So... do other people actually worry about social skills, too?

[violamama]

I know it's kind of a stereotype that hs'ers don't get socialization right, and I'm probably stepping out of the box a bit to admit- it IS something my husband and I worry about with our older kid.

 

The issue right now: My 7 year old is friendly, and extremely chatty. With everybody. EVERYbody.

 

Whatever he's interested in, he will practically tackle anyone out in public and start talking about. "Do you like diamonds? I have a zirconium diamond given to me by my grandma. I have a lot of other minerals, too." Etc.

 

He does not have a good sense of appropriate timing, and we have definitely been working on it. Busy waitress? Fast-walking college boy going the opposite direction? Fellow swim student who needs to focus on getting ready? All fair game to him. In fact I get the feeling that sometimes people think I'm too quick to jump on him or that I'm over-critical but it's important to me that he learn to consider others and I'm more than a bit afraid for his feelings being hurt later on... and that people may not get the chance to like him because he will bowl them over so completely.

 

Some of it is his age and most of it is his personality. While I would never prefer he be shamed into "normalcy" by the experiences he might have in more mainstream schooling situations, I have to admit I worry about whether I'm making too big a deal or not enough of a big deal of this. Am I just worrying about people thinking he's an odd bird BECAUSE he is homeschooled? Am I making it easier on him because he is homeschooled? Any of you guys have a kid like this?

[Snow]

I don't have been much btdt advice but I think it's good to consider social skills. In fact, as far as preparing them for success in the world, I'd put social skills and relating well with others on par with reading. So it's okay to worry, it's okay to make learning it important.

 

It's sounds like its a one of two things: missing social cues and/or having the self control to override want HE wants. He might see the cues but lacks the ability to stop himself because he's so excited. If that's the case, I think just plain old maturity is the answer. If its more missing social cues, then I think proactively hitting those areas will help. I've seen links on the special needs board for some books that looked good (even for nt kids) about learning what's appropriate in social situations. From what I've read there, it seems like some kids just need more direct instruction with it. What might have been intuitive for you or me as a kid might not be for everyone.

 

Some people are just chatty. My former boss was notorious for sitting in my office chatting. I always felt like saying, don't you realize the amount of work you've given me? And you're here chatting? But, she's one of the good ones, you know? Heart of gold and no one would ever consider her socially awkward. Just chatty :)

[Melissa in Australia]

I think social skills are something that needs to be taught. Mostly this happens trough modeling by others, for our family that would mean by Dh and I. Sometimes it needs to be demonstrated, which involves inviting people over or going to places where the child can observe examples of social skills. sometimes it needs to be explicitly discussed step by step and then give them a opportunity to practice. for example when they were younger Would invite some people and the children give them food and water. example of older instruction. ds19 goes to Uncle's place for a big wog-fest( Uncle's in-laws are Italian, it is the name they have for the big family feast). I tell him he needs to take a gift for the host.

[violamama]

From what I've read there, it seems like some kids just need more direct instruction with it. What might have been intuitive for you or me as a kid might not be for everyone.

 

Some people are just chatty.

Yep.

I think it's just not intuitive for him. He does care about others, and at times notices incredible details. We do some direct pointing out of social cues, though, and try to encourage the outward-thinking as much as we can.

 

We can pretty clearly see the genetics on this one: My husband was miserable at many points of his childhood, adolescence and young adulthood because he missed the social cues of others. He is actually a little bitter about it sometimes toward his parents, who thought he was just too smart for most people. Really, they would still say he's too special for the general populace. He did a lot of work on these skills early in our marriage, and has a much easier time now.

 

I'm chatty, in the right situation. I type like I talk, and my posts are usually too long... chatty.

 

So this poor kid, he got a double dose! For me the hs insecurity is almost never the academics or what have you; it's always the social habits and we are working on it in a very intentional way.

 

I will look for those books!

[Snow]

I didnt look back through to find the thread but i had these three in my amazon browsing history that looked up when I read the thread...

 

http://www.amazon.com/Its-Much-Work-Your-Friend/dp/B000WMOFA2/ref=pd_ybh_24

 

 

http://www.amazon.com/Picture-Teaching-emotion-communication-children/dp/1885477910/ref=pd_ybh_25

 

http://www.amazon.com/Social-Revised-Expanded-Anniversary-Edition/dp/1935274058/ref=pd_ybh_1

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[violamama]

This one looks like his speed, too:

http://www.amazon.com/Social-Rules-Kids-The-Kids-Succeed/dp/1934575844/ref=pd_sim_b_41

[debi21]

My son (only 4 though) sounds like very much like your son. He talks to everyone, waves to people in grocery stores. He stands on our back porch and yells to the neighbors in adjacent yards (who we don't know) "Hi, I'm William, who are you?." I cringe, but I am forcing myself not to critique him for the inappropriateness of some of his interactions. Why? Because I feel like the social niceties - the knowing how to listen, how to not interrupt, how to choose when to speak and when not to - can come later. My thought is, first, he needs to be confident talking to other people, confident that he can express himself, his thoughts, his needs. He needs to not be afraid to speak up.

 

Because I am. When I speak, I am always thinking about how others will judge me. I am always thinking that the words coming out of my mouth will sound awkward to others. I am always afraid, I don't even know what of. I am therefore shy and hesitant to speak. I try to go unnoticed as much as possible. I have no trouble talking about facts or even my opinion, in an academic or professional environment. But to talk about my social or emotional needs, to talk about myself and my personal opinions, likes, and dislikes... I grew up with two parents - one who seemed so overbearing/domineering/rudely aggressive in speech and the other who was so socially awkward in speech - I felt embarrassed by both of them, I think more than the average kid feels about their parents. Now, I am completely uncomfortable chit chatting with anyone until I get to know them quite well. I have a lot of trouble dealing with people in service professions - from hair stylists to auto mechanics to handymen - because I have trouble making idle conversation, talking about myself, and I suppose relating to them. I am happier with no social element to a business transaction.

 

I don't want that for my son. So I figure even inappropriate conversations are good practice for speaking. The more social interaction he gets, the more confident he will be in it. The more he talks to other kids, the better (hopefully) he will become. I don't know for sure, but I have been thinking, it's not like the popular kids with all the friends had perfect social skills in their early elementary years - I think they were just more confident and more extroverted. Honing these skills comes later for everyone, doesn't it?

 

Also I think, what good is it for the parent to critique the communication? - I mean, eventually the kids will be rejected / shot down / whatever by the person they are talking to. They will be teased or criticized by their peers for inappropriate communications. I think, will he really learn it from me telling it to him ahead of time? Why criticize unduly? Won't that only undermine our relationship? Sometimes kids don't play with / won't be friends with / shun other kids for no good reason at all, maybe they don't like they way they look. Maybe they have their friends "set". So my position is, with regard to his social interactions, I am there to support and encourage not critique. I don't want him to ever think I am not on his side.

 

And I am working as hard as I can to give my son social experiences that will allow him to develop interpersonal skills through playdates, extracurricular activities, etc, because I have already had the heartbreak of him hearing him say "Nobody wanted to be my friend today." And it still brings tears to my eyes. So to the subject of this topic... yes, I worry about this a lot.

 

Just my incoherent midnight ramble...

[ErinE]

I have a son and daughter like this. If I can, we talk about appropriate behavior beforehand. We've had many discussions on "why" we don't talk too much, even modeling certain behaviors. They didn't always understand what they were doing until I would demonstrate. I've said the following multiple times.

 

* "Listen to the coach. He has a job to do and he can't do his job when kids are talking."

* Putting my hand on the child to interrupt a story and saying, "We need to let this person go" or "We need to go."

* "Not everyone wants to hear about Beyblades. Though you might consider them interesting, others might not. Ask a question about their interests and listen."

 

On the flip-side, I've had many people approach me to comment on how polite and well-spoken my children are. There is a fine balance between too chatty and perfectly friendly.

[Chris in VA]

People are so quick to jump on the Aspie bandwagon, but...could he be somewhere on the spectrum? Could your husband? Missing social cues at 7 is different than missing them at 4. Having a deep interest and wanting to share it is not only an Aspie trait, for sure, but it is something that some Aspies "do."

Just something to consider, not saying your son has Aspergers.

[ktgrok]

I just want to say that I think that issue has nothing to do with if he is attending school. He'd just be picked on there or ostracized for it. Then he'd be chatty and depressed instead of just chatty.

 

Do work on it with him, but be careful how you do it. He is NOT doing it on purpose, I would imagine. So yes, do say things like "Did you see how the waitress was glancing back at the kitchen over and over? She needed to get back there, and that is how you can tell." Don't say, "Didn't you see that the waitress is in a hurry? It's rude to keep talking when she wants to leave!" That will make him feel upset, but won't help him one bit because no, he didn't see that she was in a hurry, and you saying "in a hurry" doesn't give him the actual cues to look for.

 

My son has Asperger's and this is something we work on.

[NotSoObvious]

Yes, we teach social skills all the time by being guests, hosts, writing thank you notes, speaking with new people, etc. It's just a matter of modeling and talking about it. But, look around NObody is perfect, and I'm talking about adults. Is a life long process and not something most people master in childhood.

 

When I worry (and I do) I try to keep my experience as a teacher in mind. There is a whole spectrum of everything. For every quirk one of my kids has, I can name ten kids who are worse and go to school. When I see them with their PS peers, I worry that they don't know who Justin Beiber is, but then I'm thankful for the other characteristics they don't have because of the influence of that whole 10 year old girl culture.

 

Just keep plugging away at it! The world needs all kinds of people. :)

[Susan in TN]

I just want to say that I think that issue has nothing to do with if he is attending school. He'd just be picked on there or ostracized for it. Then he'd be chatty and depressed instead of just chatty.

 

My son has Asperger's and this is something we work on.

 

 

It wasn't until I was 12 or 13 that I really began to "get a clue" socially. I'm fairly certain I would have been "on the spectrum" plus auditory processing issues - although I was just seen as being quiet and shy, I remember saying some terribly insensitive things. I had a very difficult time with human empathy, although I was very sensitive to the needs of my stuffed animals :D.

 

Teaching your kids some basic social skills where they are lacking is a good thing. I would tend to do this as quietly and unobtrusively as possible. OP, you sound like a pretty sensitive mom, so I'm sure you'll hit the right balance.

[Wheres Toto]

My son is exactly like this but it's Pokemon that he wants to talk about incessantly. My older brother was like this, with him it was trains.

We work on it. I do interrupt him when it gets too much and the person seems overwhelmed. He won't stop even when someone says they have to go, it's always "just let me finish....".

 

We do think he may be Aspie and adhd.

[mommymilkies]

I just want to say that I think that issue has nothing to do with if he is attending school. He'd just be picked on there or ostracized for it. Then he'd be chatty and depressed instead of just chatty.

 

Do work on it with him, but be careful how you do it. He is NOT doing it on purpose, I would imagine. So yes, do say things like "Did you see how the waitress was glancing back at the kitchen over and over? She needed to get back there, and that is how you can tell." Don't say, "Didn't you see that the waitress is in a hurry? It's rude to keep talking when she wants to leave!" That will make him feel upset, but won't help him one bit because no, he didn't see that she was in a hurry, and you saying "in a hurry" doesn't give him the actual cues to look for.

 

My son has Asperger's and this is something we work on.

 

 

I agree. Public school would not help. He'd just be made fun of and bullied. Trust me, LOTS of kids in school have issues like these. You don't want him "toughen upped" you want to help him learn. Luckily, these girls shared some great resources for doing so.

[Dmmetler]

We definitely work on it. My DD is ID'd PG and just missed qualifying for an Asperger's DX (but has a lot of the traits) and can be chatty in some situations and seriously withdrawn in others. She's actually fairly good with adults, but struggles with children. I'm SURE PS would have been a social nightmare for her!

 

One thing that's helped dramatically is an iPad app called "The Social Express". It's expensive for an app, but cheap compared to therapy. It lets kids choose actions for animated characters, and then see the results, and leads them through a lesson in choosing what to do. DD uses it to teach her stuffed animals social skills, and has given many of them personalities of types that I think she struggles to deal with-there's one stuffed snake, for example, who's definitely a "mean girl" ;). We've also used a lot of books, but being able to control the characters seems to help carry over better.

[Susan in TN]

Another thought came to me that may or may not be helpful. Has he specifically practiced starting a conversation? Be face to face, make eye contact, say "hello", introduce yourself if necessary, say "it's nice to meet you ___", then have a conversation, etc.

 

It sounds like he's wanting to express all these exciting thoughts he has and maybe if he had lots of practice starting conversations (and maybe a simple cue to remind him), he'd eventually reign in his impulsive impromptu conversations? :)

[violamama]

Another thought came to me that may or may not be helpful. Has he specifically practiced starting a conversation? Be face to face, make eye contact, say "hello", introduce yourself if necessary, say "it's nice to meet you ___", then have a conversation, etc.

 

It sounds like he's wanting to express all these exciting thoughts he has and maybe if he had lots of practice starting conversations (and maybe a simple cue to remind him), he'd eventually reign in his impulsive impromptu conversations? :)

 

 

I was just talking to a friend who knows my son and she has a college-aged boy who has a very similar personality. She says they talked a lot about this and it did help. They made lessons out of walking up and just listening to a group of people first, of saying things that pertain to the group's conversation, and of reading the facial and conversational cues he got in response. I'm encouraged that it worked for her kid, and that we can help our boy in specific ways.

 

I'm also excited about a couple of 100-lesson type books I found on Amazon last night (like the one upthread), and I do see him trying out his skills when we've talked about specific courses of action. He's very good at introducing himself and asking if kids want to play. He often does end up with playground friends and he's flexible about what/how they play although he's just as happy to take over and assign everyone a character from the inside of his richly populated head.

 

I do hear the "is he aspie" thing. It stings a little, but it seems just about everyone is "on the spectrum" these days. I think if he is on it, he is on the part that can go a long way with a few self-regulating tricks & lessons. If my husband was, he's matured beyond it- in the learned "emotional maturity" sense of that, not to be condescending at all to those who are adults with these syndromes. My son's just a very exuberant person right now. I love that, and to be frank I just want everybody else to love it, too. It's something I can be self conscious about in myself (debi21, identifying with your kid definitely resonates with me!) and I'm sure I lean toward over-thinking his every interaction.

 

Thanks so much for all these thoughts and comments. I really enjoy the perspective of other parents and always get such good food for thought from these forums.

[violamama]

Okay, I just had to update.

 

Today he had a great day. He had a completely polite and patient and NORMALLY paced conversation about his current passion (gems and minerals) with a kid who was at our house for a violin lesson. He even "got it" when the kid had to get her shoes on to head out the door and said, "Maybe we can chat again when you have more time. See you next week!"

 

He also had his new (well, we're about two weeks into it now) very challenging 60 minute swim team coaching today. This coach is AMAZING. He works 99% on focus with these boys and they somehow also learn a bunch of stuff about swimming. Fantastic, and hard work for my boy in the best way. He has to give his absolute all each day (MWF) and he adores the coach. I'm so happy we've gotten him into this group, and I hope he hangs in there. There have been days where he had to sit on the side, or walk around the perimeter of the pool. Today he did well.

 

It's like he knew I posted on here and decided to show me some development he's been brewing up... Yay!

 

Don't these little glimpses sustain you as a parent sometimes? Anyway, thanks again.

[Hwin]

We just keep practicing, but I agree that I feel like I am always stepping in and redirecting. But I have a kid on the spectrum, so I KNOW he isn't going to learn it intuitively :)

 

I didnt look back through to find the thread but i had these three in my amazon browsing history that looked up when I read the thread...

 

http://www.amazon.co...2/ref=pd_ybh_24

 

 

http://www.amazon.co...0/ref=pd_ybh_25

 

http://www.amazon.co...58/ref=pd_ybh_1

 

The second one listed here - the Social Skills Picture Book - I own and it was not terribly useful to me since all of the scenarios take place in a classroom, FYI.

[Ellie]

Children do not come out of the womb knowing how to behave. They all need to be instructed by their parents or other concerned adults on how to behave properly. Some children learn more quickly than others.

 

And it isn't only about picking up social cues; sometimes children have to be instructed pointedly in things like not engaging the waitress in conversations ("Orkie dear, when someone is working, you need to allow her to do her job. You should smile at her and tell her thank you, but that's it.")

[fairfarmhand]

I might also point out that Mom and Dad get tired of listening too. Like if I am reading my Bible or working the cows, I will pointedly say, "Son, this is not a good time. We need to talk about this later."

 

Also, I point out that some people get tired of hearing about the same topic ad nauseum. I will tell him to find another thing to talk about.

[violamama]

We have definitely had conversations about people who are working or mom & dad being busy. This is a kid who will chatter along to himself in his room given the right mood, so helping him know where to direct all that is a big deal for us.

 

I've been thinking about telling him to draw and write down some of his thoughts. I'm pretty sure that when he is just a bit better at writing, that will be a good outlet for the things he wants to obsess about.

[MFA323]

I certainly worry about social skills. I was homeschooled. It took me most of college to figure out how to function normally in a social environment. I do well in groups now, but I still have to be intentional about forming and maintaining friendships. It's not something that I learned to do naturally as a child. My mom thought that I was fine because I had sisters to spend time with and a few extra-curriculars, but it would have been helpful to spend more time with other kids my age.

You have to admit that an unusually large percentage of the kids at a homeschool group's get-togethers are awkward socially. They tend either not to know how to talk to people outside of their families at all or not to stop talking even when other people are clearly bored or trying to end the conversation.

[I.Dup.]

I agree with the others. School won't help on this at all. It's our job to teach them these things, and yes, these types of issues do concern me as a parent!

 

I don't think there is anything wrong with simply telling them to "be quiet." It really is pretty selfish to be talking ALL the time. Of course they're not doing it out of a selfish standpoint, but to expect people to stop and listen to every random thought we have is selfish in the long run. We waited at the vet for about 45 minutes the other day because the vet just would not shut up when talking to the people in the room next to us. He was talking about everything from pop music to social welfare, he was just going on, and on, and on. Nobody likes being around an adult like that. If my children are chatting too much and I'm tired of listening I will just say "okay, go play" or "okay, it's time to be quiet now." I also model situations like the above. Just keep at it! :)

[violamama]

You have to admit that an unusually large percentage of the kids at a homeschool group's get-togethers are awkward socially. They tend either not to know how to talk to people outside of their families at all or not to stop talking even when other people are clearly bored or trying to end the conversation.

 

 

I don't know. We're in an area where there are lots of hs activities at the science museum, aviation museum, libraries, camps, etc... and we also have a community we attend with about 60 other kids weekly. In our grand total of a little over two years hs'ing, we've met and played with well over 100 families.

 

Those kids (for the most part) are actually a little more advanced for their age to my eye than the average kid I teach in my music school. I think it's like others have mentioned- having a parent who makes this a priority and calls out poor behavior while modeling and maybe even directly teaching social skills can give them an advantage.

 

In the other part of your post (I cannot for the life of me figure out this multiquote stuff) you mentioned it was not necessarily something your mom thought needed to be focused on or taught. My husband had that experience also, but was not hs'ed. You can see the difference (in parenting- not necessarily style of schooling) even today in the way he and his sister interact. To be honest, they can be really immature and rude to one another. They have both said they wish their parents had taught them (required them) to do better in that regard.

[DianeW88]

I certainly worry about social skills. I was homeschooled. It took me most of college to figure out how to function normally in a social environment. I do well in groups now, but I still have to be intentional about forming and maintaining friendships. It's not something that I learned to do naturally as a child. My mom thought that I was fine because I had sisters to spend time with and a few extra-curriculars, but it would have been helpful to spend more time with other kids my age.

You have to admit that an unusually large percentage of the kids at a homeschool group's get-togethers are awkward socially. They tend either not to know how to talk to people outside of their families at all or not to stop talking even when other people are clearly bored or trying to end the conversation.

 

This is why my kids never socialized with other homeschoolers. Too much awkwardness and too many kids with a complete inability to read any social cues at all. For my very naturally socially intuitive children it was miserable. My kids simply made friends on their own...and none of them were fellow homeschoolers.

[Soror]

I certainly worry about social skills. I was homeschooled. It took me most of college to figure out how to function normally in a social environment. I do well in groups now, but I still have to be intentional about forming and maintaining friendships. It's not something that I learned to do naturally as a child. My mom thought that I was fine because I had sisters to spend time with and a few extra-curriculars, but it would have been helpful to spend more time with other kids my age.

You have to admit that an unusually large percentage of the kids at a homeschool group's get-togethers are awkward socially. They tend either not to know how to talk to people outside of their families at all or not to stop talking even when other people are clearly bored or trying to end the conversation.

 

No, I haven't noticed that at all. I cannot think of anyone offhand that is that way to be honest. I can think of one boy offhand that is somewhat shy but not excessively so and less so than my ps'd cousin who is in everything.

[LifeLovePassion]

This one looks like his speed, too:

http://www.amazon.co...ref=pd_sim_b_41

 

If you order this, please report back what you think of it. social situations are hard for dd1 as well.

[Aspasia]

He sounds kinda like me. :huh:

 

I've only really realized it as an adult, and this is something I'm constantly working on, but I was and always will be really, really chatty. Unfortunately, my mom is the same way--even worse--so she was not exactly a great model or teacher. My behavior obviously didn't stand out to her, but as I've gotten older and been out of her home longer and longer, I've learned that I do talk too much. And when I watch my mom with other people, I see those cues that she's missing. It makes me feel bad. I've learned to sort of see when someone isn't really interested in what I'm saying, but I doubt I catch that even half the time. I'm certain that I'm one of those "talk you to death" people that pp mentioned.

 

Having said all that, I went to public school but I wasn't ostracized or made fun of. On the contrary, I was fairly popular--student government, sports, etc. I'm sure a lot of people thought I was annoying (because I was/am), but it really didn't hurt me socially. I do wish I had had a mom like op who could see the unusual nature of my tendencies and help me become just a little more aware of myself and others.

 

So basically, I think it's a valid concern, but I don't think it is a huge problem.

[violamama]

I do wish I had had a mom like op who could see the unusual nature of my tendencies and help me become just a little more aware of myself and others.

 

So basically, I think it's a valid concern, but I don't think it is a huge problem.

 

 

AW! I love chatty. I truly love to know what people think (even if it's dissonant) as I am a bit gabby myself. It makes me most comfortable when I can chat freely with some one who holds their own. As much as I would love to take credit for being attentive though, my husband strongly wants more for his very-similar son than he had in his upbringing in this one area.

 

It's true I need to keep perspective; it's not a huge problem. Sometimes it's great that he is so friendly and open- he makes a lot of people smile with his enthusiasm and questions.

 

Today my college student told me all the choir girls were smitten with him because at their concert on Sunday he was complimenting all their jewelry and asking what mineral was in their rings or necklaces. I need to remember it's not always annoying, especially when people aren't hearing it as long or often...

[Katy]

Seven is maybe a little young, but when you think he can read it I'd assign How to Win Friends and Influence People. It makes it pretty obvious to the clueless that the world does not revolve around them, without being harsh or rude. It's a non-confrontational way to make a kid more considerate, and to lead to discussions about what consideration means, and how social niceties lead to friendships.

[Aspasia]

Yeah, it isn't always all bad. My mom can be totally inappropriately chatty, but she also has an incredible way of getting people to open up to her. She's the lab lady at an ob/gyn office, and she tells me stories about her patients sometimes--how on earth does she get people to share stuff like that in the few minutes they spend with her??? And even though some people might think she's a weirdo, everyone thinks she's the sweetest lady ever. And she is! Chatty isn't just chatty--it can also mean friendly. I think we should be careful not to confuse eccentric with socially awkward. One is a problem, the other is an individual difference.

 

But it doesn't hurt for some of us to be trained in paying attention to other people. :)

[Katy]

Here's something that might be more age-appropriate: http://www.amazon.com/Diary-Social-Detective-Real-Life-Interpersonal/dp/1934575712/ref=pd_bxgy_b_text_y

[Laura Corin]

We had to give Hobbes explicit instructions. In his case his problem was just talking on and on.

 

We taught him that if someone says 'Uh-huh' or similar three times in a row, it's time to be quiet or ask a question to get the other person talking. He now doesn't remember being taught the rule, but he's a much better conversationalist.

 

Laura

[Greenmama2]

We had to give Hobbes explicit instructions. In his case it was just going on and on. I have an elder brother who does this still, and it causes him social problems, so I am very aware of the issue.

 

We taught him that if someone says 'Uh-huh' or similar three times in a row, it's time to be quiet or ask a question to get the other person talking. He now doesn't remember being taught the rule, but he's a much better conversationalist.

 

Laura

 

How old was he when you taught him this rule? My three, turning four year old is the overly chatty one in our family. I'm thinking he might be a little young yet.

[Laura Corin]

How old was he when you taught him this rule? My three, turning four year old is the overly chatty one in our family. I'm thinking he might be a little young yet.

 

 

He was about eight. I think you are right that four is a bit young.

 

Laura

[violamama]

Here's something that might be more age-appropriate: http://www.amazon.co...d_bxgy_b_text_y

Yeah, that does look interesting. I saw that on Amazon when I was buying the other two. It would probably be a good read-aloud, and I found it at a library nearby and need to go pick it up.

[violamama]

If you order this, please report back what you think of it. social situations are hard for dd1 as well.

 

Will do. I ordered these:

 

Raise Your Child's Social IQ: Stepping Stones to People Skills for Kids

Cohen, Cathi

Social Rules for Kids-The Top 100 Social Rules Kids Need to Succeed

Susan Diamond M.A.

 

I think I'll pick this one up at the library today to read aloud:

 

Diary of a social detective : real-life tales of mystery, intrigue and interpersonal adventure

by Jessum, Jeffrey E.

 

I'll report back when we get them and try them all out.

[violamama]

I thought I'd give you guys my initial impressions of these books I ordered.

 

This one is my favorite so far for its open-and-go nature:

Social Rules for Kids-The Top 100 Social Rules Kids Need to Succeed

Susan Diamond M.A.

This is a really handy little book, perfect to add to my daily work pile for my boy. It's a slim book with a brief, no-frills lesson topic laid out on each page. We use the topics to discuss- it doesn't have any cutesy stories or any of that. It's more of a talking point per day, and so far I've been soliciting answers and comments from him or bringing up specific times we might need a particular skill. I also bring in a lot of examples of how to "read" people, because he has been weak in that in the past. I see improvement: it could be his age, his current experiences, this book, the barometric pressure- but I like to think this book is helping.

 

 

This one is not really doing it for me:

Raise Your Child's Social IQ: Stepping Stones to People Skills for Kids

Cohen, Cathi

It's just way wayyyy overkill and it doesn't fit my personality. It's more of a detailed self-help book for parents, the size & heft of a novel. I can imagine that as the boys get older I might take a peek at it to see if there are some tools we should use. It has lots of anecdotes and gives very specific goals, skills and detailed model dialogues. It is too psycho-babbley for me. Full disclosure: we are coming out of a ton of adoption training and my cheesy model dialogue tanks may just be too full.

It recommends setting (like, on paper) very specific goals and checking in with diagnostic reflection & even quizzes. Every chapter lays out steps for the parent to work though. I have a feeling parents with kids on the spectrum or with other stronger challenges might like this methodical approach. For us, it is just too intensely clinical.

 

I forgot to pick up the Social Detective book at the library and missed my window, but might still grab that one when I get a chance.

[Shellydon]

A speech-language pathologist can work on social skills in a group or individually. Children with social language problems may have something called Pragmatic Language Disorder. ****

So what is pragmatic language impairment and how exactly does it impact the child’s social and academic language abilities?

In 1983, Rapin and Allen proposed a classification of children with developmental language disorders. As part of this classification they described a syndrome of language impairment which they termed ‘semantic–pragmatic deficit syndrome’. Children with this disorder were described as being overly verbose, having poor turn–taking skills, poor discourse and narrative skills as well as having difficulty with topic initiation, maintenance and termination. Over the years the diagnostic label for this disorder has changed several times, until it received its current name “pragmatic language impairment†(Bishop, 2000).

Pragmatic language ability involves the ability to appropriately use language (e.g., persuade, request, inform, reject), change language (e.g., talk differently to different audiences, provide background information to unfamiliar listeners, speak differently in different settings, etc) as well as follow conversational rules (e.g., take turns, introduce topics, rephrase sentences, maintain appropriate physical distance during conversational exchanges, use facial expressions and eye contact, etc) all of which culminate into the child’s general ability to appropriately interact with others in a variety of settings.

For most typically developing children, the above comes naturally. However, for children with pragmatic language impairment appropriate social interactions are not easy. Children with pragmatic language impairment often misinterpret social cues, make inappropriate or off-topic comments during conversations, tell stories in a disorganized way, have trouble socially interacting with peers, have difficulty making and keeping friends, have difficulty understanding why they are being rejected by peers, and are at increased risk for bullying.****

[violamama]

Sheldon, interesting post. The only part here that correlates to my son would be perhaps misinterpreting or missing some social cues (like the 3 uh-huhs in a row rule a PP mentioned). He is a bit overly verbose, but that runs in our family and works out all right as long as he knows when to put on the brakes.

 

His vocab, recall, organization of thought, nuanced understanding & ability to restate are all several years advanced (not tested, just IMHO).

 

I find it kind of odd that the quote above and the wiki on Pragmatic Language Impairment don't give any developmental age guidelines. Your average 3 year old, for example, is a non-sequitur machine. This indicates they are normal, but a 10 year old with the same impulsive conversational style may have issues.

[misty.warden]

I was like that as a kid and went to PS the whole time. Sometimes I feel like I still have to check in with my friends and colleagues with something like "are you still interested in this discussion? I feel like I waylayed you a bit and am dominating the conversation." Some people are just not as intuitive with things like gauging the other person's interest or socially appropriate times for conversation. The assumption seems to be that PS will give kids like that the opportunity to learn those things, even if it's implied rather than directly taught. Anecdotal evidence of mine: Not even remotely true.

[violamama]

I was like that as a kid and went to PS the whole time. Sometimes I feel like I still have to check in with my friends and colleagues with something like "are you still interested in this discussion? I feel like I waylayed you a bit and am dominating the conversation." Some people are just not as intuitive with things like gauging the other person's interest or socially appropriate times for conversation. The assumption seems to be that PS will give kids like that the opportunity to learn those things, even if it's implied rather than directly taught. Anecdotal evidence of mine: Not even remotely true.

 

 

Appreciate your insight, Misty. I don't know if it's that I think PS would do a better job, it's more about the lion's share of responsibility of helping my boys navigate life as a kid falling to me. My husband would agree with you that assuming PS does well with this task is wrong. We just want to do whatever we can to get him on the paths that mature him.

[She Reads a Lot]

I wanted to thank you, OP, for starting this thread. I've got a nine year old who has a lot in common with your son. Hubby and I have been getting concerned about how he relates to other kids b/c it is becoming problematic with certain less nice kiddos, who have no tolerance for him. I guess it is a big DUH for me that I never thought to look on Amazon for books that could help us with this, but I just spent an hour researching (based on the links above) and I ordered several books that I think will really help us help him.

 

Yippee and thanks for posting this!

Christina

[violamama]

I wanted to thank you, OP, for starting this thread. I've got a nine year old who has a lot in common with your son. Hubby and I have been getting concerned about how he relates to other kids b/c it is becoming problematic with certain less nice kiddos, who have no tolerance for him. I guess it is a big DUH for me that I never thought to look on Amazon for books that could help us with this, but I just spent an hour researching (based on the links above) and I ordered several books that I think will really help us help him.

 

Yippee and thanks for posting this!

Christina

 

Let me know which ones you like once you get them! I love to collect potential resources. WTM boards are like a candy store for me.

[celticmom]

I wanted to thank you, OP, for starting this thread. I've got a nine year old who has a lot in common with your son. Hubby and I have been getting concerned about how he relates to other kids b/c it is becoming problematic with certain less nice kiddos, who have no tolerance for him. I guess it is a big DUH for me that I never thought to look on Amazon for books that could help us with this, but I just spent an hour researching (based on the links above) and I ordered several books that I think will really help us help him.

 

Yippee and thanks for posting this!

Christina

 

:iagree: Only my dd is 8 and we have not had too many problems yet. Some of the social skills books might be helpful for me also. I strongly suspect that I am an aspie.

[Lisa R.]

I certainly worry about social skills. I was homeschooled. It took me most of college to figure out how to function normally in a social environment. I do well in groups now, but I still have to be intentional about forming and maintaining friendships. It's not something that I learned to do naturally as a child. My mom thought that I was fine because I had sisters to spend time with and a few extra-curriculars, but it would have been helpful to spend more time with other kids my age.

You have to admit that an unusually large percentage of the kids at a homeschool group's get-togethers are awkward socially. They tend either not to know how to talk to people outside of their families at all or not to stop talking even when other people are clearly bored or trying to end the conversation.

 

Thanks for your honesty here. I do think many homeschoolers will be sharing similar sentiments when they grow up.

 

I think it is important to note that those with socially awkward kids often don't recognize it. "My kids socialize with their siblings and adults all the time. They do better than most kids their age." Hmmm. Others might not share that opinion. This is an area where it is important to try and have objectivity to determine if the child is getting enough social interaction and enough social coaching.

[misty.warden]

Thanks for your honesty here. I do think many homeschoolers will be sharing similar sentiments when they grow up.

 

I think it is important to note that those with socially awkward kids often don't recognize it. "My kids socialize with their siblings and adults all the time. They do better than most kids their age." Hmmm. Others might not share that opinion. This is an area where it is important to try and have objectivity to determine if the child is getting enough social interaction and enough social coaching.

 

 

Bolded for emphasis. I think part of this has to do with what one considers "socializing well". There are many social behaviors that thrive in popular culture that I do not want my kids socialized to, not all of them can be objective because not everyone shares my opinion about the particulars. It's also difficult to deal with the fact that sometimes our actions as parents don't have the intended effect, some poorly coached kids thrive while others afforded every opportunity do not. How much influence other people have on any one person's life and choices is a very subjective thing.

[LifeLovePassion]

Just curious your thoughts on the books you ordered. We are at an impass and have to make a decision regarding a social skills class dd has been a part of. I am wondering if I can address the issues at home.