Breaking news on Fox... 17yo Bristol Palin is pregnant and will marry the father

[genie]

As a parent, I am horrified by the amount of gossip taking place in the news media and here regarding Bristol and the Palin family. In the spirit of "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you," I appeal to each of us to consider carefully how we would want our families to be treated in a similar situation before we engage in further discussion of personal family issues--particularly those involving minor children.

 

Believe me, I've done maybe a bit too much of that, and that's why I'm reacting as I am to it. I'm putting myself in the shoes of Bristol AND Sarah, and no matter how I try to see things, I can not bring myself to believe that accepting the VP candidacy was a good choice on Sarah's part, for her family and potentially for the Republican party.

 

I would NEVER want my daughter to be discussed like this. So I would NEVER have accepted the candidacy.

[SFP]

The spotlight of being the VP's daughter has nothing on the spotlight of being the biggest news item for many months in a small town.

 

 

 

This is what I don't understand. The Alaska press started speculating that Bristol was pregnant before she was pregnant.

 

Why on earth didn't Palin or her husband tell them to leave the girl alone? I have seen nothing to indicate that they tried to stop the rumors about their daughter. Have I simply missed their efforts?

[tibbyl]

And what percentage of sexually active teens who have been taught this do you suppose actually practice it?

 

I remember my sex ed classes. We were mostly rolling our eyes because we knew this stuff' date=' thanks. Knowledge does not equal actual practice. The same can be said for abstinence. Good intentions don't always win the day.[/quote']

 

 

I'm curious. Who taught you? Your parents? My mother was too uncomfortable to discuss such things. Most of my none-school sex ed came from reading Redbook magazine. In turn, I relayed the contraception information to other girls in our circle.

[KellyBelly]

I have not heard anything about him - if he's under or over 18.

[Kris]

With this post I request that the moderators close this thread and delete it. In my opinion, it is unworthy of The Well Trained Mind.

 

Hum -- while I agree there have been some comments that weren't exactly on point (not sure what her name has to do with anything) I've found this thread to be very interesting and enlightening -- and I don't usually read the political threads.

[5knights3maidens]

I'm jumping in here. Bristol NOT her mom slept with someone. Is now having a baby. She has her own will and she (and the young man) knew the consequences. Yes, 17 is old enough to know this whether she was taught about s*x from her parents, on the street, or in a school. She must deal with the publicity. Not her mom or dad or brothers or sisters.

I cannot follow all my children around making sure they do not do this or that but I can teach them and guide them. In the long run my children will do what "they" want to do and if they make a mistake they must deal with it. I might sound mean and cruel but that is life.

Bristol's mom does not have to stop and change her life for a mistake that her daughter made. She can be there for her, love her, and help her, but she can't live Bristol's life for her.

Also, with all this speculation about who's baby is who's and why they waited to tell, and this and that...ridiculous...this is just a way to get people to gossip, spread rumors, etc...

Ok, I'm done. Now I'll run! :auto:

[[email protected]]

I respectfully disagree. Aside from my silliness about her name, I think that this thread is yet another example of how people from VASTLY different political, religious, socioeconomic, and other backgrounds can discuss important issues with civility. You won't see a discussion like this on the liberal or the conservative talk shows. I'm so impressed with you all. Makes me wanna break out the big guns:

 

:grouphug:

 

We agree, so far. If politics are allowed, this topic is as well. Unless the rhetoric gets heated, the thread stays up. If you have questions, please read SWB's sticky at the top of the General board.

[Kris]

This is what I don't understand. The Alaska press started speculating that Bristol was pregnant before she was pregnant.

 

Why on earth didn't Palin or her husband tell them to leave the girl alone? I have seen nothing to indicate that they tried to stop the rumors about their daughter. Have I simply missed their efforts?

 

And do what? The press can be like a big dog with a bone. Say nothing, and you aren't supporting your kids. Speak up, and "thou protesteth too much."

 

Tell them to leave the girl alone? Okay -- but I doubt that would have made any difference and probably just added fuel to the fire.

[MyBlueLobsters]

I am officially stepping on my soapbox right now. I have been TRYING to stay away from this thread....I've been TRYING to just 'let things go', but I feel the time has come for me to say one thing.

 

While I have not read all 30 pages of responses, it saddens me that some people (in the media and here) assume that this is either a giant cover up of who Trig's mom really is or that Sarah Palin's integrity is in question because she chose to wait to announce her pregnancy for so long then handle the birth the way she did. Now, I did not know before Logan was born that he was going to have Down Syndrome, we never had any pre-natal testing, because the results would have not made a difference in continuing with a pregnancy. I have been ridiculed, made fun of, told I was the most selfish person for bringing 'something like that into the world', heard my son be compared to a dog 'someone that might be cute when they are little, but when they grow up they are ugly and no one wants them', I have had someone say to me 'all those r**ards (meaning people with DS)are good for is cleaning up my messes and mowing my lawn'. Whenever we go out in public, I get stares, whispers (and we hear...don't think that if you whisper about another persons child that they don't hear, because we do), I have had teenage girls see Logan then start acting mentally handicapped. The nurse the night Logan was born said in a very accusatory manner "Didn't you have the AFP test?". I have had people, GROWN PEOPLE, give me looks of disgust, and ask whom I expected to pay for him when he grows up. The termination rate of pre-diagnosed Down Syndrome is 90%......so to find out that your baby has it, and then choose to keep it is a BIG DEAL. Maybe she didn't want to have to hear these types of comments while she was pregnant, I know I wouldn't. I have had friends over 40, who have had a child with DS, having their decisions questioned since the rate increases with age. No one has any idea what it is like to hear these things about your BABY that you love more than anything. The living breathing human being who you would die for.....hearing grown people question their existence, telling you that 'your child will never live, they will only exist at taxpayers expense.....shame on you for bringing him into the world'. You have no idea what that's like, unless you've been a mile in their shoes. I do not fault for Sarah Palin keeping the pregnancy a secret until she was almost full term. It is devastating enough to hear those things being said about the miracle that is in your arms....but to be pregnant and extra emotional....no one should have to be put through that, politician or not. As for her choosing to go to Texas, while I might not have done it, it sounds like she not only had her Dr's blessing but his continued advice and support on the phone. I would have done almost ANYTHING to get back to my Dr when I was pregnant.

 

Now, I'm not saying that it is not possible that this is a huge cover up, I am not naive...I know that lies come from both sides. But to ASSUME that it is, because it sounds 'fishy' or that she didn't announce her pregnancy until later is just absurd. It really saddens me that there are people (and again I'm not referring to anyone specific) who would judge her character, as a woman AND as a mom, for not announcing that she was pregnant or that he had DS right when it was detected. It is a life changing moment....a defining moment for your family when you have a child with special needs. To be able to cope with that privately is VERY important before it gets shoved into the media's hands. JMHO

 

*stepping off my soapbox*

[Jill- OK]

I think that this thread is yet another example of how people from VASTLY different political, religious, socioeconomic, and other backgrounds can discuss important issues with civility.

 

...when someone makes a comment about how civil and great political discussions here are. (This isn't a judgement on your, well, judgement, lol, I'm just musing about a phenomenon).

 

I come away from reading threads like this with a sort of sick feeling. Honestly. I don't consider much of what I've read here civil at all.

 

Am I really that much of an idealist? Or does anyone else scratch their heads when someone comments about the civility shown on threads like this? (I'm not saying this one isn't much calmer than others have been...just that I wouldn't use the word 'civil'.)

 

ETA: I just want to be sure and add that I do consider many of the folks here to be class acts, that do exhibit respect for others that believe/live differently than they do. It's just that when I think of the overwhelming atmosphere of most of these threads, and the fact that so many that I would believe to be rational people (when talking about literature selections or spelling programs) seem to be really ready to bite into others at the drop of a political hat, that sort of overshadows the rest, I guess.

 

Sorry if it's just me. Don't want to rain on the parade. (Did that sound as Eyeore as I thought it did, LOL?)

[Beth in SW WA]

Are you implying that the bold portion of your statement is indicative of his preference that his girls have abortions?

It appears to me that he's saying he want his daughters to have enough information to make good choices and AVOID pregnancy and STDs.

 

I wouldn't want to speak on behalf of Obama. I don't know if he would encourage his daughter to have an abortion to avoid being "punished with a baby."

 

I'll leave it there.

[Academy of Jedi Arts]

I have been ridiculed, made fun of, told I was the most selfish person

 

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

 

NO ONE should have to hear the kinds of things that you did. How ashamed I sometimes feel that I belong to a species that could be so cruel.

[LNC]

It wasn't my intention in starting this thread to make anyone upset or sick. I won't read or post on this thread anymore. Thanks for the discussion! It helped me process this news and the implications for the election.

[Academy of Jedi Arts]

I wouldn't want to speak on behalf of Obama. I don't know if he would encourage his daughter to have an abortion to avoid being "punished with a baby."

 

I'll leave it there.

 

Maybe he would but I don't see how that is anyone's business and he certainly was NOT saying that in that clip there. He was talking about birth control.

 

I do understand that some people are against birth control and I respect their right to that opinion.

[LNC]

I am officially stepping on my soapbox right now. I have been TRYING to stay away from this thread....I've been TRYING to just 'let things go', but I feel the time has come for me to say one thing.

 

While I have not read all 30 pages of responses, it saddens me that some people (in the media and here) assume that this is either a giant cover up of who Trig's mom really is or that Sarah Palin's integrity is in question because she chose to wait to announce her pregnancy for so long then handle the birth the way she did. Now, I did not know before Logan was born that he was going to have Down Syndrome, we never had any pre-natal testing, because the results would have not made a difference in continuing with a pregnancy. I have been ridiculed, made fun of, told I was the most selfish person for bringing 'something like that into the world', heard my son be compared to a dog 'someone that might be cute when they are little, but when they grow up they are ugly and no one wants them', I have had someone say to me 'all those r**ards (meaning people with DS)are good for is cleaning up my messes and mowing my lawn'. Whenever we go out in public, I get stares, whispers (and we hear...don't think that if you whisper about another persons child that they don't hear, because we do), I have had teenage girls see Logan then start acting mentally handicapped. The nurse the night Logan was born said in a very accusatory manner "Didn't you have the AFP test?". I have had people, GROWN PEOPLE, give me looks of disgust, and ask whom I expected to pay for him when he grows up. The termination rate of pre-diagnosed Down Syndrome is 90%......so to find out that your baby has it, and then choose to keep it is a BIG DEAL. Maybe she didn't want to have to hear these types of comments while she was pregnant, I know I wouldn't. I have had friends over 40, who have had a child with DS, having their decisions questioned since the rate increases with age. No one has any idea what it is like to hear these things about your BABY that you love more than anything. The living breathing human being who you would die for.....hearing grown people question their existence, telling you that 'your child will never live, they will only exist at taxpayers expense.....shame on you for bringing him into the world'. You have no idea what that's like, unless you've been a mile in their shoes. I do not fault for Sarah Palin keeping the pregnancy a secret until she was almost full term. It is devastating enough to hear those things being said about the miracle that is in your arms....but to be pregnant and extra emotional....no one should have to be put through that, politician or not. As for her choosing to go to Texas, while I might not have done it, it sounds like she not only had her Dr's blessing but his continued advice and support on the phone. I would have done almost ANYTHING to get back to my Dr when I was pregnant.

 

Now, I'm not saying that it is not possible that this is a huge cover up, I am not naive...I know that lies come from both sides. But to ASSUME that it is, because it sounds 'fishy' or that she didn't announce her pregnancy until later is just absurd. It really saddens me that there are people (and again I'm not referring to anyone specific) who would judge her character, as a woman AND as a mom, for not announcing that she was pregnant or that he had DS right when it was detected. It is a life changing moment....a defining moment for your family when you have a child with special needs. To be able to cope with that privately is VERY important before it gets shoved into the media's hands. JMHO

 

*stepping off my soapbox*

 

 

Has anyone said that? I think most people are concerned with Bristol's crisis pregnancy being played out in the national media bc of her mother's decision to run for VP. The liberal blogs are spewing what you mentioned in your quote. I haven't seen it here. By the way, I have a profoundly disabled son from a genetic disorder. :grouphug:

[MyBlueLobsters]

"They're" saying that Bristol is 5 months pregnant, is that right?

 

And "they've" suggested that perhaps Bristol was actually the mother of Trig, who was born . . . 5 months ago, yes?

 

 

 

So, if Bristol is 5 months pregnant *now*, it would be impossible for her to be Trig's mother, correct? So, if SUDDENLY the Palin family announces that Bristol is 5 months pregnant, then that conveniently puts to rest the rumor that Bristol is Trig's mother.

 

It's all very, very convenient, and something doesn't add up. The only thing more convenient than the timing of Bristol's pregnancy would be for the pregnancy not to reach full-term, which is what I predict will be the next announcement (that Bristol has miscarried).

 

There have also been several posts about her ability to lead due to the way she handled her delivery. Again, I am not saying I think she handled it right....but it doesn't mean she will be a bad VP

[MyBlueLobsters]

oops, double post! sorry!

[Katrina]

Are you implying that the bold portion of your statement is indicative of his preference that his girls have abortions?

It appears to me that he's saying he want his daughters to have enough information to make good choices and AVOID pregnancy and STDs.

 

I agree...I don't see how an abortion would prevent against STDs.

[Crissy]

I wouldn't want to speak on behalf of Obama. I don't know if he would encourage his daughter to have an abortion to avoid being "punished with a baby."

 

I'll leave it there.

 

Okay.

 

My apologies if I misunderstood. It was the mention of Governor Palin's pro-life stance immediately following the quote from Senator Obama that caused me to wonder.

[Peek a Boo]

And I think a number here need to look in the mirror. I can easily find posts from many of you judging the actions of other parents on many fronts, like education, how they clothe their kids, feed them, letting them go to r-rated movies, etc.

 

It stings when someone you like or support is being judged, so maybe it will be something you can reflect on as you judge that mom who allows her daughter to wear a tub top, or another mom who thinks public school is just fine for her son.

 

EVERYONE makes judgements.

i happen to believe it is just fine to make judgements.

Discerning people make judgements all the time.

I think we do our kids a disservice by teaching them that judging is a bad thing --it sets them up to be hypersensitive when they experience judgement from others.

We are reminded all the time that we can make judgments and apply what we want to our own family w/o worrying about what other people think about our choices.

 

but yeah --EVERYONE needs to look in the mirror.

There are plenty of people from all walks of life who are convinced they hold the patent on what is moral and what is not. When i hear blanket statements about "Those Christians" it shows an ignorance that deplorable. The correct phrasing would be "Those PEOPLE" --there are PEOPLE that put themselves on pedestals and rail about issues from high horses all over the place.

 

and to combine a couple posts, when Obama says PUNISHED WITH A BABY he's making his beliefs pretty darn clear.

 

PUNISHED with a baby.

not burdened, not blessed, not even as a basic consequence, but as a punishment.

 

punished with a BABY.

not punished with an STD, not punished with the stigma, not punished with the knowledge you made a mistake, but punished with the presence of a child.

 

as I mentioned elsewhere --the more Obama tries to defend his actions, beliefs and words, the more i find his actions, beliefs, and words indefensible.

 

{but that goes for McCain too ;) }

[Kelli in TN]

...when someone makes a comment about how civil and great political discussions here are. (This isn't a judgement on your, well, judgement, lol, I'm just musing about a phenomenon).

 

I come away from reading threads like this with a sort of sick feeling. Honestly. I don't consider much of what I've read here civil at all.

 

 

 

 

Well, as one who LOVES a good rowdy, passionate debate about politics and political issues, I have to agree with you on this one.

 

I left the computer and got sidetracked by that whole homeschooling thing and came back and, wowza, this has gotten ugly.

 

To clarify my points in this thing. *I* would drop everything to support my daughter. Those are the family values of *my* family. Obviously we all work out for ourselves what is and is not important to our families.

 

The back and forth and criticizing one another for holding opinions and expressing them on a message board that Mrs. Palin will never read just beats all.

[Jugglin'5]

I'm curious. Who taught you? Your parents? My mother was too uncomfortable to discuss such things. Most of my none-school sex ed came from reading Redbook magazine. In turn, I relayed the contraception information to other girls in our circle.

Yes, my mother not only taught me. She mortified me by trying to put me on the pill, because she just assumed that I was sexually active, and I wasn't.:glare:

[Christy B]

I left the computer and got sidetracked by that whole homeschooling thing and came back and, wowza, this has gotten ugly.

 

The back and forth and criticizing one another for holding opinions and expressing them on a message board that Mrs. Palin will never read just beats all.

 

I'm not reading ugly, or critical. Not even between folks who strongly disagree. But that's what I find so interesting, and that's what I *don't* get IRL; discussions with widely different POVs; including one's POV as to whether the discussion is polite and civil (which I think it is) or wretched and mean (which obviously others think it is). So that's why I appreciate it here, and maybe that's why I choose to believe that people are making a sincere effort to be civil.

 

Mind you, I'm not trying to criticize your opinion. I'm just sayin'. :tongue_smilie:

[LibraryLover]

Funny this: I haven't posted the entire summer, but when I go to rep Jackie in AK, it says I need to spread the love.

 

So here I out my admiration:

 

Jackie, I think you are a wise, wise woman and I appreciate your thoughtful words & posting.

[Mrs Mungo]

Funny this: I haven't posted the entire summer, but when I go to rep Jackie in AK, it says I need to spread the love.

 

So here I out my admiration:

 

Jackie, I think you are a wise, wise woman and I appreciate your thoughtful words & posting.

 

You have to rep 30 people before you can rep someone again. It's not a time-related factor. :)

[Margaret in GA]

I want to say a few things about this Palin situation.

 

1). If she knew and didn't tell McCain, that was just wrong. And she knew. No doubt about that. She knew. Did McCain? That's the question.

 

2.) If McCain knew, it was really dumb to choose her. Why gamble on this one and lose the Christian conservative base that was the driving force behind this pick? And I mean, no one wants negative media surrounding their VP pick. Nobody.

 

Either way, one of them has serious judgement problems.

 

I believe she will take her name off the ticket.

 

Margaret

[Vida Winter]

I see the Palin family as going through a difficult time, but stepping up to the plate and taking responsibility for it. I see no serious moral failings there, in fact, just the opposite. Maybe it's not the most ideal time in her life to take on a big job, but at least her head is in the right place. McCain could probably have picked someone with less baggage, true. But I'd take Palin, even as President, on a bad day before I'd prefer either Biden or Obama on their best day.

 

~Dana

[Kathleen in VA]

I want to say a few things about this Palin situation.

 

1). If she knew and didn't tell McCain, that was just wrong. And she knew. No doubt about that. She knew. Did McCain? That's the question.

 

2.) If McCain knew, it was really dumb to choose her. Why gamble on this one and lose the Christian conservative base that was the driving force behind this pick? And I mean, no one wants negative media surrounding their VP pick. Nobody.

 

Either way, one of them has serious judgement problems.

 

I believe she will take her name off the ticket.

 

Margaret

 

I'm not sure I get why this would make him lose his Christian conservative base. I'm a Christian conservative and it doesn't change my mind about his pick at all. Why would it? She has a daughter who made a mistake, chose poorly and is paying the natural consequences. Her daughter has chosen to have the baby - that's a Christian conservative reaction to a mistake like this. Her mom is standing behind her decision to have the baby and to get married - that's a Christian conservative reaction. Her mom is happy that she is going to be a grandparent, even in less than ideal circumstances - that's a Christian conservative reaction.

 

I'm missing it - why would this make McCain lose his Christian conservative base?

[laylamcb]

Well, as one who LOVES a good rowdy, passionate debate about politics and political issues, I have to agree with you on this one.

 

I left the computer and got sidetracked by that whole homeschooling thing and came back and, wowza, this has gotten ugly.

 

 

 

As one who h-h-h-HATES confrontation, I just don't see the ugliness at all here. Let's review: This thread has covered the role of a woman vis a vis family and career, abortion, teenage pregnancy, parenting, politics...what am I leaving out? And yet no one has called anyone else a nasty name. Really, it has become sooo hard to have a discussion/debate with anyone anymore without it turning ugly. I think it's just amazing that we, who ultimately have nothing to lose by offending and insulting one another, remain so...polite and respectful.

[Jugglin'5]

You beat me to it, Kathleen.:):)

 

 

I'm not sure I get why this would make him lose his Christian conservative base. I'm a Christian conservative and it doesn't change my mind about his pick at all. Why would it? She has a daughter who made a mistake, chose poorly and is paying the natural consequences. Her daughter has chosen to have the baby - that's a Christian conservative reaction to a mistake like this. Her mom is standing behind her decision to have the baby and to get married - that's a Christian conservative reaction. Her mom is happy that she is going to be a grandparent, even in less than ideal circumstances - that's a Christian conservative reaction.

 

I'm missing it - why would this make McCain lose his Christian conservative base?

[Parrothead]

I see the Palin family as going through a difficult time, but stepping up to the plate and taking responsibility for it. I see no serious moral failings there, in fact, just the opposite. Maybe it's not the most ideal time in her life to take on a big job, but at least her head is in the right place. McCain could probably have picked someone with less baggage, true. But I'd take Palin, even as President, on a bad day before I'd prefer either Biden or Obama on their best day.

 

~Dana

:iagree:

She isn't the first and won't be the last teen to get pregnant and get married. For me this is a non-issue. The bigger issues of where the candidate stands on the economy, the environment, border security, etc. are what matters. Her, or any other politicians, family life doesn't matter.

[Andie]

I want to say a few things about this Palin situation.

 

1). If she knew and didn't tell McCain, that was just wrong. And she knew. No doubt about that. She knew. Did McCain? That's the question.

 

2.) If McCain knew, it was really dumb to choose her. Why gamble on this one and lose the Christian conservative base that was the driving force behind this pick? And I mean, no one wants negative media surrounding their VP pick. Nobody.

 

Either way, one of them has serious judgement problems.

 

I believe she will take her name off the ticket.

 

Margaret

 

 

I think that assumes a respect for the Christian conservative base that I'm not sure is there. I think watching Bush has emboldened McCain, frankly. Yes, he knows he needs them, but I think he also thinks they have no where else to go. Interesting.

 

I wonder about her bowing out. That was my first thought, too, but the more I consider it, the more I question whether it'll happen because I think they feel they can get through it. Can you imagine that a decade ago?

[laylamcb]

I think that assumes a respect for the Christian conservative base that I'm not sure is there. I think watching Bush has emboldened McCain, frankly. Yes, he knows he needs them, but I think he also thinks they have no where else to go. Interesting.

 

 

 

I agree with this assessment.

[sagira]

I usually don't comment on political stuff at all, but IMO this is a reality check:

 

Politicians live real lives, they are humans and they have problems just like all of us do.

 

I think it's wonderful they way she's handling it and how she and her family are a living example of pro-life and pro-family.

 

I recall Ms. Palin being pro contraceptives too, so it could have been that it didn't work as well.

 

And remember, the daughter is 17, not 13. Close to 18 enough :)

[sagira]

I usually don't comment on political stuff at all, but IMO this is a reality check:

 

Politicians live real lives, they are humans and they have problems just like all of us do.

 

I think it's wonderful they way she's handling it and how she and her family are a living example of pro-life and pro-family.

 

I recall Ms. Palin being pro contraceptives too, so it could have been that it didn't work as well.

 

And remember, the daughter is 17, not 13. She may even have her baby at 18. I think congratulations are in order here. Sarah Palin is going to be a grandmother! :)

[sassenach]

Warning: totally frivolous carping below:

 

I hope I'm not offending anyone here (oh, I really do hope I'm not!), but...BRISTOL?! :001_huh:

 

That's a place, not a person. I don't understand people's weird baby names.

 

I now return you to your regularly scheduled intelligent, thoughtful discussion....

 

This might be beating a dead horse, because I haven't read through the multiple pages on this thread, but I would love to see us raise the bar in this discussion. I'm sure you were just trying to break the tension or something, but it seems wrong to go down a road such as this.

[Jackie in AR]

Funny this: I haven't posted the entire summer, but when I go to rep Jackie in AK, it says I need to spread the love.

 

So here I out my admiration:

 

Jackie, I think you are a wise, wise woman and I appreciate your thoughtful words & posting.

 

:blush:Wow, Laurie, thank you very much. I appreciate your kind words.:blush:

[LizzyBee]

Plus, I am confused here. Aren't republicans usually Christians and consider themselves to have a higher moral ground than liberals?

 

I haven't read the whole thread, so this may have already been posted. As of 2007, 82% of Americans self-identified as Christian. I think that equates to a majority of both parties, not just Republicans.

[Kris]

Well, as one who LOVES a good rowdy, passionate debate about politics and political issues, I have to agree with you on this one.

 

I left the computer and got sidetracked by that whole homeschooling thing and came back and, wowza, this has gotten ugly.

 

I must have my rose-colored glasses on today! And I don't even remember dusting them off! :lol: I really am not seeing the "ugly" stuff. Must be why my face isn't red and my BP is still normal. ;)

[Margaret in GA]

I'm not sure I get why this would make him lose his Christian conservative base. I'm a Christian conservative and it doesn't change my mind about his pick at all. Why would it? She has a daughter who made a mistake, chose poorly and is paying the natural consequences. Her daughter has chosen to have the baby - that's a Christian conservative reaction to a mistake like this. Her mom is standing behind her decision to have the baby and to get married - that's a Christian conservative reaction. Her mom is happy that she is going to be a grandparent, even in less than ideal circumstances - that's a Christian conservative reaction.

 

I'm missing it - why would this make McCain lose his Christian conservative base?

 

What I said, was that it is a gamble. And it is. I agree that this is how Christian Conservatives would *reACT* (I'm also a Christian and pro-life and I'd *react* the same way) BUT in a perfect world (national politics), she wouldn't have to react. And this whole situation gives the non-believers out there opportunity with "I told you so"s (told you abstenence- only doesn't work. told you catholic schools are for bad girls. etc) That's got to wear down your base a little bit to have to endure that kind of scrutiny. Why not choose one of the many talented conservatives without controversy?? It's a GAMBLE. Why gamble with your VP choice? I've decided that he didn't know. For goodness sakes, he only met her one time before choosing her. She's got problems. He didn't know.

 

 

Margaret

[Andie]

I'm not sure I get why this would make him lose his Christian conservative base. I'm a Christian conservative and it doesn't change my mind about his pick at all. Why would it? She has a daughter who made a mistake, chose poorly and is paying the natural consequences. Her daughter has chosen to have the baby - that's a Christian conservative reaction to a mistake like this. Her mom is standing behind her decision to have the baby and to get married - that's a Christian conservative reaction. Her mom is happy that she is going to be a grandparent, even in less than ideal circumstances - that's a Christian conservative reaction.

 

I'm missing it - why would this make McCain lose his Christian conservative base?

 

Well, McCain isn't exactly dazzling much of the base as it is, and that is a loud backdrop to all of this. Traditional wisdom would be to get a bullet proof, electoral vote carrying running mate. There is already a contingent that believes a woman leading is unbiblical. There are those that, while okay with a woman leader, aren't okay with a mother of five young children not making them her full time vocation. With this revelation, the fact is there *will* be people that see her as a "failed" mother. There will be those that question the commitment she could offer the country while faced with such challenges personally. There will be those that question the commitment she shows her family with a job like VP. So, while her actions might be perfectly in step with how most of the Christian conservative base would themselves react, just her being who she is, in the situation she is in, will itself impact a portion of the base's judgement of her.

[Catherine]

if he is the person we dems hope he is, he won't attempt to make political hay out of this. Let's hope her getting pregnant before marriage is not used to judge the family or the mom.

[5kidsforME]

Quote:

Originally Posted by georgiagirl

I personally feel the liberals will not stop at anything to get what they want - The White House.

 

 

Gasp! No wonder the conservatives have been demonizing them for years and years.

 

Broadsweeping statement followed up by another broad sweeping statement. At least the first person said it was their personal feeling. SFP you are labeling all conservatives.

[SFP]

SFP you are labeling all conservatives.

 

Is that your personal feeling?

[5kidsforME]

[/i]

 

I disagree. We had the discussion on whether Edwards should keep running or not when his wife had cancer. A family crisis will *always* raise the question of whether or not a candidate should stay in the race.

 

Mrs. Mungo, can you really compare Elizabeth Edwards CANCER, (from everything I have read she will die in the next couple of years from it) to a teenage pregnancy? Pregnancy that is going to result in birth not death??

[Joanne]

Mrs. Mungo, can you really compare Elizabeth Edwards CANCER, (from everything I have read she will die in the next couple of years from it) to a teenage pregnancy? Pregnancy that is going to result in birth not death??

 

Mrs. Mungo is not comparing cancer to pregnancy. She's comparing the amount of time, focus, energy and resources a person needs to use to respond to life situations.

[5kidsforME]

Is that your personal feeling?

 

Here is your quote:

 

Originally Posted by SFP

Gasp! No wonder the conservatives have been demonizing them for years and years.

 

 

Yes you are labeling all conservatives. So no that is not my personal feeling that is my response to your direct quote.

[5kidsforME]

Mrs. Mungo is not comparing cancer to pregnancy. She's comparing the amount of time, focus, energy and resources a person needs to use to respond to life situations.

 

I am not trying to be snarky (really, I have such a hard time sometimes getting my feeling/tone across!) but how did you get all that from her post?

[Kay in Cal]

I think this situation does indeed reflect on her personal and political judgement. While I'm happy that she is choosing to support her daughter, and that the young man is apparently stepping up to the plate, obviously there was either supervision or information that were not provided. To provide abstinence-only knowledge to your child (and vote for such education for everyone's children) and then be un-involved enough to not know that they are sexually active at 16--IMHO that is a parental judgement problem.

[Mama Lynx]

[/i]

 

I disagree. We had the discussion on whether Edwards should keep running or not when his wife had cancer. A family crisis will *always* raise the question of whether or not a candidate should stay in the race.

 

Yes ... and I did question Edwards' choice. I stopped questioning it when I heard that Elizabeth Edwards was in favor of continuing the race. It's not the choice I would have made, but it's their family.

 

However, it's also a difference in kind. A cancer crisis means you are looking at something more serious, that takes more energy, and leaves you having to potentially having to focus on how a person wants and needs to spend her last days.

 

A teen pregnancy, when the teen is getting married, isn't nearly as time- or energy-consuming.

 

I am far more concerned about Trig, and how severe his issues are, and how they will handle that - but even so, it's their family, and they know best. I don't think a 17 year old's pregnancy is necessarily that much of a crisis.