Most Japanese schools make students clean the school

[HomeMum]

I read this today and it was so fascinating to me. Lots of Japanese schools don't employ custodians. They believe that students should be required to clean because it will teach them respect, responsibility, and equality. [source]

 

I love these insights into other cultures. They really emphasize the diversity of opinions about what education really is/means/should be.

[shawthorne44]

The one that I thought was fascinating was that they won't let kids graduate from K if they couldn't walk home alone.  

[HomeMum]

The one that I thought was fascinating was that they won't let kids graduate from K if they couldn't walk home alone.  

 

Yes! That too. Cultural studies are some of my favorites. Second best thing to actually getting to travel :)

[freesia]

Hey, we make our students clean their school, too.  :lol:

[Mergath]

I would love to see that in the US, but it would never fly here. People would bitch about their precious snowflakes having to clean things, the school would bitch about how much time it takes away from test prep, and the janitors would bitch about having to find alternate employment.

[Guest]

Yes, and it works pretty well. Our churches in the past have had families clean the church so we don't waste money on a janitor and that works well too. Same principle.

[shawthorne44]

Yes! That too. Cultural studies are some of my favorites. Second best thing to actually getting to travel :)

 

 

Oh, Yes!  Totally!  Fascinating.   That is why I never understood travelling with a group.  Give me the subway any day.  There is something to be said for riding a bus with the locals and more animals than people.  

 

You ever read the Culture Shock line of books?   Totally fascinating.  

 

It just occurred to me, that might be an interesting addition to a homeschooling class on geography or world cultures.  Contrasting a culture with your own really makes it understandable.  

[Spy Car]

I saw students at a local (highly regarded academic) Catholic High School gloved up and picking up trash around their school the other day. Didn't look like punishment, either.

 

I happen to think it is a great idea. Students should be taught to help care for their learning space.

 

Bill

[Farrar]

I don't think it would ever fly here because of regulations in how we deal with trash and any space where we serve food... and to some extent I think that's important. In a large school, I think there should be someone whose job it is to clean if someone has a bathroom accident or gets sick in the hall or something along those lines. And who makes sure things are up to a safe level of cleanliness.

 

When I was school teaching, our students did all the cleaning on a daily basis. The space we had was cleaned professionally a few times a year. But most of the cleaning was just us. There was a chores time. Kids had to wipe down spaces, vacuum, sweep, tidy, take out trash, etc. But it was a small school. It was very doable because it was a limited space with limited chores. In a large building, I think you could have kids clean their classrooms and the hallways. I don't know that you could have them clean the kitchens and bathrooms in most schools.

[SKL]

Every time a kid got a splinter, the school would be sued.  And the unions would have a fit about unpaid workers who don't pay union dues.

 

When I was in KG, the students used to have to help clean up when someone peed or puked in the classroom.  Can you imagine that happening today?

[AndyJoy]

My mom founded a small school when I was in 7th grade, and we had daily after-school cleaning jobs that took about 10-15 minutes. We were using a church building, and had no janitor. We rotated jobs each week, and one student was assigned the task of supervisor to sign-off that the work was done. On Fridays we had a few extra tasks (like mopping instead of sweeping, emptying the larger trash cans into the dumpster, etc.) and we were released from class a bit earlier to accommodate this. It worked quite well. This was a small school with about 25 students in 7th-12th so it was manageable.

 

At a previous school the teachers were offered extra money if they chose to clean their own classrooms, which most happily accepted and used to pay their school-age children to clean. My sister and I loved having this daily job and steady income at age 6-10.

Edited October 7, 2016 by AndyJoy

[AndyJoy]

Our second-to-last day of school each year was an all-school workday. We deep-cleaned the classrooms, hauled books to basement storage, waxed the floors, painted, and helped with other facility improvements as a thank you to the church that let us use their building. We worked alongside our teachers and had a pizza party. I have fond memories of those workdays :).

[umsami]

When I was in school in Switzerland in St. Gallen, I know that kids cleaned at least the middle school bathrooms.  Bathrooms were unisex too.  Clean, no issues.

 

Made a lot of sense.

 

 

Would love to see kids walk to and from school as well.

[AimeeM]

I would love to see that in the US, but it would never fly here. People would bitch about their precious snowflakes having to clean things, the school would bitch about how much time it takes away from test prep, and the janitors would bitch about having to find alternate employment.

I would b*tch, but for none of those reasons. Lessen the homework load so that kids aren't up until 10 or 11 doing homework (now; it would be even later if kids were also pulling cleaning duty in the school, I would imagine), and I wouldn't complain even a little.

[TX Native]

Now I don't feel so guilty having my kids take 30 minutes out of the school day for chores around the house.

[idnib]

​

 I'm not saying they're all like this, but I really was impressed with the way the kids worked together.

[JadeOrchidSong]

I don't know about now, but when I was in school in Asia, all students from kindergarten to college cleaned the classrooms, campus, and so on. If you made a bathroom mess, you cleaned it up. Of course the sanitary standards were not as high as here. Once when I was just in 6th grade, my whole class waxed the wood floor of our classroom. To help generate funds for the school, for several years in elementary school, every student WOVE mesh bags the school sold for money. The students didn't get paid for this labor. However, college was free for me. In graduate school I got paid equivalent to $10 a month just being a student. Tuition and dorm were FREE, too. Now colleges are not free any more.

I was surely grateful to get free college and grad school education.

We all took it for granted we should clean at that time. I think it is a great idea!

[SparklyUnicorn]

I wonder how this would work in a very large school.  It would SEEM like the more people around..the more available to clean, but no I think that can mean a lot more people to coordinate. 

 

 

[Renthead Mommy]

The timing on this post is just too funny. 

 

My son attended the small private school up the street for the first two years after our move here.   Earlier in the week we were driving past the school about a half hour before they start and I see a few adults out front with neon posterboard signs.  As I get closer I see that signs say "Unfair practices with our kids" and "Kids deserve recess".  So I call my friend who is the adminstrator, tell her what is going on and head on my way. 

 

Turns out a former family, who started this year, but already had pulled out their child, so the child does not eve still attend, was annoyed.  They managed to get a few friends willing to stand on the corner and complain.  Their issue?  The middle school grades take turns setting up the tables for lunch, and then after lunch they break down the tables and sweep up the floor before heading out to recess.   This is something that takes about 6-8 max and it is not every day.  But they didn't think kids should have to do all that work.  They should have recess.

 

The kids didn't get it, because they don't see anything wrong with helping.  The parents were mad at the protestors because they like that their kids help.  And the biggest kicker of it all?  Like I said they miss about 7 minutes of recess ever few weeks.  But they are still getting a half hour of recess all the way to 8th grade because it is a private 8 year school!  Oh and there is also a 10 minute morning break that they can run around outside and get wiggles out as well.  So there is a total of 40 minutes of recess a day.  But 7 minutes ever few weeks is denying them recess. 

 

I hope my kid never had to hire or work with that entitled little princess that is being raised over in that house....

 

[Guest]

Interesting article. I wonder if the indoor slippers are the child's own personal articles or if they are just community property.

 

I agree with those concepts behind uniforms. I am pro-uniform. Although at my kid's private school, the kids use non-uniform accessories to pull status, i.e., "The Shoe Game," wherein guys place ridiculous over-emphasis on the coolness of their shoes as compared to the shoes of others.

[Cinder]

The timing on this post is just too funny. 

 

The middle school grades take turns setting up the tables for lunch, and then after lunch they break down the tables and sweep up the floor before heading out to recess.   This is something that takes about 6-8 max and it is not every day.  But they didn't think kids should have to do all that work.  They should have recess.

 

The kids didn't get it, because they don't see anything wrong with helping.

 

Good grief. When I was in middle school (7th-8th) at a private school, 7th graders took a 6-week "waiter" rotation. We ate family style at tables of 8 and the waiter would set the table at the beginning of lunch while everyone else waited outside. The "host"--an 8th grader--was responsible for dishing out the main dish (and dessert). The 2 or 3 people to the host's left were responsible for serving the side dishes. When the meal was done the waiter cleared the table and brought dessert. During dessert the principal made announcements. Then lunch was dismissed and the waiters would clear and wipe the table and sweep the floor.

 

We all liked this tradition. It was one of my favorite things about middle school.

[nd293]

In my son's Montessori school each child cleans up their desk after lunch, sweeps under it, and washes and dries the ceramic plate they eat off (they have to unpack their lunchbox onto the plate). They also tidy their classroom at the end of every day, and I'm pretty sure there's some sort of big clean at the end of each term.

 

The school is K-12, and the older kids take an international trip once in their high school years. They have to raise funds for this. One of the things they do is sweep the school at the end of the day, and the money that would have gone to a cleaning service goes into their fund.

 

I think kids cleaning their schools is a brilliant idea. After all, it's their living space. I imagine things would also stay a lot cleaner to start with if they knew they had to clean it. (It is worth noting that this doesn't work with dd who has to clean her own room, but I imagine if I had her clean her brother's room instead she'd make very sure he kept it clean and tidy!)

 

When I was in primary school I do remember we would all have to wash our desks annually at the end of the school year - soap and water.

 

ETA: The Montessori school also does slippers in winter or barefoot indoors in summer. They bring their own slippers in their preferred style.

Edited October 8, 2016 by nd293

[greenbeanmama]

When I was in sixth grade, our school was short help in the cafeteria.  They asked for sixth grade volunteers who would miss the lunch recess and about fifteen minutes of class (free reading time), in order to serve sides or wash lunch trays.  In exchange, the student ate lunch for free that day.  Since I had to buy my own lunch tickets, I volunteered every chance I got.  Once one of the lunch ladies knew I had to buy my own lunch, she made sure I worked in the cafeteria every day for the rest of the year.  The next year, someone complained about using students to do work that "should be hired out", and the lunch ladies couldn't have student help any more.  But it was a great benefit to me for that year.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Interesting article. I wonder if the indoor slippers are the child's own personal articles or if they are just community property.

 

I agree with those concepts behind uniforms. I am pro-uniform. Although at my kid's private school, the kids use non-uniform accessories to pull status, i.e., "The Shoe Game," wherein guys place ridiculous over-emphasis on the coolness of their shoes as compared to the shoes of others.

 

They are not community property.  They are brought from home and marked with their names in permanent ink.  The slippers are not what we would think of as slippers (with an open back) but are more like slip-on Keds. 

 

[rdj2027]

Interesting article. I wonder if the indoor slippers are the child's own personal articles or if they are just community property.

 

I agree with those concepts behind uniforms. I am pro-uniform. Although at my kid's private school, the kids use non-uniform accessories to pull status, i.e., "The Shoe Game," wherein guys place ridiculous over-emphasis on the coolness of their shoes as compared to the shoes of others.

LOL, they have that problem solved too.  All girls wear black penny loafers and the boys wear black dress shoes, they are all the same.  Jewelry is not allowed (at least at he local high school).

[HomeMum]

I wanted to respond to everyone, but there are too many posts now  :gnorsi:

 

Oh, Yes!  Totally!  Fascinating.   That is why I never understood travelling with a group.  Give me the subway any day.  There is something to be said for riding a bus with the locals and more animals than people.  

 

You ever read the Culture Shock line of books?   Totally fascinating.  

 

It just occurred to me, that might be an interesting addition to a homeschooling class on geography or world cultures.  Contrasting a culture with your own really makes it understandable.  

I could not agree with you more. Sometimes I even have a hard time traveling with a small group of friends just because I'm so much more independent and interested in public transit, full emersion, making the most of the experience, etc. Anyways, no, I haven't read those books. But, now its on my list :)

 

Every time a kid got a splinter, the school would be sued.  And the unions would have a fit about unpaid workers who don't pay union dues.

 

When I was in KG, the students used to have to help clean up when someone peed or puked in the classroom.  Can you imagine that happening today?

Yeah...  :crying:  I wasn't really trying to suggest in the thread that we should all implement this... I just found it fascinating. It could be a real nightmare. Glad I homeschool. :) 

 

Now I don't feel so guilty having my kids take 30 minutes out of the school day for chores around the house.

Haha, agreed! Justification at last!

 

The timing on this post is just too funny. 

 

My son attended the small private school up the street for the first two years after our move here.   Earlier in the week we were driving past the school about a half hour before they start and I see a few adults out front with neon posterboard signs.  As I get closer I see that signs say "Unfair practices with our kids" and "Kids deserve recess".  So I call my friend who is the adminstrator, tell her what is going on and head on my way. 

 

Turns out a former family, who started this year, but already had pulled out their child, so the child does not eve still attend, was annoyed.  They managed to get a few friends willing to stand on the corner and complain.  Their issue?  The middle school grades take turns setting up the tables for lunch, and then after lunch they break down the tables and sweep up the floor before heading out to recess.   This is something that takes about 6-8 max and it is not every day.  But they didn't think kids should have to do all that work.  They should have recess.

 

The kids didn't get it, because they don't see anything wrong with helping.  The parents were mad at the protestors because they like that their kids help.  And the biggest kicker of it all?  Like I said they miss about 7 minutes of recess ever few weeks.  But they are still getting a half hour of recess all the way to 8th grade because it is a private 8 year school!  Oh and there is also a 10 minute morning break that they can run around outside and get wiggles out as well.  So there is a total of 40 minutes of recess a day.  But 7 minutes ever few weeks is denying them recess. 

 

I hope my kid never had to hire or work with that entitled little princess that is being raised over in that house....

WHAT, THAT IS RIDICULOUS! I am so baffled sometimes about our culture. Geeze, is there no facepalm emoji here?

[Monica_in_Switzerland]

Our local school (Switzerland) has rotating after-recess clean up where one class goes through the playground and picks up trash.  The inside of the school is immaculate, and all classrooms have a coat room area where students leave a pair of slip on indoor shoes/slippers to use during school time.  

 

While visiting the middle school, what impressed me most was that it was also completely immaculate.  I don't' think the students are doing the cleaning, but somehow they've learned a whole lot more respect for the school grounds than the students in my own US high school when I was a student.

[heartlikealion]

In ds' classroom I saw a duty chart thing and sweeping was on the list. Lately ds has been super eager to clean around the house because dh has offered him money for these chores. He was sweeping and swiffering the hallway the other night Lol. People say to find your child's currency. Apparently for ds it's money for the bake sale at school LOL

[SKL]

I would also note that while young  Japanese kids may be cleaning their school, it's my understanding that they aren't given a lot of practical responsibilities at home.  The parents and other adults focus more on supporting the kids' school success, whereas in the US, we generally expect kids to pull a little more of their own weight outside of school.  So it probably averages out more or less.

 

Though I understand that young Japanese kids are trusted with more independence than young US kids are nowadays.  It was probably the other way around when I was a kid, though.  We've gone a little crazy with not letting kids do anything independently these days.

[J-rap]

I attended a European school for one year, and though they had one full-time employee for the kitchen, another for grounds, and another for custodial, the students did all the rest.  We had jobs that we did every day, plus bigger jobs that we did every Saturday.  It really cut down on tuition!

[ktgrok]

I vaguely remember having to wipe down the lunchroom tables every so often, maybe once a month? It was rotated through the classes. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

We had to clean our own desks including once a week wiping the tops of them.  Otherwise that was it. 

[Jean in Newcastle]

I would like to point out a few errors in this thread however.  Japanese students do not clean every part of the school.  And there are adults who are paid to clean.  http://www.japantimes.co.jp/life/2001/11/30/lifestyle/kids-get-down-to-classroom-clean-ups-2/#.V_k8DiS9XcM

[Laura Corin]

I would like to point out a few errors in this thread however.  Japanese students do not clean every part of the school.  And there are adults who are paid to clean.  http://www.japantimes.co.jp/life/2001/11/30/lifestyle/kids-get-down-to-classroom-clean-ups-2/#.V_k8DiS9XcM

 

I believe that this is the same in China: my friend who had children in school in China said that they cleaned their classroom each Friday, but that they weren't responsible for the toilets, etc.  

[shawthorne44]

I would also note that while young  Japanese kids may be cleaning their school, it's my understanding that they aren't given a lot of practical responsibilities at home.  The parents and other adults focus more on supporting the kids' school success, whereas in the US, we generally expect kids to pull a little more of their own weight outside of school.  So it probably averages out more or less.

 

Though I understand that young Japanese kids are trusted with more independence than young US kids are nowadays.  It was probably the other way around when I was a kid, though.  We've gone a little crazy with not letting kids do anything independently these days.

 

That is an interesting.   I have an Engineering Graduate Degree, so I've gotten some insights in education from the home countries of other students.   I remember one Indian guy said that he wasn't allowed to make his own tea.  His mother made his tea and became quite upset if he tried to do it.  His job was to study, and study and study.   His family thought he was quite a failure because he didn't get into that premier school in India.  Our professor in that class had graduated from there.  

[Ravin]

I don't know about now, but when I was in school in Asia, all students from kindergarten to college cleaned the classrooms, campus, and so on. If you made a bathroom mess, you cleaned it up. Of course the sanitary standards were not as high as here. Once when I was just in 6th grade, my whole class waxed the wood floor of our classroom. To help generate funds for the school, for several years in elementary school, every student WOVE mesh bags the school sold for money. The students didn't get paid for this labor. However, college was free for me. In graduate school I got paid equivalent to $10 a month just being a student. Tuition and dorm were FREE, too. Now colleges are not free any more.

I was surely grateful to get free college and grad school education.

We all took it for granted we should clean at that time. I think it is a great idea!

Japan has higher sanitation standards than the US .

[IslandMama10]

The one that I thought was fascinating was that they won't let kids graduate from K if they couldn't walk home alone.  

 

They don't have school buses (unless they go to a private school) so most walk home from school. It's a strange sight to see itty-bitty kids walking by themselves. 

 

(I'm currently in Japan now  :001_smile: )

[Jean in Newcastle]

Re. walking home alone: when I grew up in Japan our neighborhood had a "walking train ". All the kids and moms would gather in a central spot and the kids would walk together. The younger kids had bright yellow hats to make them easier to see. So it was never a matter of little Kenji walking a mile all by himself.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Edited October 9, 2016 by Jean in Newcastle

[heartlikealion]

They don't have school buses (unless they go to a private school) so most walk home from school. It's a strange sight to see itty-bitty kids walking by themselves. 

 

(I'm currently in Japan now  :001_smile: )

 

My family lived in Japan for a year before I was born. I think my sister actually rode a bus to school and I don't think it was a private school. So I am thinking it was a public bus??

[freeindeed]

When I taught public school, I had my students sweep and dust the classroom and keep their desks and areas around their desks clean and neat. They actually enjoyed helping. The custodians loved me and my class!

[SKL]

Yes, we were always expected to do some of the cleaning, but we also had a custodian who cleaned up after us.  Seems to make sense to me.

I should ask my kids what cleaning they do at school, if any.  Not that I believe it matters much, honestly.  When I was a kid, I got my housekeeping skills from my mother, and I expect that's what my kids will say too.

[Hammfried]

Yes! This is so very true in Japan. :) DD's Japanese school has an annual cleaning day much like one of the companies I used to work for. It isn't seen as a burden though and for DD's class, the kids seem to enjoy making a competition out of who can clean the fastest. There is a saying about how an uncluttered space leads to an uncluttered mind (but ask me if this translates to my current home state haha). I think it is also nice in teaching responsibility for one's space and materials. We have to write our child's full name on every school supply, right down to each individual crayon and pen and pen cap. You can bet after all of the effort that goes into preparing the school materials that we are more cognizant of taking care of it.

[JadeOrchidSong]

I would also note that while young Japanese kids may be cleaning their school, it's my understanding that they aren't given a lot of practical responsibilities at home. The parents and other adults focus more on supporting the kids' school success, whereas in the US, we generally expect kids to pull a little more of their own weight outside of school. So it probably averages out more or less.

 

Though I understand that young Japanese kids are trusted with more independence than young US kids are nowadays. It was probably the other way around when I was a kid, though. We've gone a little crazy with not letting kids do anything independently these days.

I saw a group of five 14 yr olds (both boys and girls) Japanese middle school students in Kyoto taht traveled there from somewhere near Narita Airport, several hours train ride away. They went there all by themselves for four days. It was a school project for them to learn to budget time, travel plan, hotel reservation, places to see and eat and so on. I think that was a brilliant project. In fact, they were just one of quite a few student groups we saw there.

For doing house chores, remember no other countries have living space as big as the US. Japanese homes are very very small. Individuals do not have their own bedroom. There is no car to clean and no yard to keep. No junk or clutter is possible. So there are much fewer chores than in the US. Sweeping the floor for a tiny apartment, washing your clothes in a small washing machine, washing dishes by hand or a very small washing machine, those are probably all that need to be done.