Chicago teachers to strike Monday

[wapiti]

I prefer evaluation systems in which student progress is measured individually rather than in aggregate. Johnny might increase three grade levels in reading while in Ms. Smith's class but still be below grade level. Ms. Smith should not be penalized for this.

:iagree::iagree:

 

This could apply at all student levels, bottom to top. It also still incentivizes teachers to find more efficient ways to increase student growth (e.g., ability grouping in some situations, etc.) and not let the top students languish while bringing the lower level up to the minimum.

 

I wonder whether our district uses MAP RIT scores for this purpose - I could imagine that.

 

I'd also like to see some classroom observation as a component of evaluations, even though that is laborious and subjective. It can be done. The private schools I have known do find a way to get rid of "bad" teachers and reward better ones - I wish public schools were more flexible in this regard.

[angela in ohio]

Does anyone actually object to the teachers' demands about performance based pay and such? I'm not familiar with the situation, so I'm truly just asking - it just seems everyone so far has objected to them striking because of the effect on the kids (which I completely understand) or because everyone else has it rough too, so teachers should just deal with what they get (which sentiment I disagree with) and not because of what they are asking for.

 

I do. Teaching is one of the few professions where your employment and pay are not tied to your ability to actually do the job. It is high time that this was changed. Few people understand how the system would actually work, though, so they buy into the idea that wonderful teachers will be fired left and right for student performance that isn't their fault (they won't.) Many of use are homeschooling precisely because we remember the teachers each year who didn't teach, but were still there. Those are the teachers who should be worried, and they are. Thus the outcry from the teacher's union.

 

The push for accountability is top-down, though. The school system has no choice, per federal regulations, but to implement some type of system to tie employment and pay to performance. We are just beginning to see the crisis this will cause.

 

And teachers already have evaluations (in every district I've known, at least.) It is just now that there is a push to standardize these and actually *do* something about poor ones.

 

I'm not anti-teacher, but you better believe I'm anti-bad-teacher. And until the union stops fighting for bad teachers to persist (and teachers deny their existence,) I won't take them seriously. Our children deserve better. Not everyone has the luxury to avoid bad schools by homeschooling or utilizing private schools.

Edited September 10, 2012 by angela in ohio

[GWOB]

I hate these threads because there are always nasty comments about teachers in them.

 

My sister is on strike today. She is a CPS teacher, who teaches science and math, on the south side to be precise.

 

She didn't want to go on strike, it's not a vacation. She still has to go to school, plus she doesn't want this interruption to her classes. It sucks for the teachers, too. Both students and teachers will have to make up these missed days.

 

However, what they've been doing to CPS teachers is not right. They have already put up with a lot and didn't strike, but there comes a time when enough is enough.

 

We do not want to go back to a time where the working class is just thankful to have a job. We don't rebuild a strong economy by sticking it to public school teachers.

 

:iagree: It scares me to think of living in a country where people fighting for their rights are told to just suck it up and are insulted because of the way they look. It scares me to think of workers dealing with pitiful pay, ridiculous hours, and crummy working conditions because the are so thankful for the crumbs they receive from mega-rich corporations.

[Entropymama]

Your "reeks of entitlement" phrase, though, reminds me of all the people I find loathsome--Beck, Limbaugh, Hannity, and their ilk.

 

:lol: Sorry, but that made me laugh. Where in the world did you get Beck and Limbaugh from this conversation!

 

ETA: I am not bashing teachers. I have great respect for them. I wish we could pay all of them (and police officers and firefighters, too, for that matter) top, top dollar for the work they do. However, if the money just isn't there, I don't see how we can. I also know that I have a hard time giving up even more money to give them a raise when we haven't had one in a really long time.

 

:iagree:

 

DH works at least 60 hours per week. He gets paid well, but we aren't guaranteed ANY raises, let alone 16% over four years.

 

I don't know the specifics about Chicago, but I've had plenty of teacher friends in other areas who complain about the unions. They say they often don't agree with the stands the union takes but can't dissent. I wonder if that is happening here? Maybe the "villains" aren't the teachers, but the union reps.

 

Oh, and can we leave the pp who made the comment about ugly teachers alone now? I think three nasty responses is enough. :D

[cara]

I could get behind this if they were being forced to work in horrid conditions, but they aren't and their demands and complaints are insulting to a lot of people who work a lot harder for a lot less. I think more it reeks of entitlement and our economy cannot afford it.

 

So having 1 book for 5 classes of 20 + students that the teacher has to make photocopies of out of his own pocket because the school's copy machine has been broke for 2 years is, this is what my friend's husband who is a CPS teacher has to do, ok..

 

Taking 400-1000+ of your own money to pay for your classroom needs, things the school should be providing, is ok...

 

Having to do 3-5 hours of work at home at night that you don't get paid for, because you aren't salary you are an hourly employee is ok...

 

Being held accountable for the test scores students who could give a care less about school because they live in a combat zone is and most of whom have an iep is ok...

 

The pay increase isn't what the news is making it out to be it's not even 16 percent and between the increase in hours and the increase in health benefits it isn't even an increase at all really. The working conditions in some of the schools are horrible, and deplorable. It's amazing any learning happens in them.

 

We treat our teachers like crud in this country, and then when they stand up for themselves like these teachers, we treat them even worse.

 

Want to know what the top countries in education have in common? They value their teachers, we will never have the education system that we need to become effective in a global market until we value our teachers, we pay them what they deserve, give them the tools they need, and stop setting them up for failure.

[redsquirrel]

I have a friend who was a high school science teacher for the Chicago School system. She is not 'nasty'. She is a great teacher and a very nice person. She is a loving parent and works hard to give her students a good education. She cares about her students and giving them a good education. Many of you would prob like her very much.

 

She has also left her chosen profession due to the absolute insanity of the administration. There has been year after year of experienced teachers getting laid off, then getting hired at new teacher status, only to be fired/rehired at the end of the year. She got sick of teaching to the test. She got sick of being terrorized by troubled kids, having her concerns ignored, and then being written up for 'not being able to keep order in the class.' She got tired of working year after year with declining conditions and reduced pay. She often had to teach with no books, no science equipment and kids who could not read. When she questioned why those kids (about to graduate) were even in high school she was written up for being insubordinate.

 

She explored writing a home school physics course, but has three children to support. She has left the profession entirely. It's too bad, because she knows her stuff and was a great teacher. The Chicago school district doesn't want good teachers.

[cara]

:iagree: It scares me to think of living in a country where people fighting for their rights are told to just suck it up and are insulted because of the way they look. It scares me to think of workers dealing with pitiful pay, ridiculous hours, and crummy working conditions because the are so thankful for the crumbs they receive from mega-rich corporations.

 

 

:iagree:

[rjand6more]

So having 1 book for 5 classes of 20 + students that the teacher has to make photocopies of out of his own pocket because the school's copy machine has been broke for 2 years is, this is what my friend's husband who is a CPS teacher has to do, ok..

 

Taking 400-1000+ of your own money to pay for your classroom needs, things the school should be providing, is ok...

 

Having to do 3-5 hours of work at home at night that you don't get paid for, because you aren't salary you are an hourly employee is ok...

 

Being held accountable for the test scores students who could give a care less about school because they live in a combat zone is and most of whom have an iep is ok...

 

The pay increase isn't what the news is making it out to be it's not even 16 percent and between the increase in hours and the increase in health benefits it isn't even an increase at all really. The working conditions in some of the schools are horrible, and deplorable. It's amazing any learning happens in them.

 

We treat our teachers like crud in this country, and then when they stand up for themselves like these teachers, we treat them even worse.

 

Want to know what the top countries in education have in common? They value their teachers, we will never have the education system that we need to become effective in a global market until we value our teachers, we pay them what they deserve, give them the tools they need, and stop setting them up for failure.

 

These are not the issues in question. At least that is not what either side has expressed. Working conditions are NOT part of the strike. I'm sorry these situations exist. Some of these schools are in the worst of areas. Teaching is a crummy job no matter where, but I do not agree that teachers are treated badly on average just because a list of demands is not met with full agreement.

 

Pay was agreed upon. Many of the issues brought up by the CTU are not strikeable(by law).

[jelbe5]

I wonder if that is happening here? Maybe the "villains" aren't the teachers, but the union reps.

 

Well, Karen Lewis is, in my opinion, an insult to the profession. A video of a talk she gave in 2011 went viral where she insulted Arne Duncan and talked about smoking weed years ago. Why would you do that in today's age when everything is recorded? She may be a good union negotiator but she is not who I would want to represent my profession.

[Kathryn]

These are not the issues in question. At least that is not what either side has expressed. Working conditions are NOT part of the strike. I'm sorry these situations exist. Some of these schools are in the worst of areas. Teaching is a crummy job no matter where, but I do not agree that teachers are treated badly on average just because a list of demands is not met with full agreement.

 

Pay was agreed upon. Many of the issues brought up by the CTU are not strikeable(by law).

 

:iagree: From the articles I've read, that's my understanding of the situation as well.

[SonshineLearner]

I don't know... do they have the ability to fire and start over? Hire subs? I'd say to screw most of the unions at this point....

[labst60]

You are ok with teaching your own kids to judge people by their looks? How incredibly shallow of you.

 

 

I teach my children that you WILL be judged by your looks. I don't think that is shallow, I think it is reality.

 

I didn't look at the particular photo cited, so this is much more of a general comment, but people have a CHOICE in how they present themselves. Pleasant, angry, happy, aggressive, neat, untidy - those are all CHOICES and people should expect to be judged by their choices.

 

I'm not talking about someone not having the "right" jeans or a physical handicap - but judging happens and I think I would be irresponsible if didn't prepare my children for that.

[TechWife]

where the heck does this leave the kids who are supposed to be receiving an education?!?

 

Going to school in the summer to make it all up!

[delaney]

Well I have no sympathy for the teachers. I taught for 6 years. You know going in that the pay stinks. Yes there are hours beyond the school hours but they aren't THAT many. You get all holidays off, weekends, summers. They need to stop whining. Go to work or quit. In this economy I find it rude to refuse a raise of any kind AND a guarantee to get one for the next 4 years!

[KungFuPanda]

I remember a teacher's strike in Cleveland in the mid-70s. We moved at that time, but my cousins who lived there ended up going to school all summer to make up the days. It's supply and demand though. If they CAN get more money instead of working for less, I don't blame them for trying. A teacher should be able to live and pay their student loans. If the job isn't worth much more than minimum wage to the community, then don't require a degree to get it.

 

I don't know the details of THIS case, but I do know that the pay-per-hours of work for teachers (this is NOT equal to the number of hours/days the kids are in school) is abysmal already and if someone exerts their power and DEMANDS that you work more for less, it is reasonable to push back and assert your worth.

[MBM]

Plenty of CPS teachers do want to work, but they can't at this point.

 

My two older kids, now 28 and 26, went through CPS all 13 years (I'm including kindy) with no ill effects. Most of their teachers were intelligent and dedicated and went the extra mile to help individual students who struggled or were bored. My hat is off to them. My kids still go back and visit some of them, too.

 

I hope the strike won't last too long.

[Susan in TN]

They always strike....... :glare: IL is broke..... I have no idea where they plan to squeeze anymore $$ out of.

 

 

We will see how long this one lasts.

 

They plan to squeeze it out of you and the other residents of IL, one way or the other.

[BigMamaBird]

When I was a kid, the teachers at a near by school went on strike for three or four weeks. Those poor kids had to go to school way into the summer to make up for the missed time. I can't imagine the poor seniors who were trying to get college plans finalized!

[SonshineLearner]

When I was a kid, the teachers at a near by school went on strike for three or four weeks. Those poor kids had to go to school way into the summer to make up for the missed time. I can't imagine the poor seniors who were trying to get college plans finalized!

 

If my kids were under the age I though it'd matter, I'd pull them out when school is suppose to end. Period! I'd actually hope that someday parents would be smart enough to band together against this "hostage" situation. Seriously, you mess with my summer plans, and I'll just take them out. And working wouldn't mess with those plans either. They'd be messing with my school year daycare situation, so I wouldn't care about their paycheck. Sorry.... No consideration for inconsiderate people :(

[Garga]

:iagree: It scares me to think of living in a country where people fighting for their rights are told to just suck it up and are insulted because of the way they look. It scares me to think of workers dealing with pitiful pay, ridiculous hours, and crummy working conditions because the are so thankful for the crumbs they receive from mega-rich corporations.

 

:iagree:

 

I kinda wish I'd never started learning world history with the kids. It's scary, because we've it played throughout history over and over and over, that the people in power will inevitably take, take, take from the regular people (us) and then get angry at us for daring to ask for equality. It's Yurtle the Turtle, every time. Sigh.

 

So, maybe they shouldn't strike, but it scares me when we hear comments like, 'They should just be glad they have a job at all.' Well, yes. But I wonder if the coal mine owners said that about their burdened workers, back in the day. Or the landowners said it about their serfs.

 

Ok. I'd better stop. I'm getting melodramatic now.

[nmoira]

So, maybe they shouldn't strike, but it scares me when we hear comments like, 'They should just be glad they have a job at all.' Well, yes. But I wonder if the coal mine owners said that about their burdened workers, back in the day. Or the landowners said it about their serfs.

And when it's global in scope:

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-19487985

Gina Rinehart calls for Australian wage cut

Australian mining magnate Gina Rinehart has criticised her country's economic performance and said Africans willing to work for $2 a day should be an inspiration.

[stripe]

Hmm. I think I might agree with this. I have been finding it quite frightening lately that people are more and more willing to put up with horrible conditions just to keep their jobs. Because if you lose a job, it could be years before you find a new one, and you can easily lose your home and everything you've worked your entire life for.

 

If does seem that if someone wants a nicer job, they're perceived as "greedy" and they should just be happy that they're not starving in the street.

 

That's a dangerous place for a population to be in. We're becoming content with less and less, but not in a good way--in a way that leads to companies exploiting people.

 

Exactly. And I know companies who behave this way. The worst thing I read in this vein was in Nobodies by John Bowe about a company that, brought welders from India. They were working at the John Pickle Company for two dollars an hour, staying in squalid company facilities, eating nasty food, passports withheld and rarely allowed out. One day two of the men met people at this church, and one man became disturbed by the conditions and eventually helped them escape. Anyway, like NO ONE was initially willing to accept they'd been enslaved, and a lot of people (I mean, inc investigators) kept telling them their life was better there than it had been in India where they had been starving. Except, they WEREN'T starving in India, they were middle class! And regular people (Americans) also responded that basically it was acceptable to treat them this way because being in the US was so great. I continue to be astonished that we have no sense that greatness is not bestowed, but earned. Bringing people here to abuse them is nothing to celebrate. Anyway the workers won a lawsuit against Pickle.

 

But I think in regular situations, employers count on employees not to know something is illegal, not to report it, or otherwise let it go. In The American Way of Eating, Tracie McMillan had several examples of questionable or dishonest statements by employers (such as Walmart saying workers might not get workers comp after an injury based on reviews of the accident video) as well as her getting medical care and accomodation when injured picking garlic in the field. Workers are supposed to just be so happy to have a job. At what point is that not enough.

[stripe]

I teach my children that you WILL be judged by your looks. I don't think that is shallow, I think it is reality.

 

I didn't look at the particular photo cited, so this is much more of a general comment, but people have a CHOICE in how they present themselves. Pleasant, angry, happy, aggressive, neat, untidy - those are all CHOICES and people should expect to be judged by their choices.

 

I'm not talking about someone not having the "right" jeans or a physical handicap - but judging happens and I think I would be irresponsible if didn't prepare my children for that.

 

Perhaps you should look at the photo.

 

It was of average looking middle aged women yelling at a rally. Most workers on strike do not behave as if they are models walking happily down a runway.

 

God help those of us who aren't young and skinny blonde supermodels.

 

I guess we have a CHOICE about our race, bone structure, aging effects (I checked "aging slowly and gracefully, didn't you?), health, and whether we are born into a wealthy family that got us excellent dental care in childhood.

 

:iagree: It scares me to think of living in a country where people fighting for their rights are told to just suck it up and are insulted because of the way they look.

 

Yeah, so what if the teachers are fat, middle aged, and angry?

 

So is Rush Limbaugh.

Edited September 10, 2012 by stripe

[nmoira]

Yeah, so what if the teachers are fat, middle aged, and angry?

 

So is Rush Limbaugh.

His pretentions may be middle class. But he is not. Still, you're two for three. :D

[redsquirrel]

Yeah, so what if the teachers are fat, middle aged, and angry?

 

So is Rush Limbaugh.

 

I fit two out of three. :001_smile: From what I read on these boards, so do many, if not most, of us.

[Swimtaxi234]

The military has been getting less than 2% raises these last four years (I am counting the one starting this October too). That is everyone, including those being shot at in Afghanistan and had been shot at in Iraq. Oh, and that wasn't for 5.5 hours for 170 days, either. Yes, I know they should plan and correct in the evenings. I know the good ones do and I also know the bad ones don't. So, compared to most workers anywhere, they have it really, really good. I know Chicago has dangerous areas but then so does Afghanistan.

__________________

 

A Chicago Public Schools spokesperson said average pay for teachers, without benefits, is $76,000

.

 

The agency reports that nearly $88 million worth of food stamps were used at commissaries nationwide in 2011, up from $31 million in 2008.

 

 

 

:confused:

[butterflymommy]

I had a couple TAs in my business classes that didn't strike, and if what was yelled at me is any indication, I can't imagine what got shouted at them as they were walking in the building.

 

There was recently a utility strike where I live and non-union female employees were called "whore" and "slut" by picketers for crossing the line into work. The larger women were heckled with slurs about weight. Really bad behavior but unfortunately that sort of thing by picketers is not uncommon.

[stripe]

His pretentions may be middle class. But he is not. Still, you're two for three. :D

 

I typed "class" but meant "aged" -- I corrected it immediately but not fast enough for you! :)

[nmoira]

I typed "class" but meant "aged" -- I corrected it immediately but not fast enough for you! :)

None of these were the adjectives at the tip of my tongue in any case. :tongue_smilie:

[Haiku]

Whatever your politics... where the heck does this leave the kids who are supposed to be receiving an education?!?

 

Well you know, they are doing this because they want the best for the kids.

 

The article did not say what it was that the teachers wanted that wasn't being offered, so I am not commenting here on the actual reasons for the strike, but I will say that unions are entitled to strike if the choose to, and implying that teachers shouldn't strike because they should be more concerned about their students being in the classroom is misguided. Teachers should not have to put up with unsatisfactory working conditions any more than truck drivers or electricians or carpenters should just because they work with the children and the others shouldn't.

 

I always have and will always support the right of workers to collectively bargain and strike, even when it's inconvenient for others. Even when it's teachers and students will lose class time.

 

Tara

Edited September 10, 2012 by TaraTheLiberator
formatting

[DawnM]

:iagree:

 

I have never been a really strong union supporter, but having worked in the school district with the second strongest school district in the country and then working in NC where there are NO unions, I can see a huge difference in the quality of the job itself. I hated working here in NC.

 

I don't know all the particulars of this strike, and it may be the wrong time to strike "in this economy" but, I do think that teaching should provide a living wage for a family. Very few areas of the country provide that.

 

Dawn

 

=TaraTheLiberatorWell you know, they are doing this because they want the best for the kids.

 

The article did not say what it was that the teachers wanted that wasn't being offered, so I am not commenting here on the actual reasons for the strike, but I will say that unions are entitled to strike if the choose to, and implying that teachers shouldn't strike because they should be more concerned about their students being in the classroom is misguided. Teachers should not have to put up with unsatisfactory working conditions any more than truck drivers or electricians or carpenters should just because they work with the children and the others shouldn't.

 

I always have and will always support the right of workers to collectively bargain and strike, even when it's inconvenient for others. Even when it's teachers and students will lose class time.

 

Tara

[Haiku]

It's a bad job, I'll give them that, when you consider the cr*p they put up with! But a HUGE portion of our population is dealing with long hours and a lot of cr*p too. So, while I don't know enough to make any judgment calls for or against the teachers' in this fight, I don't think they are likely to find much support even if they turn out to have very serious, legitimate grievances.

 

Divide and conquer. This is what the powers that be want. If we're kept busy fighting amongst ourselves, we won't question or fight them.

 

Tara

[cara]

Divide and conquer. This is what the powers that be want. If we're kept busy fighting amongst ourselves, we won't question or fight them.

 

Tara

 

:iagree:

[labst60]

:iagree:

 

I don't know all the particulars of this strike, and it may be the wrong time to strike "in this economy" but, I do think that teaching should provide a living wage for a family. Very few areas of the country provide that.

 

Dawn

 

It was reported on a local chicago station that the avg salay of a teacher there is $71k. I think that is a living wage - especially considering summers off with the ability to earn extra $$ or to better one's education (and therefore earning power) during that time (a benefit not offered by most other professions.

[Kathryn]

It was reported on a local chicago station that the avg salay of a teacher there is $71k. I think that is a living wage - especially considering summers off with the ability to earn extra $$ or to better one's education (and therefore earning power) during that time (a benefit not offered by most other professions.

 

:iagree: what I find:

 

"Keep in mind that CPS is a system where the average median salary for teachers*is $76,450 a year, compared to the $53,976 made by the average private sector employee..."

 

And from Wikipedia Demographics of Chicago:

 

"The median income for a household in the city was $38,625, and the median income for a family was $42,724. Males had a median income of $35,907 versus $30,536 for females. The per capita income for the city was $20,175."

 

* not to mention the demand for a 30% increase in exchange for a little more instructional time would have put the average salary to around $100,000.

Edited September 10, 2012 by kebg11

[Haiku]

Australian mining magnate Gina Rinehart has criticised her country's economic performance and said Africans willing to work for $2 a day should be an inspiration.

 

:blink: :banghead:

 

Tara

[lovinmomma]

:blink: :banghead:

 

Tara

Exactly.

Disclaimer: I didn't read the whole quote/article.

[Haiku]

"The median income for a household in the city was $38,625, and the median income for a family was $42,724. Males had a median income of $35,907 versus $30,536 for females. The per capita income for the city was $20,175."

 

 

Educated professionals should make more than the median, as the median is derived from those working totally unskilled jobs at minimum wage as well as those with advanced education working lucrative jobs.

 

Tara

[labst60]

And I would guess that those making signifcantly less are new teachers right out of school. Any "proffesional" job is going to pay less when you are starting. When I got out of school, I worked 60+ hours per week (CPA) for less than 1/2 of that. Proffessional job, so no overtime. LOTS of hours "outside of the office". Should I have striked (struck?)... no! I was basically paying my dues and after 5+ years was earning probably the "average" for the company. After another 5 years, I would hav been on the higher end. That's just life. A kid just can't come out of school and into the same job as someone who has been doing it 20+the experienc eof doing it 20+ years and expect the same salary. You start at "starting salary" for a reason - and increases should be earned.

 

So - that being said - if the average is around $71k - yes, 1/2 are making LESS... but the other 1/2 are making MORE.

[cara]

It's not about the money, it's about other things, including working conditions that help the children they are teaching. The media is spinning it to make it about money.

 

It's about working conditions - no books, no ac, no supplies, having too many kids per case. It's about being hourly employees that have to work off the clock for 3-5 hours a day, this wouldn't be an issue if they were salaried. It's about having to come out of pockets for supplies the district should be purchasing. It's about having benefits cut, benefit cost increasing and having to work more hours. When you include all of that, they aren't getting a raise. It's about teacher evaluations. They also want an elected school board.

 

These teachers have been working without a contract for a year. They make nothing while on strike, at least my friend's husband doesn't. So you think they want to be out of work. They are doing this so they, their predecessors, and the children they teach can teach and learn in environments conducive to doing so.

 

Also most of the teachers in CPS from what I read have Master's Degrees, why shouldn't they make that much? We should be paying our teachers what we pay our doctors. I think it shows how out of wack our society is that our athletes and movie stars make mega millions and our teachers are being put down for standing up for themselves and told they need to stop complaining and that 50k+ is too much money for them.

Edited September 10, 2012 by cara

[labst60]

YES... you are right, PROFESSIONALS should make more than the average. I also don't know ANY professional that works a 40 hour week. And most get 2-3 weeks vacation and only 9-10 holidays.

 

I realize that many of the good teachers are putting in hours after school - but so are many of the good accountants, analysts, marketing, hr proffessionals, etc. And they are also salaried positions where they don't get OT. THe difference is that these other folks DON"T get the summer off.

 

That just HAS to be taken into consideration in the calucation!

 

And, I just don't understand "proffesional unions". I get labor unions (rarely agree with them these days, but get their purpose.) I just don't get "professional unions".

[Kathryn]

Educated professionals should make more than the median, as the median is derived from those working totally unskilled jobs at minimum wage as well as those with advanced education working lucrative jobs.

 

Tara

 

I know that. That was in regards to whether CPS employees earn a "living wage." Their average salary is more than quite a few university professors I know here. It's more than several teachers at highly selective prep schools in New England I know.

[labst60]

It's not about the money, it's about other things, including working conditions that help the children they are teaching. The media is spinning it to make it about money.

 

It's about working conditions - no books, no ac, no supplies, having too many kids per case. It's about being hourly employees that have to work of the clock for 3-5 hours a day, this wouldn't be an issue if they were salaried. It's about having to come out of pockets for supplies the district should be purchasing. It's about having benefits cut, benefit cost increasing and having to work more hours. When you include all of that, they aren't getting a wage. It's about teacher evaluations. They also want an elected school board.

 

These teachers have been working without a contract for a year. They make nothing while on strike, at least my friend's husband doesn't. So you think they want to be out of work. They are doing this so they, their predecessors, and the children they teach can teach and learn in environments conducive to doing so.

 

Also most of the teachers in CPS from what I read have Master's Degrees, why shouldn't they make that much? We should be paying our teachers what we pay our doctors. I think it shows how out of wack our society is that our athletes and movie stars make mega millions and our teachers are being put down for standing up for themselves and told they need to stop complaining and that 50k+ is too much money for them.

 

I have not read that they were hourly - I'm not disagreeing, but in all the coverage I've seen/read that hasn't come up. IF they are hourly, why don't OT rules apply?

 

Doctors have a doctorate - not a masters. THen they do a residency. Big difference from a teacher with a masters - they shouldn't make the same.

 

I completely agree with the crazy hollywood/athlete salaries - however, if ppl didn't watch the movies and support the teams, they wouldn't get those salaries. It is entirely in the public's hands to stop that craziness!

[cara]

My information comes from the wife of a CPS employee. They are not salaried, they are hourly. They get paid by the hours they are at school working, and have to punch a time clock. This is one of the issues.

 

OT rules probably don't apply because the 3-5 hours of extra work is being done on weekends or at night at home. The work is required but there isn't enough time in the school day to complete it.

 

I get that others have to work off the clock, my husband does too. So did my dad. The difference are/were they were salaried employees.

[Mommy22alyns]

I do feel sorry for the kids. And it puts parents in a real bind too.

[cara]

I do feel sorry for the kids. And it puts parents in a real bind too.

 

If the parents are in a bind, maybe they will care what is happening to their teachers.

[justLisa]

It's just sad for the kids. A town nearby us went on strike several years back and it lasted for weeks.

[labst60]

But if the average PAY is $71k does it really make a difference if it is hourly or salary?

 

Would it somehow be BETTER if they were switched to SALARY, but still took home the same amount of pay?

 

They want to keep the same HOURLY rate and get paid for more HOURS, hence they want a pay INCREASE for essentially the same job, right?

 

They feel what they do is worth MORE than an average of $71k per school year - summers and all holiays off.

[Word Nerd]

If the parents are in a bind, maybe they will care what is happening to their teachers.

 

Why do you assume they don't? What do the parents have to do with the strike? What control do they have over the contracts?

[MBM]

YES... you are right, PROFESSIONALS should make more than the average. I also don't know ANY professional that works a 40 hour week. And most get 2-3 weeks vacation and only 9-10 holidays.

 

My husband is in his 50s, is a professional, and has rarely worked more than 40 hours per week. He also gets 5 weeks of vacation as well as federal holidays. When he worked as a university professor (taught accounting), he worked even less hours and made a pretty good salary. He chose those two jobs over Goldman Sachs so that he could have time to be with our kids. Less money but good decision on his part, I think.

 

About 3,000 work at his agency, and I don't think many work more than 40 hours per week.

 

A lot of professionals do work more than 40 hours per week but not everyone.

 

Personally, I think trying to milk too much out of employees is a bad idea and a recipe for an unhappy, less productive employee and possibly high turnover.