Question about marriage and finances

[wy_kid_wrangler04]

OK so I was talking to my mom today, and she was telling me about her friend who has been married for almost 30 years. She has NEVER known how much money her husband makes, how much they spend in a month on bills OR even how much they bought their house for or what their house payment is a month. Her car broke down and her husband LOANED her the money to get another and she makes him car payments every month. It has always been what he makes is HIS MONEY, he pays the bills so she isnt supposed to ask. If she wants money she has to get a job. They have ALWAYS had separate checking accounts, her name is not on ANYTHING of his financially.

 

I was totally blown away. I KNOW her husband makes alot of money because he has 2 video stores that he owns and he has a VERY GOOD job that sends him to Mexico yearly for who knows what. Oh, btw, she wanted to go with him to mexico and he said "Do you have enough money for your ticket and hotel room???" HIS COMPANY IS PAYING FOR HIM WOULDNT THAT INCLUDE A HOTEL ROOM????????

 

What are your thoughts on this?

[LauraGB]

Well, I suppose to each thier own, but that's not how it works here. Dh and I had a joint checking account even before we were married. Money is a family thing, not an individual thing at our house. That said, since I do the budgeting and such, I'm not sure dh knows how much money we earn every month, either, lol, but I also don't think he cares unless it's not enough.

[jonesloonybin]

I have known many couples like this. Everything is completely seperate. I just cannot imagine what that must be like. We have everything together. Dh does handle the bill paying and I handle purchases mostly. (car/yard/computer type things are more his thing.) We discuss EVERY major purchase. (this is not just money amount, but anything that is major) My dh does tell me that he doesn't care and I don't have to talk to him about every single thing, but I want to be on the same page. But I will call him if we are, say, out clothes shopping and the amount is getting up there ($75+), just to make sure I am not forgeting something that the money needs to go to. (Usually we discuss what we have coming up and what we have as far as spending money)

[hornblower]

:svengo:

 

If she is fortunate to be in a community property state (google says: Arizona, California, Idaho, Louisiana, Nevada, New Mexico, Texas, Washington and Wisconsin) I'd tell her to leave the dude & take 1/2 their assets with her. I bet he'd be gobsmacked!

 

I cannot imagine being married to someone who treated me like that.

[wy_kid_wrangler04]

:svengo:

 

If she is fortunate to be in a community property state (google says: Arizona, California, Idaho, Louisiana, Nevada, New Mexico, Texas, Washington and Wisconsin) I'd tell her to leave the dude & take 1/2 their assets with her. I bet he'd be gobsmacked!

 

I cannot imagine being married to someone who treated me like that.

 

I would love to see what he did if she did take half and leave!! lol

 

I totally feel the same way! I am still flabbergasted! I just cant believe it! They are in Michigan, I dont think they have the community property law.

[Mrs Mungo]

I cannot imagine being married to someone who treated me like that.

 

I agree.

 

We have two checking accounts-one that he pays the bills and spends from and another that I use to manage the bills and spend from. BUT, we are both on both accounts, both accounts show up in our online banking, we have total visibility.

 

I would worry about what else he was keeping secret, but that's just me.

[Ester Maria]

I have three bank accounts (in three different banks, of course :p), two of which are my private ones, and one is a joint account I share with my husband. He also has his own account aside. We manage together only the joint account, and the accounts of our daughters (not much to "manage", but we opened them their accounts and they'll be given to them as they graduate from the university; meanwhile all family members add something occasionally, and we save that). I know approximately how much money he has aside "our" money, and he knows approximately for me, but it's not the type of question we'd normally ask and when the times are good, my money aside is my money, and his money aside is his money. I give my husband the full right to deal with his money as he wishes, as well as to make decisions on his property (even if we technically joint our properties and inheritances when we married), the same goes for me and my money and property.

 

Ever since I was a little girl my mother taught me about the importance to have my own money. She also had her private money channels I don't think my father even knew about (once when I was younger I needed money for something and she used that to give me... ahem, to loan it to me :p), even though the marriage was well and stable.

 

We have been also loaning money to each other when it's about big sums. I loaned money from my mother once or twice, and properly gave it back, with my husband it was never quite the case though (since our money goes spent for stuff of common interest). I don't see any issue here. Clear reckonings... Of course, it was loaning money without interest.

 

My husband and I have a very clear deal about who pays what out of what money, what's the roof for what kind of expenses, and our daughters are familiar with those rules too. I prefer it that way.

[LisaKinVA]

OK so I was talking to my mom today, and she was telling me about her friend who has been married for almost 30 years. She has NEVER known how much money her husband makes, how much they spend in a month on bills OR even how much they bought their house for or what their house payment is a month. Her car broke down and her husband LOANED her the money to get another and she makes him car payments every month. It has always been what he makes is HIS MONEY, he pays the bills so she isnt supposed to ask. If she wants money she has to get a job. They have ALWAYS had separate checking accounts, her name is not on ANYTHING of his financially.

 

I was totally blown away. I KNOW her husband makes alot of money because he has 2 video stores that he owns and he has a VERY GOOD job that sends him to Mexico yearly for who knows what. Oh, btw, she wanted to go with him to mexico and he said "Do you have enough money for your ticket and hotel room???" HIS COMPANY IS PAYING FOR HIM WOULDNT THAT INCLUDE A HOTEL ROOM????????

 

What are your thoughts on this?

 

If he's not doing "his share" of the household chores, child-care, etc, I'd start charging him for my time. I'd charge per pound to wash and fold his laundry, extra to iron and put away. I'd charge the going rate for cleaning the house, the going rate for meal preparation, the going rate for playing nanny (half time... because the children were half mine, but if dh wasn't doing his half, I'd charge for the difference). I'd charge him a portion of the gas to run his errands (this includes food... who pays for that?)

 

Personally, I can't imagine living that way. Not that I don't have my own account, or anything. But my husband knows what I make, I know what he makes... and we both know where the money goes.

 

It sounds more like they are roommates than partners.

[EarleneW]

We have a joint and I have my own. The only reason I have my own though is bc he wasn't with me when I open up the 2nd one and we just nver went back to add him.

[abbeyej]

It's hard for me to fathom. But I once knew a couple with His and Hers groceries and dishes (in addition to totally separate finances). They didn't last 30 years though. ;)

[Crissy]

My in laws have been this way for the 57 years they have been married.

He pays his bills, she pays hers. He buys his groceries, she buys hers.

My boys get two checks on their birthdays. One from Grandma, one from Grandpa.

They have never shared anything financial.

 

It's baffling.

[Night Elf]

That doesn't sound like a marriage to me at all. It's an employee/employer relationship, and that's just one of the nicer thoughts I have. I can't imagine if her husband dies before her. She's going to be in a mess!

[abbeyej]

It's baffling.

I'm just being nosy, but... Clearly that's not the set-up you have in your home. Did your dh always find their arrangement... odd? Or did you guys have to do a fair amount of negotiation in your own home?

 

(Really, I'm just genuinely curious. Dh and I come from families with similar approaches, so it was never something we had to hash out.)

 

Feel free to ignore me if this is too personal!

 

ETA: I mean, our families were similar to each other in terms of shared finances. Not that they were similar to the family described by the OP.

[AlmiraGulch]

My parents have been married for 52 years and for the last 50 have had only separate accounts.

 

They do know what each other makes, and each one pays certain specified household bills. If one runs short, the other loans it. Not sure what they do for major purchases, like vehicles, but I think each pays what they determine to be their "fair share" toward the purchase.

 

They both have said that if they hadn't separated their money when they did, they would have been divorced years ago. Definitely works for them, so....to each their own, I suppose!

[SonshineLearner]

I think that's creepy, and would almost make me wonder if he has another life... another wife..... something's up. I'd ask him, when he wanted dinner (which I'm sure she dutifully makes) if he has enough money, and that a tip will be added to each meal ticket from now on. This... from someone who believes that women are to be in submission to a man... Biblically.

I'd be sure to let him know, that the "buck stops here".

 

Crazy!!

[Tap]

Considering that they have lasted 30 years, it apparently works for them.

 

Dh and I have always kept parts of our finances separate and I wouldn't have it any other way. We lived together before we got married so we started out splitting everything in 1/2. Over time, and children, I started working part time and he now makes 4x more than I do. As this payroll difference started increasing, he took over more of the household bills. Now, he pays for all of our household expenses, household savings, his personal savings, and his retirement. I pay for my spending money, my retirement, daycare, food, gifts and the kids classes.

 

We have very, very different ways of spending money so it works great for us. I like to enjoy spending $20 here and there, going out for lunch or decorating the house. Dh likes to skimp every penny he can, and buy a bigger item. We tried to have a joint only account when we first got married and we drove each other nuts!

 

That being said, if I don't have enough money for something we need, dh will pay for it without question. I just make sure to give him some notice so he keeps enough money in his personal account to cover it. Last summer I was off work for 6mths and only got a portion of my pay via short term disability. He covered every bit of my expenses without a thought. Then when I went back to work, we switched back.

 

 

We have never, ever had a fight about money. :0)

 

As far as the OP, and the husband expecting the wife to pay for her hotel room...

When dh has to go out of town for work, spouses are Not allowed to come along. The time on a retreat is supposed to be time spent team building, not hanging out with a spouse. I know dh's company wouldn't allow a spouse to share a room. In fact he usually only has a bedroom in a larger suite so he doesn't have a private suite.

[Crissy]

Did your dh always find their arrangement... odd? Or did you guys have to do a fair amount of negotiation in your own home?

 

 

I think he has always recognized the controlling aspect (on his father's part) of the arrangement, and he asked me before we were married if I wouldn't mind sharing accounts, etc. :)

[Sputterduck]

Marriage is not a business relationship. It's about two becoming one. I could never live like that.

[dirty ethel rackham]

This is creepy! This does not sound like a healthy marital relationship. Nor is it a good idea for her credit record. Basically, she has no credit history, so if he dies or leaves her, she ends up in a sh#&load of trouble.

 

ETA: This arrangement makes it incredibly easy for him to hide assets if he ever thinks of leaving her. I had a friend in a similar situation and her hubby hid over $1 million in assets and got away with it because she had no clue about his finances. He just "took care of her."

 

I am not opposed to separate checking accounts if that is what makes a marriage work, but I think there needs to be transparency. If you can't trust your spouse with information about your finances, then who can you trust?

 

This guy sounds very controlling.

Edited March 29, 2010 by dirty ethel rackham

[duckens]

If she is fortunate to be in a community property state (google says: Arizona, California, Idaho, Louisiana, Nevada, New Mexico, Texas, Washington and Wisconsin) I'd tell her to leave the dude & take 1/2 their assets with her. I bet he'd be gobsmacked!

 

I cannot imagine being married to someone who treated me like that.

:iagree:

 

There is also the issue of alimony. In New Mexico (according to Loverboy's sister), if one has been married for 20+ years, alimony is for LIFE!!! :D:D:D I wonder what the rules are for Michigan.

 

For me, it's not that they have separate financial arrangements. Perhaps she is just not good at managing money. But the husband comes off as such an A$$ in this version. I would soooooo be out of there.

 

--Laura in Iowa

[Mommee & Baba]

If it works for them, then I guess who am I to have a voiced opinion.

 

However in our home we have 1 checking account. I am in charge of the finances. DH and I are on everything together. I am 100% ok in shifting roles with the finances though. To me it's about honesty and treating the family finances such as that...family earnings. Not just his or hers.

[HRAAB]

For me personally, we would no longer be married unless he wanted to get reasonable. And, I live in a community property state!

 

If she's happy and it works for her, good. If not, then she needs to address that.

[mommaduck]

If he's not doing "his share" of the household chores, child-care, etc, I'd start charging him for my time. I'd charge per pound to wash and fold his laundry, extra to iron and put away. I'd charge the going rate for cleaning the house, the going rate for meal preparation, the going rate for playing nanny (half time... because the children were half mine, but if dh wasn't doing his half, I'd charge for the difference). I'd charge him a portion of the gas to run his errands (this includes food... who pays for that?)

 

Personally, I can't imagine living that way. Not that I don't have my own account, or anything. But my husband knows what I make, I know what he makes... and we both know where the money goes.

 

It sounds more like they are roommates than partners.

:iagree:

I would not be able to live like that. That's not "marriage" to me...or rather not what marriage should be like.

[wy_kid_wrangler04]

I think that's creepy, and would almost make me wonder if he has another life... another wife..... something's up. I'd ask him, when he wanted dinner (which I'm sure she dutifully makes) if he has enough money, and that a tip will be added to each meal ticket from now on. This... from someone who believes that women are to be in submission to a man... Biblically.

I'd be sure to let him know, that the "buck stops here".

 

Crazy!!

 

 

I believe that too! Totally- My husband is the head of the household, no doubt! But I totally agree with you! He seems to be more a tyrant than anything. They do not agree with biblical teachings-- in her husbands words "I have no time nor need for that"

[usetoschool]

:svengo:

 

If she is fortunate to be in a community property state (google says: Arizona, California, Idaho, Louisiana, Nevada, New Mexico, Texas, Washington and Wisconsin) I'd tell her to leave the dude & take 1/2 their assets with her. I bet he'd be gobsmacked!

 

I cannot imagine being married to someone who treated me like that.

 

I live in one of those community property states and the trick is that if he has assets that have never been co-mingled with hers and they are in his name alone, then the money is his, all his. In a divorce she would not have access to them. The real problem is going to be when he passes away. Hopefully he has a will and she is named in it.

 

I would also worry about her ability to pay bills etc. when he dies. That can turn into a big mess, as my grandmother can testify, and my grandfather wasn't even trying to keep things from her, just doing his job as the man of the house and taking care of business.

 

I don't know the situation but it sounds a little sketchy to me. I guess it works for them since they have been married so long.

[wy_kid_wrangler04]

As far as the OP, and the husband expecting the wife to pay for her hotel room...

When dh has to go out of town for work, spouses are Not allowed to come along. The time on a retreat is supposed to be time spent team building, not hanging out with a spouse. I know dh's company wouldn't allow a spouse to share a room. In fact he usually only has a bedroom in a larger suite so he doesn't have a private suite.

 

 

That was welcomed by the company because when he would go it would be for a month or two at a time. His work moved to mexico and they were training them to do the job. (Kinda strange to train somebody to do your job if you ask me.:glare:)

[Dobela]

I don't know exactly what my dh makes. I don't have time to keep up with it since it changes with commissions. I know what is on our tax return... He also handles all the bills now and I ask when I want to spend to make sure there is money in the account before I bounce checks. But we only have 1 account. When we both worked we had 2 accounts - one for my 'play money' and one for everything else. I also used to handle the bills but got tired of that so now he does. He does keep a list in his desk of who he pays and when so I would be able to take over if he for some reason couldn't pay that month.

 

I think that if it works and she is happy, then we shouldn't judge. My mom would be a fantastic wife that way. Right now though my dad drives her crazy. She is a nervous wreck and can't stand any risk at all. So when he is buying and selling real estate or some other investment, he has always been careful to give her every important detail. She can't handle it. It is one thing for her to know he is flipping houses, but something totally different to know he bought it for x, is spending y to remodel, and hopes to sell it for z. She is constantly afraid he is going to lose money or theirh car or their house...

[Melissa in Australia]

My in laws have been this way for the 57 years they have been married.

He pays his bills, she pays hers. He buys his groceries, she buys hers.

My boys get two checks on their birthdays. One from Grandma, one from Grandpa.

They have never shared anything financial.

 

It's baffling.

my in-laws are like this as well. they even have separate fridges/freezers and cook their own meals.:001_huh: they are both in their late 80's and I can only look and think their life would be so much easier if they helped each other out a little.

[HRAAB]

I live in one of those community property states and the trick is that if he has assets that have never been co-mingled with hers and they are in his name alone, then the money is his, all his. In a divorce she would not have access to them. The real problem is going to be when he passes away. Hopefully he has a will and she is named in it.

 

 

When making purchases in a community property state, although only his name might be on it, she is still responsible for the payments, and if the property is sold, she would be entitled to her part.

[Rhonda in TX]

I have a friend that really has no idea how her DH spends their money. He's a lawyer and makes a lot of money. She has a budgeted amount to spend, but that's because they do Dave Ramsey. He doesn't seem to have the same sort of budget, but she doesn't care too much.

 

We have to watch our money so closely that I am very aware of how much DH makes and how our money is spent. DH believes strongly in one bank account and mutual accountability.

 

I think your mother's friend's DH has some serious control issues. I couldn't live like that.

[Melissa in Australia]

Could it be a generational thing? I know WAY in the past when nearly all women stayed at home and men worked. the men would give their wife an allowance. And it was viewed as the man's responsibility to pay the bills etc. I know older people who's husbands has always done the shopping and the wife stays at home all the time. they are usually in very rural locations. I remember when I was a child, the small country town I grew up in,the women mostly didn't even drive. I think that access to joint bank accounts is a relatively new thing, and comes with the whole liberation of women etc.

[Medieval Mom]

Delete.

Edited March 29, 2010 by Medieval Mom

[jillian]

different strokes for different folks. it seems a little nutty to me but that's because i know that dh can't handle the finances to make sure things get paid and he leaves for 3 months at a time so i kinda have to know how much things are lol

[Mejane]

It's the opposite here. I control all the money, he just earns it.

 

(Seriously, he just doesn't want to be bothered. He has access to everything.)

[Tap]

It sounds like the wife works in this situation since she has the money for a car payment. So, does she have assets that doesn't have dh's name on it?

 

Does he know how much she makes? Does he try to control her money or is she allowed the same privacy that he has? It could be a tit for tat situation.

[CatMomof3]

What works for us is that I do all the finances and my dh makes 99% of the money. I work odd graphic jobs when I have time (or we need an extra dollar or two). My dh does not know what are monthly bills are or how much we spend on food and other odds and ends. It has worked for us. If he needs money he asks - I always say yes, I always find a way of moving the numbers around.

 

It just show what works for some couples will not work for others.

[Jane in NC]

The question that I have concerns income tax. Do these people file separate returns? Many couples consider both separate and combined returns, then file what is most beneficial. It would seem that some discussion of finances would have to take place to minimize the tax bite.

 

Or is the wife just suppose to sign a 1040 because dearest hubby said to? That is frightening to me.

 

Jane

[Jennifer in MI]

It's the opposite here. I control all the money, he just earns it.

 

(Seriously, he just doesn't want to be bothered. He has access to everything.)

 

 

Same here. Dh is really, really terrible with money!!! He knows it. So, I pay all bills. We discuss all major purchases, but usually, if I think it's a good idea, he's on board. Dh is just too busy to be bothered with it too. It works for us.

 

That said, I could never imagine a situation like the one OP described. I'm too much of a control freak though!!!:lol:

[ereks mom]

 

We have two checking accounts-one that he pays the bills and spends from and another that I use to manage the bills and spend from. BUT, we are both on both accounts, both accounts show up in our online banking, we have total visibility.

 

We have two accounts too, and like Mrs. Mungo & her dh, my dh & I are both on both accounts and both accounts show up in our online banking. One account is the one dh uses mainly for bills, and the other is one I use mainly for buying books, school supplies, curriculum, gifts, etc.

 

I would worry about what else he was keeping secret, but that's just me.

 

:iagree:

[NoPlaceLikeHome]

:svengo:

 

If she is fortunate to be in a community property state (google says: Arizona, California, Idaho, Louisiana, Nevada, New Mexico, Texas, Washington and Wisconsin) I'd tell her to leave the dude & take 1/2 their assets with her. I bet he'd be gobsmacked!

 

I cannot imagine being married to someone who treated me like that.

 

:iagree:

and second the:

:svengo:

 

And he loves her? I don't think so at all:(

[wy_kid_wrangler04]

It sounds like the wife works in this situation since she has the money for a car payment. So, does she have assets that doesn't have dh's name on it?

 

Does he know how much she makes? Does he try to control her money or is she allowed the same privacy that he has? It could be a tit for tat situation.

 

She makes just enough to pay for her needs. (other than living expenses) when she makes more he makes her pay for more (including borrowing from him if need be) but she is never able to keep enough to have her own assets.

[justamouse]

:svengo:

 

If she is fortunate to be in a community property state (google says: Arizona, California, Idaho, Louisiana, Nevada, New Mexico, Texas, Washington and Wisconsin) I'd tell her to leave the dude & take 1/2 their assets with her. I bet he'd be gobsmacked!

 

I cannot imagine being married to someone who treated me like that.

 

Word.

 

Or, I'd never marry a man like that in the first place. Does she think so little of herself? Really? That is sad.

Edited March 29, 2010 by justamouse

[Sputterduck]

She makes just enough to pay for her needs. (other than living expenses) when she makes more he makes her pay for more (including borrowing from him if need be) but she is never able to keep enough to have her own assets.

 

Why does he get to know how much she makes?

[6packofun]

*Screeeeech* That was my brakes. I'm curious about what kind of video stores he owns. And if he's keeping her that much in the dark, there is something creepy and sneaky to it, if you ask me.

 

If I were her, it would be matter of telling him that he shares the info or I get a lawyer.

[Natalieclare]

She makes just enough to pay for her needs. (other than living expenses) when she makes more he makes her pay for more (including borrowing from him if need be) but she is never able to keep enough to have her own assets.

 

 

Now that's just sad. I'm not one to jump to conclusions, but the only people I know who've been in arrangements where the wife was kept in a perpetual state of dependency have been in abusive, manipulative, and controlling relationships. So sad.

[LisaKinVA]

She makes just enough to pay for her needs. (other than living expenses) when she makes more he makes her pay for more (including borrowing from him if need be) but she is never able to keep enough to have her own assets.

 

Essentially, then, "what's his is his, and what's hers is his"

 

Unlike many of the other scenarios described, this truly describes a controlling, and potentially abusive situation. It is infuriating that a man would not only keep his wife in the dark about his finances, but make it his business to determine how much of her money she should be able to keep for her "needs" and "not allow" her to build her own assets...

 

...and then he has the NERVE to ask her if she has enough money to pay for her plane ticket and hotel for the company trip to Mexico?!?! Of course, he knew the answer to the question before it was even answered. He took all of her "extra" money!

[Liza Q]

Now, I don't know exactly what my dh makes or exactly the cost of our bills because he is in charge of finances. He is the detail person in this relationship and so keeping the finances straight works with his personality but it's not like he hides things from me. IN fact we specifically go over our budget on a regular basis, I just don't remember the numbers.

 

Same here. He tries so hard to keep me up-to-date and hardly ever buys anything without running it past me but the numbers just float through my head!

[lulubelle]

I think it's sad. The man from the OP sounds like a control freak, but the woman seems to be staying around. It takes two. But, it does bring up the old fear of many a man! Being afraid that their wife will shop their money away! My husband had a friend while we were dating that told him he should never tell a woman how much money he had and to beware that women will spend their money away! Also, ever ask a married woman if she was in credit card debt when she was married? You get some interesting answers! And, I did just get to know a woman that confided, in a group that we are in, that she is one of those women! She has driven them into major credit card debt and she just secretly got her own card and has wracked up even more debt. I think she is an extreme case. How can a marriage work at it's best when each person really doesn't trust each other.

[AngieW in Texas]

It's the opposite here. I control all the money, he just earns it.

 

(Seriously, he just doesn't want to be bothered. He has access to everything.)

 

We're pretty much the same. I took over doing the actual bill-paying for my dh before we got married. He would regularly wait until he got the notice that the electricity/water/phone/whatever was going to be cut off before paying the bill. He did everything in cash, so I started going through his mail and pulling out all of his bills. I'd have him give me the money and then I'd go out to pay all his bills.

 

I do all the bill-paying. I have to go to him occasionally to find out if a charge on a credit card is legitimate. There was a charge on the card that I didn't recognize this month. It was for something he ordered back in December that finally shipped.

 

I handle the checking and savings account along with all the bill paying. Dh has a stock account (employee stock purchase plan) that he manages.

 

Dh just has to let me know if he's going to make any major purchases. When we have a large expense, we put it on the credit card and my dh will transfer money from the stock account to our checking account to cover it.

 

Everything is online, so dh can look it up anytime he likes. I could do the same for the stock account, but don't bother. He rarely looks up the checking account.

[ChristusG]

DH makes all the money and handles the finances, bills, etc. I hate dealing with numbers, money, making payments on time, etc. He's an accountant and that's his thing, not mine. So I have no issues with him handling all of it. I know the ballpark of money that he makes, but I do not know about our investments, etc. DH tries to tell me about them sometimes, but my eyes begin to glaze over and his words start running in one ear and out the other LOL.

 

That said, we have joint everything. I do not get an "allowance." I spend whatever. We only discuss big purchases such as cars, houses, appliances, vacations, etc. It works pretty well for us. I couldn't imagine everything being seperate....especailly to the degree of those people you are referring to.