Teen daughter advice...Long

[WagsWife]

First, please don't quote, because I will probably delete this later.

 

I need some advice for my middle daughter (13 will be 14 in Nov.) She is my "difficult" one. She has been difficult since the day she was born. She would not allow anyone to hold her except for me and my husband, she was too busy to say more than three word sentences until she was almost three, we learned very early that there were times her will was much stronger than ours...and that we would have to pick our battles or we would be battling 24 hours a day, which we tried and it. did. not. work. She makes *everything difficult.

 

She does not want to take on any responsibility, she will not do minimal chores (hers is the kitchen) without being told...and then she will do just enough to get by, even though she knows she is going to be called on it at some point. She is a bear to live with, everything is a bother to her. We try to hold her responsible while still showing her that we love her--I am quite sure that to her we are too hard on her. I really feel like we allow her to slide way more than we would allow the other two. We spend an obscene amount of time and money on sports for her. She is very gifted athletically and she wants to play...but she will not put in any effort outside of practice--she is just not interested.

 

She will not talk to us. From the time she was little you could tell that she was upset/mad about something, but she will refuse to tell you. We have tried telling her how important it is for her to talk to us, how much we want to know what she is feeling, we have tried forcing it out. Nothing works...there are times where she will give us something, but most of those times we are left with the feeling that she really did not tell us what the real issue is...she just told us something to get us to leave her alone. If she thinks we prefer _______A_______ she will always choose ______B_______. She is *extremely dramatic. My husband and I have prayed for her, cried over her, and have spent the vast majority of our parenting on her. She is *extremely dramatic.

 

Yesterday, my husband found her diary. He read it. I really do not want to discuss the fact that he violated her privacy. I know he did...he knows he did...at this point he does not really care, because we are worried about what is going on with her. In the diary there is really is not much to talk about...a few things we were not thrilled to read, but not too surprising for a teenager-especially one we know likes to push the limits of our rules.

 

However, the day before yesterday she wrote about Amanda Todd. We had actually talked about her the same day and I had stressed how important it is to tell parents, and that no matter how mad they thought we would be about something...no punishment, or grousing at them could ever be as bad as what Amanda had to go through. In her diary, DD mentioned how sad Amanda's story made her. She then went on to say that she thinks she (dd) is depressed, she does not like her body (she is not heavy...but she is a solid athlete), she does not think people like her (my older daughter and I think she is very well accepted. It actually surprises me how many people WANT to spend time with her, she not a social butterfly)...and lastly she mentioned that she has thought about cutting herself.

 

I am trying not to freak out. I know that we can never tell her that he read her diary, but I am not sure how to handle this. What I want to do, is to get her to a counselor yesterday! There is a small part of me that thinks this *could* be her being dramatic because of the discussion about Amanda Todd, especially since there is nothing in her diary that would suggest any of this until the other day. However, what if it is not? We have talked about counseling with her before, but we don't know how to do it without her feeling like we think something is wrong with her.

 

If this was your daughter what would you do? And please be gentle, because I already feel like we did something majorly wrong with her...I just don't know what.

[FeFe]

:grouphug::grouphug: I don't have any advice. I just wanted to give you a hug because parenting is so stinkin' hard. :grouphug::grouphug:

[justamouse]

:grouphug:

 

I am of the opinion, that even a whiff of suicide/self inflicting wounds is cause to run to counseling. I'd rather overreact and be safe. :grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

[ondreeuh]

My teen is a real grump and has become difficult to live with. I know that she is depressed, and that is a huge part of why he has no tolerance for us. Maybe your dd is so dramatic and difficult because she also struggles with depression. I would talk to her about counseling for that reason alone.

[fourisenough]

She needs help that you can't give her and nobody is to blame for it. She likely won't want to speak with a therapist or counselor, but she absolutely needs to (based on what you've shared). Prepare for her to be mad at you and for things to get worse before they get better. I don't see any need to mention the diary; sounds like there are plenty of other behaviors/emotions that are public knowledge which could be offered as justification (if any is needed).

 

At my daughter's high school this week a student (16 year old boy) committed suicide. I don't know the specifics, only that he was a very nice, smart kid from a good home. Depression and other mental health problems can happen anywhere, to anyone. Pretending it doesn't exist or isn't serious can have tragic consequences.

 

Good luck to your family and hugs to your daughter. You will get her through this.

[trlt]

I would absolutely have her in counseling. There is the possibility that she is being overly dramatic after hearing the story but what if she isn't? It's better to react than wait and see, imo. I wouldn't mention anything related to what you read. If you feel you need to give her a reason why you are having her in counseling I think you could give her anything from your backstory, kwim? Teens are very difficult and counseling could help tremendously. My son went to counseling when he was 13/14 and for the first could sessions he did not speak at all. However, he finally did open up to the counselor and later to us and it helped our relationship with him as well as helping him deal with feelings that he didn't understand or know how to handle.

 

My thoughts are with you and your family.

[Alphabetika]

BTDT, sort of. I second, third, fourth the advice to investigate the depression angle. I wish we'd done it much sooner. :grouphug:

[kalanamak]

I would take this seriously. I believe there are going to be copycats of A.T. given the HUGE amount of attentions she is getting for this.

[Mommy22alyns]

I really don't think you've done anything wrong by her. :grouphug: I would get her into counseling immediately, but don't beat yourself up.

[WagsWife]

Thank you everyone. I am not worried about stigma of counseling, I have always worried about what she will think. Will she think we think something is wrong with her? Obviously, we do now...but before yesterday we could not decide if it is her personality, middle child syndrome, or if our expectations are off because the other two are so easy. When I have talked to other parents who know her...they do not see what we do. They see a sweet, fun girl (and she is...but we see everything else too), so we have been left wondering if we were making more if it than there is.

 

Ok, so counseling. I am thinking that we should play it like we want help with our communication with her. She will hate it...but hopefully she will get over it?

[WagsWife]

I would take this seriously. I believe there are going to be copycats of A.T. given the HUGE amount of attentions she is getting for this.

 

This is EXACTLY what I am worried about.

[Katy]

My sister went through major depression as a teen. Three pieces of advice:

 

If she's been on any sort of hormonal medication, take her off of it. Both my sister and I were put on the pill at a young age to regulate constant and extremely painful periods that were causing anemia. It was fine for me, but for my sister it triggered her depression. To this day she gets depression if she goes on any sort of hormonal treatment. The only time in my life I've been depressed was in the weeks after my father died. My sister pointed out I'd changed the brand of the pill I'd been on the week before he passed and asked me to go off of it. I did, and within 3 days I was okay again. I was still grieving, but I was again in control of my emotions and able to get out of bed and function normally.

 

I would make sure she gets in to see a cognitive therapist. The reason I say that is that many kinds of therapy are not about getting better, they're about sitting around and endlessly discussing your problems. Cognitive therapy is about identifying where your thinking is wrong and changing the way you think. My sister said she got more help out of the first month of cognitive therapy than she did out of years of other therapy, where it almost seemed like the therapist was creating problems.

 

Encourage her to pursue a passion. Anything to make her get outside of her head and focus on anything else. Maybe it's a charity, maybe it's training for a race, maybe it's an artistic goal.

[catz]

My teen is a real grump and has become difficult to live with. I know that she is depressed, and that is a huge part of why he has no tolerance for us. Maybe your dd is so dramatic and difficult because she also struggles with depression. I would talk to her about counseling for that reason alone.

 

:iagree: I would just say you're worried about her behavior and mood and you want to see if there is a way she can be feeling better. :grouphug:

[Guest]

I suffered depression as a teen and your description sounds very familiar, although I was the classic "good" girl, which heightened my feelings of isolation. I now think my hormones were very imbalanced, because I can see the same tendencies now with perimenopausal hormone imbalances.

 

I agree with the others that it would be a big help if she could talk to a councelor. You have more than enough to go on without mentioning the diary. I would say, "We're very concerned because you are unhappy. It could be hormonal imbalance and we would love to help you find a little joy."

 

:grouphug:

[Ottakee]

I agree with counseling and following up on depression.

 

Also, if you have not done so, I would take her in for a full physical (not gyn type) with blood work, etc. Sometimes hormonal issues, thyroid, anemia, blood sugar issues, etc. can play a big role in behavior and those would need to be addressed first.

 

Fish oils can be very helpful for mood stuff and just overall health. We use the Country Life Omega 3 mood and they are quite reasonable.

[Bluegoat]

Well, I won't say I disagree with the others, because I don't. But I will say, there are lots of things teens think about doing that they wouldn't, in fact, ever do. And the feelings she is describing are in themselves pretty normal for teenagers.

 

I guess I think the real question for me would be how is she actually handling her difficult feelings? Teens do have over the top feelings for a lot of reasons, and they can struggle with them, but that doesn't mean they aren't actually coping with them.

 

And it would be really natural to write about those struggles in a diary and that wouldn't mean the teen wasn't coping either. It might be an example of coping. Especially if she is a person who manages stress by expressing it.

 

My reaction would be to say you need to talk with her and see how things are, but since you say she isn't likely to be open, that is not that useful maybe. On the other hand, if you say you want her to see a counselor, she might balk if she is really that contradictory, and I suspect she might be just as close-mouthed with that person.

 

I think I might instigate more, indirectly. Maybe see if you can have a natural discussion about teens that do things like cutting or whatever and see what she says. If you are having a lot of news about such things, it might be easy to bring it up when you hear it on the radio or whatever.

[TammyS]

I would make sure she gets in to see a cognitive therapist. The reason I say that is that many kinds of therapy are not about getting better, they're about sitting around and endlessly discussing your problems. Cognitive therapy is about identifying where your thinking is wrong and changing the way you think. My sister said she got more help out of the first month of cognitive therapy than she did out of years of other therapy, where it almost seemed like the therapist was creating problems.

 

 

I agree with this whole heartedly, particularly with a kid who is likely to see it as "you think there is something wrong with me". You really don't actually want a therapist who is going to encourage a lot of navel-gazing and over-dramatizing every emotional twitch that she has. You want someone who will help her accept her emotions and deal with them, rather than being overwhelmed by them.

 

I would also suggest the same for yourselves (you and dh) at the same time, but separately, and possibly with a different counselor.

 

In more practical terms, while it will definitely not solve everything, one strategy that I can suggest is to unplug yourselves emotionally from her emotional state. I'm not saying stop caring about her and having a normal level of emotional involvement, not at all. But when she gets dramatic and is having a teenage temper tantrum or other dramedy about something, try as hard as you can to stay emotionally unplugged from it. Just nod sympathetically, make a noncommital noise, and walk away (literally, find a place where you can't see, hear, or smell her - take up nighttime gardening if necessary). Walk away as many times as necessary, to a locked room if you have to. If you allow yourselves to participate in her drama there are two huge pitfalls:

 

1. You are losing perspective on reality. You get so you can no longer see what is really tragic and what isn't, because you will be so worn down that everything feels tragic.

 

2. You are NOT helping her to find a perspective on reality. If you give drama an audience, you are assisting her in inflicting misery on herself and others.

 

I am not saying don't be there for her. If she has a real problem, hurt, etc. Be right there to give her all the help and support she needs - but don't feed her inner drama queen, it's like a feral animal that will keep coming back to a reliable source of sustenance.

[Tiramisu]

I agree with everyone who recommended cognitive therapy.

 

Not to pathologize every personality type, but it sounds like your dd may have been dealing with a tendency toward depression from very early on that has affected your relationship. It wouldn't necessarily have changed anything even if you were the very best parents in the world, always did the right thing, never made a mistake. You need to identify the problem, whatever it is, and get her the right therapy or treatment. This could make all the difference for your dd's future and your family life.

 

I completely agree with Ottakee that a medical examination and bloodwork to check for things that can cause the types of symptoms your dd is having is one thing you should do ASAP.

 

:grouphug:

[Tammyla]

Talk with the counselor / therapist first and let him/her know about the diary when you set up the appointment. The counselor may have an idea of how to tell your dd that she is going to see her.

 

:grouphug:

[PentecostalMom]

I really don't think you've done anything wrong by her. :grouphug: I would get her into counseling immediately, but don't beat yourself up.

 

 

:iagree:

[bolt.]

Do counseling -- it can do a lot of good, and most teens love it. Everybody likes having someone who is a good listener and 'on their side'. I wouldn't give an excuse about you needing to communicate better. I consider a counselor as valuable as a nurse, a teacher or a coach. You'd send her for tutoring, extra coaching or physio or something just because the need is there. I'd say, "You are a girl with strong feelings, and we don't always get along well as a family. As you get into your teen years you need someone to show you the skills, techniques and short cuts to deal with that. Those people are called counselors / therapists and you have an appointment next week."

[Jpoy85]

:grouphug::grouphug:

[Audrey]

SHE NEEDS COUNSELING.

 

I cannot stress that enough. Please. Get her into some counseling as soon as possible. There is nothing you can do on your own that is going to resolve her issues. She needs professional help. Now.

[Durriyyah]

I would bring her to counseling, but make sure to let her know it is just to help open the lines of communication. My parents put me in counseling and I absolutely felt like they were trying to outsource fixing me, which felt terrible. If you come at it from the angle that you are looking for a mediator so you can keep a healthy relationship, it could possibly help it not be hurtful.

 

Best wishes! This is really a tough age for parenting! :grouphug: :grouphug:

[dansamy]

I agree with counseling now. Since you have a pretty open dialogue with her, perhaps you can talk more about Ms Todd with her. Ask open-ended questions and allow her to verbalize what she thinks/feels. Do not interrupt.

 

I have a difficult middle child, who is dramatic and complains of being unliked. She's been difficult since she got here too. If I had any suspicions that she had thoughts of harming herself, she'd be in a counselor's office. My DH suffers from severe MDD and has had multiple unsuccessful attempts. Every unsuccessful attempt raises your risk of a successful attempt in the future. I'm 99% certain that I will be a suicide widow someday. He's really good about talking things out with me too. I usually know when he's having thoughts and I make an extra appt with his doctor. Winter is the worst. Fall is nice. He likes the fall. Nice enough to be outside without melting or freezing and not much pollen to make me miserable. December every year is a struggle. I think it's been 2 or 3 years since he's come to family T-giving/Christmas celebrations. It's difficult and lonely. It's hard to explain to his family that it's not about them. It's about him being trapped in his own brain, a prisoner to his depression.

[Elizabeth in MN]

First of all... if my husband read our daughter's diary... he'd be walking funny for a week. That was a horrible thing for him to do, to violate her privacy like that. When she finds out, and she will find out, she will never trust or love your husband as much as she does right now.

 

Secondly, get her to a therapist. LET HER CHOOSE WHICH ONE TO SEE. Therapy does no good if you don't trust your therapist. I also think that family therapy would be good since you and your husband don't trust your daughter.

[Guest submarines]

:grouphug:

 

I think making your bond with her a priority now and working on it is much more important than jumping into counseling. Counseling might send all kind of wrong messages to her. Going through the process of selecting the right counsellor and developing rapport is already stressful and can be counterproductive.

 

The typical internet advice for almost anything is to get counseling. I hope it is just because many want to err on the side of caution when giving advice, and I do understand this. However counseling is rarely the best way when the parents need to work on closer relationship with their child.

 

Listen to her, actively listen. Let her talk. Talk to her. Work on trust and bonding. You'll eventually need to deal with the fact that her father violated her privacy. :grouphug:

[Starr]

Once she has the help she needs she'll be glad her father read her diary.

[i.love.lucy]

First of all... if my husband read our daughter's diary... he'd be walking funny for a week. That was a horrible thing for him to do, to violate her privacy like that. When she finds out, and she will find out, she will never trust or love your husband as much as she does right now.

 

Secondly, get her to a therapist. LET HER CHOOSE WHICH ONE TO SEE. Therapy does no good if you don't trust your therapist. I also think that family therapy would be good since you and your husband don't trust your daughter.

That was harsh. The OP specifically mentioned that she knew her DH should not have read it.

 

Are you the parent of this kind of child? Do you have this nagging feeling that something is wrong emotionally but said child will not open up to you? It's a very scary place to be as a parent and I don't blame him one bit for reading her diary. That is an act that can be forgiven, especially if it leads to a deeper relationship and communication between them.

[besroma]

That was harsh. The OP specifically mentioned that she knew her DH should not have read it.

 

Are you the parent of this kind of child? Do you have this nagging feeling that something is wrong emotionally but said child will not open up to you? It's a very scary place to be as a parent and I don't blame him one bit for reading her diary. That is an act that can be forgiven, especially if it leads to a deeper relationship and communication between them.

 

:iagree: OP needs help right now, not this.

[Farmgirl70]

I have always told our kids that we'd never violate their privacy UNLESS we were worried about their safety or well being and then we might, because we care. Perhaps your husband's hunch will end up helping you help her. :grouphug:

 

You sound like good parents. It's not your fault. It can be hard to be 13, and harder for some than others. I might say, "Honey, we're concerned about you. Are you feeling depressed?" and then go from there to offer help and counseling, perhaps.

[Elizabeth in MN]

That was harsh. The OP specifically mentioned that she knew her DH should not have read it.

 

Are you the parent of this kind of child? Do you have this nagging feeling that something is wrong emotionally but said child will not open up to you? It's a very scary place to be as a parent and I don't blame him one bit for reading her diary. That is an act that can be forgiven, especially if it leads to a deeper relationship and communication between them.

 

Yes, it was harsh but so is what her dh did.

 

Yes, I am the parent of "this kind" of child. Yes, I've had the nagging feeling that something was wrong and I worked by butt off until we got answers. Yes, it's a very scary place to be. Imagine doing it as a single mother! I would never intrude on my dd's diary, even with all the junk we've had to deal with.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

I think the OP has enough to worry about without the hex about the daughter never loving her father as much again. That's not necessarily true, and totally unnecessary to say.

[MBM]

Thank you everyone. I am not worried about stigma of counseling, I have always worried about what she will think. Will she think we think something is wrong with her? Obviously, we do now...but before yesterday we could not decide if it is her personality, middle child syndrome, or if our expectations are off because the other two are so easy. When I have talked to other parents who know her...they do not see what we do. They see a sweet, fun girl (and she is...but we see everything else too), so we have been left wondering if we were making more if it than there is.

 

Ok, so counseling. I am thinking that we should play it like we want help with our communication with her. She will hate it...but hopefully she will get over it?

 

Besides long-term sadness, depression can appear as a lack of joy or curiosity, an inability to commit to something and also anger. It does sound like she might be mildly depressed.

 

Depression physically affects parts of the brain. People who are depressed have more activity in the right prefrontal cortex than the left. You might want to learn more about that in Richard Davidson's book The Emotional Life of Your Brain. (He's a neuroscientist.)

 

Additionally, a teen girl's brain has the most volume around age 11 or so, and then it begins to prune and rewire and decrease in volume. It is sort of switching from a more emotional state to a more logical state, but it takes years for this to happen -- around the early 20s. (For boys this change begins around age 13.)

 

First, though, I think the counseling would be very helpful for all of you. Your daughter needs someone to hear her and she needs to learn new ways of dealing with her perceptions as well as new skills to help herself. All of you probably could benefit by learning new ways of communicating. A good therapist can be really, really wonderful.

 

When broaching the topic with her, you could maybe mention that this is a family problem, not just her problem. You could also mention that you've noticed signs -- a lack of interest and curiosity, difficulty sustaining interest, a little anger.

 

Your daughter deserves to feel better, and that is what you're trying to do. Best of luck to all of you. It's so hard to see our kids suffer.

[Audrey]

I think the OP has enough to worry about without the hex about the daughter never loving her father as much again. That's not necessarily true, and totally unnecessary to say.

 

 

No. It's not necessarily true at all. I wasn't thrilled when my mom read my diary, but I never doubted that it was because she was worried. I might have been mad for a bit, but it never diminished my love for her, nor did it ever make me doubt her love for me. If anything, I understood it a little bit better.

[Audrey]

This is EXACTLY what I am worried about.

 

 

Then tell her that. I know you're worried about what she will think, but it is so clear that you are primarily worried about her -- about her mental health, her physical health, her happiness, her self-esteem...

 

Just tell her that. Tell her you are worried. You love her. You want her to be happy and healthy. If something is wrong, you want to know that, you want her to know that, and you want to help her with whatever it is. No matter what it is you love her.

 

I cannot guarantee you anything, but I know that hearing my parents tell me that meant everything. I wasn't all sweet and cuddly with them for doing that, but it meant all the difference in the world.

 

Even if you have to make her let you help her, do it. In the long run, you will not regret it, and neither will she.

[gardenmom5]

okay - I've got four through their teen years.

 

My first thought is to wonder if she has something biochemically wonky going on in her brain. whether she is hypersentive to some type of food, or not absorbing certain nutrients.

 

My hyper volatile teen turned out to not absorb vitamin D. at. all. (eta: five years of antidepressants were a wasted five years.)

 

granted I have done quite a bit of late with biomed, but I've also been seeing dramatic results with one who was *really* struggling.

 

so my suggestion would be a naturopath experienced in this particular area with a full blood work. it examines sensitivies, toxins, vitamin/mineral status, enzymes, neurotransmitters, etc. the blood work wasn't that much as we paid an upfront fee to the lab, and if they coud get more from the insurance co great (and we might even get something back), if not, that was it.

eta: this can also be a good companion to a counseling approach.

Edited October 15, 2012 by gardenmom5

[Joanne]

double post. Have a great day!

Edited October 15, 2012 by Joanne

[Joanne]

I can not believe I am about to post this.

 

Well, I won't say I disagree with the others, because I don't. But I will say, there are lots of things teens think about doing that they wouldn't, in fact, ever do. And the feelings she is describing are in themselves pretty normal for teenagers.

 

I guess I think the real question for me would be how is she actually handling her difficult feelings? Teens do have over the top feelings for a lot of reasons, and they can struggle with them, but that doesn't mean they aren't actually coping with them.

 

And it would be really natural to write about those struggles in a diary and that wouldn't mean the teen wasn't coping either. It might be an example of coping. Especially if she is a person who manages stress by expressing it.

 

My reaction would be to say you need to talk with her and see how things are, but since you say she isn't likely to be open, that is not that useful maybe. On the other hand, if you say you want her to see a counselor, she might balk if she is really that contradictory, and I suspect she might be just as close-mouthed with that person.

 

I think I might instigate more, indirectly. Maybe see if you can have a natural discussion about teens that do things like cutting or whatever and see what she says. If you are having a lot of news about such things, it might be easy to bring it up when you hear it on the radio or whatever.

 

:iagree:

 

And, even more.

 

When I was reading your OP, I felt the mis-match between personalities. I felt smothered by your need to *talk* to her. Not every personality needs to "share" their feelings and thoughts.

 

Frankly, the diary could be a GREAT, MATURE coping skill that will prevent self-harm. Self-harm is a coping skill in and of itself. It's a poor one, obviously, but the function of it is a coping skill to the user.

 

Your dd "may" benefit from counseling. But, frankly, I think the family needs it more or at least in conjunction. I think part of the problem may be your expectation of what a close, healthy family looks like.

 

Yes, I have a child that consumes more than their share of family resources in terms of money, time, energy, attention. I have one that doesn't line up with my idea of healthy and engaged.

 

On the violation of privacy, I personally think it was a mistake; a huge one. I think that part of your family struggle is that the more you've pushed to hear about her inside, the more she's resisted. Now you've taken her safe place. That is serious.

 

My kids know that backpacks, rooms, drawers, and diaries are subject to scrutiny if I suspect drugs or suicide. But even THEN, I would be very, very careful and need some serious indications.

 

I'm a believer in therapy. ;) I'm usually one of the first ones to suggest it, and to see pathology based on posts.

 

But in this case, sending her for therapy but not the *family* could very well be a sypmtom of the problem, not the fix.

[TranquilMind]

I think the OP has enough to worry about without the hex about the daughter never loving her father as much again. That's not necessarily true, and totally unnecessary to say.

 

Yes. That was a really crappy thing to say.

[swellmomma]

I agree with everyone else about counselling and I would tell her you read it in her diary. May as well be as honest with her as you want her to be. YEs she will be livid and claim to hate you forever. My response to that would be I sure hope so, because it means you are alive and well enough to hate me. My kids know that when they are displaying behaviours that worry me they forgo any right to privacy in my home for their own good. They hate it at the time but when they come out the other side they see that you did the right thing.

[WishboneDawn]

I can not believe I am about to post this.

 

 

 

:iagree:

 

And, even more.

 

When I was reading your OP, I felt the mis-match between personalities. I felt smothered by your need to *talk* to her. Not every personality needs to "share" their feelings and thoughts.

 

Frankly, the diary could be a GREAT, MATURE coping skill that will prevent self-harm. Self-harm is a coping skill in and of itself. It's a poor one, obviously, but the function of it is a coping skill to the user.

 

Your dd "may" benefit from counseling. But, frankly, I think the family needs it more or at least in conjunction. I think part of the problem may be your expectation of what a close, healthy family looks like.

 

Yes, I have a child that consumes more than their share of family resources in terms of money, time, energy, attention. I have one that doesn't line up with my idea of healthy and engaged.

 

On the violation of privacy, I personally think it was a mistake; a huge one. I think that part of your family struggle is that the more you've pushed to hear about her inside, the more she's resisted. Now you've taken her safe place. That is serious.

 

My kids know that backpacks, rooms, drawers, and diaries are subject to scrutiny if I suspect drugs or suicide. But even THEN, I would be very, very careful and need some serious indications.

 

I'm a believer in therapy. ;) I'm usually one of the first ones to suggest it, and to see pathology based on posts.

 

But in this case, sending her for therapy but not the *family* could very well be a symptom of the problem, not the fix.

 

I'm with Joanne and Bluegoat on this. All you have to go on are a few of the very latest pages in her diary that were written in response to a recent and tragic event. I think you need a real pattern of behaviour, not a few thoughts she thought no one else would ever see.

 

I think you really need to give her room to come to you. She doesn't sound like someone who needs to be told it's safe to come talk to you (in fact, to some people that can feel like a pushiness they need to resist). She sounds like someone who needs to be SHOWN that. Small things she might talk to you about (her favourite show, etc.) need to be listened to and talked about. You might need to find ways for the two of you to be together quietly or involved in neutral conversation (cleaning the kitchen together while playing 20 Questions? Her going with you while you run some errands?) so she has space to come to you about things. This is how my daughter works. If I get pushy or inisist I'm safe to talk to, she shuts down. If I give her time with me alone and we stay on safe and neutral topics, she'll eventually open up if she needs to.

 

I would NOT mention anyone read her diary and I would NOT do it again. I think that might be a big flag to her that you guys can not be trusted. I would not seek counseling. I really, really think that without any pattern or further warning signs that would be an over reaction that would cause more issues then it would solve.

[WishboneDawn]

I have to express this another way....

 

You've been telling her all along that she can talk to you, that it's safe to express her feelings or share her thoughts but now that she has done that tentatively in a safe place (she thinks) you're going to tell her you violated her privacy and take her off to counselling?

 

I think the lesson she's liable to take from this is that what you guys say is not trustworthy and that it is not safe to share her feelings in any way.

 

Again, this is a few pages in the otherwise pretty innocuous diary of a teenage girl. If there's nothing else troubling going on I'd address it by changing my own approach rather then jumping to the extreme of intervention. Keep watching her for other signs, be aware, but there's a wide middle ground to explore before taking the next step.

[ma23peas]

Love, love, love her!

 

My first daughter can be as you described, I have found that I do have to work harder at making those connections. When I see things going south (bad attitude) I deal with it quickly, the worst you can do is to let them be and give space.

I will spend an afternoon just with her, make an excuse to shop for something, then branch out to a picnic or meal out. I get honest with her, I do not focus on her behavior but how darn tough it is to see clearly in these ages of hormones..I make it more about coping through the changes in our bodies. I often tell how after each pregnancy I felt 'not myself' I just felt the blahs...exercise helped, diet helped but hormones are tricky beasts. let her know that you do not expect perfection, that you and Dad will still hound her for chores, but that it is not about the chores it is about honoring God with all we do...will any of us be perfect? I throw in here examples she knows where I am not, but that God picks up the slack so we must trust in Him to carry us through...if there is one thing I want her to leave my house knowing is not how to clean a kitchen or finish their assignments, but that it is to know as much as we have their back, it is God who carries us. We finish and clean to honor Him who carries is, apologize if that has not been the focus and ask her how she feels..I have three teenagers and these talks occur about 3-4 times a year...my kids need that reassurance and strong faith to help them through these spots...the unbridled joy is when they start to come to you with their own faith experiences...will be praying for you all.

[MBM]

Regarding cutting, one of my son's best friends began in junior high and had to leave high school for about three months while she sought treatment. Experts believe cutting has an effect similar to taking cocaine. For many former cutters, the lure of cutting to cope can linger for years. That is something you don't want your child to start. Just don't let her go there.

 

http://www.webmd.com/mental-health/features/cutting-self-harm-signs-treatment

[labst60]

I really don't think a 14 yo should have an expectation of privacy from his/her parents. I know I did not as a child.

 

A 14 yo is just that - a child and I think it is the parents *responsibility* to know/find out what they can about their children.

 

I'm not saying you MUST read your child's diary - what I am saying is that if there is some concern or worry that prompts you to read it - you shouldn't feel apologetic or ashamed.

 

That being said - I would also let DD know that we did in as non-confrontational a manner as possible - if you found something that worried you. It is your right as a parent, plain and simple. You can choose to not excercise that right - but don't feel bad for trying to find out what is bothering a 14 yo child.

 

Finally - I will just share this one piece of advice (and my children are younger, so this is more coming from my memory/perspective of BEING a child). In retrospect, I kept a lot from my parents.... and had they been more involved, they could have helped me prevent a lot of mistakes - some I still regret to this day. I'm not blaming them - but the fear of "disappointing" them was overwhelming. In addition - though I "could" talk to my mom - there really wasn't any real time/opoortunity for me to open up, kwim? I was the oldest of 4 and though my mom stayed home, she was always busy (doing mom things :)). It really takes time and bond for a teenager to feel comfortable opening up and talking. So - it might be one full month of 2 hour one-on-one ice cream dates before you get her to say anything - but don't give up just because she doesn't share all those feelings inside during the first one!

[MBM]

In retrospect, I kept a lot from my parents.... and had they been more involved, they could have helped me prevent a lot of mistakes - some I still regret to this day. I'm not blaming them - but the fear of "disappointing" them was overwhelming. In addition - though I "could" talk to my mom - there really wasn't any real time/opoortunity for me to open up, kwim? I was the oldest of 4 and though my mom stayed home, she was always busy (doing mom things :)). It really takes time and bond for a teenager to feel comfortable opening up and talking.

 

Po Bronson and Ashley Merryman talk about the main reason kids lie in their book Nurture Shock and it is because kids do not want to harm their relationship with their parents. The chapter on lying has some good advice about helping kids tell the truth. Well worth reading.

[labst60]

Once she has the help she needs she'll be glad her father read her diary.

 

 

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

 

I couldn't agree with this statement more- and I've BEEN THERE from the child perspective. My mother didn't find/read my diary -but she did go through my room (I was 18 or 19) looking for "something" to give her some clue as to why I was acting different. She found some stuff and - honestly, I was slightly angry at the time - but at this point, I'm so glad.

 

I didn't feel comfortable opening up to her on my own - and then I had no choice. It was all out in the open and it got so much better after that.

 

Your DD might be angry - but she will not stop loving your DH - just the opposite. At some point she will realize how much he loves her to be willing to spend his time trying help/fix her.

[Joanne]

why I was acting different[/b]. .

 

You were acting different; your parents where concerned.

 

The child in the OP has always preferred some privacy:

 

She will not talk to us. From the time she was little you could tell that she was upset/mad about something' date=' but she will refuse to tell you. We have tried telling her how important it is for her to talk to us, how much we want to know what she is feeling, we have tried forcing it out. .[/quote']

 

This family has been trying to change this child's preferred style of relating. There is no evidence that this child is at risk. :confused: This child has been *consistently* private from birth. This child has a range of challenging behaviors/patterns (who doesn't?).

 

This family is clearly invested in and caring, and diligent. I get that. But, honestly, I do not see red flags or a clear trajectory to a problem.

 

The reference in a private diary to a desire to cut could very well show a useful, healthy, coping skill: Process emotion on paper rather than inappropriately.

 

I truly feel it's very possible that intervention on this child - as if her style of living is inherently flawed - will reinforce and suggest just what this family is trying to mitigate.

 

This child needs to be honored and worked with for who she is and has been. I strongly believe THE FAMILY needs counseling, and the child is a scapegoat. Sending this child for counseling as if she were the focus would be a serious mistake on top of the mistake of violating her privacy. Even counseling for the child with "check ins" from the parents or occassional family sessions would be a wrong move.

 

There may be nothing wrong with this child.

Edited October 15, 2012 by Joanne

[LittleIzumi]

I have to express this another way....

 

You've been telling her all along that she can talk to you, that it's safe to express her feelings or share her thoughts but now that she has done that tentatively in a safe place (she thinks) you're going to tell her you violated her privacy and take her off to counselling?

 

I think the lesson she's liable to take from this is that what you guys say is not trustworthy and that it is not safe to share her feelings in any way.

 

Again, this is a few pages in the otherwise pretty innocuous diary of a teenage girl. If there's nothing else troubling going on I'd address it by changing my own approach rather then jumping to the extreme of intervention. Keep watching her for other signs, be aware, but there's a wide middle ground to explore before taking the next step.

:iagree::iagree::iagree: And I used to cut for a while. It is a coping mechanism. I stopped after a while--maybe six months? I was quite fine. Although if I found out my parents read my diary I would absolutely NOT have been fine unless they were truly worried about drugs or suicide (which wasn't on the radar at all, either of them).