Crissy Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I had a roommate in college whose parents were Auschwitz survivors. The would try to hide their tattoos, but sometimes they would peak out from their sleeves. I hope we all remember. My sister worked with a woman who was and Auschwitz survivor. She never tried to hide her tattoo. My sister was glad for that. Her friend was always willing to discuss her experiences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enviromommy Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 :iagree: As others have said, usually the younger generation (further removed) are less aware of the details of WWII. Likewise, I have seen my generation and older generation in my family be less aware of history within the last two decades. (I am 41yo). The genocide of Rwanda, for example, is unknown to them...among other historical events. I agree. I think that people are less and less informed about current events because of the ubiquity of entertainment. Who has time to know what is going on in the world when there are hundreds of TV channels, Internet games, iPods, and Facebook? I think this is an enormous, dangerous problem. Politics and current affairs used to BE people's entertainment. There wasn't so much competition for people's attention. Of course, I guess I'm guilty of this too - here I am posting on a message board instead of reading something "serious". :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justamouse Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 My dd made a comment to me the other day--when she was in Germany with the Bach Festival, she noticed that several of the musicians she came in contact with were Holocaust deniers. That really surprised her. It came up in conversation several times. They were having a discussion and she mentioned that she wished she had a bit more time to travel--that she would have liked to visit some WWII sites. One fellow commented that nothing had happened at Dachau... It was weird. For the life of me I cannot wrap my head around that. It's like telling me the sky is orange. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*~Tina~* Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 To the OP - it's okay that you didn't know. Now is a great time to learn about it and to make sure that your children know as well. When we were doing Core Knowledge in the elementary years' date=' I learned so much I had never heard before.[/quote'] The joy of homeschooling is that you can learn ahead or with your children. :iagree: I think this is why it's important to know how to learn - we can fill in our own educational gaps as we become aware of them. As an adult I have an interest and ability to learn and understand things that would have been wasted on my younger years and I never learned about the holocaust in school.:001_huh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parrothead Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 For the life of me I cannot wrap my head around that. It's like telling me the sky is orange. It happens. Often. I know it is Wiki, but it is an interesting article. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tntgoodwin Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I am 26 and would say it is common knowledge among my peers and those younger. As it should be. But then, I watched Schindler's List at school in 6th grade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrogMom5 Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Yes, it is common knowledge. If it's not anymore, it should be. My kids learn about it. Denise Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyline Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I'm part of the 'younger generation' and I would defently say it is common knowledge amongst my friends. Then again I read I Have Lived A Thousand Years when I was twelve so perhaps I'm not the most accurate representation of my generation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twoxcell Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Yes I most definitely think it should be common knowledge, but I would not be surprised if it wasn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*~Tina~* Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 This link has a lot of information... http://history1900s.about.com/od/holocaust/tp/holocaust.htm I am glad you posed the question it led me to learn a bit more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justamouse Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 It happens. Often. I know it is Wiki, but it is an interesting article. Am I getting this right? That their motivation to deny the Holocaust gives the green light to Antisemitism and racism? I mean, what is the motivation? Cognitive dissonance-they has it. Amazing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonshineLearner Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Knowing about "camps and such in general" is not good enough. Knowing that "it's a terrible thing that happened" is not enough. Knowledge loses its power if it is not specific and detailed. Personally, I find it shocking that anyone doesn't know the name Auschwitz. As a Jew, I experienced the original post as a punch in the gut. As an American and an inhabitant of the world, I find it inconceivable and depressing that anyone 42 years old could have managed not to come across it in books, newspapers, movies, etc. I apologize in advance to the OP; I do not mean to criticize you personally. I think that my quick response was because I felt bad for the original OP. I do know many of the horrible things that happened; as a Gentile, I am proud that many who weren't Jewish took risk of death to save Jews. I hope that this is sometimes remembered. While nannying for a Jewish family, I found the book The Sunflower by Simon Wiesenthal. It's a wonderful book, and just one of the books I've read that really makes one think. I think it's natural, but not good, that people in general want to not think about the mass killings among other atrocities that happened during that time. As bad and horrible as trying to wipe out the entire Jewish population, as I said, I wish that we would learn from that and stand up for all life. Look at the mass killings in Africa; it's beyond horrible to even start to think about, and yet I wish that we could somehow help. :( I'm not sure how specific you need to be informed about killings in concentration camps, and all of the other horrific things that happened, to be appalled. I do know that you need to know some. :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justasque Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 (edited) OP some of the information about the camps can be quite disturbing. Please go at your own pace in learning more. A good book on a related topic is Three Came Home, a story of a woman, Agnes Keith, and her small child in a WWII Japanese civilian internment camp. (Her husband is in another Japanese camp; they had been living in Borneo when the war broke out.) It was made into a movie starring Claudette Colbert. It gives a realistic sense of life as a WWII prisoner, without the horrors of the Nazi camps. I would also consider carefully what your son is ready for and what should wait until he is older. Start gently with books like Snow Treasure (historical fiction adventure story, no camps just mean Nazis; see the Amazon review here) and work up from there. OP, there were many camps. Auschwitz is probably the most widely known. Other well-known camps include Treblinka, Dachau, Buchenwald, and Bergen-Belsen. Prisoners included Jews, but also Gypsies/Roma, homosexuals, Jehovah's Witnesses, Catholic priests, and so on. There are some very disturbing movies documenting the liberation of at least one camp. I've also seen a number of relevant museum exhibits and memorials. One of my college classes included a movie about the camps. The instructor was very careful to say that we were not obligated to attend class that day, and if we did choose to, we could leave at any time. It was some pretty serious stuff. Edited July 17, 2011 by askPauline Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chepyl Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I learned about this in elementary and middle school, and more in depth in high school. We read the play I Never Saw Another Butterfly, we talked about doing the show in drama class. It is an amazing drama, I am sure YouTube has videos of the play. We also studied The Diary of Anne Frank, read the play, and watched. My Grandfather helped to liberate the concentration camps, he does not talk about it much, but he owns every book and movie every made/published about WWII. We knew from a young age what concentration camps were. We went to the opening of the museum for his division in TX about 10 years ago. There were pictures of some of the people they rescued, it was incredibly moving. It is the 12th Armored Division Museum in Abilene, TX. I am 32, and I do assume this is common knowledge. And it should be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jewellsmommy Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 DH and I both agreed that we would consider it to be common knowledge. I don't know that I would automatically recognize the names of other camps though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElizabethB Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 DH and I both agreed that we would consider it to be common knowledge. I don't know that I would automatically recognize the names of other camps though. Most people would not. There were a large number of camps, I didn't realize how many until I saw a map of them at Dachau, I only recognized the names of a few. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FO4UR Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Yes. It should be. I went to college with people who didn't know Hiroshima or how to make verbs agree with the rest of the sentence on a regular basis. There are a lot of "gaps" left in most ps educations. Don't feel badly about not knowing, but self-educate now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ester Maria Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Yes, it should be one of those instantly recognizable names - also because it tends to be used in a pars pro toto way to symbolize all of holocaust. The instant recognition of the name / concept is right there with the instant recognition of Hiroshima, for example. I would expect an average teen to have come across it, let alone an average adult. I would not expect a deep familiarity with holocaust, but recognizing a few of the major camps names, having heard of Kristallnacht or Final Solution, etc. is definitely a general knowledge about the topic in my view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBarnes Posted July 17, 2011 Author Share Posted July 17, 2011 Wow, OP, bet you're sorry you asked. No, I'm not sorry I asked. I'm clearly in the minority here and that's okay. I learned something. Knowing about "camps and such in general" is not good enough. Knowing that "it's a terrible thing that happened" is not enough. Knowledge loses its power if it is not specific and detailed. Personally, I find it shocking that anyone doesn't know the name Auschwitz. As a Jew, I experienced the original post as a punch in the gut. As an American and an inhabitant of the world, I find it inconceivable and depressing that anyone 42 years old could have managed not to come across it in books, newspapers, movies, etc. I apologize in advance to the OP; I do not mean to criticize you personally. I'm very sorry that you feel like that was a punch in the gut. I am very aware of the Holocaust and the camps in general. The fact that I don't remember the name is not for lack of caring. Names and dates don't stick with me. When my family and friends are talking about famous movie people and such I'm lost until one of them describes to me what the person looks like. That's just how my mind works. So really I'm not surprised to find myself the odd woman out here. It's not the first time and I'm sure it won't be the last. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carpe Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 It is and should remain common knowledge. If you're ever in Poland, there are tours of Auschwitz. There's a shuttle from Kracow. Go on an empty stomach and take the guided tour. I think the punishment for neo-nazis and holocaust deniers should be the guided tour at Aushwitz with the tour guide whose grandparents were imprisoned there, followed by a trip to the Memorial to the Murdered Jews of Europe in Berlin. In the exhibit under the statues there is a room where a voice reads the names of victims of the holocaust. I think that room alone could cure someone of their ignorance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBarnes Posted July 17, 2011 Author Share Posted July 17, 2011 I think that my quick response was because I felt bad for the original OP. I do know many of the horrible things that happened; as a Gentile, I am proud that many who weren't Jewish took risk of death to save Jews. I hope that this is sometimes remembered. There's no reason to feel bad for me. :confused: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paintedlady Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I have hard time imagining how anyone could get out of middle school without knowing this. Boggles the mind actually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonshineLearner Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 There's no reason to feel bad for me. :confused: Just kinda felt you were getting slammed a bit. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amira Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I don't think it is common knowledge in most parts of the world. It is (or ought to be) in North and probably South America and Europe certainly, but people in those parts of the world often don't know anything about genocides in other parts of the world. Auschwitz, however, is the only camp name I would expect people to know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 :iagree: Who was the general that wanted the photos and documentation so that the world would never forget? Even with the photos and documentation seems people are already forgetting. I can't fathom how that is happening. I think it was Eisenhower. sorta related, I dont' remember being taught about the bataan death march, and certainly not about the h3ll ships. those atrocities towards american servicemen and philipino soldiers were right up there with the atrocities by the nazi's. I learned about them because my fil was one of the very FEW who survived to be repatriated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean in Newcastle Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 There's no reason to feel bad for me. :confused: I agree. I remember a time when I shared at a dinner party an interesting science fact that I had just learned. Turned out it was common knowledge and everyone just nodded at my insight because they had all already known it. OK - I might have gotten the common knowledge a bit later than everyone else, but I did get it in the end! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 ItIf you're ever in Poland, there are tours of Auschwitz. There's a shuttle from Kracow. Go on an empty stomach and take the guided tour. I think the punishment for neo-nazis and holocaust deniers should be the guided tour at Aushwitz with the tour guide whose grandparents were imprisoned there, followed by a trip to the Memorial to the Murdered Jews of Europe in Berlin. In the exhibit under the statues there is a room where a voice reads the names of victims of the holocaust. I think that room alone could cure someone of their ignorance. I hate to tell you this, but they will still deny it. It isn't about ignorace, it's about agenda. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonshineLearner Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I agree. I remember a time when I shared at a dinner party an interesting science fact that I had just learned. Turned out it was common knowledge and everyone just nodded at my insight because they had all already known it. OK - I might have gotten the common knowledge a bit later than everyone else, but I did get it in the end! Which is why I felt bad; everyone has holes that someone else can point out as "uneducated". I just wanted her to not feel like just because of this one, that she was any different than say... me :) I thought that some comments were a bit strong. And, as she said... she did know about the camps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonshineLearner Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I hate to tell you this, but they will still deny it. It isn't about ignorance, it's about agenda. Yup. This. It's not like at this point you can really ignore that it happened; but perhaps if they can go down saying that it didn't, then at some point... someone will believe them :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
specialmama Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 The documentary, Paper Clips, is really good too. Wow. Thank you for mentioning this Mrs. Mungo. I'm going to try to find that. We'll be watching The Boy in the Striped Pajamas soon, so this documentary will tie in nicely. I had never heard of it before. Thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 (edited) It gives a realistic sense of life as a WWII prisoner, without the horrors of the Nazi camps. ?huh? My husband's aunt was in one of those camps as a four year old girl. she saw her nanny brutally gunned down because she tried to sneak something to her through the fence. she watched as her mother had a cross cut into her back with a samurai sword and be thrown into a pit under the tropical sun for three days with no food or water because she cut the hair off the "pretty" girls so they wouldn't be used as comfort women. when she came out, she was covered with maggots. the japanese did vivisections on prisoners - they were just as brutal, it just isn't taught. Edited July 17, 2011 by gardenmom5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Yup. This. It's not like at this point you can really ignore that it happened; but perhaps if they can go down saying that it didn't, then at some point... someone will believe them :( well you know, if you repeat a lie often enough, it makes it true. /sarc that's why I homeschool - I can make sure my children are taught the truth. My husband's grandfather is armenian - turkey still denies what they did, and the rest of the world lets them get away with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trish Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Auschwitz and Treblinka, yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melissa in Australia Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 ?huh? My husband's aunt was in one of those camps as a four year old girl. she saw her nanny brutally gunned down because she tried to sneak something to her through the fence. she watched as her mother had a cross cut into her back with a samurai sword and be thrown into a pit under the tropical sun for three days with no food or water because she cut the hair off the "pretty" girls so they wouldn't be used as comfort women. when she came out, she was covered with maggots. the japanese did vivisections on prisoners - they were just as brutal, it just isn't taught. They are taught in Australia. I think most Australians know more about the Japanese prison of war camps, Burma Road, Changi etc. than they do about WWII in Europe. seeing as such a large amount of Aussie soldiers ended up in them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie Smith Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Just the word by itself? I'm not sure. I think people might know by hearing it but maybe they've never seen the word and cannot pronounce it. Then I wouldn't expect the person to know it just from looking at it. Does that make sense? Kelly I can know this word by sight, but I wouldn't have a clue how it's said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orthodox6 Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 well you know, if you repeat a lie often enough, it makes it true. /sarcthat's why I homeschool - I can make sure my children are taught the truth. My husband's grandfather is armenian - turkey still denies what they did, and the rest of the world lets them get away with it. Agreeing. Many people do not know about the Armenian genocide, just as many people do not realize that Stalin was responsible for an enormous number deaths. He was "the Soviet Hitler". In the absence of informed world news broadcasts, how many of us ever would know even the least information about mass killings in parts of Africa? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stripe Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 the rest of the world lets them get away with it. I think this is the saddest thing of all. There have also been multiple successful genocides since WWII (including Bosnia, Rwanda, and Darfur) and yet people act like there was only one and there has only been one. This is a grave misunderstanding of history. And others' complicity in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Word Nerd Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Yes, my assumption would be that it's common knowledge, as it comes up even in the popular culture--not just academic settings. But we all have gaps in our education and facts that we've missed, so I wouldn't fret over it. (I'm almost 40.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NanceXToo Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Absolutely. I can't imagine getting out of junior high/middle school without having heard about the holocaust. And even if you didn't hear about it in school, it comes up in conversation, on documentaries, occasionally in the paper or online (such as mentioning a holocaust survivor or some such), there are books about it, etc etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 It is and should remain common knowledge. If you're ever in Poland, there are tours of Auschwitz. There's a shuttle from Kracow. Go on an empty stomach and take the guided tour. I think the punishment for neo-nazis and holocaust deniers should be the guided tour at Aushwitz with the tour guide whose grandparents were imprisoned there The standard education for every school child growing up in East Germany included an 8th grade class trip to Buchenwald concentration camp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBarnes Posted July 17, 2011 Author Share Posted July 17, 2011 Just kinda felt you were getting slammed a bit. :D Thank you for considering my feelings. It's not fun to eat humble pie... nor is it fun to fall off high horses. I don't feel like I'm the only one here lacking knowledge, but that's a whole new thread. So I'll just go back to eating my pie.:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-rap Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Yes, I do. I've made sure my children are well-read on it. The Holocaust is a big emphasis of mine during world history studies, but it just comes up in a lot of my everyday conversations, too, because it has made such an impression on me in my lifetime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBarnes Posted July 17, 2011 Author Share Posted July 17, 2011 Absolutely. I can't imagine getting out of junior high/middle school without having heard about the holocaust. And even if you didn't hear about it in school, it comes up in conversation, on documentaries, occasionally in the paper or online (such as mentioning a holocaust survivor or some such), there are books about it, etc etc. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justasque Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 ?huh? . Absolutely right. My apologies. I know better. (Note to self - don't post after midnight! Brain may not be engaged!)) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denise in Florida Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Personally, I know what it is, but cannot remember where I first heard the name, when or where I learned it. It's one of those things I just know, and in that situation, I tend to assume that it is common knowledge. That said, we all have gaps in our education, things that we "should" know that we just never came across. I never studied world history in school, and only became familiar with the full scope of European history (not only the World Wars) in college because I was a romance language major. The rest of world history? Thanks SOTW ;). Another beauty of homeschooling: filling in the gaps in our own education while learning alongside our dc! :iagree::iagree::iagree: times 100. I had good grades and graduated from college (snirk) and thought I was educated. HA. The things you didn't know you didn't know. :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wendi Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I suggest reading Night, by Elie Wiesel, but not with your kids. Great book. It was actually assigned to me in high school. I may have ds read it when he's a senior. Wendi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsquirrel Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I haven't read the entire thread, but I wouldn't be concerned if you didn't know to what what the specific word "Auschwitz" referred. I do know, but I live in an region with a large Jewish population and count the children and grandchildren of survivors among my friends. I can see how, if one lived in a different region, one might miss out on a specific fact. I would be concerned if you had not heard of the Holocaust at all. If that had not been a part of your education, then there is a problem. I am not saying this to 'slam' you but to state a truth. If you are using SOTW 4 for history it does touch on the Holocaust but only briefly, due to it's nature. If you do feel the need to dig deeper into that subject I would like to pass on something a professor once said to me. She said, "Everyone is interested in how Jews died. There is a lot of interesting history in studying how Jews lived." So, don't forget to learn about Jews lived before and after the World Wars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Great book. It was actually assigned to me in high school. I may have ds read it when he's a senior. Wendi Oh, my kids will likely read it as seniors. It's just not for young kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pretty in Pink Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I guess I am kind of surprised that you (OP) didn't know what Auschwitz was, but don't beat yourself up. We *briefly* covered concentration camps somewhere between 5th and 8th grade, but that was just a very brief overview -- one section of one chapter in a history book. We never got past the American Civil War in high school history class. :001_huh: Our teacher's house burned down that semester, we finished out the year with a string of substitute teachers, completed no further reading or studying, and were all passed with A's. I am not kidding. 'Night' by Eli Weisel (sp?) is an excellent and fairly quick read on the topic for adults and mature teens. There is also an excellent series available for streaming on Netflix, I think it's a History channel series, that focuses heavily on the concentration camps if ever become that interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suzybluecheese Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 We never got past the American Civil War in high school history class. :001_huh: Our teacher's house burned down that semester, we finished out the year with a string of substitute teachers, completed no further reading or studying, and were all passed with A's. I am not kidding. I'm sure this doesn't surprise anyone here, but I learned most of my world history from high school lit. classes and college art history courses. I learned the most about the Holocaust when we read Anne Frank. cat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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