Mothers during and after birth

[Scarlett]

Can we discuss this? 
 

My great nephew’s wife just had their child.  This morning. He lives about 3 hours away. My mom was very very close to this grandson….he is 30 now. 32 this year I think.  Anyway there is a planned c section planned for today.  Mom says to nephew a few weeks ago, ‘ I would love to be there for the birth’.  My nephew comes back very sweetly and says, ‘It will just be my mom and Dw’s mom at  the hospital. But we would love to have you visit when we get home and settled.’ I thought it was expectations perfectly and kindly explained.  My mom said to me, ‘ I guess I have to accept I am a generation removed now. ‘.   I said yep.

 

Fast forward to today…….baby is born. We get immediate notification from  nephew…..pics etc.  my mom gets a text from a cousin in the town nephew lives in…..she says, ‘isn’t today baby is coming?’ My mom said yes…..and cousin says oh I wanted to be there.   Mom tells her ‘ well I would go on up there. ‘.  I looked shocked at mom…..um they said they did  not want people at the hospital.  Mom says, well, the baby is here now, if I was there I would go up there.   I said, ‘After you were told no?’ Mom says, well it is his ( her grandson) baby too……and I know he would not care.  
Half an hour later cousin texts and says she went to the hospital and she was turned away by nephews mom who said they are not accepting visitors.  
I told mom,  ’well you set cousin up for that.’

Mom said, ‘ I just don’t know how we got to this point where family isn’t wanted.’  I said, I don’t know either mom but I do know if you push it and don’t respect wishes and boundaries you will just alienate them from you further.’   She said, ‘well, if they don’t want us there we are obviously already alienated.’

So honestly how do we explain this? To me every birth seems fraught with emotional land mines and disappointment. Yes, we all know it is the moms body etc…..but why are we cutting out family completely? Is there not a mid ground of everyone in delivery room vs no one is allowed on hospital grounds?
 

[Rosie_0801]

There is no way to explain to people who don't want to understand.

 

I'd have thought "we'll invite you when we're ready" was the middle ground.

[rebcoola]

Babies keep their is no need to impose on a mother in the hospital.  Baby will still be tiny and squishy.  I let people visit but totally understand why bleeding, leaking exhausted women dont want visitors.

Edited September 20, 2023 by rebcoola

[gardenmom5]

Nephew was polite.  "We'd love to see you when we're settled at home".

 

Hospitals have nurses constantly in and out, poking at mom, poking at baby. Lots of chaos, and stays tend to be shorter than a generation ago.

Sadly, some people just look to be offended.

[Danae]

9 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

why are we cutting out family completely? Is there not a mid ground of everyone in delivery room vs no one is allowed on hospital grounds?
 

Sure.  The middle ground in this case is the new parent’s moms supporting them at the hospital and everyone else invited to visit when they get home.

[Clarita]

3 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

Is there not a mid ground of everyone in delivery room vs no one is allowed on hospital grounds?

If it's the US you are only in the hospital for 2 maybe 3 days, or 1 night stay after baby is born. Do people seriously need to be there that quickly?

On top of that the hospital that I gave birth in gave me a limit of people to be in the delivery room, because the DOCTORS and NURSES need space to work too. In addition for the first 6 weeks of a baby's life the baby is super susceptible to all kinds (for an adult benign diseases). A common cold can easily kill a baby of 6 weeks and younger. 

"Cutting off family completely" seriously your (the general you, I know you @Scarlett isn't the one requesting) desire to touch a squishy newborn does not trump the life of the baby. That's why.

[Starr]

It was different when dd had her baby than when we had ours. I had more visitors but no one stayed long unless asked. 

[mmasc]

I really did NOT like visitors when I was in the hospital after childbirth, so I totally get why a mother wouldn’t want that. 
 

It seems like they were totally polite by telling her she is welcome to visit when they are home and settled. There should be no hard feelings in this situation, imho. 

[cjzimmer1]

8 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

 

 

So honestly how do we explain this? To me every birth seems fraught with emotional land mines and disappointment. Yes, we all know it is the moms body etc…..but why are we cutting out family completely? Is there not a mid ground of everyone in delivery room vs no one is allowed on hospital grounds?
 

I guess I'm struggling to understand how asking family to wait until you are home is considered cutting out family.  For my first everyone came and visited and frankly that is my biggest regret.  I was exhausted and having to be "social" just made it worst.  And since the majority of hospitals the baby is now in the room with mom (baring severe medical issues), it means mom does have to be social for every visitor.  So family being on the hospital grounds means eventually they will be in my room if they are going to see baby.  In this day of instant everything, I think a whole lot of people are forgetting that healing isn't instant and expecting to see baby right away (especially when told by parents to wait), is really rude on the family member's part.  

[Starr]

If one is used to the social custom of dropping by the hospital it is a change. A change to be gracious about but harder for some. We were able to visit as long as dd and dsil wanted after they were all settled in room, it took About Two hours  or so. it was weird for me that we couldn’t run in. Hug hug. Kiss kiss and step out but that’s the new way. 

[Corraleno]

28 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

Is there not a mid ground of everyone in delivery room vs no one is allowed on hospital grounds?

This woman just had MAJOR surgery in addition to having a new baby, with all the exhaustion that goes with that.

I could not even move after my C-section — literally could not sit up or even turn over in bed. I was wearing nothing but a tee shirt while lying on a giant pad leaking blood and fluids. I felt incredibly gross and there was no possibility of taking a shower. I still had an IV and a catheter for many hours afterwards!

It also takes much longer for your milk to come in after a C-section, so my baby was nursing nonstop because all he was getting was a little colostrum and he was crying because he was hungry. I did not want ANYONE in the hospital room with me!

My in-laws showed up at the hospital uninvited 3 days later (drunk/hungover after an all night party, no less!) and I was seriously pissed, but at least by that point I could sit up and wear pants. The idea that anyone should have a right to be in the hospital the same day a woman gives birth (especially with a C-section!!!) unless they are explicitly invited is totally bonkers to me. I put that in the same category as people who think they have a right to touch pregnant women's stomachs — that's just a crazy level of entitlement to me.

Edited September 20, 2023 by Corraleno

[Harriet Vane]

No one was "cut off." They were asked to visit at a more convenient time and place, when the new mom is feeling up to it. It's perfectly understandable and it's absolutely her right. It's not rude. She just had major surgery, for crying out loud. 

[Scarlett]

I just called my nephew.  He answered immediately. I could hear newborn crying.  We talked a bit about her name, how the mom is doing etc.  I said mom and I were anxious to meet new  baby and he said, Maybe you can come on the weekend.  And he said to wife, ‘babe, can grandma and aunt Scarlett come this weekend?  (To be clear not spending the night)  She said something I did not understand but he repeated to me, ‘She said if we get the floors clean’. ‘I said, nephew, we aren’t worried about floors!’  He said, ‘I can totally do the floors!’.  It all made me laugh,  

I think when you abide by these boundaries you will find this ease up a lot. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

9new baby girl. 

[regentrude]

The middle ground is that the young parents will welcome visitors when they are ready and settled in their home.

Nobody is entitled to intrude on a new family's privacy - the wishes of the new parents are the only thing that matters here.

Eta: I am mind-boggled why people think young mothers want extended family to see them immediately after delivery. 

Edited September 20, 2023 by regentrude

[prairiewindmomma]

25 minutes ago, Rosie_0801 said:

There is no way to explain to people who don't want to understand.

 

 

It does feel like your mom set cousin up, and did so to express her displeasure at her being told to visit later. If cousin had been able to visit, I would guess she would feel vindication.

 

[Scarlett]

I see a lot of the points you have made…..but I do think the pendulum has swung wide and far.  No one has to bother the mom to say hi to the dad and offer support to him and possibly get a peek at baby. 
 

[MercyA]

I admit I was not super happy when my pastor and his wife and a friend and his wife came to the hospital the morning after I gave birth. I know they meant well and I would never say anything to them about it. But I don't love unannounced visitors on a good day, much less when I am all stitched up and bleeding, wearing a hospital gown. I remember I was so hungry, and my dinner was sitting there getting cold while they talked and talked. 😉 Plus I had to keep my robe on because I wasn't wearing a bra.  

I know that sounds really self-centered, but I don't think anyone (even grandparents!) should drop in without an invitation or at least permission. There are times a woman wants privacy. 

Edited September 20, 2023 by MercyA

[Melissa in Australia]

1 minute ago, Scarlett said:

I see a lot of the points you have made…..but I do think the pendulum has swung wide and far.  No one has to bother the mom to say hi to the dad and offer support to him and possibly get a peek at baby. 
 

I don't get this. You were able to ring the dad to say hi

No need to go to hospital to do it. 

[Scarlett]

Just now, MercyA said:

I admit I was not super happy when my pastor and his wife and a friend and his wife came to the hospital the morning after I gave birth. I *know* they meant well and I would never say anything to them about it. But I don't love unannounced visitors on a good day, much less when I am all stitched up and bleeding. I remember I was so hungry, and my dinner was sitting there getting cold while they talked and talked. 😉 

I know that sounds really self-centered, but I don't think anyone (even grandparents!) should drop in without an invitation or at least permission.

Why would you not just start eating? 
 

I really struggle with this as a grandmother who was not allowed to me our grandson for 4months. 

[Corraleno]

Just now, Scarlett said:

I see a lot of the points you have made…..but I do think the pendulum has swung wide and far.  No one has to bother the mom to say hi to the dad and offer support to him and possibly get a peek at baby. 
 

It's not "offering support" if the dad would prefer to focus on his wife and baby instead of having to entertain visitors. Friends and relatives can "get a peak at the baby" via photos. Insisting on visiting the hospital and seeing the baby in person, even when the mother (who just had surgery and is nursing a newborn!) does not want visitors, is more self-centered than supportive.

[regentrude]

4 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I see a lot of the points you have made…..but I do think the pendulum has swung wide and far.  No one has to bother the mom to say hi to the dad and offer support to him and possibly get a peek at baby. 
 

What's so important about seeing a newborn right away? They'll still look like a baby a few weeks later.

And it does bother mom if dad has to entertain visitors instead of being present with her. That is not "support"; it's a selfish intrusion.

What can possibly be this urgent about looking at a newborn?

Eta: not to mention that some parents prefer to limit exposure to visitors' germs. 

Edited September 20, 2023 by regentrude

[Harriet Vane]

4 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I see a lot of the points you have made…..but I do think the pendulum has swung wide and far.  No one has to bother the mom to say hi to the dad and offer support to him and possibly get a peek at baby. 
 

Scarlett, you are dead wrong on this one. I'm not trying to be combative, just very direct. It IS a bother for the dad to say hi to a host of eager visitors because he's not available to his wife or baby. It IS a bother to present the baby to the hordes of people--it interferes with sleeping, breastfeeding, and their own special time together. He needs to focus on the comfort of his wife after this major medical event, and they get the privilege of enjoying their baby as a new family. It IS a bother when others intrude.

Edited September 20, 2023 by Harriet Vane

[MercyA]

I agree with you more often than not, Scarlett ❤️, but not this time.

[Scarlett]

Just now, Melissa in Australia said:

I don't get this. You were able to ring the dad to say hi

No need to go to hospital to do it. 

What don’t you get?  Yes we have phones here.  Of course there was no ‘need’. No one lived or died based upon that.  But it is a sharp deviation from my childhood and up until Covid……..hospital stays and births involved a lot people.  My moms breast cancer surgery had 20 people in the waiting room.  My dads prostate surgery has as many or more. 

[MercyA]

3 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

Why would you not just start eating? 

I definitely would now. I was 15 years younger, not as direct or confident as I am now, and I thought it would be rude to eat in front of them.

[Scarlett]

Well, you are all saying what I told mom is the new norm.  But we had generations of it being done differently and not everyone hated it.  

[MercyA]

I hope you don't feel too dogpiled. 😬 There's nothing wrong with an honest question! 

[Melissa in Australia]

Generations ago people stayed in hospital for a lot longer to recover. 

Hospitals here have forever had visiting hours and a limit of 2 to 3 people at a time..

Unless someone is actually in the process of dying . Then they can have lots of family and no visiting hours

Edited September 20, 2023 by Melissa in Australia

[Scarlett]

Just now, MercyA said:

I hope you don't feel too dogpiled. 😬 There's nothing wrong with an honest question! 

I don’t.  I realize we don’t always ageee.  I am in the middle on this.  I do see both sides.  I just see a certain trend that I find unsettling.  

[Harriet Vane]

Just now, Scarlett said:

Well, you are all saying what I told mom is the new norm.  But we had generations of it being done differently and not everyone hated it.  

I don't know how new it is, though I can see that it feels new in your family culture or possibly your geographic area.

I'm 51 years old, and I remember my childbirth classes and my talks with peers and with my midwife when getting ready for the birth of my first child. There was no expectation of lots of visitors. In fact, there were some folks who were astounded that we invited dh's parents to visit the baby in the hospital. They were very dear to us, and their hospital visit was a special privilege we extended only to them. The norm for us, where we lived and with our families and friends, was not to have visitors until we had had a chance to settle in at home a bit. Like for a week or two. Church folks dropped off meals at the door. Family visited when the baby was a couple weeks old (except for dh's parents). Friends of mine did similarly. 

 

[Clarita]

5 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

But it is a sharp deviation from my childhood and up until Covid……..hospital stays and births involved a lot people.

I gave birth to both my kids 2 years before COVID. this trend is not since COVID. In fact my friends who have kids in their teens also didn't have an entourage of visitors at the hospital when they gave birth.

[Scarlett]

2 minutes ago, Clarita said:

I gave birth to both my kids 2 years before COVID. this trend is not since COVID. In fact my friends who have kids in their teens also didn't have an entourage of visitors at the hospital when they gave birth.

Maybe not in your world but yes in my world it is very different.  

[regentrude]

10 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

  But it is a sharp deviation from my childhood and up until Covid……..hospital stays and births involved a lot people.  My moms breast cancer surgery had 20 people in the waiting room.  My dads prostate surgery has as many or more. 

That may have been typical in YOUR family, but doesn't represent a general norm.

None of my elders would have appreciated an entourage at the hospital, and I don't know a single friend who had her mother present in the delivery room. Heck no, last thing I would have wanted.

[Terabith]

I was bored and wanted to show my newborns off and I wanted company, which is kinda weird because I'm not generally super sociable, but I really did want people there.  

After the birth.

There was NO WAY I was letting even my own mother in while I was having the baby.  And I TOTALLY understand why someone might not want company while they're bleeding and trying to breastfeed and exhausted.  

[Scarlett]

Just now, regentrude said:

That may have been typical in YOUR family, but doesn't represent a general norm.

None of my elders would have appreciated an entourage at the hospital, and I don't know a single friend who had her mother present in the delivery room. Heck no, last thing I would have wanted.

Well I am discussing my family and my culture, so there is that. 

[Scarlett]

Just now, Terabith said:

I was bored and wanted to show my newborns off and I wanted company, which is kinda weird because I'm not generally super sociable, but I really did want people there.  

After the birth.

There was NO WAY I was letting even my own mother in while I was having the baby.  And I TOTALLY understand why someone might not want company while they're bleeding and trying to breastfeed and exhausted.  

Well sure! Makes sense.  

[wendyroo]

I agree that this sounds more like a difference in family culture or personal preference than a sudden or generational change.

I am 42 years old, and when I was born only my mother's mother came to the hospital...and she just visited for a short time the day after I was born.

When I had my kids, I did not have anyone other than DH come to the hospital. Even I was barely at the hospital because I wanted out. I headed home as close to 24 hours after giving birth as possible.

[City Mouse]

I think the new parents were perfectly fine and normal to put such restrictions in place if they want to do so. Just because a practice used to be socially acceptable to previous generations does not mean that it should continue even if the older generation doesn’t want to change. I could give lots of non-childbearing examples, but I don’t want to start more arguments.

[wendyroo]

4 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

Well I am discussing my family and my culture, so there is that. 

Your family, your nephew, is the father, not the mother. Her family culture will be the driving factor in what she is comfortable with during her birth.

For all we know, her family culture would have only included her own mother in the birth, and even including his mother as well was already a compromise on her part.

[Scarlett]

1 minute ago, wendyroo said:

Your family, your nephew, is the father, not the mother. Her family culture will be the driving factor in what she is comfortable with during her birth.

For all we know, her family culture would have only included her own mother in the birth, and even including his mother as well was already a compromise on her part.

I have no idea if his mom was allowed in delivery. 

[popmom]

@Scarlett did you or your mom ever have a c-section?

[Scarlett]

Just now, popmom said:

@Scarlett did you or your mom ever have a c-section?

No. 

[Melissa in Australia]

Here the only other person allowed in  cersarian delivery would be the husband of the wife. Operating theaters here aren't public specticals or entertainment venues

I am quite shocked at the idea that an audience expected to be in theater 

[SKL]

When you were born, who all was allowed in the hospital?

Where I was born, hardly anyone was allowed into the maternity ward, and hardly anyone would have thought to go "visit" when someone else was having a baby.

I do remember at age 12 being allowed in to see my baby sister, but she was a couple days old already, no complications, no c-section.

I have never given birth, but I don't think I'd want a bunch of people around when in that condition either.

Edited September 20, 2023 by SKL

[popmom]

4 minutes ago, Melissa in Australia said:

Here the only other person allowed in  cersarian delivery would be the husband of the wife. Operating theaters here aren't public specticals or entertainment venues

I am quite shocked at the idea that an audience expected to be in theater 

I think it is interesting considering that we are not that far removed from a time (me and my siblings births) when even the father wasn't allowed in the room even an uncomplicated natural delivery. 

Edited September 20, 2023 by popmom

[Scarlett]

1 minute ago, popmom said:

@Scarlett did you or your mom ever have a c-section?

My mom has had a lot though. She never one time did not want help or visitors.  SHe needed help. She was a single mom though   when she was cut from stem to stern much worse than any c section. So yes, I acknowledge people are different, but it isn’t far fetched that some, maybe many people want support.  

[Scarlett]

2 minutes ago, Melissa in Australia said:

Here the only other person allowed in  cersarian delivery would be the husband of the wife. Operating theaters here aren't public specticals or entertainment venues

I am quite shocked at the idea that an audience expected to be in theater 

What are you talking about? My mom was not asking to be in the operating room.  Good gravy.  

[wendyroo]

7 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I have no idea if his mom was allowed in delivery. 

Okay, but according to your original post, his mom was at the hospital, so she was included even if she was not in the delivery room...which it would not surprise me if neither mom were in the delivery room since it was a C-section.

So my point stands that for all we know, the new mom would have been more comfortable with just her own mom around shortly after giving birth and having major surgery. And even allowing MIL to be there could have been a compromise between her family culture and nephew's.

[Melissa in Australia]

Oh sorry that was what I thought you meant when you said "at delivery"

That there was an audience at delivery was what I interpreted that to mean. 

 

[Scarlett]

Just now, Melissa in Australia said:

Oh sorry that was what I thought you meant when you said "at delivery"

That there was an audience at delivery was what I interpreted that to mean. 

 

No. Just at the hospital to offer support to the dad and maybe catch a glimpse of new baby.  I think what many don’t understand is that to NOT show up in certain cultures is to be seen as failing to offer support.