s/o - how important is *popular* cultural literacy?

[IsabelC]

As the title says!

 

I am attracted to the idea of a canon of knowledge, culture, whatever you want to call it, and the aim of imparting to children at least some idea of everything in it, so that they can 'join the Great Conversation', or at least be aware it is happening lol. (E D Hirsch is on my wishlist!) Of course you can debate and deconstruct the canon endlessly, but you have to know a bit about something before you can critique it: that's why I don't agree with the argument that canon=dead white males, therefore it's not useful. I am one of those people who tut-tuts silently when people display shocking cultural illiteracy (I don't dare tut-tut out loud because I know that I could use a big improvement in that area myself). So I'm definitely sold on 'classical culture'.

 

But pop culture I'm ambivalent about. I don't much like a lot of what passes for entertainment for children/young adults (for most of the usual reasons). But, I sometimes wonder whether I'm breeding freaks because my children don't know about most of the most popular toys, characters etc. We don't have television or DVDs, we don't have any electronic gaming, the kids only use the computer for their math program a few times a week, they don't hear pop music very often, and we don't buy any toys that are movie/television merchandising. If I put my 6yo into school this year, chances are he'd have almost nothing to talk about with the other kids because he is culturally illiterate according to their tastes.

Edited January 1, 2010 by Hotdrink

[Peela]

I think its great to limit exposure to those things for a good many years...but by teenage years, possibly a bit before, I think its very important for kids to feel comfortable navigating our culture.

In the Steiner schools, they insist on no TV until the kids are about 9 I think. Thats the age they feel that kids start to become a lot more aware of the world around them, and it can be an emotional age.

I think computer literacy can be picked up quite quickly by kids who are 10 or 12 or 14- most of us have picked it up as adults and are doing ok :)

I think you have a few years up your sleeve before you need to worry about it...then it might happen in spite of you. Visiting friends, watching tv at other peoples' homes, etc etc. If you come down too negative, I think pop culture then you are giving pop culture more power than it deserves. We have all survived it.

And in the end...your parents probably didnt like the culture you grew up in either, the music and movies and icons...but it happens to every generation, and I swore I wouldnt be a fuddy duddy to my kids. I listen to their music in the car and let them teach me things, because I want them to keep the communications open and not feel I am too alien to them. My son shows me his computer games.

I think there IS a point at which it is not helpful to be too rigid, and to find compromises that help it work both ways. And you can open up and have some fun and not be too judgemental of all the pop culture. My kids and I had a wonderful time enjoying Twilight together- the books and movies. I am glad we did that because it gives us a common language. If it werent for my kids though I would never have read them.

But as I said, you are a few years off needing to worry about it- I honestly dont think they are going to be upset with you for not being exposed to children's cartoons.

[Tammyla]

We were watching a local hs quiz bowl the other day and they had a pop-culture category...

 

The question was...drum roll...

 

Angelina Jolee and Brad Pitt have how many biological children together?:tongue_smilie:

[Guest Virginia Dawn]

I agree that if your kids have much exposure to any other families or groups, they will pick up on a lot of it, especially as they get older. I just set a boundary that I am comfortable with and let the rest roll over me.

 

IMO, popular culture has a lot to do with money and economics. If you don't have the money to spend on new stuff, you are out. I've been out for a long time. It doesn't bother me most of the time, and my kids are pretty discerning about recognizing trends and fads. They are given opportunities to earn money to allow them to follow their interests, it seems to make them more cautious and deliberate when it is not my money they are spending, lol. Yes, to some extent they are different from many of their peers. I like to think that is a good thing.

[OrganicAnn]

There are two aspects of cultural literacy.

 

One is for kids to get along with other kids. This often depends on what is on TV. It changes constantly and it doesn't last. I think little kids in school don't have that many conversations about what's on tv. Some kids watch PBS, some kids have certain channels from cable, some dish etc. There is not just one set of tv shows that all kids watch. It is like chasing an illusion. All it takes is a few kids to claim one show is great and the old popular show is for babies and suddenly everything changes.

 

The other aspect is what I'd call "classic" popular culture (if that isn't an oxymoron). I think if a teenage had never heard of the Beatles, Frank Sinatra, or Michael Jackson, then they would be illiterate in the popular cultural sense. They wouldn't have to know their songs, but at least know they were very popular singers/musicians. I think the people/trends/shows have stood the test of some time for them to be included in what I would consider classic popular culture. Of course everyone would probably have a different list of popular culture.

Edited January 1, 2010 by OrganicAnn

[laughing lioness]

I realized when we were off-loading our house (from the fire in October) just how odd we are. We don't have a lot of "hip" toys. We have legos, playmobile, Brio, books, books, more books, CD's, Dvd's, Language studies, art supplies, lots of tools, gardening equipment, etc. Very little electronic anything. No T.V. for the past decade. Yesterday my 9 yo told me he needs some of his "imagination" toys back (what we have left is still being cleaned).

My kids know how to learn. If they get to the point where they need to know how many kids Pitt and Jolee have together they can find out (hail, Google) We are just not that concerned about it becasue so much of it is meaningless anyway.

[whitestavern]

I have thought about this from time to time and decided it's not really an issue. Even though my kids aren't exposed to most of what's considered pop culture these days, they learn about it from other sources, at least enough to be able to participate in a conversation about a certain subject. My dc know all the TV characters, musicians, etc. through friends, magazines (you'd be amazed at some of the articles in Nat'l Geographic Kids!), relatives, stores, etc. As an adult I realize I have a broad knowledge of popular culture even though I'm not necessarily exposing myself to the shows/movies/music that they're originated from.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

 

The other aspect is what I'd call "classic" popular culture (if that isn't an oxymoron). I think if a teenage had never heard of the Beatles, Frank Sinatra, or Michael Jackson, then they would be illiterate in the popular cultural sense. They wouldn't have to know their songs, but at least know they were very popular singers/musicians. I think the people/trends/shows have stood the test of some time for them to be included in what I would consider classic popular culture. Of course everyone would probably have a different list of popular culture.

 

My kids are doubly disconnected. Not only do we not emphasize popular music and culture at our house (unless it is Dr. Who), but we've lived outside the US for much of their youth, so they have missed a lot of the general exposure.

 

So I have found myself explaining who Elvis and Michael Jacksonand having spontaneous music history lessons via You Tube. We watched Singing in the Rain over Christmas and I'll probably get some of the On the Road movies to introduce Bob Hope. When episode 3 of Star Wars was coming out, I made sure that my kids had seen the original trilogy so that they had something to use for conversation.

 

But I feel little pressure to exert effort to expose them to contemporary pop culture. I feel little more than contempt or pity for many of the current entertainers. And it isn't like whoever is popular now will matter in a couple of years.

[AnneC]

I was bullied and ostracised as a teenager for my lack of pop culture knowledge. Even now as an adult there are many conversations that I cannot participate in because I have no knowledge of that era. Conversations between my dh and my sil, or conversations with friends. A lot of small talk and conversation with people you are getting to know revolves around pop culture.

 

Now as an adult I don't watch much TV and don't follow pop culture, but that is my choice and I will not inflict that choice on my kids when they get older.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

I was bullied and ostracised as a teenager for my lack of pop culture knowledge. Even now as an adult there are many conversations that I cannot participate in because I have no knowledge of that era. Conversations between my dh and my sil, or conversations with friends. A lot of small talk and conversation with people you are getting to know revolves around pop culture.

 

Now as an adult I don't watch much TV and don't follow pop culture, but that is my choice and I will not inflict that choice on my kids when they get older.

 

I did have a pretty good exposure to pop culture and was taunted for getting good grades and wearing glasses. I think that the jerks who are going to bully people are rarely left at a loss for justifications for mocking others.

 

I'm not a big anti-pop culture person. I just am not willing to expend that much effort in that direction.

[angela in ohio]

I'm not worried about it. It's not very often now that I need to name the characters on ALF or talk about Bon Jovi. :D I am sure that whatever is a fad now will not matter one bit when dc are older.

[Jumping In Puddles]

Most 6 year olds I know don't only talk about what is on TV or the current movie. If you put him in school, I doubt he wouldn't have anything to talk about with the other kids.

 

I supervise the lunch hour for 1st-3rd grade at a Montessori school (my children attend part-time) and the kids talk about the ghost they think is inhabiting the barn and any new evidence of haunting, they hash out which game they want to play at recess and who is going to join or not, they talk quite a bit about their food (who is eating messy, has their mouth full and talking, who is sharing food, who is eating dessert first, etc), they play this game with rubber bands, where they wrap the band around fingers and someone chooses 3 fingers, then they slip the fingers through the rubber bands and announce "ok...you're a rabbit, or you're from Jupiter. :confused: and :lol: During recess they dig in the sandbox, swing, jump, play football or baseball. They built a "bug condo" out of rocks, they have a "mine" and a "coal factory" behind this bush, they collected onion grass which they decided to sell for $12/bunch and when they are inside they make crowns, draw with markers, play checkers/chess (very badly), build with legos.

 

They sometimes will talk about going to see a movie or an awesome movie they saw. I have NEVER heard them talk about popular music. I do remember one kid asking my ds if he saw a certain show on Cartoon Network and my ds said "no" so the kid described something to ds, who then said "cool!" and that was it.

 

My point is that kids, especially at 6, don't rely on tv or music for their conversations.

 

As an adult, I do enjoy some pop culture and I don't really care if someone else thinks it is a waste of time. For me, I'm glad that I watched Seinfeld and I'm glad that I get the pop culture references that came out of that show. I was entertained while watching it, and I still get a laugh thinking about it.

[Ginevra]

I think when they are little, I don't really care if they know about what the "other" kids have in their culture. So, say maybe 8 or 9 or younger. But eventually, I do think it's good for them to at least know what "Hannah Montana" is or know what "Pokemon" refers to. Not that they have to watch those shows or play those games, but that they should have a casual awareness of what it is.

 

I do think a kid can be too "sheltered" and so have no way to relate to the majority of other kids/people.

[Ginevra]

For me, I'm glad that I watched Seinfeld and I'm glad that I get the pop culture references that came out of that show. I was entertained while watching it, and I still get a laugh thinking about it.

 

That made me laugh, because "Seinfeld" referrences are usually what spring to mind when people talk about this subject. We use The Soup Nazi references a lot around here, ie. "No Blankets for You!" or "No ice cream sundaes for you!" :lol::lol::lol: Even my kids, who post-date Seinfeld, are accustomed to this reference just from hearing me and dh talk about it.

[Jumping In Puddles]

I wanted to mention that my daughter knows who Hannah Montana is and according to her, she loves HM. She has never seen an episode and I don't think she even knows she has a tv show. But, she sees her image everywhere and for some reason she thinks all teen girls in images are HM. She has a barbie doll that she thinks is HM. I don't make a big deal out of it.

 

My dd also told me she was playing tinkerbell with a friend but it wasn't that Tink. it was Tinkerbell and the Lost Treasure. She didn't seem to care that she had no idea that TLT was a new movie out. She picked up on what it was about and used her imagination.

[Jumping In Puddles]

That made me laugh, because "Seinfeld" referrences are usually what spring to mind when people talk about this subject. We use The Soup Nazi references a lot around here, ie. "No Blankets for You!" or "No ice cream sundaes for you!" :lol::lol::lol: Even my kids, who post-date Seinfeld, are accustomed to this reference just from hearing me and dh talk about it.

 

:lol: The other one that springs to mind around here is Office Space the movie. Sometimes my dh will say he doesn't want to go to work anymore, so he's just going to stop going. :tongue_smilie: Oh, there are so many from that movie! Or the movie Airplane. Another movie with many references "Don't call me Shirley!" etc.

 

If I were to shun all pop-culture I probably wouldn't laugh as much because it's the pop culture comedy that I like. The celebrities and their lives are not interesting to me. Reality tv is not interesting to me, but give me a good comedy and I'm happy. :)

 

 

ETA: my avatar is a bit of...well, the best of pop culture! :lol: Some on this board get it, some won't and they don't know what they are missing! (hehe, just kidding!)

Edited January 2, 2010 by Jumping In Puddles

[gandpsmommy]

I'm sort of in the middle on this one. I really don't see the need to make sure my kids know pop culture, but I also don't see the need to completely prevent them from knowing some things. They actually got very little exposure to pop culture before we moved three years ago. We lived in a small college town where there were a lot of Waldorf-style parents and unschoolers. The kids did watch some cartoons, but just the innocent Little Bear kind of stuff. The neighbor kids here introduced them to the wider world of Webkinz, video games, SpongeBob, Hannah Montana, etc. But we still don't really participate too deeply. We really aren't into the Disney Channel or Nickelodeon. Dd was never into Hannah Montana, and didn't even know who the Jonas Brothers were when asked by a relative if she liked them. But she does like Taylor Swift and listen to her music. We go to a lot of movies. We do have Wii and Nintendo ds. But my kids balance it out with a lot of other activities and interests.

 

I grew up with almost no knowledge of pop culture. I did watch tv, but it was only select shows, and we rarely ever went to the movies and didn't listen to any music except gospel/church music. In high school and college I had no idea who famous movie stars and musicians were. And I still don't know much 80's or 90's trivia, even though that's when I grew up. I don't necessarily want my kids to be that out of the loop. I don't see any harm in letting them watch a silly cartoon, play a video game, or listen to good popular music. I do draw the line at books, though. Absolutely no Junie B. Jones or that kind of rubbish in our house.

[Crimson Wife]

Don't you guys ever take your kids to Target/Walmart? We don't have TV, but my kids have picked up on what's popular simply through observing what the mass merchants are selling. My 7 y.o. was dancing around the other day with a wooden spoon pretending it was a microphone so that she could play "Camp Rock". :lol:

[helena]

I think ultimately it isn't important at all. The world is chock full of people who don't get Seinfeld or Curb your Enthusiasm quotes, and life is working out perfectly fine for them.

I think here in the US kids can and do catch flack for being out of the loop, I don't think it's fair to put them at a (pop?)cultural disadvantage. I've met some homeschool families that are raising older kids who are "freaks".. their pants are pulled up to their chins, their hair is all funky...it's not right. It's like the parents are trying to prove a point at the kids expense. Sure clothes don't matter, sure pop culture doesn't matter, sure it's what's on the inside that counts, until you cross a line of "oh man you poor kid". I also think that it's giving to much power to electronics to avoid all of it across the board. It turns it into more than what it is, yet another modern tool to be used with balance and according to your ethics. I love movies, but I believe movies that show extreme violence are damaging to the soul, I avoid these movies, and I'm comfortable to say no to these kinds of films and why if a friend wants to go see one.

I think it's about being well rounded, and that is a very personal definition based on a lot of different factors.

 

I was raised in a home without tv, we ate totally wholesome foods, I was raised with very proper manners, etc. In contrast to that my parents were very young when they had me. They were hippies (although back then my mom would say she wasn't one :)) and I was exposed to everything that goes with that. So was it a traditional upbringing, was it immersed in what was pop culture then, was it counter culture?

 

This subject has always been very personal to me growing up, and is now as an adult raising my own daughters. So much of what I grew up being into in the 80s (and the 90's as a young adult) was what I considered counter culture. Punk scene, vegan/vegetarian culture, and all that jazz...but now in 2010 all of that is very pop culture to me. It has been diluted and tamed.

It's now made pop culture or "retro" from the late 70s and 80s and it has been pacified and marketed to death in present culture.

 

I feel like I walk a line with my kids very similar to how my husband and I grew up. We are very traditional and conservative in many aspects. No tv, we don't drink, my kids don't know any young singers (like Hannah Montana), no mini skirts, no dating in the future etc..

BUT my husband is in the music industry and they have grown up exposed to that, they've grown up around punks, hip hop artists, poets, metal kids...they've spent time in recording studios, concerts and festivals. My kids are in familiar territory in that whole scene (and could care less about the fame side of it) and they are equally comfortable spending the day with Sufis, praying and discussing faith and such.

 

I hope and pray my kids don't get sucked into the pop culture abyss. I have the advantage (disadvantage) to see what young "hip" (I know, that word is out now :)) culture is all about. It is nasty. And not oh no I have herpes 1960s nasty, I mean a whole new level of oh my goodness :eek: nasty. I can't help but see a connection of what parents allow and don't allow in their home to going out in the world to the free for all. I am unapologetically strict and unapologetically a product of my upbringing. I don't care if it seems contradictory to some people. I love crass shows like 'Inbetweeners' but I will not allow my kids to watch Disney shows.

 

That said I don't think Disney shows wreck a kid, I just don't want that reality in my life.

Edited January 2, 2010 by helena

[LibraryLover]

I'll admit that I quietly shudder at the exposure

.

 

 

That's what she said.

[Laura Corin]

I think that putting a toe in the water is fine - it gives my boys something to talk about with acquaintances, although they also talk about the other aspects of their lives with good friends. We allow limited video gaming (two hours a week) and television (also two hours a week). When we hear that something is popular, we'll mention it to the boys if we think it's suitable. Calvin has been watching the latest Dr Who episodes this Christmas - he likes them and, as they are wildly popular, he gains a topic of conversation with others.

 

Laura

[Garga]

I'm right in the middle.

 

This is the world/time that I live in and I don't see everything in it as inherently wrong or harmful or bad or unworthy of attention.

 

Some of pop culture is stupid, and some is very entertaining. There's nothing wrong with a bit of entertainment. I think that when people close themselves from all types of popular culture, they make themselves very boring and isolated. (And where is their sense of humor?)

 

What entertains an adult is different from what entertains a kid. I find Clone Wars (cartoon based on Star Wars) to be very boring, but my kids love it.

 

So, they watch a little bit of kid pop culture, I watch a little bit of grown up pop culture (Lost) and everyone's happy.

 

But we don't watch things I find offensive, like that horrible cartoon Chowder. And I don't watch offensive grown-up stuff. Or listen to offensive music.

 

Bottom line: we move about in this world and pick and choose what we'll listen to/watch. We don't go overboard, however, and if something goes too much against our basic beliefs, we don't listen/watch it anymore. Simple.

[Jumping In Puddles]

I think ultimately it isn't important at all. The world is chock full of people who don't get Seinfeld or Curb your Enthusiasm quotes, and life is working out perfectly fine for them.

 

Those that don't get Seinfeld are not like the "freaks" that you describe and those that do get it are not all pop culture junkies, following celebrities and trashy music.

 

I have never seen Curb Your Enthusiasm, so maybe I'm missing some references and life is working out fine for me. :) I agree with you, I think ultimately it really isn't important at all. I like to pick and choose.

[Word Nerd]

That's what she said.

 

:lol:

[Word Nerd]

Don't you guys ever take your kids to Target/Walmart? We don't have TV, but my kids have picked up on what's popular simply through observing what the mass merchants are selling. My 7 y.o. was dancing around the other day with a wooden spoon pretending it was a microphone so that she could play "Camp Rock". :lol:

 

I wondered the same thing. I don't see how it would even be possible to completely shelter a child from pop culture, regardless of whether they watch much TV. On a related note, we avoid Hannah Montana and most Disney and Nick shows, but Phineas and Ferb is a great show our whole family enjoys.

[Matryoshka]

I think I'm somewhere in the middle too. When my kids were younger, I was very strict about it. Pretty much the only pop culture they got was Mr. Rogers, and that was from a generation or two ago.

 

I am still completely uninterested in pop culture for them via knowing the trendy singers (they know Hannah Montana is that girl whose picture is up all over Walmart). We don't have cable, so Disney and Nick shows aren't even an option. Now that they're 11 and many of their peers are getting sucked into this stuff, they hear a lot more about it. They have friends obsessed with Twilight. I gave them a plot synopsis so they're not totally lost, but they don't even want to read it (yay). They've played Wii at friends houses, so they're familiar with that even if we don't own one.

 

Some pop culture that I feel may stand the test of time or has some redeeming value I expose them to when I think they're ready. I let them read all the Harry Potters the year they turned 10, and yes, now they're huge fans. They have yet to see Star Wars, but I'm sure in a couple more years I'll watch it with them. Starting last year we let them watch Dancing with the Stars and So You Think You Can Dance (although we usually fast forward through 90% of the results shows where there's a ton of pop culture - we only watch on TiVo so there's no commercials either). I even let them watch a season of American Idol, which they agreed wasn't worth it. We were just studying the '50s, and I played them Elvis and Buddy Holly music, and took I Love Lucy dvds out of the library (and Leave it to Beaver ones, but they don't want to watch them, lol. They do love Lucy.) I also just took a bunch of episodes of The Muppet Show out of the library for them to watch.

 

With the wealth of choices out there today, no one's going to have seen every show or movie, or know every singer or get every reference. I think if they can learn to be discerning about their choices and not just follow the crowd, that goes a long way.

Edited January 2, 2010 by matroyshka

[Jean in Newcastle]

If you walk ever walk into a mall, I don't see how you could remain ignorant of who Hannah Montana, SpongeBob and even Twilight are - at least in a "broad stroke" sort of way!

 

I do want my kids to have that broad stroke knowledge of popular culture. For that reason, when we were studying modern history, we went decade by decade through some of the main aspects of popular culture. We watched a Charlie Chaplin silent movie, listed to some ragtime and talked about flappers and prohibition for the twenties. We listened to some Beatles, looked at some Jackson Pollock pictures, talked about flower children etc. for the sixties.

 

For this past decade, I would want them to know what "emo" music is, some of the popular technology (IPods and Wii come to mind), know that there were bank failures and know some of the major actors and movies. We would know in a broad stroke way who "Harry Potter" is and even what "Twilight" is. (It is harder to choose the important things in a decade that we just went through - what will stand the test of time and be remembered?!)

 

If you have a basic idea that Angelina Jolie and Brad Pitt are actors, and if you further have a basic idea that they have a lot of kids - even if you don't know exactly how many of them they have - then I think you have more than enough popular cultural literacy. I don't think it is important to know every actor of a decade but they are some of the more important (or at least famous) actors out there.

[Stacy in NJ]

I occasionally eat at McDonalds (love french fries and chocolate shakes), watch "pop" TV or movies. I also enjoy well prepared nutrious meals and better quality books and movies. I allow my sons access to pop culture on a limited basis. I'm not one to think that modest amounts of Sponge Bob, Hannah Montana, or Burger King will ruin your child. A diet only or mostly consisting of them will. But then I think lifestyles that encourage only the "good" things can be limiting as well.

 

Balance and self discipline, like in most anything else, is key.

[dragons in the flower bed]

If I put my 6yo into school this year, chances are he'd have almost nothing to talk about with the other kids because he is culturally illiterate according to their tastes.

 

He'd be caught up within a week. I don't bother to teach my children anything that advertisers are investing millions of dollars a year into motivating the children to learn independently.

[Nicole M]

He'd be caught up within a week. I don't bother to teach my children anything that advertisers are investing millions of dollars a year into motivating the children to learn independently.

 

Exactly! Especially for the very young children.

 

It's a little harder to catch up when you're older. I have a friend, an American, who grew up in Yemen. She finished school a year early (an international school), and her parents wanted her to experience one year of American public high school before she went to college. So she basically repeated her senior year, living with her grandparents. For the first few months that she lived in the US, she had absolutely no idea what anyone was talking about, ever. She heard English coming out mouths, but there was zero meaning. Finally, she started watching TV and started to understand a little.

 

For me, I don't think it's necessary to seek out popular culture "stuff" for my children, and I don't intend to ever own a television again in my life. We've watched together the Stargate series (plural, though I don't recommend the newest one) and my older son has watched Lost, online. He is 18 and that has been his only exposure to TV popular culture. He copes just fine in social settings. ;)

[LibraryLover]

Pop culture and mass media are two different things.

 

Pop culture varies and is particular to area. Pokemon might be important in one school culture, but non- existent in another. It's Marilyn Monroe one decade and a Brittany in another. It's Anne Boleyn then it's Jane Seymour. It's constantly changing.

 

Mass Media is what I think most folks are talking about. Mass Media is hard to avoid. Mass media is when you're trying to watch a little league game and the name of the local bank is painted on the back fence, or when you are watching movie about one thing, but a Coke can is in every scene. You can't avoid it if you tried.

 

Pop culture can be harmless- knowing who Big Bird is, or knowing that Ellen is replacing Simon. Mass media is more dangerous, imo, and kids are exposed to it no matter what and have to learn to see beyond it and behind it.

[hillfarm]

IMO, the purpose of most pop culture from the audience's stand point is entertainment. There's nothing wrong with allowing an appropriate amount of entertainment that is suitable in terms of a child's age and the family's values.

 

When dd was little, I let her watch a bit of television, generally the Franklin, Bob the Builder, Little Bear, etc. cartoons. As she is an only child and a prolific talker, boy oh boy did we discuss those shows. She felt it crucial to inform me of every opinion she had about every character and what they were doing. I felt those discussions provided an ample supply of character training moments and cautionary tales.

 

Now that she is 11, I permit her to watch some other things that are more geared toward her current age group. The lifestyles and plots are rarely realistic and never represent our lifestyle. As before, we discuss much of what she sees. How and why it is different. Whether it is good, congruent with our beliefs, acceptable. How would she parent a child who was involved in such activities, etc...? Wonderful discussion starters.

 

Why do I permit this incursion of pop culture (aka drivel) into our lives? We live on a small farm at the end of a dead end road. After chores and schooling, there is only so much swinging, reading, playing in the woods, playing with pets, etc. that one kid can tolerate. So not in place of those things, but after those things, I let dd check out what the rest of her peers are seeing. It fills the purpose of entertainment and education for her.

 

I would never expose her to these influences if I felt she was not yet mature enough to handle them (there are many things I don't expose ME to because I can't handle them, either!). And it is not like she isolates herself in her room to watch--she views this material in our living room with the rest of the family frequently passing through and often asking questions or commenting. Nor does her viewing time take over the rest of her life. (BTW, we don't use any licensed merchandise--if they want us to advertise their products, they can contract with us, provide the materials, and pay us for our work!)

 

But I expect my dd to grow up to be a leader and to have influence over others. IMO, her passing familiarity with popular culture will give her a language in common with others. The Bible talks about becoming as a gentile in order to evangelize among the gentiles. I feel that we are controlling most of the negative aspects that come along with a knowledge of popular culture, and are mining all the positive learning potential we can out of contrast and comparison studies. At the same time, our dd will not be shocked or mesmerized by these things when she goes out into the world on her own and eventually does come across them.

 

I can imagine a future exchange where she would ask a friend to remember how Hannah Montana was always trying to hide her true identity and whether that was honest. And use that conversation to get into whether it is acceptable for our politicians to hide their true identities from their constituents.

 

I realize that our way would not be right for all families. And I certainly am not an advocate of exposing children to things they are not ready for or to give them a steady diet of pop culture at the expense of a great academic education or other healthy pursuits. My point is that I don't think pop culture can be totally avoided and that by experiencing it in a controlled manner and seeking ways to use it in a beneficial manner, it can be a positive instead of a negative in our children's lives.

Edited January 2, 2010 by hillfarm

[Sebastian (a lady)]

Exactly! Especially for the very young children.

 

It's a little harder to catch up when you're older. I have a friend, an American, who grew up in Yemen. She finished school a year early (an international school), and her parents wanted her to experience one year of American public high school before she went to college. So she basically repeated her senior year, living with her grandparents. For the first few months that she lived in the US, she had absolutely no idea what anyone was talking about, ever. She heard English coming out mouths, but there was zero meaning. Finally, she started watching TV and started to understand a little.

 

For me, I don't think it's necessary to seek out popular culture "stuff" for my children, and I don't intend to ever own a television again in my life. We've watched together the Stargate series (plural, though I don't recommend the newest one) and my older son has watched Lost, online. He is 18 and that has been his only exposure to TV popular culture. He copes just fine in social settings. ;)

 

I might still argue that this had more to do with a drastic culture shift than just a lack of exposure to contemporary media. I moved from WA to TX before my senior year of high school and found that I also had trouble understanding people when they talked to me and often had little to discuss with them. And this was despite having a shared media background.

 

I had spent the intervening summer as an exchange student and found myself surrounded by people who thought that Washington was snowed under the entire year and acted as if going to Colorado was world travel.

 

I suggested the book Third Culture Kids in a different thread as having a good amount of relevance to homeschoolers. It explores the idea that stradling multiple cultures can result in a disconnect with either or both. I would argue that homeschooling and less than average media consumption both have a tendency to make one a stranger and an outcast, even in one's home culture. (Which is not an arguement against homeschooling or for a larger media diet.)

[KidsHappen]

Well, I am not terribly up on pop culture but I do watch Bones and most of the time I feel like Brennan with the, "I don't know what that means."

[Daisy]

I'm not quite sure what to say. I don't avoid it but we are a no-tv, non-gaming family so we just don't see it. We don't really get it at Target/Walmart. We aren't big shoppers and my children don't wander around the toy aisles looking at everything. They just want legos. LOL.

 

I find there are more negatives associated with pop culture than positives so I'm not out to educate my children on pop culture. I figure they will eventually get it just from exposure.

 

Hubby and I are completely out of the loop when it comes to current pop culture and we don't really care. Actually we find the banal conversations centered around who's hooked up with who and what is playing on the telly, torturous.

 

And yet, I feel for my 10yo daughter who is struggling a bit. She literally does not understand (comprehend) the conversations her peers are having. They talk about nothing but video game and tv characters and use terminology & slang that we don't use. She says it is like they are talking a foreign language and it is so boring. They talk in txt msg almost. So I tell her to bring up topics she is interested in. "Mom, then they don't know what I'm talking about!" Perhaps one reason why homeschoolers tend to talk to homeschoolers or to adults more often?

 

She is, however, aware of 1950's culture. LOL. Watching Robin Hood and Daniel Boone tv shows DVDs and reading Bobbsey Twins. Sigh. What to do?

[nmoira]

I don't think that exposure to any specific cultural element such as Hanna Montana is critical, but I can't imagine pretending that, say, manga or anime doesn't exist. I tend not to shy away so much from forms as from (what I perceive to be) crap. However, the girls are still young and so DH and I are responsible for what comes into the house. I'm content to let go when they're older, knowing that in their younger years they've been shielded from literally hundreds of thousands of television commercials and hundreds of hours of pap.

 

We're hit and miss, and most of our pop culture exposure isn't contemporary material, though, with the exception of Disney, not as a matter of principle: we live in a relatively sheltered crunchy neighbourhood and just aren't exposed to it. I'm sometimes a bit nervous that they're probably exposed to more things from DH's and my childhood era than their own (the original "Land of the Lost" shows, etc.) But it's not really limited to that.

 

I think these are our big ones:

 

 

• No cable or broadcast TV, but the kids watch SpongeBob on demand at Grandma's. They do not know who Hanna Montana is and have never seen a Disney cartoon (though they have seen "Bedknobs and Broomsticks" and "Mary Poppins")
  
• They have a Wii and are conversant in Pokémon, Mario, Zelda, etc.
  
• Bugs Bunny, Animaniacs
  
• some manga, including the original Astroboys
  
• Miyazaki films
  
• movie exposure has been relatively limited because the girls are sensitive to the volume and visual bombardment. As they can handle more will continue to broaden our range.
  

 

[JumpedIntoTheDeepEndFirst]

I think it just doesn't matter if you are up on pop culture. I don't think that I would make any extra effort to teach my kids pop culture to be sure they could "cope" in society. I am far more concerned that they grow up with positive values and being happy with the people they are and the interests they have. If that includes some pop culture we will assess that as necessary. In the mean time I just want them to be happy with who they are-if that means no Barney or Barbie and lots of Playmobil and Legos when young great. If they love music that is never heard on American Idol-so what.

 

Pop culture will come to them when they are curious. Then starts the debate on what pop culture at what age your family will allow.

[mirth]

Yes there actually is such a thing -- the study of how Madonna (yes, the singer) has influenced western culture and feminism. It is an offshoot of journalism or communications degrees.

 

If this is what it means to (pay to be) be amongst the titled culturally literate, then count me amongst the blissful and ignorant.

[LibraryLover]

I am feeling a little at a loss because my Star Trek knowledge is baseline to say the least. :D Off to study. I've got hours and hours of Hulu to deal with now. I am still two seasons behind with Hoarders, *and* Toddlers & Tiaras. I've stopped trying to catch up with 19 and Counting, now this!

Edited January 4, 2010 by LibraryLover