No memorial or celebration of life question, plus whining

[Ginevra]

PLEASE DO NOT QUOTE. 
 

My dad does not wish to have any type of memorial or Celebration of Life in my mother’s honor. He does have some good ideas that I support about cremation and where to take ashes. But does not want any part of services for people to come and…celebrate her life. Remember her; share stories. 
 

I accept this because he is my dad and is a deep introvert and I can appreciate how miserable it would be for him. However, I feel very sad for her friends. My mom was a very bubbly, warm, extroverted and creative woman. She was a “joiner”; groups, clubs, studies; if people gathered there, she was game. (Basically, the perfect opposite of my dad.) She had many friends, some for several decades, some since they were girls. The thought of informing these friends that there will be nothing makes me feel horrible.
 

I had always envisioned filling a fellowship hall with pictures of her *amazing* creations and, in some instances, the actual creation. (The bunny she made for my daughter; the pillows she made for my son; the dress she made for my wedding…) She was a mind-bogglingly good seamstress. 
 

My dad is (rightly) upset by the response of their church where both of my folks have poured their talents and time in for three decades. They put a condolence message on voicemail and THAT. IS. IT. My dad has been cared for better by the folks at my sister’s church, where he has only visited a few times since they moved in with my sister. These practical *strangers* are being far more Christlike than the pastor and leadership of the church where my folks have faithfully contributed (*poured* themselves into!) for thirty years. It’s disgusting. It makes me ever more jaded about “church people”. 
 

Anyway… that long rant is part of the reason my dad does not want to do anything; because he (logically) expected the church would happily host a memorial for my mom, likely with no rental fees, because she was a beloved member of that community for freakin ever. But no. No such offer; no such mention. 
 

My dad does not like the thought that if we had a memorial elsewhere, here would come the deadbeat pastor of his own church with their fake sad faces on. He can’t. He just can’t. He went through something similar when my sister died and he will not go through it again. 
 

It will be okay; I’ll be okay. But at the moment I’m thinking of all the people who truly did love my mom; I imagine them learning that there is going to be *nothing*…and that feels bad to me. 

[Drama Llama]

Could you do an invitation only thing? Gather a group of ladies for a luncheon to talk and remember her?  
 

I am so sorry for your loss.

[Ginevra]

6 minutes ago, BandH said:

Could you do an invitation only thing? Gather a group of ladies for a luncheon to talk and remember her?  
 

I am so sorry for your loss.

It’s a decent idea. Might be possible. Maybe a couple months from now. 

[Mrs Tiggywinkle Again]

Frankly I’d call the pastor of his church and have a discussion.  They may not have considered offering as they assumed everything would be handled elsewhere if no one asked. If they’ve been decent to your parents otherwise for years, I’d probably assume ignorance more than malice.

It doesn’t sound like your dad is as opposed to a celebration of life as he is feeling like hypocrites will show up and irritate him.  So I’d call his church and ask if they’re willing to help. 

[Pawz4me]

I'm sorry you're having to deal with extra "stuff." It does seem to me that especially since Covid people are adapting to all sorts of new trends around funerals and celebrations of life and lack thereof. I see many obits that say no formal service. So I don't think her friends will think too much about there not being a service.

[Drama Llama]

56 minutes ago, Ginevra said:

It’s a decent idea. Might be possible. Maybe a couple months from now. 

Maybe make it a "ladies luncheon" and have a beautiful album made with the photos to pass around?  Then you have a piece of the experience you want, and your Dad has a reason not to attend.

What would your Dad have wanted from the church.  If they had offered a memorial service, would he have wanted it then?

[Ginevra]

19 minutes ago, BandH said:

What would your Dad have wanted from the church.  If they had offered a memorial service, would he have wanted it then?

I don’t think so. But, for example, my sister’s church organized meal trains, leant them a motorized rocking chair (the kind that helps you up and costs like $5,000), not to mention calling my sister, offering to take the kids places and asking if any help is needed. So I assume he would have liked and expected that kind of service-minded reaching out from their own church. 

[Selkie]

1 hour ago, Pawz4me said:

I'm sorry you're having to deal with extra "stuff." It does seem to me that especially since Covid people are adapting to all sorts of new trends around funerals and celebrations of life and lack thereof. I see many obits that say no formal service. So I don't think her friends will think too much about there not being a service.

I agree with this. I look through the obituaries in our local paper every day, and usually at least 50-75% say no service or private family service. 

[marbel]

I'm sorry that your parents' church has disappointed them. 

I think in your place I would suggest gently to your dad that you and other family members would benefit from something. It wouldn't have to be publicly announced. No one from his church would have to know. But of course I don't know your dad so this could be bad advice.

Hugs to you as you navigate this. 💗

[Carol in Cal.]

I would not expect a church to offer to hold the memorial service, but rather to respond favorably when asked.  

[Drama Llama]

39 minutes ago, Ginevra said:

I don’t think so. But, for example, my sister’s church organized meal trains, leant them a motorized rocking chair (the kind that helps you up and costs like $5,000), not to mention calling my sister, offering to take the kids places and asking if any help is needed. So I assume he would have liked and expected that kind of service-minded reaching out from their own church. 

One of the best things about our parish is how they come together to support people in time of need.  They certainly did for us.  That's really heartbreaking that they failed in this way.

I was just asking because I wasn't clear if your Dad never wanted a memorial, or if he wanted one and then changed him mind when he was mistreated. If it was the latter, I might respond differently.

 

[TexasProud]

6 minutes ago, Carol in Cal. said:

I would not expect a church to offer to hold the memorial service, but rather to respond favorably when asked.  

THIS!!!  No church I know would ever offer to do anything because you want to make sure it is what the family wants.  If this is something you want, talk to one of her good friends and ask if they would like to organize something like that.  But they haven't said anything because they don't know what to do. Protocol says the family contacts the staff, not the other way around.  They cannot guess what you want. 

[Clarita]

I would bring up the ability to do an invitation only memorial service, honestly there's no rule stating the service has to be publicly announced. Anyone who asks (who wasn't invited) just say it was a small private service; it's what we wanted.

I do think you could approach your dad with your ideas on what the service could look like. I know sometimes spouses get so wrapped up in the change and the grief they don't really want to think about the event.

[katilac]

I think it's fine if your dad doesn't want to host or participate in a memorial, but I don't think he gets to say no one can have one, ever. 

Wait a bit to respect his feelings? Sure, but I don't think it's fair to say that you can't host a memorial for her friends (or that they can't). 

The first thing I would do, if possible, is to try and sort out what happened with the church. Is hosting memorials something they do often? Many churches do, many churches do not (the families host and organize them). If it's not something they do, maybe it would help to gently point that out. 

If it is something that church does, I would simply call the pastor and ask: hey, my dad was very disappointed that the church didn't offer to have a memorial or do anything else; he's upset about it, so I wanted to speak with you and clarify. Sometimes X thinks Y made the offer, sometimes voicemails get left on the wrong machine (when we had a landline, I would be calling people up at least twice a year so they didn't think their kid didn't call them for the holidays, or that their old friend didn't want to see them). 

[Clarita]

I can definitely see why your dad is disappointed and upset about how his church handled it. Back when my dad passed away both my church and my mom's church reached out and gently inquired whether anything was needed. (We declined the offers from my church and my mom's pastor just accompanied my mom to the cemetary, since my dad hated Christianity.) There are absolutely ways for churches to approach people about the subject without being pushy.

[City Mouse]

I don’t have a lot of experience with churches in this situation, but as you say he his a long time member, is it possible that he spoke to people in the past and they know he didn’t want any type of service? maybe that is influencing what is happening now.

[TexasProud]

Just now, City Mouse said:

I don’t have a lot of experience with churches in this situation, but as you say he his a long time member, is it possible that he spoke to people in the past and they know he didn’t want any type of service? maybe that is influencing what is happening now.

That is what I was thinking.  If he said anything about not wanting a service, then of course, they will honor his wishes and not bring it up.

[Faith-manor]

1 hour ago, Selkie said:

I agree with this. I look through the obituaries in our local paper every day, and usually at least 50-75% say no service or private family service. 

Private is becoming so common here. Churches no longer provide facilities for free or help with food or anything, and pastors charge $125-200 for people in their own congregations. Many families can no longer afford a traditional funeral or memorial service. When mother in law passes, it will be Mark and I, his brother and sister in law, my mom, the grandkids, and a backyard barbecue at her house or in case of inclement weather, a restaurant meal. We will share memories, laugh and cry together. Nothing else. She is being cremated, and her eldest granddaughter would like to keep the urn so we all agreed that was fine.

[Ginevra]

54 minutes ago, BandH said:

One of the best things about our parish is how they come together to support people in time of need.  They certainly did for us.  That's really heartbreaking that they failed in this way.

I was just asking because I wasn't clear if your Dad never wanted a memorial, or if he wanted one and then changed him mind when he was mistreated. If it was the latter, I might respond differently.

 

I don’t think he wanted one from the start, because of something similar that bothered him in 2008 when my sister died suddenly. He felt there were a lot of fake sad people who never reached out after the memorial. (And that was surely very draining in part because it was sudden and a total shock.) So he still holds resentment about that and it was more like, “And another thing…” that his own church has been so silent and (to him) un-Christlike. 

[Ginevra]

33 minutes ago, City Mouse said:

I don’t have a lot of experience with churches in this situation, but as you say he his a long time member, is it possible that he spoke to people in the past and they know he didn’t want any type of service? maybe that is influencing what is happening now.

I don’t think it’s that. She also has been in very poor condition this whole year, including in and out of the hospital and facility. From his POV, my sister’s church has been on top of developments and in contact but his own church was not. 

[Ginevra]

6 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

Private is becoming so common here. Churches no longer provide facilities for free or help with food or anything, and pastors charge $125-200 for people in their own congregations. Many families can no longer afford a traditional funeral or memorial service. When mother in law passes, it will be Mark and I, his brother and sister in law, my mom, the grandkids, and a backyard barbecue at her house or in case of inclement weather, a restaurant meal. We will share memories, laugh and cry together. Nothing else. She is being cremated, and her eldest granddaughter would like to keep the urn so we all agreed that was fine.

That actually makes me feel better, if others are doing something similar. 

[Faith-manor]

1 minute ago, Ginevra said:

That actually makes me feel better, if others are doing something similar. 

It really is okay. It is also just fine for you to choose to get together privately with people who support you even if your dad does not participate. You can respect him by not planning something he would feel guilty about not attending, and still respect yourself by having some time to share memories and grieve. It doesn't have to be an either/or with one person feeling railroaded.

[Ginevra]

1 hour ago, TexasProud said:

THIS!!!  No church I know would ever offer to do anything because you want to make sure it is what the family wants.  If this is something you want, talk to one of her good friends and ask if they would like to organize something like that.  But they haven't said anything because they don't know what to do. Protocol says the family contacts the staff, not the other way around.  They cannot guess what you want. 

They were not merely pew-members; they were integral to the organization of the church. My dad taught classes there for decades. My mom ran the children’s church and VBS in the past. For the pastor to ask him directly would not be weird at all.  If they were just pew-member people who don’t normally talk to the pastor at all, I would agree with you. But not for members like they were; the pastor should be calling my dad’s own phone and should have been since January. 
 

PS It may have changed since Covid, but in the past, my parents have been offered the use of the fellowship hall for free for other things. I’m sure that is why my dad expected the offer. 

[Dmmetler]

FWIW, my mother's funeral, with the church stepping in and doing a lot (like the women's group did the reception afterwards, in part because my mother had coordinated many of them)  still cost thousands of dollars in just various costs and for church fees to cover paying the people who had to be there and work extra-because while it's part of the senior pastor's salary, it isn't part of the custodian's or the part time pianist who is also a grad student, or the AV guy who recorded it for the folks who couldn't be there. That doesn't include the burial itself.

 

My father felt it was important. My mother's life had been focused around the church for many years, and the single thing she'd wanted most was to get back there. 

 

But at the same time, it was draining and very, very hard on the family. In many respects, we had made our goodbyes when we'd done the family only graveside service (which had to be fast due to doing a green burial). The service was for everyone else, not for us. And for me, there was a real fear that this would turn into a COVID superspreader event and cost lives, because so many of the people there were elderly and have had health issues in recent memory, which made it even more anxiety inducing. 

 

So, I can see both sides here, and reasons for both. 

 

 

 

 

[Scarlett]

2 hours ago, Selkie said:

I agree with this. I look through the obituaries in our local paper every day, and usually at least 50-75% say no service or private family service. 

I hate this trend.  And I will not agree to it with anyone of my loved ones.  Memorial services are for the living and they offer great comfort.  The dead know nothing at all. 

[Scarlett]

If I were @Ginevra I would organize something  on my own.  With or without the church or her father.

Edited June 20, 2023 by Scarlett

[Faith-manor]

1 minute ago, Scarlett said:

I hate this trend.  And I will not agree to it with anyone of my loved ones.  Memorial services are for the living and they offer great comfort.  The dead know nothing at all. 

I hope you intend on paying for those services then. It is frightful what these things cost now, even simple ones with cost saving measures. And sometimes the living really do not want to grieve publicly. There are MANY of us like that. I was utterly miserable at my father's very public funeral, physically exhausted, and at one point held up in the church nursery having a panic attack. Every family should do what is best for their immediate members. Anyone for whom that is uncomfortable should not be guilted into attending or looked down on by others.

[KungFuPanda]

If your mom was the outgoing organizer, your father may have no idea how these balls actually get rolling. He may have trouble imagining that he’s supposed to grieve AND plan stuff. It’s impossible but it’s what the family does. He may have more people than he knows just waiting to be asked. The church might not be able to offer things without a date or any idea what he wants. 

[ktgrok]

3 hours ago, BandH said:

Maybe make it a "ladies luncheon" and have a beautiful album made with the photos to pass around?  Then you have a piece of the experience you want, and your Dad has a reason not to attend.

 

This was exactly what I was going to suggest! If you can. make contact with one or two of the women your mom knew and volunteered with they could help you contact the others. And no need for dad to feel he has to come. 

1 hour ago, Ginevra said:

I don’t think it’s that. She also has been in very poor condition this whole year, including in and out of the hospital and facility. From his POV, my sister’s church has been on top of developments and in contact but his own church was not. 

Ok, that's crazy. And sad. 

[Scarlett]

12 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

I hope you intend on paying for those services then. It is frightful what these things cost now, even simple ones with cost saving measures. And sometimes the living really do not want to grieve publicly. There are MANY of us like that. I was utterly miserable at my father's very public funeral, physically exhausted, and at one point held up in the church nursery having a panic attack. Every family should do what is best for their immediate members. Anyone for whom that is uncomfortable should not be guilted into attending or looked down on by others.

In my world it is not expensive.  And I am talking about deaths for which I would be next of kin.  And no one has to attend if they don’t want to.  Good grief.  

[Scarlett]

I just think a person’s life is worth emotion or a chance to share and grieve together.  And when a next of kin says no service I say the ones who loved the dead person should just do their own thing.  A company I worked for had a beloved sales rep who was estranged from his only child and no service was planned.  His co workers arranged a service and it was attend by many.  

[Kidlit]

I wonder if all this depends on the size of the church.  My childhood church, where I have attended MANY funerals and where my own grandparents' funerals were held, charges exactly $0 for any lifetime events (weddings, funerals, parties like for graduation--most anything I can think of) of its members.  The ladies of the church even sometimes fix a post-funeral meal (in addition to sending food the night of the death or the night of the visitation, as appropriate) for community members that are related somehow to the church, though not members. It is a small church.  Members are family. 
 

ETA: My actual point is this:   A grieving family would incur no extra expenses by having a funeral at the church, just what the funeral home charges for transporting the deceased, etc. (The church itself wouldn't charge anything.)

Edited June 20, 2023 by Kidlit

[Scarlett]

5 minutes ago, Kidlit said:

I wonder if all this depends on the size of the church.  My childhood church, where I have attended MANY funerals and where my own grandparents' funerals were held, charges exactly $0 for any lifetime events (weddings, funerals, parties like for graduation--most anything I can think of) of its members.  The ladies of the church even sometimes fix a post-funeral meal (in addition to sending food the night of the death or the night of the visitation, as appropriate) for community members that are related somehow to the church, though not members. It is a small church.  Members are family. 
 

ETA: My actual point is this:   A grieving family would incur no extra expenses by having a funeral at the church, just what the funeral home charges for transporting the deceased, etc. (The church itself wouldn't charge anything.)

Yes, same here.  Most people I have known recently who died have been cremated and there was only a memorial service 2-3 weeks later.  A lovely service and possible a covered dish meal.

[wintermom]

I'm very sorry for your loss, and also that your parent's church has not been reaching out in ways that you and your dad have hoped and expected. That must compound the pain of your loss. 

My dad died suddenly last winter, and he didn't want a funeral. With COVID still quite risky, and the bad weather, we only had a visit to the funeral home (which was horrible), and a small family take-out meal, which was really nice and relaxing. We looked through photo albums and chatted. Mom has had really nice visits with her friends over the last year, and doesn't seem to have moved any slower or faster through the grieving process. Sure, it's not the way things traditionally have been in the past, but with COVID everything about life was different anyway. 

I would urge you not to get too upset about how your mom's friends deal with their grief. They'll find a way through, and it may be more comforting for them to visit your dad one at a time spread out over a longer period of time. 

Edited June 20, 2023 by wintermom

[Ellie]

My mother died 10 days after being diagnosed with lung cancer. She was in no condition to discuss anything with *me,* but she had already discussed with her dh that she didn't want anything. So I was completely caught off guard when the cremation company picked up her body and that was that. It was over 20 years ago, and I'm still bitter about it. Well, maybe "bitter" is too strong a word, but I still feel very strongly about it.

The people who are left behind want to get together and hug each other's neck, and tell stories, and just *remember* their loved one who is gone. It is selfish and painful  the surviving family members to do *nothing.* Yes, even if that's what the deceased wanted. There should be *something.* A meet-up in the park. Anything.

Edited June 20, 2023 by Ellie

[Scarlett]

1 minute ago, Ellie said:

My mother died 10 days after being diagnosed with lung cancer. She was in no condition to discuss anything with *me,* but she had already discussed with her dh that she didn't want anything. So I was completely caught off guard when the cremation company picked up her body and that was that. It was over 20 years ago, and I'm still bitter about it. Well, maybe "bitter" is too strong a word, but I still feel very strongly about it.

The people who are left behind want to get together and hug each other's neck, and tell stories, and just *remember* their loved one who is gone. It is selfish and painful to the for the surviving family members to do *nothing.* Yes, even if that's what the deceased wanted. There should be *something.* A meet-up in the park. Anything.

Exactly. Also who really knows what the deceased one wanted  unless they heard it with their own ears.  Sadly I think some of this is the living not wanting to deal with it.

[City Mouse]

I’m a bit offended that so many people think I and my family members are “wrong” not to have a public service. 
My dad died recently. He was not religious in any way, and he made his wishes clear to both me and my sister. While he did not say anything to my other siblings, they know him and believe us. My mother is in a nursing home and could not travel even across town to attend a service. All extended relatives live several states away , and most are elderly themselves. My parents friend are all elderly and are either living in the assisted living where my parents lived until recently or at his nursing home, so they couldn’t travel to attend a service. My siblings and I are all perfectly fine with the decision not to have a public service. 

Edited June 20, 2023 by City Mouse
Fixing typos

[Scarlett]

3 minutes ago, City Mouse said:

I’m a bit offended that so many people thing I and my family members are “wrong” not to have a public service. 
My dad died recently. He was not religious in any way, and he made his wishes clear to both me and my sister. While he did not say anything to my other siblings, they know him and believe us. My mother is in a nursing home and could not travel even across town to attend a service. All extended relatives live several states away , and most are elderly themselves. My parents friend are all elderly and are either living in the assisted living where my parents lived until recently or at his nursing home, so they couldn’t travel to attend a service. My siblings and I are all perfectly fine with the decision not to have a public service. 

Well, that is fine if that is what all the family wants.  You aren’t ‘wrong’, but neither would others be wrong if they chose to have a service/Memorial of their own.

[Ellie]

36 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

Exactly. Also who really knows what the deceased one wanted  unless they heard it with their own ears.  Sadly I think some of this is the living not wanting to deal with it.

There are some things that might be important as far as what the deceased might have wanted. Catholics wanting a funeral Mass, for example. But other things, like a memorial or some sort of get-together...no. They're gone, we're here, we want to get together in your memory.

[Ellie]

Also, one of my cousins died unexpectedly. He was not the least bit religious, and his wife, whom I also dearly love, just had him cremated. I was so disappointed. He was well known in the music community where he lived, having played in a popular local band for over 50 years. He had friends who would have wanted to get together. Band members who had played with for many of those 50 years. If his wife couldn't bear to do it, she could have asked one of the band members to throw a party on the beach and she could have stayed home. I imagine there are still people who don't even know he died.

It's just not right. Speaking as one of the ones left behind, I can say that: it just isn't right. And it kind of feels disrespectful. Yeah, good ol' Tom. He died, he was cremated, he's in a jar on the mantle in the family room, the end.

[Rosie_0801]

When my son died, our homeschool group organised a memorial get together, because that is what their children needed, and invited my mother and I to attend. We did. I did not attend the thing my ex organised.

When his father died, his mother said there would be no funeral and she was very firmly told there would be. I don't blame her for not wanting to organise it herself, but it would have been highly inappropriate not to. Her excuse was that the minister of their church didn't do funerals. Naturally enough, ministers who don't do funerals can pull their finger out when one of their parishioners, who has contributed a great deal of service to their charities, dies, even if he was an atheist. In the end, it was quite a nice funeral and at least a hundred people showed up. 

It seems unreasonable to me to put the burden of organising a wake on the people most affected by the death. Someone around should offer. It's not the right time to politely mind your business, it's a time to politely interfere.

[Clarita]

3 hours ago, Scarlett said:

6 hours ago, Selkie said:

I agree with this. I look through the obituaries in our local paper every day, and usually at least 50-75% say no service or private family service. 

I hate this trend.  And I will not agree to it with anyone of my loved ones.  Memorial services are for the living and they offer great comfort.  The dead know nothing at all. 

I think you hating this trend basically is saying that those of us who chose not to have a public service is wrong. The family who is feeling the bulk of the sting of the death and all the baggage surrounding it does not owe the public closure. Immediate family and those who actually have to deal with the logistics of the death are the only people who get a say in whether an event happens.

In this case it is appropriate that @Ginevra, the daughter, gets to have a say and talk to her father about wanting to have something. Joe Shmo from the church does not. 

[Ginevra]

7 hours ago, Scarlett said:

In my world it is not expensive.  And I am talking about deaths for which I would be next of kin.  And no one has to attend if they don’t want to.  Good grief.  

I agree that it is expensive. Even if the church donated the hall and pastor’s services, it still would be. I was there when they quoted him for cremation and urn; it was a not-small four-figure number, even though they own pre-purchased plots. So that is actually something to be reckoned with. My mother did not have a life insurance policy. 

[Bootsie]

25 minutes ago, Ginevra said:

I agree that it is expensive. Even if the church donated the hall and pastor’s services, it still would be. I was there when they quoted him for cremation and urn; it was a not-small four-figure number, even though they own pre-purchased plots. So that is actually something to be reckoned with. My mother did not have a life insurance policy. 

I view the costs of cremation, urn, or burial plot separate from the cost of having a memorial service.  The cost of cremation is the cost of cremation whether there is a memorial service or not.  

[Pawz4me]

6 hours ago, City Mouse said:

I’m a bit offended that so many people thing I and my family members are “wrong” not to have a public service. 
My dad died recently. He was not religious in any way, and he made his wishes clear to both me and my sister. While he did not say anything to my other siblings, they know him and believe us. My mother is in a nursing home and could not travel even across town to attend a service. All extended relatives live several states away , and most are elderly themselves. My parents friend are all elderly and are either living in the assisted living where my parents lived until recently or at his nursing home, so they couldn’t travel to attend a service. My siblings and I are all perfectly fine with the decision not to have a public service. 

The error in their thinking is (of course) that everyone else deals with grief the same way they do. It's arrogant thinking, but we all know it happens. The very last thing on earth I want or need when a close person dies is to be forced to "people." It's pure torture. I want everyone to leave me alone so I can process in peace.

Neither DH nor I want a service after we pass. If our family wants to get together for an informal meal or some type of gathering that's fine. The idea that people somehow miss not attending a service was a totally new one to me until this board. I don't know a single person in real life who thinks grieving as a group is a necessary thing at all. The first "no service" close death I had experience with was about thirty years ago, and my first reaction was "good for him." Because funerals are horrific.

Now, even though neither DH nor I want a service, if our boys choose to have one that's okay, too. It's not like we're going to care.

[TexasProud]

9 hours ago, Ginevra said:

They were not merely pew-members; they were integral to the organization of the church. My dad taught classes there for decades. My mom ran the children’s church and VBS in the past. For the pastor to ask him directly would not be weird at all.  If they were just pew-member people who don’t normally talk to the pastor at all, I would agree with you. But not for members like they were; the pastor should be calling my dad’s own phone and should have been since January. 
 

PS It may have changed since Covid, but in the past, my parents have been offered the use of the fellowship hall for free for other things. I’m sure that is why my dad expected the offer. 

I guess our church is different. We are also integral to the organization of the church: I  directed children's choir for over 20 years.  I did VBS music for nearly as long and am doing it again.  I have been a member of the choir and chairman of music committee almost since we joined 27 years ago.  I was interim music minister for a summer. My husband is now chairman of the deacons.  

They would still wait for me to ask for what I wanted.  Once I expressed it, they would be ALL IN. They would call everyone in.  But they would not be proactive. Just the culture here. They love me, though.

[Hilltopmom]

When my child died, we did not have services, a memorial, etc. 

It’s not something we wanted to do or be a part of.

That wasn’t about his wishes (he was non verbal and young, I have no idea what he was thinking), but ours. 

Families don’t have to have memorial services if they don’t want to. Not all families want to do that. And that’s their choice.

Edited June 20, 2023 by Hilltopmom

[SKL]

I wonder if you could put together something digital to share with loved ones?  Folks could be invited to participate in it if you want that.

I understand both feelings as far as wanting and not wanting an event.

Prayers for you all.

[Dmmetler]

I suspect that part of the cost will depend on whether the church folks are salaried or hourly, and whether the person arranging things knows that. 

 

My father had been on the administrative board for years, so he knew good and well that a large funeral was a negative on the church's books. Therefore, he made sure that he covered those expenses. And, well, it was one more thing to put on the statement before the accident went into settlement. It wasn't that they sent him a bill, but that he made sure that those who were there in a professional capacity hadn't donated their labor without meaning to do so. 

 

My mother had made her wishes known and planned out the scriptures and songs she wanted, with very, very detailed notes. It was actually a case where we needed to trim it to keep it from being hours long. 

 

There's no way anyone but family could have planned it for us, because we were the ones with the notes and knowledge and memories. We also needed to work around people's schedules and get them there, as well as church availability and clergy schedules (we've twice been in the position of planning a service when the lead pastor for the church was supposed to be on vacation since they'd just finished Christmas or Holy Week...). 

 

I do absolutely feel the church folks should have reached out as soon as they knew (and things like the reception did get planned without us being involved). But we needed to notify them first. In fact the first day was largely spent notifying "need to know" folks so they could pass it on and take on part of that emotional labor.  

 

My DH didn't do a service for his father, and now regrets it. There were a lot of reasons as to why at the time, but given that he's still struggling with that decision four years later, I think that if you feel uneasy not doing something now, it's not going to get better with time. 

[Spryte]

Ginevra, I’m so sorry for your loss. I hope that there will be a way for you to feel supported in your grief, and comforted.
 

On the expenses topic mentioned by some: it varies widely. We have just had two funerals since Feb. Both Catholic, full mass, all the things. Radically different costs on top of all the prepaid funeral expenses that had already been covered.

First was at a local Catholic church. There was a fee for the use of the church, the priest, the music, everything had a line item. All these fees were well into four figures, and this is on top of cremation, urn, plot, fees associated with the plot, etc. The use of the church hall, and catering for 80 was the most expensive, and we had to arrange for the food and drinks and make sure it was all delivered to the hall. Then there was a customary donation on top, actually a few of them. The amount of planning for this service felt overwhelming.

Second was at a Catholic church 90 minutes away. No line item fees for anything. The use of the church hall was free. The volunteers on the funeral committee asked how many would attend (150) and prepared a full meal, set up and cleaned up. No charges, just a beautiful, huge meal. We donated around the same amount, but had we been unable to do so, the funeral would have gone on. Planning was easier, more streamlined, and we could grieve rather than planning food for so many people.

I think there must be huge regional differences, and expectations may vary.