JAWM - Sometimes I hate being an introvert ...

[PrincessMommy]

Or rather, why I hate that being an introvert makes me out to be the bad guy.

 

Sigh.

 

My sister (who we hardly see) is visiting next weekend. It's the first time I've seen her in a year.  She's going to swing over here Sund/Monday and then go see her daughter and grand-kids on Tues. for the rest of the week. 

 

She called me to today just so we could discuss about when she'll be arriving after the conference, so we can coordinate with my other sis who lives locally to me.  I was SO looking forward to just having some nice time with my sisters and their spouses.  

 

But....

 

Then my sis tells me that her daughter, Son-IL, and 2 grandkids are planning to come up *to my house* to spend the night Sun/Mon :confused1: :huh: .     I mumbled something about how I was really looking forward to spending time just with my sister, but then I caveat it with "but I wouldn't want to keep you from seeing your grandbabies."  It was just really awkward... and my niece hasn't even contacted me about this either, so clearly she's not coming up to see me.    Here I am...looking at seeing a houseful for the weekend when what I was really looking forward to was spending time with my sis and her dh.    If I say something, then I'm just grumpy and inhospitable.    But, my sis was just down there 2 weeks ago and they're going from here back down for the rest of the week..

 

I'm sad and now I just wish I could throw in the towel on the whole thing and go into my cave. 

 

Ugh... I hate this.. :sad:

[sunflowerlady]

I get it. Really.

[JessReplanted]

Sorry, I am the same way. :grouphug:

[Anne]

You know, I'm not an introvert - but I wouldn't be very happy about this, either!  If it were me, I'd be calling my sis back and saying, hey, wait - I love the youngers, BUT I was really looking forward to getting to spend time with *you*  - how can we work that out?   I really don't think you would be grumpy and/or inhospitable - especially since your sis has just seen the grandkids and will see them again after this visit.  

 

t might not change the dynamics of this episode, but it might help my sis grasp that I would really like to spend some time just with her.

 

:grouphug:

 

Anne

[Seasider]

She invited people to be houseguests at a house where she is a guest herself, without first running it by the homeowner? That was really impolite.

 

I'm sure you are fond of all these people but I certainly understand your disappointment. I have noticed new and surprising behaviors emanating from folks I know when they become grandparents.

[PrincessMommy]

She invited people to be houseguests at a house where she is a guest herself, without first running it by the homeowner? That was really impolite.

 

I'm sure you are fond of all these people but I certainly understand your disappointment. I have noticed new and surprising behaviors emanating from folks I know when they become grandparents.

 

no, I think my niece probably did the self-inviting.  I really don't know for sure, but I'm pretty sure that's how it happened.

[PrincessMommy]

thanks for understanding guys.  I knew you all would. 

[TammyS]

 

Then my sis tells me that her daughter, Son-IL, and 2 grandkids are planning to come up *to my house* to spend the night Sun/Mon :confused1: :huh: .  

 

This is not about you being an introvert.

 

This is about that your niece's family is RUDE!

 

People don't get to invite themselves to others homes.  Especially to spend the the night.  And especially without even asking that person. 

 

How I about I invite myself to spend the night at your nieces' house?  With my husband, Great Pyrenees, and two rowdy boys?

[gaillardia]

Then they won't mind sleeping in places that may not seem very hospitable and comfortable.

[goldberry]

I get it too.  I can't stand when I have friends visit or when I have to visit them for an "event".  I have a dear friend in California that it was very important to her that I come out for her (3rd) wedding reception.  They had a destination wedding and were having a local reception.  I flew in, stayed at her house with a zillion other people, attended the reception, and flew back the next day.

 

No real visiting/talking time, and any time period was shared with 5 other people minimum.  I was miserable. 

 

When my brother died, this same friend said she wanted to come stay with me for a few days.  Did I want her to come for his ashes being scattered?  Nope.  I waited until all other family was done, then had her come for an open weekend.  We had a lovely time.

 

I get it.  :grouphug:

[PrincessMommy]

This is not about you being an introvert.

 

This is about that your niece's family is RUDE!

 

People don't get to invite themselves to others homes.  Especially to spend the the night.  And especially without even asking that person. 

 

How I about I invite myself to spend the night at your nieces' house?  With my husband, Great Pyrenees, and two rowdy boys?

 

thanks... it's SO nice to have people who understand.  Really.

 

My dh is an extrovert and when I tell him the news he'll say, "Great!! More people to party with."  And he will.not.get that I find it disappointing and rude.  He'll think I'm being non-social.

[Ripley]

My family is like that. It's not considered rude in our family, it's just considered family. It'd actually be weird to ask.

 

But my ex-husband's family worked way differently.

Honestly it wasn't until I met him that I realized families have different boundaries.

And that by common poll, my family apparently had zero whereas the rest of the world had SOME.

:)

 

I'm sorry your weekend is not going to go as you had hoped and planned. As more of my brothers and sisters got married, the light bulb went from dark to dim and eventually to bright. I hope your niece eventually figures it out. And for your sake I hope it's before your BIL's next conference LOL.

 

Is there any way you can channel your inner assertive sister? Maybe say, "Oh, sounds great, but why don't we /insert plan to cut niece's visit in half/ because I had planned to do /insert something best done as a sister trio/ on /whatever day/" and see how that goes over? It might be scary, but it'd be a start - and a good way to activate your niece's light bulb!

 

 

[Cinder]

no, . . . .  I really don't know for sure, but I'm pretty sure that's how it happened.

 

Even if your niece did self-invite your sister is clearly ok with this because she *informed* you this is what would be happening; she didn't just ask if it was ok.

 

I'd be quite annoyed too but would probably just deal with it.  :grouphug:

[Ethel Mertz]

I totally get it. Similar situations have happened here. Fortunately, I have trained my extrovert Spouse and usually get some accommodation. Good luck with your situation! I agree with others about trying to negotiate and put limits on niece's incursion.

[catz]

That's just totally rude because people don't just get to invite themselves over whenever they feel like it.  I'd be mad!  And I'm not introverted - more balanced.  Having one adult sibling over is vastly different than hosting 5 and young kids. 

[TammyinTN]

I completely understand what you mean.  I'm so sorry! 

[Miss Tick]

I like Ripley's idea, quick schedule a mani-pedi at someplace someone had ever raved to you about. Our even just mentioned.

 

Also, be sure to mention how great it is that she can take you ALL out for dinner at the new place.

[jenn-]

You are a better person then me.  I would call up the sister and say that you really cannot handle the extra people mentally/physically/emotionally right now.  Let her know that you really really want to spend this time doing xyz and having the other family will make it harder to do.  If the sister wasn't going to be going to the grandkid's house this trip, then I might be agreeable but that is not the case here.

[applethyme]

:grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug:

 

I understand.

[PrairieSong]

If your sister lives that far away no wonder you want to spend special time with her, not with a crowd of people. I hope it works out for you. Hugs.

[shanvan]

You are a better person then me.  I would call up the sister and say that you really cannot handle the extra people mentally/physically/emotionally right now.  Let her know that you really really want to spend this time doing xyz and having the other family will make it harder to do.  If the sister wasn't going to be going to the grandkid's house this trip, then I might be agreeable but that is not the case here.

​This is exactly why I would do.  The older I get, the less I stress myself to meet these sorts of demands.

[TammyS]

Call up your niece and say that you are so excited to see her and you wondered if she wanted you to send her some recommendations for local hotels or could she handle the arrangements herself?

[Suzanne115]

I'm sorry.  I totally understand your disappointment.  Last time, my Aunt from California came to visit my mom, I was excited about the few days that I would be able to join them.  I went and my mom had invited a ton of other people.  I was really disappointed, but I had to go along and make the best of it.  I'm very introverted so a large crowd at my house would upset me too. 

 

Suzanne

[fairfarmhand]

I get it.

 

I probably wouldn't say anything because I am a coward, but I would totally be disappointed and irritated.

 

For me the dynamics of a group are just SO SO different than one on one.

 

Basically, I am such a wallflower that I wouldn't end up visiting with anyone.

[PrincessMommy]

thanks everyone.  Well.. to answer a few questions.  My house is the biggest, and now that college kids are gone we have 3 available rooms plus a queen in the main room of our basement.   So, having someone stay at a hotel when we have plenty of room wouldn't work.  My local sister has no room.  Small house, family, 2 big dogs.  Yeah, no room for 4 extras.   Somehow, it was just assumed I'd do it.  I don't understand why this was the case though.  No one thought to *call* me and see???   I would never do that, unless it was some kind of an emergency, family tragedy or something.    My local sister is much more social than me too.  She's always going out and doing stuff with other local family.   They never/rarely invite me.   I may say something to local sister about not even being asked ahead of time (she might get this part)...but I worry that if I say something about this then it will only make me more excluded... I think I'm just going to suck it up... but it makes me stressed out about the next time.

 

Why don't people understand boundaries??

 

Don't even get me started about the holidays & extended family :scared:

 

 

[wintermom]

 

Why don't people understand boundaries??

 

 

They will know your boundaries if you tell them what is fine with you and what isn't. If you want to just visit with your sister then be very clear. The niece can be upset, but that is NOT your problem.

[TammyS]

  So, having someone stay at a hotel when we have plenty of room wouldn't work.

 

Sure it would.  I didn't say to tell her you have no room.  It doesn't matter if you do or not.  It's your space to use as you wish.  Just call her up and ask her if she wants a hotel recommendation.  Don't say anything about the space.  Just ask about the recommendation.

 

I don't care if you were extroverted to Nth degree.  You don't invite yourself to other's homes unasked.  Rude.  But if you are going to do it, you at least call and ask.  You don't assume you have a standing invitation unless you actually have one.

 

I strongly suggest you do not suck it up.  You asked why they don't understand boundaries.  This is why.  Because you aren't putting them in place.  They will understand them just fine as soon as you create some.

[KungFuPanda]

Ha! They probably think they're doing you a favor. "Poor Sis with her empty lonely house. She could use some cheering up!" I'm an extrovert and I'd be seriously taken aback if an entire family invited themselves to my house and never even told me. Not to mention that I'm no longer little kid safe. I'd let them come but would likely push back with "Oh, I have a class on Friday night, so you all are in charge of dinner that night."

[Anne in CA]

Sadly, I have learned that sucking up this kind of thing does not get you included next time. This sort of person is simply using you and will not include you in the next fun thing they do unless you can do most of the contributing. That aside, it sounds like this relative is looking for a free getaway at your expense. 

[fairfarmhand]

Can you call your sister and say, "hey I am looking forward to your visit. However, I had x and y planned for just the two of us. Could neice and kids only come for like one night so that you and I can still spend those days together?"

[PrincessMommy]

They will know your boundaries if you tell them what is fine with you and what isn't. If you want to just visit with your sister then be very clear. The niece can be upset, but that is NOT your problem.

 

yes, you're right.  I shouldn't complain if I'm not willing to make my boundaries clear.

[Greta]

I'm extremely introverted, so I can absolutely relate. :grouphug: Houseguests are emotionally exhausting to me, even when I have invited them, and truly want them to stay, and have a wonderful time with them. I still have to recover for awhile once they're gone!

 

I cannot imagine a family of four inviting themselves to stay and not even bothering to discuss it with you!!! That's the part that made my jaw drop. Maybe your niece thought that your sister asked you? But either way, one or both of them assumed it was okay with you without actually consulting you, and that's got nothing to do with introvert/extrovert, that is about basic manners. I have no advice to offer, but I can offer my sympathy. I know how I would handle it, but my living situation and my family dynamic are different.

[wintermom]

yes, you're right.  I shouldn't complain if I'm not willing to make my boundaries clear.

 

It's not easy, and them putting you in the situation of being the potential "bad guy" just isn't fair of them at all. That was not your choice. They made some assumptions for whatever reason, and a gentle reminder that it is not alright to invite oneself over is probably in order. Sorry you have to go through this. (((hugs)))

 

The good news is that once you've dealt with it, you probably won't have to do it again. Of course, there is the possibility that they all get bent out of shape and decide not to visit you, which would be sad. It's still not your fault. That would be their choice.

 

[8circles]

OP, I totally understand your feeling, being an introvert myself.  I hate having company at all, let alone overnight guests.  I have no suggestions how to handle your situation because I'd be similarly in a pickle.  So I'm not disagreeing with you at all.

 

However, I'm a little take aback by all the exclamations of horror by some posters over your niece inviting herself over to your house. I agree that for many (most?) families this would be not acceptable or certainly out of the ordinary, I don't think it is for all families & I don't think that means those family members are rude or lacking boundaries.  In my FOO and their families (both sides) this is acceptable behavior.  I know that my FOO has all kids of messed-up but I don't think this is one of those things.  It is still the general known rule that if you are traveling and will be near family, you would be welcome at that house.  We have had people stay here & we have been welcomed at others homes as well.  I just wish people wouldn't be so harsh about it.  I mean, in an ideal world, doesn't it sound lovely knowing that you would be welcome at the home of any family member?  I don't think the niece is being rude, I think its more likely she just feels the love. 

 

Of course, I don't know your family or this niece & I understand there could be a lot of other factors and you've alluded to some - but I don't know that the niece is involved in any of those things so I hate seeing all the accusations of rudeness.

[Liz CA]

She invited people to be houseguests at a house where she is a guest herself, without first running it by the homeowner? That was really impolite.

 

I'm sure you are fond of all these people but I certainly understand your disappointment. I have noticed new and surprising behaviors emanating from folks I know when they become grandparents.

 

It is impolite. Many people don't understand that concept, especially when it's "all in the family."

 

There is another side to this - or two. From the introvert's view, it seems "I am not good/worthy/entertaining enough to be visited for my sake. They have to bring someone along to make it more fun."

The extrovert's view is often more like this: "Let's bring Susie, Joe and Mary while we can all squeeze in a visit. I am sure she'll (you) love to see them as well. The more the merrier."

 

I understand both sides even though I am tending more to the introvert.

[Liz CA]

 

 

However, I'm a little take aback by all the exclamations of horror by some posters over your niece inviting herself over to your house. I agree that for many (most?) families this would be not acceptable or certainly out of the ordinary, I don't think it is for all families & I don't think that means those family members are rude or lacking boundaries.  In my FOO and their families (both sides) this is acceptable behavior.  I know that my FOO has all kids of messed-up but I don't think this is one of those things.  It is still the general known rule that if you are traveling and will be near family, you would be welcome at that house.  We have had people stay here & we have been welcomed at others homes as well.  I just wish people wouldn't be so harsh about it.  I mean, in an ideal world, doesn't it sound lovely knowing that you would be welcome at the home of any family member?  I don't think the niece is being rude, I think its more likely she just feels the love. 

 

 

 

For me, it's not so much that I don't want to invite someone but I want to KNOW ahead of time and perhaps issue the invitation myself. I would not think of inviting someone to another person's house - not even family. I would say, "my sister is in town during that time. Is it going to be too much for you if I brought her along?" Or something like this.

[8circles]

For me, it's not so much that I don't want to invite someone but I want to KNOW ahead of time and perhaps issue the invitation myself. I would not think of inviting someone to another person's house - not even family. I would say, "my sister is in town during that time. Is it going to be too much for you if I brought her along?" Or something like this.

 

I totally get that.  I wouldn't want those people at my house at all so I'm even worse.

 

My point is there are some legit family cultures that do think it's OK & believe it or not many people are OK with it, on both ends.  I think there's a chance that the OP is part of a family culture where maybe she doesn't fit in so nicely, like me.

[Greta]

OP, I totally understand your feeling, being an introvert myself.  I hate having company at all, let alone overnight guests.  I have no suggestions how to handle your situation because I'd be similarly in a pickle.  So I'm not disagreeing with you at all.

 

However, I'm a little take aback by all the exclamations of horror by some posters over your niece inviting herself over to your house. I agree that for many (most?) families this would be not acceptable or certainly out of the ordinary, I don't think it is for all families & I don't think that means those family members are rude or lacking boundaries.  In my FOO and their families (both sides) this is acceptable behavior.  I know that my FOO has all kids of messed-up but I don't think this is one of those things.  It is still the general known rule that if you are traveling and will be near family, you would be welcome at that house.  We have had people stay here & we have been welcomed at others homes as well.  I just wish people wouldn't be so harsh about it.  I mean, in an ideal world, doesn't it sound lovely knowing that you would be welcome at the home of any family member?  I don't think the niece is being rude, I think its more likely she just feels the love. 

 

Of course, I don't know your family or this niece & I understand there could be a lot of other factors and you've alluded to some - but I don't know that the niece is involved in any of those things so I hate seeing all the accusations of rudeness.

 

You do bring up some interesting points.  In my family, I think it would be expected that you would have a place to stay with family if you were visiting the city in which they live.  But it would also be expected that you would check in with them first to make sure it wasn't an inconvenience.  That's the part that surprised me, but I guess different families can be very different in this way.  In my family, I think that in the case of an emergency or some other last-minute situation, that would be totally understood and accepted.  But having the ability and time to pay the host the courtesy of asking, and yet choosing not to do so -- that would be pretty odd.  But I concede your point that different families just have different ways of doing things, and I shouldn't be so quick to judge a dynamic that is different from what I'm used to.

[Tammyla]

thanks everyone.  Well.. to answer a few questions.  My house is the biggest, and now that college kids are gone we have 3 available rooms plus a queen in the main room of our basement.   So, having someone stay at a hotel when we have plenty of room wouldn't work.  My local sister has no room.  Small house, family, 2 big dogs.  Yeah, no room for 4 extras.   Somehow, it was just assumed I'd do it.  I don't understand why this was the case though.  No one thought to *call* me and see???   I would never do that, unless it was some kind of an emergency, family tragedy or something.    My local sister is much more social than me too.  She's always going out and doing stuff with other local family.   They never/rarely invite me.   I may say something to local sister about not even being asked ahead of time (she might get this part)...but I worry that if I say something about this then it will only make me more excluded... I think I'm just going to suck it up... but it makes me stressed out about the next time.

 

Why don't people understand boundaries??

 

Don't even get me started about the holidays & extended family :scared:

 

 

 

:iagree: I 100% get where you are coming from, but to be honest, you are not setting any boundaries by suffering silently and going along with the flow.  Discuss this with your sister and everyone in an open and honest way.  Even if accommodating them with plenty of room is a no-brainer, you are still going to have to host them and that takes, time, money, energy and planning. :grouphug:

[Tammyla]

Geez, I'm a little off today, somehow I overlooked the JAWM part. 

 

That said, I think many people introverts or extroverts would be put off by a last minute change this big.  And I'm really sorry you aren't going to have that just-sister time visit you were looking forward to.

 

 

[Word Nerd]

I'd be both frazzled by the extra company to prepare for, feed, and entertain, and disappointed not to get any sister time. Hopefully you'll still get a chance to talk more privately even if the whole horde is around.

[Magnolia Rain]

Oh man, OP this really resonates with me today.

 

JAWM rant: We just had our 5th baby (4 weeks ago) and are having a baby blessing for her in 2 weeks. My parents and my IL's are flying - cross country - to attend. We heard from them yesterday that they are flying out all of DH's siblings (5 of them), spouses (4 plus 1 new bf), and children (17). Typing that all out makes me want to crawl in a hole ... Which I feel terrible about. But, the real stressor is that they asked if the kids could sleep in blankets and pillows on the floor while the adults sleep at a nearby hotel. We have the room, but the thought of 17 children, who I love but haven't seen in 3 years, staying at my house is making me twitchy.

 

Honestly, I'm just kinda pissed. But, how do you say that without offending everyone?

 

Sorry for my rant. OP, I hope it works out and your weekend is stress free and enjoyable.

[Miss Mousie]

I wonder if your niece hasn't done any (or much) hosting of her own.  If that's the case, she may not realize all the small details involved, nor even the big ones (as in, "whoa! dinner for 5 is now dinner for 9!  I'm going to need another 10# of potatoes!  I don't have a pot large enough for all that pasta!" etc.). 

 

[i see from your signature that you have six kids, OP.  So you probably do have a large enough pot.  But I think you'll understand what I'm trying to say.  :) ]

 

 

[Miss Mousie]

Oh man, OP this really resonates with me today.

 

JAWM rant: We just had our 5th baby (4 weeks ago) and are having a baby blessing for her in 2 weeks. My parents and my IL's are flying - cross country - to attend. We heard from them yesterday that they are flying out all of DH's siblings (5 of them), spouses (4 plus 1 new bf), and children (17). Typing that all out makes me want to crawl in a hole ... Which I feel terrible about. But, the real stressor is that they asked if the kids could sleep in blankets and pillows on the floor while the adults sleep at a nearby hotel. We have the room, but the thought of 17 children, who I love but haven't seen in 3 years, staying at my house is making me twitchy.

 

Honestly, I'm just kinda pissed. But, how do you say that without offending everyone?

 

Sorry for my rant. OP, I hope it works out and your weekend is stress free and enjoyable.

 

:eek:   So you'll be six weeks post-partum and they think it's a good idea for you to be the overnight babysitter for 17 kids who don't know you all that well so their parents can have a little getaway time?!   GAH!

[Word Nerd]

Oh man, OP this really resonates with me today.

 

JAWM rant: We just had our 5th baby (4 weeks ago) and are having a baby blessing for her in 2 weeks. My parents and my IL's are flying - cross country - to attend. We heard from them yesterday that they are flying out all of DH's siblings (5 of them), spouses (4 plus 1 new bf), and children (17). Typing that all out makes me want to crawl in a hole ... Which I feel terrible about. But, the real stressor is that they asked if the kids could sleep in blankets and pillows on the floor while the adults sleep at a nearby hotel. We have the room, but the thought of 17 children, who I love but haven't seen in 3 years, staying at my house is making me twitchy.

 

Honestly, I'm just kinda pissed. But, how do you say that without offending everyone?

 

Sorry for my rant. OP, I hope it works out and your weekend is stress free and enjoyable.

 

Wait. You have a newborn and they don't think it should be a problem for you to host 17 kids in your home? Are they insane?!? I think you should pull the new mom card and burst into tears. For real. 

[PrincessMommy]

Oh man, OP this really resonates with me today.

 

JAWM rant: We just had our 5th baby (4 weeks ago) and are having a baby blessing for her in 2 weeks. My parents and my IL's are flying - cross country - to attend. We heard from them yesterday that they are flying out all of DH's siblings (5 of them), spouses (4 plus 1 new bf), and children (17). Typing that all out makes me want to crawl in a hole ... Which I feel terrible about. But, the real stressor is that they asked if the kids could sleep in blankets and pillows on the floor while the adults sleep at a nearby hotel. We have the room, but the thought of 17 children, who I love but haven't seen in 3 years, staying at my house is making me twitchy.

 

Honestly, I'm just kinda pissed. But, how do you say that without offending everyone?

 

Sorry for my rant. OP, I hope it works out and your weekend is stress free and enjoyable.

 

OMGoodness!!  That is just too much.  I'd be pissed too.  They should realize that you are post-pardem and this is just unacceptable.    Seriously, a house full of kids with a new mom..It's going to be a giant wake-over.  Since they asked, please tell them no and that you cannot do it. 

[PrincessMommy]

I wonder if your niece hasn't done any (or much) hosting of her own.  If that's the case, she may not realize all the small details involved, nor even the big ones (as in, "whoa! dinner for 5 is now dinner for 9!  I'm going to need another 10# of potatoes!  I don't have a pot large enough for all that pasta!" etc.). 

 

[i see from your signature that you have six kids, OP.  So you probably do have a large enough pot.  But I think you'll understand what I'm trying to say.  :) ]

 

Yes, it's true, I hadn't thought about the food too.   

[Seasider]

Wait. You have a newborn and they don't think it should be a problem for you to host 17 kids in your home? Are they insane?!? I think you should pull the new mom card and burst into tears. For real.

Magnolia Rain, Say no! You don't always have the New Baby card working for you. Pull it out now, girl!

 

Why should you have to supervise their kids while they get a vacation? Not cool. If anything, they should be inviting your kids for a swim at the hotel pool while you rest up.

 

ETA My husband would be calling and telling them he would not allow that strain to be put on me.

[idnib]

So what was wrong with the original plan, the one in which your sister was going to go visit her daughter and the grandkids after visiting you? Was there a reason given why it won't work?

[Cinder]

JAWM rant: We just had our 5th baby (4 weeks ago) and are having a baby blessing for her in 2 weeks. My parents and my IL's are flying - cross country - to attend. We heard from them yesterday that they are flying out all of DH's siblings (5 of them), spouses (4 plus 1 new bf), and children (17). Typing that all out makes me want to crawl in a hole ... Which I feel terrible about. But, the real stressor is that they asked if the kids could sleep in blankets and pillows on the floor while the adults sleep at a nearby hotel. We have the room, but the thought of 17 children, who I love but haven't seen in 3 years, staying at my house is making me twitchy.

 

Honestly, I'm just kinda pissed. But, how do you say that without offending everyone?

 

That is just wrong! How on earth can they think it's ok to just leave all their kids with you? They're just being over-the-top rude and inconsiderate. How about you go to a hotel too? :sneaky2: