Can homeschoolers be "B" students?

[coffeefreak]

When we started homeschooling, one of the "beauties of homeschooling" was, that all homeschoolers are straight "A" Students. The thought process was, if a child doesn't "get" something, you don't move on. You stick with it and eventually, they WILL get it, and everyone will be happy, and they'll thank you for sticking with them and dedicate their lives to you and buy you flowers on your birthday and a new house when they discover the cure for cancer because you worked at their pace and they never would have made it without you!:001_huh:

 

 

 

 

OK, maybe I got a little carried away up there. But, here's my thing. My dd has NEVER been great at math. It took her 3 years to figure out how to add and subtract. She has always been 1/2 year "Behind" her peers. But now, in 4th grade, with fractions and factoring and measuring etc, she STRUGGLES. The funny thing is, since I can grade her and give her tests to see where she's at, she's a solid B student. I'm starting to feel bad because we're being really hard on her. She'll miss things that we feel she should know, and she says, "But Mom, I only missed 4 on the whole test! Isn't that good?" Quite frankly, if I averaged her grades right now, she'd probably fall between 85-90. I'm wondering if I should ease up on her. It's not like you can really stop at this age YKWIM? I'm not going to spend weeks and weeks on factoring numbers, it doesn't seem reasonable.

 

So, here's the thing, do we allow her to be a "B" student? Do we say, as long as you get a B, we're happy? Is that OK? In the past, it's been her attitude, (telling me she gets it when she really doesn't, getting mad and giving up and crying - this was why she couldn't add until she was 8). However, more recently, she is just genuinely confused and she just. doesn't. get it. I feel like we've fixed the attitude problem. But, now that we've fixed the attitude, I am realizing she just isn't fabulous at math!:blush: I apologized to her today for getting mad (did I mention I got mad today :blushing:), and explained that this would be a crossroads for her dad and me, even if she was in public schools. The truth is, I wasn't great at math either! I never memorized my multiplication tables, barely hung in there in elementary school, and had tutors from 8th grade on. All of that and I was still a C/B student. I blamed public school and the, fact that they had to keep moving forward when I wasn't ready, but now, I'm not so sure. I guess I just always thought ANY kid could be a straight A student, as long as they had one on one tutoring. :lol:

 

 

AUGH!!!!!!! I hate it when my ideals are demolished and I have to eat crow!!!!!!:glare:

 

Dorinda

ps it's not the curriculum, we've tried them all:lol:

[Chris in VA]

I don't believe in sticking with something until mastery is achieved 100%. I move on after a reasonable amt of time, which varies, and then circle around to the item again. Sometimes a little more maturity is needed, or another approach. I believe the mind occasionally needs a rest to "get" some things, and can sort of silently process while something else is being learned. Then when you come back to the hard thing, the mind can handle it. (Weird, huh? lol) I also think sometimes another connection needs to be made, so moving in another direction can help that.

So, yes, a B or even less is possible in my world. But there are some things that do need to be nearly mastered before moving on--for example, multiplication facts can be almost mastered, then they can get used so much in long division and in fractions that the practice leads to mastery.

Does that even make sense? lol

[swellmomma]

If she is consistently between 85-90% you need to back off. As a child who always did well but was pretty much a solid B student it really hurt when my parents focused on the ones I got wrong rather than acknowledging the rest I got right. Definitely work on where she is making mistakes, and encourage her but don't push so much she gives up. I got to the point that if my parents were going to be that upset over a couple wrong on a test then why bother trying at all. I became my own worst enemy and started failing as a result. In our schools 85-90% is still considered an honor student (consistently making over 80% gets you labeled as such). I think with what you are saying, no you don't stop, you keep working through as long as it takes to learn it, but don't give her such a hard time over a couple wrong on a test or assignment.

[Firefly]

My DD is also a B student in Saxon Math, and I am totally okay with that. There is so much repetition in Saxon, even among different levels, that I know eventually it'll sink in. And even if it absolutely everything doesn't, it doesn't stress me out as long as she is mastering the major grade level concepts. HTH

[Lindy]

I can almost guarantee that my kids will not be mathematicians and I'm quite happy with a B average on tests. My girls are gifted in other areas and I don't want to spend all my time pushing math concepts when they thrive on fine-tuning their strengths.

 

Math is important, but not so important that I keep pushing and pushing the material until they perfectly master it. I believe they'll catch what they must know over time. I did. :001_smile:

[Snickerdoodle]

I listened to SWB's talk The Joy of Classical Education over the weekend and I'm glad I did. It was a nice way to remember the big picture when you are worried about the details.

[Jean in Newcastle]

I think it depends on if she gets the concept or not. With that many right, I would suspect that she does get it, though she might make a careless mistake or forget what she's doing now and then.

[mcconnellboys]

My older son got B's and C's from me in his algebra work. I did not give straight A's for high school level work. I gave him the grades he made and we moved on. The grades I gave him were consistent with grades he received from outside teachers and have remained consistent with the sorts of grades he makes in the private school he now attends.

[DarlaS]

Yes, because mastery does not translate to never making a mistake.

 

We all make mistakes, and cannot always have a second chance. Why teach that there is always another try when there isn't?

[rwjx2khsmj]

In a public school classroom, test scores are not the only thing reflected in a grade. Homework, classwork, participation, extra work and test scores all count toward a final grade. A child who is showing 80% mastery on tests (which is great by the way! Our children don't need to be perfect at something to understand the concept!) would probably have an A in a class if they were consistently completing homework and class assignments.

[Karen in CO]

I don't give grades until highschool. I do make my dd correct her math and check her answers, but that's all. In highschool, my ds was a B student in several things including math. He only gave a B effort, and he only got B's. There was no way I would have given him A's for some of the work he did. Some was wonderful, but some was truly bad. I graded his work and averaged it at the end of the year then put it on his transcript. He got what he earned.

 

But my younger kids do their work, make corrections, and I have no big dreams that it will be all roses and happiness and 100% understanding. We move along. I just don't grade it. They know when they do well or not.

[Orthodox6]

A homeschool student should receive whatever grade is fair for the work submitted. I would lose all credibility as a teacher were I to grade otherwise. My children would lose motivation to aim at improvement were they to receive A's which were not merited. The "A", in fact, would be meaningless and would lose its value as a goal and/or accomplishment.

 

The homeschool environment is the most pain-free and supportive place to learn about success and failure. I don't want to raise children who cannot survive knocks here-and-there in the outside world. By grading accurately, I also can remind my children that a mediocre or bad grade bears no relationship to their personal characters.

[myfunnybunch]

AUGH!!!!!!! I hate it when my ideals are demolished and I have to eat crow!!!!!!:glare:

 

LOL, you don't have to eat crow. Just change those ideals.

 

One of the other beauties of homeschooling is that you know your child and her learning habits, style, abilities so well that you don't really need grades to give an accurate picture of her progress. You don't have to worry about grades at all, really. Picture those A's and B's floating away into space where they belong. ;)

 

I don't grade during the elementary years, particularly in math. I just ask myself: Is my child ready to move on? Do they understand the material? Will continuing to teach to 100% mastery benefit or frustrate my kiddo? Do grades motivate my child, or not?

 

In many areas, an 85-90% success rate demonstrates enough understanding that the student is ready to move on. As a matter of fact, with my oldest, had I tried to teach her math to 90-100% mastery, I think she'd have curled up under the chair every time she saw the math book. LOL And she's brilliant at math, just not brilliant at accuracy.

 

We learn so much on this journey, don't we? Sometimes I think that we're sent these issues just to blow our ideals out of the water. ;)

 

Cat

[coffeefreak]

LOL, you don't have to eat crow. Just change those ideals.

 

One of the other beauties of homeschooling is that you know your child and her learning habits, style, abilities so well that you don't really need grades to give an accurate picture of her progress. You don't have to worry about grades at all, really. Picture those A's and B's floating away into space where they belong. ;)

 

Cat

 

:Angel_anim: Bye bye little grades. . .Bye Bye!

 

 

LOL! This is what I was afraid of. You guys have given me a lot to think about. Math has always been a struggle, partly because of the personalities in the house, and partly because of the concepts. DD really did/does hate it because it didn't come easily. EVERYTHING else came easily to her. We have had so many tears and temper tantrums over math. There were times I was going to put her in school just so I didn't have to fight with her anymore. We accommodated her every way we knew how, and things were better for a while. Then, this year, the work got "hard" again. She had mastered all the basics, and the end of the 3rd grade book, the concepts started ramping up. She started throwing temper tantrums, and we said NO! We told her she was too old to get angry and cry and throw a fit and it doesn't help anyway (trust me:lol:). So, we finished out the 3rd grade book (lots of review at the end) and started the 4th grade book after the 1st of the year. I skipped the first 30 lessons, because it was all review, and she was trucking along fine. And that's where we came to this problem.

 

You're right about backing off Brandy, I feel horrible that somewhere along the way we started expecting perfection (not just in math, in everything). I even told her I was writing this thread asking for help because I felt so bad about how Math was going, and that I felt like I was being too hard on her in school. :crying: I don't want her to think we're not proud of her, and I don't want her to hate me because I got angry during Math all the time. What a great homeschool memory!:glare:

 

As for grades, at this point I think I need to apologize and say, "I know you're doing your best, and as long as you do your best, that's all that matters." I do put grades in other subjects, but maybe I shouldn't. She got a B on a science test a while back, and I thought, "REALLY? THAT'S IT?! We totally studied for that test!" The PS here doesn't even give grades anymore! They give pluses, check marks and minuses. :001_huh: A friend of mine just put her ds in this year, and said she couldn't make heads or tales of his report card. But what do they have as their goals if you don't have grades? I mean, even dh is graded on his work! Sales people have goals they have to meet. What do you do if your dc don't have a benchmark?

 

:confused:

Dorinda

[coffeefreak]

A homeschool student should receive whatever grade is fair for the work submitted. I would lose all credibility as a teacher were I to grade otherwise. My children would lose motivation to aim at improvement were they to receive A's which were not merited. The "A", in fact, would be meaningless and would lose its value as a goal and/or accomplishment.

 

The homeschool environment is the most pain-free and supportive place to learn about success and failure. I don't want to raise children who cannot survive knocks here-and-there in the outside world. By grading accurately, I also can remind my children that a mediocre or bad grade bears no relationship to their personal characters.

 

This has been my thinking. But, I don't think I'm being very supportive, and I do think dd thinks it's a reflection of whether we are proud of her or not. The only thing bringing me comfort tonight is the fact that homeschooling had nothing to do with it. DH and I realized we would have been this way even if she had been in PS and would still have to somehow fix what we've done. We were such slackers in school, we were DETERMINED our children would not get away with it. Hence the grade issue.

 

Thanks for putting it into perspective.

Blessings!

Dorinda

[Jean in Newcastle]

Instead of expecting perfection, you can expect that they work hard. You can expect that they listen to you. You can expect that they eventually get the concepts.

 

But you also expect that they will make mistakes at times from tiredness, inattention, and spring fever. And that when they do, you will need to redirect them. You can expect that they might need to fix mistakes and if there are too many, that you might need to reteach a concept, sometimes from a different angle.

 

And you can expect that sometimes from tiredness, selfishness or PMS that some times you will yell again. And you'll apologize and will mend the relationship. You don't have to be perfect either. I'm still learning this one.

[myfunnybunch]

:Angel_anim: Bye bye little grades. . .Bye Bye!

 

LOL. That made me laugh.

 

What do you do if your dc don't have a benchmark?

 

:confused:

Dorinda

 

:) Knowing that your dd is able to complete her work within a reasonable amount of time with 85-90% accuracy is a great benchmark. The learning becomes the yardstick. You're still measuring progress, but you're no longer attaching a separate value, the grade.

 

And I like what Jean wrote too. I want to put a big thumbs up YES to all of it.

 

Cat

[coffeefreak]

Instead of expecting perfection, you can expect that they work hard. You can expect that they listen to you. You can expect that they eventually get the concepts.

 

But you also expect that they will make mistakes at times from tiredness, inattention, and spring fever. And that when they do, you will need to redirect them. You can expect that they might need to fix mistakes and if there are too many, that you might need to reteach a concept, sometimes from a different angle.

 

And you can expect that sometimes from tiredness, selfishness or PMS that some times you will yell again. And you'll apologize and will mend the relationship. You don't have to be perfect either. I'm still learning this one.

 

:grouphug:

Thanks Jean. That is perfect.

Dorinda

[Alenee]

I don't believe in sticking with something until mastery is achieved 100%. I move on after a reasonable amt of time, which varies, and then circle around to the item again. Sometimes a little more maturity is needed, or another approach. I believe the mind occasionally needs a rest to "get" some things, and can sort of silently process while something else is being learned. Then when you come back to the hard thing, the mind can handle it. (Weird, huh? lol) I also think sometimes another connection needs to be made, so moving in another direction can help that.

 

 

:iagree: and I've seen how breaks from math work in particular have helped my oldest. Maybe a break is what she needs. I also can't say I'd be terribly disappointed if I had a B student. Sounds to me like you're actually doing a wonderful job. :)

[Time4tea]

I don't do a lot of grading stuff. We move on even if things aren't perfect. We may review a bit if I see she isn't getting something.

Edited April 13, 2010 by Time4tea

[TravelingChris]

Definitely they can be B students. Both of my older kids had subjects that they were not as good in. I don't give out A's just because they are my kids. In fact, I have to remember to tell my middle that she ought to consider the grading schemes at the colleges she is looking at because she is pretty consistently a low A student and that is reflected on her yearly tests too. Now that doesn't matter for my school since I grade without pluses or minuses. SHe might look for that as one of her considerations.

 

Anyway, my high schoolers do get Bs if they deserve them. I probably would give a C but neither of the older two did work that deserved it and neither has the youngest yet who is only doing one class right now for high school.

[Rhonda in TX]

Yes, because mastery does not translate to never making a mistake.

 

We all make mistakes, and cannot always have a second chance. Why teach that there is always another try when there isn't?

 

I really don't get the idea that all homeschoolers will be A students. That just doesn't make any sense. We all have areas of strengths and weakness. Yes, there will be the students that make straight A's. And there will be plenty who don't.

 

When you're in college, or working, you won't get many do-overs. They want it done right the first time.

[Haiku]

I haven't read the replies, but my opinion is that people can't be excellent or perfect at everything. I see nothing wrong with being a B student in math. I don't think it's good for kids to feel pressured to get A's in everything. I was that child, and when I took physics my junior year in HS and got a C on the first test, I honestly did not know what to do. I panicked and dropped the class. I wish my parents would have given me the option of not being perfect in every class. (Btw, I transferred from physics to Rocks for Jocks [i was most decidedly not a jock] and LOVED the class ... it was certainly more interesting to me than physics, and my teacher was one of the best I ever had.)

 

Tara

[MomOfOneFunOne]

FWIW . . .

 

My daughter took some practice exams for the NLE (through her latin class). On ALL of them she got mediocre grades at best. As a result, it didn't occur to me that she'd do well on the actual exam. She did really well, though, and got a gold medal. So, holding a practice test and the real test in my hands I asked her why she did so well on the real one and not so well on the others. Her response: (pointing to the practice test) "B/c that one is boring" (pointing to the real NLE) "and that one is for a GOLD medal!"

 

perspective

[lovemyboys]

I don't believe in sticking with something until mastery is achieved 100%. I move on after a reasonable amt of time, which varies, and then circle around to the item again. Sometimes a little more maturity is needed, or another approach. I believe the mind occasionally needs a rest to "get" some things, and can sort of silently process while something else is being learned. Then when you come back to the hard thing, the mind can handle it. (Weird, huh? lol) I also think sometimes another connection needs to be made, so moving in another direction can help that.

So, yes, a B or even less is possible in my world. But there are some things that do need to be nearly mastered before moving on--for example, multiplication facts can be almost mastered, then they can get used so much in long division and in fractions that the practice leads to mastery.

Does that even make sense? lol

 

 

Good points. I've seen this with dc, sometimes they need a little space to get something. We've reached the saturation point so continuing on the same lesson or concept is pointless (like long division) but coming back to it and/or allowing some time for it to sink in while moving on to other lessons works well.

 

In general, we do work for mastery, but I like the way you say this -- 100% mastery.

 

And for OP, I'm happy if ds has a B in spelling. Some subjects just will not be an A for your student no matter how hard we might try or how hard we might work.

 

:001_smile:

[Mommyfaithe]

Yes, because mastery does not translate to never making a mistake.

 

We all make mistakes, and cannot always have a second chance. Why teach that there is always another try when there isn't?

 

:iagree: sometimes, it's a one shot deal. no re-dos

 

Sometimes a B is just great!

 

Faithe

[Night Elf]

So, here's the thing, do we allow her to be a "B" student?

 

"allow"? Oh my, my first thought is... Oh, the pressure! Eeek!

 

I've homeschooled for 9 years now. I've never had that impression of homeschooling. I don't homeschool to ensure my children get As. It's true that I like taking time with a subject to really get into it; but I have never put so much emphasis onto grades.

 

My children use an accredited high school program so a grade is a grade. I expect them to do their best, but not be perfect.

 

Besides, how do you account for the material not retained? What if you spend 4 weeks making sure a child gets an A on a test, only to find out that material wasn't totally retained on the next test? Do you back up and try again? Maybe I'm reading too much in your question? In my mind, I'm seeing my ds13 repeat preAlgebra over and over until he gets every question correct every time he does it. He's in Algebra now and is doing rather well, but he did not get every math question correct in his preAlgebra class. He hasn't gotten every math question correct in Algebra either. But his overall score is a low A at the end of the first semester. He's borderline though. :)

[Orthodox6]

:iagree:I think you are putting way too much pressure on your daughter. A "B" in math is fine. I do not expect all A's. I am okay with B's. There is no reason to be upset with her for a B, and no reason to pressure her over this. Let her know you are proud of her. Too much pressure can cause a child to give up. Oh, and I've never heard that homeschool students are "A" students.

 

 

Dh and I accept even a "C" in a course, so long as the child has done his/her best. As homeschooling is "one-on-one" teaching, I absolutely know whether or not he has exerted his best !

 

In my own framework, however, consistent marks of "D" or "F" point toward either an attitude problem, a learning disability, or both.

 

There are myriad different "gifts" sprinkled over the cradle by the fairies; no baby receives them all ! :)

[Tree House Academy]

I absolutely give the grade they make. When it comes to averaging grades for reporting, I do "weigh" them and take into account daily work and so forth. They do a LOT more work than just taking tests and I make sure to notice that. :) Tests, for me, are just a way to see what they are learning and what they can do when I am NOT leading, guiding, and directing.

[LG Gone Wild]

We aren't grade giving yet but my son is a "B" student in everything. It's just in his nature. I can't change that so I will have to be content with B.

[Night Elf]

But what do they have as their goals if you don't have grades? I mean, even dh is graded on his work! Sales people have goals they have to meet. What do you do if your dc don't have a benchmark?

 

:confused:

Dorinda

 

Hmm... This is a good question that I've seen discussed many times over the years on homeschooling boards.

 

I definitely do not like the idea that grades should be a child's goal in education. I am certain my opinion is not held by everyone. A grade is too short term. I was really good at getting great grades. I did not retain a great deal of information from my school years, but I have my report cards that show I was a pretty good student!

 

Your DH receives actual grades? Like an A or a B? I've heard of performance evaluations but I didn't think anyone ever got perfect remarks. How would there be room for improvement? Why would a person want to grow and become an even better employee?

 

The problem with benchmarks is that someone has to set them. Who is qualified to do that? And are those qualifications or benchmarks standard? Would you see the same benchmarks in my state of Georgia that we might find in California, Wisconsin, or any other U.S. state? Or why do we look at benchmarks only in the U.S.? What about other countries that have a high educational rate, perhaps a high percentage of students going on to higher learning? And should those benchmarks be grade level? What if Suzie isn't capable of doing 6th grade math when she's in the 6th grade? Does that make her a failure? What if her neighbor, Anna, is doing 7th grade math? Does that make her gifted?

 

Yes, I know benchmarks are just a standard set of something by which something else can be measured. I don't want standard though. I want customized and suited to my child. In the workplace, people who play to their strengths are noticed and praised for their work. I've never once held a job that expected me to know the exact same thing as every other employee and be able to step into their job at any time.

 

Benchmarks are necessary to see how a group of children are progressing. I'm not teaching a group. I'm teaching only 3 and even then I'm teaching them 1-on-1. I know my children are learning because I sit with them and talk with them, something teachers in schools cannot do with every student every day on every subject. We homeschool using our various curriculums and as I understand my child is progressing through the material, I don't see why I need to worry about how the Joneses are progressing through the same material.

[Haiku]

But what do they have as their goals if you don't have grades?

 

My oldest dd, who is in 9th grade, goes to a school that does not give grades. Advancement is based on demonstrated mastery of what they call "indicators" and successful completion of six "gateways" (which are projects that involve writing and presenting a paper, completing community service, keeping journals, and other things). Demonstrating mastery of an indicator is a fluid thing; you can achieve mastery this month but lose it next month if you "memorize and dump." Indicators are tested all year long, so kids have to truly master them, not just pass a single test on the material. My daughter doesn't worry about getting good grades; she focuses on mastering the material and compiling the best gateway she can.

 

In my homeschool, with my younger kids, I plan, as they get older, to help them work toward larger goals than grades. I want them to be able to identify goals in all areas of their life and incorporate their education into planning for those goals so that they really feel a sense of owning their own education, not just performing for me or for a grade. If my dd wants to be a wildlife biologist, for example, I would expect that doing well in biology would be a part of that overall goal, rather than the goal being "get an A in biology because an A is a good grade."

 

Am I making any sense or am I just babbling again? :001_smile:

 

Tara

[missmoe]

Yes, goals are important, but the goals do not need to be grades. Finishing her math program this year and understanding the concepts taught is a great goal at this point in her life. At some point grades become necessary to play the academic game, but that's the great thing about homeschooling. We can put off playing the game for a time and just focus on real learning.

[Tap]

Bs are our goal, As are gravy.

 

When my kids take any test or complete a major assignment, I will accept nothing less than a B. If they get less, they redo the lesson. It isn't a punishment and it is not presented that way, it is a standard of learning in our house. We reteach the entire concept to fill in the holes and sometimes reach for a different curriculum to make sure it sticks.

 

Most of the time they get As. But not always. Especially on things like math that have a cut and dried grade. If they redo a lesson I do allow a substitution grade to be placed over the origional grade.

[lauracolumbus]

I sat through Art Reed's presentation of Saxon's math program at the Midwest HS convention. He said to never grade the daily work and as long as they were getting 80s on the tests that they were doing well. I questioned him on this and he said if they are consistently getting 80s they are mastering the material b/c the material is getting harder. He also added that Saxon is considerably harder than other math programs so a student who consistently earned 80s would do well w/college math. I'm not sure if I agree w/the last statement, and I'm still trying to wrap my head around being happy w/80s. He said not to work about daily work if they were getting the 80s on the tests. That all kids make errors in daily work, but they know to put their game hat on for tests.

 

Laura

[phathui5]

I think it's more important that she like learning when it comes to the end of homeschooling. If she's happy to move on with 85-90%, I would go over the ones she got wrong and explain them to her, then move on.

[Ester Maria]

My daughters get formally examined by a school they supposedly belong to, on a "grade level" in all subjects they're supposedly taking, so regarding that, yes, they both receive the highest grades in all subjects so far. Probably because what we do at home is a lot more thorough and complex version of what they're expected to do for school, we don't do all subjects on "grade level" and we study some areas which don't belong to their official curriculum.

 

Technically, I don't have to grade, anything, ever. The reason why I still do it is for our own orientation - to see where we really are (with regards to their actual abilities and their actual curriculum, which common criteria cannot take into account). I didn't do it when they were very small and when I was still "observing" what types of students they were and what was realistic to expect from each of them for each grade.

I use the Italian 10-point scale, with 6 being a minimum grade to pass, and with 10 being a very rare grade that's given for really amazing effort and results in which they beat themselves for the criteria I gave to them. An equivalent of A is 9, not 10, A+ would be 10. But for my standards, they don't even have all 9s.

 

I estimate my younger daughter's Latin as worthy of the grade 8. She's 12 years old, finished morphology and starting syntax, current texts she's working on are excerpts from Sallust and Cicero. And yep, she has 8 in my book. Not 9, and certainly not 10, even though her Latin is better than most high school kids'. In my view, 8 is "distinguished" - a VERY good mark. It's not extraordinary though, and I'm perfectly happy with her being an 8 student in Latin. She also gets 7-8 in Hebrew, and I'd rate her B1+/B2 on the main European scale for languages. But again, those grades are such because they're given in accordance with her actual abilities, actual level and actual work - of course that she would fly through ANY middle and probably even high school Hebrew with A+, and should she ever take Hebrew SATs or something of the kind, she'll score it great.

 

My older one is a pure 10 student in Latin and Hebrew, but I rate her Math as 8, even 7 sometimes, for her abilities and her level (and she's working a year ahead of what she should be doing). She just doesn't care - she gets it, conceptually, on a very high level (ergo my "above grade level" expectations of her), but doesn't care to be as precise and to practice as much as needed, she often does her Math work in hurry, just to "get it done" and thus does a lot of little lapsuses on her way, so it can't possibly be 9-10, even though her real, "grade level criteria" marks WOULD be 9-10, and indeed ARE in the end, when she gets formally graded by other people.

 

We don't make much fuss over grades, but that's because my grades have no significance for them whatsoever, officially; however, they do tend to take them more seriously. They often say that they'll have 9-10 on their transcripts by the common criteria, but mom knows where they really are in each subject. :)

Of course things are a bit different for me as I've technically accelerated them, so there's a huge gap between what they do for transcript, and what they do for our homeschool. Grade level wise they ARE A/A+ students and I wouldn't take it away from them if I were to formally grade them, but that's only because those grades are realistic with regards to common criteria. If those common criteria were actually normal criteria - without the inflation of A students we have these days and the lowering of all standars possible - they might even not be, though they'd still do considerably better than in the context of one-on-one instruction where your instructor knows exactly what criteria apply to you.

 

Unfortunately, given that inflation of A students, it's very hard today to actually believe anyone's grades. I'm always suspicious of straight A students and the criteria that are behind it. In my opinion As should be something extraordinary, not a default for anyone who simply does their work well - and a lot of homeschoolers, I agree, tend to consider them that way.

[Ginevra]

When we started homeschooling, one of the "beauties of homeschooling" was, that all homeschoolers are straight "A" Students. The thought process was, if a child doesn't "get" something, you don't move on. You stick with it and eventually, they WILL get it

 

That doesn't describe an "A" student. That describes a "C" student. C is average. An average student may not get something immediately, or even quickly, but can learn it through patient help.

 

I never had a notion that all homeschoolers are straight A students. I do have a notion that there is no need to ever fail a homeschooled student. In the event that they didn't understand it, we would back up, wait, change approach, etc., so they need not ever be an "E" student.

 

A straight A student is most often already bright, or gifted, and learning something new is not hard. That is not necessarily a trait of a homeschooler, although lots of bright or gifted children are homeschooled. :001_smile:

[mcconnellboys]

Attitude, willingness to work, etc. definitely played into the way I assessed class grades.

[mcconnellboys]

And I think too many homeschoolers with straight A's tends to make outside souces not trust our methods of grading, either. Many already think that we are going to skew toward our sons and daughters. If I'm giving my student straight A's, but then they don't make those same grades in every outside class they take, have test scores that coroborate such grades, etc., it makes me look too lenient. If my grades tend to agree with (or even be a little lower than) outside grades, then I look fair....

[Teachin'Mine]

There's nothing wrong with B's, and to me there's nothing wrong with not giving grades in the lower grades. The goal is learning. :)

 

I hear a lot of people skip the first thirty lessons or so in the math books because they are review, but I think it's great for kids to have a time where math is less of a struggle. I also think that it's during these times of review that stuff is really mastered and it makes it so much easier for them to build on that great foundation. For us doing all the lessons was helpful even in the years we moved quickly through the lessons.

[KidsHappen]

I only graded on a pass/fail option before high school. Once they reach high school level they get whatever grade they earn. I give them the option to work at their own pace and keep at it until they are happy with their grade though so it is really up to them. I have one that just works through it as fast as she can and is happy with whatever grade she gets whereas I have another that makes sure that she masters the material before moving on. Both of their SAT scores support their grades.

[tex-mex]

Have you thought of evaluating her for a learning disability?

[tex-mex]

I only graded on a pass/fail option before high school. Once they reach high school level they get whatever grade they earn. I give them the option to work at their own pace and keep at it until they are happy with their grade though so it is really up to them. I have one that just works through it as fast as she can and is happy with whatever grade she gets whereas I have another that makes sure that she masters the material before moving on. Both of their SAT scores support their grades.

:iagree: When you have your child take the ACT/SAT or standardized test... it will verify the "mommy grades".

[Peela]

I would back off. I have a B and sometimes C grade student with ocasional brilliant moments (academically- his strengths are more social), and an A grade student who is B in math.

 

I think it's worth checking with ourselves every now and then whether we want our students to be top students purely for their own benefit- or for our own glory to some extent. It's quite humbling to have a student who is never going to be a top student or who writes messily no matter what, or can't memorise their times tables. I would say that getting angry might be a sign that we are not quite clear who this is for (I've done it!). It feels so much more gratifying when our kids shine, but for many, getting a lot less than A might be their own brand of shine in that area, and having a parent who wants A grade shine in all areas could be quite disheartening. I'm sure we've all done it.

[coffeefreak]

That doesn't describe an "A" student. That describes a "C" student. C is average. An average student may not get something immediately, or even quickly, but can learn it through patient help.

 

I never had a notion that all homeschoolers are straight A students. I do have a notion that there is no need to ever fail a homeschooled student. In the event that they didn't understand it, we would back up, wait, change approach, etc., so they need not ever be an "E" student.

 

A straight A student is most often already bright, or gifted, and learning something new is not hard. That is not necessarily a trait of a homeschooler, although lots of bright or gifted children are homeschooled. :001_smile:

 

I totally agree Quill. I never thought about it that way. It's not that they are "A," it's that they should never "fail."

 

I would back off. I have a B and sometimes C grade student with ocasional brilliant moments (academically- his strengths are more social), and an A grade student who is B in math.

 

I think it's worth checking with ourselves every now and then whether we want our students to be top students purely for their own benefit- or for our own glory to some extent. It's quite humbling to have a student who is never going to be a top student or who writes messily no matter what, or can't memorise their times tables. I would say that getting angry might be a sign that we are not quite clear who this is for (I've done it!). It feels so much more gratifying when our kids shine, but for many, getting a lot less than A might be their own brand of shine in that area, and having a parent who wants A grade shine in all areas could be quite disheartening. I'm sure we've all done it.

 

Peela, You are always so graceful with your answers. I really appreciate your comments. You are so right about my attitude.

 

After a week off, and 3 days of my MIL teaching the kids, I'm beginning to see the light. It has been such a stressful year, and I did lose sight of where we were going and who it is all about. My MIL has totally put things in perspective. My kids are right where they need to be. They have received nothing but praise from her, and they are so happy right now. They forgive me though. Kids understand stress and forgive so much easier than adults. I asked my girls and they are just having a blast showing off for Grandma. So, next week, when I'm on my own again and up and running, I'm going to pray I remember to praise, praise praise, them, and slow down to enjoy the day.

 

Thanks for all your wise words ladies!

Blessings!

Dorinda

[Starr]

Until high school math is either "nice bridge" or "your bridge just fell down." If the bridge has fallen it's time to fix the math. This always made ds laugh and get on with his "fixes".