Another (long) post about my son . . . (Update #2 in post 172)

[regentrude]

 I would politely and respectfully point out that what I actually requested was for folks to share their experiences with integrating a non-student young adult as a contributing member of the household....

 

 

However, just in case that isn't how things shake out and we do end up needing to follow through with the "treat him like an adult" option, I would still appreciate hearing from others about how similar situations work in your families.

 

Jenny, if I recall correctly, your own daughter did live at home for a few years after she finished college, right? How did you handle the situation then? In which way did she contribute to the family? What, if anything, do you think needs to be different with DS? If he were working, would the fact that he has not finished college change the way you treat him? In case you choose to implement a different set of rules for your DS than you did for his sister, how will you explain this difference to him?

 

ETA: I still think, if it is at all way possible, he should not be given the option to drop out of college, but be scaffolded and coaxed and prodded to finish at least the AA. 

Edited July 29, 2017 by regentrude

[bettyandbob]

Jenny, if I recall correctly, your own daughter did live at home for a few years after she finished college, right? How did you handle the situation then? In which way did she contribute to the family? What, if anything, do you think needs to be different with DS? If he were working, would the fact that he has not finished college change the way you treat him? In case you choose to implement a different set of rules for your DS than you did for his sister, how will you explain this difference to him?

 

ETA: I still think, if it is at all way possible, he should not be given the option to drop out of college, but be scaffolded and coaxed and prodded to finish at least the AA. 

 

 

Obviously I'm not the OP. Jenny's dd graduated with a BA (in theatre I think) at age 16. The way she treated her dd for the first years after college had to be different because she wasn't even a legal adult. 

[TechWife]

Thank you.

 

Although I appreciate the concern and the general feedback I've been receiving here -- it's always helpful to get other perspectives, in part because formulating responses to them helps me to clarify my own thoughts -- I would politely and respectfully point out that what I actually requested was for folks to share their experiences with integrating a non-student young adult as a contributing member of the household.

 

...

 

 

However, just in case that isn't how things shake out and we do end up needing to follow through with the "treat him like an adult" option, I would still appreciate hearing from others about how similar situations work in your families.

 

I hope others can offer some ideas on this as well, as I may soon be going through this very same thing. It would be helpful to have ideas from others who have been down this road before. 

[bettyandbob]

Jenny I think the posters who are suggesting getting a degree in anything may have the right idea. Your ds is pursuing a field where experience, networking and just being present counts more than the degree itself. So, he could try to get a degree zeroing in on his exact interests, but those interests within his field are variable, so he's changed majors and schools a couple times. The reality is the exact subject focus of his degree will probably not effect his place in his field of interest. 

 

The reality you know is that having a degree, any degree is a safety net for getting a foot in the door for a significant number of jobs, whether or not the skills of the job really need those skills attained while earning a BA. This is why you want him to finish. I'd look at the shortest path to a BA at the local university. That may or may not be in any of the previous majors your ds has had. Presented as the fasted way out that he can do while still doing most of the stuff he's already doing to build his experience and resume may be something that appeals to him. Whatever route you go, I think you will have to be more involved than you anticipated. 

[TechWife]

What would be helpful, to me at least, would be suggestions for moving the relationship from the parent/child phase to the parent/adult son phase when the adult son is still dependent somewhat on the parent. 

 

What expectations did you have in place as far as: 

 

Contributions to the household - financial, chores, recreational time spent as a family unit? Of these contributions to the household - how did you decide how much/what was appropriate? What variables should I be on the lookout for? 

 

Did you expect the adult son/daughter to take care of preparing their own meals?

 

Did you expect them to pay their own way if you went out to eat as a family?

 

Who pays for the adult son/daughter's favorite snacks that are kept on hand?

 

If the adult son/daughter is preparing their own meals, are they also doing their own shopping? Do they have a dedicated area in which to keep their own food? What about things like laundry detergent, toilet paper and other necessities?

 

If the adult son/daughter's  contributes financially: 

How did you decide on an appropriate amount? Percentage of adult son/daughter's income? Did they pay specific household bills (such as paying the electric bill every month or buying groceries twice a month)? Did they pay a percentage of household bills? Did you set an arbitrary amount? 

 

If the adult son/daughter is responsible for household chores: 

Did you keep it to just areas they could directly impact, such as doing their own laundry, keeping the bathroom they use clean, cleaning up after themselves in the kitchen and looking after their pets? 

Did you include maintaining common areas such as yards, living areas and common bathrooms? 

 

What about using common areas - did you have set laundry days?

Was the adult son/daughter encouraged to invite their friends over ? Did you have agreements on areas used for socialization (such as limiting particular days of the week so that the adults can watch a favorite in season sport or so that the adult son/daughter could have friends over for the big game)? Did you do that formally or casually? 

 

How did you adjust your expectations if your adult son/daughter decided to decrease the amount of time spent, start or stop their formal education? 

 

What did you do if your adult son/daughter did not live up do your expectations? Did you set up if/than scenarios in advance or did you anticipate some possible scenarios and put limits in place ahead of time? How did you enforce these limits (let's assume kicking them out of the house is not an option, because, for me, unless circumstances were extreme, it would not be an option). 

 

Please keep in mind these are young people we are talking about. The amount of education they have or have not had is not really related to the situation at hand. This is not about determining an educational or career path for the adult son/daughter. The goal is to encourage and equip the  young adult towards independence while preserving and maturing the relationship between the parent(s) and the adult son/daughter. 

 

 

Edited July 30, 2017 by TechWife

[Jenny in Florida]

Jenny, if I recall correctly, your own daughter did live at home for a few years after she finished college, right? How did you handle the situation then? In which way did she contribute to the family? What, if anything, do you think needs to be different with DS? If he were working, would the fact that he has not finished college change the way you treat him? In case you choose to implement a different set of rules for your DS than you did for his sister, how will you explain this difference to him?

 

ETA: I still think, if it is at all way possible, he should not be given the option to drop out of college, but be scaffolded and coaxed and prodded to finish at least the AA. 

 

The way we looked at it was that, if our daughter had started college at a traditional age, we would have anticipated supporting her completely until she was at least 22, and we were not interested in "punishing" her for achieving early.

 

It took her about a year after earning her degree to figure out the next step. During that time, she made almost no demands on us beyond room, board and some transportation. She figured out how to get around town on foot and by bus as much as possible, made (and cleaned up after) her own meals and pitched in with pet care and household chores as asked.

 

The year after that, she found her way into an informal internship and, from there, into paid work. At that point, at her own insistence, she took over paying all of her own discretionary expenses while banking 80-90% of her earnings. She was very intentional about preparing herself to relocate and move on to the next phase of her life. She read and studied on her own so she would be ready. Within two years, she had saved enough to finance her move to NYC, and she has been self-supporting since then (except for medical expenses and her cell phone).

 

The differences with my son are that he has not finished a degree (and thus is not at a logical "transitional" stage), that he is over 18 and not facing the challenges associated with trying to find a job while under-age, that he does not seem to feel any obligation to help out around the house or even to reliably clean up after himself, that having him here means having an additional person (his girlfriend) around roughly 50% of the time, that we made certain arrangements and agreements with the understanding that we are supporting him while he finishes his education but that he seems to take for granted (providing weekly spending money, subsidizing his car insurance, etc.) and that he has no clear plan for what he is doing next or how to get there.

 

Applying the same general guidelines we relied on with our daughter, we are happy to support a young adult until a typical graduation age (22-ish), as long as that person is either actively enrolled in some kind of formal educational or training program or has already completed such a program and is working towards a clearly articulated next step. 

 

If our son is over 18, has not completed an educational or training program and is not working towards any particular benchmark or goal, then, yes, things need to be different. 

Edited July 30, 2017 by Jenny in Florida

[Jenny in Florida]

What would be helpful, to me at least, would be suggestions for moving the relationship from the parent/child phase to the parent/adult son phase when the

adult son is still dependent somewhat on the parent.

 

[snip]

 

Please keep in mind these are young people we are talking about. The amount of education they have or have not had is not really related to the situation at hand. This is not about determining an educational or career path for the adult son/daughter. The goal is to encourage and equip the  young adult towards independence while preserving and maturing the relationship between the parent(s) and the adult son/daughter. 

 

Right, these are exactly the kinds of issues I was hoping to discuss in this thread. Thank you for taking the time to articulate such a great list of questions!

[Jenny in Florida]

He would probably like a break from school but knows it would disappoint you. I don't even know you and I can tell it would disappoint you, lol...so he definitely knows your preference.

 

I've repeatedly suggested he take a break. I even sent him links to audition notices for cruise ship contracts and for a national tour that was looking for puppeteers (a special interest of his), as well as postings for full-time internships at three different local theatres for the upcoming academic year.

 

I would definitely not be disappointed.

[Crimson Wife]

If he were strategic about selecting classes and not too picky about going for a specific degree, he could finish in a year because he has over 100 credit hours completed, including some upper-division coursework taken at the private university. A generic "theatre studies" degree at the state university requires only 120 credit hours. I've actually looked through the requirements for that degree and matched them up with his current transcripts. Even assuming he might need to fill in with a couple of classes to check off boxes he missed along the way, he should be able to knock off that much in two 15-hour semesters.

 

Saying this gently, but it's his life and for the sake of your relationship with him, you need to back off with the train barreling full speed ahead towards BA city that it seems pretty clear to me is YOUR dream rather than HIS.

 

My parents had a notion in their heads about what I "should" do when I was your son's age that had very little to do with what *I* actually wanted. This harmed our relationship because no child wants to be a "disappointment" to their parents.

[Jenny in Florida]

Saying this gently, but it's his life and for the sake of your relationship with him, you need to back off with the train barreling full speed ahead towards BA city that it seems pretty clear to me is YOUR dream rather than HIS.

 

My parents had a notion in their heads about what I "should" do when I was your son's age that had very little to do with what *I* actually wanted. This harmed our relationship because no child wants to be a "disappointment" to their parents.

 

Okay. One. More. Time.

 

My son is in no way a disappointment to me. I think he's pretty damned awesome. I was asked why I thought he could finish a degree in a year, and I explained the facts. I did not say he "should" do that or that I thought it was the best plan. It is, however, a possibility. Since he does, for practical reasons, want to finish a degree and since he doesn't love being in school for the sake of being in school, there's a good argument to be made for the idea of just barrelling ahead and getting it out of the way. In fact, one of the reasons we agreed to let him graduate from high school and head to college early was that he wanted to "get it done." 

 

As I have said repeatedly, we have, as a family, discussed any number of alternate paths and possibilities for him, and I have never been anything less than supportive of him pursuing whatever interests him. 

 

I have drawn his attention to several apprenticeships and internships offered by local (and not so local) theatres. Each time, his first question has been whether he could do them while staying in school and he has ended up saying he will keep them in mind for the year after he finishes his degree.

 

It was literally less than a month ago that I encouraged him to attend an audition for a national tour. We talked about the relatively low odds of him getting an offer (just because he has no similar professional experience on his resume), how he wouldn't need to accept even if it were offered but also that having the adventure and experience of a year on the road could be great for him. 

 

He knows all of this. He KNOWS. 

 

Please don't attribute your parents' attitudes and actions to me.

Edited July 30, 2017 by Jenny in Florida

[TechWife]

Saying this gently, but it's his life and for the sake of your relationship with him, you need to back off with the train barreling full speed ahead towards BA city that it seems pretty clear to me is YOUR dream rather than HIS.

 

My parents had a notion in their heads about what I "should" do when I was your son's age that had very little to do with what *I* actually wanted. This harmed our relationship because no child wants to be a "disappointment" to their parents.

 

But, this thread isn't about that. It's about how to scaffold a young adult into adulthood. Education is a minor component of this, and Jenny offered the explanation only as background information, not the focus of her questions. She has said repeatedly that she is fine with him not going to school and has actively encouraged him to pursue other avenues (such as the cruise ship idea). He has said repeatedly that he wants a degree. She is actively working on helping him reconcile his stated goal with this actions (or lack thereof) and to make sense of it all - to help him either reach his goal or change his goal. Either one seems fine with her. But, in the meantime, they all have to figure out how to do life together. 

[StephanieZ]

What would be helpful, to me at least, would be suggestions for moving the relationship from the parent/child phase to the parent/adult son phase when the adult son is still dependent somewhat on the parent. 

 

What expectations did you have in place as far as: 

 

Contributions to the household - financial, chores, recreational time spent as a family unit? Of these contributions to the household - how did you decide how much/what was appropriate? What variables should I be on the lookout for? 

 

Did you expect the adult son/daughter to take care of preparing their own meals?

 

Yes, unless they are eating with the family when we are all eating. This is my expectation for all my kids after about age 12. 

 

Did you expect them to pay their own way if you went out to eat as a family?

 

Never. I'll always pay for our kids meals with us unless we befall some financial disaster or they become very insistent. My folks always treated us when we went out, as do dh's. We have only rarely succeeded in picking up bills with our folks, and I intend to do the same with our kids if they let us. If they're flush and want to pay, we'd let them if it meant a lot to them. 

 

Who pays for the adult son/daughter's favorite snacks that are kept on hand?

 

If I'm at the store, I buy all the food I can think of that anyone likes. If they're at the store, I'd figure that my adult kids would buy what they want. I don't reimburse for snacks . . .  but I do my utmost to keep favorites on hand, and anything that is put on the list in the pantry will magically appear in a matter of days. 

 

If the adult son/daughter is preparing their own meals, are they also doing their own shopping? Do they have a dedicated area in which to keep their own food? What about things like laundry detergent, toilet paper and other necessities?

 

Never in my house would food be segregated among family members unless there was a weird allergy or "Mom's Izzes that no one can touch" or some similar very favorite thing that someone doesn't want messed with. Staples & household goods will always be in abundance and funded by us parents. 

 

If the adult son/daughter's  contributes financially: 

How did you decide on an appropriate amount? Percentage of adult son/daughter's income? Did they pay specific household bills (such as paying the electric bill every month or buying groceries twice a month)? Did they pay a percentage of household bills? Did you set an arbitrary amount? 

 

N/A. No kid of mine will pay bills to live in my house unless I have a brain disorder. My kid is welcome to live in my house rent free, cost free, unless they are being such a useless shit that I throw them to the curb. But, if they aren't a shit, they can live with me, for free, for as long as I can keep them there. I like them. 

 

If the adult son/daughter is responsible for household chores: 

Did you keep it to just areas they could directly impact, such as doing their own laundry, keeping the bathroom they use clean, cleaning up after themselves in the kitchen and looking after their pets? 

Did you include maintaining common areas such as yards, living areas and common bathrooms? 

 

Same as since age 12 or so re: personal chores . . . Mine are required to keep their own spaces (bedrooms, bathrooms) in decent shape. They all do their own laundry, start to finish. If their rooms/bathrooms get gross, I tell them to clean it up "today" or similar, and they do it.

 

Our entire family cleans the kitchen and dining room after dinner, every night, together. Other common spaces are generally kept up by  me, but when I ask for specific tasks/chores, they step up and do them nicely. For rooms they or their friends generally mess up (guest bed rooms, home office, basement rec room), I will tell them to go clean it up or change linens/etc, and they'll do it.

 

Yard chores are generally done by dh or the kids. We pay our 18 year old to mow, as we're pretty much finding ways to "pay him" spending money as he has no job but has huge merit scholarships for college (as does his big sis) . . . but when his big sis was home last summer -- her first "adult" summer between college years, and we did *not* pay her for mowing/chores/etc since she was a grown up by now and also accustomed to getting large allowances from us  . . . I expect this to be the same for ds next year . . . as once they hit college, they are, for the first time, getting big allowances from us . . . So, at that time, we transitioned from us "paying" our kids to do chores/tasks/give little sister ride places/etc . . . to the young adult just being expected to help "for free" . . . but meanwhile, we just *give* the young adults cash allowances whereas when they were in high school, we never did that, but just "paid" them for chores . . . Now we expect chores/help/cooperation/teamwork . . . just "because they are now adults who all work together for the common good" . . .

 

What about using common areas - did you have set laundry days?

 

Whoever gets there first gets the machines. We move laundry to the next stage if it's in the way or we think of it. We have 2 sets of machines, so there's rarely conflict.

 

Was the adult son/daughter encouraged to invite their friends over ?

 

Please do! We live in the boonies, so they rarely have folks over, but we love it when they do. 

 

Did you have agreements on areas used for socialization (such as limiting particular days of the week so that the adults can watch a favorite in season sport or so that the adult son/daughter could have friends over for the big game)? Did you do that formally or casually? 

 

Nope. We don't have broadcast TV and don't watch sports, so no conflicts there. Occasionally, kids differ on who gets dibs on the basement rec room . . . Been easily worked out that kid-with-pals-over has dibs. 

 

How did you adjust your expectations if your adult son/daughter decided to decrease the amount of time spent, start or stop their formal education? 

 

Hasn't happened yet, but if they weren't in school FT, I'd expect them to be working . . . to a "FT equivalent" between school and work. School breaks excepting, so long as they have big merit scholarships . . . 

 

What did you do if your adult son/daughter did not live up do your expectations? Did you set up if/than scenarios in advance or did you anticipate some possible scenarios and put limits in place ahead of time? How did you enforce these limits (let's assume kicking them out of the house is not an option, because, for me, unless circumstances were extreme, it would not be an option). 

 

N/A so far, but we have made clear the expectations that the college kids are "usefully occupied" 90%+ of the year . . . So, for school terms and summers, our college kids are expected to be doing something useful -- school, work, volunteer, travel . . . If they needed to earn money to contribute to their school costs, then they'd have to do that for breaks . . . We provide "blow money" (i.e., allowance for fun stuff) in addition to school and living expenses . . . during the school year. But, during summer break, the college kids are expected to work for $$ unless they have a good alternative plan . . . Last summer, college girl did a volunteer internship, but she did it FT and worked for pay PT, so she was "usefully occupied" . . . and we then provided her "blow money" all summer . . . but we would NOT have done that if she weren't volunteering. This summer, she's working a co-op job in her field and is making bank. :) DS made a comment the other day about how next summer (first college summer), he plans to "goof around all summer in Europe" . . . (presumably following our planned family trip to Spain at the beginning of summer). I said, "How are you paying for that?" He didn't say much, lol. I'll probably bring it up sometime soon and suggest a plan, some sort of reward/bribery scheme for great first semester grades . . . Maybe some set dollar amount from us if he gets X grades . . . But, no, I'm not giving him a blank check to goof off all summer, lol. Since it's something that sounds good to me, I'd like to help (and my mom funded my own goof off all summer in Europe one college summer . . .), but it'd be a one-time thing, not an every summer thing. I think they know that. Maybe college girl will join him . . . (I'd suggested they take 2-3 weeks to goof off after our family trip . . . but hadn't expected him to extend it to all summer, lol).

 

Please keep in mind these are young people we are talking about. The amount of education they have or have not had is not really related to the situation at hand. This is not about determining an educational or career path for the adult son/daughter. The goal is to encourage and equip the  young adult towards independence while preserving and maturing the relationship between the parent(s) and the adult son/daughter. 

 

I think it is important to keep in mind that once our kids hit a certain point/age, appropriate goals for parenting change a lot. For me, my goals are changing from control/influence/direct to coach/help/support. I want to have a lifetime relationship with my kids. I want them to be happy and healthy and well. I want to be the soft place where they know they can land. The sympathetic ear when they call. The source of decent advice when they ask for it . . . I want to support them and help them, but I don't want to keep trying to be in charge of who they are or what they do. That's their role as adults . . . My role is to be a minor supportive character, not the director of their lives. So, I'll give what I am able, support how I can . . . My goal is for us to all be "on the same team" and help each other, love each other, etc. I am trying to treat them as young people I adore and cherish and want for company, companionship, etc . . . To get there, I have to let go of being in charge. That's a tough thing to swallow for me personally, as I am nothing if not a control freak. But, I'm realizing that if I hold on to controlling them, I'm going to lose the chance to build meaningful loving relationships with my ADULT kids. 

 

Edited July 30, 2017 by StephanieZ

[TechWife]

I think it is important to keep in mind that once our kids hit a certain point/age, appropriate goals for parenting change a lot. For me, my goals are changing from control/influence/direct to coach/help/support. I want to have a lifetime relationship with my kids. I want them to be happy and healthy and well. I want to be the soft place where they know they can land. The sympathetic ear when they call. The source of decent advice when they ask for it . . . I want to support them and help them, but I don't want to keep trying to be in charge of who they are or what they do. That's their role as adults . . . My role is to be a minor supportive character, not the director of their lives. So, I'll give what I am able, support how I can . . . My goal is for us to all be "on the same team" and help each other, love each other, etc. I am trying to treat them as young people I adore and cherish and want for company, companionship, etc . . . To get there, I have to let go of being in charge. That's a tough thing to swallow for me personally, as I am nothing if not a control freak. But, I'm realizing that if I hold on to controlling them, I'm going to lose the chance to build meaningful loving relationships with my ADULT kids. 

 

 

I think we have very similar goals with parenting! I'm working on how to transition to that supportive role - it can be rough! 

 

Thanks so much for your input. 

 

My question regarding food storage area was really a practical question. For example, if my son does purchase his own food, should we set aside an area for him to make sure that his food isn't co-opted by us? I won't have any issue with him getting into whatever food we have in our pantry, it's more that I want to help him have a  good personal boundary and respect his investment, if that makes sense. If he buys himself a bag of his favorite cookies, I don't want us to assume we can help ourselves. Does that make sense? For a bit of context - we don't take food to the bedroom areas of our home. Beverages yes, food, no. This is for sanitation reasons and I won't compromise on it. Therefore, having a drawer or cabinet in his room would not be appropriate. 

[StephanieZ]

I think we have very similar goals with parenting! I'm working on how to transition to that supportive role - it can be rough! 

 

Thanks so much for your input. 

 

My question regarding food storage area was really a practical question. For example, if my son does purchase his own food, should we set aside an area for him to make sure that his food isn't co-opted by us? I won't have any issue with him getting into whatever food we have in our pantry, it's more that I want to help him have a  good personal boundary and respect his investment, if that makes sense. If he buys himself a bag of his favorite cookies, I don't want us to assume we can help ourselves. Does that make sense? For a bit of context - we don't take food to the bedroom areas of our home. Beverages yes, food, no. This is for sanitation reasons and I won't compromise on it. Therefore, having a drawer or cabinet in his room would not be appropriate. 

 

Sure, that makes sense. I'd think that a designated cabinet or a certain shelf in the pantry and/or a bin in the fridge would be helpful. You can always provide that space, and if he doesn't use/need it, then you can let it fall by the wayside. In my house, that'd make the most sense for keeping younger siblings from eating the older one's special snacks/treats/whatever. 

 

I agree that this transition is *rough* for me. Really rough. I'm just now feeling like I'm "getting" it. I told my kid (the 18 year old, he's much more challenging than his easy-going-people-pleasing big sis, lol) that "we are now in this together" insofar as figuring out our relationship . . . I find it much better going now that I'm "owning" my newbie-ness at parenting adults and openly asking for help in figuring it out. We had an "issue" the other day with ds, and he set a "boundary" that caught me by surprise. I thought about it . .. reconsidered my position, changed my position, and kept moving forward. I'm forcing myself not to get backed into corners or get stubborn . . . I'm not trying to be the "consistent rules" parent I long thought I had to be . . . now I'm just trying to be a consistently loving force in their lives . . . and to be loving, I have to be willing to be wrong, to change, to negotiate, to give up control  . . . I think my 18 yo is going to help me be a much better parent of adults, lol. He's pushing me . . . and it's for the good . . . I believe. 

 

Meanwhile, for gosh sakes, pass me a glass of wine, lol.

[gardenmom5]

When it comes to years of college, you are exactly right. It doesn't matter what age the student was when the classes were taken; it all counts towards the degree. (

The driving and "volunteering" thing is a bit less clear cut.

 

He and his girlfriend have been together almost two years and are very much a partnership. She helps keep him on track with regard to schoolwork, for example, and they split all expenses 50/50 for various outings and activities. He provides a fair amount of emotional support for her, as well as doing the driving.  tbh: I'd start to be concerned about them being co-dependent upon each other.  that isn't necessarily a healthy thing.

 

And, in the world of theatre, a lot of opportunities arise out of being "there" and being a known quantity. 

In fact, the super-secret thing he was recently cast in did not hold open auditions. Instead, the director put out the word that he was open to receiving resumes. He knew my son from other things and e-mailed asking him to submit. After reviewing the resume, he asked for a video. Only at that point was an official invitation issued to come to the in-person auditions.

 

you are the one expressing concern about how he is doing, that he doesn't have a degree, despite being very close.   you need to decide what you are wiling to support, and what you are NOT.

 

 So, while not all of these experiences equate to "jobs" that can go on a resume, they do help him build his network. And they provide photos for his portfolio. Which is why, frustrating as it is sometimes for me to see him "not working," I try to bite my tongue at least some of the time and give him the space to invest in making a name for himself in the community.

 

 - YOU need to decide what you are willing and not willing to support. - and if he's not getting paid adequately to live on, then that means financially supporting as well.

you can't have it both ways.  if you're going to support this - why are you being so concerned about it?   I'm getting conflicting signals and it's confusing to me.

 

Part of my challenge is to balance being supportive and understanding of that necessity with encouraging him to maintain some kind of recognizable forward momentum academically and financially.

 

 

 

 

1.  
2. I really do not think it is my place to tell my son how to handle his interpersonal/romantic relationship(s). If he feels it is important and worthwhile for him to support his partner by driving her to and from classes, then I respect that decision. (

    

   Nor do I think it is appropriate for me to tell a young adult to whom I have no parental connection that she "needs" to do one thing or another with her life. His girlfriend and I are on good terms, and she does seek my advice on various things, which I am happy to share (and delighted that she wants). We have spoken multiple times about the anxiety/driving thing, and I respect that she knows herself and her abilities better than I do.

 

 

you're not telling your son's gf anything.  you're telling you son he needs to prioritize his time - and he needs to make plans on how he is going to support himself and start working towards that.  nice he's got all these opportunities - but they don't' pay any of his bills.

 

Some of us have relatives that chose the consequences. My brother did, and we buried him back in 2010 as a result. I hope every one is careful of such advice. Each situation is different and some people are more vulnerable than others. "Tough love" is not a solution for everyone. 

 

I'm sorry your experience turned out so badly.  

[SereneHome]

So some random thoughts bc it's 2am and I REALLY should be sleeping.

 

I think US culture of expecting kids, and yes, I consider a 19 yr old a kid, to be able to do certain things is simply unrealistic.  For many, their brain is just not there.

I think that at 19 is the BEST time to do many fun and non-fun, but experimental (not talking about drugs) things.  I would prefer my kid doing that while young and single vs married with family to support.  I don't want them to be 35, look back and all of a sudden decide to "find themselves" at the expense of their own families and their kids.

Again, it might be cultural, but I wouldn't mind my 19 yr living at home as long as he wasn't sitting on the couch, doing nothing. 

 

That being said!

I would decide what *I* am OK with in regards to contribution to the house, family, schedule - both, monetary and not - and lay it out very plainly and very specifically.

I would reiterate over and over - I am here for whatever help you need.  But then I would move to the back seat and let him drive - allowing him to get wherever he ends up.

 

I would give this until December and then re-visit. 5 months is not going to make or break anything.

 

I would much prefer to teach my kids independence under the safety of their family.  I am all for tough love, but I would rather they were getting it at home, in combination with my "regular" love and support.

 

There is a saying where I am from "smart people learn from their mistakes, very smart ones learn from someone else's"  I hope my kids can be the latter :)

 

[J-rap]

Haven't read all the posts...

 

How to integrate.  I know that after thinking we did a good job parenting and teaching responsibility, it still takes some step-by-step directions/guidance with our young adult children to handle certain situations.  We think they should know by now, but sometimes they don't.  Continue to work on thinking (talking) out loud with them about necessary steps, plans, and consequences.  Give them a little room to make mistakes, but keep at it.  If they make mistakes, work with them on showing them how to correct them, without actually doing the correcting ourselves.  Sometimes, we may need to let them suffer the consequences to learn.  Other times, it is better to hold their hand for a bit and guide them through, lessening the grip as time goes on.

 

I have some kids who learned how to be very independent early on, and I have others who thought they were ready but weren't.  It's probably a mix of brain development and circumstances.  I've found that as they get older, it's harder to guide even though they still need it.  You have to treat them as adults instead of kids, yet gently offer our clear advice or suggestions  (even when what we really want to do is just tell them exactly what to do!) 

 

Personally, as a parent, I will never back completely off saying "your choices, your life."  I will ALWAYS be there for them, hopefully slowly guiding them to a healthier and wiser independence. 

[lea1]

I am wondering if his gf's dependence on him is affecting his decisions.  What would she do if he took a traveling job for a year?  Based on what you have said about her family, it sounds like he is really all she has and she depends on him every day.  And she spends half of her time at your house?  What would she do if he was not around?  How long have they been seeing each other?

[kiwik]

A 19 year old is an adult - they can vote, drink where we are, fight in a war, marry etc. Why does everyone think it is young and he shouldn't actually want to support himself? This is not aimed at the OP just a general question. At 19 I would have been embarassed to be entirely supported unless I was physically or mentally too unwell.

[kewb]

A 19 year old is an adult - they can vote, drink where we are, fight in a war, marry etc. Why does everyone think it is young and he shouldn't actually want to support himself? This is not aimed at the OP just a general question. At 19 I would have been embarassed to be entirely supported unless I was physically or mentally too unwell.

A 19 year old is considered an adult. They are still a young adult. Just because they are chronologically 19 doesn't mean their maturity matches up. Some 19 year olds need more time, more direction, more mentoring. Especially if there is an undiagnosed disability. At 19, I certainly wasn't ready to be supporting myself. I probably could have done it if necessary but I wasn't ready.

Edited July 30, 2017 by kewb

[bettyandbob]

A 19 year old is an adult - they can vote, drink where we are, fight in a war, marry etc. Why does everyone think it is young and he shouldn't actually want to support himself? This is not aimed at the OP just a general question. At 19 I would have been embarassed to be entirely supported unless I was physically or mentally too unwell.

I don't know where you live. I know a couple of 19 year olds who supporting themselves. They work multiple jobs, have no time for school, and likely will be stuck in lower level jobs for a long long time because working so to support themselves there is no time to pursue training, education, certification that is needed to move up. There is also no time to seriously research jobs that might give a better path.

[catz]

A 19 year old is considered an adult. They are still a young adult. Just because they are chronologically 19 doesn't mean their maturity matches up. Some 19 year olds need more time, more direction, more mentoring. Especially if their is an undiagnosed disability. At 19, I certainly wasn't ready to be supporting myself. I probably could have done it if necessary but I wasn't ready.

 

:iagree: If you can launch a kid fully self supporting and emotionally mature at age 18 more power to you.  But that just isn't reality for many young people in this age range.  Many kids at the OP's age are just launching to college for the first time and are getting financial and emotional support.

[gardenmom5]

A 19 year old is an adult - they can vote, drink where we are, fight in a war, marry etc. Why does everyone think it is young and he shouldn't actually want to support himself? This is not aimed at the OP just a general question. At 19 I would have been embarassed to be entirely supported unless I was physically or mentally too unwell.

 

because boy's brains keep developing into their 20s.

and some kids mature later than others.

[SereneHome]

A 19 year old is an adult - they can vote, drink where we are, fight in a war, marry etc. Why does everyone think it is young and he shouldn't actually want to support himself? This is not aimed at the OP just a general question. At 19 I would have been embarassed to be entirely supported unless I was physically or mentally too unwell.

 

I think a lot of it is really cultural.

 

I was working almost full time and was going to school full time at 19.  I still lived with my parents bc pulling resources in our culture is very very common thing to do.  As a matter of fact, I lived with my parents for awhile, even once I had a full time job and investing in real estate and doing a lot of other things.

 

But not everyone develops at the same rate and I think it's a bit unkind and unnecessary (in general) to say that once you reach this arbitrary number and simply bc you can vote - your brain should have developed enough to be completely out on your own.

 

Wanting to support oneself and having ability to do it is not the same thing.

[displace]

because boy's brains keep developing into their 20s.

and some kids mature later than others.

This is not sex restricted. Research suggests brain development continues until at least the mid 20's to possibly early 30's.

[Sdel]

I'm beginning to wonder how much of this is about the gf. If Jenny's son is away on tour, doing something even semi-long distance, or even taking his own classes, how does that affect him being available to drive her places? If he feels the need to be so supportive he may not feel he can take to time to be focusing on himself.

 

Is that something he would feel comfortable admitting to you Jenny?

 

Stefanie

Edited July 30, 2017 by Sdel

[Scarlett]

I believe that he should get a B.A. in something ASAP. Possibly not Theater Arts. Possibly General Studies. Whatever he can get a B.A. degree in the quickest and easiest for him. Studying in a classroom is not something he enjoys. If he doesn't get the B.A. now as someone else wrote the University may change their requirements or what they will give credit for. He is very close and if he doesn't make getting a B.A. in something now his immediate priority he may never get a B.A. degree.That would be sad.

 

Sent from my SM-G355M using Tapatalk

Believe it or not there are a lot of people walking around without B.As. And it isn't really that sad.

[TechWife]

:iagree: If you can launch a kid fully self supporting and emotionally mature at age 18 more power to you. But that just isn't reality for many young people in this age range. Many kids at the OP's age are just launching to college for the first time and are getting financial and emotional support.

Agreed. People also need to realize that the 18 year old in the Army is in a highly controlled work environment. While they are earning money and defending our country, it should not be assumed that they are mature enough on their own. The armed forces provides a great deal of structure and places specific behavioral demands upon its members. They also receive very job specific training. They aren't making as many independent decisions as some people might think. The training and other expectations are highly scaffolded with a lot of built in supports through the command structure.

[Catwoman]

Believe it or not there are a lot of people walking around without B.As. And it isn't really that sad.

I can't speak for Lanny, but I interpreted his post to mean that Jenny's son is so close to having enough credits to earn a degree that it would be sad if he doesn't finish it. A lot of time, effort, and money has been dedicated to earning all of those college credits. I don't think Lanny meant that it would be sad for anyone in general if they didn't have a college degree, but that he was only talking about Jenny's son.

 

(Edited because I can't type today!)

Edited July 30, 2017 by Catwoman

[Lanny]

Believe it or not there are a lot of people walking around without B.As. And it isn't really that sad.

With all due respect if someone has 100 credits and does not complete a degree I think that is very sad. To get SO close to finishing and not finish would IMO be bad for him for the rest of his life. His goals and his dreams may with tlime change. If he has a B.A. he will be more marketable. Someday he may need or want to get a job he has no knowledge of at this time where a 4 year degree in something is a requirement.

 

Sent from my SM-G355M using Tapatalk

[Crimson Wife]

Believe it or not there are a lot of people walking around without B.As. And it isn't really that sad.

 

Exactly. I don't see why there is this idea that he needs to finish up a BA now or it'll never happen. He's 19. If he finishes his associates and works for a few years he'll still be young. While it's harder to finish up school in middle age, I don't think it's harder to finish school at say, 23 & 24 than it is at 19 & 20.

[Guest]

Exactly. I don't see why there is this idea that he needs to finish up a BA now or it'll never happen. He's 19. If he finishes his associates and works for a few years he'll still be young. While it's harder to finish up school in middle age, I don't think it's harder to finish school at say, 23 & 24 than it is at 19 & 20.

 

Schools have an expiration date on credits, generally five years. He isn't going to be able to transfer old credits in. He will have to demonstrate proficiency or retake; either way he will pay.

[kiwik]

I will be happy to help support my kids as long as they need it. But I expect them to have the desire to contribute as much as they can which means using the summer to study, work to earn money for books and other expenses or help around the house in a fairly major way (the neighbour kids painted their grandmother's house for instance). It is probably cultural/money oriented as in NZ lower income people get assistance for kids until they leave high school and can't really afford to fully support them after that. If I lived at home after that I would be expected to contribute to food and bills or free up someone else to do more work.

 

I would however give him as much help as I could to get those last papers including going with him and helping him choose the quickest, easiest options and then encourage him to go for the cruise ship thing where there will probably be enough structure for him and let him do something he likes while he develops more EF. Might make some useful contacts as well.

 

It would also get him and his girlfriend to see investigate other transport options.

Edited July 31, 2017 by kiwik

[ktgrok]

 

Two more thoughts on this issue:

 

1. I think I'm coming at this from the other side of your experience, MedicMom. My daughter also struggles with anxiety and was not able to manage it well enough to get a driver's license. When she still lived at home, we tried for months to get her comfortable and competent behind the wheel. She learned the mechanics of driving just fine, but was so nervous that she would panic and lose control of the car. She was very motivated to try and learn, because she was applying for an internship she really wanted that required her to have a vehicle and license, but she never could do it.

    

   She now lives and works in NYC and uses public transportation to get around. She is far from the only person she knows in the city who never learned to drive and/or doesn't have a license. So, while I do chalk that up as one parenting fail on my account, it has turned out to be a non-issue for her. And if, at some point down the road, she decides she really needs to drive, I have confidence she will tackle it appropriately.

    

2. I really do not think it is my place to tell my son how to handle his interpersonal/romantic relationship(s). If he feels it is important and worthwhile for him to support his partner by driving her to and from classes, then I respect that decision. (For what it's worth, there were a few years after we moved to Florida when my husband did not drive due to a health issue. I drove him to and from work every day during that time, because we are a team.)

    

   Nor do I think it is appropriate for me to tell a young adult to whom I have no parental connection that she "needs" to do one thing or another with her life. His girlfriend and I are on good terms, and she does seek my advice on various things, which I am happy to share (and delighted that she wants). We have spoken multiple times about the anxiety/driving thing, and I respect that she knows herself and her abilities better than I do.

 

But you said she also is unable to or unwilling to use public transportation...does that include cabs, Uber, etc? I mean, she can't spend her life living in this area and not get a drivers license OR use other transportation, its not feasible. And puts your son in the role of feeling she depends on him, which can have relationship stifling effects. What if he wants to break up at some point, but he know she NEEDS him for rides? Or if she wants to break up, but needs the rides? It's just not a healthy dynamic long term. Not for our area. Now, if she can and will use public transportation, that's a different story, and I'd suggest she look at moving somewhere with a better public transport system once she graduates or whatever. But expecting friends/relatives/etc to drive you the rest of your life, that's not really a great plan. 

[ktgrok]

If he were strategic about selecting classes and not too picky about going for a specific degree, he could finish in a year because he has over 100 credit hours completed, including some upper-division coursework taken at the private university. A generic "theatre studies" degree at the state university requires only 120 credit hours. I've actually looked through the requirements for that degree and matched them up with his current transcripts. Even assuming he might need to fill in with a couple of classes to check off boxes he missed along the way, he should be able to knock off that much in two 15-hour semesters.

 

Most universities require 60 hours at their university for a degree. Not all, but most. 

[ktgrok]

Some of us have relatives that chose the consequences. My brother did, and we buried him back in 2010 as a result. I hope every one is careful of such advice. Each situation is different and some people are more vulnerable than others. "Tough love" is not a solution for everyone. 

 

Thank you for this. I'm so sorry you have this experience to share, but it's something I've only recently actually thought about and it's important to remember. 

[Pen]

...

 

I have drawn his attention to several apprenticeships and internships offered by local (and not so local) theatres. Each time, his first question has been whether he could do them while staying in school and he has ended up saying he will keep them in mind for the year after he finishes his degree.

 

...

 

OK, so it sounds like he Does want to finish his degree.  What is needed to make that happen?  20 credits away from BA makes that sound like a situation to just do it! Focus in -- it's not that long, and get er done.  

 

 

With all due respect if someone has 100 credits and does not complete a degree I think that is very sad. To get SO close to finishing and not finish would IMO be bad for him for the rest of his life. His goals and his dreams may with tlime change. If he has a B.A. he will be more marketable. Someday he may need or want to get a job he has no knowledge of at this time where a 4 year degree in something is a requirement.

 

Sent from my SM-G355M using Tapatalk

 

I was one of the people who was not so sure about the degree when it seemed like it might be a long way off.  But with only 20 credits to go, I totally agree that getting it makes sense and is part, probably, of learning an adult skill of finishing something that has been started.  

 

Also, things he knows now he is interested in such as starting a theater arts program of some sort would almost certainly be benefitted by having a degree.  Unless he were a super big name in the theater industry where just his name would do it for everything he'd need, like maybe business loans...

 

I am wondering if his gf's dependence on him is affecting his decisions.  What would she do if he took a traveling job for a year?  Based on what you have said about her family, it sounds like he is really all she has and she depends on him every day.  And she spends half of her time at your house?  What would she do if he was not around?  How long have they been seeing each other?

 

 

I'm wondering that too.  Can he actually go take an opportunity elsewhere, or is he limited due to gf?  Are they planning to marry?  Have kids? 

[Pen]

Most universities require 60 hours at their university for a degree. Not all, but most. 

 

 

Sounds like basic fact finding is needed for the particular situation.  

 

And it sounds like the boy probably had 60 or close to that in 2 years at a private college, so maybe he could finish by going back to it if the state U rules don't allow him to finish off promptly.

[Scarlett]

I never know how much background to include; I don't want to bore people who might remember my previous posts, but I also don't want to waste the time of folks who might want to be helpful but not know enough about the situation . . .

 

So, as quickly as possible:

 

I have this son. In a lot of ways, he's awesome. He's brilliant and creative and not nearly as much trouble as an awful lot of other guys his age. One consistent issue we have, though, is lack of follow-through in dealing with various kinds of administrative stuff. A couple of examples: He started full-time college at 16, living on campus 90 minutes from home. His first semester wasn't great, but he got his act together academically and did fine-to-very well after that. However, he twice ended up missing deadlines to sign up for a dorm room, and once he ignored issues with his registration that resulted in him being temporarily un-enrolled (while still going to class and doing all assignments).

 

After two years at the private university, he decided to switch gears, major-wise, and we agreed he'd move back home and do a year at the community college while he got his ducks in a row to apply for transfer to the state university (also local). The understanding/goal was that he would check off the boxes remaining to get an associate's degree, which would make it easier to transfer (and, since I have always harbored a bit of doubt about whether he'd actually stick to the whole school thing long enough to get a bachelor's, I selfishly knew I'd sleep better if he had at least one official piece of paper to show for his time). He's done great at the CC, honor roll both semesters (4.0 for one of them) while carrying more than a full-time load and working part-time and doing a variety of theatre-related activities.

 

What he hasn't done is -- you guessed it -- actually finish the associate's OR jump through the hoops to line up the transfer.

 

I told my husband that I often feel like, when it comes to academics, our son is like a wind-up toy: Once I get him prepped and pointed in the right direction and set him down at the starting line, he'll keep chugging along for as long as necessary. What he can't seem to manage is doing any of the prep work or strategizing on his own. Back at the beginning of the summer, we decided to roll with this and have me continue in the role of administrative assistant for a while longer, while trying to encourage/teach him to take on more of this, himself.

 

To that end, back in early June, he and I sat down and had a chat about his plans. I said repeatedly that, if he had changed his mind about the transfer, that was fine; he just needed some kind of plan for how to proceed from here. If he wanted to look at different colleges, cool. If he wanted to take a year off and work full time, cool. (He has talked several times about auditioning for one of the cruise ships or a touring production, for example.) If he wanted to try for an internship or apprenticeship at a local theatre, cool. If he had some other idea and/or wanted help brainstorming, cool. He was adamant that he wanted to follow through with transferring to the state university and was downright dismissive of my attempts to open a conversation about alternatives.

 

[i had typed out a bunch of details here about what happened next, but I doubt that would be interesting to anyone. So, suffice it to say . . .]

 

He submitted the transfer application, and we ordered transcripts. However, he dropped the ball on making sure all of the documents were received and has now missed the transfer application deadline.

 

Three weeks ago, my husband and son and I sat down again and had a meeting about the situation. We told him -- again -- that we are open to all kinds of possibilities, but that the one thing he may not do is not be in school and continue to be treated like a kid. We explained that, if he's not enrolled in some kind of formal educational program leading to some kind of credential, then he needs to start functioning like a contributing adult in the household (or move out). We all agreed to a deadline of the end of this month for him to work out a plan and show us evidence that he is enrolled in something, somewhere for this fall OR we would figure out how his role in he household would be changing.

 

That deadline is Monday. To the naked eye, it does not appear that he has done anything at all to put any kind of plan in place. He's actually away for the weekend, but I did mention to him before he left that Monday marks the end of the month, just so he wouldn't be surprised when he returns.

 

I should hasten to explain that, it's not like he's a slacker. He has genuinely been very busy. He drives his girlfriend to her summer classes and has been recruited to help out with various things: performing in and making last-minute costumes and working backstage at the recital of his former dance school, partnering students enrolled in his girlfriend's dance class and performing in their semester-ending performance, designing and sewing two skirts for his sister, making a couple of costumes for another friend's community theatre show, designing and making costumes for himself and his girlfriend for two different conventions, auditioning for professional performance gigs of his own and still working at the theme park on an on-call basis.

 

He actually does have some casting news that is potentially very cool, but I'm not allowed to share details about that until an official announcement is made. What I can say is that it is not something that would prevent him from continuing to go to school and does not seem to be anything like a full-time job, in terms of income.

 

So, if you're still with me, here I am finally getting to the actual question:

 

If this were your young adult, what would you consider appropriate steps to transition him from functioning as a kid/student to becoming a contributing adult member of the household, assuming that he does not come to us with the agreed-upon plan/evidence on Monday?

 

My husband and I consulted about this briefly and have already decided that the small allowance we give our son that was initially intended to provide spending money and cover incidentals while he was on campus will be discontinued more or less immediately. Several months ago, we sold him my old car at a greatly reduced rate, but held onto the registration and title in order to make it easier to handle insurance. Because he hasn't gotten around to setting up the e-Pass I bought for him, we have gotten several toll-by-plate bills, all of which are in my husband's name. I have paid them promptly, and my son has (not quite so promptly) paid me back. However, when the registration is up for renewal in September, we plan to go ahead and put that in our son's name so that he will be fully responsible. At that point, we will also likely require him to get his own insurance, rather than just having him pay half of the increase in our rates that resulted from putting him on our policy.

 

When we talked to him a few weeks ago, I pointed out that "contributing" does not necessarily refer only to financial stuff. For all of the years I was a SAHM, there were long stretches during which I brought no money into the house. My contribution during those years was raising and educating him and his sister and doing the majority of the household upkeep and generally managing everyone's lives and schedules. Since he is not currently working many hours, it's probably not meaningful to talk about monetary rent. But we do want him to "feel" this transition. So, I'd appreciate hearing what you require of any young adult offspring who live with you and are not in school.

 

A final consideration: My ultimate goal, here, is to nudge him towards getting back in school. I absolutely do not want to make this so unpleasant/difficult/contentious that he opts to give up/move out/take whatever crappy full-time job he can get just so he can scrape up enough to pay his bills. I want to design a situation that, as much as possible, makes him see that he had a good thing going and motivate him to step up and take responsibility for getting back on track.

The thread got long and convoluted, but I wanted to try and answer your actual question. The deadline is here, so the consequences need to be enforced. I agree with most of your plan, except I would probably allow him to stay on your insurance and pay his portion.

 

I guess you have to wait and see what he has come up with when he returns, but basically since he has missed the deadline for school he really needs to get a job, pay some rent and begin doing his adult share of chores around the house.

 

I agree also with continuing to encourage him to finish his AA for sure since he is so close.

 

I think he is still very young and that this is part of what comes with kids going off to college too young, and I remember thinking this when he first went....that eventually it would catch up with him. However, it sounds like he has done remarkably well and there isn't much to complain about....he just needs a little time to finish maturing.

 

Oh and I also suspect part of this has to do with the gf.....him being more concerned about the relationship than he is his own education. Normal stuff.....but it helps to be aware so you can guide him.

[gardenmom5]

It's a bad, bad plan. Speaking as someone who has never driven in her life, but who is very capable at getting where I need to go on public transport. Relying on others is a recipe for relationship stress, imo. I have and will initiate discussions with my young people on co-dependent behaviours (in themselves or their boy/girl friend.) Usually, I have little patience for the concept, because we are all interdependent, but sometimes behaviours really do spill over into this area, and it's not good for anyone.

 

this.   my grandmother drove.  I remember when she drove.   when my grandfather retired - she quit driving, and he was forced to drive her everywhere she wanted to go.   it isn't mentally healthy to be dependent - or to have an otherwise healthy and capable adult dependent upon you.

 

Sounds like basic fact finding is needed for the particular situation.  

 

And it sounds like the boy probably had 60 or close to that in 2 years at a private college, so maybe he could finish by going back to it if the state U rules don't allow him to finish off promptly.

 

number of credits towards a degree depends upon several factors.  what degree does he want?  how many of those credits actually apply to the degree he wants?

how does that college count credits to apply to a degree? 

[ktgrok]

As for the classes, I think have him take the three he needs for the AA at the CC. JUST those three. That leaves him time for working, figuring things out, etc. Then he'll have his AA and you can figure out the rest then. 

[DawnM]

He is young.  Boys mature slower.  Help him in whatever way you need to help him.  Sink or swim is NOT always the best for kids.  It certainly wouldn't be for my kids.

 

My oldest is in CC.  We are helping him by giving a LOT of guidance, helping him plan his classes for each semester, and making sure he takes what he needs to graduate on time. He lives at home and we pay 100% of his college expenses.   They aren't high, but they would be a LOT of money for him.

 

Middle is a senior this year.  I signed him up for the ACT in Sept.  I found an online program for him to study, and I am helping him pick a major and college.  

 

When I say help, I mean that I just know more than they do, so I come up with suggestions and options and ideas for them to research better, etc.....I think this is the right way to go about it.

 

ETA:  Oldest has Asperger's and middle has ADD.  My youngest is very neuro-typical and probably won't need the level of help I am giving the older two......you do what you need to do to help your kids launch!

 

 

Edited July 31, 2017 by DawnM

[Jenny in Florida]

In case inquiring minds want to know, here's the update:

 

I worked a closing shift at the library last night, but shortly after I got home, our son came to talk to us. After a few pleasantries about his weekend, he basically threw himself on our mercy, admitted he hadn't done as much as he should have done to get his ducks in a row and said he was ready to accept help. We talked through several of the things folks have mentioned here (including, at length, whether he really wants to be in school at all, with the parents reiterating that this is his choice, that we will support him in whatever path he chooses as long as there is a path, etc.), and he repeatedly said he does want to finish the bachelor's and that he welcomes my administrative assistance to get him to that point.

 

As of this moment, he is registered at the CC for the three classes he needs to complete the associate's, and he has submitted the application for the program that guarantees transfer to the state U with an AA. I would still prefer that he take one more class in order to maintain his full-time student status; however, we combed pretty thoroughly through the requirements for the state U degree and compared them to the transferable options from the CC, and there really doesn't seem to be available anything that would make sense for him to take.

 

We printed out current copies of his records from both the CC and the private university and the requirements for the state U major and minor, and I will spend some time today matching them up more carefully so I can give him a one-page summary of where he is and what I think he needs to do.

 

We have a date on Friday morning to go to the CC in person so he can speak to an advisor there and make sure he is really on track to graduate after the fall semester. I'm pretty confident he's all set for the AA, but he is also trying to earn a technical certificate, and there is one class he has been promised would substitute for a requirement that isn't showing that way on the online degree audit. So, he needs to follow up on that.

 

He has also sent an e-mail to the head of the dance department to investigate whether there is any possibility he could turn the slate of dance classes he has taken both there and at the private university into any kind of additional degree or credential. I think that is a long shot, but it's worth asking the question. And if it turns out he could do that by taking an extra-heavy load this semester (using up the slack between his current nine credit hours and a traditional full-time courseload), that would be nice. Honestly, even if it "cost" him one additional semester at the CC, meaning he finished the theatre associate's and technical certificate in December, then the dance associate's in May, that might still be worthy of consideration. At that point, if he still wants to pursue it, he could transfer smoothly to the state U next fall with, one hopes, a carefully work-out plan to complete the BA by the end of that summer. However, if, at that point he is too burned out or uninterested to continue, he'd at least be walking away with a few pieces of paper to his name.

 

I have not -- and will not unless he gets encouragement from the dance department head -- mentioned that extra semester concept to him.

 

We made it very clear to him last night that we are unwilling to continue with things as they are: He needs to give me login info for all school-related accounts and keep me 100% in the loop. He seems not only willing but enthusiastic about handing over management of this stuff to me.

 

So, it's just a bit early to say the crisis has passed, but I think he's at least taking us seriously. And there is an action plan on the table.

[catz]

Great update Jenny!  :)

[Annie G]

 

We made it very clear to him last night that we are unwilling to continue with things as they are: He needs to give me login info for all school-related accounts and keep me 100% in the loop. He seems not only willing but enthusiastic about handing over management of this stuff to me.

 

So, it's just a bit early to say the crisis has passed, but I think he's at least taking us seriously. And there is an action plan on the table.

 

Sounds like progress has been made. Yay!

 

The only thing that stands out to me is your comment that he's enthusiastic about handing over management of that stuff to you.   I get that you're trying to get through this crisis- we're in a similar one with ds- and it's hard to have time to guide a kid through it. So much easier to just jump in and do it.  But if you think your ds is close to being ready to manage his own stuff, it might be worth it to make him be there through it all as you do it. 

[RootAnn]

I'm glad you all have a plan moving forward. I hope you have peace in your heart with the discussion and can push through your admin burnout until he is ready to take over the next step.

[almondbutterandjelly]

Yay!

[displace]

Awesome!

 

It may be worthwhile to require him to take a self management course. Like a great courses course on ... I forget the title, but I've heard it discussed. It helps students with executive function and self management things I believe?

[regentrude]

Great update, glad it worked out like this.

 

This, however

. He seems not only willing but enthusiastic about handing over management of this stuff to me.

 

has me concerned a bit. Being willing is one thing, but being enthusiastic about handing over all the unpleasant logistic details to mom? Pretty convenient for him.

Are you taking any steps to address this and have him eventually take over management of his own affairs? Colleges may have courses and assistance for students with a lack of EF.

Edited August 1, 2017 by regentrude

[Jaybee]

Great update, glad it worked out like this.

 

This, however

 

has me concerned a bit. Being willing is one thing, but being enthusiastic about handing over all the unpleasant logistic details to mom? Pretty convenient for him.

Are you taking any steps to address this and have him eventually take over management of his own affairs? Colleges may have courses and assistance for students with a lack of EF.

 

Yes...and no. Sometimes young men need to come to the point where they realize they actually do need help and can't handle some things on their own. When they willingly give up some independence in order to be more closely managed by a parent who formerly gave them that independence, I see that in itself as a positive step. Then you can go from there. And as a side note, some people will always need that scaffolding/accountability. That's why they have great administrative assistants, etc. But getting them to the point where they recognize that need is a helpful move in the right direction.