Did I lose my housekeeper?

[Night Elf]

I told my housekeeper that I was going to be out of town and she said to text her to remind her so she wouldn't drive to the house. So I texted her on Wednesday June 19th and she replied just by saying "yes". So fast forward to the next Wednesday, the 26th and I asked if she would be here at her regular 9:30 am time. She did not respond. She didn't show up on time on Thursday. So at 9:45 am I texted asking if she was coming today. My message didn't go through. Three hours later I texted her again and that message didn't go through either. So I called her Thursday evening and my call was sent to an automatic voicemail. When I looked at my phone, the messages had finally gone through. I do not know if she read them. Finally, yesterday morning, I texted and told her if she was quitting to please let me know so I can start the interview process again. No response. Now it's possible she's going through something that is preventing her from contacting me for some reason, although even if she's having difficulty I think she should let her 'job' know she's tied up. Right? So I'm not going to text her again until next Thursday if she doesn't contact me or show up. Of course, it's July 4th and she may not want to work on a holiday, but wouldn't you expect her to tell you that? So if she doesn't contact me or show up, I'm thinking I'll just text her a final message telling her that her lack of communication bothered me and I was letting her go. I think that's fair, don't you?

FWIW, my DH thinks we can handle the housework on our own and doesn't want to replace her. She deep cleaned the house so we're just doing maintenance and he thinks we can do that. My concern is the same as it was before she started. With working three quarters time, I'm never in the mood to clean. Weeks would go by before I'd think to clean the bathroom. Or grease from cooking a meal that lands on the stovetop wasn't getting cleaned up for a week. It wasn't just me not doing it, my DH is guilty as well. So I hate the idea of not having a housekeeper. I thoroughly enjoyed my clean house as she came each week. No dirt ever had time to build up. But if DH doesn't want another housekeeper, that's just the end of it. We had a budget for it but we've had so many things happen in the last month that we're in debt we weren't in when we hired the housekeeper so I think he's thinking about the money. I'm thinking of my sanity. Ugh.

Am I wrong in my assessment of the lack of communication from my housekeeper. It just seems so inconsiderate. What's worse is while I was on vacation, I got a call from someone because my housekeeper gave my name and number to her as a reference. So was this a new job that would take up all of her time and she would be unable to work for me any longer? I have no idea. I didn't think to ask the lady if she was hiring her full time. I gave her a glowing report because up until that Wednesday night, she was fine. I haven't heard from her since the 19th. That's 10 days. 

What do you think?

Edited June 29, 2019 by Night Elf
grammar editing

[maize]

If she hasn't been unreliable or lax in communication before I think it is most likely that some kind of complication has cropped up in her life--health crisis or some such.

[Pen]

3 minutes ago, maize said:

If she hasn't been unreliable or lax in communication before I think it is most likely that some kind of complication has cropped up in her life--health crisis or some such.

 

I would agree.

 

Also I would expect July 4 would *not* be a work day without having to say so

you could try a call rather than text

and you could  call the person you gave reference to and see if she’s heard anything 

[Night Elf]

4 minutes ago, maize said:

If she hasn't been unreliable or lax in communication before I think it is most likely that some kind of complication has cropped up in her life--health crisis or some such.

So how long do I give her to get in touch with me? If she doesn't contact me or show up next Thursday, do I wait another week and see if she shows up that Thursday? I really do want to be fair because I don't want to lose her but I'd like to know if something is going on. I don't want details. I just want the courtesy of telling me she won't be at work maybe for a while. It's not knowing that is bothering me.

[Tap]

I would say she quit and doesn't want to tell you.  I would text her "You did not shown up for your shift on June 27th and have not responded to numerous attempts to contact you. I am taking this as your resignation and wish you the best. "  If you owe her any money, mail her a check and put "payment in full for services rendered" in the subject line. 

Edited June 29, 2019 by Tap

[alisoncooks]

 I'm thinking the reference was for a (higher paying? more steady?) job, and she's not coming back...

[Liz CA]

16 minutes ago, Night Elf said:

So how long do I give her to get in touch with me? If she doesn't contact me or show up next Thursday, do I wait another week and see if she shows up that Thursday? I really do want to be fair because I don't want to lose her but I'd like to know if something is going on. I don't want details. I just want the courtesy of telling me she won't be at work maybe for a while. It's not knowing that is bothering me.

 

Car accident? Lots of things. I suppose the deciding factor would be what maize said. If she has been reliable in communication and showing up for work, I'd give her a few more days. Next Thursday is a holiday, so it's unlikely she'd be working then anyway. And I would not expect anyone to work on a holiday unless they specifically offered to do so. In that case, a little extra pay is nice too. Just read the reference thing, could be either way. She was either just adding a client or did find something more lucrative / better fit for her schedule, etc., however, in that case I would expect to be notified.

Edited June 29, 2019 by Liz CA

[Catwoman]

Why did you keep texting her instead of just giving her a call?

My assumption is that she’s not coming back, though.

[Selkie]

I would assume she quit. But if you really want to know - do you still have the number of the woman who called for the reference? You could call her and ask if your housekeeper is working for her or if she is in contact with her. That way, you may find out whether your housekeeper has some sort of crisis going on or if she just quit and handled it in a very unprofessional way.

[KungFuPanda]

In any of your messages did you ask if she was OK? 

[mmasc]

I’d say she quit and doesn’t want to tell you. I probably wouldn’t contact her again, if I was in this situation.  

[lavender's green]

A few weeks ago I lost cell phone service because of a new credit card (old one was stolen) and the plan didn't renew because of that. I didn't know about it for a while because it's normal for me to go a  couple days without calls or texts, and I rarely use it for internet browsing. The phone gave me no indication that something wasn't working; it just wouldn't send the text the next time I needed to send one, and that occasionally does happen if service is iffy. So it's possible she's having a credit card issue with her provider and doesn't even know about it. Now, 10 days is a long time to never send/receive a call or text, but I just thought I'd throw it out there.

[Tap]

5 minutes ago, lavender's green said:

A few weeks ago I lost cell phone service because of a new credit card (old one was stolen) and the plan didn't renew because of that. I didn't know about it for a while because it's normal for me to go a  couple days without calls or texts, and I rarely use it for internet browsing. The phone gave me no indication that something wasn't working; it just wouldn't send the text the next time I needed to send one, and that occasionally does happen if service is iffy. So it's possible she's having a credit card issue with her provider and doesn't even know about it. Now, 10 days is a long time to never send/receive a call or text, but I just thought I'd throw it out there.

Just like this example, I can think of lots of ways people can lose contact with someone on the phone, but she didn't show up for a scheduled shift --and--- didn't may any attempt to contact Night Elf.  If Night Elf finds out she was in the  hospital for a week with no way to contact her....she can decide to rehire her. But personally, an employee no-showed for a shift and has gone silent since then. I wouldn't count on her coming back. 

[klmama]

You said the texts didn't go through.  She may have a TracFone or other pay-as-you-go service and needs to add minutes/texts.  

[Tap]

1 hour ago, klmama said:

You said the texts didn't go through.  She may have a TracFone or other pay-as-you-go service and needs to add minutes/texts.  

If you run out of minutes...do you still have access to the contacts? Couldn't she have just looked at the number, and used a different phone to call or text a message? Presumably she knows she missed a work shift. Borrow the phone of a friend or neighbor? There are also lots of public places that have phones available, that they will loan you for a short call.  I have seen people borrow a phone at the customer service desk at grocery stores, libraries, hospitals, churches etc. A quick "I am out of minutes on my cell phone, I will be at your house to clean on xxx. Thank you!" doesn't take long, but would have gone a long way towards keeping a job.

[Shoeless]

She's not coming back and is ghosting you.  I would not call or text anymore.  If she pops up in a few weeks with a reasonable explanation of why she went silent, (some sort of emergency), then you can make the decision on whether to rehire her.  I'm betting, however, that you don't hear from her again. 

[Night Elf]

11 hours ago, Catwoman said:

Why did you keep texting her instead of just giving her a call?

My assumption is that she’s not coming back, though.

I did call, but my call went automatically to voicemail. So I texted again hoping she'd see it when her phone was on and working again, if it was ever off and/or broken. She's not one for lengthy discussions whether by text, phone or in person. If I ask her a question, I get a yes/no type response. I've learned not to ask questions that don't require such a simple answer by text or on the phone. She's easier to talk to in person. She has a heavy accent and I have to get her to repeat herself but we eventually understand one another. It's just annoying.

[Night Elf]

11 hours ago, Selkie said:

I would assume she quit. But if you really want to know - do you still have the number of the woman who called for the reference? You could call her and ask if your housekeeper is working for her or if she is in contact with her. That way, you may find out whether your housekeeper has some sort of crisis going on or if she just quit and handled it in a very unprofessional way.

I did think about that but I got spam messages that day as well and I don't know which number is hers. Besides, if my housekeeper really isn't quitting, I don't want to jeopardize her possible new position. If she found  better position, she should take it. She was only working for me once a week for two hours, after she deep cleaned the house. I'd just to hear from her to explain what is going on, whether she is quitting or not.

[Night Elf]

10 hours ago, KungFuPanda said:

In any of your messages did you ask if she was OK? 

No. It didn't occur to me. I just asked her why she didn't show up. That was wrong of me. Thank you for pointing that out.

[Night Elf]

7 hours ago, klmama said:

You said the texts didn't go through.  She may have a TracFone or other pay-as-you-go service and needs to add minutes/texts.  

They went through later that evening, and the one I sent to her the next day (I think it was), went through fine. At least they all said 'delivered'. I don't have 'read receipts' on my phone.

[Night Elf]

6 hours ago, MissLemon said:

She's not coming back and is ghosting you.  I would not call or text anymore.  If she pops up in a few weeks with a reasonable explanation of why she went silent, (some sort of emergency), then you can make the decision on whether to rehire her.  I'm betting, however, that you don't hear from her again. 

I'll give it a couple of weeks, and if she doesn't contact me, I may go on care.com and make a comment on her profile. If she is ghosting me, that's extremely unprofessional.

[Spryte]

I would start looking for someone else.

 

[Catwoman]

3 hours ago, Night Elf said:

I did call, but my call went automatically to voicemail. So I texted again hoping she'd see it when her phone was on and working again, if it was ever off and/or broken. She's not one for lengthy discussions whether by text, phone or in person. If I ask her a question, I get a yes/no type response. I've learned not to ask questions that don't require such a simple answer by text or on the phone. She's easier to talk to in person. She has a heavy accent and I have to get her to repeat herself but we eventually understand one another. It's just annoying.

 

If you left her a voicemail and sent her multiple texts, I would assume she isn’t coming back and not give this another thought.

 

[SKL]

I have often had communication issues with my cleaner because she loses her phone or whatever.

Generally I take it in stride.  So far she's always come back sooner or later.

As far as whether to continue the service - what about getting a "deep clean" once a year and a touch-up once a month?  That way if you do forget, at least it doesn't build up really bad.  And it doesn't cost as much as frequent cleaning.

[Harriet Vane]

How about a compromise on the cleaning? Rather than weekly, perhaps once or twice a month? That saves money but also gives you the help you need. Your sanity is worth saving, too. 🙂

[Night Elf]

1 hour ago, SKL said:

I have often had communication issues with my cleaner because she loses her phone or whatever.

Generally I take it in stride.  So far she's always come back sooner or later.

As far as whether to continue the service - what about getting a "deep clean" once a year and a touch-up once a month?  That way if you do forget, at least it doesn't build up really bad.  And it doesn't cost as much as frequent cleaning.

The problem with this is if she's gone, I'd need to hire someone new and they all seem to want to perform a deep clean before they'll do maintenance work. My housekeeper worked about 15 hours on 3 separate days to deep clean my house. It was more than I anticipated but she was doing things I would never have dreamed of doing so I never complained. So now my house is in great shape. If I hire someone else, they may want to do their own deep cleaning and I can't afford that again. My coworker said she could recommend a cleaning service as she used to work there so it's possible she can vouch for me that I've already had a deep cleaning and am only looking for maintenance. I'll talk to her about it.

[Night Elf]

1 hour ago, Harriet Vane said:

How about a compromise on the cleaning? Rather than weekly, perhaps once or twice a month? That saves money but also gives you the help you need. Your sanity is worth saving, too. 🙂

I actually discussed this with my housekeeper as it would be kinder to my budget if she only came two Thursdays a month. She seemed surprised and said she wouldn't be able to keep up the maintenance with such a long time between cleanings. I don't know if she was being truthful or just wanted to ensure a weekly job.

[SKL]

37 minutes ago, Night Elf said:

The problem with this is if she's gone, I'd need to hire someone new and they all seem to want to perform a deep clean before they'll do maintenance work. My housekeeper worked about 15 hours on 3 separate days to deep clean my house. It was more than I anticipated but she was doing things I would never have dreamed of doing so I never complained. So now my house is in great shape. If I hire someone else, they may want to do their own deep cleaning and I can't afford that again. My coworker said she could recommend a cleaning service as she used to work there so it's possible she can vouch for me that I've already had a deep cleaning and am only looking for maintenance. I'll talk to her about it.

You can say no to the deep clean.  I've never had a cleaning service insist on that.  Say no and if they hang up, then their loss.  Someone will work with you.

[Harriet Vane]

1 hour ago, Night Elf said:

I actually discussed this with my housekeeper as it would be kinder to my budget if she only came two Thursdays a month. She seemed surprised and said she wouldn't be able to keep up the maintenance with such a long time between cleanings. I don't know if she was being truthful or just wanted to ensure a weekly job.

I think YOU set the terms, not her. You tell her what you want and how much time, and then you pay her. End of story.

I worked as a house cleaner through my college years, and I have employed many house cleaners over the last 25 years of grown-up life. Different clients want different things. If your house cleaner does not want to come fewer times, hire someone else. 

[Night Elf]

1 hour ago, Harriet Vane said:

I think YOU set the terms, not her. You tell her what you want and how much time, and then you pay her. End of story.

I worked as a house cleaner through my college years, and I have employed many house cleaners over the last 25 years of grown-up life. Different clients want different things. If your house cleaner does not want to come fewer times, hire someone else. 

Truth. I was just afraid of losing her because she works so well and I'm always pleased with the results. But I only pay her $50 for two hours once a week. I can see where she'd prefer to take a more lucrative position.

[Harriet Vane]

1 hour ago, Night Elf said:

Truth. I was just afraid of losing her because she works so well and I'm always pleased with the results. But I only pay her $50 for two hours once a week. I can see where she'd prefer to take a more lucrative position.

That's $25 an hour, which is a solid rate of pay. It's normal for house cleaners to cobble together numerous jobs with different expectations.

But there's also nothing wrong with telling her how much you value the good job she does and giving her supportive extras from time to time.

[QueenCat]

3 hours ago, Night Elf said:

Truth. I was just afraid of losing her because she works so well and I'm always pleased with the results. But I only pay her $50 for two hours once a week. I can see where she'd prefer to take a more lucrative position.

 

Wow! I haven't seen rates like that in years. All of the cleaning companies around here charge $40 per cleaner/per hour. The independents usually charge $35/hour. Pretty much all of them will do either weekly, biweekly or monthly. 

[Shoeless]

16 hours ago, Night Elf said:

I'll give it a couple of weeks, and if she doesn't contact me, I may go on care.com and make a comment on her profile. If she is ghosting me, that's extremely unprofessional.

 

Yes, it's very short sighted of her to ignore you.  House cleaners depend on good references.  

[PeterPan]

12 hours ago, Night Elf said:

I actually discussed this with my housekeeper as it would be kinder to my budget if she only came two Thursdays a month. She seemed surprised and said she wouldn't be able to keep up the maintenance with such a long time between cleanings. I don't know if she was being truthful or just wanted to ensure a weekly job.

I don't know your house, but if you've been happy with her work it might be she's telling you the truth. You're basically saying she should come less often and work twice as hard, which doesn't seem right. Personally, I wouldn't cave to your dh on this. The "Oh we can do this ourselves" thing in our house is just infamous for what doesn't happen, what doesn't get done. If it was working to have her on that schedule before, keep her, kiss her feet. Her rates seemed really low and she was keeping you happy and she was honest. Doesn't seem worth screwing up.

[Night Elf]

10 hours ago, QueenCat said:

 

Wow! I haven't seen rates like that in years. All of the cleaning companies around here charge $40 per cleaner/per hour. The independents usually charge $35/hour. Pretty much all of them will do either weekly, biweekly or monthly. 

I used care.com to find her and the range of rates for housekeepers was $10/hr to $35/hr. So I felt $25 was fair. She readily agreed to it. 

There was one I interviewed which was a strange situation because one lady was the one advertising on the site, her sister came to the interview, and the actual housekeeper was a cousin. So they wanted me to hire the cousin without even meeting her. After a deep cleaning which would cost $150 or so, she'd come back and clean once a week for $75 regardless of how long it took her to clean. I'm worried a situation like that will encourage half-as*ed cleaning, as in I'll only work 1-2 hours. My housekeeper was working 2 hours but she wasn't hitting all of the house in one day. She'd do the kitchen/hall bathroom and some living room on one day. Then the next week she'd do kitchen/dining room (attached to kitchen so very little to do in there)/master bed and bath. She usually finished a few minutes late but I'd round up her salary. If she worked 2.5 hours, I'd pay her $65 for the day rather than the actual amount of $62.50 which seemed silly to me. 

[gardenmom5]

11 hours ago, QueenCat said:

 

Wow! I haven't seen rates like that in years. All of the cleaning companies around here charge $40 per cleaner/per hour. The independents usually charge $35/hour. Pretty much all of them will do either weekly, biweekly or monthly. 

Rates vary based  on location. I don't know what the going rate where night elf is, but if she's in the average - she's fine.   If she's low, she'll have cleaners leave again. 

[Carrie12345]

5 hours ago, PeterPan said:

I don't know your house, but if you've been happy with her work it might be she's telling you the truth. You're basically saying she should come less often and work twice as hard, which doesn't seem right. Personally, I wouldn't cave to your dh on this. The "Oh we can do this ourselves" thing in our house is just infamous for what doesn't happen, what doesn't get done. If it was working to have her on that schedule before, keep her, kiss her feet. Her rates seemed really low and she was keeping you happy and she was honest. Doesn't seem worth screwing up.

That’s along the lines of what I was thinking.  It’d be perfectly okay (imo) to say we’d like to cut back to 2 hours every other week to include X, Y, and Z.  It’s not okay to say (or give the impression) that we want to cut back to half the time to include the same things.  Even opening it up to “whatever you can get to in that time”  would put a contractor in the position of possibly doing half-@$$ed work, which a client is likely to find unsatisfying and eventually drop all together.

Disclaimer: I say that as someone who got ZERO responses when sending out requests for quotes on an 1100sf house with 5 kids and 4 pets.  So what do I really know, other than that not all house cleaners are desperate for work? 😆 

[PeterPan]

1 hour ago, Carrie12345 said:

Disclaimer: I say that as someone who got ZERO responses when sending out requests for quotes on an 1100sf house with 5 kids and 4 pets.  So what do I really know, other than that not all house cleaners are desperate for work? 😆 

Fwiw, did you try looking under the people's listings rather than the posted job? I found lots of jobs posted but also lots of people listing themselves. I took it to mean they didn't want to look for you but for you to find them. And yeah, if people are willing to work at $10-15 an hour (which I saw quite a few listings for), then someone is desperate enough, lol. I don't think I'd even mention the kids, unless you expect the housekeeper to clean them.  

2 hours ago, Night Elf said:

She'd do the kitchen/hall bathroom and some living room on one day. Then the next week she'd do kitchen/dining room (attached to kitchen so very little to do in there)/master bed and bath. She usually finished a few minutes late but I'd round up her salary. If she worked 2.5 hours, I'd pay her $65 for the day rather than the actual amount of $62.50 which seemed silly to me.

So it looks like a lot of time is being spent cleaning your kitchen each week. If you do that or part of that, she might be able to come every other week. 

[QueenCat]

4 hours ago, gardenmom5 said:

Rates vary based  on location. I don't know what the going rate where night elf is, but if she's in the average - she's fine.   If she's low, she'll have cleaners leave again. 

 

Of course they vary. I was just expressing my surprise. I didn't say that she wasn't paying enough or wasn't fine. 

Edited July 1, 2019 by QueenCat

[Pen]

What did your June 19 text say?

[Night Elf]

6 hours ago, Pen said:

What did your June 19 text say?

I texted: Just a reminder that I'm out of town and won't need you to come in tomorrow. I'll see you next week. Thanks!

She responded with just "Yes"

[Night Elf]

10 hours ago, PeterPan said:

Fwiw, did you try looking under the people's listings rather than the posted job? I found lots of jobs posted but also lots of people listing themselves. I took it to mean they didn't want to look for you but for you to find them. And yeah, if people are willing to work at $10-15 an hour (which I saw quite a few listings for), then someone is desperate enough, lol. I don't think I'd even mention the kids, unless you expect the housekeeper to clean them.  

So it looks like a lot of time is being spent cleaning your kitchen each week. If you do that or part of that, she might be able to come every other week. 

She seems to like cleaning the kitchen. She deep cleaned it so well that all it really needs are the counters and stove top wiped down and maybe clean the inside of the microwave if it's dirty. She cleans it all though.

And no, I did not look at people posting their availability. I only posted the job and responded to applicants I received. I was surprised that several live about 45-60 minutes away. That didn't make sense to me.

[katilac]

On 6/29/2019 at 6:44 PM, Catwoman said:

Why did you keep texting her instead of just giving her a call?

Because it's not 1997? 😎

I kid. Sort of. If I have to call you to get you to come back . . . you are probably never coming back. 

[Pen]

1 hour ago, Night Elf said:

I texted: Just a reminder that I'm out of town and won't need you to come in tomorrow. I'll see you next week. Thanks!

She responded with just "Yes"

 

Do you know if she has family or someone who’d be aware if she disappeared?

Do you know her address?

 

[Catwoman]

2 hours ago, katilac said:

Because it's not 1997? 😎

I kid. Sort of. If I have to call you to get you to come back . . . you are probably never coming back. 

 

We have clients of all ages, and most still prefer to call rather than text when it’s a business discussion.

[kbutton]

21 hours ago, Night Elf said:

I texted: Just a reminder that I'm out of town and won't need you to come in tomorrow. I'll see you next week. Thanks!

She responded with just "Yes"

You mentioned communication difficulties but eventually working out understanding--does she think she's now coming less often and then also thinks you ditched one of those cleanings because you were out of town? Perhaps she'll show up a month from the last time she came thinking that's what you wanted.

But I agree that she should answer if she is still working for you and is safe/well.

[Pen]

You may have lost her.

or something may have happened to her.

or she may have lost (been robbed of) her phone and all her contact information  so that who you are texting isn’t her (maybe even the “yes” came from someone else) and she may no longer be able to reach you.  This happened (cell phone and computer robbery) to someone I know recently   Increasingly we (many of us) don’t have back up information if our devices go missing 

 

[Night Elf]

I don't know anything about her really. I did not get a background check on her because I never anticipated her being alone in my house. I didn't ask for references because she had a couple on the site and they were positive. I pay her in cash and don't even know her last name. I have absolutely no way to get in touch with her except her cell phone. I have texted 3 times and left one voicemail. If she lost her phone, she can contact me through care.com again. I'm not going to chase her down. I've done what I can do to get in touch with her. Now the ball is in her court. 

[katilac]

20 hours ago, Catwoman said:

 

We have clients of all ages, and most still prefer to call rather than text when it’s a business discussion.

But I wouldn't really consider a yes or no question about cleaning my house to be a business discussion. 

[Xahm]

Since you've hired her essentially under the table and you said she has trouble with English, I would wonder if perhaps her immigration status has caused her difficulties as it has for some other immigrants in the area.