wuhan - coronavirus

[Laura Corin]

BBC News - Covid in Scotland: Virus infection levels hit new record high
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-60707979

[Pawz4me]

If you're in the U.S. you can now request a second set of free Covid test kits.

[Tenaj]

Just now, Pawz4me said:

If you're in the U.S. you can now request a second set of free Covid test kits.

I requested mine on Monday and received them on Thursday!  I couldn't believe it!

[ieta_cassiopeia]

The UK as a whole has had 56.3% increase in positive tests this week and a 16.9% increase in hospitalisations this week. Anyone would think England had dropped masking requirements in most circumstances and reduced isolation periods...

Thanks to some suspicious symptoms, I'm getting my first PCR test this afternoon. I may have to miss work tomorrow regardless of the result, but I'm hoping it's negative and I simply have a cold. (Nobody else in my work team or among my other contacts was known to have the virus, but I do know the care home near me's had 6 cases in the last week).

Edited March 13, 2022 by ieta_cassiopeia

[prairiewindmomma]

In my area we have been on consistent 90 day wave cycles of outbreaks. Is that holding true for everyone else also?

[kbutton]

1 hour ago, prairiewindmomma said:

In my area we have been on consistent 90 day wave cycles of outbreaks. Is that holding true for everyone else also?

Are you saying the peaks are 90 days apart? 

We have highs followed by lows. Things like summer with outdoor activities and holidays with church events, concerts, plays, and family get togethers make levels fall and rise. Sometimes these factors overlap so an increase is slower or faster. 

I expect spring break to bring another increase, but schools no longer have to report cases here. 

[prairiewindmomma]

Yes, state epidemiologists noted as our state dropped indoor masking requirements yesterday that our peaks have been roughly 90 days apart through the entire pandemic. That may be very regional, though.

Our state is still doing wastewater screening and estimates BA2 is less than 2% of cases in our state…and does not predict a significant BA2 wave here. I hope they are right on that one, but I worry they are really wrong. Anything as transmissible as measles is scary.

 

[catz]

4 hours ago, prairiewindmomma said:

In my area we have been on consistent 90 day wave cycles of outbreaks. Is that holding true for everyone else also?

No not for us in the upper midwest.  We were at a low in June and July.  We had a slow and annoying rise through the fall.  Delta peaked in December.  Omicron peaked a month later.   

[kbutton]

[Jean in Newcastle]

3 hours ago, prairiewindmomma said:

Yes, state epidemiologists noted as our state dropped indoor masking requirements yesterday that our peaks have been roughly 90 days apart through the entire pandemic. That may be very regional, though.

Our state is still doing wastewater screening and estimates BA2 is less than 2% of cases in our state…and does not predict a significant BA2 wave here. I hope they are right on that one, but I worry they are really wrong. Anything as transmissible as measles is scary.

 

So does that mean that I should keep masking for 90 days to see the effect of not having the indoor masking requirement?  I had been thinking that I might know after a month. 

[Ausmumof3]

3 hours ago, prairiewindmomma said:

Yes, state epidemiologists noted as our state dropped indoor masking requirements yesterday that our peaks have been roughly 90 days apart through the entire pandemic. That may be very regional, though.

Our state is still doing wastewater screening and estimates BA2 is less than 2% of cases in our state…and does not predict a significant BA2 wave here. I hope they are right on that one, but I worry they are really wrong. Anything as transmissible as measles is scary.

 

That may prove right here. We had a peak in January and cases are heading up again now.

[Ausmumof3]

Just realised that would have is peaking at Easter - right when the hospitals are already under the pump with vehicle accidents, skiing accidents etc etc 

[prairiewindmomma]

42 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

So does that mean that I should keep masking for 90 days to see the effect of not having the indoor masking requirement?  I had been thinking that I might know after a month. 

I dunno. Same report said their estimates were based on 86% of the population having some degree of immunity based on vax rates and antibodies from having contracted COVID. I think they were talking peak to peak, so I’d expect to start to see a rise at the 3-5 week mark after dropping masks. So many are home testing anymore, though, that I think the only accurate numbers are hospitalizations and deaths.

My .02 is mask if getting ill would be inconvenient or unsafe for you, and mask around vulnerable persons. I was out and about today and I’d say locally about 50% of persons were masked indoors. If you continue to mask I don’t think you’ll be alone. If you choose not to, I think that’s ok too. 🙂 

[kbutton]

1 hour ago, prairiewindmomma said:

So many are home testing anymore, though, that I think the only accurate numbers are hospitalizations and deaths.

Good point.

[Jean in Newcastle]

1 hour ago, prairiewindmomma said:

I dunno. Same report said their estimates were based on 86% of the population having some degree of immunity based on vax rates and antibodies from having contracted COVID. I think they were talking peak to peak, so I’d expect to start to see a rise at the 3-5 week mark after dropping masks. So many are home testing anymore, though, that I think the only accurate numbers are hospitalizations and deaths.

My .02 is mask if getting ill would be inconvenient or unsafe for you, and mask around vulnerable persons. I was out and about today and I’d say locally about 50% of persons were masked indoors. If you continue to mask I don’t think you’ll be alone. If you choose not to, I think that’s ok too. 🙂 

90% of people at the group store today were still masked. Don’t know how long it will last but I was happy to see it. 

[ieta_cassiopeia]

12 hours ago, prairiewindmomma said:

In my area we have been on consistent 90 day wave cycles of outbreaks. Is that holding true for everyone else also?

That would be particularly interesting as PCR testing is deemed unreliable if done within 90 days of a positive test.

Which puts me in a bit of a bind - I'm still testing negative on lateral flow tests despite a PCR test I took yesterday indicating I am positive (for the first time). It's not clear how I prove I've done with this particular COVID-19 infection, given that the lateral flow test is presumably still not going to state whether I have it or not given it's continously claimed I don't have it.

[Ausmumof3]

Anyone worried about China again? They seem to be having a biggish outbreak, not just in Hong Kong but also mainland. Supply chain issues could be a thing yet again.

[Laura Corin]

12 minutes ago, ieta_cassiopeia said:

That would be particularly interesting as PCR testing is deemed unreliable if done within 90 days of a positive test.

Which puts me in a bit of a bind - I'm still testing negative on lateral flow tests despite a PCR test I took yesterday indicating I am positive (for the first time). It's not clear how I prove I've done with this particular COVID-19 infection, given that the lateral flow test is presumably still not going to state whether I have it or not given it's continously claimed I don't have it.

I suspect you know more about this than I do, but personally I would self isolate the longest recommended time then lft and use that as 'proof'.  It's a fudge, but what else can you do?

[Arcadia]

15 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

Anyone worried about China again? They seem to be having a biggish outbreak, not just in Hong Kong but also mainland. Supply chain issues could be a thing yet again.

I read that Foxconn suspend work at its Shenzhen Apple factory. Don’t think food supplies are affected yet.

[ieta_cassiopeia]

1 hour ago, Laura Corin said:

I suspect you know more about this than I do, but personally I would self isolate the longest recommended time then lft and use that as 'proof'.  It's a fudge, but what else can you do?

Makes sense to try that. My workplace has a set procedure for when LFTs can be used following a positive test, so that would be the starting point (short version: it's impossible for me to return before Day 6, and that falls on a day off...)

[Corraleno]

Cases are also way up in South Korea and Vietnam, and are heading up in Europe, due to BA2:

[KSera]

7 hours ago, ieta_cassiopeia said:

That would be particularly interesting as PCR testing is deemed unreliable if done within 90 days of a positive test.

Which puts me in a bit of a bind - I'm still testing negative on lateral flow tests despite a PCR test I took yesterday indicating I am positive (for the first time). It's not clear how I prove I've done with this particular COVID-19 infection, given that the lateral flow test is presumably still not going to state whether I have it or not given it's continously claimed I don't have it.

I would LFT again this evening and/or tomorrow, assuming you have easy access to them still. With omicron, it’s seeming pretty common for people to test positive on PCR 1 to 2 days before they test positive on rapid tests. The good thing is, if you’re trying to stay isolated from others in your household, your PCR may have picked it up before you were contagious to others and stopped the spread.

[Teaching3bears]

Is there going to be another big wave?  They are closing whole cities in China.  Things are bad in Hong Kong.  Rates are going up in many countries in Europe.  People are travelling more and everything here is opening up.  Still, I don’t hear experts saying they are worried about BA2 so I’m confused.  

[Faith-manor]

16 minutes ago, Teaching3bears said:

Is there going to be another big wave?  They are closing whole cities in China.  Things are bad in Hong Kong.  Rates are going up in many countries in Europe.  People are travelling more and everything here is opening up.  Still, I don’t hear experts saying they are worried about BA2 so I’m confused.  

I think the experts have been told to pipe down. The world is watching a possible global war if the Ukraine situation escalates, Iran lobbed missiles at a US consulate in Iraq, the world is just in a crisis mess other than just the pandemic, and so the political will  to do any mitigation is over with. They have their fingers crossed that nothing bad will come of taking their eye of the ball in favor of gaining public goodwill for measures like weapons and money for Ukraine, and sanctions on Russia, etc. It will probably backfire, sad to say, but I am pretty sure this is what they are all hoping for anyway. That is my guess.

[TCB]

I don’t know if I’ve missed it but has anyone mentioned the brain MRI findings from the UK study? The more I hear about these recent studies, the less keen I am to get Covid, but I always feel inclined to reserve judgment, as some of the studies are so poorly conducted. This seems hard to ignore though.

[KSera]

The lifting of mitigation started happening en masse early February, so I don’t see them being tied to the war in Ukraine. It certainly makes paying attention to Covid even more difficult, though. How many crises can we handle at once?  I think it’s been a matter of which experts the media and politicians have been paying attention to. There are plenty that are continuing to sound the alarm that this is not a good idea, but the media chose to give attention to the “urgency of normal“ people instead and politicians seemed only too happy to follow suit.

Have people seen the charts comparing the difference between what’s happening in Hong Kong right now versus New Zealand? The case rates per 100,000 people are very similar, but the death rate is on a different planet for Hong Kong.

 

NZ is having to finally deal with very high case rates after keeping Covid out for two years, but they are reaping the benefits of having held it off until they could get their population vaccinated. While on the other hand, Hong Kong has the majority of their over 80s unvaccinated. It’s very sad to see so much preventable death. 

[Arcadia]

“Deltacron” is now acknowledged as real

https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20220311/new-covid-variant-deltacron

”March 11, 2022 -- A new COVID-19 variant -- unofficially dubbed “Deltacron” because it’s a combination of the Delta and Omicron variants -- has been detected in a small number of cases in France, the Netherlands, and Denmark, the World Health Organization says.

Because there are few cases, scientists don’t know much about the variant, such as how easily it spreads and if it causes severe illness.

"We have not seen any change in the epidemiology with this recombinant. We haven't seen any change in severity. But there are many studies that are underway," World Health Organization COVID-19 technical lead Maria Van Kerkhove, PhD, said at a news conference.

WHO scientists noted that the variant will probably spread.

"Unfortunately, we do expect to see recombinants because this is what viruses do, they change over time," Van Kerkhove said. "We're seeing a very intense level of circulation. We are seeing this virus infect animals, with the possibility of infecting humans again. So again, the pandemic is far from over."”

[Mom_to3]

8 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

I think the experts have been told to pipe down. The world is watching a possible global war if the Ukraine situation escalates, Iran lobbed missiles at a US consulate in Iraq, the world is just in a crisis mess other than just the pandemic, and so the political will  to do any mitigation is over with. They have their fingers crossed that nothing bad will come of taking their eye of the ball in favor of gaining public goodwill for measures like weapons and money for Ukraine, and sanctions on Russia, etc. It will probably backfire, sad to say, but I am pretty sure this is what they are all hoping for anyway. That is my guess.

It wasn't an attack on the consulate in Iraq, but a private Iraqi compound, as far as I've heard, and the "experts" were told to pipe it down well before the war. IMO, they could have kept the mask guidance rather than announcing the change the day after the war started, as the news cycle was going to move away from covid anyway (and we'd have been much safer covid wise). Throwing tons of money at the war (rightly so), but failing to provide funding for continued testing, vaccines and treatment in order to do so is a very bad judgement call. We are just days away from 1 million dead from covid in the US alone.

[Laura Corin]

5 minutes ago, TCB said:

I don’t know if I’ve missed it but has anyone mentioned the brain MRI findings from the UK study? The more I hear about these recent studies, the less keen I am to get Covid, but I always feel inclined to reserve judgment, as some of the studies are so poorly conducted. This seems hard to ignore though.

Fwiw the brain study was Alpha and pre-vaccine-availability.

[Faith-manor]

2 minutes ago, Mom_to3 said:

It wasn't an attack on the consulate in Iraq, but a private Iraqi compound, as far as I've heard, and the "experts" were told to pipe it down well before the war. IMO, they could have kept the mask guidance rather than announcing the change the day after the war started, as the news cycle was going to move away from covid anyway (and we'd have been much safer covid wise). Throwing tons of money at the war (rightly so), but failing to provide funding for continued testing, vaccines and treatment in order to do so is a very bad judgement call. We are just days away from 1 million dead from covid in the US alone.

The New York Post has it listed as an Iraq attack on the consulate. Whatever.

I didn't say I agreed with "pipe down". Nor did I say it was a good judgment call. I just said what I thought the political mindset was.

[Mom_to3]

9 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

The New York Post has it listed as an Iraq attack on the consulate. Whatever.

I didn't say I agreed with "pipe down". Nor did I say it was a good judgment call. I just said what I thought the political mindset was.

Oh, I understand - I was basically agreeing with what you said.

(Initially I think it was thought it was an attack on the consulate. Here is what our government says right now https://www.state.gov/irans-missile-strikes-on-the-kurdistan-region-of-iraq/  Bad enough)

[Corraleno]

15 minutes ago, KSera said:

Hong Kong has the majority of their over 80s unvaccinated. It’s very sad to see so much preventable death. 

And roughly half of the vaccines distributed in Hong Kong were from China (Sinovac), which isn't very effective in the elderly (efficacy against death for people over 80 = 45%). The per capita death rate in Hong Kong right now is literally double the per capita death rate during the worst peak in the US. It's horrific.

[Melissa Louise]

Lifting of mitigations is not health driven anywhere - it's politically driven.

A gamble, basically, that 'freedom' will only take out the elderly and unwell, resulting in approval points at the polls as we all parrot 'they had pre-existing conditions'. 

Specifically, in my state Health has suggested reinstating mask and density rules in response to rising numbers ( mostly driven by transmission in schools). Government refuses, claiming 'living with flu' and 'no appetite'. 

 

[popmom]

6 minutes ago, Melissa Louise said:

Lifting of mitigations is not health driven anywhere - it's politically driven.

A gamble, basically, that 'freedom' will only take out the elderly and unwell, resulting in approval points at the polls as we all parrot 'they had pre-existing conditions'. 

Specifically, in my state Health has suggested reinstating mask and density rules in response to rising numbers ( mostly driven by transmission in schools). Government refuses, claiming 'living with flu' and 'no appetite'. 

 

I agree to an extent. I don’t see it as either/or. Either health or freedom is a false dichotomy because “health” isn’t just COVID and “freedom” isn’t just masking, mandates, etc.

Edited March 14, 2022 by popmom

[KSera]

30 minutes ago, Arcadia said:

 A new COVID-19 variant -- unofficially dubbed “Deltacron” because it’s a combination of the Delta and Omicron variants -- has been detected in a small number of cases in France, the Netherlands, and Denmark, the World Health Organization says.
 

Dare we hope the vaccine prevents infection with this more than with omicron, since it had more coverage for delta than omicron? Though certainly the variants that will spread most will be those the vaccine is least protective against.

28 minutes ago, Mom_to3 said:

We are just days away from 1 million dead from covid in the US alone.

I was thinking about this the other day. It's hard to imagine what history will say about 1,000,000 Americans dying in a pandemic over a two year period, with a sizable minority of the country insisting it was no big deal and not wanting to do anything about it. I imagine history will have a hard time understanding how that could have been.

[kbutton]

8 minutes ago, KSera said:

I was thinking about this the other day. It's hard to imagine what history will say about 1,000,000 Americans dying in a pandemic over a two year period, with a sizable minority of the country insisting it was no big deal and not wanting to do anything about it. I imagine history will have a hard time understanding how that could have been.

Given how little we talk about the 1918 pandemic, it could that virtually no one will talk about it, sad to say. 

[lewelma]

2 hours ago, Teaching3bears said:

Still, I don’t hear experts saying they are worried about BA2 so I’m confused.  

They have been genetic sequencing every case here in NZ that has ended up in the hospital, and they have said that it is mostly BA2. Currently, the hospitalization and death rates are not high. Currently, about 10% of the population have/had omicron (we only started about 4 weeks ago) which is 400,000 (tests say 200K, but they are saying at least double that), and we have had about 1000 people in the hospital, 20 in ICU (right now, not sure of 4 week total), and around 40 deaths from omicron. 

I know there is a delay between contracting it and hospitalization and death, but if we go back 2 week to say 200k, the numbers of hospitalization and death are still low.

However, we are

95% double vaxed for 12+, (97% with a single dose)

53% single vaxed for 5-12year olds, and

73% boosted for 18+

So the NZ low hospitalization and death numbers could be due to high vaccination rates. But we are not finding BA2 to be bad.

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2022/03/coronavirus-ba-2-omicron-cases-outnumber-ba-1-in-new-zealand-delta-infections-still-occuring.html

Edited March 14, 2022 by lewelma

[prairiewindmomma]

1 hour ago, kbutton said:

Given how little we talk about the 1918 pandemic, it could that virtually no one will talk about it, sad to say. 

Right? The hedonistic 20s spun off of a society sick of war (WW1) and sick of a pandemic.  They threw a helluva party. 

(Awful things happened in the 1920s, too, lots of famine and revolutions, but they are largely ignored. People (at least in the US) focused on motion pictures, speakeasies, jazz, flappers, and baseball.)

[Melissa Louise]

1 hour ago, popmom said:

I agree to an extent. I don’t see it as either/or. Either health or freedom is a false dichotomy because “health” isn’t just COVID and “freedom” isn’t just masking, mandates, etc.

Masking is a very low stakes mitigation with minimal effects on freedom or other aspects of health. 

I don't enjoy masking, and I unmask for work that can't take place masked (phonics instruction), so I'm not inflexible about it.  It's just nuts to me that if your health people say 'hey, probably a good time to bring masks back in enclosed spaces', you, the government, say 'nah, doesn't play well in polling.'

[Ting Tang]

It is concerning to see another wave may be headed our way in the states.

I will preface this with I more or less gave up my life for two years, and so did my children.  We lived like hermits a great deal of the time.

I am vaccinated and boosted.  I do require my children wear masks to their extracurriculars I finally allowed them to do (two of the four take a class once per week).

It feels like there are ups and downs with this virus.  

How long do you wait to...yes...move on with your life?  It feels like many believe we will have to live with the coronavirus.  In the US, you've had your chance to get vaccinated if you are over a certain age.  I was hoping for better vaccine options.  But who knows when they will come.  Do we wait for more years to pass us by?  Because I feel like now I have moved on from Covid to worrying about World War III.

Some people are not going back to precautions.  Some never took them.  

I just don't know what we are to do, forever be in this cycle?  Our CDC said this would become seasonal.  So there is that.  I am just rambling. 

I feel for the immunocompromised and do not believe people are throwaway people.  I just wonder what anyone thinks the answer is anymore.  😞

[KSera]

3 minutes ago, Ting Tang said:

How long do you wait to...yes...move on with your life?  It feels like many believe we will have to live with the coronavirus.  In the US, you've had your chance to get vaccinated if you are over a certain age.  I was hoping for better vaccine options.  But who knows when they will come.  Do we wait for more years to pass us by? 

While it would be great to not need masks anymore, I don't consider wearing a mask indoors in public to be not moving on with life. To me, that's what allows the greatest numbers of people to move on and not let years pass them by. As it is, dropping masks means people at lower risk can continue doing things, while people at higher risk who want to protect themselves have to go back to staying home, because public becomes too high risk for them. I'm very bothered that so many people are just fine with that trade off.

[thewellerman]

4 minutes ago, Ting Tang said:

It is concerning to see another wave may be headed our way in the states.

I will preface this with I more or less gave up my life for two years, and so did my children.  We lived like hermits a great deal of the time.

I am vaccinated and boosted.  I do require my children wear masks to their extracurriculars I finally allowed them to do (two of the four take a class once per week).

It feels like there are ups and downs with this virus.  

How long do you wait to...yes...move on with your life?  It feels like many believe we will have to live with the coronavirus.  In the US, you've had your chance to get vaccinated if you are over a certain age.  I was hoping for better vaccine options.  But who knows when they will come.  Do we wait for more years to pass us by?  Because I feel like now I have moved on from Covid to worrying about World War III.

Some people are not going back to precautions.  Some never took them.  

I just don't know what we are to do, forever be in this cycle?  Our CDC said this would become seasonal.  So there is that.  I am just rambling. 

I feel for the immunocompromised and do not believe people are throwaway people.  I just wonder what anyone thinks the answer is anymore.  😞

The only catch to this is the getting sick part.  My family has also stayed pretty much home for the last 2 years.  My husband just took a business trip, and we all got covid.  It has been 2 weeks for me today, and I am still exhausted.  He was actually much sicker than I was, even though I only have had 1 dose of Pfizer.  I think I'm going to come through it eventually, but how often can a person be knocked down with an illness?  2 to 3 weeks of being home and feeling terrible every 3 months or so is not a workable solution.  

We are going to pretend the pandemic doesn't exist for a few weeks, take advantage of our temporary immunity, and then probably start masking again.  We are letting our kids do all their usual summer activities, though.  I feel like we can't keep them home forever. 

[Ting Tang]

10 minutes ago, KSera said:

While it would be great to not need masks anymore, I don't consider wearing a mask indoors in public to be not moving on with life. To me, that's what allows the greatest numbers of people to move on and not let years pass them by. As it is, dropping masks means people at lower risk can continue doing things, while people at higher risk who want to protect themselves have to go back to staying home, because public becomes too high risk for them. I'm very bothered that so many people are just fine with that trade off.

I just wonder...for how long.  It is affecting children's development.  I can handle it as an adult.  It has been two years.  Four years, six, forever?   It just feels like this can go on forever. 

 

5 minutes ago, thewellerman said:

The only catch to this is the getting sick part.  My family has also stayed pretty much home for the last 2 years.  My husband just took a business trip, and we all got covid.  It has been 2 weeks for me today, and I am still exhausted.  He was actually much sicker than I was, even though I only have had 1 dose of Pfizer.  I think I'm going to come through it eventually, but how often can a person be knocked down with an illness?  2 to 3 weeks of being home and feeling terrible every 3 months or so is not a workable solution.  

We are going to pretend the pandemic doesn't exist for a few weeks, take advantage of our temporary immunity, and then probably start masking again.  We are letting our kids do all their usual summer activities, though.  I feel like we can't keep them home forever. 

I am sorry to read you all got sick.  That is terrible after two years.  I, of course, do not want to get sick, either.  It has been nice not getting certain illnesses I grew accustomed to getting, usually from the kids.  I feel like progress on vaccines has seriously stalled out.  

 

ETA I don't disagree with anyone.  It just feels like there may be no end in sight.  😞 

Edited March 14, 2022 by Ting Tang

[thewellerman]

3 minutes ago, Ting Tang said:

ETA I don't disagree with anyone.  It just feels like there may be no end in sight.  😞 

I agree.  I'm really tired of it.  

[Melissa Louise]

Citations re masks affecting children's development? 

I work with children. The youngest ones have been affected by lock downs during ages 2-4. That's obvious in their SE learning. 

I don't see any evidence they have been affected by adults masking around them indoors at the supermarket etc. 

(Where I live, masking has never been mandatory for children - some do, most don't). 

[KSera]

2 minutes ago, Ting Tang said:

I just wonder...for how long.  It is affecting children's development. 

The masks? For most of them, it's really not. That's largely an anti-masker talking point. It's certainly not harming their development to wear them when they go to a store or whatever. For very young children who are in full time child care, that's the one situation I can see it might make sense to have different rules. If a kid spends most of their time in child care, that's a lot of time and some kids have some special circumstances (such as difficulty with speech). But for most kids, who spend lots of time with their family and not wearing masks, I don't see how this outweighs the effect on other kids' health and lives due to covid risk. Millions of kids have lost primary caregivers due to covid. I am certain that is a much bigger, worse effect on their development. And I'm a mom with a small child with a relatively serious speech disorder (which surprisingly, has improved a ton over the pandemic, even though we have had to conduct all speech therapy over zoom and he wears a mask anytime he is in public).

[thewellerman]

5 minutes ago, Melissa Louise said:

Citations re masks affecting children's development? 

I work with children. The youngest ones have been affected by lock downs during ages 2-4. That's obvious in their SE learning. 

I don't see any evidence they have been affected by adults masking around them indoors at the supermarket etc. 

(Where I live, masking has never been mandatory for children - some do, most don't). 

Since I exclusively homeschool all our kids, and moved just before and just after the pandemic (meaning we didn't have a local community during the initial lockdowns, and have yet to establish much of one in our new town), masks aren't really the issue for me.  It is the isolation.  

[Happy2BaMom]

2 hours ago, Corraleno said:

And roughly half of the vaccines distributed in Hong Kong were from China (Sinovac), which isn't very effective in the elderly (efficacy against death for people over 80 = 45%). The per capita death rate in Hong Kong right now is literally double the per capita death rate during the worst peak in the US. It's horrific.

You're pretty scientifically on top of things. To the best of your knowledge, is what is occurring in HK / China due to Omicron only? Or do you think something else might be going on (like a new variant they don't want to announce)?

I'm really not trying to stir the pot or raise old issues, and I'm the furthest thing from a conspiracy theorist (my family and I are vaxxed, boosted AND believe government should be able to set mask mandates). But I am starting to wonder about China....it's not like they haven't had 2 years and vaccines to get prepared for this and the way they're racing like mad to lock everything down is, uh, disconcerting.

 

(As a side note, to further cheer y'all up....lockdowns in China are also expected to negatively impact supply chains! Sigh)

Edited March 14, 2022 by Happy2BaMom

[KSera]

5 minutes ago, Melissa Louise said:

I work with children. The youngest ones have been affected by lock downs during ages 2-4. That's obvious in their SE learning. 

I'm curious what the general family setup would have been for most of the kids you work with during the lockdown periods. Mine has been in that age range for the pandemic and while this is *clearly* coincidental and just inborn personality, I've been amused to see that this kid is my most socially gregarious and seems wholly unaffected by all this socially. The effect I see most is just lack of memory of certain experiences that would usually be normal--restaurants and things like that that we haven't done at all. He facetimes with other young family members occasionally and does the occasional outdoor social thing, and really hasn't skipped a beat socially. It can be several months between seeing a friend in person, and he's right back to happily playing on the playground with them and chatting with them and being normal as could be. It's been a much bigger social impact on the teens.

[Acadie]

32 minutes ago, Happy2BaMom said:

You're pretty scientifically on top of things. To the best of your knowledge, is what is occurring in HK / China due to Omicron only? Or do you think something else might be going on (like a new variant they don't want to announce)?

I'm really not trying to stir the pot or raise old issues, and I'm the furthest thing from a conspiracy theorist (my family and I are vaxxed, boosted AND believe government should be able to set mask mandates). But I am starting to wonder about China....it's not like they haven't had 2 years and vaccines to get prepared for this and the way they're racing like mad to lock everything down is, uh, disconcerting.

 

(As a side note, to further cheer y'all up....lockdowns in China are also expected to negatively impact supply chains! Sigh)

Well, I'll chime in and say Omicron BA.2 is different enough from the original Omicron strain that many people have argued it should be named as a new variant.

That and low vaccination rates with Sinovac and Sinopharm, which in themselves are much less effective than Pfizer and Moderna. I think China stuck with their less effective vaccines for nationalist pride, and overconfidence in the effectiveness of other mitigation measures.

Plus protection from currently available vaccines does wane.

Hard to say exactly how BA.2 is going to hit in the US, because we have more natural and vaccine-induced immunity than China. But it's here and spreading.

Nations that have opted for limited Covid response, ie, mostly vaccines (US) or mostly mitigations like masks, surveillance/contact tracing/lockdowns (China), eventually find limited success. It's clear to me that we need to use all the tools we have available, and probably what will get us out of the pandemic eventually is a different vaccine technology that confers more lasting immunity. 

Edited March 15, 2022 by Acadie