X-Post: CPS Help Please

[Ananda]

This is cross posted from the Gen. Education Board.  I I freeking out and shamelessly want as much advice as possible.

I am a long time lurker, and in desperate need of advice & hugs.  Sorry this is long.

We were reported to CPS.  I am unclear on the details of the allegations.  The lady showed up at our house last Thursday morning.  She said they received a report that our children were home in the daytime.  She seemed to think it was a administrative error (like a name misspelled in the state homeschoolers data base or something).  She was professional, kind, and didn't seem concerned at all.  I quickly told her that we are legal homeschoolers.  I offered to print off my "affirmation  letter" that I receive from the State.  She asked me to email it to her.  "She asked to "set eyes" on each of the children (including my 3 year old).

She talked briefly to my 9 year old.  She asked him about what rules we have.  He didn't answer, so I helped by saying "what are some things you are not allowed to do?"   He then said, "Mom wants me to moderate my electronics use.  I play video games all day."  (This is because I got upset with him last night about how I always have to kick him off electronics.  I wish he wish he would moderate himself.  He of course doesn't play video games all day, because I do kick him off). 

She asked him what other rules we have and he didn't have an answer.  She asked him what happens when he breaks a rule, and he said time out.  She asked him what his favorite subject was in school, and he didn't have an answer, but they did get around to the fact that he likes to read. 

I had to wake my 6 year old, and he was grumpy & complaining about how it was cold.  So she didn't talk to him, and he went right back inside.  She saw the three year old, and he was cute and quickly went back inside.  

She then asked me if my 9yo was in pull ups.  I said no, all my children (including recently the 3yo) are potty trained.  But I knew what she was referring to.  A few weeks ago 9yo was sick and didn't want to poop his pants.  He chose to wear a pull up for about two days, because he didn't want to poop his pants.  But How would anyone know that!?  And why does that even matter?  It isn't illegal/abusive for a 9yo to wear a pull up.

She said she needed make an appointment to talk to my husband & left.  She didn't ask to see the house, although she did probably see the reasonably clean (but still a bit untidy) living & dinning room as I was going in and out with the various children.

I quickly emailed her the affirmation letter regarding my 9 year old, and explained the situation regarding my 6 year old.  That for kindergarten you send a letter to the local school board saying that you intend to homeschool your child for first grade.  I did send this letter, but I have no proof because I messed up on getting a return receipt from the post office.  I also included a link to the state department of ed's FAQ regarding homeschooling to answer any questions she might have about the law.

My husband called her that evening to set up a time to talk to her.  She wasn't available until Tuesday (tomorrow).  She told him that she had received my email and still seemed to think it was an administrative error.  

My husband noticed that her office was next door to his, and offered to meet her there (by email).  She sent the following reply: 

"Part of my job is to meet with the family in a normal and comfortable setting in the home. Seeing the interactions and where the children live really helps us to get to know the family. I would prefer to meet with both you and your wife at your home. Let me know if that still works for Tuesday!"

 

He replied that the original plan of our house was fine.

We have deep cleaned the house and everything.  We are freaking out.

I don't know what to do. 

Part of me thinks we should just meet with her tomorrow in our home.  She will be a reasonable person, see things as they are and close the case.  Then we can put this behind us.  The other part of me keeps flashing back to every cps horror story I have ever heard.

We are not members of HSLDA, should I peruse legal council.  If so how/who?  Or wait to see how tomorrow pans out?

Concerns:

1.  We keep a non-traditional schedule.  The children go to bed late & wake up late.  They get adequate sleep.  When she showed up at 10:00 I was in my pajamas with an old braid and my 9yo's hair was unbrushed.  I had to wake my 6 yo.  Usually the children go to bed around 11:00, and get up 9:00.  I go to bed about 2:00 and wake up when my 3 yo does.

2.  I have tons of books & am a homeschool curriculum junkie.  But I don't keep records and don't have a lot to prove our work.  We do a lot orally, and a lot on white boards.  I don't keeps much around.  Math Mammoth worksheets immediately become scratch paper, then trash.

3.  I share a queen sized bed with my 9 yo, and my 6 yo sleeps in a loft bed in the same room.  I have asked the regularly if they would like their own room.  They prefer this situation, and I was okay with it. My 3 yo sleeps in the closet of my husband's room.  The 3 yo controls the bifold door.  It is always open unless he chooses to close it.  It is easy to just push it open.  He has a toddler bed, board books, stuffed toys & a light.

4.  Our house is older with a lot of minor damage.  Nothing dangerous or serious, but cracks & small holes in the wall plaster (could easily be patched), cabinet doors that don't close properly.  The bathroom while perfectly serviceable does need to be redone.  (all fixtures work appropriately).  We also have drawing on the walls.

5.  We have fruit flies.  We set traps and the situation is now minor, but I do notice the occasional fly.

6.  I am concerned that we may say or especially the children may say something that is taken out of context and blown out of proportion. 

7.  We don't know the exact allegations.  She seems focused on the legal homeschool paperwork.  But is vague when we ask if that is all there is.  Our paperwork is in order, surely she has figured that out by now.  Why does she want to meet us in our home etc.  if that is all there is?

 Please help

 

[Carrie12345]

You are not legally obligated to allow anyone in your house without a warrant.

When CPS came to my door, I did allow them basic access because I was confused and (obviously) panicked. When they requested a follow up, I told them they’d need to have a warrant.

I was sent my letter of “no findings” promptly.

[shawthorne44]

Hugs.   This is a nightmare of mine. 

I don't know what to tell you other than to not let the camel's head into the tent.   

[Pen]

https://cpsdefense.com/ten-things-you-must-do-if-cps-knocks-at-your-door/

 

[Ananda]

5 minutes ago, Pen said:

https://cpsdefense.com/ten-things-you-must-do-if-cps-knocks-at-your-door/

 

I understand that perspective.  I just wonder if it would make things worse in my situation.  The CPS lady didn't seem like she was trying to catch us out.  She seemed like she was trying to do her due diligence to close the case.  It seems like such a risk either way.  

She could visit with us and see things as they are and quickly close the case.  My instinct is this is what she wants to do.  On the other hand your link could be right.  She could find little things to justify escallating our case.

On the other hand, if we go lawyer & protect my rights on her.  She could back off & close the case.  Or she could continue to come back in an attempt to complete her investigation.  Or she could escallate the case because it looks like we are hidding something.

My understanding is that my rights are different.  That while I can refuse her access to my home & children, to do so will look bad.  I have to prove my innocence, rather than have my innocence assumed and she have to prove the allegations.  When the charges are criminal silence can't be construed as guilt, but apparently with CPS it can?

That sucks so much for us.  But maybe it is necessary to protect truly abused children.  I don't know.

I am receiving conflicting advice.

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply to me.  

[MrsRobinson]

Hugs! How scary for you all! I wish I had good advice... maybe more people that have faced CPS will chime in. 

[Ellie]

1 hour ago, Carrie12345 said:

You are not legally obligated to allow anyone in your house without a warrant.

When CPS came to my door, I did allow them basic access because I was confused and (obviously) panicked. When they requested a follow up, I told them they’d need to have a warrant.

I was sent my letter of “no findings” promptly.

This. So much this.

It's possible that HSLDA might help, even if you are not a member. They have been known to get involved when CPS behaves egregiously (which is way too often).

[Pen]

29 minutes ago, Ananda said:

I understand that perspective.  I just wonder if it would make things worse in my situation.  The CPS lady didn't seem like she was trying to catch us out.  She seemed like she was trying to do her due diligence to close the case.  It seems like such a risk either way.  

She could visit with us and see things as they are and quickly close the case.  My instinct is this is what she wants to do.  On the other hand your link could be right.  She could find little things to justify escallating our case.

On the other hand, if we go lawyer & protect my rights on her.  She could back off & close the case.  Or she could continue to come back in an attempt to complete her investigation.  Or she could escallate the case because it looks like we are hidding something.

My understanding is that my rights are different.  That while I can refuse her access to my home & children, to do so will look bad.  I have to prove my innocence, rather than have my innocence assumed and she have to prove the allegations.  When the charges are criminal silence can't be construed as guilt, but apparently with CPS it can?

That sucks so much for us.  But maybe it is necessary to protect truly abused children.  I don't know.

I am receiving conflicting advice.

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply to me.  

 

I don’t know.

 I was a foster parent and so tended to view CPS as mostly rational.

However, a friend of my son’s mom had a visit from CPS where she tried to handle it in the friendly, case will be realized to be an error and it can be closed and we’ll move on—only it didn’t work out that way.  

It seems like you have a child who makes it sound like he or she spends all day doing nothing but video games, and a sleeping situation which might strike a caseworker as being odd...  and then the pull ups question and not being direct about the charges they’re investigating bothers me...

I’d be wary of something that started as just a homeschooling issue escalating...

Maybe you could put it off while seeking legal assistance.  

[ktgrok]

I would've a reason ready as to why you have the schedule you do - something about how you adjusted to a different schedule so the kids can spend more time with your husband after he gets home from work. 

[scrapbookbuzz]

1 hour ago, Carrie12345 said:

You are not legally obligated to allow anyone in your house without a warrant.

When CPS came to my door, I did allow them basic access because I was confused and (obviously) panicked. When they requested a follow up, I told them they’d need to have a warrant.

I was sent my letter of “no findings” promptly.

THIS! 

[Ananda]

8 minutes ago, Ktgrok said:

I would've a reason ready as to why you have the schedule you do - something about how you adjusted to a different schedule so the kids can spend more time with your husband after he gets home from work. 

That is the reason.  That and we were already on a later schedule so all our children just naturally fell into it.

[Ausmumof3]

Different country so no useful advice really but it bothers me about the pull-ups thing.  I would wonder if there is more to the allegation and she’s not being perfectly up front.  She asked to see your paperwork and she’s seen it.  I’d worry there was something more.  People with more experience can give better advice but if you can see the actual allegation it might be better.  

I really hope everything works out quickly and ok.

[Shoeless]

Who did you tell about the pull-ups?  Did you mention it in passing to another mom in homeschool group?  Did your 9 year old mention it to a relative on the phone?  Did your husband tell a co-worker?  Someone you know called this in. 

Not to add to your worry-load, but I'd be trying to figure out who called this in and going scorched earth on them.  That person would be forever dead to me. 

[Ananda]

3 minutes ago, Medicmom2.0 said:

 

I can’t speak for every state, but the norm here is two visits.  The second is usually just a very brief follow up, but it covers their bases.  My best guess is someone accused you of neglect—academic neglect, maybe neglect in a nine year old wearing pull ups, maybe they said there’s a developmental delay and you haven’t sought help.  Obviously none of this is true and they should figure it out quickly.  It can still take weeks though to close.

Uggg.  I haven't been sleeping (on benedryl and melatonin).  I think if this drags on weeks, I will legit need anti-anxiety medication.  Her manor thus far & my instinct is that she is  box checking so that she can close her case.  But but but . . . the horror stories . . . our families eccentricities . . . the way children always speak in hyperbole . . . 

[Jean in Newcastle]

4 minutes ago, Ananda said:

Uggg.  I haven't been sleeping (on benedryl and melatonin).  I think if this drags on weeks, I will legit need anti-anxiety medication.  Her manor thus far & my instinct is that she is  box checking so that she can close her case.  But but but . . . the horror stories . . . our families eccentricities . . . the way children always speak in hyperbole . . . 

You've had one visit.  Tuesday would be the second. 

[Ananda]

Just now, MissLemon said:

Who did you tell about the pull-ups?  Did you mention it in passing to another mom in homeschool group?  Did your 9 year old mention it to a relative on the phone?  Did your husband tell a co-worker?  Someone you know called this in. 

Not to add to your worry-load, but I'd be trying to figure out who called this in and going scorched earth on them.  That person would be forever dead to me. 

 

Neither I, nor anyone else told anyone, before the CPS investigation.  It would have to have been seen through the curtains.  It is most likely a neighbor.  Possibly the mailman or Fed-ex guy etc. (but probably not, they are always so quick).  Yeah it freaks me out, and makes my paranoid that is will become an on going problem. 

[Shoeless]

I'm confident you will get through this. 

 

[maize]

6 minutes ago, MissLemon said:

Who did you tell about the pull-ups?  Did you mention it in passing to another mom in homeschool group?  Did your 9 year old mention it to a relative on the phone?  Did your husband tell a co-worker?  Someone you know called this in. 

Not to add to your worry-load, but I'd be trying to figure out who called this in and going scorched earth on them.  That person would be forever dead to me. 

I've actually had people call CPS about my family twice, and both times the reporter was sincerely well intentioned just kind of clueless. One time it was an older woman in our neighborhood who had just been through volunteer training at her church and thought she was required to report any possible inkling of a problem. 

CPS lady came out, I talked to her on my front steps, she said she wasn't concerned but needed to walk through the house, I said we had had a stomach flu over the weekend and it was a bad time but she could come back another day, preferably Wednesday afternoon because my cleaning lady came on Wednesdays. She saw a couple of my kids because they came to the front door but didn't actually ask to see all of them.

She never did come back though I was certainly nervous for weeks. In our state they are not required to actually open a case on every allegation so I think she decided there was really no concern and that was that.

So there's my not scary CPS story.

[ktgrok]

Someone maybe saw you buying the pull ups? Or bringing them in?

[Ananda]

Just now, Ktgrok said:

Someone maybe saw you buying the pull ups? Or bringing them in?

Yeah, that is the other thing.  Up until a few months ago, my 6 yo (how is tall for his age) wore a pull-up at night.  So maybe the confused the children?  But again WHY DOES THIS MATTER?  My youngest is 3, it isn't odd that we have pull-up in the house.

[maize]

5 minutes ago, Ananda said:

Yeah, that is the other thing.  Up until a few months ago, my 6 yo (how is tall for his age) wore a pull-up at night.  So maybe the confused the children?  But again WHY DOES THIS MATTER?  My youngest is 3, it isn't odd that we have pull-up in the house.

One of mine was in nighttime pullups until about age 8. 

Pullups are just not that uncommon and certainly not a sign of neglect...

[Katy]

I know it's difficult to relax in this situation, but try to.  We've had CPS here all the time because we're foster parents, and we've had social workers question us because of accusations from bio parents.  They were always unfounded.

They are extremely limited in what they can do.  Frankly there's a couple I know who just got their children back who I'm firmly convinced would be in prison if they were any of the following: 1) not married, 2) not homeowners, 3) not white, 4) not middle class.  It's sad to say but if you're a white middle or upper middle class home owning family even if multiple doctors turned you in for child abuse chances are it would be years before kids were removed from your home.  Especially because homeschooling is a supreme-court defined constitutional right.

You absolutely do not have to let them in your home.

Did you mention to a doctor that your 9 year old was in pull ups bc of flu?  That may have been the source of the request for a home check.

[Ananda]

15 minutes ago, Katy said:

I know it's difficult to relax in this situation, but try to.  We've had CPS here all the time because we're foster parents, and we've had social workers question us because of accusations from bio parents.  They were always unfounded.

They are extremely limited in what they can do.  Frankly there's a couple I know who just got their children back who I'm firmly convinced would be in prison if they were any of the following: 1) not married, 2) not homeowners, 3) not white, 4) not middle class.  It's sad to say but if you're a white middle or upper middle class home owning family even if multiple doctors turned you in for child abuse chances are it would be years before kids were removed from your home.  Especially because homeschooling is a supreme-court defined constitutional right.

You absolutely do not have to let them in your home.

Did you mention to a doctor that your 9 year old was in pull ups bc of flu?  That may have been the source of the request for a home check.

 

Yeah, I have never been so glad to be privileged.  I feel guilty, but I am genuinely relieved that I am: white, educated, middle class, healthy physically & mentally etc.  I don't have to worry about discrimination for anything except homeschooling & general weirdness.  It goes without saying it shouldn't be that way. 

[Mergath]

I don't know what state you're in, but my experience here is that CPS doesn't get involved until a child has actually died. I have a FB (not actual) friend who brags about doing drugs while she was pregnant and still has custody of all three kids, including the newborn.

I reported another homeschool family myself because of extremely severe and long-term educational neglect (I'm talking teens who were illiterate and could barely add), untreated and dangerous mental illness in the mom while the dad was gone all the time (knives and self-harm in front of the kids was a thing, as well as paranoid delusions), and the children having no food. It was bad. So bad. CPS didn't do a thing.

I think you'll be fine. Regardless of what HSLDA propaganda would have you believe, CPS is not out to get your kids. If you follow all those stories where people freak out about kids being taken away from homeschool families, every time it comes out later that the parents were on drugs and the kids were being abused. Really, with the lack of available foster homes in most places, as long as you aren't actually snorting crushed up narcotics off your children, you'll be fine. Not even joking, that's basically where the bar is set now. 😔

[Pen]

2 hours ago, Æthelthryth the Texan said:

PS- If I'm wrong then you can all say I'm wrong and overreactive and paranoid. But if I'm right........you're going to be paying a lawyer you wish you'd gotten sooner possibly thousands of dollars. Which bet do you want to hedge? 

 

@Ananda I’m in agreement.  

The parent of my son’s friend I mentioned, who started trying the compliant nice approach assuming there was nothing founded and thus it would quickly go away, when I last heard, they had been fighting CPS for months, had paid thousands in legal bills, and everyone in family was feeling sick from stress...

and I feel pretty certain there was no abuse or neglect (as I understand it, the child got sick probably with Lyme disease, but CPS didn’t believe in Lyme disease as present in their state, nor in the iGenex test... ) 

I’d be concerned that no matter the reality of how nice it may be, a child sleeping in a closet won’t come out sounding good (not as bad as tied up in basement, but could be fodder)...  CPS might not discover it, but they might, for example, a child might say something.  

Anyway, if you,  Ananda and family, do decide to go through with the visit tomorrow, I do hope it goes well .  

Edited February 26, 2019 by Pen

[Pen]

2 minutes ago, Æthelthryth the Texan said:

I think the link you posted up thread Pen has wise advice. That's an attorney's office. Not a homeschool specific organization. Not to mention our own brilliant former DA here from the Hive who has btdt and is echoing the same thing in the X-post. 

 

Who is the hive’s own former DA?

[Ananda]

I will consult an HSLDA & an attorney.  I agree that it isn't worth the risk.  I can take the financial hit.  (Probably, I actually don't know how much an attorney costs.)  But wow . . . a neighbor tattles on us for legally homeschooling and I have to pay a but ton of money to defend myself. 

We have decided to go through with tomorrow's visit.  My mother is here for support, 3rd set of ears, and child control (so that we can focus on the workers).  We will answer the specific allegations, but be circumspect about anything else.

We are insisting on receiving the specific allegations in writing before the visit. If they are more serious then we have been led to believe, we will cancel the visit.  We won't allow her to talk to the children without us present.  We will record the interview.

Hopefully we can pay a small amount (hundreds not thousands) for legal advice, and go into this with our eyes wide open.  I will update, as appropriate.  I have been convinced both to consult a lawyer and to cooperate with a brief home visit.  Hopefully this is the right choice.  No choice was presented itself as safe or clearly correct.  We take a leap of faith.

[LMD]

I hope everything resolves quickly for you Ananda

[Bluegoat]

You know, I would guess that asking about toilet training had nothing to do with the pull-ups.  

 

[TravelingChris]

Wearing pullups is not a bad thing.  Many older children have bedwetting issues and still need them. But I am very concerned that they want another visit because if it was just homeschool papers, and you showed them already,  then their original reason is false. 

I am not one to think that every dealing with CPS is an overreach. but the need for a second visit, to meet with husband and you and all kids, pullups, etc sounds more like they may be looking at other types of abuse, not educational at all.  My recommendation in your specific case to is to get a very good lawyer who will fight.  

One of those other suggestions, i,e. medical exam, is something that CPS often needs and getting one on your own terms with your children's own physician who knows the family is a lot better.

[....]

9 hours ago, Mergath said:

I reported another homeschool family myself because of extremely severe and long-term educational neglect (I'm talking teens who were illiterate and could barely add), untreated and dangerous mental illness in the mom while the dad was gone all the time (knives and self-harm in front of the kids was a thing, as well as paranoid delusions), and the children having no food. It was bad. So bad. CPS didn't do a thing.

 

The family who lives in the house next to mine has been reported and nothing has happened to them.  I don't want to post details, but if our CPS did nothing to that family, they're not going to do anything to anyone else.  The conditions inside the house are so bad that we can't open our windows on the side of the house - the smell wafts into our house.  If the kids are outside playing and we go outside, we can actually smell the kids from our front porch.  I'm also pretty certain the kids don't own jackets/coats.

I know there are a lot of scary stories on the internet about CPS.  My sister is a defense attorney and she says it is actually very, very hard for CPS to take anyone's kids away.  She said you could even be an addict and CPS will still find a way to help you keep your kids.

Maybe it depends on where you live...  Good luck with whatever you decide, OP!  

[City Mouse]

It really does depend on your state.

in Texas, CPS has a lot more leeway to remove children, and there are all kinds of stories of CPS being "proactive" or "overreaching" depending on your view. However, the only cases I know of personally, CPS was extremely justified in removing the kids when they did. -I just remembered, I do have a friend whose teenage stepdaughters reported her for making them do chores around the house. There were no long term issues there except for the girls.

In my current state, our CYFD has extremely limited powers as evidenced by the recent child deaths. CYFD here does not actually have the authority to remove a child without a court order from a judge. Emergency removal must be done by a police office in cases of immediate serious dangers. The one time my DH (a police officer) has done this was to send a boy to the hospital. The boy was about 7 and is entire back was covered with one giant, oozing sunburn blister. The boy was running around town under the "care" of his 10 yr old sister who was also watching the toddler. All of this while the parent (a know drug abuser-very small town) was unable to be located. The kid was treated the hospital and released to his grandmother. The only other case that I have a personal connection to was a teenage girl who reported sexual abuse by her grandfather/guardian. The adults in the case were extremely uncooperative and both kids were removed from the home. I don't know the resolution on that case as the younger child was removed from our school to attend school elsewhere whil in foster care. - so basically it takes direct verbal confirmation for, the child which in most cases doesn't happen.

Edited February 26, 2019 by City Mouse

[RootAnn]

Since you have your mom there, I would keep all the kids in another part of the house (or they are all out with your mom shopping or on a field trip). CPS lady has already seen/talked to them & only needs to talk to your DH, so they don't have to be there. Thus, you remove a chance one of the kids will say something weird that will be misconstrued.

Hugs! I hope it is a quick visit & you quickly get a letter that there is nothing to this.

[Ananda]

This was the CPS workers reply to our inquiry regarding complaint:

I am not able to give you the physical copy of the report. However, I am able to summarize the report for you.  The report just stated that the children are currently homeschooled. The report stated that ds9 has been wearing a pull-up and that the children will have difficulty following directions. When the report was received, the children were checked to see if they were registered as homeschooled. The report stated that there was not filing for exempt school under the name D--- (children & husband's last name) for the children to be homeschooled. There is no other information in the report.

 

I was able to confirm with the Dept. of Ed. that ds9 is exempt due to a filing under your wife’s name, Ananda (my last name which is different). And your wife explained to me that a letter was sent to ds6’s district school stating that she was homeschooled. I believe that when checking on the exempt school filing, ds9’s birth date was entered incorrectly in our system which was why they were unable to find this information.

 

Let me know if this makes sense. Thanks!

Thoughts?

Edited February 26, 2019 by Ananda
removing names

[moonflower]

Since they've cleared up the allegation, why do they need to enter your home and meet with you again?  

[Bluegoat]

6 minutes ago, moonflower said:

Since they've cleared up the allegation, why do they need to enter your home and meet with you again?  

 

It might just be their SOP.

[Scarlett]

Please remove your real names!

[PeppermintPattie]

Don't allow them to come inside your home again. Call HSLDA and follow their advice.

[moonflower]

I'm sure it's their SOP, what I'm saying is I don't see the need to cooperate with it.  The allegation is resolved, no judge is going to issue a warrant at this point, so there's no need for the meeting, really.

[AmandaVT]

1 minute ago, Æthelthryth the Texan said:

This is what I'd be replying- IF ANYTHING- while waiting to talk to the lawyer and HSLDA. The only reason to reply is if she's due at your house shortly. 

"Dear CPS worker, 

Since the exemption question has been remedied, it would seem that any misunderstandings have been resolved and we will not be meeting with you today as planned.

In the case that you have further questions or concerns, please let me know and I will forward them directly to our counsel. They can then contact you directly to set something up. 

Thanks!

Homeschooler" 

 

I agree - it sounds like they have resolved the question as to whether you properly registered your kids as homeschoolers. If "having trouble following directions" was a CPS reportable offense, I think 100% of families would be reported at some point or another, if not weekly. If a child (or adult) needs a pull-up or adult diaper for medical reasons, that's also not an offense of any kind. 

[Ananda]

I joined HSLDA in fear.  Apparently you can join after the fact.  They game me two names of local-ish lawyers to call.  

[moonflower]

I feel like people in the US are generally more clear about the wisdom of telling the police "I would like to talk to a lawyer" before talking to the police than they are about CPS.  I credit Law&Order for this phenomenon; it was clear from that show and similar (which I realize are fiction but this is how information is spread these days) that the police are really not on your side if you are under suspicion and that there is no harm to you for saying you want a lawyer.  It always pisses off the police in the show.  

I believe that the majority of CPS workers are fairish and have your best interests at heart.  I don't think all of them are like this.  I think the majority of police officers have your best interests at heart too, but I'm not ceding my constitutional rights on the assumption of their goodwill, because they see too many bad things in the profession and imo start seeing all nails, since they're a hammer.

[Scarlett]

I don’t feel this is anything to worry about. You are doing all you can to protect your self from an overreach and nothing about your life sounds abusive to me.  It sounds a little chaotic....but many homes are at times including mine!  

I just shook my head about the ‘following directions” thing.  Good grief.  On any given day at any home in the world is some child not following directions.  

Try not to worry OP.  It will be fine. 

[Valley Girl]

What busybody thought it was OK to report someone because a kid didn't follow directions? OP, I wish you the best. I'd be REALLY concerned about getting to the bottom of who reported you...and avoid them like the plague. So sorry you're having to go through this situation.

[Pen]

51 minutes ago, Ananda said:

This was the CPS workers reply to our inquiry regarding complaint:

I am not able to give you the physical copy of the report. However, I am able to summarize the report for you.  The report just stated that the children are currently homeschooled. The report stated that ds9 has been wearing a pull-up and that the children will have difficulty following directions. When the report was received, the children were checked to see if they were registered as homeschooled. The report stated that there was not filing for exempt school under the name D--- (children & husband's last name) for the children to be homeschooled. There is no other information in the report.

 

I was able to confirm with the Dept. of Ed. that ds9 is exempt due to a filing under your wife’s name, Ananda (my last name which is different). And your wife explained to me that a letter was sent to ds6’s district school stating that she was homeschooled. I believe that when checking on the exempt school filing, ds9’s birth date was entered incorrectly in our system which was why they were unable to find this information.

 

Let me know if this makes sense. Thanks!

Thoughts?

 

Personally, since the alleged “issue” should now be cleared up, I’d use that as primary basis on which to cancel the meeting at your house. 

But I’d talk to a lawyer ASAP first if at all possible.

[Pen]

http://fightcps.com/nebraska-child-welfare-inspector-general-speaks-out/

If you don’t know how to find a lawyer and don’t have success via a homeschooling group, you could try aclu or 

[Pen]

http://fightcps.com/nebraska-child-welfare-inspector-general-speaks-out/

If you don’t know how to find a lawyer and don’t have success via a homeschooling group, you could try aclu or 

posting problem

 

National Lawyer’s Guild, possibly NLG.org

 

the Nebraska link because your profile seems to give that as your state

[Pen]

As of now you aren’t dealing with court case or trying to get children back.

 You should be able to have something like a half hour consultation, perhaps a letter from an attorney to CPS, or similar that should not be hugely costly.  

 

[Ananda]

About the following instructions thing:

ds9 is generally good, he can be spacey or distractable, when overwhelmed (which becoming increasingly rare) he does melt down.  I have given him coping skills and worked with his teachers to allow him to leave is overwhelmed.

ds6 is generally good.  We have been having trouble with attitude.  He cries and whines and makes a martyr out of himself.   This is a problem that we are actively parenting (with no effect).

ds3 is on the stubborn end of normal for a 3yo in following directions.

[Ananda]

Update:

I joined HSLDA out of fear. Apparently, you can join after the fact.  So I got real legal advice. Go me!  He suggested a middle road because that was what made us most comfortable.  We will keep the meeting, invite the cps worker into our living room and have brief conversation with her.  My mother will play with the children in the adjoining play room or dinning room.  So they will be able to see the kids.  She will not tour our house.  If we become uncomfortable, I will excuse myself to talk to legal council (ie HSLDA).