Do you think it is inherently dangerous to protest?

[3 ladybugs]

Without getting into specifics, I am curious what your general thoughts are on this. I am 39 (this month) and my mom seems to think that I shouldn't protest causes that I feel warrant it because it is inherently dangerous. We are not breaking any laws and just using 1st amendment protected rights. 

 

What do you think? Is it dangerous? Would you bring your child to protest something? For the record I do bring my children with me. 

[Luckymama]

Inherently dangerous? No.

 

Now a situation that is known for escalating to rioting or violence---that's another thing.

 

Taking children to a peaceful protest teaches them civic engagement.

[catz]

Generally?  No, I don't think so.  We've gone to a few very peaceful protests and demonstrations.  I have friends that go to them all the time.  At least locally, they are very generally peaceful.  And yes, I have and would bring my kids. 

[MarkW]

I think it's more dangerous now than it has been in the past. I won't mention the particular administrations under which the conditions changed dramatically so as not to derail the thread, but I do agree that protest can be inherently dangerous now.

 

Which is probably a reason that we need MORE and not less of it. :-/

 

There are two ways to think of it:

 

Protest as a concept? Not inherently dangerous.

 

Protest in our current political and social context? Yeah, inherently dangerous.

[Mimm]

I would go, but be prepared to leave if it seemed like things were heating up. No, I don't think protesting is inherently dangerous but that some protests do become dangerous situations.

[Word Nerd]

Protests can be dangerous, but I wouldn't say they are inherently dangerous.

[gardenmom5]

I think it depends upon what and location,

 

as for bringing children- it depends upon what, and location.   I've seen news video of people bringing kids to protests that are dangerous.

[Katy]

Depends on the nature of the protest. If it is in an area that is likely to break out into riots (I'm thinking Baltimore & St Louis issues over the past year), I wouldn't be comfortable with my kids in that area.

 

If you're talking about local protests by carrying signs in front of a state capital or a local business...  There might not be any harm in it.

 

Honestly I think getting a letter to the editor published in a major newspaper would accomplish more than a protest would though.

[MarkW]

Couldn't disagree more. Very few people read the paper or the Op Ed on the paper's website anymore. Protests are actually seen by people in your community who are just passively existing in the community itself. Those are the people you most need to reach.

[Arcadia]

Some people like to incite riots, gang violence on all occassions there is an assembly of people. I grew up with gang turf wars. So whether it is dangerous depends on location and the personality of the organizers.

 

We have two not so near neighbors who were confrontational and may have anger management issues. People had log police reports. I won't go to the same protest as them even if I agree with the cause just in case things get ugly.

[MarkW]

Some people like to incite riots, gang violence on all occassions there is an assembly of people.

I agree.

 

Some of those people have been shown to be plainclothes policemen.

[Valley Girl]

I don't think it's inherently dangerous. In fact, I think it is a good thing to teach children how to effect change peacefully. To me, that includes teaching them to write letters to the editor as well as to politicians and corporations when something with which they disagree is happening. I think kids need to see their parents exercising their rights in that way. However, they should be able to articulate the reasons they're there and have some understanding of the issue. (I've seen too many interviews where protesters had no idea why they were attending.)

 

That is one of the reasons I've taken my kids to participate in a couple of peaceful protests. I was, however, very alert and very prepared to leave at the first sign of trouble. I would never take them to a protest which had the signs of turning ugly before it even started.

[SproutMamaK]

I think protesting by definition is dangerous. Whether is SHOULD be or not is another matter. But protesting is standing up to a perceived injustive and publicly making it known that you disagree with the issue and why. Obviously in a protest, there will be another party that disagrees with your stance on the matter, and that party is one that you have already identified as one that is willing to act in a less-than-honourable manner in some way or another... and now, these less-than-honourable people are being publicly called on the carpet and their way of life/practices/culture/what have you is being threatened in some form by the protest. Given that, I think it is always wise when protesting something to expect that there may be a negative, even dangerous, backlash. Of course we SHOULD be able to protest safely, but given the very nature of the situation I would think it unwise to expect/assume that nothing could go wrong.

[Aiden]

I think I've been broken by my time overseas. When I lived in the US, I wouldn't have thought twice about going to a protest. I accidentally found myself in the middle of one outside the Supreme Court while walking from one work appointment to another one day. A protestor lay down on the sidewalk in front of me, and I just stepped over her and kept going. It never occurred to me that it could be dangerous.

 

Then I moved overseas. I was in Egypt when the protests turned into revolution, and my daughter and I were evacuated for three months. I was in Cambodia just before protests resulted in tanks on the streets, and I was concerned for friends there. In Kosovo, there were protests that were pretty peaceful, but by then I knew that if there was a protest, I wanted to be far away. Now, in Greece, I get daily emails telling me times and places where protests are scheduled, and you couldn't pay me enough to go to those areas at those times (especially the ones put on by anarchists).

 

So, no, I doubt that I'd go to a protest even in the US now, and there's no way I'd take my daughter. However, I can recognize rationally that many protests probably would be perfectly safe ... you just can't always tell which ones won't be until you're in the thick of it.

[mathnerd]

Mostly only if it was peaceful. And then, if it looks like things could go bad, I would be vigilant and leave. I would not take my child to protests. I think that he needs to grow up and form his own opinions about what values and causes are important enough to him in order to participate.

[LucyStoner]

I grew up at protests and have been in a pretty reasonably large number of them since I was a teenager.

 

There is risk. I was trying to get around downtown Seattle to see Noam Chomsky during WTO so yeah, I definitely know things do not always go well. Most of the time though things go fine. Some of these risks are crowd dynamics, some protester/police dynamics and some just random assholes who may show up.

 

There are some things I avoid. For instance, there's a particular group of anarchists in this area and I will not participate if I get wind they are coming. I won't take my kids into excessively large crowds because of my son's difficulties in crowds and not wanting to be pinned in. I will, and have, taken them to smaller things when I am certain of which ways I can navigate out. I tend to go to things only if they are predicted to be about 1/4-1/3 of what I think the space or route can handle to allow room for turnout to exceed expectations.

 

That said, I think for most protests the risks do not rise to the level of extreme danger or mean that it's irresponsible to participate.

[Carol in Cal.]

It depends how regular/organized the protest is, and how likely clashes are with counterdemonstrators.

 

At the university I attended, which was well known for very violent protests during the 1960s, (as in 'burning a building down'-type violent), by the time I attended protests were registered in advance, they got to use university sound system devices from 12:10 until 1PM in this one central plaza, and the electricity was cut at 1 and everyone left to go to class.  Once in a while a protest would march off campus at that point, but there was no ugliness.

 

OTOH if there had been counterdemonstrators it would have been a different dynamic.

 

Nowadays the police don't really take a side very often, so it's more intra clash than police/military clash unless the protest is against dignitaries who might feel or even be threatened.

[Katy]

Couldn't disagree more. Very few people read the paper or the Op Ed on the paper's website anymore. Protests are actually seen by people in your community who are just passively existing in the community itself. Those are the people you most need to reach.

 

People?  No.  Politicians?  Yes.  I interned for a Senator in college.  Part of the job was to cut out of the newspaper any article that mentioned him specifically, as well as the letters to the editor of the two largest papers in the state, the Times, and the Post.  He never got a summary of the opinions of people who called or wrote, but he cared about letters to the editor.  Other interns reported very similar experiences.  15 years may have passed, but many of those with the same policies are still in the Senate.

 

ETA:  In local matters just contacting state representatives or the mayor's office can be effective.  Small enough office that they'll take your call and speak to you.

[MarkW]

I think it's more important to engage people than politicians, which only becomes more true as you go up the rungs from local to federal politics. Politicians agendas are rarely in line with the people's at the state level and beyond, and the only thing that I think really changes that is widespread disapproval and attention from a whole lot of voters. You don't get that with an Op Ed.

[Murphy101]

I don't think they are, though of course they can be.

 

But also, how dangerous it is might make it all the more important to go. Because the one thing I do know is it does not get less dangerous if everyone is too scared to risk standing up.

 

And yes. Even risk our kids. Bravery to do the right thing often has an awful price.

 

That said I wouldn't put my kids at risk to protest just anything either.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Depends on what you are protesting.  I do think there are definite risks, but again it depends on how contentious the issue is. 

[MercyA]

Honestly I think getting a letter to the editor published in a major newspaper would accomplish more than a protest would though.

 

I strongly disagree. I have personally seen lives saved at protests.

 

OP, I think it's great that you're taking your children to protests. They are learning about the issues that matter to you and about the necessity of taking action. I would absolutely take my child to protests, unless they were in a riot-prone area.

 

That said, people can be unpredictable and emotions can run high. My friends and/or I have been spit at, had things thrown at us, and had our materials destroyed. One fellow protestor was deliberately swerved at and clipped by a car. We called the police, and an officer took down statements. When we picked up a copy of the police report later, the vast majority of eyewitness statements were conspicuously missing. 

 

That brings me to my next point. I fear law enforcement more than the general public. 15 years ago, I had no problem telling police officers that they were mistaken regarding my rights and that because of that I was under no obligation to obey them. I wouldn't try that now. Your 1st amendment rights mean next to nothing when you are out there, okay?  You can obey all laws and still be wrongly accused. Do what the police tell you, be respectful and cheerful, and *record everything*. You can seek recourse later.

 

I understand your mother's concerns, but I think you're doing the right thing. (ETA: Generally speaking, of course. I have no idea what you're protesting.) Just make sure that you stay alert and have a phone and videocamera at all times.

[redsquirrel]

It would never occur to me that a community protest could be dangerous.  I've been to plenty over the years, both local and to DC, and have never been particularly worried. Walking outside your house is inherently dangerous, but that's not going to stop me.

 

I have brought my kids to a few, but not all protests.  My older boy is 15 and I would bring him to any that I would go to.

 

ETA: most local protests I have been to are very tame affairs. People holding up signs or singing songs and everyone else walking past, a few stopping to listen.  Not exactly a radial event. I have a group of friends who protest at a particular corner every Tuesday morning. They have been doing it for years and nothing has happened. People drive by and either wave at them in support or just keep driving.

 

I really don't know what your mother is worried about.

[SKL]

I think it depends on the location and the subject matter.  Most protests are not dangerous.  On what history is your mom basing her concern?

[umsami]

In the US? No, it's pretty safe for the most part.  Where my husband is from (Egypt)?  Very dangerous.  Being at the wrong place at the wrong time (even if not intended to protest) can land you in jail, dead, etc.  You can lose your job, etc.  

 

Now, this weekend a bunch of people ("Oath Keepers") are holding armed protests at mosques around the country.  Would I go just to support my fellow Muslims?  No, it's not worth it for me.  I'm grateful for people of all faiths who will show up in solidarity, but in general, I think it's too dangerous to show up.

[MarkW]

Showing up at mosques to protest what? The existence of Islam?

Should progressives show up and surround gun shops and Walmarts in protest of school shootings? If they showed up armed they'd probably get shot.

[justasque]

...

That said, people can be unpredictable and emotions can run high. My friends and/or I have been spit at, had things thrown at us, and had our materials destroyed. One fellow protestor was deliberately swerved at and clipped by a car. We called the police, and an officer took down statements. When we picked up a copy of the police report later, the vast majority of eyewitness statements were conspicuously missing. 

 

...

 

From a safety perspective, I think there's a difference between protests where the issue is a bill or a policy or promoting a religion (things that will affect people but aren't personal, per se), vs. an issue with a particular person's actions or beliefs.  If you're actively trying to convince a particular individual that what they are doing at that moment is bad, and if they are feeling particularly emotional at that moment, then it could get ugly quickly.  When it gets personal, it is more likely to be taken personally,  

 

ETA - misread the OP.

[Katy]

I strongly disagree. I have personally seen lives saved at protests.

 

OP, I think it's great that you're taking your children to protests. They are learning about the issues that matter to you and about the necessity of taking action. I would absolutely take my child to protests, unless they were in a riot-prone area.

 

That said, people can be unpredictable and emotions can run high. My friends and/or I have been spit at, had things thrown at us, and had our materials destroyed. One fellow protestor was deliberately swerved at and clipped by a car. We called the police, and an officer took down statements. When we picked up a copy of the police report later, the vast majority of eyewitness statements were conspicuously missing. 

 

That brings me to my next point. I fear law enforcement more than the general public. 15 years ago, I had no problem telling police officers that they were mistaken regarding my rights and that because of that I was under no obligation to obey them. I wouldn't try that now. Your 1st amendment rights mean next to nothing when you are out there, okay?  You can obey all laws and still be wrongly accused. Do what the police tell you, be respectful and cheerful, and *record everything*. You can seek recourse later.

 

I understand your mother's concerns, but I think you're doing the right thing. (ETA: Generally speaking, of course. I have no idea what you're protesting.) Just make sure that you stay alert and have a phone and videocamera at all times.

 

Oh...  if you mean a woman's health clinic rather to stop a personal decision rather than a more political cause, I can see that.

 

Though I have a personal story about that...  I moved to an area of Iowa after college where there were only a handful of OB's, and I couldn't find one that would take my insurance that was also taking new patients.  I'd had problem periods since I was young where I used to need to go on the pill for about six months periodically for them to normalize. My period was getting to the point of debilitating and I needed the pill again.  The only place I could find an appointment was the particular clinic that's been protested a lot lately. I crossed a picket line at the clinic to do go to my appointment (the current rules didn't exist then, or if they did they weren't followed because someone got in my face).  I said something about being harassed by the protesters to the girl behind the counter and she rolled her eyes and said the ironic thing was that they didn't even perform the procedure they were protesting at that clinic.  Apparently in that state you had to go to a clinic in Iowa City and have the procedure there, at least back then.  I mentioned it to a friend at church when he said he was leading some of those protests and it turned out the group didn't know that.  After that they moved the protests to the appropriate clinic. Ever since then whenever I've heard about a clinic with protesters I always wonder if it's the same situation and they're protesting at a clinic that is only a GYN office. 

[Katy]

In the US? No, it's pretty safe for the most part.  Where my husband is from (Egypt)?  Very dangerous.  Being at the wrong place at the wrong time (even if not intended to protest) can land you in jail, dead, etc.  You can lose your job, etc.  

 

Now, this weekend a bunch of people ("Oath Keepers") are holding armed protests at mosques around the country.  Would I go just to support my fellow Muslims?  No, it's not worth it for me.  I'm grateful for people of all faiths who will show up in solidarity, but in general, I think it's too dangerous to show up.

 

Really?  That is terrible.  I'm so sorry.

[3 ladybugs]

I am glad I asked this. I am loving reading the responses. :)

 

ETA - Don't you think it is funny that there are probably protests everyday that we never even hear about. Odd when you think about it. I almost wish we had "protest pages" in the newspaper. :)

 

[MarkW]

Protests are deliberately not covered by mainstream media which in the US is now owned by only SIX major corporations (down from over 100 in the mid 80s) whose ownership would rather you not think about the things that protesters are trying to bring to light.

 

This is what happened to Occupy Wall Street. It was MASSIVE and right in the middle of New York City. It was barely covered except for the minority of arrests, photographs of piles of litter attributed to protesters, and any footage they could get of protesters misbehaving or causing trouble.

[Btervet]

I often went to protests in DC before having kids. They were always peaceful protests and yet I was physically assaulted multiple times. Ended up sitting in a cop car one night, in the hospital twice. One of my friends was seriously injured. The verbal abuse we endured was terrible. It was worth it for me, especially as many of the fights we were fighting have been won now. However, I stopped the day I got pregnant, and would never bring my kids. I don't feel I have the right to put my kids lives in danger because of my political beliefs, no matter how important they are to me.

[MarkW]

Sometimes your kids lives and livelihood are in danger if you don't protest and make it known that children are affected, too. I don't blame you, but it's certainly not cut and dry.

[Bluegoat]

Not inherently, but it would really depend on the sort of crowd that would be attracted and the circumstances.

[Guest]

Uh, no.

[SKL]

I think protesting on social media makes up for the selectiveness of the traditional media.

[Pam in CT]

In the US? No, it's pretty safe for the most part.  Where my husband is from (Egypt)?  Very dangerous.  Being at the wrong place at the wrong time (even if not intended to protest) can land you in jail, dead, etc.  You can lose your job, etc.  

 

Now, this weekend a bunch of people ("Oath Keepers") are holding armed protests at mosques around the country.  Would I go just to support my fellow Muslims?  No, it's not worth it for me.  I'm grateful for people of all faiths who will show up in solidarity, but in general, I think it's too dangerous to show up.

 

umsami, the bolded is... very troubling.  If you are able to share information of where they plan to protest, I would be interested (PM if that's better).

 

 

to the OP: I agree with what a number of pp have said: context matters (who's organizing, the size & egress routes of the space, etc.).  The vast majority of protests in this country are comprised of people lawfully and peacefully exercising their rights.  There are times though that either the issue being protested (i.e. police actions in Ferguson) or the organizing group (I would include Oath Keepers, here; or Westboro) are sufficiently provocative / emotional that conditions are more flammable and unpredictable.  

[MarkW]

I think protesting on social media makes up for the selectiveness of the traditional media.

 

Social media is pretty selective, too, and far less ubiquitous because of the way that communities of thought sequester themselves even online.

[Guest]

I am glad I asked this. I am loving reading the responses. :)

 

ETA - Don't you think it is funny that there are probably protests everyday that we never even hear about. Odd when you think about it. I almost wish we had "protest pages" in the newspaper. :)

 

I think some people in the press are deliberately muddying the waters and conflating protests with riots. That is an agenda-driven prerogative. 

 

Niche media covers the protests. Mass media cottons to the riots, mostly to the exclusion of protests.

 

Take your kids. Keep an eye out. Rock the cause, man.

[Guest]

umsami, the bolded is... very troubling.  If you are able to share information of where they plan to protest, I would be interested (PM if that's better).

 

 

to the OP: I agree with what a number of pp have said: context matters (who's organizing, the size & egress routes of the space, etc.).  The vast majority of protests in this country are comprised of people lawfully and peacefully exercising their rights.  There are times though that either the issue being protested (i.e. police actions in Ferguson) or the organizing group (I would include Oath Keepers, here; or Westboro) are sufficiently provocative / emotional that conditions are more flammable and unpredictable.  

 

The world is saying no to Islam, dontchaknow.

 

They've got mad feelings and they need to use their 1st amendment rights to let the world know about them.

 

As a side note, "Mikey White" sounds like the name a character parodying this dude would get.

[justasque]

umsami, the bolded is... very troubling.  If you are able to share information of where they plan to protest, I would be interested (PM if that's better).

 

 

to the OP: I agree with what a number of pp have said: context matters (who's organizing, the size & egress routes of the space, etc.).  The vast majority of protests in this country are comprised of people lawfully and peacefully exercising their rights.  There are times though that either the issue being protested (i.e. police actions in Ferguson) or the organizing group (I would include Oath Keepers, here; or Westboro) are sufficiently provocative / emotional that conditions are more flammable and unpredictable.  

 

Armed Protesters To Rally Against ‘Evils Of Radical Islam’ Saturday In Dearborn

 

"Similar protests are planned for the same time outside mosques nationwide including Atlanta, Georgia; Huntsville, Alabama; and Murfreesboro, Tennessee."

[Tanaqui]

It's dangerous to get in a car. It's dangerous to cross the street. Car accidents remain one of the top causes of death for all Americans.

 

Depending on the situation, it may be dangerous - for society, if not for you personally - not to protest. Consider the Rosenstrasse protest. If these women had not gone against the prevailing climate of fear, things would have turned out very differently for their husbands. For that matter, if more people had stood up and protested in Nazi Germany, history would be very different.

 

We are not living in Nazi Germany. Although violence is something that does sometimes happen at protests (and I'll refrain from casting blame here), the risks are not at all the same as in a totalitarian state.

 

If you're going to a protest where you think there is a high likelihood of violence, don't bring the kids. Otherwise, I wouldn't worry about it.

 

I *will* say that it's unethical to coerce your kids into protesting for you. If they want to carry a sign or otherwise be actively involved, that's one thing, but if they're not that into it it's better to have them just be there with a book, or to stay home if they're old enough, while you do the protest.

[LucyStoner]

I think it's more important to engage people than politicians, which only becomes more true as you go up the rungs from local to federal politics. Politicians agendas are rarely in line with the people's at the state level and beyond, and the only thing that I think really changes that is widespread disapproval and attention from a whole lot of voters. You don't get that with an Op Ed.

And with the migration of news to the web rather than paper, letters to the editor aren't even read. More or less. Rarely at most. An ever shrinking number of people even have a paper in their home, much less read the thing cover to cover. I mean, it's not 1965 or 1995.

[Pam in CT]

Armed Protesters To Rally Against ‘Evils Of Radical Islam’ Saturday In Dearborn

 

"Similar protests are planned for the same time outside mosques nationwide including Atlanta, Georgia; Huntsville, Alabama; and Murfreesboro, Tennessee."

 

Thanks.  Not "liking"... cuz.

[umsami]

Here's some articles on it:

http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2015/10/09/armed-anti-muslim-protesters-to-rally-saturday-outside-dearborn-mosque/

 

http://www.ibtimes.com/anti-muslim-protests-scheduled-nationwide-global-rally-humanity-calls-demonstrations-2120625

 

 

[Pam in CT]

Here's some articles on it:

http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2015/10/09/armed-anti-muslim-protesters-to-rally-saturday-outside-dearborn-mosque/

 

http://www.ibtimes.com/anti-muslim-protests-scheduled-nationwide-global-rally-humanity-calls-demonstrations-2120625

 

Thank you.  Not "liking," cuz.

 

Do you know if affected communities have been able to reach out and connect with interfaith groups and other supporters of freedom of religion?  

 

(I'm a little mortified that I was unaware that this was happening, but I was not.)

[umsami]

Thank you.  Not "liking," cuz.

 

Do you know if affected communities have been able to reach out and connect with interfaith groups and other supporters of freedom of religion?  

 

(I'm a little mortified that I was unaware that this was happening, but I was not.)

 

I'm only personally aware of what one of the communities is doing....and yes, they've connected with interfaith groups, the FBI, and local sheriff's office.  I'm assuming the other communities have done the same.

 

This group tried to do a similar thing in Phoenix last year, and many many people showed up to support them.

 

Even with that, it only takes one to turn it bad....when there are so many guns....I don't want to be there.  

[Valley Girl]

 

 

I *will* say that it's unethical to coerce your kids into protesting for you. If they want to carry a sign or otherwise be actively involved, that's one thing, but if they're not that into it it's better to have them just be there with a book, or to stay home if they're old enough, while you do the protest.

 

I would agree. I don't, however, think there is anything wrong with taking them along as a civics lesson.

[abba12]

Depends on the protest. For example, I decided not to attend a protest about compulsory vaccination because threats were made by pro-vaccination people, measles and whooping cough both had recent outbreaks and there were threats to bring those people and intentionally expose the group. I don't think many people with babies attended, and I decided a protest about health could end up going badly because of the nature of it and didn't go. 

 

On the other hand, I'd have no problem taking them to any sort of union/wages/strike type protest. They're pretty safe here. 

[Tanaqui]

I would agree. I don't, however, think there is anything wrong with taking them along as a civics lesson.

 

No, certainly not! Just, like Sadie, I think you should refrain from having your cute little tyke *actively participate* until they're at least old enough to formulate their own, educated opinion on the subject (whatever it is).