than grounding for a week. Other than that, I don't think you're out of line -- especially if your DS is pushing boundaries right now and you're trying to send him a clear message about who is in charge. I think telling instead of asking your littles to do things is fine too, so long as you're being polite and saying, "please," instead of barking orders at them. The tone in which you tell them to do things was not specified in your OP.

 

If it makes you feel any better, the same people who have told me I'm hard on my kids are also the first people to tell me how beautifully my kids behave. There's a correlation there that some people just don't see ;)

[JulieH]

Grounding him for a whole week when he did what you told him to seems really harsh, imho.

 

:iagree:

 

I think removing a privilege for a day (no video game or no TV) would have been a more reasonable punishment than grounding for a week. Other than that, I don't think you're out of line -- especially if your DS is pushing boundaries right now and you're trying to send him a clear message about who is in charge. I think telling instead of asking your littles to do things is fine too, so long as you're being polite and saying, "please," instead of barking orders at them. The tone in which you tell them to do things was not specified in your OP.

 

If it makes you feel any better, the same people who have told me I'm hard on my kids are also the first people to tell me how beautifully my kids behave. There's a correlation there that some people just don't see ;)

:iagree:with bolded part.

[sassenach]

IMO, your parenting sounds appropriate for your youngers, but over the top for your 15yo. At 15, it's time to move on from first time obedience training.

[LND1218]

It sounds like you are doing great!

 

I have been told I am too hard on my kids, but then I hear how wonderful they are. I am getting the results I want - I have wonderful well behaved kids (most of the time) who are a joy to be around for dh and I and anyone else who spends time with them.

 

I like how you rescinded when you realized that you weren't clear.

 

I also like that you grounded him from something - video games and didn't send him off to his room. I don't think a day is enough or at least around here because they don't play every day.

 

I , personally, don't ground my kids by sending them to their room for a long period of time (more than one day) because I feel like that can lead to bitterness. They have nothing to do but sulk and think about being mad at you. I will ground them from things like you did - video games, computer, TV etc.

 

Or I'll to add work or something else like that esp for my teen. You didn't do that job or you didn't do it correctly then you can do another one instead. I could be wrong on this, but I don't like encouraging teens to close themselves up in their room.

 

I think most parents are too easy on their kids.

 

It's easy to forget what having little ones is like. A friend of mine was recently being critical (in her own mind - she didn't say anything until later) of both my handling of my toddler and his behavior until she watched him for a couple hours. And she said apologetically - I forgot what that stage is like!

 

Generally, people who think I am too hard either have kids who I don't enjoy being around or they have older kids, so I take it with a grain of salt!

[NanceXToo]

Er. Yes. Yes, I do think you are too hard on your kids. Grounding for a week for the basketball thing seems overly harsh to me (a consequence, yes, but a week's worth? Eh, too much IMHO, for something like that).

 

My eyes kinda bugged out at the thing with the asking if they needed help, though. You didn't specify who to ask, he did as you told and "asked them," someone told him no, and that was that. So you punished him for a week because he didn't ask a specific person, when you didn't even tell him to? That's way over the top to me. Worst case scenario, you should have just asked your husband, "Can you use his help?" And if he said yes, told your kid, "They found something for you to do, go help," and if he said no, let it go.

[Jumping In Puddles]

I just want to warn you... we had a toddler girl who did really well at restaurants, too. Then we had DS... :lol: How a 14mo behaves is all in the personality... not much you can do.

:iagree:

 

Ooooh, yeah, you are just asking for the bolt of lightning to smite you. ;)

 

 

:lol::lol::lol:

 

Mama Geek :tongue_smilie: I'm just teasing. I have been where you are and...:D I'll agree with matroyshka -- God has a sense of humor!

[Nakia]

I don't have a teenager, but I used to be one, lol. I think it was a bit much to ground him for an entire week for what he did.

 

I find it very hard to find a balance between grace and "too much". Parenting is not for wimps, that's for sure.

 

:grouphug:

[Parrothead]

I think you are low expectations on the 'okay to say no if asked' for the 15 year old. That's the age where they should be realizing that 'asking= do now'. It's also a job skill..when boss asks you to move the crate, he's going to say 'joe, can you move that crate up against the wall?', and the response is not 'maybe, after I have my break'. Also at this age, anytime mama asks for help, it should be given immediately, 'cause mama has a lot of work to do and mama should be respected. Teen should know by now that he should step up and pitch in without being asked if parent is doing yard work, not play. Same with kitchen/cooking..no one at this age should be playing while mama is slaving on family chores.You might sit out in your lawn chair with a lemonade doing a crossword puzzle next time he's doing yard work to make the point.

 

With the downstairs biz, I'd be on Dad. Dad should be setting up boy for success here and have jobs for him as he works his way up from helper/parts runner to actually contributing.

:iagree:What she said.

 

If I don't want a "no" in reply to something that needs doing I make it a command instead of a request. Please keep in mind that a command does not have to sound like DO IT NOW!!!

 

I do allow for "One moment, please." I don't see anything wrong with that unless it is something of an urgent nature. Dd (and dh for that matter) can tell by tone if something is urgent or not.

 

From reading the interaction between you and your older ds, it sounded like he was pushing boundaries both times. It sounded like he was trying to get out of doing the right thing. I feel that as parents one of our most important jobs it to instill a sense of how important it is to do the right thing as often as humanly possible. Consequences for not doing the right thing should be appropriate.

 

In both cases your young man was attempting to get out of physical work. If it had been me, he would have had to do more physical work as a consequence both times. Taking away his video games is taking away one avenue to pleasure. He still had basketball and his other fun pursuits.

[Laura Corin]

I do think you might want to pull back a bit. I tend towards bossiness but I'm very aware that I want to maintain a good relationship with my children, especially into the teens.

 

When you were telling the littlies to tidy up, was it immediately after they had put down a toy? Or did you tell them in advance, for example, "We'll have a good tidy up before your snack," and then let them make a bit of a mess in the mean time. Littlies often like to browse between toys - I don't see anything wrong with that. Also, when they were tidying up, did you tidy alongside, modelling the behaviour? Often an example comes across as less bossy than repeated instructions.

 

With the 15yo: did it matter when he went to get the wheelbarrow? I try very hard to offer leeway to my teenager when possible, so that I can be obeyed without problems when necessary. I try to make it a rational relationship: if it matters that he does it now (unpack the dishwasher so that his brother can repack and I have space to make supper, for example) then I insist on it. If the leaves would still be there in thirty seconds after he took his basketball shot, and you were all having a relaxing weekend with family, then I would not have pushed it so hard. Our rule is that you can't disobey, but if you have a decent reason for doing something in a different way, I'm ready to listen (in most cases). "Mum, can I finish this chapter?" is usually fine, as is, "I've been planning this shot, is it okay if I make it before getting the wheelbarrow?"

 

The tiling question. Do you think that it's possible that your 15yo is feeling boxed in and lacking in autonomy, so is seeking out any wriggle-room he can find?

 

As far as future behaviour: Calvin has lots of opportunity, with me and with others, to do exactly what he's told. I do think that negotiating with a boss is also a good skill though: "I'd really like to move that box, but I'm finding something out for a customer right now. Is it okay if I sort that out first then come back and move it?"

 

FWIW, in Calvin's first year at school, the most common comments from teachers on his report were 'mature', 'polite' and 'respectful'. One teacher also told me that C. spoke very highly of me. He's not an indulged or badly-behaved child.

 

Laura

Edited September 8, 2011 by Laura Corin

[SKL]

I am having a hard time lately as well, so I feel your pain. I think it's important to lay a foundation of respect for parents, and that includes not talking back, doing what you're told, and doing the right thing (age-appropriate) even if you haven't been reminded. Although I'm not perfect about it, I do believe in consequencing them every time they have knowingly broken a rule. The hard part is figuring out what the consequence should be. I wouldn't have grounded your son for a week, but I would have given him some hard labor to do.

 

As far as the little ones picking up stuff, I see nothing wrong with that. I believe that picking up after oneself is part of whatever project one is doing. That's how I conduct my own life, too. Now, I'd be lying if I said I was consistent with my kids about this. But we're working in that direction.

 

Not sure if you have tried this, but one thing to consider is whether you are phrasing things as positively as possible. For example, instead of saying "you can't do x until you do abc," you could say "abc is your responsibility, and when it's done, you are free to do xyz as you choose."

[SKL]

Oh, and yes, I have been told I'm too hard on my kids - sometimes right in front of them. By people who don't have kids, I might add. Hmm. I wonder what they would say if I was more lax, and my kids went around breaking other people's stuff, screaming their heads off, etc.

[elegantlion]

I think the week grounding was too much as well. I find my ds needs turn around time when switching gears. I will often tell him, "In five minutes, I'll need your help." That gives him time to wrap up whatever and still be obedient.

 

What was the expectation on the trip? I find that may play into attitude as well. Did he expect to be at the lake house and just kick back? Are there always ongoing projects?

 

I also have to give him specific instructions. "I need you to go ask your dad what you can do to help." They don't automatically think what we see as the most obvious.

 

I'd also be interested your dh's take on this, not that you have to post it. However, I find a united front much easier to deal with. I also think at 15 some of the discipline needs to come from Dad, not me. What did Dad expect him to do while he was working?

 

I also give room for correction. If I had found my ds had asked the person most likely to say no, I would have sent him back down to help. If they were done I'd found something else for him to do.

 

I'd also consider what you have him do when grounded, again just a thought. Does he get out of work when being grounded? Or do you take away privileges and make him do the work anyway?

 

I was the queen of getting out of work as a kid. My parents never grounded me, but they'd get so aggravated that I could get out of anything. Yeah, I knew exactly what I was doing. Grounding would have just added to my time I got to do exactly what I wanted, which was be alone in my room.

[Samiam]

I don't think that you are too hard at all.

 

First, about staying on the little children about picking up things, I think that is great. I know, and I bet everyone here has too, that we have had children over who have no respect for things, ours or theirs. They don't pick up, and don't think twice about leaving things laying around. I think is a great to teach a child to be respectful of things, especially other people property. If you use it, you should pick it up. Great training for young children. It's doesn't have to be harsh or mean, it is just teaching them this is the way we do things. We clean up after ourselves.

 

As far as your 15 year old, nope, I completely get that too. First, waaaay to many teenagers would be just laying around, playing video games, etc and their parents would not even think to make them to offer to help. So first, that is great that you are instilling in him the thought to offer help to others. Second, my DS13 does that exact same thing "Wait, let me finish this never-ending video game first before I do what you ask" or "Wait, let me start and finish this bike ride that I was not even intending to do until you asked before I put help with groceries". My point is if I left it up to him, it would always be "Wait, I gotta do something else first"...which is a way of getting out of helping. It's his way of manipulating the situation to his favor, and I see it, and it's not gonna happen. I TOTALLY see my DS13 doing the same thing in terms of asking. He's a smart kid...he knows if he asks the one person who will say he doesn't have to help, he'll get out of it. Your son even agreed that he KNEW the right person to ask, but again, he choose to manipulate the situation by asking the other person.

 

Not bashing my son, or yours. Great, amazing, smart, all of that. But that "smart" can also be used in "evil" ways, lol. I feel that if you call their bluff, they will eventually get that you just can't pull the wool over Mom's eyes, and there are consequences when you try.

 

I provide a loving, nurturing home, but I also have a "no BS home".

 

I truly think that parents of only children sometimes do not understand how we have to parent when we have several children. My husband is an only child, while not to bash his mother, who did the best she could, we see many things that she did for him, as an only child, that we (we being me and even DH!) think are quite ridiculous (like making him completely seperate meals), and things that we choose that we would not do as parents. I know that I parent a bit differently now that I have three DS, than when I only had the first DS for the first five years.

 

So I don't think that your cousin, with only one child, can really comment on being too "hard" on your children (unless you were constantly yelling and shrieking). It's probably no big deal to have to pick up constantly after only one child. But add several more children, and they are not picking up after themselves, then it's a huge daily mess that YOU are having to deal with on top of the rest of life too. Not fair for you, and not fair for the children not learning more responsibility.

 

I think you handled it properly.

[Parrothead]

I truly think that parents of only children sometimes do not understand how we have to parent when we have several children. My husband is an only child, while not to bash his mother, who did the best she could, we see many things that she did for him, as an only child, that we (we being me and even DH!) think are quite ridiculous (like making him completely seperate meals), and things that we choose that we would not do as parents. I know that I parent a bit differently now that I have three DS, than when I only had the first DS for the first five years.

 

So I don't think that your cousin, with only one child, can really comment on being too "hard" on your children (unless you were constantly yelling and shrieking). It's probably no big deal to have to pick up constantly after only one child. But add several more children, and they are not picking up after themselves, then it's a huge daily mess that YOU are having to deal with on top of the rest of life too. Not fair for you, and not fair for the children not learning more responsibility.

 

I think you handled it properly.

As the parent of an only, I really have to beg to differ on this. Yes, I'm sure there are parents of only children that spoil their children. By the same token there are plenty of parents of multi children that spoil their kids. Honestly I've seen more multi child families that have spoiled brats than I have spoiled only children.

 

The old stereotype of spoiled only children is something that needs to go by the wayside.

 

Also just because one is the parent of an only child does not mean that one cannot have an opinion of the parenting skills of a parent of more than one. Children are individuals regardless of family size. If a parent need advice about a particular child it shouldn't matter if the advice is sound if it comes from a parent of many or a parent of one.

Edited September 8, 2011 by Parrothead

[Laura Corin]

I just want to warn you... we had a toddler girl who did really well at restaurants, too. Then we had DS... :lol: How a 14mo behaves is all in the personality... not much you can do.

 

I thought I was a brilliant mother. It turned out that Calvin was just unusually biddable as small child. Then I had a second....

 

Laura

[Scuff]

I think your standards are just fine. Whether you should have let him shoot one more or not, you didn't and then he outright did anyway. That needs a consequence. My oldest is only 10, but I find that if I let him get away with stuff like that it just breeds more of it.

 

As to the punishment, I'm with the pp who said add more work. Your grounding for a week for everything reminds me of my mother when we were teens. She'd just keep piling on weeks for every little thing and at some point you just don't care anymore because your summer is gone and you can't win.

[Pretty in Pink]

Little kids often need to be micro-managed and told exactly what to do. A fifteen year old doesn't like to be bossed around and really he shouldn't need to be. I don't think that anything you expected of your children was over the top, but there are probably better ways to get your teen to cooperate with you than the way you went about it.

 

Is it possible that your family is referring to your tone of voice and overall attitude towards your children? I know that I tend be short and bossy with my kids, especially when I am stressed.

[EJCMom]

Well, my kids are still little. My oldest will be 7 next week, and my youngest is three. Technically I ask. I'll say, "Emma, would you please put your clean clothes away." But, we've had many conversations about the fact that when their dad or I ask them to do something, we aren't *really* asking. We're just phrasing it in a way that is polite.

[Daisy]

Little kids often need to be micro-managed and told exactly what to do. A fifteen year old doesn't like to be bossed around and really he shouldn't need to be. I don't think that anything you expected of your children was over the top, but there are probably better ways to get your teen to cooperate with you than the way you went about it.

 

Is it possible that your family is referring to your tone of voice and overall attitude towards your children? I know that I tend be short and bossy with my kids, especially when I am stressed.

 

I agree.

 

Though I expect my 12yo to obey me immediately, I do try to give her enough space that she can choose to make good choices. I'm not sure that makes sense. I have high expectations but she's old enough that I can trust her to reach those expectations without my hovering.

 

Tone is huge. If I'm having an attitude with the kids or the 15yo had an attitude with me, then this is a whole different ballgame.

[elegantlion]

I truly think that parents of only children sometimes do not understand how we have to parent when we have several children. My husband is an only child, while not to bash his mother, who did the best she could, we see many things that she did for him, as an only child, that we (we being me and even DH!) think are quite ridiculous (like making him completely seperate meals), and things that we choose that we would not do as parents. I know that I parent a bit differently now that I have three DS, than when I only had the first DS for the first five years.

 

So I don't think that your cousin, with only one child, can really comment on being too "hard" on your children (unless you were constantly yelling and shrieking). It's probably no big deal to have to pick up constantly after only one child. But add several more children, and they are not picking up after themselves, then it's a huge daily mess that YOU are having to deal with on top of the rest of life too. Not fair for you, and not fair for the children not learning more responsibility.

 

I think you handled it properly.

 

Many parents of only children were not only children themselves. So I'll chose to focus on the word "sometimes" and pass some bean dip on that one. However, I will comment on picking up after one. Seriously? We didn't just pick up after ds being all thankful that there was only one mess. :tongue_smilie: Even with one, you still teach them to pick up. There is no elder child to model behavior, no younger one to get into their stuff to motivate them to pick it up. Parenting one is still parenting. We still have the same expectations of responsibility as if we had more children. And they couldn't blame the mess on someone else either. :lol:

 

As the parent of an only, I really have to beg to differ on this. Yes, I'm sure there are parents of only children that spoil their children. By the same token there are plenty of parents of multi children that spoil their kids. Honestly I've seen more multi child families that have spoiled brats than I have spoiled only children.

 

The old stereotype of spoiled only children is something that needs to go by the wayside.

 

Also just because one is the parent of an only child does not mean that one cannot have an opinion of the parenting skills of a parent of more than one. Children are individuals regardless of family size. If a parent need advice about a particular child it shouldn't matter if the advice is sound if it comes from a parent of many or a parent of one.

 

:iagree: I'll say it again, parenting one is still parenting. Discipline is an individual activity.

[justamouse]

I would relax.

 

If I am in the middle of a sentence (say, on the board) and someone needs me, I say, "Wait a minute." No one can be available to you at every minute, and if he was int he middle of basketball, then yes, I would let them finish.

 

No, I wouldn't have grounded him. I agree with the other posters who said you are micromanaging him, which, at his age, isn't a good thing.

[SailorMom]

I don't think you are too harsh.

We're tough on our kids too, and they have so far been doing wonderfully - and we have a great relationship, imho.

The basketball thing - oh - that would have burned me!!! My ds, who will be 15 in October, is doing the same sort of thing and it is driving DH and I crazy.

Anyway,our job is to prepare them for the real world - and no one is going to treat them with kid gloves out there.

I know I am hard on my kids, but they understand it. We have MANY conversations when everything is calm and no one is in trouble discussing my DH and my own decisions on parenting and discipline. Both of my boys have come to me numerous times and said that while they don't like it, they get it, and see kids that obviously are not being taught the way they are....

 

ETA- I wanted to add that I am told I am too tough all the time by numerous people, but that those same people are always impressed by my kids (responsible, respectful, kind, etc.). Also - we are tough, but we also trust them. This weekend DH and I went away to CA for 3 days - and left them in charge of the house. So - tough - but it has its payoffs.

Edited September 8, 2011 by SailorMom

[Mama Geek]

My story about my dd was not that she is an easy child. It was more that we have worked with her and have high expectations for her behavior. Our families at least tend to think that we are too hard on dd, but then have commented on how well she does. I have known fairly large families where all the kids were usually well behaved both in public and at home.

 

As for more kids it took us 7+ years to have this one and considering I am 36 it is unlikely that we will have more although we would love to.

[Lisa R.]

I don't really have an opinion on whether you are too hard on your kids or not. What I would say is this: when I correct my kids or hand out a consequence, it is in private 99% of the time. If people are around to see me do this, they will likely judge, and I'm not interested in providing opportunities for people to do this. I can't tell from your post whether your corrected your kids in front of your cousin or not. If you're in the habit of doing so, you may want to reconsider doing this.

 

Also, your cousin is offering unsolicited advice. It's gracious of you to consider her point of view, but honestly, it was not polite of her to give you her opinion.

 

I admire you for trying to take a step back and take an honest look at how you parent. We all need to do this from time to time.

[sassenach]

Little kids often need to be micro-managed and told exactly what to do. A fifteen year old doesn't like to be bossed around and really he shouldn't need to be. I don't think that anything you expected of your children was over the top, but there are probably better ways to get your teen to cooperate with you than the way you went about it.

 

Is it possible that your family is referring to your tone of voice and overall attitude towards your children? I know that I tend be short and bossy with my kids, especially when I am stressed.

This.

I have to add that we vacationed in a family member's cabin this summer and I was all over my kids about taking care of the space. If someone ha observed me, I'm sure they would have called me too harsh.

[Danestress]

Or someone else you trust.

 

It's hard to know if someone is being bossy/unreasonable/over the top based just upon a written report like what you provided us from your perspective. So much of family life is tone of voice, the look on your face, etc.

 

In general, I tend to think that it's good to be a thick skinned Mom and not care if someone thinks you are too hard on your child (or too soft or too whatever). But since you are asking us for feedback, you seem open to feedback, and someone who actually knows you probably will give better insight. Maybe you should respond to your cousins observations with follow up questions. Or maybe you should share her observations with another Mom (or your DH) who regularly observes you but is likely to be really frank with you.

 

I will say that I do regularly ASK my children to do things, and they never ever say "no." They might, as your son did, say, "Wait, let me finish X first" and sometimes that is just stalling. But when I CAN say "Okay" I try to. My Mom was always "soft" that way. "Would you mind emptying the dishwasher?" She didn't order me around, and I would have hated it if she had, but I still helped her all the time and still do. I guess I am the same way.

 

I don't want to be a bossy Mom, and I don't think good leadership is bossy and controlling. Good leadership of a boy your son's age includes getting him to see what it is he contributes to his family, what his place in the family is, why he is valuable and needed, etc. As your kids get older, you are demonstrating leadership. If you are afraid to ask for something because the person might say "no," you are already in a position of not really having that person's loyalty and commitment. Yeah, sometimes we have have to make teens do things. And sometimes we have to forbid things they want to do. We are parents. But just from what I read, it sounds like you are so afraid of your son being independent and making mistakes that you are being a bit controlling.

[justamouse]

Or someone else you trust.

 

It's hard to know if someone is being bossy/unreasonable/over the top based just upon a written report like what you provided us from your perspective. So much of family life is tone of voice, the look on your face, etc.

 

In general, I tend to think that it's good to be a thick skinned Mom and not care if someone thinks you are too hard on your child (or too soft or too whatever). But since you are asking us for feedback, you seem open to feedback, and someone who actually knows you probably will give better insight. Maybe you should respond to your cousins observations with follow up questions. Or maybe you should share her observations with another Mom (or your DH) who regularly observes you but is likely to be really frank with you.

 

I will say that I do regularly ASK my children to do things, and they never ever say "no." They might, as your son did, say, "Wait, let me finish X first" and sometimes that is just stalling. But when I CAN say "Okay" I try to. My Mom was always "soft" that way. "Would you mind emptying the dishwasher?" She didn't order me around, and I would have hated it if she had, but I still helped her all the time and still do. I guess I am the same way.

 

I don't want to be a bossy Mom, and I don't think good leadership is bossy and controlling. Good leadership of a boy your son's age includes getting him to see what it is he contributes to his family, what his place in the family is, why he is valuable and needed, etc. As your kids get older, you are demonstrating leadership. If you are afraid to ask for something because the person might say "no," you are already in a position of not really having that person's loyalty and commitment. Yeah, sometimes we have have to make teens do things. And sometimes we have to forbid things they want to do. We are parents. But just from what I read, it sounds like you are so afraid of your son being independent and making mistakes that you are being a bit controlling.

:iagree::iagree:

[LibraryLover]

I think understanding that kids deserve respect is important. My kids are not at my beck and call. If I need their help (and it's not an emergency) I tell them what I need and in the time frame I need it. If my children are working on something- paino, drawing, playing...whatever it is, I give them a heads up and let them get to a stopping point. I know I appreciate someone taking my own time and needs into account.

 

I think my kids are respectful and helpful human beings, but they are not my servants and I don't expect them to jump the moment I need something. They would always hold a door open for someone in need, they let older folks go first, they are thoughtful about how one treats others. I wouldn't want anyone to tell me I couldn't get to the end of sentence in a book I'm reading, for instance. I'll leave the "Right now!" for something like the house being on fire.

Edited September 9, 2011 by LibraryLover

[simka2]

First off, do not feel alone!!! I fail at this pretty miserably myself. :grouphug:

Or someone else you trust.

 

It's hard to know if someone is being bossy/unreasonable/over the top based just upon a written report like what you provided us from your perspective. So much of family life is tone of voice, the look on your face, etc.

 

In general, I tend to think that it's good to be a thick skinned Mom and not care if someone thinks you are too hard on your child (or too soft or too whatever). But since you are asking us for feedback, you seem open to feedback, and someone who actually knows you probably will give better insight. Maybe you should respond to your cousins observations with follow up questions. Or maybe you should share her observations with another Mom (or your DH) who regularly observes you but is likely to be really frank with you.

 

I will say that I do regularly ASK my children to do things, and they never ever say "no." They might, as your son did, say, "Wait, let me finish X first" and sometimes that is just stalling. But when I CAN say "Okay" I try to. My Mom was always "soft" that way. "Would you mind emptying the dishwasher?" She didn't order me around, and I would have hated it if she had, but I still helped her all the time and still do. I guess I am the same way.

 

I don't want to be a bossy Mom, and I don't think good leadership is bossy and controlling. Good leadership of a boy your son's age includes getting him to see what it is he contributes to his family, what his place in the family is, why he is valuable and needed, etc. As your kids get older, you are demonstrating leadership. If you are afraid to ask for something because the person might say "no," you are already in a position of not really having that person's loyalty and commitment. Yeah, sometimes we have have to make teens do things. And sometimes we have to forbid things they want to do. We are parents. But just from what I read, it sounds like you are so afraid of your son being independent and making mistakes that you are being a bit controlling.

 

This is the mom I WANT to be!!!!

[angela in ohio]

I think you rock.

 

It is rare anymore that people respect others property and teach their dc the same. It is rare that people don't use the "well, he's a teen" excuse to let their ds goof around all day. Of course people will think you are too hard on your kiddos. They aren't used to seeing a parent parent.

 

Honestly, you should be given an award for teaching a young man to work before he plays. I can't imagine how much better off we all would be if more people worked to teach their dc this. And my dc know that if I say, "go ask if you can help," they better insist and help, not just ask and run off.

 

We spend a few weeks a year with dh's family (one stays with us, and the others all come here every day to see him.) Without fail, they tell me that I am too hard on my dc. They also comment proudly to other relatives about them, appreciate that we can go places with them without drama, and enjoy them immensely. :D

 

Just let it roll off your back. The proof is in the pudding, and it may take years before they see that you were right. :001_smile: My parents listened to it for years and years from my aunt. Of her two dc, one is in and out of rehab and the other lives in her basement with his gf and her baby. My db and I have stable happy families. Whenever I am tempted to buckle under pressure from the crowd, I remember how my parents stood up to it.

Edited September 8, 2011 by angela in ohio

[justamouse]

I think you rock.

 

It is rare anymore that people respect others property and teach their dc the same. It is rare that people don't use the "well, he's a teen" excuse to let their ds goof around all day. Of course people will think you are too hard on your kiddos. They aren't used to seeing a parent parent.

 

Honestly, you should be given an award for teaching a young man to work before he plays. I can't imagine how much better off we all would be if more people worked to teach their dc this. And my dc know that if I say, "go ask if you can help," they better insist and help, not just ask and run off.

 

We spend a few weeks a year with dh's family (one stays with us, and the others all come here every day to see him.) Without fail, they tell me that I am too hard on my dc. They also comment proudly to other relatives about them, appreciate that we can go places with them without drama, and enjoy them immensely. :D

 

Just let it roll off your back. The proof is in the pudding, and it may take years before they see that you were right. :001_smile:

 

As with the spanking threads, there seems to be an either/or thought process with obedience. But then there are parents that are easy AND have likable, obedient children and they contradict the 'parenting' assumptions you make in this post.

 

You can be easygoing AND have obedient children-even teenagers. Especially if mutual respect is the foundation of your relationship.

 

I take mine everywhere, have always been complimented-even by my grandmother who tells her out of state friends what a good mom I am-and yet I am non punitive and easygoing. There is no either/or.

Edited September 8, 2011 by justamouse

[angela in ohio]

As with the spanking threads, there seems to be an either/or thought process with obedience. But then there are parents that are easy AND have likable, obedient children and they contradict the 'parenting' assumptions you make in this post.

 

You can be easygoing AND have obedient children-even teenagers. Especially if mutual respect is the foundation of your relationship.

 

I take mine every were, have always been complimented-even by my grandmother who tells her out of state friends what a good mom I am-and yet I am non punitive and easygoing. There is no either/or.

 

I wasn't addressing "easygoing" parenting, because that's not what the OP asked about. I didn't say that it won't work; I didn't say anything abut it. :confused: I am supporting the OP in her method, because I have been there and understand the situation.

 

Unless you are equating "easy going" and non-punitive with "lets kids do whatever they want." I don't. There is a difference between non-punitive parenting and non-parenting in my mind, at least as far as the people I know IRL.

 

My point isn't that her method is superior (or the only one that works.) It's that people aren't used to seeing ANY parenting, no matter what the method.

Edited September 8, 2011 by angela in ohio

[Murphy101]

I would tell cousin that I am indeed bossy because AM the boss.

 

The end.

 

Really. If you are satisfied with your relationship with your son and feel your parenting is effective, then everyone else should mtob.

 

I also don't agree with framing expectations as questions. If I'm telling them, then I use a declarative sentence. ;)

[seraphina]

Sounds like you expect your children to respect property and be well-behaved, no problem with that. But I think the punishment was a bit too harsh with you 15 year old. I always give my kids a few minutes warning when I expect their help. I rarely just say something like "now" unless it's an emergency. But yeah I am lax, if they say one more shot or can I have another minute, I usually say fine.

 

There is this argument of you are the boss and yes I agree but I also want to have a level of mutual respect with my children. I am by no means a push-over parent but I am easy going and I have respectful children. With teenagers being too harsh with punishments can backfire on you but alas you are his parent and in the end it's your rules.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

I would relax.

 

If I am in the middle of a sentence (say, on the board) and someone needs me, I say, "Wait a minute." No one can be available to you at every minute, and if he was int he middle of basketball, then yes, I would let them finish.

 

No, I wouldn't have grounded him. I agree with the other posters who said you are micromanaging him, which, at his age, isn't a good thing.

 

:iagree:

 

I think understanding that kids deserve respect is importnant. My kids are not at my beck and call. If I need their help (and it's not an emergency) I tell them what I need and in the time frame I need it. If my children are working on something- paino, drawing, playing...whatever it is, I give them a heads up and let them get to a stopping point. I know I appreciate someone taking my own time and needs into account.

 

I think my kids are respectful and helpful human beings, but they are not my servants and I don't expect them to jump the moment I need something. They would always hold a door open for someone in need, they let older folks go first, they are thoughtful about how one treats others. I wouldn't want anyone to tell me I couldn't get to the end of sentence in a book I'm reading, for instance. I'll leave the "Right now!" for something like the house being on fire.

 

:iagree:

 

I have done the "No, I mean now," routine with boys who are just hitting puberty. I like to start that era with the understanding that I am not going to be walked upon just because their testosterone is surging.

 

OTOH, I hate to see a teenage boy cowed by his Mom. By age 14ish, my boys look like young men to me. I'd rather treat my boys with respect, and require respect in return, than to keep playing the authoritarian parent into the teen years. I think that is more conducive to preparing them for adult relationships of all kinds.

 

I want my boys to be respectful and kind to everyone, all their lives. I also want them to be very independent and good at keeping personal boundaries. I don't want them harassed by a coach or teacher, cowed by a boss, bullied by a neighbor, hen-pecked by a wife, or pushed around by their own children. I want them to be masculine and strong, like their father, but it is within my power to destroy that possibility if I treat them like tiny children or servants!

 

Mothers, especially homeschooling mothers, can build the future men of the nation, but only if we realize that's what we're doing. We can build, or we can tear down. If we're not careful, we might build subservient weaklings who are over-sheltered and tied to our apron strings long past the time that they should have begun conquering the world.

 

And then we'll wonder why our sweet boys who do everything we say are still living in our basements at age 25, suffering from "failure to launch."

 

Free men are not at the beck and call of anyone, not even their mother or their wife. (Free women aren't, either, but we're talking about males right now.) They should do their part in their families, homes, jobs, communities, and nation. Good men will voluntarily give their time and love to serve others. But it should be voluntary, or it is worthless.

 

Training time for children is nearly over by puberty. After that, modeling the behavior is much more effective than demanding it. Discussions are more valuable than punishments.

 

~mother of four sons

[seraphina]

 

I have done the "No, I mean now," routine with boys who are just hitting puberty. I like to start that era with the understanding that I am not going to be walked upon just because their testosterone is surging.

 

OTOH, I hate to see a teenage boy cowed by his Mom. By age 14ish, my boys look like young men to me. I'd rather treat my boys with respect, and require respect in return, than to keep playing the authoritarian parent into the teen years. I think that is more conducive to preparing them for adult relationships of all kinds.

 

I want my boys to be respectful and kind to everyone, all their lives. I also want them to be very independent and good at keeping personal boundaries. I don't want them harassed by a coach or teacher, cowed by a boss, bullied by a neighbor, hen-pecked by a wife, or pushed around by their own children. I want them to be masculine and strong, like their father, but it is within my power to destroy that possibility if I treat them like tiny children or servants!

 

Mothers, especially homeschooling mothers, can build the future men of the nation, but only if we realize that's what we're doing. We can build, or we can tear down. If we're not careful, we might build subservient weaklings who are over-sheltered and tied to our apron strings long past the time that they should have begun conquering the world.

 

And then we'll wonder why our sweet boys who do everything we say are still living in our basements at age 25, suffering from "failure to launch."

 

Free men are not at the beck and call of anyone, not even their mother or their wife. (Free women aren't, either, but we're talking about males right now.) They should do their part in their families, homes, jobs, communities, and nation. Good men will voluntarily give their time and love to serve others. But it should be voluntary, or it is worthless.

 

Training time for children is nearly over by puberty. After that, modeling the behavior is much more effective than demanding it. Discussions are more valuable than punishments.

 

~mother of four sons

 

:iagree: Very well said.

[fairfarmhand]

One thing I am working on with my kids is that if they are in the middle of something and I am needing them to do something, they need to ask "May I do x first?" Sometimes it is finishing a chapter of a book, or completing another task. I've told them not to tell me "In a minute" or "Hold on" but to ask politely. Many times my task can wait a few seconds, and they trust that when I need something done immediately, it is because it is important. I am not just throwing my weight around and being bossy. If they forget and say "HOld on" I usually try to say, "Uhhh, you want to rephrase that?"

 

We talk about this ahead of time. So put your son on warning that this is what you expect.

[emubird]

The two problems the OP described don't seem serious enough to ground for.

 

I would have just expressed my disappointment about his not helping with the ceiling and moved on. I wouldn't have even mentioned the basketball incident.

 

Grounding is for big things. I've never had to use it.

 

My oldest was a terror when she was younger. She's perfectly well behaved now. My disapproval was more deterrent to bad behavior than any spanking or grounding could ever be for her.

[SailorMom]

 

 

Mothers, especially homeschooling mothers, can build the future men of the nation, but only if we realize that's what we're doing. We can build, or we can tear down. If we're not careful, we might build subservient weaklings who are over-sheltered and tied to our apron strings long past the time that they should have begun conquering the world.

 

And then we'll wonder why our sweet boys who do everything we say are still living in our basements at age 25, suffering from "failure to launch."

 

~mother of four sons

 

I have to say - this is the exact opposite reaction I get. Perhaps we have a good balance here - but no one would look at my sons and say they are "cowed" or "subservient". I also see an inherent gender bias here - you don't mention sons cowing to their fathers. I could be reading too much here - but if I am reading you right, then we do have very different opinions on this. I don't want my boys to cow to anyone - but I expect the same respect and authority over them that my DH has.

 

As for "mutual respect"..... uh - no. When they are 18, move out, have a job, go to shcool, etc. Sure. But now? Sorry, it doesn't work that way here.

 

I respect my kids if they earn my respect. Period. Dot. There is no asusmption of respect here. If they lose my respect through their own behavior, they have to deal with the consequences, and then earn it back. The same can be said for trust.

 

They have to respect me because I am their mom - or at least respect the authority I have. Thankfully, they do respect me in the more complete way. There is a balance here for me. I am NOT their friend, nor do I ever want to be. I am their mom - they only get one of those, and I truly believe I'd be doing them a disservice to expect any less of them than I do.

 

Again - they do earn my respect, which is why they were left home alone all weekend. They do not have 'bedtimes' because so far they have given me no reason to give them one - they go to bed when they need to. I do not need to remind my older son to do his homework - he gets straight A's - if that changes, then I'll start requiring 'homework time'.

 

But they know that at any time, if they do not meet my expectations, they can lose both trust and respect.

 

I see a lot of "either/or" in this thread (as usual), but I believe balance is the key. I also believe that kids need to have a clear understanding of parent's expectations and where the lines get drawn. If they do - and there is consistency - then pretty much any discipline/parenting method can work...

[gardenmom5]

I don't own anything at this house and my cousin and her dad have purchased everything down to the beach toys.

I stayed on my kids to pick up after themselves and to make sure they didn't lose anything.

so it's their house, their stuff, and they didn't have a problem with the little kids pulling out and playing with "their" things, but you did? why?

I didn't specify who he should speak to.

a 15 yo "knows" if they should be asking their parent. You shouldn't have to specify unless it's someone else.

 

I just feel if I ASK them to do something I should expect a NO. If I tell them there is no choice just do it.

even good teens will grumble. part of that is developmental, and you need to adjust to what is age appropriate, and that means more autonomy. (they do become civilized again.) at this age, giving assignments and letting him determine how to complete that within stated parameters/timeframe will help him on his developmental way. It also makes it more likely when when you need soemthing NOW, he'll respond "now".

 

My mom always told me what a great baby/toddler I was and how she could bring me out to restaurants and anywhere else, and everyone would comment on how well behaved I was, and she'd look over at those people with the screaming toddlers throwing their food and think to herself how those poor mothers weren't doing it right.

 

Then she had my brother. She didn't go out to eat for years. God has a sense of humor. :D

 

:lol::lol::iagree: God, does have a sense of humor. 3ds has sensory disorders and can be high maintence. 2dd was in college when he was born, and she only had a few months with him at a time at most until he was five. she'd me what I what needed to change in how I was handling him. oh, just you wait henry higgens. then she graduated and will be living here while attending grad school (we're a very convienent location, and it helps her bottom line - re: loans - to not have to pay rent). It wasn't long before she was locking her bedroom door to keep him out. :lol: She is better than I am at making things into a game for him, but she's still found him to be a handful.

 

Our rule is that you can't disobey, but if you have a decent reason for doing something in a different way,

The tiling question. Do you think that it's possible that your 15yo is feeling boxed in and lacking in autonomy, so is seeking out any wriggle-room he can find?

 

As the parent of an only, I really have to beg to differ on this. Yes, I'm sure there are parents of only children that spoil their children. By the same token there are plenty of parents of multi children that spoil their kids.

Also just because one is the parent of an only child does not mean that one cannot have an opinion of the parenting skills of a parent of more than one. Children are individuals regardless of family size..

:iagree:, and I have five children. I've also received very snotty comments from a couple mothers with fewer and much younger children telliing me what I was "doing wrong with my youngest" by comparing him to their own NT children. (they couldn't handle him - so they blamed me.) well, he's not NT, so that's an apples and potatoes kind of thing. the best teacher he's ever had is young, and has *very* young children, but she was incredilble with him.

 

I thought I was a brilliant mother. It turned out that Calvin was just unusually biddable as small child. Then I had a second....

 

1dd was so easy - then 2dd would scream if people so much as looked at her. thunk. I swear she had the same expression as the baby rhesus monkeys in the 1960's experiments as they were clinging to their terry cloth mothers. she did not like being a baby and made sure everyone knew it. she's grown into a delightful adult.