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Completed only half of Algebra 1 textbook, now what?


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My 9th grader worked all year on Algebra 1. He put in approx. 160 hours and has only completed half of the textbook. My plan was to have him work on it and catch up over the summer. However, he was hired to work at camp all summer so that's no longer an option. Plus, I don't want to discount the fact that he has put in enough hours for a full credit.

 

How should we proceed? Just start next year where he left off and move to Geometry whenever he completes Algebra? Work on both at the same time?

 

How do I show this on his transcript? What if it takes him all year to complete the rest of the Algebra? Is this the point where I need to move to a subject transcript?

 

ETA: He works very slowly due to his ADD which is also why we homeschool him. He is understanding the material. We require corrections to be made on all mistakes. DS has always hated math and has always struggled to get through it, not for lack of understanding, he just has to work so very hard to get there.

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Any idea why it seems to be so challenging? Was the curriculum a bad fit? Are there some basics that are shaky or missing?

 

Besides the transcript I would be trying to find out why he is having a hard time with Algebra and maybe try to target whatever specific areas of weakness or confusion he may have before attempting to continue forward. Otherwise Algebra II may be impossible.

 

Maybe Hands On Equations and The Key to ...series might help?

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Algebra is one of those classes where the credit granted is not about the hours spent (actually I would argue that hours spent is only a rough guide for any class and that the material covered is really what drives credit). I would withhold credit until he finishes the book and then give 1 credit for Algebra I.

 

I would also try to figure out what is taking him so long. If he is working independently, I would start working with him. If the resource you are using is a problem, I would think seriously about switching, but IMO the most important thing is to have him working regularly with a human if he is not already.

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160 hours doesn't seem like THAT much, honestly. <shrug>  If there are, say, 180 school days in a year then that's less than an hour a day.  If you include 'instruction', homework and studying - I'd speculate that PS kids probably spend 1.5-2x that on an Algebra class over the course of a year...no?  Sometimes it just takes longer.

 

 Certainly, though, I wouldn't move on to geometry till he's completed Alg1.

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My 9th grader worked all year on Algebra 1. He put in approx. 160 hours and has only completed half of the textbook. My plan was to have him work on it and catch up over the summer. However, he was hired to work at camp all summer so that's no longer an option. Plus, I don't want to discount the fact that he has put in enough hours for a full credit.

 

How should we proceed? Just start next year where he left off and move to Geometry whenever he completes Algebra? Work on both at the same time?

 

How do I show this on his transcript? What if it takes him all year to complete the rest of the Algebra? Is this the point where I need to move to a subject transcript?

 

To be completely honest:

 

1. We don't do credits by hours put in, but by skill / knowledge demonstrated;

 

2. The kids aren't allowed to work or volunteer until they pass all their classes.

 

But to answer your question directly, finish the book after work.

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Any idea why it seems to be so challenging? Was the curriculum a bad fit? Are there some basics that are shaky or missing?

 

Besides the transcript I would be trying to find out why he is having a hard time with Algebra and maybe try to target whatever specific areas of weakness or confusion he may have before attempting to continue forward. Otherwise Algebra II may be impossible.

 

Maybe Hands On Equations and The Key to ...series might help?

The first curriculum we used was a bad fit. We switched after just a few weeks. At that time we had him start at the beginning just to be sure he was understanding the material. I have wondered about The Key to...series.

 

Algebra is one of those classes where the credit granted is not about the hours spent (actually I would argue that hours spent is only a rough guide for any class and that the material covered is really what drives credit). I would withhold credit until he finishes the book and then give 1 credit for Algebra I.

 

I would also try to figure out what is taking him so long. If he is working independently, I would start working with him. If the resource you are using is a problem, I would think seriously about switching, but IMO the most important thing is to have him working regularly with a human if he is not already.

His biggest problem is ADD. He just works so very, very slowly. We require him to do corrections on any missed problems so we know that he is understanding what he's gotten through. My husband tries to work with him on every lesson. My son prefers to work on it alone.

 

To be completely honest:

 

1. We don't do credits by hours put in, but by skill / knowledge demonstrated;

 

2. The kids aren't allowed to work or volunteer until they pass all their classes.

 

But to answer your question directly, finish the book after work.

We feel that the credit shouldn't be earned in less the work is done. My feeling is that the book must be complete regardless of how long it takes. My husband feels that most of the text should be complete but time put in should hold some weight. Opinions were needed to help us decide how to proceed. Thank you for yours.

 

Because ADD makes school work such a long process for our son we have not limited his outside work or activities based on getting school work done. He works 8-9 hours a day on school then we let him move on to other things. Plus, he is such a homebody we were shocked (and pleased) that he was interested in summer camp. He is gone for 6 weeks so work will continue when he gets home.

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160 hours doesn't seem like THAT much, honestly. <shrug>  If there are, say, 180 school days in a year then that's less than an hour a day.  If you include 'instruction', homework and studying - I'd speculate that PS kids probably spend 1.5-2x that on an Algebra class over the course of a year...no?  Sometimes it just takes longer.

 

 Certainly, though, I wouldn't move on to geometry till he's completed Alg1.

I agree that 160 hours isn't that much. In my mind I was thinking it would become 320 hours to complete if he continues to work at the current rate. At which point I worry...because this isn't "normal"...his life will be over??...because I'm a mom and that's what we do?  :confused1:

 

"Sometimes it just takes longer." That sounds very wise. Maybe it could be my math mantra?

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Some schools have Algebra 1 A, and Algebra 1 B, over two years. I'd probably do that, if he can't do it over the summer. 

 

I ended up doing this for ds. We had finished more than half of the concepts the first year, but he needed another year to solidify skills. He's not ADD, but worked slowly in math at that point. 

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I agree that 160 hours isn't that much. In my mind I was thinking it would become 320 hours to complete if he continues to work at the current rate. At which point I worry...because this isn't "normal"...his life will be over??...because I'm a mom and that's what we do?  :confused1:

 

"Sometimes it just takes longer." That sounds very wise. Maybe it could be my math mantra?

What are your DS' long term goals?  He needs to fully understand the "heart" of the material before moving on. He does not have to solve every challenge problem correctly.

 

see

http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/555480-gentle-but-thorough-algebra-1/

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I have a son that shuts down with the "school work completed before work or social life" approach.  He gets so far behind that he's overwhelmed, then ends up just hanging out in his room accomplishing nothing.  That doesn't seem healthy.  So I understand how that approach doesn't work for every kid.  In your situation, I would encourage the job at camp, too.  My son, a junior, did not finish his math curriculum either this year.  We were doing PreCalculus, but we basically had to go back and solidify some Algebra skills.  So kudos to you for taking care of that now.  In our situation, we will continue to work on math throughout the summer (around camp and work experiences).  The goal is to finish 3/4's of the curriculum, call it Trigonometry on the transcript, and call next year PreCalculus/Calculus, depending on how far he gets.

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My dd's school has an Intro to Algebra class and a separate Algebra class.  Maybe you could do that?

 

What textbook are you using?  That might make a difference.  For instance, my dd used a Pre-Algebra textbook at her private school, and they only got through Chapter 8 by the end of the year.  I don't think it was even half the book.  The book was HUGE.  Maybe your book is huge and your ds doesn't need to do all of it?  Knowing which textbook he's using will help the Hive advise you.

 

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He must not proceed until he completes all of Algebra 1.  Everything is based on Algebra 1.  Possibly you can find something that helps him, like Khan Academy or Tablet Class or something else?  Maybe a different textbook?  A sound understanding of Pre Algebra and Algebra 1 are required. GL

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My current 9th grader missed 14 weeks of school this year for illness (and just went down again with something new this morning....UGH!!!).  She is still cognitively impaired from the long illness. She was in chapter 7 of Foerster's Algebra I when she got sick. When we restarted, we found that we had to go back, a couple of CHAPTERS back, in the text because with only 7 chapters completed, she hadn't mastered the material.

 

We are working on algebra all summer, but I think she'll be at chapter 9 out of 14 by the end of summer. I'm skipping a short chapter on probability and probably the 14th chapter (few public schools gets that far).

 

Our plan is to continue algebra I until she finishes it and then move to geometry.  Hopefully, by the end of NEXT summer, she will be caught up.  If she gets really sick again, though, we will end up postponing graduation for a year.

 

For our transcript, we will switch hers to be a transcript that just lists "courses completed" unassociated with grade. Hopefully, for math, hers will read Algebra I, Geometry, Algebra II, Pre-Calc.

 

You've received some great advice about assessing what makes him work so slowly. Might it work to split math class into two parts so that it doesn't seem as long for him?

 

Best of luck!!  And in the end, when he's 25, will anyone care that he took 1.5 to 2 years to complete Algebra I?  Thankfully, no!

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I did not realize he had ADD. In that case I would make exceptions to the don't pass, don't do extra rule. But I wouldn't abandon it.

 

That said, he is going to have to learn to cope. In high school he should be preparing the necessary coping mechanisms to get through college. If you have not been successful up to now in helping him find ways to just get it done, then in my opinion you would be very well served to help him find an excellent occupational therapist who excels in helping ADD kids prepare for college workloads.

 

Finally, your son isn't progressing slowly, he's doing half the work, if that's really all the time he spent on it. So that's good, right? It means he's not slow, he just needs to work more.

 

My stepdaughter had to finish Algebra in about 320 hours. She does not have ADD and scores far above average on nationwide assessment tests. Math is not her favorite subject. :) She just went to class every day (50 minutes) and studied at home (30 - 120 minutes, average about 60) until she got through the homework and went to the school's tutorial once a week or so to get help on the hard problem sets (60 minutes).

 

So I don't get why your son should only have to spend 180 hours. That approach will not serve him well in college, not even community college with accommodations.

 

I am kind of amazed at the willingness to give credit without finishing the material. I don't mean ktgrok's suggestion of Algebra A and B, which sounds like the right solution. Our public schools would get raked over the coals for just finishing half the curriculum and then awarding credit. I guess my question would be, how much do they have to do to get credit on a transcript?

 

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I really have nothing to add that you haven't already been told. However, my SIL is a high school math teacher. She teachers Algebra 1A and 1B and the kids get a full credit for each class. The school divides Algebra 2 the same way for those who are not able to pass it at standard pace. 

 

So, my answer is finish the course before moving on. Credit it as you see fit.

 

That said, I would increase the amount of time you require him to spend on math each day though. An hour is a minimum. Through high school, ds who has multiple LDs, never spent less than 90 min and at times 2 hours per day on math. If math takes him a long time because of his ADD, then it is important that he prioritize it and spend the time necessary.

 

I think this is more "normal" than you think. His life will not be over because he has to work hard. He will be prepared and stronger for it. There are many kids who struggle and have to spend hours/day on subjects that challenge them. Sometimes on every subject. Encourage him to step up. 

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My dd's school has an Intro to Algebra class and a separate Algebra class.  Maybe you could do that?

 

What textbook are you using?  That might make a difference.  For instance, my dd used a Pre-Algebra textbook at her private school, and they only got through Chapter 8 by the end of the year.  I don't think it was even half the book.  The book was HUGE.  Maybe your book is huge and your ds doesn't need to do all of it?  Knowing which textbook he's using will help the Hive advise you.

We are using A Fresh Approach so not a challenging text but, thorough.

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I did not realize he had ADD. In that case I would make exceptions to the don't pass, don't do extra rule. But I wouldn't abandon it.

 

That said, he is going to have to learn to cope. In high school he should be preparing the necessary coping mechanisms to get through college. If you have not been successful up to now in helping him find ways to just get it done, then in my opinion you would be very well served to help him find an excellent occupational therapist who excels in helping ADD kids prepare for college workloads.

 

Finally, your son isn't progressing slowly, he's doing half the work, if that's really all the time he spent on it. So that's good, right? It means he's not slow, he just needs to work more.

 

My stepdaughter had to finish Algebra in about 320 hours. She does not have ADD and scores far above average on nationwide assessment tests. Math is not her favorite subject. :) She just went to class every day (50 minutes) and studied at home (30 - 120 minutes, average about 60) until she got through the homework and went to the school's tutorial once a week or so to get help on the hard problem sets (60 minutes).

 

So I don't get why your son should only have to spend 180 hours. That approach will not serve him well in college, not even community college with accommodations.

 

I am kind of amazed at the willingness to give credit without finishing the material. I don't mean ktgrok's suggestion of Algebra A and B, which sounds like the right solution. Our public schools would get raked over the coals for just finishing half the curriculum and then awarding credit. I guess my question would be, how much do they have to do to get credit on a transcript?

I had no intention of awarding him a full Algebra 1 credit without having him complete the work. My questions were more to find out how to show on his transcript that he was working on a math credit during his 9th grade year though he didn't finish it. He will be awarded Algebra 1 once he earns it, as of now he has not, which is why I asked if a subject transcript makes more sense in this situation or if there were other options. Labeling this year Intro to Algebra/Algebra 1A seems fair to me.

 

I understand your concern about preparing him for a college load. I felt that way too so I scheduled 7.5 credit hours for this year. That was way too much for him. It is also why he didn't work longer hours on his math. Had I been more realistic he would have had the time to work 2 hours a day on Algebra. Hindsight and all that...

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:iagree: SWB and Lee Binz have both addressed this exact situation in recent online webinars, and they both recommend doing exactly that for a student that is working hard but progressing slowly through algebra. They also both award credit based on hours spent on a subject, not on completing a textbook, with anything between 120-180 hours being worthy of a full year's credit.

Thank you for this. This is exactly the information I am looking for because he has not earned the Algebra 1 credit but, he has been working on math all this year.

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That's actually a mishearing...

 

A student should be awarded high school credit for spending over 120 hours on a subject...but NOT for Algebra I, Geometry, and Algebra II. You can only award a high school credit for those subjects once they're finished.

 

What I actually said was: if a student completes Algebra 1 in less than 120 hours, you can still award a high school credit, because the required (set) amount of material has been covered.

 

Those courses need to be completed before a credit can be given.

 

Happy to clarify as needed.

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Regarding moving things along with kids with attention issues....

 

One thing I've found to work well is for me to sit across the room with the solutions manual and have the kid tell me what answer he got after doing each problem. It gives immediate feedback which can be motivating and it prevents the doing a bunch of problems the same wrong way syndrome. I can usually give hints from afar as well if needed but first they have to make a good try to correct the problem themselves.

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Regarding moving things along with kids with attention issues....

 

One thing I've found to work well is for me to sit across the room with the solutions manual and have the kid tell me what answer he got after doing each problem. It gives immediate feedback which can be motivating and it prevents the doing a bunch of problems the same wrong way syndrome. I can usually give hints from afar as well if needed but first they have to make a good try to correct the problem themselves.

 

Yes! We've done this with my son and it is HUGELY helpful. Now we use Teaching Textbooks, with automatic grading, which has the same effect. Hugely motivating, and prevents careless mistakes. 

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I really have nothing to add that you haven't already been told. However, my SIL is a high school math teacher. She teachers Algebra 1A and 1B and the kids get a full credit for each class. The school divides Algebra 2 the same way for those who are not able to pass it at standard pace. 

 

So, my answer is finish the course before moving on. Credit it as you see fit.

 

That said, I would increase the amount of time you require him to spend on math each day though. An hour is a minimum. Through high school, ds who has multiple LDs, never spent less than 90 min and at times 2 hours per day on math. If math takes him a long time because of his ADD, then it is important that he prioritize it and spend the time necessary.

 

I think this is more "normal" than you think. His life will not be over because he has to work hard. He will be prepared and stronger for it. There are many kids who struggle and have to spend hours/day on subjects that challenge them. Sometimes on every subject. Encourage him to step up. 

 

:iagree:

 

I think you have two different questions.  One is what do you have him do going forward in math.  I think that he needs to work through the rest of the material in algebra 1 before moving on to geometry.  I think that it is good that you make sure he understands the problems he got wrong, but you might consider not having him rework every single problem he gets wrong.  Try to make a distinction between things he doesn't understand, things he is habitually careless in (negative signs, multiplying every term on both sides times the same number when cancelling, etc) and places where he just made a mistake.  

 

So for example I wouldn't make my kid totally rework a problem if he carried wrong.  But if he's not showing work or is dropping negative signs, then he would be reworking it.

 

With my sons, I've often found that they just aren't ready for wholly independent work on math and their ability to self-propel declined a lot at age 13, before bouncing back around 14-15.  I learned to knit so that I could sit with them at the table and help keep them on task, but not be asking them every few seconds if they were done with a problem.  At other times I worked through the problems alongside them.

 

When they were struggling with a subject, they did not have the option of saying they didn't like the way I wanted them to work.  Preferring to be alone in a bedroom, having music on, not having me nearby, etc were benefits of diligence and doing well.  If I thought that something had become a distraction, then the distraction was removed until they were back on track.  (I had to be very picky about work on the computer around this age, because it is so very easy to get distracted and lose the sense of elapsed time.)  

 

We also spend around 2 hours a day on math.  90 min on a good day.  It took about 45-60 min to work through the new concept and then another 45-60 min to do the end of lesson problem set.  Math isn't a passive subject that a student can just read and understand.  They really need to be working through problem sets, struggling through them, trying something and then trying something else.  [FWIW, I'm teaching algebra for the second time to my youngest.  I'm seeing things in the book that I don't remember understanding when I went through the same book a couple years ago.  I even found myself working the same problem differently within the same hour last week (the second time was more concise and elegant than the first time).

 

The question of how much credit is granted is an administrative question that I think is separate from the issue of if he needs to finish the algebra (or most of it).

 

Don't lose heart, either of you.  It's not a race.  Development isn't linear.

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I had no intention of awarding him a full Algebra 1 credit without having him complete the work. My questions were more to find out how to show on his transcript that he was working on a math credit during his 9th grade year though he didn't finish it. He will be awarded Algebra 1 once he earns it, as of now he has not, which is why I asked if a subject transcript makes more sense in this situation or if there were other options. Labeling this year Intro to Algebra/Algebra 1A seems fair to me.

 

I understand your concern about preparing him for a college load. I felt that way too so I scheduled 7.5 credit hours for this year. That was way too much for him. It is also why he didn't work longer hours on his math. Had I been more realistic he would have had the time to work 2 hours a day on Algebra. Hindsight and all that...

 

I hear what you are saying.

 

I thought others were encouraging you to give credit for Algebra 1 without finishing the material.

 

I think having the minimum load so he can spend more time on hard classes is an excellent strategy.

 

In college, if he takes 3 classes, the minimum full-time (in our system anyway) and makes sure it's one easy, one medium, and one hard/time-intense and really focuses that should be do-able.

 

I also agree that two years for algebra is just fine. I just don't think it's okay to skip or skim.

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Some schools have Algebra 1 A, and Algebra 1 B, over two years. I'd probably do that, if he can't do it over the summer. 

 

Agreeing with this.  After learning that this is a typical track at our local high school, I gave my dd one credit for Alg I A and another credit the following year for Alg I B.  She completed a curriculum the first year, but I was dissatisfied with her retention and knew it was in her best interest to ground her skills.

 

The colleges to which applied accepted it without question.

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I think you have been underestimating how much time students need to spend on math at the high school level.  In a traditional school, students spend about 150 total hours in class; many of those students will spend another hour or more on their math assignments.  So, completing all of the work for the course may take 300+ hours. 

 

As you go forward, you will want to think about how much time you are allotting for math, as well as for science.  Chemistry and physics are both math-heavy courses and may require a lot more time for calculations.  Many colleges do not require those courses, however.  Do some investigating to find out what is required at the colleges your ds is most likely to attend or wants to attend, and help him plan his time accordingly.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I would be a little more flexible on the "doing a problem over if there is a mistake" thing.

 

There's a difference between not understanding a concept and needing to re-work a problem after having gained more understanding vs. making a simple mistake in a calculation and having to redo the whole problem just so that it's perfect.

 

I would point out the mistake (ie. error with a negative/positive sign; incorrectly combining two terms; error in subtraction, etc.) without having him do the entire problem over every single time. Save your energy and his energy for the big concepts and the big gaps in understanding.

 

ETA I hope that I don't sound harsh.

 

I think you just revolutionized my entire homeschool for SweetChild. I promise you, she will be singing the tales of your glorious wisdom for many years to come. :hurray:

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

 

At other times I worked through the problems alongside them.

 

 

This is a powerful tutoring technique. Sebastian's entire post was great but I wanted to but sure that this one line gem didn't get lost in her overall message.  Sitting together and working the problems independently but at the same time is a great way to work through challenging problems.  Not only is the student enouraged by having someone in the trenches with them, they get an extra boost of confidence when they manage to work a problem correctly and the adult doesn't. I wouldn't make errors on purpose (the student would be sure to pick up on that!) but mistakes happen and it is good for the student to witness this in work besides their own. 

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This is a powerful tutoring technique. Sebastian's entire post was great but I wanted to but sure that this one line gem didn't get lost in her overall message. Sitting together and working the problems independently but at the same time is a great way to work through challenging problems. Not only is the student enouraged by having someone in the trenches with them, they get an extra boost of confidence when they manage to work a problem correctly and the adult doesn't. I wouldn't make errors on purpose (the student would be sure to pick up on that!) but mistakes happen and it is good for the student to witness this in work besides their own.

It does happen that I make mistakes. Often I just work things out differently, which is helpful too.

 

And it helps both of us see how long problems can/ought take. (I had to learn to knit to give myself something to do while I waited.)

 

Plus it can be kind of fun. I enjoy math a lot more now that I'm not getting a grade.

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My 9th grader worked all year on Algebra 1. He put in approx. 160 hours and has only completed half of the textbook. My plan was to have him work on it and catch up over the summer. However, he was hired to work at camp all summer so that's no longer an option. Plus, I don't want to discount the fact that he has put in enough hours for a full credit.

 

How should we proceed? Just start next year where he left off and move to Geometry whenever he completes Algebra? Work on both at the same time?

 

How do I show this on his transcript? What if it takes him all year to complete the rest of the Algebra? Is this the point where I need to move to a subject transcript?

 

ETA: He works very slowly due to his ADD which is also why we homeschool him. He is understanding the material. We require corrections to be made on all mistakes. DS has always hated math and has always struggled to get through it, not for lack of understanding, he just has to work so very hard to get there.

 

Pick up where he left off, for one algebra credit; start geometry when he finishes algebra. On his transcript, give him the credit wherever he finishes it, e.g., at the end of his sophomore year.

 

That he spent that many hours is not as important as the fact that he completed only half the book.

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Just a suggestion. Neither of my children had a great love for math work. The way I managed that is that I only assigned maybe 1/3 of the problems in the book selected from various difficulty levels. If they 'got it' we went on the next section. If they didn't get it, we worked on the issue and then I assigned some of the problems that they didn't do the first time around. I didn't make them redo their work but rather used their mistakes as a teaching tool so that they could try again to solve new problems.

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Were I you, and if you foresee this being an ongoing problem with your son, I would treat math as two subjects for the purposes of determining his course load. For example, if you wanted him to have six subjects each year, math would count for two slots. That way he has enough time to work on the course and get through the material in a reasonable amount of time. If he doesn't need Algebra 1A and 1B based on comprehension or other learning issues, and it's just a matter of working slowly, then double the amount of time he spends on math each day, breaking it into two work periods if necessary. I would do this so that he doesn't end up with a weak math transcript.

 

I would do whatever I could to facilitate him getting through the rest of algebra 1 and geometry by the end of 10th grade so he can resume a normal college-prep track, if that's what you're aiming for.

 

 

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