Public school is never an option-- is that true for anyone else?

[LibraryLover]

I absolutely understand why some would never consider public school an option.  My dc is attending school for the first time, ever, as an IB 9th grader. It is a highly diverse urban school, with free condoms in the nurse's office. My dc has teachers and who are openly gay (meaning married), atheist, religious; simply everyone and everything is represented here. A few people we know are absolutely horrified that our family made such a choice, so I understand where the OP is coming from. (Heck, even our orthodontist cautioned us.)

 

It's working, and I am thrilled with the diversity of people, thought, educational options etc. Funnily enough, I find myself missing hsing. My dc is excited about the program and people, and so far has no plans to hs again.  I'm a little sad about that, although excited that my dc is so engaged.

[dhudson]

We have homeschooled ours all the way through. We have been through hard times, times when I had back surgery and had to rest for 6 weeks, times when my dh travelled 2-3 weeks a month. We have had people seriously question us, especially with our gifted oldest was entering high school and we haven't wavered. Clearly, we are committed.

However, I would not say, "never" just based on a James 4. I don't know what will happen tomorrow so I want to be very careful about the words I say. I wonder whether there are many who are committed to homeschooling, but would not put the "never" into words just because we have seen too many of our previous "nevers" come to fruition.

I, myself, have eaten many a word I have previously spoken, so I am far more careful now. : )

[Sahamamama]

Why the sudden bandwagon of ganging up on Sheldon? Sheldon (OP) didn't say that she was trying to convince others to continue homeschooling their children, only that others (no longer homeschooling) were trying to convince her to be done. And what, if anything, should she think and do about it? Also, Sheldon didn't say that the no-longer-homeschooling moms were financially strapped, had faced loss of spouse, loss of income, a death in the family, divorce, serious illness, or any of the other (truly possible) "you never know" scenarios being portrayed throughout this thread. The original post:

 

Our family is 100% opposed to public school for our children.  Many of our local homeschooling friends have been putting their kids into public schools because mom is burned out/tired.  (which I get!)  They always try to convince [me] that I should do the same and are offended when I tell them that public school is not an option for us.  Ever.   If it became necessary, we have a local private school we would use.   Anyone else feel the same?  I kinda feel like the lone homeschool hold out here.

 

The key words here are "they always try to convince me." Sheldon's not going out of her way to make others feel uncomfortable with their choices. They come to her, put down her choice, then get offended when she has a conviction? Bleh.

 

IMO, it is not elitist or smug for Sheldon (or anyone) to know and state that, for her family, public school is not an option. Quite the contrary -- it's rather smug to tell her that she's wrong to have this conviction. :huh: The nerve, actually.

 

I've been away from these boards for six months, and after reading this thread, I remember my reasons.

 

 

[idnib]

I also do not understand the animosity in this thread. As far as I can tell Sheldon was looking for other people in the same situation. Why then respond with all the reasons you are not in that situation?

 

Who cares what the reasons are that a person will never use public school? Is it because they earned/won/inherited lots of money? Because their family runs an awesome private school where the kids could attend for free? Because the grandparents or aunts/uncles/friends would be willing to homeschool them? Because they have 7- or 8-figure insurance policies? Is there a monetary limit over which people would not harass them and finally agree with them?  One million dollars? Ten million? What about my billionaire friend who's homeschooling? Does he get to say he would never use public school? If the answer is "yes" then there must be some dollar limit over which people think a person is allowed to have that opinion. How much is it, then?

 

Just because people are asking to find others in the same boat doesn't mean they have to justify why they can afford to be in that situation. Otherwise we should declare open season on all the Disney threads.  :001_rolleyes:

 

 

[Cz mama]

A friend of mine homeschooled her son, and when he was about 9ish, they decided to send him to a local small country school out in a rural area. They figured that there were small class sizes, they generally knew the teachers, and it would probably be a decent experience. They were surprised when even at a country school in a rural area, her son was being exposed to sexual videos and pictures on his school buddies phone. My point is that  besides the academics, public school by its nature exposes children to a huge variety of things...many things being bad. My husband and I are both products of public schools and we have COUNTLESS memories of innocence lost through vile conversation and example. I remember being as young as in first grade when a boy classmate told me that when he got a girlfriend he was going to hump her. I was like ?????    Just something to think about... Innocence is a precious thing.

[unsinkable]

I've been away from these boards for six months, and after reading this thread, I remember my reasons.

I am glad you are back!

I was worried about you!

[Misha]

While I am not anti-public school it is not a viable option for us either, we've always homeschooled and will continue to do so.

 

 

 

[unsinkable]

Count me among those who don't think Sheldon is being smug. And the pile-on is ugly.

She's talking about her choices for her family.

And all the talk of..."you better hope you don't have to eat your words..." My response to that kind of talk:

She's human. I'm sure she has had her tragedies that derailed her plans and choices before. I'm sure she is not skipping through a charmed life, untouched by circumstances that caused her to reevaluate her choices. And if she has said "THIS! This is what I will cling to!" then more power to her.

[TracyP]

My family is also 100% opposed to public school. However, I do not have the luxury of saying never. (besides, I don't like 'never' because I've been burned) The closest private school is an hour away. I would have to go even further to get to a "good" private school. We have a back-up plan in case something devastating happens to me, but this back-up plan could possibly have holes. Also this back-up plan does not cover burn-out.  I just do the best I can every day, and I assume the same about others.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Catwoman]

Count me among those who don't think Sheldon is being smug. And the pile-on is ugly.

She's talking about her choices for her family.

And all the talk of..."you better hope you don't have to eat your words..." My response to that kind of talk:

She's human. I'm sure she has had her tragedies that derailed her plans and choices before. I'm sure she is not skipping through a charmed life, untouched by circumstances that caused her to reevaluate her choices. And if she has said "THIS! This is what I will cling to!" then more power to her.

:iagree:

Seriously people, smug? Ostentatious? Insensitive?

My impression was that Sheldon was speaking only for herself and about her own personal situation. I didn't see her comparing her own circumstances to anyone else's, nor did she appear to be critical of anyone whose goals or financial situations were different from hers.

I see several people being resentful, competitive and judgmental in this thread, but Sheldon isn't one of them.

Based on Sheldon's original post to this thread, I thought she was just venting a little and that she wanted to know if others felt as strongly about homeschooling as she does. She certainly didn't seem to be showing off or looking for a fight, so I have no idea how this thread turned into such a bash-fest.

[Catwoman]

I've been away from these boards for six months, and after reading this thread, I remember my reasons.

Welcome back! :)

[HS Mom in NC]

I think way too many people hear about the cost of some expensive private schools and then make assumptions that all are cost prohibitive for people making average incomes. (Which, in the US is what now? $50K or $60K?)

 

My brother's son attends a local, private Christian school.  Tution is $5, 200 per year for elementary aged kids.  Preschool and K are less. There are no academic requirements to get in or to stay. They test better than thier public school peers as a whole.  My nephew is academically slower than most of his peers, but cooperative and pleasant in class. Class sizes are 12 children maximum with a teacher and a teacher's aid in each room.  Parents are required to volunteer a certain number of hours per year.  It's minimal as my borther and his wife, (my nephew's step-mother) and his mother all work full time.  They work closely with him at home based on what the teacher recommends to keep my nephew up to speed with his peers.

 

My husband's sister's kids used to attend a local private, Christian school in the same area.  It was $5,000 per year per child. I don't know about academic testing for them.  Their classes ran about 10 kids in each room too.

[Sahamamama]

I am glad you are back!

I was worried about you!

 

Thanks, Unsinkable. I'm fine, we're all doing great here, I just needed a break from the Shark Fest (LOL). Well, actually, it was a very good thing to take a long break. I've had more time to focus on getting to bed when I should, staying on track with our school work, keeping our home running smoothly, and really mothering and teaching these three sets of legs. ;)

[jennynd]

I did not believe in public. So I can understand what Sheldon came from. Have I still lived where I was, there is NO WAY I will send my kid to PS. But I also moved to another state and was in private school and it turned out to be the most miserable experience and we gave public school a shot. Suddenly DS is happy and he learned a ton in ps. His gifted program offered courses that is at least 3/4 grade level ahead. We are very very happy with public school at this point.

What I am trying to say, there is a lot different reason we believe and we do not believe in public school. The most important thing is.. We all try to do the best for our children...

[Crimson Wife]

:iagree:

Seriously people, smug? Ostentatious? Insensitive?

My impression was that Sheldon was speaking only for herself and about her own personal situation. I didn't see her comparing her own circumstances to anyone else's, nor did she appear to be critical of anyone whose goals or financial situations were different from hers.

Oh really?

Having firm beliefs about the welfare of my children is smug?

Implying that people who are not able to HS or send their kids to private school do not care about the welfare of their children.

We can afford it because we have lived on next to nothing and put back every cent to be able to support our children in a way that we believe. We literally put our money where our mouth is.

Implying that those who have not been able to sock away funds for private school tuition in addition to a rainy day cushion are living above their means.

Also, I am very fortunate to have a high demand degree -- I get job offers weekly. If DH lost his job, I could have a job by end of the week. I totally realize that other people don't have such a skill set. I purposely pick such a degree and it has been very useful.

Implying that those who have experienced financial problems lack a marketable degree and skills.


The OP has been very fortunate to have weathered the lousy economy with a hefty savings account. Rather than thanking God for his/her good fortune, he/she is judging those who have been less fortunate. And that is going to tick off a LOT of people.

[jennynd]

I do want to know what degree Sheldon holds though.. I have worked for 15 year with friend from all different level school and disciplines. ( computer, mechanical, aero, RN, neurosurgeon, lawyer...)I have not have friend claim that they can have a job offer by the end of week when they are out of market this long.
So do tell, Sheldon....

[hjffkj]

Can't quote you crimson wife but all of the above quoted in your last post were after people attacked her ability to say never to it not being an option. She then said what her dh and she did in order to make that a reality for the welfare of their children. You are assuming she is implying anything about it but I see it as she's defending her decision because of the smug ppl who assume that her convictions aren't strong enough to say never.

[Jane Elliot]

Oh really?


Implying that people who are not able to HS or send their kids to private school do not care about the welfare of their children.


Implying that those who have not been able to sock away funds for private school tuition in addition to a rainy day cushion are living above their means.


Implying that those who have experienced financial problems lack a marketable degree and skills.


The OP has been very fortunate to have weathered the lousy economy with a hefty savings account. Rather than thanking God for his/her good fortune, he/she is judging those who have been less fortunate. And that is going to tick off a LOT of people.

 

Honestly, I don't see any of this alleged judging in any of her posts. I just don't see it. I see a person making choices for her own family and planning to put those choices into effect for her own family. There's nothing judgmental or unhealthy in that.  I don't think she was implying any of those things you are accusing her of implying.

[Jane Elliot]

Sheldon, I don't think you assumed that your careful financial management and excellent situation is the norm.  It sounds like you've definitely worked hard to save, plan, and even sacrifice to make it that way.

 

Said gently....But Crimson Wife is right in her overall assessment....based on this thread (and remember, we don't really know you IRL...all we have to go on is this forum)...you really do have an attitude that is unhealthy in your degree of expectations of how effective planning can be.  

 

Even the best laid plans may go astray.....I mean...this is stuff from Shakespeare, the Bible, the Jewish Torah, even secular literature cautions people against such kinds of thinking.

 

So, you only know what she's said in this thread (all of which has been interpreted differently by different board members) but you feel qualified to diagnose her attitude as unhealthy???

[idnib]

Oh really?


Implying that people who are not able to HS or send their kids to private school do not care about the welfare of their children.


Implying that those who have not been able to sock away funds for private school tuition in addition to a rainy day cushion are living above their means.


Implying that those who have experienced financial problems lack a marketable degree and skills.

 

Yes, really.

 

Your use of "implying" instead of "stating" or "saying" or "posting" or "insisting" is...indicative.

 

I'm either an idiot with minimal literacy skills or I'm in the wrong thread. Please help me out by quoting exactly where these things happened and spell them out for me, using the 3 points above. They are your own points, after all, so you should have some evidence upon which they rest. If multiquote is too much of  pain, post numbers will suffice.

 

I really don't see what you see. And it's not because I agree with Sheldon, either. We would probably not put our kids in public school, but like others here, I never say never. If I decided to put one kid in school, it would probably be public because I would still be home with the other and not working. If both went back to school, I would work and my salary would cover their tuition.

 

I know from your other posts you have wished for private school but because it is too expensive you are homeschooling. I hope that situation is not coloring your responses here....

[Catwoman]

Oh really?Implying that people who are not able to HS or send their kids to private school do not care about the welfare of their children.Implying that those who have not been able to sock away funds for private school tuition in addition to a rainy day cushion are living above their means.Implying that those who have experienced financial problems lack a marketable degree and skills.The OP has been very fortunate to have weathered the lousy economy with a hefty savings account. Rather than thanking God for his/her good fortune, he/she is judging those who have been less fortunate. And that is going to tick off a LOT of people.

I'm sorry, but I don't think Sheldon has been "implying" anything, but you've certainly been quick to jump to judgment about her.

Not a single one of your quotes demonstrates that she is doing anything other than discussing her own personal family situation. She hasn't judged you or anyone else, and quite frankly, I think she has been quite gracious considering the way she is being so harshly flamed in this thread. I have no idea why you are leaping to such assumptions about her.

You are reading words and intentions into her posts that I don't see at all, and I'm not sure why you are so determined to believe that she has such unpleasant thoughts and motivations. Why can't you just take her at her word instead of deciding that she is actually "implying" something entirely different?

Sheldon has been around for a while, and I've never known her to be a shrinking violet. If she actually believed any of the things of which you're accusing her, I'm pretty sure she would come right out and say so, rather than "implying" them.

[lea_lpz]

I just wonder why so many think private school is going to be superior to public. I have attended both. The academics at the private school I attended were without a doubt better than the public schools- hands down. But the character of the kids, what sort of trouble they got into, if they were drinking, doing drugs, sexually active, etc, was no different than that of the public school students, and this was at a Catholic school, so most parents assumed they were paying for an environment of kids being raised in Godly homes.

But then if the main concern is solely academics than I can see if homeschooling isn't an option the next best thing would be a private school following your educational philosophy.

I moved a lot and went to 5 different high schools and 4 junior highs. It was also my experience the schools I went to that were ranked as the best and in the most affluent neighborhoods had hands down the worst drug problems. A kid in my class died of a heroine over dose his sophomore year. I never saw anything like that in working / middle class neighborhood schools. Ever.

Just something to consider- can you really buy your way into the perfect school- either by paying for a private school or moving into the right neighborhood?

[SarahW]

I've only read some of the replies...but to give another perspective.

 

I read the OP when it was first posted, and it made me feel wildly uncomfortable. I've avoided posting, but now I think I should just throw myself out there.

 

I've been under the NEVER mentality....when I was homeschooled. My mother fell into the mindset that sending ones kids to school was a sin. At first it didn't matter why we were homeschooling, but then it did - when I reached middle school, when there were lots of extra little ones in the house, when my mother's emotional state became very fragile, when the tension and anger in the house escalated. It was bad. Very bad.  :crying:

 

Eventually, I ended up with a H.S. diploma. I didn't like H.S. very much, but that was mostly because it was built post-Columbine. Looking back, I wish I had taken advantage of more that was offered there, like Latin and some neat science classes. But I was such a fish out of water, and receiving no direction from anyone, that I just did what I thought was good. My lunch table ended up being a bunch of good Catholics, a conservative Jew, and a Muslim. I wouldn't say we were the most moral group in the school, but we knew how to have a lot of good, clean fun.

 

Idk, maybe the people who know the OP that are telling her that she should consider PS see a reason for it? Maybe I am just cynical because of my own experience, but, really, the scare-whispers and fear-mongering about PS that I see in the (broader) homeschool community even now is ridiculous. I'd hate to see someone short-change their kids education because of irrational fear.

 

That is all.

 

:leaving:

[Soror]

People that have the attitude that homeschool is the only option have soured me from the only hs attitude. Some families do a fabulous job and I can only hope to do so well. However, some sacrifice their children's education on the altar of homeschooling because either they don't value education, aren't able to give a good education or are ignorant about what makes a good education. Some moms sacrifice their health and well-being to homeschooling. Some moms sacrifice their family relationships or children's relationships as they put hs'ing above everything else. When I first started hs'ing I just assumed that I would hs all the way through, now I pray that God grants me the wisdom to discern the best choice for our family, even if it isn't what I want to do or think is the "best." 

 

I also don't understand the reasoning that private is better than public, at least where I live. There is too wide a range of both. Lastly, we are doing well financially but I know others have done everything "right" and still struggle so I'm personally hesitant to say that others could do the same if they had just made the "right" decisions.

[stripe]

One thing I have noticed, in many, many areas, and especially on the internet, is the fondness for questions like this to show one's fervent dedication to "the cause," be it religious, food, diaper-related, parenting style-related, or otherwise: an extreme question posed and we are supposed to align ourselves with either the hard-core "I would die before I ate packaged food"/"I never speak to non-believers"/"My child will never touch plastic!" camp or the more flexible camp, who are then pilloried for their non-adherence to the cause. Sometimes, or even most times, extreme, sweeping statements serve very little practical purpose.

 

Personally, I am a huge fan of public schools. I think they can be utterly amazing and transformative. 

[hjffkj]

People that have the attitude that homeschool is the only option have soured me from the only hs attitude. Some families do a fabulous job and I can only hope to do so well. However, some sacrifice their children's education on the altar of homeschooling because either they don't value education, aren't able to give a good education or are ignorant about what makes a good education. Some moms sacrifice their health and well-being to homeschooling. Some moms sacrifice their family relationships or children's relationships as they put hs'ing above everything else. When I first started hs'ing I just assumed that I would hs all the way through, now I pray that God grants me the wisdom to discern the best choice for our family, even if it isn't what I want to do or think is the "best." 

 

I also don't understand the reasoning that private is better than public, at least where I live. There is too wide a range of both. Lastly, we are doing well financially but I know others have done everything "right" and still struggle so I'm personally hesitant to say that others could do the same if they had just made the "right" decisions.

 

 

For me when I say private school is better than public school I am strictly talking about in my area.  And I also don't believe all private schools are.  Sadly most of the Catholic school, which is what I'd want to go with if I needed to, are essentially glorified public schools.  They use the same crappy textbooks as public school, the do grade by age rather than ability, and they have the same issues with students because they tend to deal with problems quietly or not at all so they don't lose the tuition from either student involved in a problem.

 

However, there is one Catholic school that is not associated with the diocese I live in that I would absolutely enroll them in if I needed to.  It even has a home school option where the kids are there one day a week I believe getting teacher instruction and the parent does the rest.  There are also some non Catholic private schools that are far superior to public school in my area.  So I think it all has to do with knowing your area and what your reasons are for not ever letting public school be an option

[Jane Elliot]

Sarah, I am sorry for your experience. There are many homeschoolers for whom the "NEVER mentality" has nothing at all to do with the mindset that sending kids to school is a sin or being willing to short-change their child's education because of fear. I hope you have a chance to meet some of them irl someday.

[wapiti]

FWIW, a never-PS philosophy can come across as a lack of perspective on the wide variation in quality across schools, public, private and homeschool.  IMO there is a big difference between choosing against PS under individual circumstances (e.g., I offer more academically than the local, specific PS or the PS is otherwise a bad fit for myriad reasons) and asserting that all PS everywhere are bad/evil/poisonous/not good enough and a worse choice than homeschooling under all circumstances.

 

What hasn't been fleshed-out in this thread are the reasons that a person might hold the latter position, i.e., care to discuss?  Not seeing reasons beyond individual, situation-specific reasons may be why it seems like an unreasonable position to some of us.

 

Eta, I'll start:  in our area, I perceive the local PS to be less-than-ideal socially even though the academics at the high school level are supposedly very good (this is not an economically-disadvantaged area).  Where less-than-ideal social concerns outweigh everything else is likely to balance out differently for different families, as less-than-ideal doesn't necessarily mean not-good-enough-under-any-circumstances.  Academically, we live in a district that has formally rejected Common Core.

 

[ZeeMommy]

I think even if you are philosophically opposed to public education, it is a little extreme to put it the way you put it.  What if you contract a debilitating disease?  And then your husband is laid-off or dies suddenly?  What if, what if, what if?  It's ok to say you are philosophically opposed to home school, but life does occasionally throw a curve ball we are not prepared for! 

 

 

 

This sort of situation happened to my cousin, who had cancer.  He and his wife have homeschooled all their children, but while he was in treatment (and driving to Mayo Clinic to get care) then put their children in public school for a time.  Fortunately their local public school was good, academically and socially.  But they did go back to homeschooling once his cancer was in remission.  Then there's my friend's son who has Asperger's, who has been thriving more academically and socially in the local public school than in homeschooling.  She's chosen to homeschool their oldest son.

 

I am not impressed with the local public school I would have to send my children too.  There are other private options, but I'm not sure how expensive or good they are.  My parents sent me to private Christian schools for 3-12.  Academically it was good, but I'm sure it was expensive.  I'd keep homeschooling my children as much as possible.  There's the option of K-12 online education, either through the state here or through other companies.  Personally, there's a lot of factors and things that could happen that keep me from saying that I would never send my children to public school.  Here for me, my choice would be different for other people, because of availability of educational resources, income, health, etc.  I am responsible for my children's lives right now, and I have to make the best choice for them, what will get them to the point of becoming a thriving adult. 

 

Oddly enough, in the 3rd/4th grade class I teach at church, there are public school kids and homeschool kids.  And the kids that are bright and thoughtful and all the other wonderful things we like to see in kids are the ones whose parents are involved in their lives in a very positive way, despite the schooling choices.  There's crappy education everywhere, and there's good education too.  I think it depends a lot on the people involved, their dedication and viewpoints that drive them to do what they do.   
 

[Jane Elliot]

FWIW, a never-PS philosophy can come across as a lack of perspective on the wide variation in quality across schools, public, private and homeschool.  IMO there is a big difference between choosing against PS under individual circumstances (e.g., I offer more academically than the local, specific PS or the PS is otherwise a bad fit for myriad reasons) and asserting that all PS everywhere are bad/evil/poisonous/not good enough and a worse choice than homeschooling under all circumstances.

 

What hasn't been fleshed-out in this thread are the reasons that a person might hold the latter position, i.e., care to discuss?  

 

No, I don't. I didn't see this as the purpose of this thread. It didn't seem at all to be the question the op was asking. Maybe you should start a new thread asking if there are people out there who believe that all ps everywhere are bad/evil....

 

While I believe the ps is a perfectly valid and often more desirable (not evil, not bad, not poisonous) option depending on individual circumstances, for me and my own individual circumstances, I've been at this long enough to know my own family dynamics, options, resources, outcomes (having graduated six already), etc. etc etc... to safely say that I will never send my kids to ps. And that answers the op's original question.

[CatholicMom]

Not an option for us either, barring some very exceptional circumstances like a major illness that makes it impossible for me to homeschool (God forbid) and we absolutely cannot put them in private Catholic school for some reason (unlikely). Even though private school would be very difficult to afford, we would absolutely make it happen if it at all possible, down to taking a loan out from the bank or borrowing from friends to do it. That's how "last resort" public school is for us. You're not alone.

[Arcadia]

Just something to consider- can you really buy your way into the perfect school- either by paying for a private school or moving into the right neighborhood?

Drug problems stretch across socio-economic strata; from street drugs to expensive designer drugs. Teenage pregnancy too even in religious schools.
I dont go for perfect since I think it is hard for any school to be perfect. Even tutors that I have hired in the past aren't perfect but the best match we can find. However when house hunting, hubby and I are willing to pay more in mortgage to stay where parents are more involved regardless of where their kids school (homeschool /private /public). If we see graffiti everywhere, we won't want to stay in that area.

[shawthorne44]

We will shortly be moving to a new town where the public school was so miserable the state took over a few years ago.  It does make for a larger homeschooling percentage than otherwise, which is good for us.  But, it makes the public school even less of an option.  

[SeaConquest]

I just wonder why so many think private school is going to be superior to public. I have attended both. The academics at the private school I attended were without a doubt better than the public schools- hands down. But the character of the kids, what sort of trouble they got into, if they were drinking, doing drugs, sexually active, etc, was no different than that of the public school students, and this was at a Catholic school, so most parents assumed they were paying for an environment of kids being raised in Godly homes.

But then if the main concern is solely academics than I can see if homeschooling isn't an option the next best thing would be a private school following your educational philosophy.

I moved a lot and went to 5 different high schools and 4 junior highs. It was also my experience the schools I went to that were ranked as the best and in the most affluent neighborhoods had hands down the worst drug problems. A kid in my class died of a heroine over dose his sophomore year. I never saw anything like that in working / middle class neighborhood schools. Ever.

Just something to consider- can you really buy your way into the perfect school- either by paying for a private school or moving into the right neighborhood?

I don't assume that by homeschooling I'm somehow shielding my children from having to make choices about having sex or using drugs. These are choices every person has to make at some point, and the values I hope to pass along to my children will be discussed irrespective of where they receive their education. For us, the decision to homeschool is principally an academic one and is therefore maleable.

[mommymilkies]

I just wonder why so many think private school is going to be superior to public. I have attended both. The academics at the private school I attended were without a doubt better than the public schools- hands down. But the character of the kids, what sort of trouble they got into, if they were drinking, doing drugs, sexually active, etc, was no different than that of the public school students, and this was at a Catholic school, so most parents assumed they were paying for an environment of kids being raised in Godly homes.
 

It depends on the area and the school, obviously.  Here the public school system has had many of the extracurriculars (band, even) cut from funding.  They also had to lay off a substantial portion of their special ed teachers.  Not to mention their complete unwillingness to make arrangements for kids with allergies.  The private Catholic school, however, is nut free, has great services for kids, extracurriculars, and smaller class sizes (with less testing, too!) and all for ~$1600/kid/year. So that would be my choice if I had to send my kids to school.  Absolutely, at this point I would not send my kids to public school unless there was literally no other choice.  The private school is an option, though, in large part due to my nut allergic kid. 

[shinyhappypeople]

No, I don't. I didn't see this as the purpose of this thread. It didn't seem at all to be the question the op was asking. Maybe you should start a new thread asking if there are people out there who believe that all ps everywhere are bad/evil....

 

While I believe the ps is a perfectly valid and often more desirable (not evil, not bad, not poisonous) option depending on individual circumstances, for me and my own individual circumstances, I've been at this long enough to know my own family dynamics, options, resources, outcomes (having graduated six already), etc. etc etc... to safely say that I will never send my kids to ps. And that answers the op's original question.

 

This!

 

When I say "never" to the traditional public school model, it's a decision that my DH and I have made based on our family situation, our location, and our educational philosophy.   Our decision to reject PS isn't an indictment of another family's decision to embrace it.  I have enough on my plate raising my own children.  I don't feel any need to raise other people's children, too.

[Incognito]

Our family is 100% opposed to public school for our children.  Many of our local homeschooling friends have been putting their kids into public schools because mom is burned out/tired.  (which I get!)  They always try to convince that I should do the same and are offended when I tell them that public school is not an option for us.  Ever.   If it became necessary, we have a local private school we would use.   Anyone else feel the same?  I kinda feel like the lone homeschool hold out here.

 

FWIW, I have been in conversations like this as the other side of the coin - I think your opinion gives offence because of the way it is delivered, not because of what you actually feel/think about the topic (well, it could be that too, but probably not).

 

I have a friend who will NEVER put her kids in public school.  The first time we talked about why we were homeschooling, I had to graciously overlook the way she presented that information.  Telling someone you will NEVER do what they might do someday (or are doing) because you think that choice is so absolutely basically horrible (or religiously irresponsible or whatever) is going to be offensive.  It doesn't have to be a big deal - we all have our reasons for many things we do, and not everyone needs to know the heart and soul of WHY I choose what I do.  

 

It sounds like the OP gave too much information about a heart-based topic at a stage where the conversation or relationship wasn't ready for that information.  

[abba12]

DH and I were both homeschooled, though I was in and out of schools, and as well as homeschooling for about 6 of my 'school years' I attended no less than 7 schools, two of which were private. 

 

School will never be an option for us. Now, I will clarify that by saying special programs, such as a performing arts high school, or a special school for a severely disabled child would be potential options, but I don't really consider either of them to be 'school', the environments and purposes are entirely different. They're 'programs' to me, quite different from the local school down the road, and my choice to use them would have nothing to do with my ability to continue homeschooling.

 

Saying I will never consider school an option doesn't mean I think school is evil. I know some homeschooled kids who should be in school, I know some schooled kids who are lucky to be at school, public school is not evil. But for my family, with our abilities, beliefs, and life goals, school does not in any way fit into that. But our goals for our family and children are different to many families and we recognize that. The common argument is that if I get sick or die they'll have to go to school. Well, no, in my personal case, we believe having the children at home with the family and those bonds would be even MORE important if I were badly ill, and since my husband is also a graduated homeschooler who is absolutely dedicated to homeschooling, and we have homeschooling immediate family members, I have no doubt that if I died the kids would still be at home. I am another person who, like some PPs, buy curriculum and books ahead of time when I can, during good times, so that they are available if the worst happens, or even if life throws a curveball that stops me from being able to dedicate time to planning for awhile. (I also believe in making a curriculum work for you, rather than jumping from one thing to another, so I am not too worried about buying future levels of something which matches our family well only to discover they 'dont work' later. Maybe I will have an exceptional child who needs something different, but when we were kids we had nowhere even close to the choice in curriculum available now and we somehow managed to learn, so finding that perfect program isn't something my family, in our personal situation with two parents who are confident with homeschooling and have experience with the process, and who are not afraid to modify a program need to worry about. But not all families have that luxury.)

 

When we were kids homeschooling was still illegal in our country for the most part. So, naturally, most families who homeschooled were very, very dedicated and there was none of this 'reassessing each year' stuff happening. My family was unique in switching so much, and we had our own reasons for that. The culture now of homeschooling being a temporary thing, and reassessing constantly, not being able to say with certainty that homeschooling is better for your kids right now without being judged or 'warned', and choosing, even planning, to put the kids in school for anything but the final years of high school is pretty foreign to me and to most other graduated homeschoolers I know. (because of the issues of homeschooling not being recognized back then it was common to put kids in school for grade 11 and 12 to get their official paperwork and tests etc to allow for a normal progression into university). I get the impression from many people that it is wrong for me to be confident in homeschooling and it's benefits. Quite different to the dedicated families who needed to be passionate to stick it out long enough to allow you people to homeschool freely and legally today. 'We'll try it for a year and reassess in summer' wouldn't have washed back then, too much risk needed to be taken in the first place. I remember the days of not being allowed outside until 3pm because of neighbors, and drills on what to say if child services ever showed up. So I guess my perspective is skewed, but I am still surrounded by many passionate people and old school homeschoolers who agree that a bad period of homeschooling under stress/drama is still, in many ways, superior to the school environment.

 

So just like I feel I can say I will never cheat on my husband, I will never move to a country which oppresses women and I will never buy soy milk, I can say I will never consider traditional school an option. It simply does not fit with my family, our beliefs and goals and priorities and lifestyle. I'm sorry if that offends. That doesn't mean I think others are neglectful, they have different priorities, goals, lifestyles, etc. Someone who prioritizes employment and earning will look different to someone who prioritizes relationships and time (not to say you can't have both, but sometimes there will be choices to make, and some families will make one choice while other families make a different one). As for life forcing you to put the kids in school because you 'have' to get a job or because you 'have' to do something, well, that all depends on your definitions. I'm yet to meet a homeless homeschooling family. But I have met plenty who go through periods of not spending anything, and mum/kids doing what they can to help make ends meet (selling stuff, cutting back, etc). Some people consider that unacceptable and would decide they 'have' to work, others consider it an acceptable sacrifice to continue the lifestyle of homeschooling, and for those families it isn't about forms of education, it really is a lifestyle choice and a family choice quite detached from the education argument. For me, there is a LOT more to consider than just education (and don't think I am light on academics, my husband and I both were/are 'gifted', and I think we have some pretty high academic expectations too)

 

----------------------

 

As a side note, on the public vs private thing, if I absolutely had to send my kids to a school, I would choose public, NOT private, after my experiences as a child and my knowledge of the schools IN THIS AREA. That may not be true everywhere, but here, it is, I believe, the better choice. So money doesn't factor into it.

[lea_lpz]

Well, I would never say never.

I am having my 3rd biological child and have a stepson who could potentially be living with us at some point so paying for 4 children to attend private school in our area would be extremely expensive, even with me working full time with a masters degree. My dh and I considered local private schools when dd was attending a Christian preschool and when we looked into the cost of k-8 and high schools, it was clear that this choice would lead to 2 things to work- one, as soon as my youngest child was in school I would have to start working full time for us to afford for them to go to school, and two, we'd have to stop having children, because paying for more than 2 children to go to private schools and a good after school program would be more than we could afford realistically.

Before homeschooling I had planned to work part time when my youngest was school age and we weren't quite sure if we were done having kids.

Ultimately neither public or private were a good fit for dd and so we decided to give homeschool a try and have been very happy with the results. As long as its financially feasible, we plan to continue. My kids are young though so it would a bit soon for me to say without a doubt we will homeschool through high school. Although it is my opinion that jr / sr high are actually the years I would personally most want to homeschool so we could guide their hearts and influence them with our family values, although I don't believe this will shelter them from everything or create perfect teenagers or help us avoid the whole teenage rebellion / angst thing. From my experience in school during jr / sr high school, the thing was private or public, working class, middle class or affluent schools, if you wanted to find trouble you could and even if you were a good kid and tried to avoid negative influences, you'd be exposed to them.

For our family I don't have the confidence that I could prepare for in any given situation we would either continue to homeschool or could afford private schools. We don't have a huge savings, we struggle to make it on one income, and I don't have family members who would be able to homeschool my kids. If my dh and I both died odds are no one in our family would homeschool them if they had custody. They would probably feel that putting them in school was a much better thing for them. They might put them in a good private school though and my family does have a culture of emphasizing higher education so I do think they we mould be prepared for and go to college. If I for some reason had to work full time or was too ill to homeschool or it just plain wasn't working anymore, then I guess most likely public school is probably the most likely solution.

That said we are willingly making conscious sacrifices right now to homeschool that other families would maybe not consider if they were not pretty dedicated to it. We live a very tight budget and so by choosing to homeschool we are essentially choosing to live a very modest life style. We have what most people might think is too small of a house for our family, we are very much buy used save the difference, and we don't get to do what I notice a lot if families think is a given- vacations, shopping when your bored, etc. I hear a lot of families say they couldn't afford to have one parent stay home, but then they have a home twice as big as ours, new cars, go on expensive vacations, etc. All of which is fine, but to me shows where my priorities lie vs were most families do. So, even we are really in rough patches of unemployment and underemployment, we've managed to be able to continue to homeschool and have me stay home without me putting the kids in ps immediately and looking for a job ever even coming up. We've weathered the storms. To me that says we are probably in this for the long haul. We just prioritize time together as a family and being together I think more than material goods. When I feel guilty that I can't provide our kids with a lot of extras I try to remember they have me. My upbringing was more privileged then dh's, although I wouldn't say we were rich, but I was alone a lot! I went to private school, we always went on vacations, had new cars, I had a ton of clothes, toys and was generally given what I asked for, but I spent very little time with my parents. My dh's dad worked very hard to support his family as truck driver and worked a lot of long hours / over time, but rarely was home. DH has decided that we will priortize him being an actively involved dad, even as the breadwinner, and so he typically only works 40 hours a week, and he doesn't commute more than a half hour and tries to take positions that are 8-5, weekends off, even if that means less money. Don't gets wrong; with no other options he has worked 10-12 hour days, or weekends, or 10-7 shifts, but over all we value him being present as a dad over the extra $ if its a viable choice.

Right now I could argue homeschool-with not even private school being on the table, is our only option. My dd has a medical issue that's unresolved at this point and neither dh are willing to put a struggling learner in school who would need to be either very drowsy from medications or would be constantly wet because of renal cysts (or sent to school in a diaper), and would miss school pretty frequently in order to be seeing a specialist. If she's diagnosed with a chronic kidney diases that will eventually lead to renal failure, then we have decided we will do everything we possibly can to keep her home. We don't want any extra burdens on her, we can't see how she'd keep up academically with the amount of school she'd miss and having medical reasons for not being able to stay alert all day and a compromised immune system. And we'd just want us to have her home and spend as much to together as a family as possible. In this situation, I don't think we'd ever look back and think, "gee, I wish I would have had her in school full time instead all day."

Ideally, I would like to work part time when I graduate. I am in a masters program for educational and personal counseling. I am hoping I can find something flexible enough for me so that I can continue to homeschool. At this point, the only way I can see us being able to have any sort of savings to sock away for a rainy day / insure we have $ for private school, is for me to bring in some ince by working part time, which on the other hand actually makes homeschooling more challenging, lol, but I have been doing it going to school part time from the beginning. DH as very supportive of me being in school and jumps in at home when he's home to make it as feasible as possible for me to go to school. Right now we meet our needs but just don't have anything left over, so part time work would be optimal, but not if it meant I couldn't homeschool.

[Kathryn]

Ideally, I'd love to say yes, it would never be an option. Realistically, I know that parental death or expensive illness or major disability would mean public school most likely. There are only two private schools in our area I would consider and they are both way outside of what we could pay. We don't have the luxury of saving for private school tuition for three children in the event of homeschooling becoming unfeasible.

[FloridaLisa]

Yes, pretty much. I cannot say never because in trying to follow the Lord, I cannot presume, But my heart says, "As for me, no thank you."  

 

Lisa

[CourtneyBrooke]

Never. Never ever ever. Obviously the Lord can change situations, but I cannot imagine a scenario where He would want our children to be in the cesspool of public education. Our family has discussed every possible option. Our guardians (in the case of our death) will homeschool. If either myself or my husband dies, the other will continue homeschooling with the help of family. Money would not be a reason to send my children to public school. There simply is no earthly reason that my children would ever enter those doors, barring the government literally snatching them from my hands and taking them there... God forbid.

 

I knew this from the time I was a child, and I made sure that every man I dated had the same viewpoint. I didn't want to fall in love with a man who didn't share my viewpoints on this subject.

[CyndiLJ]

I find the philosophical perspectives here fascinating...how many are offended by what one person says when the question is "Is public school never an option for YOU?"   Personally, I don't consider it arrogant or elitist to anyone to say that, nor do I really have any vested interest in what any particular family does or doesn't do with the education of their children.  Sometimes it saddens me to read how many people feel the need to "correct" someone's closely held beliefs or judge them, particularly when they don't effect them in any way.

 

For us, by default and not over any rigidly held belief, public school is the last possible option and probably not one at all.  We were in public school for 5 years, and I have my own concerns about it but our situation is so unique I can not blame the school, and the teachers we had were very concerned, caring individuals who were doing a good job within the system that often didn't work well for student or educator.

 

Our children are years behind, and we have many special needs.  For one son, in particular, we have been told by no less than 4 different public educators that we need to recognize that he can never fit in a traditional classroom setting and learn well...and he has made amazing progress at home.

 

Would we put them in public school? Well, clearly, if we had no other options that would be what we would do.  However, we have made the commitment in our minds and hearts to see this through, as we know it is best for our kids and our situation, and we would do just about anything possible to continue to homeschool through graduation, because any other alternative will not work well for most of our kids.  Honestly, our concern about this would lead us to sell our home to be able to do it, as they are that important to us and we already know what didn't work.  Our kids are older now, and more self-directed,and even if something happened to me, we have talked about ways to work around teaching some subjects at night and using particular curriculum that would allow them to keep moving forward at home, or with a little adult guidance that my life insurance would pay for.  It is important to us, mainly because we can't see them reaching their full potential in public school.

 

Other families have different situations, different values, different financial circumstances...and even different access to great private schools or alternatives.  I don't feel there is anything wrong at all with saying this is a black and white issue for some families, and more gray for others.  I'll bet that in every family for which the answer to this question is a gray area, there are other questions whose answers would be more black and white. 

 

I think we could be kinder to one another on this forum when asking questions like these, it saddens me that we ask such open ended questions, and then argue about the responses as if there is a right or wrong that is absolute.  

[Crimson Wife]

If the OP had simply framed his/her original post as a gripe about people pushing PS on him/her, there would've been a ton of sympathy for him/her. But no, he/she had to get all smug and "holier than thou" about being in a fortunate financial position that he/she attributed 100% to his/her moral superiority rather than a combination of good decisions and pure luck. THAT is what got people upset.

[Shellydon]

If the OP had simply framed his/her original post as a gripe about people pushing PS on him/her, there would've been a ton of sympathy for him/her. But no, he/she had to get all smug and "holier than thou" about being in a fortunate financial position that he/she attributed 100% to his/her moral superiority rather than a combination of good decisions and pure luck. THAT is what got people upset.

 

You were the only one with that point of view.

[PentecostalMom]

I don't consider ps an option for us either, but I am not willing to say never.  I will say I will do everything that I can to prevent it, but sometimes circumstances are simply out of our control.

[Luanne]

I don't think the OP is saying public school shouldn't ever be an option for other families... just not her family.

 

The public schools around here are not good.  Students here spend little time learning and lots of time hanging out with bad influences. 

 

Yes, I was definitely at the point by the time my daughter finished 5th grade to say "public school here was NOT an option."

[Luanne]

I guess I don't understand the jumping on the OP because she feels that is the way it is in her family.  At no point did she say she had a problem with you sending your children to public school.  

[stripe]

You were the only one with that point of view.

I beg to differ.

 

 

I guess I don't understand the jumping on the OP because she feels that is the way it is in her family.  At no point did she say she had a problem with you sending your children to public school.  

I don't understand what the point of the thread is, then. "Eating meat is never an option -- is that true for anyone else?" does not seem like a neutral opener to discuss dietary preferences.

[shinyhappypeople]

I beg to differ.

 

 

 

I don't understand what the point of the thread is, then. "Eating meat is never an option -- is that true for anyone else?" does not seem like a neutral opener to discuss dietary preferences.

Maybe to find out if one's beliefs are really all that unusual?  Maybe to find like-minded people?  

 

I didn't find her posts offensive at all.  I think people area assuming that because she feels confident in her choices and the safety net she and her DH have created, that means she's looking down on others who are in different situations.