BalanceSeeker Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 I'm not an extremist at all. I just don't think I want to live in the U.S. long-term. Hubby and I basically just want to be left alone so we can be free and happy. I want to be able to turn on my A/C when it's 123 degrees and not pay exhorbitant taxes because I like being comfortable in my home. I want to decide the best way to spend my hard-earned money. And my list goes on. I'm conservative, and would love the place I live to reflect my values. Is there any country that would be a better fit for me? I don't want to spark a debate, this is a truly innocent question! Christa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nestof3 Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 I honestly don't know, but aren't most European countries more socialist than the US? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz CA Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 I'm not an extremist at all. I just don't think I want to live in the U.S. long-term. Hubby and I basically just want to be left alone so we can be free and happy. I want to be able to turn on my A/C when it's 123 degrees and not pay exhorbitant taxes because I like being comfortable in my home. I want to decide the best way to spend my hard-earned money. And my list goes on. I'm conservative, and would love the place I live to reflect my values. Is there any country that would be a better fit for me? I don't want to spark a debate, this is a truly innocent question! Christa SIGH. If you find a place like you described, this side of heaven - let me know. It gets a little depressing listening to any kind of news lately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amy g. Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 I've heard good things about Costa Rica. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amiechoke Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 (edited) ...let us know. Europe, though pretty and historic, is more socialist than here. I saw something funny, though - it was about rebuilding Iraq. "Let's loan them our constitution. Heck, we're not using it at the moment...." :-) ATB Edited May 20, 2009 by amiechoke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtroad Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 DH and I have discussed this subject several times. If this country continues down this highly invasive, highy regulative, law & constitution ignoring path to Socialism & eventually communism..... where can we go? I have read the Road to Serfdom... we are on it & I want to get off! I am afraid the US is the last land of hope & I don't know where to go. Europe, South America, and Asia are all dictators or socialist or communist. Others are so poor or considered 3rd world without any roads, clean water or commerce. Australia is closer to Europe than we are! How does New Zealand work? Israel? How long can they survive if we abandon them? We may have to fight for our own country & I do not know where to start. I write my congressman but he is clueless & lives in his millionare world voting on the dumbest stuff. One Senator is smart.. one is in it for profit & power. The odds are against me. So sad. You ARE NOT ALONE!!!!!!:ack2: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stripe Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Are you looking to be merely left alone by the government? You might try a country with no government, or a very weak one. (Of course, that doesn't mean everyone will leave you alone.) The downside is that most anarchies are weak on, say, a non-corrupt police force, roads, or medical system. The US probably is one of the more "comfortable" countries, when you consider the poverty in most of the world. In most places, large amounts of hot water from the tap (never mind safe drinking water at any temperature) and air conditioning are highly unusual. You could consider relocating to a cooler climate. Most parts of the US don't reach 123 degrees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosy Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 DH and I joke that we're hoping that Texas exercises it's right to secede from the US, then we would move there. Otherwise, I'm not sure you could do much better than here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keptwoman Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 DH and I have discussed this subject several times. If this country continues down this highly invasive, highy regulative, law & constitution ignoring path to Socialism & eventually communism..... where can we go? I have read the Road to Serfdom... we are on it & I want to get off! I am afraid the US is the last land of hope & I don't know where to go. Europe, South America, and Asia are all dictators or socialist or communist. Others are so poor or considered 3rd world without any roads, clean water or commerce. Australia is closer to Europe than we are! How does New Zealand work? Israel? How long can they survive if we abandon them? We may have to fight for our own country & I do not know where to start. I write my congressman but he is clueless & lives in his millionare world voting on the dumbest stuff. One Senator is smart.. one is in it for profit & power. The odds are against me. So sad. You ARE NOT ALONE!!!!!!:ack2: I don't think you would like New Zealand either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BalanceSeeker Posted May 20, 2009 Author Share Posted May 20, 2009 Are you looking to be merely left alone by the government? You might try a country with no government, or a very weak one. (Of course, that doesn't mean everyone will leave you alone.) The downside is that most anarchies are weak on, say, a non-corrupt police force, roads, or medical system. The US probably is one of the more "comfortable" countries, when you consider the poverty in most of the world. In most places, large amounts of hot water from the tap (never mind safe drinking water at any temperature) and air conditioning are highly unusual. You could consider relocating to a cooler climate. Most parts of the US don't reach 123 degrees. No, not NO government. LIMITED government. Where free-market rules for the most part. Not NO police, etc. enforcing the law. That would be ridiculous. Just not...making me pay for my evil of wanting to be comfortable in my home, or for using gas to drive to my job type of punishment, uh, I mean taxation. And, I don't want socialized medicine, either. I'm a nurse, and I know what will happen when that day comes. I guess this doesn't exist? I knew if I asked the hive, I'd get my answer. So bummed. So incredibly bummed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PinkInTheBlue Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 No suggestion...just in agreement. If you decide where this place is maybe we can get discounted tickets to all fly there. :) It certainly is not here and doesn't seem to be heading that way either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JenniferB Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Maybe a deserted island. :lol: Do they have air conditioning there? We don't need A/C here in WA state. I love WA state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Have you ever lived in another country? I would suggest living abroad for a while and experiencing the differences for yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WTMCassandra Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 We don't need A/C here in WA state. Speak for yourself! ; ) It was 115 when we were house-hunting here in Tri-Cities almost three years ago. It gets VERY hot here, although not humid, thank God! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cricket Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 DH and I joke that we're hoping that Texas exercises it's right to secede from the US, then we would move there. Otherwise, I'm not sure you could do much better than here. We'll join you! :001_smile: My dad has always said he would like to move to Tonga. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LND1218 Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 DH and I joke that we're hoping that Texas exercises it's right to secede from the US, then we would move there. Otherwise, I'm not sure you could do much better than here. Yep! We'd go to Texas too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katemary63 Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 No, not NO government. LIMITED government. Where free-market rules for the most part. Not NO police, etc. enforcing the law. That would be ridiculous. Just not...making me pay for my evil of wanting to be comfortable in my home, or for using gas to drive to my job type of punishment, uh, I mean taxation. And, I don't want socialized medicine, either. I'm a nurse, and I know what will happen when that day comes. I guess this doesn't exist? I knew if I asked the hive, I'd get my answer. So bummed. So incredibly bummed. :iagree::iagree:We're trying to figure out how we will afford our next farm truck once the new regulations on vehicle emissions, MPG, etc go into effect. I guess we'll have to make this one last forever! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josie Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 ...let us know. Europe, though pretty and historic, is more socialist than here. I saw something funny, though - it was about rebuilding Iraq. "Let's loan them our constitution. Heck, we're not using it at the moment...." :-) ATB Wow!! This "funny" is so sad, but so true. Sad, very, very sad!:crying::( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emeraldjoy Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 I just try to be thankful that I can vent about my frustrations without penalty in this country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Saudi Arabia will be perfect. It get's to 123. You can run the A/C full time and no one will bat an eye (heck, they'd look at you funny if you didn't). And it's very conservative. You will love it! :D You're not hung up on driving your own car, are you? Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demal Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 According to The Heritage Foundation and the Cato Institute: Hong Kong. http://www.heritage.org/index/ranking.aspx http://www.cato.org/pubs/efw/map/index.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vida Winter Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 I'd guess that the most conservative, hands-off places in the whole world right now are Texas, Idaho, and possibly Alaska. Other countries are far further down the socialism path, although we seem to be running fast to catch up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowan25 Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 ...let us know. Europe, though pretty and historic, is more socialist than here. I saw something funny, though - it was about rebuilding Iraq. "Let's loan them our constitution. Heck, we're not using it at the moment...." :-) ATB That is funny..........and rather sick and sad too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brindee Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 (edited) Speak for yourself! ; ) It was 115 when we were house-hunting here in Tri-Cities almost three years ago. It gets VERY hot here, although not humid, thank God!That's true, Tri-Cities and Yakima tend to get hotter than we do nearer to Seattle! But hey, we got really hot for 3 days in August last year, so there! That was our "hot summer"! :D "The grass is always greener..." My oldest has some of these same thoughts. I tell him he's already in the best country. When you're in those places for awhile, America looks much better! Edited May 20, 2009 by Brindee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 (edited) Saudi Arabia will be perfect. It get's to 123. You can run the A/C full time and no one will bat an eye (heck, they'd look at you funny if you didn't). And it's very conservative. You will love it! :D You're not hung up on driving your own car, are you? Bill :iagree: You didn't mention the really cheap gas! Of course, even the more conservative women here will have to get used to dressing more modestly if they don't want to raise eyebrows or have people thinking they look trashy. Edited May 20, 2009 by Mrs Mungo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stansclan89 Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 I'd guess that the most conservative, hands-off places in the whole world right now are Texas, Idaho, and possibly Alaska. Other countries are far further down the socialism path, although we seem to be running fast to catch up. And Montana. I've never lived anywhere that was as conservative as here (We've lived in ID, WA, OR, AZ). The government is very hands-off also (as much as they can be with our feds). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibbygirl Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 I'm not an extremist at all. I just don't think I want to live in the U.S. long-term. Hubby and I basically just want to be left alone so we can be free and happy. I want to be able to turn on my A/C when it's 123 degrees and not pay exhorbitant taxes because I like being comfortable in my home. I want to decide the best way to spend my hard-earned money. And my list goes on. I'm conservative, and would love the place I live to reflect my values. Is there any country that would be a better fit for me? I don't want to spark a debate, this is a truly innocent question! Christa Maybe you just need a different state?? I think the taxes in the US are pretty low compared to other countries in the world, you have a lot of freedom here too that you don't necessarily have in other places. It is legal to homeschool your children which is not legal in many other countries, you already speak the language of the land and have protections of a citizen and the employment rate compared to other countries is pretty good here. Not to mention you even have AC and other first world creature comforts. Gasoline is decided lower here than in Europe as well as the taxes and you have access to state of the art hospitals and medical care as well. I can see getting tired and longing for the greener grass on the other side, but maybe you just need a vacation?? I'm not trying to convince you of anything, just trying to point out the good things about living in the US. I love my husband's country (the Dominican Republic) I think it is breathtakingly beautiful, the people are warm and friendly, the food is great, but the downside is people are desperately poor. I've seen entire families living under overpasses on the side of the road with a cook fire burning right there to cook their food in and a makeshift clothesline on the side of the road to dry their clothes. The police are pretty corrupt, the government stability is always a little shaky, cashiers always pocket your change when you go to the grocery store etc. As much as I love visiting my hubby's country, when I see the good and the bad side by side, I still think living in the US is a pretty good thing. Just my humble 2 cents. :) I wish you and your husband all the best in searching for a place where you can feel home. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mommyrooch Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Sounds like you might like Oklahoma. In my opinion OK is the most conservative state in the nation. Take homeschooling for example. OK is the only state of all 50 states that actually has the right to homeschool written into their constitution. There is absolutely no jurisdiction on homeschooling. No testing, attendence requirements etc. Oklahoma residents are pretty much free to educate their kids in any way they see fit. I live in OK and love the conservative stance on homeschooling but I do respectfully disagree with the majority here about some of the other issues mentioned. I refuse to get into a political debate so I won't mention specifics but I will say that I personally believe that most of the changes our country is currently undergoing are long overdue. I'm definitely in the minority here though so I'll quietly fade into the background on this one. :leaving: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audrey Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 And, I don't want socialized medicine, either. I'm a nurse, and I know what will happen when that day comes. Well, you're out of luck, then because pretty much all the other civilized nations have some form of universal healthcare / socialized medicine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audrey Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 :iagree: You didn't mention the really cheap gas! Of course, even the more conservative women here will have to get used to dressing more modestly if they don't want to raise eyebrows or have people thinking they look trashy. :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tex-mex Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 (edited) I'm not an extremist at all. I just don't think I want to live in the U.S. long-term. Hubby and I basically just want to be left alone so we can be free and happy. I want to be able to turn on my A/C when it's 123 degrees and not pay exhorbitant taxes because I like being comfortable in my home. I want to decide the best way to spend my hard-earned money. And my list goes on. I'm conservative, and would love the place I live to reflect my values. Is there any country that would be a better fit for me? I don't want to spark a debate, this is a truly innocent question! Christa W-e-l-l... considering most of the world's nations hate the USA, their governments are more restrictive and taxes are higher, and freedoms/rights are not commonplace (i.e. UN Rights of the Child, voting, etc.) in all places. If you choose to go to a third world country... in all honesty, you'd just be grateful to have electricity to keep food cool and clean water. And let's not even talk about corruption in other countries... you think it is BAD here? Ha. Try going to India and getting a permit. Or a kidney transplant. You are very fortunate to live in the USA -- it isn't perfect. No place is. America is one of the last bastions of freedom. We Americans are very pampered compared to the rest of the world. Our poorer populations would be "rich" in other third world nations. Not to scare anyone... but none of this should surprise anyone what direction our country is going. Helloooo-o? Like what does the Bible say about end times and the world getting scarier to live in? Just means Jesus is coming soon. (Not sure what it means for the USA... I think it will become a police state by then. But so will all countries. ???) God is in control!!! Edited May 20, 2009 by tex-mex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BalanceSeeker Posted May 20, 2009 Author Share Posted May 20, 2009 I do rest in the fact that God is in control. I'd welcome Jesus coming with open arms. I LOVE my country. The old one. Heck, our dog's name is Liberty! I just don't recognize my country anymore based on the changes where we are becoming like everyone else. I don't see the majority of the changes as good, although some might be. Maybe a change in state is overdue. The federal govt would just get bigger anywhere, though. Socialized medicine. Phooey. Long wait times to be treated, higher rates of death, that's all I have to say about that. I've done the research. This, coming from someone who pays $1000/month for premiums. You'd think I'd welcome it. As for the freedom to speak of this at all...how long will that last? Truly, I mean that with all my heart, not to be a troublemaker :001_smile:. So, as far as outside countries...Saudi Arabia is the only one that is remotely appealing. As far as other states mentioned: TEXAS (always wanted to move there), Alaska, Oklahoma, Montana. I've been to Costa Rica. Aside from crummy roads, I didn't want to leave! (I had dental work done there...amazing medical care for much less!) They did the best job. Thanks for all the great ideas. Christa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soph the vet Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 I just try to be thankful that I can vent about my frustrations without penalty in this country. For now anyway...;). I have a friend who has a plan to move to some island in the Pacific that still believes in a free market. I haven't convinced dh yet that we should look into that:lol:. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hana Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 As for the freedom to speak of this at all...how long will that last? Truly, I mean that with all my heart, not to be a troublemaker :001_smile:. So, as far as outside countries...Saudi Arabia is the only one that is remotely appealing. As far as other states mentioned: TEXAS (always wanted to move there), Alaska, Oklahoma, Montana. Christa I'm curious in what ways you see the freedom to speak as you wish being curtailed. Also, I can't imagine thinking of Saudi Arabia as being a less restrictive government than the US, at least not if one is a woman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stripe Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 You have a truly fresh perspective -- much more than I'd imagined. I'm honestly impressed the Saudi Arabia is your ideal of freedom. (They do need nurses, if you want a job.) I'd never had an urge to live there before, but I'm rethinking everything! You should be able to find lots of domestic help; that's par for the course. I think you're on to something....What a person does in private (as opposed to in public) is not generally of much interest in Saudi Arabia. Certainly being personally extravagant won't be curtailed there any time soon. It's virtually impossible to become a citizen, though. That's a bit of a trick. But you might be able to live there. (Don't worry about the driving thing -- you can get a driver, and probably the laws about women driving will be changed. It's not as if the men have much to recommend them in terms of driving safety -- it's quite dangerous. Apparently this is another example where "freedom" shouldn't be curtailed by following the driving rules.) Certainly all the Gulf countries will give you the opportunity to experience 123 degree temperature, and embrace you for wanting to run the A/C. Perhaps consider UAE and Qatar as well. Yemen, I'm not so sure about the prevalence of A/C, but the government may be lax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moxie Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 I plan on staying in the US and working my fingers to the bone to make sure we remain "the land of the free". Running isn't the answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MomofSeven Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 My husband oversees his investments and portfolio, manages his household and foundations. Just think Joseph from the Bible, for modern times. Anyway, this man, who is a millionaire, would agree with many of you here, in terms of feeling his freedom infringed upon and more importantly, being punished for his success. So, he's currently moving most of his assets offshore and he's presently in New Zealand researching that country as a possible country for emmigration should things in this country continue down this high-regulation, less individual freedom path. His family are multi-millionaires, but in many ways I don't envy their position. They pay over 60% of their income in taxes! He has been targeted for his conservative beliefs by government agencies on more than one occasion. He's been investigated for having firearms and hosting political fundraisers in his house. All of which would be considered harmless if done by the average citizen, but his exceptional wealth makes him a bigger target. The saddest part of all this is that just 15 years ago, this man and his family were just like us...he started his business in his daughter's bedroom. He's lived the American dream and now, in many respects, he's being punished for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firefly Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Well, I've heard Alec Baldwinia is nice. :lol: Saudi Arabia? Having lived there for nearly a decade, I can say it is not a place to move to if you are seeking more freedom (especially as a woman). There were lots of things I loved about KSA, but freedom (as in a serious lack of) was not one of them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelli in TN Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 :iagree: You didn't mention the really cheap gas! Of course, even the more conservative women here will have to get used to dressing more modestly if they don't want to raise eyebrows or have people thinking they look trashy. I'm guessing those strapless and spaghetti strap shirts probably won't go over well there, will they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Virginia Dawn Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Good luck. I don't think there is a perfect place where one can have life exactly the way they want it with no drawbacks at all. The world is becoming smaller and more tightly controlled everyday. It's been happening for decades, even centuries. My dad was just telling me last night that he thinks digital communication (cell phones vs. landlines) will become mandated in a few years, and then taxation of e-mail and internet usage. I could handle a quasi-Amish lifestyle right now. I'm so tired of everyone assuming that I am fully modernized. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MamaT Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 My dh and I have had the same thoughts of moving to another country eventually. We have looked at Costa Rica and we LOVE it there, but they are making new laws that make it harder for expats to stay in their country right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keptwoman Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 (edited) Socialized medicine. Phooey. Long wait times to be treated, higher rates of death, that's all I have to say about that. I've done the research. This, coming from someone who pays $1000/month for premiums. You'd think I'd welcome it. Statements like this always amuse me. I always wonder if folks over there get their info from US Insurance companies who have a lot to loose with socialised medicine. I'm very very very happy to be in a country with socialised medicine. I'd like to see the proof of higher rates of death because frankly I don't believe it. I will happily pay my $150 health insurance a month to be sure that I can skip the queues (not that they are that bad... in fact sometimes we just sit in queue because it's not worth paying the $500 insurance excess for a hospital admission not to) I see the doctor I want when I want for a whole $15 out of pocket. I happily had my babies for free with excellent care including home visits to support the establishment of breastfeeding. And I am happy that those less fortunate than me who don't have the money for insurance still get treated without bankrupting them. I'm very grateful that none of my friends will ever sit on a breast lump because they can't afford to get it checked out like a US friend currently is. So, he's currently moving most of his assets offshore and he's presently in New Zealand researching that country as a possible country for emmigration should things in this country continue down this high-regulation, less individual freedom path. As a New Zealander I can't imagine him finding NZ freer of government than the USA. Socialised medicine (Thankfully!!) The government might be "centrist" by NZ standards but I'd say it's extreme left by USA standards by what I've seen you guys discussing here. Edited May 20, 2009 by keptwoman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagira Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 (edited) I lived in Aruba for the first nineteen years of my life and it was really nice growing up there. To me, you had more freedom there in certain respects than here. You're free to write any political cartoons about your politicians, thrash them, etc. Freedom of speech is alive over there too :tongue_smilie: Things are slower there, and people just don't sue each other. I got bitten by a dog, and the owners said sorry. That's it. Here it always gets into bigger issues. I was fine with it, I scared the dog and it happened. They punished the dog (not the kindest owners), but that was it. Don't expect that it's like living in the USA, but you get a lot of ownership of responsibilities too. E.g. if you fell down and broke my leg in your store because I wasn't looking I have no right to sue you. I actually like that. Stuff happens. It's more conservative in beliefs as 95% of Arubans are Catholic. Mentioning God on the street and in schools is welcome and accepted. However, people don't dress too modestly, it's more showy and nicely dressed everywhere. You will see teens dressed to whatever style is going on at the moment, and there are South American immigrants who live there who dress.. well.. very revealing to an average American but normal (they want to look sexy) to them. E.g. no self-respecting Aruban would go to the bank wearing shorts, but nice long pants and a dress shirt are common. At least when I used to live there, there was a good network of social control over children. If your teenager snuck out of school you would hear about it because some acquaintance told you about it. The Aruban people are very friendly too, but more and more immigrants mean there aren't most Arubans in service positions anymore according to my mom, who still lives there. Arubans all want to be in the better jobs, like managers and owners. Health care is free, which is very nice IMO (my mom is very thankful for that), but remember, you have a right to pay for alternative care if you wish to do so. People don't remember that. In the Netherlands for instance, having a midwife is standard care in a normal pregnancy. Physicians are saved for the cases that truly need more expert medical care. However, if for some reason you'd rather want a doctor, you can pay for one. Nobody says you can't. As for long lines waiting for doctors, I had to wait in long lines in Miami while paying a high premium for my health care. This is the reason my mom can't move to the USA and live with us -- she couldn't possibly afford the outrageous health care over here. I love the security she gets from getting her health care paid for. After all, she deserves it after working hard. Virtually no racism when I was growing up. Everybody lives together happily as I remember (as far as race is concerned of course). I actually know one black friend and one white friend (we just say black and white and everyone's fine with it) who went to study in the US and left, dejected, because "racism is still alive and kicking over there. It's so sad." They went to study in the Netherlands after that with no problems. I feel people are so compartmentalized over here too, not just freely mixing like in Aruba. That said, I like living here because of other types of freedoms. People don't criticize the way you live, say, if you're messy. I couldn't get away with that in Aruba. Everyone would be talking about me and my house. People have no sense (I don't know if now, but not back then) of political correctness. "How can she keep her house like that?" or they could tell you to your face. Homeschooling would be another issue: "Our schools are some of the best in the world (you learn four languages too), why would anyone want to homeschool?" To tell you the truth, I would let my children go to school part time there at least just to learn those four languages: Papiamento, Dutch, Spanish, and French. Any government transaction is slow and if bad stuff happens to you, it's more of an attitude of "oh, stuff happens deal with it" or "It's like God wants" (people really say this -- it's as He wills is more the correct term). This is used a lot as a response from the deceased's family at a funeral. It's a comfort to them. Christian references everywhere. I think many Christians here would like it there :) Edited May 20, 2009 by sagira Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PineFarmMom Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 I'm not an extremist at all. I just don't think I want to live in the U.S. long-term. Hubby and I basically just want to be left alone so we can be free and happy. I want to be able to turn on my A/C when it's 123 degrees and not pay exhorbitant taxes because I like being comfortable in my home. I want to decide the best way to spend my hard-earned money. And my list goes on. I'm conservative, and would love the place I live to reflect my values. Is there any country that would be a better fit for me? I don't want to spark a debate, this is a truly innocent question! Christa The problem is we are the last of the free governments, and it's laughable to say!! We are a far cry from the freedom we used to have, but it's probably better than it used to be...though not for long, with the current trend of things. We'll be socialist before long. I don't know the place to tell you to go because I don't think it exists anymore. It used to be America, but no more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elegantlion Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 My dh and I have had the same thoughts of moving to another country eventually. We have looked at Costa Rica and we LOVE it there, but they are making new laws that make it harder for expats to stay in their country right now. Yes, I've looked the immigration laws for Costa Rica. :glare: We went a few years ago and I could have stayed, it's simply beautiful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creekland Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Statements like this always amuse me. I always wonder if folks over there get their info from US Insurance companies who have a lot to loose with socialised medicine. I'm very very very happy to be in a country with socialised medicine. Hmm, personally, I get my info from my step-mom - a Canadian citizen who has come to the US more than once to not only get quicker treatment, but also to get the most advanced treatment possible. It took her a week here to get treatment that would have been a 6 month wait with an older style treatment there. Then, we hosted a German exchange student who's father is a Dr. in Germany. He also preferred our system to his - except for routine minor care. Our system is not perfect. I don't believe any are. You are correct that those with socialized health care routinely report being happy with the care in general (esp routine care as with childbirth), but the stats that show people being treated with more severe cases of stuff (from cancer to heart disease, etc) have a better shot of a longer life here. I wish there were a way to take the pros of both systems and make them into one. Since I don't think there is, here's another vote for keeping ours and trying to modify it (less malpractice costs, etc). Healthcare costs me roughly $300/month to belong to a Christian healthshare group - then we pay $300 for any incident and all routine care ourselves (check-ups, etc). I'd venture to say what we save on taxes makes our system less costly to us as a family than your "free" one is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karen sn Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 DH and I have discussed this subject several times. If this country continues down this highly invasive, highy regulative, law & constitution ignoring path to Socialism & eventually communism..... where can we go? I have read the Road to Serfdom... we are on it & I want to get off! I am afraid the US is the last land of hope & I don't know where to go. Europe, South America, and Asia are all dictators or socialist or communist. Others are so poor or considered 3rd world without any roads, clean water or commerce. Australia is closer to Europe than we are! How does New Zealand work? Israel? How long can they survive if we abandon them? We may have to fight for our own country & I do not know where to start. I write my congressman but he is clueless & lives in his millionare world voting on the dumbest stuff. One Senator is smart.. one is in it for profit & power. The odds are against me. So sad. You ARE NOT ALONE!!!!!!:ack2: It's really Stalinism. He once said regarding these united states: We will not have to attack. She will fall like an over ripe fruit into our hands. No true communism exists, closest thing to it was Guam before us. Stalin twisted Marx's ideals in order to gain power himself. I LOVE your last paragraph!!!!! We should fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagira Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 (edited) Sorry double post Edited May 20, 2009 by sagira Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sagira Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 Statements like this always amuse me. I always wonder if folks over there get their info from US Insurance companies who have a lot to loose with socialised medicine. I'm very very very happy to be in a country with socialised medicine. I'd like to see the proof of higher rates of death because frankly I don't believe it.I will happily pay my $150 health insurance a month to be sure that I can skip the queues (not that they are that bad... in fact sometimes we just sit in queue because it's not worth paying the $500 insurance excess for a hospital admission not to) I see the doctor I want when I want for a whole $15 out of pocket. I happily had my babies for free with excellent care including home visits to support the establishment of breastfeeding. And I am happy that those less fortunate than me who don't have the money for insurance still get treated without bankrupting them. I'm very grateful that none of my friends will ever sit on a breast lump because they can't afford to get it checked out like a US friend currently is. I agree. If I lived in Aruba I would have had my finger checked (possibly broke it), but I just can't afford it right now (and for the last year). The health care here is exorbitant, and the reason my mom can't come move in with us, even though she's all alone in Aruba :( The whole health care system in a country such as the Netherlands or Aruba is set up to get you well, up and going, not to keep spending needless money and keeping you sick, which is what you could say of the system here sometimes. I don't see why people can't have both freedom and free healthcare, you know? You could always choose to pay if you want a second or third opinion, but it would not be as expensive as paying $600 a month whether you need it or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highereducation Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 I plan on staying in the US and working my fingers to the bone to make sure we remain "the land of the free". Running isn't the answer. Absolutely! Great post! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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