Fuming over ridiculous In-Laws

[38carrots]

This is obviously true to the OP (who was offended at being asked) and to some posters here; to other posters here (and obviously to the OP's in-laws, who did ask), asking to change the date is not a faux pas and is in fact expected behavior with family.

 

For me and my family, the faux pas would be if a relative just expressed regrets instead of making an attempt to see if our plans were flexible enough to accommodate their other event.

 

This. I wouldn't dream of asking a casual friend to change dates for me, but family or a very close friend? Absolutely. The assumption is that we want to spend time with them and they want to spend time with us. We don't expect to be always accommodated or get upset if things can't get changed, obviously.

 

I love having family and friends who are comfortable enough with each other to not to be bound by etiquette at all times.

[Bluegoat]

Yes, in my family it would be ok to bring up a conflict.  Whether I did or not would depend - for example I have some young cousins and when there is a conflict for their birthday I don't ask as I know it is already hard for them to set dates - I would be complicating things.  In another situation, it would be fine.

 

I've sometimes missed their parties because of church things which I know their family thinks are silly, but they aren't judgy over it.  There are lots of other times to build relationships.

[SKL]

I guess in my family, whether it is OK to ask for a reschedule would depend on the event.  Normally, it is reasonable to assume people picked a date because other dates weren't as good for them.  In our family, kid birthdays are normally celebrated on the day if possible (or on the closest weekend day).  If I had a conflict but really wanted to attend both events, I'd respond to the kid's mom with "oh, gosh, we have ___ at that same time."  And then the organizer would have the option to say "well, I could move the time" or "oh bummer."

 

When there's a big family get-together and it actually matters who shows up, like a milestone for my parents, the organizers normally check availability before setting dates.  I wouldn't expect my availability to be checked for a kid birthday party.  If I had a conflict, I'd send my regrets and a gift.

[BigMamaBird]

Is the party here?  This is a national chain that is sort of a sport's bar, although more of an arcade.  It's not for everyone, but it's not a bad thing, and very popular with some.  I've never held a party here for my own children, but I've attended a child party here.  It was loud, for sure. :)   "Eat & Drink"  "Play Games"  "Watch Sports"  "Parties & Events"

 

https://www.daveandbusters.com/kids-birthdays

 

Unfortunately, no.  That would be fun for the kids.  The place they're having her party is just a run of the mill sports bar with lots of TVs and tables.  Nothing for the kids to do except sit around, eat and watch the adults watch the game. 

 

We would have tried to find another date, but the week before her party is Easter weekend, the weekend before that is my nieces's party and the weekend we're doing it is the first in April, I assumed March Madness would be over by April.  Apparently I was wrong. 

 

We got a text from her yesterday saying "oh, the game isn't until after the party after all so it's all perfectly fine."  Seriously!  You can't check times BEFORE asking people to move around times?!?!

[SquirrellyMama]

The relationship was stained already and my dh planned a Super Bowl party rather than to go his sister's event. DH DOES value football more than living breathing family members we have had other issues over it. People always are more important that media. An emotionally healthy person can find the dysfunctions of other amusing. And yes, putting sports ahead of family is dysfunctional. My SIL was 22 from a broken family and she was not the only person hurt. I KNEW that it would be this way, but DH loves his football.

 

I know lots of people wont agree with me, but the life you are IN is the one that is important, not the one where you WATCH others pursue their dreams. Those two things are just not equal no matter how long you have been a sports fan. No matter how much transference you have placed in your team. I don't expect everyone to agree with me or get it. That's okay.

 

I'm very sorry for your IL situation, I truly am. If it is a habit with your dh, then the anger should be directed at him, not your kids. Why can't they have a good relationship with you and the kids? Why couldn't they see the effort you made to bring the kids? You didn't hurt them, he did.

 

My dad has a better relationship with my kids than he does with me. If I wanted to I could keep them from ever seeing him for some of the crap he's done, but I make sure they have some relationship. Distance is a huge factor in how much they interact with him. I deal with the hurt with just him, not punishing everyone.

 

Families can be some of the most painful factors in our lives.  Sad :(

[Jean in Newcastle]

 

We got a text from her yesterday saying "oh, the game isn't until after the party after all so it's all perfectly fine."  Seriously!  You can't check times BEFORE asking people to move around times?!?!

 

Which proves the point in my mind, that she thinks of you as a safe person to work all this out with on the fly.  The question the other day was an attempt to find out options.  Now she's gone home, looked at the calendar etc. and is getting back to you.  It's messy.  It's life.  It's family. 

[ChocolateReignRemix]

Unfortunately, no. That would be fun for the kids. The place they're having her party is just a run of the mill sports bar with lots of TVs and tables. Nothing for the kids to do except sit around, eat and watch the adults watch the game.

 

We would have tried to find another date, but the week before her party is Easter weekend, the weekend before that is my nieces's party and the weekend we're doing it is the first in April, I assumed March Madness would be over by April. Apparently I was wrong.

 

We got a text from her yesterday saying "oh, the game isn't until after the party after all so it's all perfectly fine." Seriously! You can't check times BEFORE asking people to move around times?!?!

NCAA tournament times sometimes have a preliminary listing and the times get changed later. Newspapers/sports websites often will list the preliminary time without indicating that it is not official.

[Butter]

Anyone can tell from my screen name and avatar how I feel about March Madness.

 

It took me about a minute and a half to figure out what Jyhwk meant and even then I wasn't sure until the end of your post and discovered a university (KU is Kansas???) has Jayhawks as their mascot.  I vaguely have heard of March Madness.  It has something to do with college basketball?  I always thought it was some professional sport.  If I had to guess what your username meant I'd actually guess you had children with letters beginning with J, Y, H, W, and K!  So, no, not anyone lol  It's kind of fascinating how based on what we are into things would be obvious - or not - to our brains.

 

Seriously, that's how little I know about sports.  Except the Spurs.  Because they are awesome.  (We have rabbit ears so we can watch them in the final game or two... if we think about it...)

[Jyhwkmama]

It took me about a minute and a half to figure out what Jyhwk meant and even then I wasn't sure until the end of your post and discovered a university (KU is Kansas???) has Jayhawks as their mascot.  I vaguely have heard of March Madness.  It has something to do with college basketball?  I always thought it was some professional sport.  If I had to guess what your username meant I'd actually guess you had children with letters beginning with J, Y, H, W, and K!  So, no, not anyone lol  It's kind of fascinating how based on what we are into things would be obvious - or not - to our brains.

 

Seriously, that's how little I know about sports.  Except the Spurs.  Because they are awesome.  (We have rabbit ears so we can watch them in the final game or two... if we think about it...)

 

 

My heart weeps for you.  ;)

 

Yes, KU is the University of Kansas Jayhawks

 

March Madness is the annual NCAA basketball tournament that has been played since 1939.

[zoobie]

Which proves the point in my mind, that she thinks of you as a safe person to work all this out with on the fly.  The question the other day was an attempt to find out options.  Now she's gone home, looked at the calendar etc. and is getting back to you.  It's messy.  It's life.  It's family. 

 

I agree that normal, sane family would do this. Her ILs from the Christmas incident she shared didn't seem to fall into that category. ;)

[heartlikealion]

It took me about a minute and a half to figure out what Jyhwk meant and even then I wasn't sure until the end of your post and discovered a university (KU is Kansas???) has Jayhawks as their mascot.  I vaguely have heard of March Madness.  It has something to do with college basketball?  I always thought it was some professional sport.  If I had to guess what your username meant I'd actually guess you had children with letters beginning with J, Y, H, W, and K!  So, no, not anyone lol  It's kind of fascinating how based on what we are into things would be obvious - or not - to our brains.

 

Seriously, that's how little I know about sports.  Except the Spurs.  Because they are awesome.  (We have rabbit ears so we can watch them in the final game or two... if we think about it...)

 

lol I didn't even get that far with her username. I just glanced at it and thought, "what?". When I saw the image I didn't think anything til I kept reading and knew it was a mascot.

[heartlikealion]

Which proves the point in my mind, that she thinks of you as a safe person to work all this out with on the fly.  The question the other day was an attempt to find out options.  Now she's gone home, looked at the calendar etc. and is getting back to you.  It's messy.  It's life.  It's family. 

 

While this is probably true, it also screams to me, "not a detail-oriented person" lol. Next, she could say her team isn't even playing that day. And that would have been really obnoxious if the OP had moved the party.

 

[brett_ashley]

NCAA tournament times sometimes have a preliminary listing and the times get changed later. Newspapers/sports websites often will list the preliminary time without indicating that it is not official.

If I recall correctly, semifinal games are always prime time. One will be at 6 and one will be at 8cst. Or 7 and 9p.

[almondbutterandjelly]

It took me about a minute and a half to figure out what Jyhwk meant and even then I wasn't sure until the end of your post and discovered a university (KU is Kansas???) has Jayhawks as their mascot.  I vaguely have heard of March Madness.  It has something to do with college basketball?  I always thought it was some professional sport.  If I had to guess what your username meant I'd actually guess you had children with letters beginning with J, Y, H, W, and K!  So, no, not anyone lol  It's kind of fascinating how based on what we are into things would be obvious - or not - to our brains.

 

Seriously, that's how little I know about sports.  Except the Spurs.  Because they are awesome.  (We have rabbit ears so we can watch them in the final game or two... if we think about it...)

Yeah, I looked at her username and thought something Homework Mama, and her avatar was a parrot.  I didn't get it.

 

I'm not a sports person.

[gardenmom5]

My fondest memory of march madness has nothing to do with basketball.
It was in seattle that year. some airhead eastcoast talking head was whining about coming here and "where will she get her Starbucks? ???

Huh. Where'd you think it came from honey?

 

eta: for those not aware of it -starbucks was founded in seattle. as was tully's, as was sbc.

Edited March 15, 2016 by gardenmom5

[I talk to the trees]

I haven't read through all of the responses, so forgive me if this has already been posted. Sil should have simply turned down your invitation with a simple "Sorry we can't make it." Choosing to skip the party for a sports event in which one is not participating is fine (even if I can't wrap my head around why someone would want to.) Asking someone to reschedule an event for something that is neither an emergency nor life-changing (another event such as a wedding, for example) is just plain rude, imo.

 

Op, I think you should have the party as scheduled, and enjoy the company of those who do attend, in the knowledge that they value time with you and your family more than they do some silly electronic device!

[AnnE-girl]

My heart weeps for you. ;)

 

Yes, KU is the University of Kansas Jayhawks

 

March Madness is the annual NCAA basketball tournament that has been played since 1939.

I only know about the Jayhawks because my cousin went to Kansas and likes a lot of Jayhawk/Bill Self articles on Facebook. I only pay attention to March Madness to be excited for her if the Jayhawks do well.

[8circles]

I am not a sports fan, unless it's my kid's team.  DH and some DS's are sports fans.  There is significant talk of March Madness (I didn't know what this was until I was married) and there are definitely plans being made to watch certain games.  It doesn't bother me in the least.

 

1st birthday parties are not a big deal, and besides the parents, I don't think kid parties are that big of a deal either.  We've had 1st birthday parties & not had 1st birthday parties.  We've had bigger kid birthday parties & not had bigger kid birthday parties.  

 

I do value family get-togethers.  

 

I think that if my sister asked how firm a birthday party date was, I'd consider it & try to accomodate.  But I don't have a sister who would ask this because of a sporting event.  I have a good relationship with my sister & I feel valued & feel like she values our relationship.  Her asking me is an indication that she feels comfortable asking me.  I would think it awfully rude for my brother to ask & would not try to accomodate.  My brother would also never do this because of a sporting event.  I don't have a great relationship with him and he doesn't value having one with me.  If he were to ask, it would signal to me that whatever event is more important than me.

 

I don't understand some of the comments in this thread, though.  I think having a hobby, passion, whatever, that you are invested in & finding your "tribe" that way can be very healthy.  I would never begrudge someone that.  I have a passion.  I understand.  But my passion has never interfered with my important human relationships.  Never.  & it could totally be the case that I just don't know a diverse enough group of people, but I've never seen this kind of importance placed on a so-called passion except with these extreme sports fans.  I say "so-called" because I think it's more than that in these cases.  It's obsession.  Being part of something is a great feeling.  Camaraderie is fantastic.  It isn't so great to make it obvious that other people aren't as important because they aren't part of it.  This is one of my biggest problems with these extreme sports fans.  So often they just end up acting really obnoxious.

 

& no, I don't think this is a "teenager judgyness".  It's regular old adult discernment resulting from behavior that I have observed.  In my life & experiences, this is how it has played-out.  YMMV.

 

Sports bars are not only for children.  There are many chains which almost cater to children or are at least appropriate for children.  My kids have been to them plenty of times.  I'm not aware of any sports bar where children are not legally allowed to be.  I live in WI.  Parents take their kids to bars all.the.time.  I've done it & neither DH nor I drink more than 1-2X/year.  I have no problem with a 4 yr-old's birthday party being at a sports bar - as long as it's actually an outing about the birthday girl & not an excuse to drink & watch sports.

[bolt.]

I think it varies by jurisdiction. Children (of any age) are not allowed to be in bars, lounges, or bar-and-grills of any kind in my province. I always thought it was normal. People here don't take their children to bars. (You can order drinks in non-bar eateries, but somehow the regulations must clarify what's an eatery-with-drinks-available, and what's a bar-with-food-available. I think calling it a 'bar' on the sign is one of the things.)

 

(Children aren't even allowed in liquor stores. And alcohol can't be sold anywhere but a liquor store. I was *shocked* the first time I saw alcohol at a gas station while travelling as a child. I was more accepting of seeing it in grocery stores, but some how gas stations seemed to imply a connection with driving that just really surprised child-me.)

 

Whatever you're raised with always seems normal, I guess.

[8circles]

I think it varies by jurisdiction. Children (of any age) are not allowed to be in bars, lounges, or bar-and-grills of any kind in my province. I always thought it was normal. People here don't take their children to bars. (You can order drinks in non-bar eateries, but somehow the regulations must clarify what's an eatery-with-drinks-available, and what's a bar-with-food-available. I think calling it a 'bar' on the sign is one of the things.)

 

(Children aren't even allowed in liquor stores. And alcohol can't be sold anywhere but a liquor store. I was *shocked* the first time I saw alcohol at a gas station while travelling as a child. I was more accepting of seeing it in grocery stores, but some how gas stations seemed to imply a connection with driving that just really surprised child-me.)

 

Whatever you're raised with always seems normal, I guess.

 

IDK, I wasn't raised here & I've lived in lots of places, not only the US, but this seems really normal to me.  It's the corner pub.  It's clear that it isn't like this everywhere, though.  

 

http://www.theatlantic.com/daily-dish/archive/2010/12/where-are-americas-corner-pubs-wisconsin/178942/

[heartlikealion]

I just want to repeat that the OP scheduled it in April and like her, I would never know that March Madness spilled over into April.

[8circles]

I just want to repeat that the OP scheduled it in April and like her, I would never know that March Madness spilled over into April.

 

No, nor would I.  But to some people it would just be another way of pointing out that some are on the outside.  "Duh, it's March Madness - how could you not know!  I mean, this has happened every year since 1928.  It's *so* important.  I mean anyone who has a clue schedules their whole life around this major event."

[gardenmom5]

I think it varies by jurisdiction. Children (of any age) are not allowed to be in bars, lounges, or bar-and-grills of any kind in my province. I always thought it was normal. People here don't take their children to bars. (You can order drinks in non-bar eateries, but somehow the regulations must clarify what's an eatery-with-drinks-available, and what's a bar-with-food-available. I think calling it a 'bar' on the sign is one of the things.)

 

(Children aren't even allowed in liquor stores. And alcohol can't be sold anywhere but a liquor store. I was *shocked* the first time I saw alcohol at a gas station while travelling as a child. I was more accepting of seeing it in grocery stores, but some how gas stations seemed to imply a connection with driving that just really surprised child-me.)

 

Whatever you're raised with always seems normal, I guess.

 

this is how it is/was here.  It's only recently grocery/other stores can sell hard liquor.  (costco was actually behind that.)

 

but there is still a difference between a bar that serves food (no one under 21), and a restaruant that serves booze.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Most bars and grills here will have a delineation between the actual bar place (which has signs posted saying that minors are not allowed) and the dining area where minors are allowed. 

[catz]

Most bars and grills here will have a delineation between the actual bar place (which has signs posted saying that minors are not allowed) and the dining area where minors are allowed. 

 

 

:iagree:   Most of the sports bars in my area are very oriented to family dining offering kids eat free nights and children's menus.  So that's not weird to me at all.  There are times during my kids childhood where they might have said a sports bar was their favorite restaurant.   I'm also in the upper midwest.

[goldberry]

Which proves the point in my mind, that she thinks of you as a safe person to work all this out with on the fly.  The question the other day was an attempt to find out options.  Now she's gone home, looked at the calendar etc. and is getting back to you.  It's messy.  It's life.  It's family. 

 

Asking someone to change a time for something to accommodate you, when you don't even know if it is necessary or not, is not just "family".  That's rude, no matter who you are dealing with.

 

And yes,  I do have people close enough to me that I have on occasion, when there was no way to avoid it, suggested that I might be available another time if it fit their schedule. Not even checking before you ask someone to change plans is either laziness or lack of respect, whatever the family culture is.

 

ETA, this does sound a bit snippy, but I have been puking and too tired to rewrite... stomach bugs suck!  Carry on..

Edited March 16, 2016 by goldberry

[Farrar]

I keep thinking about this.

 

I think being a good family member is really about the totality of how you act and not about individual acts. It's about building a relationship that has flexibility and understanding both ways. It's so weird to me that some people are so quick to judge that they must be "ridiculous" and bad based on two small examples - a request to move a party and a party at a sports bar - both of which have multiple interpretations and takes. Neither of those things rise to anything near "bad family" to me. I am definitely okay with people choosing a hobby over family sometimes, which is why it's about the totality and not one thing. Even the OP's response, which I thought was rude, doesn't really rise to that for me. Family should be so much more forgiving. Of course, it sounds like this family doesn't have that understanding and flexibility at all and the OP honestly doesn't sound like she wants to work on it.

[bolt.]

Most people are *additionally* taking the swear-word name-calling, and other description(s?) of loosing their temper over not getting their way into account.

 

I'm sure asking (if it might be possible) to (maybe) change a party time for a nearly-reasonable reason... I'm sure that can be done well (respectfully, with consideration and kindness) in some families. The two small examples *alone* would not automatically be rude in every context.

 

However, it also really doesn't sound like these relatives are generally the respectful type; so that data gets incorporated.

[Farrar]

Most people are *additionally* taking the swear-word name-calling, and other description(s?) of loosing their temper over not getting their way into account.

 

I'm sure asking (if it might be possible) to (maybe) change a party time for a nearly-reasonable reason... I'm sure that can be done well (respectfully, with consideration and kindness) in some families. The two small examples *alone* would not automatically be rude in every context.

 

However, it also really doesn't sound like these relatives are generally the respectful type; so that data gets incorporated.

 

But the swearing was the mil. I don't think I'd blame sil for that? And the descriptions in the OP were just that they were "ridiculous" and she was fed up with them. To me, that's not data - that's her emotions about the situation. Which, of course, she's entitled to. I get that everyone is reacting to that. Maybe there were previous threads that I missed.

 

But I wonder what people would say if we had sil on here instead saying, I'm so fed up with this other part of the family, blah blah blah.

[catz]

I have zero problem with the party at a sports bar.  People can entertain how they want, invite who they want, and people can accept or decline accordingly.  A child's birthday doesn't have to be 150% designed and oriented around the explicit desires of the child IMO.  I am big on the low key birthday as is.  There are years I could have seen us doing this.  When we bother to celebrate my kids birthdays with my side of the family we often just hook up at a restaurant.   

 

On asking for flexibility on the game, I can totally see how some close relationships are totally fine with this.  Especially if you're having a small just family type of gathering.  Many of my family gatherings end up with a football game on.  My FIL often has golf on at DH's family gatherings.   When we're doing just family oriented gatherings we might e-mail everyone with a choice of a few dates to see what generally works well for people and we accommodate as well as we can. 

 

If it's a larger scale event with more than just grandparents, aunts, uncles on one side of the family coming, I do find a bit rude to ask.  Especially if you know the inviter isn't really the sports type and probably wouldn't throw a party oriented to that.  I do see a difference between getting an invite from a sibling or inlaw that says "hey - are you all available the 21st or 22nd to celebrate with mom and dad and us?" which opens a discussion and getting an actual invitation to something with clearly defined intent and timing.  I don't know how the OP originally invited the group, so I won't speculate. 

 

I'd be fine with a relative turning an invite down like this though and I really wouldn't care why.  Everyone can't make it to everything and life is too short to get bent out of shape about it.  For better or worse, I have pretty low expectations in this regard.  LOL. 

[fraidycat]

I think it varies by jurisdiction. Children (of any age) are not allowed to be in bars, lounges, or bar-and-grills of any kind in my province. I always thought it was normal. People here don't take their children to bars. (You can order drinks in non-bar eateries, but somehow the regulations must clarify what's an eatery-with-drinks-available, and what's a bar-with-food-available. I think calling it a 'bar' on the sign is one of the things.)

 

(Children aren't even allowed in liquor stores. And alcohol can't be sold anywhere but a liquor store. I was *shocked* the first time I saw alcohol at a gas station while travelling as a child. I was more accepting of seeing it in grocery stores, but some how gas stations seemed to imply a connection with driving that just really surprised child-me.)

 

Whatever you're raised with always seems normal, I guess.

It's like Boston Pizza. Restaurants with bars and tvs. Edited March 16, 2016 by fraidycat

[8circles]

I think it varies by jurisdiction. Children (of any age) are not allowed to be in bars, lounges, or bar-and-grills of any kind in my province. I always thought it was normal. People here don't take their children to bars. (You can order drinks in non-bar eateries, but somehow the regulations must clarify what's an eatery-with-drinks-available, and what's a bar-with-food-available. I think calling it a 'bar' on the sign is one of the things.)

 

(Children aren't even allowed in liquor stores. And alcohol can't be sold anywhere but a liquor store. I was *shocked* the first time I saw alcohol at a gas station while travelling as a child. I was more accepting of seeing it in grocery stores, but some how gas stations seemed to imply a connection with driving that just really surprised child-me.)

 

Whatever you're raised with always seems normal, I guess.

 

So, kids aren't allowed in Chili's?  Applebee's?

[bolt.]

So, kids aren't allowed in Chili's? Applebee's?

If you have kids, you are seated in the dining room. If you are adults alone, they ask you, "Dining room or bar?" There are no kids in the bar. The areas are physically separated.

[8circles]

If you have kids, you are seated in the dining room. If you are adults alone, they ask you, "Dining room or bar?" There are no kids in the bar. The areas are physically separated.

 

Huh.  Never seen that before.  Here, they aren't really separate.  I've sat in the "bar area" with my kids before and it isn't ever an issue.

[Joker]

If you have kids, you are seated in the dining room. If you are adults alone, they ask you, "Dining room or bar?" There are no kids in the bar. The areas are physically separated.

 

 

But, at least here, the dining room has seats right next to the bar. Many don't even have a wall separating some of the seating. 

 

I find this part of the conversation interesting. Where we live now, we can't sit as a family in the bar area of restaurants (although we can sit right next to them, see them, and hear them). I find it silly.

 

Where we've spent most of our time in several other states, we could choose to sit in the bar area if there were seats at any time of the day or night and with or without children. 

 

Heck, where I grew up in Texas my parents could take us to nightclubs with dancing and music. They could also order us alcoholic beverages even though we weren't 21. They did so for all of us on certain occasions and it was never an issue. 

[eternalsummer]

Our favorite pizza place (they had vegan pizza) in the last city we lived in, a midwestern suburb, had arcade games for kids and a bar for adults (not particularly separate, and of course they'd serve beer or wine to any table), and big screen tvs for games.  It was great.

 

When I was a kid in central TX (or maybe after I'd moved to southwest of Houston, not entirely clear) there was a similar place called the Sweet Mesquite (surely it is gone now, 20+ years later).  

 

I think what Bolt said about how you were raised is what you take for granted is the crux of the issue - for some people it feels really rude and inconsiderate and etc. to ask for a reschedule or to watch a sports event on TV for a birthday party, for a variety of reasons, and for others it just doesn't feel rude.  Similarly, it seems like for some people it's incredible that kids are not only normal inhabitants of bar/grills but might even like being there, while for me it seems pretty normal.  Hard to dismiss one's feelings about it either way.

[heartlikealion]

This thread is really eye opening lol. In my limited experience with sports bars you'd be lucky to find anything besides big screens. You might find a pool table. So it definitely doesn't sound like a place I'd imagine a child asking to go. I also don't associate Hooters with children, but I'm sure some families eat there (or could. I'm basing this off the movie Big Daddy so don't ask me if I know what I'm talking about lol). My family has eaten inside a casino with children before, so don't get me wrong, I know that places that seem like adult zones are not always strictly for adults (the buffets are quite popular for families and can be on another floor than gaming. None of us even gamble). Unless going to one of these places is the norm (or has happened at least once) for a particular family I would find them all strange places for a child to request. I'm agreeing that what you are used to colors your view on what sounds strange/plausible.

[SKL]

I will say that even if I did know it was March Madness season, that would not affect how I scheduled my kids' birthday parties.

 

I don't know how sports fanatics get things done.

[Bluegoat]

I think it varies by jurisdiction. Children (of any age) are not allowed to be in bars, lounges, or bar-and-grills of any kind in my province. I always thought it was normal. People here don't take their children to bars. (You can order drinks in non-bar eateries, but somehow the regulations must clarify what's an eatery-with-drinks-available, and what's a bar-with-food-available. I think calling it a 'bar' on the sign is one of the things.)

 

(Children aren't even allowed in liquor stores. And alcohol can't be sold anywhere but a liquor store. I was *shocked* the first time I saw alcohol at a gas station while travelling as a child. I was more accepting of seeing it in grocery stores, but some how gas stations seemed to imply a connection with driving that just really surprised child-me.)

 

Whatever you're raised with always seems normal, I guess.

 

It sounds like your province might be fairly conservative on this.  Our laws about kids in pubs and liquor stores changed years ago, maybe when I was in high school - they even have stickers at the liquor store these days for kids with their parents.

 

In fact you can always tell older pubs because they have no windows - they didn't want people outside to be able to peer inside and be influenced by whatever morally suspect behaviors might be going on inside. 

 

When my dad was in university, women weren't allowed in pubs.  There was one lounge called The Ladies' Beverage Room, where only women and men with a female escort were allowed.  Other than that, public drinking was male only.

[Bluegoat]

this is how it is/was here.  It's only recently grocery/other stores can sell hard liquor.  (costco was actually behind that.)

 

but there is still a difference between a bar that serves food (no one under 21), and a restaruant that serves booze.

 

Yes, in most places it is a different licence.  IN a restaurant, you probably are not allowed to buy booze without food.  There may be different rules about opening hours as well.  Here, bars can be open, IIRC, to midnight or one, but cabarets (a different liscence, no kids allowed) can be open until three.  Usually those are places with dancing, and not much in the way of food.

Edited March 16, 2016 by Bluegoat

[importswim]

SKL, on 15 Mar 2016 - 11:29 PM, said:

I will say that even if I did know it was March Madness season, that would not affect how I scheduled my kids' birthday parties.

 

I don't know how sports fanatics get things done.

 

 

I don't think that many (if any) of us sports fans are saying that nothing should be scheduled during March Madness or during any other sport event throughout the year. We're saying that we don't find it unreasonable, given the fact that the team that they follow are in the tournament and have a great chance at making the championship game, to ask if the day/time is firm within one's own family.

 

I think it's firmly established that the OP has other issues with the family and they are rude and selfish in general which is why I understand she perceived this as a slight. In most (or maybe just the ones I'm familiar with) healthy familial relationships being honest and asking about scheduling conflicts is something that isn't a big deal. If it becomes a repeated thing then I think it's a problem, but asking one time shouldn't be. I would never ask someone to change their wedding date, funeral date, or big group party date because of a TV sport event conflict, but I don't see 1 year old birthday parties on that level. Granted, my family all live overseas so that could cloud my vision on things. 

 

As with everything there's a balance. I'm sorry for those of you who have people in your life who are consumed by sport to the exclusion of all other things.

[SKL]

Come to think of it, I have a sister who will insist on being able to watch her football team play each game.  She used to babysit for my kids, and if I planned for her to take them on some outing, she would stiffen up and say, "that's during the ___ game!"  Which honestly, I found rather off-putting.  She would at times refuse paid work or insist on a work schedule that respected her football watching schedule.  And this is for a team that hasn't made the playoffs in decades.  It's not her only "passion" that needs respected, either.  It's a life-limiting choice to be so set on things IMO.  But, it's not my problem.  If she told me she couldn't come to one of my kids' events because of a fun / hobby passion, I would honestly not care.  But darn sure I wouldn't change the time for that.

[Jean in Newcastle]

It sounds like your province might be fairly conservative on this.  Our laws about kids in pubs and liquor stores changed years ago, maybe when I was in high school - they even have stickers at the liquor store these days for kids with their parents.

 

In fact you can always tell older pubs because they have no windows - they didn't want people outside to be able to peer inside and be influenced by whatever morally suspect behaviors might be going on inside. 

 

When my dad was in university, women weren't allowed in pubs.  There was one lounge called The Ladies' Beverage Room, where only women and men with a female escort were allowed.  Other than that, public drinking was male only.

 

Yes!  I had a great aunt who was quite bitter about being excluded as a woman.  Whenever we met, she would have us meet at Frederick and Nelson's bar and grill and would crow about us being allowed in there.

[Jyhwkmama]

Our favorite pizza place (they had vegan pizza) in the last city we lived in, a midwestern suburb, had arcade games for kids and a bar for adults (not particularly separate, and of course they'd serve beer or wine to any table), and big screen tvs for games.  It was great.

 

When I was a kid in central TX (or maybe after I'd moved to southwest of Houston, not entirely clear) there was a similar place called the Sweet Mesquite (surely it is gone now, 20+ years later).  

 

I think what Bolt said about how you were raised is what you take for granted is the crux of the issue - for some people it feels really rude and inconsiderate and etc. to ask for a reschedule or to watch a sports event on TV for a birthday party, for a variety of reasons, and for others it just doesn't feel rude.  Similarly, it seems like for some people it's incredible that kids are not only normal inhabitants of bar/grills but might even like being there, while for me it seems pretty normal.  Hard to dismiss one's feelings about it either way.

 

 

Did you say vegan pizza?   :wub:  :wub:  :wub:  :wub:  :wub:

[eternalsummer]

It is so good!  If you're around the KC area, it's called Waldo's and has a location I think downtown somewhere (? westport maybe) and one out in Lee's Summit (we lived in Lee's Summit).  It is glorious.

[38carrots]

I wasn't allowed into a completely empty bar, at noon, because I had a 2 week old baby in my sling, and you know, you can't go into a bar if you are under 18. My friend and I just wanted a burger and mineral water, which the bar did serve. Ha.

[Jyhwkmama]

I have never been there, but know it exists. Not very far away.

[Zinnia]

Come to think of it, I have a sister who will insist on being able to watch her football team play each game.  She used to babysit for my kids, and if I planned for her to take them on some outing, she would stiffen up and say, "that's during the ___ game!"  Which honestly, I found rather off-putting.  She would at times refuse paid work or insist on a work schedule that respected her football watching schedule.  And this is for a team that hasn't made the playoffs in decades.  It's not her only "passion" that needs respected, either.  It's a life-limiting choice to be so set on things IMO.  But, it's not my problem.  If she told me she couldn't come to one of my kids' events because of a fun / hobby passion, I would honestly not care.  But darn sure I wouldn't change the time for that.

 

I grew up in a college town in the SEC.  This seems perfectly normal to me.  :)  When I had jobs that worked weekends, we had to draw straws to take turns on the Saturdays with games.  It was assumed that everyone wanted to be off, of course, so we took turns.  It doesn't seem limiting to us, just sort of this fun thing that almost everyone participates in. 

 

Everyone I know with a fall wedding arranged for the wedding to be on the bye weekend of their favorite team, too.  Just seems like the right thing to do.

[shawthorne44]

You know, OP if I were in your shoes I'd be tickled pink not fuming now.   After thinking about it, but initially fuming.  

 

It is likely that she won't show.  Woo Hoo.   Win-Win.  

[FaithManor]

Come to think of it, I have a sister who will insist on being able to watch her football team play each game.  She used to babysit for my kids, and if I planned for her to take them on some outing, she would stiffen up and say, "that's during the ___ game!"  Which honestly, I found rather off-putting.  She would at times refuse paid work or insist on a work schedule that respected her football watching schedule.  And this is for a team that hasn't made the playoffs in decades.  It's not her only "passion" that needs respected, either.  It's a life-limiting choice to be so set on things IMO.  But, it's not my problem.  If she told me she couldn't come to one of my kids' events because of a fun / hobby passion, I would honestly not care.  But darn sure I wouldn't change the time for that.

You must be speaking of Detroit Lions fans. Must. Really. You can't even have a decent Thanksgiving meal around here with your dying and this will be his last Thanksgiving family meal ever relative because the Lions fans in the family don't care about anything but the Lions' game. Well that and you can't let your kids make a single noise when the Macy's Day parade is on. So basically the whole day is ruined and then when you suggest having the family get together on Friday instead in order to avoid the drama and allow the Lions and Macy people to enjoy their day, they look at you like you have a hole in your head because one should eat Thanksgiving meal on Thanksgiving Day, just on their terms apparently.

 

Sigh....

 

I have news for Lions fans. They stink. They have pretty much always stunk. They will continue to stink. They are the Titanic of football teams. Don't go down with the ship. Join us in the life boats, find another team, and be happy. :D  ;)