Poll: Would you/do you take your kids out of school (yes, I know...) for vacation?

[Haiku]

Bill, you are ascribing to people an attitude of, "I'm harming the school and I don't care!" when, in reality, people's attitude is, "I'm not harming the school, so it's not a big deal." Can you honestly not see the difference? You needn't agree that it's not harmful, but you can't tell people they are deliberately, intentionally causing harm when the schools' attendance policies are in their side.

 

Well, I mean you can, but then you just look combative.

 

Tara

[SKL]

(1) If people made responsible decisions schools would not need approved absence policies. As John Madison famously said in Fed. 51, "if men were angles we would not need governments."

 

(2) The problem—and the sentiment has been expressed though out the thread—is that many people do not give a d@mn how their actions negatively effect a school. The "screw the school" comment was a direct quote. There were many other expressions of "my family first." This is pure selfishness.

 

(3) The idea that a child can miss a week of school without having a negative effect defies common sense. Are there exceptional cases where family crisis, illness, or genuine learning opportunities make absences necessary and understandable? Sure.

 

But that was not the case in the OP (details which have since been erased). It was IMS a family who just wanted to go to the beach for a week because it was convenient. I'm sorry, but I don't think that sort of vacation during the school term is a valid reason to miss a week of school.

 

Bill

 

Since I don't know how to "multi-quote" (maybe they taught that on the day I skipped):

 

1) Attendance policies are for people who have to be forced to go to school at all. Not people who want to supplement a good education with an extracurricular activity.

 

2) You are picking out two quotes (one of which was clear hyperbole) out of over 300 posts, and attributing these statements to everyone who thinks you're being too dramatic. Most of us have not indicated we take this type of decision lightly. We just think it's a decision parents should make on a case by case basis.

 

3) Define common sense. There are plenty of kids who have learned more outside a traditional classroom setting than in one. I know nobody who believes like you do. Nobody. How can it be "common sense" if you're the only person arguing it?

 

4) As others have noted, it's not up to you to decide what's important for everyone else in the world. Further, your credibility/rationality/objectivity on this matter has been called into serious question. I guess if it makes you feel good to put others down, you are free to do so, but then it's kind of funny for you to suggest your behavior is more compassionate than everyone else's.

[Spy Car]

Bill, you are ascribing to people an attitude of, "I'm harming the school and I don't care!" when, in reality, people's attitude is, "I'm not harming the school, so it's not a big deal." Can you honestly not see the difference? You needn't agree that it's not harmful, but you can't tell people they are deliberately, intentionally causing harm when the schools' attendance policies are in their side.

 

Well, I mean you can, but then you just look combative.

 

Tara

 

The OPs original scenario involved a family that decided to yank their children out of school to go to the beach for a week. I don't see how missing a week of school doesn't cause harm.

 

Are there scenarios where there are legitimate educational experiences, or family matters, or illnesses that necessitate absences? Sure. Are their ways to mitigate the harm? Yes. Does it place an extra work burden on teachers? You bet. Do teachers extend themselves when their are legitimate grounds for absence. One hopes so.

 

But let's not pretend that students missing school doesn't cause problems for other people.

 

Bill

[elegantlion]

Wonderful sentiment!

 

Nurturing compassion entails caring about others, not behaving in ways that causes others harm, and not acting in ways that are willfully selfish.

 

Too few have learned these lessons, methinks.

 

Bill

 

Methinks we have differing opinions, but it is wonderful sentiment I agree.

 

Bill, you are ascribing to people an attitude of, "I'm harming the school and I don't care!" when, in reality, people's attitude is, "I'm not harming the school, so it's not a big deal." Can you honestly not see the difference? You needn't agree that it's not harmful, but you can't tell people they are deliberately, intentionally causing harm when the schools' attendance policies are in their side.

 

Well, I mean you can, but then you just look combative.

 

Tara

 

He's certainly not looking compassionate or caring about others. We've just been told to suck it up and not take vacations if they don't fall within a prescribed time period.

 

Thankfully, as far as I know, they haven't made L.A. the center of the universe, or the world even.

[SKL]

The OPs original scenario involved a family that decided to yank their children out of school to go to the beach for a week. I don't see how missing a week of school doesn't cause harm.

 

Are there scenarios where there are legitimate educational experiences, or family matters, or illnesses that necessitate absences? Sure. Are their ways to mitigate the harm? Yes. Does it place an extra work burden on teachers? You bet. Do teachers extend themselves when their are legitimate grounds for absence. One hopes so.

 

But let's not pretend that students missing school doesn't cause problems for other people.

 

Bill

 

OK, this is what I think. If you haven't had your kid in a full-time educational setting all summer (as I have), then you are causing harm to your kid's teacher and class. He's missed a whole summer that could have been spent moving ahead in the curriculum. Now his teacher will have to spend a ridiculous amount of time getting him up to speed. Wasting the time of the entire class. And for what? Some nonsense you like to call summer vacation. Disgusting. How selfish of you. You should be fined! Arrested! You call that compassion? You've single-handedly cost the schools thousands of dollars that they could have spent on . . . what . . . another attendance officer! Really. Shocking attitude I'm seeing exhibited here. I don't see how you can sleep at night.

[*Michelle*]

But let's not pretend that students missing school doesn't cause problems for other people.

 

:001_huh:

[LucyStoner]

I think chronically absent students cause a burden for teachers because they are behind (and frequently come to school unprepared to learn or dealing with seriously negative home lives.) I fail to see how it is a burden for a child who is on track or ahead to be gone a few days a limited number of times when mom and dad will more than catch him up. The only teachers I have heard say this IRL are the ones who are somewhat to seriously unorganized and can't just say what the upcoming work is because they are basically winging it or running behind. Most of the teachers I know can pull a few papers and list the text book chapters for the coming week easily. Again, when I pulled a 3rd grader for a week for a trip (he was living with us when his mom was in rehab), his teacher was excited the boy got to go on a trip and handed me the work in a few minutes. I was appreciative and I always took him extra supplies and snacks since it was a low income class and most others could not send in the needed supplies. The student we were caring for had a great trip, got his work done and started reading for fun for the first time ever about that time. In the 6 months he lived with us, he went from being below grade level to above. Part of that was his great teacher. Part of that was having my husband and me helping him and modeling habits like reading and learning for fun. I don't undervalue teachers or their time or effort at all. But I do think respect is a two way street.

Edited August 20, 2012 by kijipt

[Word Nerd]

Bill, you are ascribing to people an attitude of, "I'm harming the school and I don't care!" when, in reality, people's attitude is, "I'm not harming the school, so it's not a big deal." Can you honestly not see the difference? You needn't agree that it's not harmful, but you can't tell people they are deliberately, intentionally causing harm when the schools' attendance policies are in their side.

 

Well, I mean you can, but then you just look combative.

 

Tara

 

:iagree: Presuming to know other people's motives and ascribing a negative intent to their actions—even when they expressly say otherwise—is combative.

[Haiku]

 

But let's not pretend that students missing school doesn't cause problems for other people.

 

 

Oh, I'm not pretending it doesn't. I know it doesn't. If students taking excused absences for vacations were really as catastrophic as you claim, the schools wouldn't allow it. Yet, somehow, my daughter's school makes provision for it, as do many other schools. So I am going to side with the school (shocking!!) on this one and say, "Nope, not harmful." You are presenting your opinion as fact backed up with nothing but your opinion, whereas others are presenting their opinion backed up by the FACT that the school agrees with them.

 

And now I know that you either don't or won't (and I am leaning toward won't) see the difference in what I asked you previously, so I know there's no use in discussing it further.

 

Tara

[SKL]

Bill, you are ascribing to people an attitude of, "I'm harming the school and I don't care!" when, in reality, people's attitude is, "I'm not harming the school, so it's not a big deal."

 

Or the way I would put it: "I'm not harming others, so why do YOU care?"

[Spy Car]

Oh, I'm not pretending it doesn't. I know it doesn't. If students taking excused absences for vacations were really as catastrophic as you claim, the schools wouldn't allow it.

 

No. Your school—seeming unlike yourself—knows absences cause harm and therefore have a policy of making students who miss classes spending double the time missed in study-hall detention.

 

Most schools will not allow vacations "just because." All that I know of excuse absences for illness, deaths in family, and other extreme circumstances. Many (most?) have provisions for genuine educational opportunity. All for these things.

 

But I can't imagine a school approving of a week off durning the term so a kid could spend a day n the beach or go to Disney-world (assuming neither they or a close relative were dying from cancer or or other life-threatening illness).

 

Yet, somehow, my daughter's school makes provision for it, as do many other schools.

 

It isn't really a provision. You said no one teaches the students the missed lessons. Their consequence is to get detention at school. Slim provisions, methinks.

 

Bill

Edited August 20, 2012 by Spy Car

[Haiku]

Slim provisions, methinks.

 

Only because you don't know my dd's school or its mission or its target population. An excused absence is an excused absence. They get "detention" for being sick, too, as well as for missing school for the mandatory job shadows and internships and college classes they take. But as you refuse to see nuance on the issue, I'm sure any explanation I could give you would fall on deaf ears. When you agree to attend this school (which is by application only), you don't agree to never miss school. you agree to follow their policies if you do.

 

Tara

[Scrub Jay]

 

But let's not pretend that students missing school doesn't cause problems for other people.

 

Bill

 

Nobody is pretending, they are just not agreeing with you.

[creekland]

 

The idea that a child can miss a week of school without having a negative effect defies common sense.

 

Not really. It's a fact that a child missing a week to travel and making up the work does not negatively affect the school nor the class nor the student. It's actually common sense that it doesn't.

 

It was IMS a family who just wanted to go to the beach for a week because it was convenient. I'm sorry, but I don't think that sort of vacation during the school term is a valid reason to miss a week of school.

 

Bill

 

And your OPINION is fine - you're allowed to have your opinion, but it certainly isn't shared by all and certainly isn't "fact" no matter how many times you state it. There are plenty of real life scenarios and experiences that disprove your so-called "fact."

 

But let's not pretend that students missing school doesn't cause problems for other people.

 

Bill

 

We're not pretending. It simply isn't true. That's a fact. You're pretending it IS a problem.

 

 

But I can't imagine a school approving of a week off durning the term so a kid could spend a day n the beach or go to Disney-world (assuming neither they or a close relative were dying from cancer or or other life-threatening illness).

 

Shrug. Ours does as do all the school districts around us. We've taken advantage of it each year - sometimes a day or two - once a month - another few times 2 - 3 weeks. And none of these require the time be made up either. It's just the work the students need to complete on their own.

 

Anyone is allowed the opinion that it's not the right thing to do. Others of us are allowed the opinions to "Go For It" and enjoy the memories.

 

But it's a FACT that it does not cause harm to classmates, teachers, or the student (as long as they kept up with their work). The only reason presented that MIGHT cause harm to a few districts is the financial one and that doesn't apply to the majority of districts. To me, that's certainly not a good enough reason. It might be to others. To each our own with our opinions on that.

[WagsWife]

I did it. When our oldest was in kindergarten, my Dh deployed before the end of the school year...he did not get back until a couple of months into first grade. We always try to take some kind of trip when he comes home from a deployment. That time we decided on a week at Disneyland. DD's teacher gave me so much carp for taking her out of school. She told me that was a trip we should have taken during the Summer. UHHH, that would be great if he would have BEEN here during the summer. When we asked about getting her work for the week, the teacher told me that it would all need to be turned in the first day back to school. There was no way that I was going to make DD do school at Disneyland, so I told her that we would turn in what DD could get done on the weekend, but that was it. I did not think missing a week of school in the FIRST grade was going to be detrimental to the rest of her school years.

 

This was the same teacher who would send home 3 hours of homework (which I had to help with) every. single. night. She also assigned a 20 sentence report on a famous Black American--using two sources. When DD turned in the report, I sent a note to the teacher telling her that DD had not written the report, her dad and I had pulled every single sentence out of her...WE had written the report, because first graders normally can't give you 20 sentences about anything! A couple of months later, DD was given an award for "Excellence in Writing" for that same report.

 

We started homeschooling the next year @@

[Mrs Mungo]

Just seemed like the right time to quote you as your points could not be more spot-on.

 

To re-quote Heather:

-many of the posters who think pulling a child for a vacation is ok also either had bad experiences with PS or are still having bad experiences with PS. This colors their opinion on the matter.

 

Many, not all. My kids have never even been in public school. My one experience with this involved my niece, and it was fine with her school. If it was fine with them, then you should MYOB.

 

-those who homeschool often have a "maverick" mindset and want to march to the beat of their own drum rather than join in with the band. There is nothing wrong with that. It just doesn't mix well when one who thinks the rules are stupid and either don't or shouldn't apply to them also have their children in a group education setting where group rules are the norm.

 

This is *hilarious* given the very conservative lives led by most homeschoolers here. Mavericks? We're a freaking military family. We follow rules on everything from walking on the grass to stopping while retreat plays in the evening. That is SERIOUSLY flawed logic and not at all accurate in my experience.

 

-the "I'm going to do what I want to do and I don't care what anyone thinks and how dare you infringe on my right to do exactly as I please" mindset WHILE still expecting to be part of a group that has certain standards and expecting that group to lovingly embrace your individualism-run-amok or be labeled a family-time-hater actually IS a bit selfish. I am not sure where everyone got this idea that a family vacation is some kind of civil right every person is entitled to?

 

The majority of people are talking about taking vacations *within* their school's allowed parameters. So, it is a LIE that everybody is talking about "doing what they please."

 

-I don't get the "well, our school sucks anyways so who cares if my kid misses a day?" attitude either. If your school is THAT bad either pull your child out or roll up your sleeves and be a part of making it better. Contributing to the problem by disrespecting class time and a teacher's time is not the answer. But if it makes you feel better to justify your choices that way then...proceed.

 

Please quote where anything more than one or two posts said anything like this.

 

I am very thankful at this moment to work at a private school where parents who disregard the importance of what we are doing here are asked to leave and that spot is filled with a child whose parents are willing to fully support what we are trying to do. I don't think I can ever work in a PS and be that beholden to parental whims again.

 

:lol: And that may be true as long as you have your captive audience of overseas families. In the US? My experience in my community is that private school families have a larger expectation of accommodation than the local public school families.

Edited August 20, 2012 by Mrs Mungo

[SKL]

About public schools being beholden to parental whims . . . um . . . we're your employers AND your customers. Whose whims should public schools be beholden to?

 

I could just imagine going into a meeting with my boss and customers and announcing "I'm not interested in what's convenient or important to you, because I'm not beholden to the whims of those I serve nor those who pay me."

[SKL]

Gosh, I wonder if any of our Olympic athletes had to take time off school to participate in the games. Where's the compassion?

[Haiku]

No, silly, it was the SUMMER Olympics, scheduled within the structure of American public schools and for their convenience!

 

Tara

[ErinE]

:lol: And that may be true as long as you have your captive audience of overseas families. In the US? My experience in my community is that private school families have a larger expectation of accommodation than the local public school families.

 

Agreed with this! My niece attends an excellent private school and the administration and teachers are very understanding when it comes to family vacations. DN took a few days off of school "juz cuz" her cousins and aunt traveled 1,000 miles to see her. So long as the request was made in advance and the child made up the work, the private school accomodated the family, regardless of the reason for the absence. Which tells me that public schools are more concerned about money lost and absentee statistics than they are about the effect of absences on a child's education.

[SKL]

No, silly, it was the SUMMER Olympics, scheduled within the structure of American public schools and for their convenience!

 

Tara

 

Oops, my bad. I didn't notice since my kids were in school every day this summer. I sure hope none of the winter olympiads attend public school.

[SKL]

I just received the following in a marketing email:

 

Premier Landscaping

Our Earth Revolves Around You!

 

Another of Bill's hypotheses disproven.

[Haiku]

Oops, my bad. I didn't notice since my kids were in school every day this summer. I sure hope none of the winter olympiads attend public school.

 

Well, come on, they can schedule the Winter Olympics during winter or spring break! There's plenty of time then!

 

Tara

[PeacefulChaos]

Ok, here's your laugh for today...

 

So I started this thread and later deleted the OP and stuff because I realized that my reasonings were perhaps (ahem) influenced more by the people involved than the act of pulling the kids out of school for vacation (which I'm convinced is the fault of FB. I think that in general, I wouldn't notice how annoying some people are if I didn't see their posts on FB every day ;) But that's another topic...)

Well, as I'm driving to the store tonight I realize....

I pulled the boys out of school (pre-k and 1st grade) for a day and a half to go to Great Wolf Lodge.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

OOOH, boy. Pot, meet kettle. Aiya...

FTR, I didn't feel bad about pulling my kids out of school for said trip, despite it being in no way educational (we went because they are way cheaper during the week and DH was off work) and the teachers weren't particularly pleased. :D

 

So, anyway... I have already voted and it turns out I voted wrong. :tongue_smilie: (BTW, I have since hidden these people from my FB feed so I don't find myself annoyed with them anymore. I can be blissfully unaware... :D )

 

... and I was going to find a picture of some vacation/screw the schools/truancy cupcakes but I have NO idea how to get one on here from another website.

[melmichigan]

My DD did attend public school at one time. No, I didn't have a bad experience and yes I was an involved parent.

 

Our PS policy allows for 10 absences before a note comes home regarding attendance, another note again at 15, and at 20. At 20 absences the child is considered truant and may be reported as such to the truancy officer.

[creekland]

Ok, here's your laugh for today...

 

So I started this thread and later deleted the OP and stuff because I realized that my reasonings were perhaps (ahem) influenced more by the people involved than the act of pulling the kids out of school for vacation (which I'm convinced is the fault of FB. I think that in general, I wouldn't notice how annoying some people are if I didn't see their posts on FB every day ;) But that's another topic...)

Well, as I'm driving to the store tonight I realize....

I pulled the boys out of school (pre-k and 1st grade) for a day and a half to go to Great Wolf Lodge.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

OOOH, boy. Pot, meet kettle. Aiya...

FTR, I didn't feel bad about pulling my kids out of school for said trip, despite it being in no way educational (we went because they are way cheaper during the week and DH was off work) and the teachers weren't particularly pleased. :D

 

So, anyway... I have already voted and it turns out I voted wrong. :tongue_smilie:

 

... and I was going to find a picture of some vacation/screw the schools/truancy cupcakes but I have NO idea how to get one on here from another website.

 

:lol: Thanks for sharing. ;)

 

ps I bet your boys will remember your trip far more than they will remember what they would have learned in school those days...

 

Education is important - ALL forms of education. The well-rounded kid/adult has plenty of experiences, including some form of formal education but also many forms of "life" experiences.

 

pps I'm with you on preferring smaller crowds. The experience of going with crowds vs without is amazing. Carlsbad Caverns in Aug vs Sept is a totally different experience IMO, but that goes for more than Carlsbad...

[kalanamak]

I certainly can't dictate to my employer either, but it seems strange that companies are so badly organised that taking time during school breaks is impossible.

 

Where I work, it goes by seniority. The people who've been there a coon's age usually don't have school aged children. The people young enough to have school-aged kids are often OOL for choice spots. I knew one woman who finally quit because she couldn't go see her 90+ mother in Finland in the summer, despite working there for 15 years, because someone else wanted one day off in the middle of her two weeks.

I put in up to two years in advance to get a summer break of a few days for the family reunion, and I work extra for *anyone* who asks to store up "favors" in case I'm ever pinched.

So, it isn't "badly organized", it has rules. Do I want them broken? No. As soon as you don't follow this, favoritism takes over: who ever is best at "stroking the boss" would get the choice spots.

But, where I work there has to be a certain amount of staffing. There can't be any slow-down days.

[kalanamak]

In California and a couple other states, it works this way. In most states, including mine, it does not work this way at all. Schools are paid for each day that a student is enrolled, regardless of attendence unless expelled for truancy.

 

How does one find this out about one's state?

[LibraryLover]

I'll play. Looks like MA allows 7 days unauthorized absences within any 6 month period. Being sick or attending a funeral is authorized, and is not counted in that 7 total. So, it looks like you aren't truant even if you go to WDW for a week. You could be there Sat of one weekend to Sun of the next, and still have two days left for long weekends without getting referred to the Attendance Officer.

 

Every school age child is expected to be in school, attend all classes, and be present during the state and district standardized testing periods. Parents will be notified of all state and standardized testing dates in advance. The Massachusetts General Laws (Chapter 76, Section 2) specifies that a student under 16 years old may not be absent more than 7 days within any six month period.

 

A student absent for more than seven days within any six month period for a vacation or other non-authorized absence will be referred to the Attendance Officer for appropriate action.

 

The TMI Schools asks all parents to please respect the school calendar when planning family vacations. The school calendar is established during the summer. Parents can visit our website: TMI.us to see the calendar or you can request a copy. A parent/guardian who excuses a student for a family vacation or other non-authorized absence (for any number of days) will assume full responsibility for the education of the student during the absence.

 

So, not encouraged, but certainly not illegal.

Edited August 21, 2012 by LibraryLover

[KidsHappen]

Part of TN's funding is based on the average daily enrollment of students. One of my friends was actually fined for taking her child to my friend's mother's (so the child's grandmother's) funeral. Being the feisty person she is, she, of course, refused to pay. It turned out the letter requesting payment was an illegal action on the school's part, so that shows either ignorance of the law or how badly they want bodies in seats.

 

------

Quoted from the overview of The Basic Education Program TN uses to allocate funds to their schools:

 

"Student enrollment (average daily membership) is the primary driver of funds generated by the BEP."

--------

 

So, there's another state to add to the list.

 

 

As for me and the poll, though, I responded "in a heartbeat". It's not that I don't place importance on education, but rather I feel the family's decision trumps the school system's schedule. Thankfully, we homeschool so I don't have to answer to anyone but myself. And for the record, the vacations we take as a family can easily be considered far greater learning opportunities than anything a child would gain sitting in a classroom.

 

We live in TN and my dd's high school has a procedure for setting up vacation time during the school year. It needs to be done in advance. A funeral or sickness would always be considered an excused absense. If the kids miss a single day in connection with a holiday some administrators will excuse is (especially if it is a half day - they almost seem to expect it) while others won't. It seems that they get more lenient as they move up to the next highest school which seems odd to me. Certainly high school work is much more important that elementary school work.

[ack25]

I voted other.

In K-3, I pull them out without a second thought. As they hit 4th and 5th and then middle school, it is hard to make up the lost classroom time! My answer for the older grades is no, I would not pull them out.

And then there is the exception...dd is in 8th grade this year. She will miss 3 days in November to go overseas with her Grandmother. :D

[Laura Corin]

Where I work, it goes by seniority. The people who've been there a coon's age usually don't have school aged children. The people young enough to have school-aged kids are often OOL for choice spots. I knew one woman who finally quit because she couldn't go see her 90+ mother in Finland in the summer, despite working there for 15 years, because someone else wanted one day off in the middle of her two weeks.

I put in up to two years in advance to get a summer break of a few days for the family reunion, and I work extra for *anyone* who asks to store up "favors" in case I'm ever pinched.

So, it isn't "badly organized", it has rules. Do I want them broken? No. As soon as you don't follow this, favoritism takes over: who ever is best at "stroking the boss" would get the choice spots.

But, where I work there has to be a certain amount of staffing. There can't be any slow-down days.

 

The rules stink though. I wouldn't want the rules broken, but I would want them changed.

 

The places I've worked, there's been a lot of negotiation between staff who could cover for each other so that everyone gets something like what they want. Then they go to their boss to check that it's okay and get it registered.

 

On the other hand, my current company, which includes two manufacturing facilities, just closes down for two weeks at Christmas.

 

Another thing that happens a lot here: many of the national holidays are not freighted with meaning, so a lot of companies give people the option of taking them or using the days at another time. My annual holiday allocation includes days in lieu of all national holidays, so it's up to me how I use that, for example during school half terms.

 

I am starting to think that the US tradition of three months off in the summer is part of the problem though: it puts too much pressure for time off into one period.

 

Laura

[Parrothead]

We live in TN and my dd's high school has a procedure for setting up vacation time during the school year. It needs to be done in advance. A funeral or sickness would always be considered an excused absense. If the kids miss a single day in connection with a holiday some administrators will excuse is (especially if it is a half day - they almost seem to expect it) while others won't. It seems that they get more lenient as they move up to the next highest school which seems odd to me. Certainly high school work is much more important that elementary school work.

Because many parents know this and won't take a high schooler out of school unless absolutely necessary. But a lot of parents have a "Oh, it is just first grade work. What's the big deal." I know I would, and do.

[SKL]

Yesterday I met with my kids' 1st grade teacher and asked about (among other things) vacation policy. Her initial reaction was that it's a bad idea and why can't we travel in the summer. I pointed out that my summer workload is so heavy that I can't even take the kids to church half of the time, let alone travel.

 

She then noted that during short weeks (there are a couple of 3-day school weeks on the calendar), she doesn't teach the regular curriculum units, so those would be good times to take off if that's what I decide to do. I told her I'd take that under advisement.

 

I am pretty sure she feels respected even though it's clear I want my kids to have a chance to travel. It doesn't have to be either/or.

[SKL]

It seems that they get more lenient as they move up to the next highest school which seems odd to me. Certainly high school work is much more important that elementary school work.

 

My thought: their experience tells them that a highschooler has the maturity to make sure the work gets done and concepts get mastered, if he cares about his school record. And if he doesn't, the parent isn't likely to blame the teacher when he falls behind.

[Haiku]

My thought: their experience tells them that a highschooler has the maturity to make sure the work gets done and concepts get mastered, if he cares about his school record.

 

And this is the premise on which my dd's school operates. It's an early college academy. Its job is to prepare disadvantaged and under-educated kids for college (my dd qualifies because she lived for many years in an overseas orphanage). They do have guidelines for missing school, as I posted previously. Unlike how Bill misinterpreted them, however, they are not guidelines for how many days you can or can't miss or when you can miss. They are guidelines for what you must do IF you miss. The school actually REQUIRES you to miss for various activities you must attend in order to graduate, and you must make up the missed time. It's not, as Bill has misunderstood, because they know how damaging it is to miss school, and it's not because they reteach the lessons. It's because it's far easier for them to have a blanket policy that applies to everyone rather than allow various students to do various things in various ways.

 

The school has NEVER said a word to me about my dd missing school. They are generally very happy for her to have the opportunities she has had, and they are HUGE on student responsibility. They see it as, IF the student makes the decision to miss school, THEN the student will demonstrate the requisite maturity and commitment to get caught up. IF you want to do THAT (whatever that is), THEN you agree to do THIS as well.

 

Most of the kids at dd's school come from families that haven't been overly concerned about their educations. The school is actually doing them a favor by requiring them to make up the time. They certainly don't have to. They could just say, "Hope you get caught up. Good luck." Instead they take steps to insure that the student catches up, but this does not require any extra effort on the part of the teachers, as they DON'T reteach the lessons or tutor the students who missed. They just expect the kids to catch themselves up.

 

In fact, the school is so consistent in its policy that when she was suspended for skipping out of school one day to go out to eat, they required that she make up NOT ONLY the time she missed while skipping BUT ALSO the time she missed while suspended ... she just got no credit for any of the work she completed. :D And I applauded them.

 

It is complete and utter bunk that every school everywhere is horrified and p!ssed off whenever a student misses school for anything other than illness/funeral.

 

Tara

[FairyMom]

We do take ours out for vacation, it's the best part about homeschooling; avoiding the crowds during off peak travel. We have one planned for two weeks in September.

[FairyMom]

I can sleep at night knowing we don't skip school to take advantage of shorter lines at Disneyland.

 

Bill

 

Oh, please. WE DO THIS INTENTIONALLY!! This is an advantage of homeschooling, which you obviously don't do.

[Ibbygirl]

Oh, please. WE DO THIS INTENTIONALLY!! This is an advantage of homeschooling, which you obviously don't do.

 

:iagree: We do too. It's one of my favorite things about homeschooling. I can choose when we take off for vacations since I have the whole year open to me. I don't feel one bit guilty of taking advantage of of cooler weather or shorter lines. Why should I? It's one of the perks of being a homeschooling family which I totally embrace. :D

[GoVanGogh]

Thinking of this post today...

 

There were a number of "back-to-school" articles in the paper today. One talked about the number of families that don't return back to school until after Labor Day, though the first day of school is tomorrow. (Kids then miss the first week of school.)

 

The article said that our schools receive $41 per student per day. They expect to lose $1 million in school funding the first week of school alone due to families extending their summer vacations by one week.

 

One family keeping their own children out (or pulling them out) for a vacation doesn't seem like much, but district-wide it does add up.

[Scrub Jay]

The article said that our schools receive $41 per student per day. They expect to lose $1 million in school funding the first week of school alone due to families extending their summer vacations by one week.

 

One family keeping their own children out (or pulling them out) for a vacation doesn't seem like much, but district-wide it does add up.

 

Sounds like it's a massive problem and that they need to re-do their calendar since obviously it doesn't meet many of their families needs.

[MariannNOVA]

Some of this is starting to make sense --

 

last week, I was dropping off forms in the office of the local middle school and a mom and her son were meeting with someone in the office getting his paper work together.

 

They had recently relocated here from Tennessee. The mom was questioning the admin. about the absence policy here in no. va. The mom was saying that under certain circumstances and with a certain amount of absences (I think a doctor's note was involved - I wasn't totally eavesdropping - just about 60% ;)) the student would be fined and if the fine wasn't paid, grades would not be released at the end of the year.

 

The admin was trying to conceal her astonishment that this was an actual practice someplace.

[*Michelle*]

Sounds like it's a massive problem and that they need to re-do their calendar since obviously it doesn't meet many of their families needs.

 

Seriously. These families are the school's customers. If you run a business and your hours are 9 to 5, but you notice that you get hardly any traffic until 12 and people are constantly showing up just as you're locking the doors, what would you do? Complain about it or swich your hours to 11 to 7?

[GoVanGogh]

Sounds like it's a massive problem and that they need to re-do their calendar since obviously it doesn't meet many of their families needs.

Our state passed a new law several years ago, stating that schools could not start back until after Labor Day. (Bill was introduced and supported by tourism industry.) But the state created a loophole - every district could ask for (and be granted) a waiver to start early. I live in a major metro area and know of no districts that don't start before Labor Day. What a waste to pass such a bill. :glare:

The schools say they have to start now so the terms are evenly spaced around the holidays and exams taken prior to Christmas break. Pushing back the start of school puts semester exams the first week after Christmas, which everyone agreed was a bad idea. It ends up being a case of parents wanting it both ways -- they don't want their kids studying for exams over Christmas, they don't want them back in school before Labor Day. So they hold them out and cause the school to lose money.

[Scrub Jay]

The schools say they have to start now so the terms are evenly spaced around the holidays and exams taken prior to Christmas break. Pushing back the start of school puts semester exams the first week after Christmas, which everyone agreed was a bad idea. It ends up being a case of parents wanting it both ways -- they don't want their kids studying for exams over Christmas, they don't want them back in school before Labor Day. So they hold them out and cause the school to lose money.

 

So strange. I always started school past Labor Day and I don't remember ever studying during winter break.

 

DD's virtual charter school started August 20th. I don't care because we do our own thing (this is not the type of virtual school that requires you logging in, etc). But if she was in a brick and morter school I would not be happy.

 

Most schools here seem to be starting before Labor Day these days and they end in late May.

[Princess Peach]

I don't think the parents should feel like they can have their kids start a week later because they feel like it. I'm all for change that benefits the greatest number of people, but procedures are in place for that change to occur. These parents ought to be petitioning the school board. Otherwise, their kids should be in school when it starts.

[jennynd]

I am taking my now PS DS to Taiwan this November to see my Dad. I don't think it will be a big deal

[*Michelle*]

The schools say they have to start now so the terms are evenly spaced around the holidays and exams taken prior to Christmas break. Pushing back the start of school puts semester exams the first week after Christmas, which everyone agreed was a bad idea.

 

I don't really get that, either. How do the schools fret over the kids forgetting everything they've just learned over a brief Christmas break, yet keep a three-month summer between grade levels?

 

I'm not sure why they even bother with "semesters" anyway. It seems rather arbitrary. During high school, I only had two classes that were semester long instead of a full year. The end of the nine weeks was just a spot for taking a longer test before picking right up where we'd left off the next day.

[Impish]

Wolf's busy work season begins end of March, calms down 2nd wk of Sept.

 

If he's not working, he's on call.

 

No way could he take vacation when ps does.

 

Just one of the many reasons we'll continue to hs. If we have the opp to go on family vacation, we're going.

 

Plus, it strikes me as Borg like...owing our children's presence somewhere. *shudder*

[Ibbygirl]

I don't really get that, either. How do the schools fret over the kids forgetting everything they've just learned over a brief Christmas break, yet keep a three-month summer between grade levels?

 

I know right! It's not like they don't send them a work packet home (to do over the holiday break) anyway. :glare: