Compassion and Understanding for ALL types of minds

[CAMom]

But, this is common for everyone whatever their circumstances. Everyone has to filter what they say every day. That's life. It would be wonderful if we could all say whatever we want and receive the "support" (i.e. validation) we believe we deserve, but context in human relationships is everything, and it is dynamic. Knowing and having some understanding of your audience is simply respectful.

 

Parents of gifted children don't need to apologize for that giftedness just as the rich don't need to apologize for their wealth. While it's reasonable to expect fairness when discussing these issues, it is presumptuous to expect "support", and that's what some of the posters here want. Support is something freely offered and freely given; it's not a matter of "deserve".

 

OK, I did not mean deserve as in "it's my inalienable right" or anything.:) And, support does not necessarily mean validation in my book.

 

I'm talking more about relationships that are a two way street. You talk to me about your kids and your struggles with their issues and I talk about mine. Don't make it a one sided relationship because you can't relate to what I'm going through or because you're jealous of my kid's intelligence. And don't assume that my challenges are not real.

 

It's real when you have a gifted kid who fits the stereotype of the eccentric gifted person. It's a real struggle when you see your kid ostracized because he doesn't fit in. It's a real struggle when you can't figure out how to challenge your kid because you're no where near as smart as he is. It's a real struggle when your kid ends up depressed because no one in his immediate circle can relate to him.

 

And, I have two kids that are very bright and one that is gifted. It's a whole different ball game. I am actually thankful on behalf of my smart two that they are not gifted. In my experience and the experience of others with whom I have been in contact, giftedness is no cake walk-either for the child or the parents.

[Stacy in NJ]

I don't believe anyone need apologize for riches (of whatever variety), and talking openly about life's challenges (of whatever variety) is and should be part of any enjoyable conversation online or IRL, but expecting others to relate to problems arising from those riches is just unrealistic. Expecting fairness and open-mindedness is realistic; expecting relatedness and support is not. Like-minded forums exist for the latter.

 

You know, this is a really good comparison. I agree with you.

 

I think, though, that there should be a legitimate outlet for people with those types of problems too. In places where people of all walks of life meet, like this virtual community, people should not have to self-censor all the time lest they somehow offend. It is quite easy, logistically, to ignore the things you do not wish to read about. I think internet is a wonderful medium in that we can be a lot more *open* than we normally would be and find people with whom we can discuss issues which are still largely taboo to be discussed in general society.

 

On a strictly logical level, if you treat people as individuals to the fullest, all adjectives are gone. A child cannot be tall if there is nobody to compare to, so "tall" has no inherent meaning; the same can be said about being "smart" or "advanced" or "behind" or "pretty" or... you name it, all of the adjectives we use, some with a more objective basis, some with a more subjective basis. The sole labeling of people admits to the existence of comparison. Comparison is the only way to make sense in a huge variety that exists. But, at the same time, one should strive to view each person as an individual, with their right to their own growth and their own set of virtues and challenges. Thus the tension. And that is okay, but only as long as we do not reach a conclusion that "some children are more special than others" and when the issues of those "others" start being downplayed and people start self-censoring.

 

Nobody has to listen or read anything they do not want, but people with those other type of issues - the ones stemming from wealth rather than poverty, the ones stemming from having rich intellectual lives and leisure, the ones stemming from having atypically accomplished children rather than the ones that are not, etc. - need a platform too, for discussion and free exchange of ideas, in which they should not feel judged if they share. That is why, in some ways, the emphasis on discretion (which I 100% agree with if we talk about casual IRL conversations with people who are not our closest family and friends) is in my view not always a good thing. Sure, people should not be "in your face" about it if it can be prevented, but those are legitimate subjects for discussion too. There should be a time and a place for them without it being somehow morally problematic or problematic as regards common etiquette.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

It is hard to educate a child who is on the gifted end of the bell curve but for kids on that end the world is their oyster. There is nothing limiting what they can achieve and accomplish. A lot of schools do not meet their needs but they still will be accelerated and get into good colleges and they can achieve anything they want. They tend to make more money and they are more successful. A child with special needs or on the other end of the spectrum is limited in what they can achieve and has similar educational challenges but there are other challenges that go along with it. The profoundly gifted have social challenges but the moderately gifted usually do not. Having more intellect is not the same challenge as special needs it isn't even close.

 

MistyMountain, you know how teachers will beat down a special needs child until he feels absolutely worthless and unable to learn?

 

That happens to profoundly gifted kids, too. Public school teachers (and Sunday school teachers!) often resent these kids and make their lives a living hell. They can't out-logic him, or be superior by holding more facts, so they resort to schoolyard bully tactics of belittling, mocking, shaming, and (my personal favorite) the Kiss of Death. The Kiss of Death is totally over-the-top, gooey, obnoxious over-complimenting the smart kid, day in and day out, until the other kids entirely despise him and he dislikes himself, too.

 

Then there's the Crab Bucket Syndrome, and the Tall Poppy Syndrome. Those are about kids who are above average, or different in a positive way, being kept down by their teachers and peers through psychological warfare.

 

By the time our little genius develops the maturity to understand what's going on, it might be too late for his spirit. He might hate people, even if he comes to understand what happened to him through his whole school experience.

 

A bitter, misanthropic genius can be one scary dude. We all know the examples.

 

This type of thing is one reason why some parents of gifted kids cry. Some gifted kids have a target on their back, just exactly like delayed learners have, especially in non-academic communities where everybody's running low on inspiration or role models.

 

They need teachers who were not at the bottom of the academic ladder, but they won't get teachers like that in most public schools. It's not that their genius needs fed constantly, but that their intellect needs respected because every human deserves to be treated with dignity.

 

When I saw the negativity that was poured toward my profoundly gifted son by adults at church I took him out of Sunday school, never to return. I later risked youth group, but it was more of the same. The kids liked him until the youth pastor hated him, and taught the kids that ds was stuck up and weird for being homeschooled. I was so angry I was ready to do bodily harm. I warned the man to never speak to my son again, not even in the hallway at church. He will NOT be permitted to paint a new picture of my son for my son to carry around forever.

 

I praise God for every adult and child in ds's life who accepts him and loves him for who he is. (Almost all of these people are in martial arts or Civil Air Patrol.) They give him the positions of leadership and responsibility that are rightfully his due to his natural capabilities, his dedication, and his personality. They don't ever treat him as someone on a pedestal, though. He is taught, disciplined, and held accountable. He is loved and helped up when he falls, just the same as the most struggling cadet or the newest yellow belt. These appropriate relationships help him to have a balanced and accurate picture of himself, which is something we all want for all of our children.

 

My middle two children are bright, happy, capable people. All else remaining equal, the world really might be their oyster because they are not far from average and of cheerful dispositions. No major struggles, often chosen to help others, but never singled out to be Captain or King. It's a nice place to be.

 

My youngest child is just like my eldest child, and I will protect him even more fiercely than I protected his brother. I will do everything in my power to ensure that when he looks in the mirror he likes and accepts what he sees.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Tibbie Dunbar

[Impish]

Honestly, I see most of the talk about 'gifted' as another shot in the Mommy Wars.

 

Yes, there are some kids that are off the charts, and they represent educational and parental challenges.

 

Then there's the type I'm most familiar w/, *everything* Jr does is award worthy, he's always done *everything* ahead of everyone else on the planet, Einstein should have stuck to eating library paste by the time this kid hits 3rd grade, yadda, yadda, yadda.

 

Oh, and this kid is usually also being offered modelling contracts on the street, and the Oilers already want him for their farm team, but insist that he's completely toliet trained first...which, since he's only 10 mths old, will be in the next hr or two...

[angela in ohio]

I wonder if more transparency with the struggles would help.

 

Tried that. No one remembers the struggles; they just focus on the rest.

 

Public school teachers (and Sunday school teachers!) often resent these kids and make their lives a living hell.

 

Yep, try saying that you homeschool because you feared for the health of your gifted child when pressed for a reason at a homeschool meeting. :001_huh: Not happening.

 

I remember the few teachers who were hateful to me and really damaged me. Looking back, I can handle it, but as a child, it was devastating.

 

I cried for dd1, and I didn't cry because she's gifted. I cried because I recognized that the gifts she got from me came with the same package of baggage that mine did for me.

 

So well said (although I do cry for the challenges that come with it, because we really didn't know what to do to help her and feared for her future well-being.) I cry mostly, though, for knowing - from experience - that people will try to tear her down just for her existence, no matter how hard she tries to be "normal" (hate the word.)

[FaithManor]

Tibbie Dunbar, I relate to so much of your post.

 

Dh and I were physically abused, emotionally abused, verbally abused, you name it for our abilities in school...mine were musical, his were mathematical and science though neither of us were lightweights in other academic disciplines. Dh from 3-5th grades ended up electively mute during school hours. I ate my lunch in a janitor's closet until the teachers figured out where I was hiding. Now, in defense of my elementary teachers, I did not tell them how bad the bullying was for "being different", but once they figured it out heads did roll. However, once I moved to the middle school the "gloves came off" and not only that, the teachers were absolutely hideaous excuses for adults. The only friend I had in that entire school was the band director. As for the other adults, the principal referred to me as "the freak", and the teachers referred to me as "music nerd" and all of this was often in front of the class. It lead to me being very afraid to walk down the hallway alone. Fortunately, the band director cultivated a couple of "band buddies" to accompany me which really helped keep me safe. I wouldn't say my band buddies were friends, but they were compassionate.

 

Unfortuntely, the micro-culture we live in is anti-intellectual. Thankfully, the anti-musical part has abated. However, we still have to shield ds sooooooo much. We are now in a healthy church family...in our previous one, ds was kicked out of the pre-school Sunday school class because as the education director put it, "He seems like a nice boy, but we wouldn't want to make the other children feel bad about themselves because he can do these things, now would we?" :tongue_smilie: This was totally supported by the senior pastor. DD, in 6th grade, a great academian but not precocious, was told by the youth pastor to "dumb up" and "don't talk about anything too smart". He felt she would fit in better... of course, part of her not fitting in was simply because she was raised a little differently and didn't have much use for flirting and what not. :glare: We were pleasantly surprised to find the culture of children's ministries and the youth group to be entirely different, making them I fear very unusual, from the other churches we visited.

 

Oh, and just for the record. Dh and I have normal personalities. Seriously, we aren't all that weird. But, we did learn to hide our true selves and are very careful not to let our brains out of their bags with new people until we have figured out what kind of response we are likely to get. Given our history it is not the least it surprising that we shelter ds as much as we do.

 

Ester Maria, I really wish I had grown up in your childhood culture. It sounds like you had a lovely childhood, able to be the person you really were, and able to interact with others without judgment and hostility. Alas, there are many areas of the US that are rather "anti-intellectual" and advanced children and even more so precocious learners, do not find such acceptance.

 

Faith

[FaithManor]

Honestly, I see most of the talk about 'gifted' as another shot in the Mommy Wars.

 

Yes, there are some kids that are off the charts, and they represent educational and parental challenges.

 

Then there's the type I'm most familiar w/, *everything* Jr does is award worthy, he's always done *everything* ahead of everyone else on the planet, Einstein should have stuck to eating library paste by the time this kid hits 3rd grade, yadda, yadda, yadda.

 

Oh, and this kid is usually also being offered modelling contracts on the street, and the Oilers already want him for their farm team, but insist that he's completely toliet trained first...which, since he's only 10 mths old, will be in the next hr or two...

 

 

 

:lol::lol::smilielol5::smilielol5::smilielol5:

 

I needed to laugh! Thanks IMP!!!!!

 

Faith

[tex-mex]

Honestly, I see most of the talk about 'gifted' as another shot in the Mommy Wars.

 

Yes, there are some kids that are off the charts, and they represent educational and parental challenges.

 

Then there's the type I'm most familiar w/, *everything* Jr does is award worthy, he's always done *everything* ahead of everyone else on the planet, Einstein should have stuck to eating library paste by the time this kid hits 3rd grade, yadda, yadda, yadda.

 

Oh, and this kid is usually also being offered modelling contracts on the street, and the Oilers already want him for their farm team, but insist that he's completely toliet trained first...which, since he's only 10 mths old, will be in the next hr or two...

:lol::lol::lol:

So true!!! Spot on, Imp!

[Aelwydd]

They can't out-logic him, or be superior by holding more facts, so they resort to schoolyard bully tactics of belittling, mocking, shaming, and (my personal favorite) the Kiss of Death.

 

When I saw the negativity that was poured toward my profoundly gifted son by adults at church I took him out of Sunday school, never to return.

 

 

That's been my observation, when I was growing up seeing how my best friend was treated by certain teachers.

 

Many adults, upon failing their attempt to defeat her reasoning, would fall back on their "respect mah authoritae!" spiel. It was profoundly uninspiring. They frequently resorted to bullying and intimidation with all us smart kids. It's just they reserved the extra nasty condescension for the gifted kids like my best friend.

 

I would also share that some of the nastiest adults were parents of advanced-but-not-truly-gifted students. They were so green with jealousy. They just couldn't stand to have their little "Einsteins" shown up by the true geniuses. That's why I maintain that gifted students get a lot of the blow back from the obnoxious wannabe parents of smart, advanced, but still normal kids. Those folks were freaking brutal.

[WIS0320]

There is only one parent I know to whom I can mention this - my SIL who went through similar struggles.

 

I have a friend who has a daughter 3 weeks older than mine. Her son is 3 weeks older than my son as well so we were pregnant together 2x and have had a lot of fun discussing parenting and having our kids play over the years.

 

My friend's daughter is profoundly gifted and never once have I thought she was bragging as we've discussed it and she's sought advice about how to navigate her public school system. I tried to give her helpful feedback when she asked as they were trying to get the school to move her daughter up a grade level. I have never once felt like she was making her child out to be "better" than my own daughter who is bright but on the normal end of the spectrum.

 

Not all parents of bright kids are obnoxious and I think it matters who and when you are talking about your kid. My point here in sharing this story is that it is frustrating to read posts that are basically "Boo hoo, I can't talk about my kid!".

 

It is sort of like porn - I know it when I see it. I know when a parent is bragging or when they are seeking to share due to excitement or needing support. There is a big difference in my mind and I hear bragging more often than not when a child's aptitude, reading level, etc. are being discussed.

[Laurie4b]

I think this is a common misconception. There are many gifted people in my family (I'm using scored high on IQ tests as my definition). A couple of them are high school drop outs who can't hold down a job for very long. Being able to achieve in one area is no guarantee of success in other areas.

 

Wendy, is this solely due to being gifted, or are there other special needs at play here?

[Greta]

If you read her article and her comments, she is specifically hating on gifted kids as a group, not on any kids smarter than hers. If she was educated in the US, she knows not to single out any particular group for hatred or intolerance. Nasty, and not deserving of taking her thoughts seriously.

 

I didn't see any hatred of gifted children at all. What I saw was a woman who, annoyed by boastful parents, was making a painful admission about her own disappointment in her daughter. I hope that she will be able to get over that, because it's a pretty rotten thing to saddle your child with. I know she went on to talk about how kind and pleasant her daughter is, and to bemoan the fact that these aren't qualities that are valued as highly as intelligence and giftedness (and I agree with her on that count!). But even as she says these things, she seems to feel that this is just the consolation prize, and that what she really wanted was a gifted child. And she referred to her daughter as "willful stubborn a pain in the ass strong-minded" and "a little hothead". I hope that I have never spoken publicly in such a negative way about my child, and if I have may God and my daughter both forgive me. One thing I'm coming away from this with is a determination to be more careful in what I say about my daughter, whether it's negative or positive.

[Laurie4b]

The bigger problem is the hate speech. The author of that article knows that hate in print is protected under the constitution, right up until she uses 'fighting words'. She likely won't stand up at the school board meetings where she can't duck the rebuttals, but she will likely advocate further hatred and get her friends to quietly pressure the school board to eliminate differentiation for above grade level children. It's already been done here.

 

The author needs to be id'd publicly as the bigot she is. Shame on her for advocating intolerance towards children. SHe needs to learn what grandma always said "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all."

 

The object of the author's rant is the mothers who are bragging. Like others, I see no "hate speech" directed toward anyone but braggarts.

 

What comes across to me from the article is insecurity, envy, and disappointment in her own kid; I can't see why the article gets any attention at all. I find it sad and pathetic.

[dragons in the flower bed]

I wonder if more transparency with the struggles would help.

 

That's what is hard, though. Restraining yourself about the exciting things is easier than not seeking aid and comfort with the hard things. IMHO. But people get annoyed at you when you say something like, "my son has read every YA book in the library and I don't know what to do next because he can't survive without reading material," or, "if I have to listen to him play that instrument for one more minute I am going to scream," or "I am losing my relationship with my eight-year-old because all he wants to talk about is calculus and I can't understand it." This will just seem like sneaky bragging. People tell you to be grateful for what you have.

[inmyopinion]

I do brag on my oldest child's talent in math. He is a smart kid in a lot of areas but he also has some special needs which we struggle with every day. So, after we have spent time spelling out the areas he struggles with to his OT, his speech teacher, his Sunday School teachers, co-op teachers, and coaches I look forward to being able to brag on him. Also, as many children with special needs, they have areas that they excel in. Think of Aspergers. There you often have a child who is gifted in many areas but struggles to make friends. I am probably obnoxious when I do so, but I am often obnoxious so it is to be expected. I want to enjoy these proud moments as I know when the kid gets older he will blame everything on me. Let me have my moment of Glory!!!:tongue_smilie:

[SKL]

Everyone has to filter what they say every day. .... Knowing and having some understanding of your audience is simply respectful.

 

 

I knew someone was going to say that. Of course that's true. You don't go up to an obese woman and whine about how hard it is to find size 1 jeans. You don't walk through a poor neighborhood and whine about how bad the food was on the cruise you just took. That's called rubbing it in. But the idea that practically nobody in this world can stand the fact that some kids are smarter than theirs? That's kinda sick. Maybe it's not parents of advanced kids (or beautiful or talented kids, for that matter) who need to look at themselves in the mirror. I mean, if your most basic needs are met, you should have some capacity to be happy for someone else.

 

That linked article shows a woman who is emotionally handicapped. The fact that the majority of her commenters share the same handicap does not make it a healthy way to be.

 

I don't want to make people feel badly, which is why I hate the fact that I really have no control over that. Just shutting up when I feel like saying something doesn't solve the problem. They still hate me and my kid for whatever she does that their kid can't do. And unless I put my kid in a box, it's bound to become apparent at some point.

 

It's the same as people who frown when they see a slim, healthy woman walking down the street, minding her own business. The next thing you know, the heavier people are finding fault with how Ms. Slim is dressed, and making assumptions about how and why she keeps herself so slim. Ugh. I guess if Ms. Slim had any consideration, she'd wear padded clothing.

[freesia]

That's what is hard, though. Restraining yourself about the exciting things is easier than not seeking aid and comfort with the hard things. IMHO. But people get annoyed at you when you say something like, "my son has read every YA book in the library and I don't know what to do next because he can't survive without reading material," or, "if I have to listen to him play that instrument for one more minute I am going to scream," or "I am losing my relationship with my eight-year-old because all he wants to talk about is calculus and I can't understand it." This will just seem like sneaky bragging. People tell you to be grateful for what you have.

But I guess I don't see why these are problems that need to be shared with everyone. (Remember my kids are gifted so I understand.) In my mind they are sneaky bragging.

 

You can share the issues easily--my child is hyper focused on something how can I get him to develop other interests? "I'm not into what my kid is into--what do you do when that happens?" The book issue is best raised with a librarian or the parent of another avid reader bc what can the other parent do/say, really?

 

There is no reason, in particular, to share the details of the situation. That's where we parents of gifted kids need to use discretion and be brutally honest with ourselves about our motivations.

 

I am really not saying we can't share our kids accomplishments ever just that we need to be clear about our motivations and honestly think about the way they will effect the other person.

[SKL]

I am really not saying we can't share our kids accomplishments ever just that we need to be clear about our motivations and honestly think about the way they will effect the other person.

 

I think most people naturally do this anyway - whatever the topic.

 

The problem with the "I hate" article in the pop media is that it creates a "ganging up" mentality that moves the topic from "OK/inappropriate depending on the group you're in" to "taboo." Of course this topic has always been taboo with some groups, but why encourage the ignorance? (Not saying anyone here is doing that.)

[simka2]

But I guess I don't see why these are problems that need to be shared with everyone. (Remember my kids are gifted so I understand.) In my mind they are sneaky bragging.

 

You can share the issues easily--my child is hyper focused on something how can I get him to develop other interests? "I'm not into what my kid is into--what do you do when that happens?" The book issue is best raised with a librarian or the parent of another avid reader bc what can the other parent do/say, really?

 

There is no reason, in particular, to share the details of the situation. That's where we parents of gifted kids need to use discretion and be brutally honest with ourselves about our motivations.

 

I am really not saying we can't share our kids accomplishments ever just that we need to be clear about our motivations and honestly think about the way they will effect the other person.

 

This is along the lines of my thinking as well. I have both gifted, LD's and completely normal kids. I have to be wise when communicating about all parts of the spectrum. Normal to friends who are struggling really hard with LD's, gifted to normal, normal to gifted, and amazingly gifted to gifted. :tongue_smilie:

 

That's what is hard, though. Restraining yourself about the exciting things is easier than not seeking aid and comfort with the hard things. IMHO. But people get annoyed at you when you say something like, "my son has read every YA book in the library and I don't know what to do next because he can't survive without reading material," or, "if I have to listen to him play that instrument for one more minute I am going to scream," or "I am losing my relationship with my eight-year-old because all he wants to talk about is calculus and I can't understand it." This will just seem like sneaky bragging. People tell you to be grateful for what you have.

:grouphug: Tell me anytime! Good or bad, sometimes it is just fun to share!

[justamouse]

Tibbie, your post totally resonates.

 

Three of my kids were constantly told to stop answering...then to being ignored...now (in outside Classes) don't even bother anymore.

[LostSurprise]

Yes, you can talk endlessly about the struggles of raising a child with special needs, and it is fine, but dare to mention that you are struggling with your child who is gifted, and you are "bragging or boasting."

 

I'm wondering how many people with this point of view have both special needs and gifted children?

 

In my own experience, its extremely difficult to find someone to share the struggles of raising a special need child.

 

Forget talking endlessly, I can't even tell people a basic outline of what happened at my house today without clearing a room.

 

My other boys are only Advanced (probably in the 120-135 IQ range), but I can get across their lives and struggles in a limited, balanced way. If I want depth I go to someone who understands.

 

I can't even talk in a limited way about my special needs son without alienating people or killing conversations. Oh, they're very nice about it, but they'll change the conversation, walk away, or be very emotional about it (throwing a pity party when all I want to do is vent or just talk)...as if they need to comfort me for something terribly tragic.

 

At this point I talk about the other boys and give a very general answer about my special needs son.

 

I think that whoever lives on the fringe, whether with decreased or increased capacity, will always be misunderstood, will always make people feel uneasy. When people feel uneasy they respond inappropriately or not at all.

 

I don't think this is an aspect of people hating the gifted, but an aspect of human beings responding to what they understand, and isolating that which they don't.

[Ester Maria]

I wonder where you read that it is a necessity, because I never said such. :confused: I write from my perspective and about my experiences as a child and hsing my children. That's all it is or is intended to be.

Sorry, was typing quickly, I meant to include parenthesis with "I know this is not what you said". I was not trying to impute it to you, I am sorry if it ended up that way. :)

 

I sort of get irked (but that is my problem, on my side of the fence, not your problem :)) when I see the identification of atypical intellect with a particular disposition / personality, which I thought your post did in a way (but perhaps I was wrong).

 

I am the dummy of our family, but even I am reasonably smart - and an extrovert.

My husband is one of the sharpest minds I know. And a very normal, down to Earth, well-adjusted guy. Quite organized too, not like your typical scientist stereotype.

One of our daughters would most likely qualify as profoundly gifted, although I am loath to drag her to psychologists to have it confirmed because I am firm about keeping my children very AWAY from them. She most definitely does not have social challenges and had only minor ones as a child. I always strictly separated her character issues from her academic issues and never justified one with the other nor romanticized her problems with self-control (MUCH better now!) as a side-effect of giftedness nor anything. I know a LOT of people who are IMO doing a disservice to their very smart children by doing exactly that.

Our other daughter is very bright. And a social butterfly who, while she values her time on her own, is actually really good with people.

 

Both my older daughters have a lot of common sense, warm and energetic temperaments, and most definitely do not fit any stereotype about poor, misunderstood, depressed and awkward gifted kids. They know their manners and are not one of those obnoxious smartish kids who cannot shut up about their interests or who moralize to other people. They have skills in relating to people of not only different intellect levels, but also from different cultures and backgrounds. They are really not withdrawn weirdoes and I know many talented individuals who are very far from that stereotype, which is why it always sort of irks me when I feel somebody is identifying intellectual gifts with a particular personality. It is really two different issues, not every gifted child will have all those stereotypical problems.

[Laura Corin]

I get that, too. What ARE you suppose to say when someone says, "Do you know she is SO smart!" Sometimes I stammer so much I think they are thinking, "Well s/he didn't get his/her brains from that parent!":D

 

"He likes (whatever he has been seen to excel in)." It deflects the conversation from ability to interest. I follow up with, "Your Johnny seems really interested in robots," and the conversation moves on.

 

Laura

[freesia]

"He likes (whatever he has been seen to excel in)." It deflects the conversation from ability to interest. I follow up with, "Your Johnny seems really interested in robots," and the conversation moves on.

 

Laura

That is excellent, Laura! Must be your years in the UK. When I lived in Ireland I found that folks there were masters of the redirect. I will definitely use that.

[CAMom]

 

Both my older daughters have a lot of common sense, warm and energetic temperaments, and most definitely do not fit any stereotype about poor, misunderstood, depressed and awkward gifted kids. They know their manners and are not one of those obnoxious smartish kids who cannot shut up about their interests or who moralize to other people. They have skills in relating to people of not only different intellect levels, but also from different cultures and backgrounds. They are really not withdrawn weirdoes and I know many talented individuals who are very far from that stereotype, which is why it always sort of irks me when I feel somebody is identifying intellectual gifts with a particular personality. It is really two different issues, not every gifted child will have all those stereotypical problems.

 

Well, my kid has suffered from depression because of the isolation. And, he struggles with being a "withdrawn weirdo." but he's really working on it and it would be nice if he could experience some compassion and encouragement from someone other than his own mother.

 

I fear we might be losing some of the achievments the great minds could give us because of the lack of being treated decently. YMMV.

[tex-mex]

I saw this article today and thought it was relevant to the thread. I loved the young boy's attitude!

 

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http://news.yahoo.com/boy-geniuss-book-reveals-life-college-age-8-075047170.html

 

LOS ANGELES (AP) — The one thing 14-year-old Moshe Kai Cavalin dislikes is being called a genius.

 

All he did, after all, was enroll in college at age 8 and earn his first of two Associate of Arts degrees from East Los Angeles Community College in 2009 at age 11, graduating with a perfect 4.0 grade point average.

Now, at 14, he's poised to graduate from UCLA this year. He's also just published an English edition of his first book, "We Can Do."

 

The 100-page guideline explains how other young people can accomplish what Cavalin did through such simple acts as keeping themselves focused and approaching everything with total commitment. He's hoping it will show people there's no genius involved, just hard work.

 

"That's always the question that bothers me," Cavalin, who turned 14 on Tuesday, says when the G-word is raised. "People need to know you don't really need to be a genius. You just have to work hard and you can accomplish anything."

[mamajag]

For those who are criticizing another pp for saying that she cried...My husband is a genius (seriously). He's also highly eccentric from a highly eccentric family. He has always felt like he is out of step with the rest of the world and that just getting through the day is a struggle. He said that he sees things differently and it just baffles him that others don't see the same things that he does. He worries about our DD10 because he sees a lot of himself (as a kid) in her. He said middle school was when things went downhill for him (he started getting into trouble and eventually went to military school). He has always wanted us to homeschool but particularly during those times so they make better choices than he did. (He was kicked out of every public school they could find, and then all of the private schools as well). I think my DH would absolutely agree with her post (except he didn't cry).

 

Thank you. :001_smile:

 

I know the crying fit wasn't just over my daughter's wiring. At the time, she had GI issues that could very easily be fatal. I was being told she would have issues far worse than what she does now, and I was dealing with all of that pretty much by myself because my DH was working every minute he was allowed to try to afford her needs. I had watched and been in denial that she was like me. I was trying hard not to see it. One day my husband comes in from work, and after seeing her at play he let go an "OMG, her brain works just like yours." It was too much on top of everything else. I didn't have any real help or support growing up, so I thought that she was going to have my childhood and there wasn't anything I could do to make it easier. I have since figured out that the fact that I am wired like her helps tremendously simply because there is someone else in her life broadcasting on her frequency who has been around the block a few times. I can encourage her to be braver than I was because I know how much I missed out on because of that fear and anxiety, and she has a better childhood and a better social life than I did because we work through the issues instead of sweeping them under the rug the way it happened when I was a child.

[mamajag]

I'm talking more about relationships that are a two way street. You talk to me about your kids and your struggles with their issues and I talk about mine. Don't make it a one sided relationship because you can't relate to what I'm going through or because you're jealous of my kid's intelligence. And don't assume that my challenges are not real.

 

:iagree::iagree::iagree: This is all most parents of gifted children want…a chance to take part in these exchanges without it being misconstrued as something it is not.

[Catwoman]

I do know parents who really are bragging in order to show how their kids are better than your kids. Typically they are not the parents of profoundly gifted kids (who in my experience generally do not share for some of the reasons you mentioned.) But they are not doing it to share a journey, they are doing it to show up their kids. I don't think that is helpful to anyone, the kids included.

 

We do need to accept all learners and we need to be able to share the journey with one another. However, we need to stop using our kids to compete and stop judging ourselves based on our kids accomplishments, too.

 

:iagree: :iagree: :iagree:

 

I think it's usually relatively easy to tell which parents are bragging, because they also tend to go on and on about every wonderful thing they own, every vacation that was clearly better than your vacation to the same place they visited, their perfect car, their perfect house, and their fabulous good looks.

 

Sincere is nice. Obnoxious is not nice. It really has nothing to do with the kids. The parent who brags to no end about her gifted child would also be the biggest drama queen about how she is Martyr Mother of the Year because she works so hard with her learning disabled child. Because, ultimately, the bragging has nothing to do with the children; it's all about the mom wanting you to think she is better than you are.

[jenbrdsly]

I'm the OP of this thread (but NOT the mean spirited Baby Center.com blogger). Everyone's comments have been so meaningful for me to read. Thank you! I feel like I should bookmark this page and read it again when I'm having a rough day. It is so helpful to hear from other moms and dads who struggle with the same issues I do.

[mamajag]

Sorry, was typing quickly, I meant to include parenthesis with "I know this is not what you said". I was not trying to impute it to you, I am sorry if it ended up that way. :)

 

I sort of get irked (but that is my problem, on my side of the fence, not your problem :)) when I see the identification of atypical intellect with a particular disposition / personality, which I thought your post did in a way (but perhaps I was wrong).

 

In this thread, most of my thoughts have been regarding my experiences and that of/with dd1 and not intended to be a statement that intelligence=weirdness. I give my example only because the attitude I get most often when forced to share in these comparative situations is that if you have a child that's labelled gifted all of a sudden you are on parenting easy street and will never have a struggle again. For the record, dd2 and ds will likely nearly equal dd1, but they are much more natural and charming socially so people don't instantly realize how far ahead they are. I am most often told how witty and clever they are. I am very happy that they can blend so easily and relate to others so well. It's something I'd love for dd1.

 

Dd1 is that stereotypical, awkward kid by default and so was I. Our minds are wired so similarly that I can see where the trouble's about to appear and handle it preemptively. Dd1 has said that my ability to get into her head is spooky. She crashed at public K because teacher interaction and her need for perfection clashed. She shut down. She was half way through the first year of ballet before she learned any of the girls' names because she froze up trying to figure out what to say. I gave her ideas of what to say and then we practiced them. She had some remnants of speech issues at the time so the practice made her feel comfortable that she could pronounce all of the words without tripping over her tongue. I had to remind her that she did have some things she liked that kids her age liked such as collecting Pet Shop pets and Hello Kitty things. Over the last few years, she's really blossomed and can handle almost any social situation. She still draws on my ideas for conversation starters, though. She feels comfortable with them and has met a lot of cool people that way. She has told me that being around most kids is an act for her. She likes to be around them and she has fun, but she makes it a point to familiarize herself with stuff she doesn't really care about so she can participate in their conversations. She's realized that in order to have these relationships, she has to leave a part of her behind. She can't show up to ballet all excited about what happens when two galaxies collide. What she really wants is to make friends with a child her age who is just as intense and excited by knowledge as she is. She wants someone she can relate to without having to do the social hokey pokey and leave out what really makes her tick. I don't blame her for that.

[beaners]

I'm talking more about relationships that are a two way street. You talk to me about your kids and your struggles with their issues and I talk about mine. Don't make it a one sided relationship because you can't relate to what I'm going through or because you're jealous of my kid's intelligence. And don't assume that my challenges are not real.

 

:iagree::iagree::iagree: This is all most parents of gifted children want…a chance to take part in these exchanges without it being misconstrued as something it is not.

 

I think this is the biggest problem for me right now, and I'd only call my daughters bright, although a few here recently informed me that my "normal" is skewed. :001_smile: I have always found normal conversations with most people exhausting. A dearly missed friend once told me that he loved how my mind worked. I had just explained that I think diagonally and forget to connect those in-between skips for other people. You know how you can connect some facts in one linear progression, and others branch off from some of those points, and still others branch out from there? I have to take care when I am talking that I don't switch three or four planes without leaving any indication of where I'm coming from. And see, I don't know if I even explained that in a way that anyone can follow.

 

I can do shallow and superficial conversations all day long, but it tires me to talk on a somewhat intimate level with a friend and still be rethinking everything I say. Am I allowed to share my cute stories and mischief too? How can I say everything safely? Can I say anything safely? Am I being silly for even thinking certain things my children are doing are out of the ordinary? Is it conceited for me to worry about offending people with my normal, bright children? It is exhausting.

 

Maybe other people deal with this all the time without trouble, and it's some deficiency on my part to struggle with this. Does everyone come away from every conversation hoping you haven't said something odd or something that could be construed in a way you hadn't intended? It seems like almost everyone I talk with just lets everything out with very minimal filtering.

[Soror]

I think if you leave a conversation and your worried about offending someone it is likely you haven't. I think those that are offensive are the ones that when they leave a conversation are wondering if they impressed someone with their awesomeness. If that isn't your attitude then I wouldn't worry.

[Dmmetler]

What I find interesting is that the single two parents I know IRL who truly "Get" DD and understand my frustrations-who I CAN vent to even about things that, for ME are real concerns, but that probably do seem like bragging if stated flat out-are the ones you'd expect to understand the least because they're the ones who's children have serious issues. But the fear for the future, the frustration, the lack of feeling in control-that's real. They understand the feeling of embarrassment when your kid doesn't fit in and the "Why can't she just blend in for once" feelings-and then the feeling ashamed because you're the child's parent and if you can't accept them, who can? That's real. The only difference is the reason behind it.

[Soror]

What I find interesting is that the single two parents I know IRL who truly "Get" DD and understand my frustrations-who I CAN vent to even about things that, for ME are real concerns, but that probably do seem like bragging if stated flat out-are the ones you'd expect to understand the least because they're the ones who's children have serious issues. But the fear for the future, the frustration, the lack of feeling in control-that's real. They understand the feeling of embarrassment when your kid doesn't fit in and the "Why can't she just blend in for once" feelings-and then the feeling ashamed because you're the child's parent and if you can't accept them, who can? That's real. The only difference is the reason behind it.

 

I don't see how any of that could be construed as bragging. I try to keep my own motivations and intentions pure, you cannot control what people perceive though. We all carry our own baggage. Someone who has scars from being that isolated gifted child will be more apt to feel offense about such things. Someone with special needs kids will also be likely to hear offense even when none is meant. It is hard to change that. You cannot keep from offending people sometimes, it is just life.

 

I try to keep in mind my own sensitivities and assume the best about people and avoid people that like to one-up me about everything. The ones who are constantly reminding you that you are your children are less than them whether it is because you are not as smart, pretty, rich etc.

[Greta]

Lots of people in this thread have expressed their frustration at not being able to talk about their gifted kids without offending, and I must admit that really surprises me. Maybe more people than I realized are as envious as the woman who wrote the article. But please know that many of us are not! My goodness, I should like to think I would be as open and supportive of hearing about your gifted child as I am about hearing about the struggles of raising ANY child. I may not understand from a perspective of personal experience, but I will listen with empathy all the same.

 

I know two families with gifted children, and I've never been the least bit offended or uncomfortable with anything that they have shared with me. But they have shared in a sincere way, talking to me as an equal, without any judgment or superiority on their part. On the other hand, I have encountered a woman who likes to START conversations by relating her children's IQs. :001_rolleyes: Please. I know haughtiness and boasting when I see it. And I do not wish to be used as a sounding board for anyone's bragging, for any reason.

 

So I guess I'm just saying that if some parents seem touchy, maybe that's why. Maybe they've endured boasting before? Maybe they are suffering from the same disappointment as the woman who wrote that article.? If it's the former, I hope they will get over it as they get to know you better. If it's the latter, then my sympathy is for their children. No child should bear the burden of their parents' disappointment. That is what I found most upsetting about the article.

[Happy2BaMom]

It is hard to educate a child who is on the gifted end of the bell curve but for kids on that end the world is their oyster. There is nothing limiting what they can achieve and accomplish. A lot of schools do not meet their needs but they still will be accelerated and get into good colleges and they can achieve anything they want. They tend to make more money and they are more successful.

Sorry, but this type of mis-information about gifted children makes me grit my teeth. When I got my MS Ed., I found out that gifted children drop out of school with nearly the same frequency as inner-city children. Many of them spend decades of their lives bored out of their minds, wasting time, underfulfilled, underchallenged, and entirely punished and beat down any time that they seek out more stimulation. After years of having their NEEDS denied, they drop out, no longer seeing the point of participating in a system that wastes their time and produces nothing of value for them.

 

Their NEEDS are not met. Why is this no big deal, just because they are gifted?

 

And where are your sources for stating that "they tend to make more money and are more successful?"

 

There is a world of difference between children who are bright - whose needs can be met in a normal classroom and who often go on to live successful lives - and children who are 'outliers', typically considered to be the top 2% (or higher) in both IQ and academic achievement. They have the same struggle to find a life that works as does any other child who fits into the extremes of other bell curves. And the assumption that they are "just fine because they're already so smart" only hurts them.

 

Depression, acts of self-destruction, and maladaption plague many truly gifted children. You could ask me how I know, but then I might be accused of bragging.

Edited February 16, 2012 by Happy2BaMom

[shinyhappypeople]

Honestly, I see most of the talk about 'gifted' as another shot in the Mommy Wars.

 

Yes, there are some kids that are off the charts, and they represent educational and parental challenges.

 

Then there's the type I'm most familiar w/, *everything* Jr does is award worthy, he's always done *everything* ahead of everyone else on the planet, Einstein should have stuck to eating library paste by the time this kid hits 3rd grade, yadda, yadda, yadda.

 

Oh, and this kid is usually also being offered modelling contracts on the street, and the Oilers already want him for their farm team, but insist that he's completely toliet trained first...which, since he's only 10 mths old, will be in the next hr or two...

 

:lol:

 

Bingo.

 

True intellectual giftedness is pretty unusual, and yet it seems like every other child is gifted these days. I think part of the irritation and skepticism I feel stems from the absolute hordes of genius children who have suddenly appeared on the planet.

[Cassy]

:lol:

 

Bingo.

 

True intellectual giftedness is pretty unusual, and yet it seems like every other child is gifted these days. I think part of the irritation and skepticism I feel stems from the absolute hordes of genius children who have suddenly appeared on the planet.

 

Shh! Careful, your idiosyncratic view of 'giftedness' is showing :leaving:.

 

:D

 

Cassy

[OLG]

The Accelerated Learner Board has been talking about a rather mean spirited blog post on Baby Center.Com called I Hate Hearing About Your Gifted Child. I have written my own response to this post, which I titled Gifted Children Deserve Compassion and Understanding.

in my mind, saying your child is gifted is not actually bragging at all. It's an explanation for the long and difficult road of challenging school and social choices a child has ahead of him.

 

Thank you - well said!!:iagree:

[CAMom]

Depression, acts of self-destruction, and maladaption plague many truly gifted children. You could ask me how I know, but then I might be accused of bragging.

 

:grouphug:Relating...:grouphug:

[LisaKinVA]

I'm having one of those CARP! moments, but because of what it relates to if I dared talk about it in public, I'm sure most people would think I'd be bragging. Problem being, I feel like hyperventilating. And most people would NOT understand why. I'm sure, when everything settles down, I'll be fine. But in the moment between the discovery of what my 8yo has been up to, and the moment everything is fine. I am NOT fine, and have nowhere to go, other than dh...who is at work, and can't talk. It's a very isolating feeling.

 

True intellectual giftedness is pretty unusual, and yet it seems like every other child is gifted these days. I think part of the irritation and skepticism I feel stems from the absolute hordes of genius children who have suddenly appeared on the planet.

 

I'm still struggling to determine what you mean by "True intellectual gifteness". There are fairly objective standards as to what it means, but when you write, I feel like you are putting your own personal spin on it. It comes across as rather snarky. But, of course, I may be completely misinterpreting what you say.

 

My children are not PG. but they are far enough on that bell curve that we were told in no uncertain terms, by the local school, to keep them home. We were told that "traditional" schooling would be the absolute worst thing for them. I suppose I should be grateful that they admitted that much to me, because it took away any latent guilt I might have had about homeschooling.

 

But, my children are made to feel "ashamed" because of where they are.

 

It hurts that my oldest son is mocked (he's too sweet to really say anything back, he wants badly to be accepted, and he doesn't understand why his "friends" say what they do). It hurts that people go out of their way to shut him down. Some of the adults in his life "get" him. In fact, the first time they met him, they pulled us aside to tell us that he "had stripes on his shoulders." There are also some that go out of their way to to really help him, despite his "age," while others who refuse because he is "so young."

 

It hurts that my dd is only accepted as long as she keeps to herself about what she's reading, or learning and has to "nod" and agree with her GS friends about how difficult long multiplication is. It hurts that when she attempts to have a conversation with an adult they do the :001_huh:, and then give her the equivalent of a "patronizing pat on the head" response. Most adults don't get her, the few that do, she clings to. She's a loving, thoughtful girl, but instead of being herself, has learned how to hide and blend into groups. I keep hoping that one day, she'll meet someone like her. And yes, she is acutely aware that she doesn't have any "real" friends, she has people she can play with on a superficial level, but no "real" friends.

 

I'm not sad because of their gifts... I'm sad that they have to actively learn how to avoid being mocked, put down, ostracized, and made to feel like THEY are the problem. I'm sad, because if my child was really excited about learning something far outside the "norm" from his friends, and wanted to share, such sharing is automatically deemed "bragging." Their excitement is met with a sneer, and the words, "Well, but you're smart." The feeling behind those words is, "so, what?" BUT, his friends who are equally excited about mastering their times tables are given high-fives and told how GREAT their achievements are. My children see the differences, and it affects them.

 

If you think this type of thing doesn't occur...you are sadly mistaken.

Edited February 16, 2012 by LisaK in VA

[SKL]

Giftedness may or may not pave the way to an easily successful adulthood.

 

My brother has always been a spacey professor type and had loads of trouble throughout school and in his professional life. His second grade teacher threatened to fail him for not doing his homework, which he found painfully juvenile. He learned to keep his thoughts to himself, but would occasionally explode with anger which nobody understood. His grades were borderline, except for subjects he really liked. As a college student he attracted the weirdest friends on the planet and was shunned by "normal people." In the military he began drinking socially and was eventually labeled an alcoholic. He was fired from his first post-military job for just not getting it. He had a rough time in the next job as well. He is a top expert in his field, but knowing the techinical part of it better than everyone is not enough.

 

He now has his own business and a few loyal and understanding (but demanding) clients. His 16yo kid is even smarter than he is, and can barely speak a full sentence (without having read it in an encyclopedia first). He's in danger of getting kicked out of his gifted high school for the same reason my brother almost failed 2nd grade. Easy? No, not always.

[gardenmom5]

Originally Posted by MistyMountain

It is hard to educate a child who is on the gifted end of the bell curve but for kids on that end the world is their oyster. There is nothing limiting what they can achieve and accomplish. A lot of schools do not meet their needs but they still will be accelerated and get into good colleges and they can achieve anything they want. They tend to make more money and they are more successful.

 

:confused::confused::confused: what planet do you live on? I have a gifted son with learning disabilities. Get past those LD's, and he is brilliant. the attitude you have is that gifted and LD cannot coexist in the same child. They often do. Children with unmet LD needs struggle to learn -no matter how brilliant or "gifted" they may be. "but gifted children don't have LD's" is a very common attitude. because of the unmet LD's, they are repeatedly fed the message they are lazy and they are stupid. Utterly ironic given they can be brilliant, but their needs aren't being met in multiple areas.

My son had "gifted" teachers who had that same attitude as you.

 

Sorry, but this type of mis-information about gifted children makes me grit my teeth. When I got my MS Ed., I found out that gifted children drop out of school with nearly the same frequency as inner-city children. Many of them spend decades of their lives bored out of their minds, wasting time, underfulfilled, underchallenged, and entirely punished and beat down any time that they seek out more stimulation. After years of having their NEEDS denied, they drop out, no longer seeing the point of participating in a system that wastes their time and produces nothing of value for them.

 

Their NEEDS are not met. Why is this no big deal, just because they are gifted?

 

And where are your sources for stating that "they tend to make more money and are more successful?"

 

There is a world of difference between children who are bright - whose needs can be met in a normal classroom and who often go on to live successful lives - and children who are 'outliers', typically considered to be the top 2% (or higher) in both IQ and academic achievement. They have the same struggle to find a life that works as does any other child who fits into the extremes of other bell curves. And the assumption that they are "just fine because they're already so smart" only hurts them.

 

Depression, acts of self-destruction, and maladaption plague many truly gifted children. You could ask me how I know, but then I might be accused of bragging.

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

[gardenmom5]

I read an edition of Orson Scott Card's Ender's Game that had author's notes in the back that had some very unique insights. For those unfamiliar - the book is about some extremely gifted children.

 

in the author's notes, he received many snarky and denigrating comments from teachers of "gifted" children about how little he understood these children. He ALSO included some notes from gifted teens thanking him for "getting" them when no one else did.

[shinyhappypeople]

I'm having one of those CARP! moments, but because of what it relates to if I dared talk about it in public, I'm sure most people would think I'd be bragging. Problem being, I feel like hyperventilating. And most people would NOT understand why. I'm sure, when everything settles down, I'll be fine. But in the moment between the discovery of what my 8yo has been up to, and the moment everything is fine. I am NOT fine, and have nowhere to go, other than dh...who is at work, and can't talk. It's a very isolating feeling.

 

 

 

I'm still struggling to determine what you mean by "True intellectual gifteness". There are fairly objective standards as to what it means, but when you write, I feel like you are putting your own personal spin on it. It comes across as rather snarky. But, of course, I may be completely misinterpreting what you say.

 

 

:grouphug: I'm sorry my post hurt you.

 

Yes, there are objective standards by which we define academic giftedness. I'm not disputing that at all. It's just that whether your child is gifted or not has become fodder for the Mommy Wars and it seems like far more children are being labeled by the parents (not necc. on this forum!!) as gifted than is statistically possible. That's why I feel cynical about this issue.

 

I do know first hand how frustrating and difficult it can be to be academically gifted, as do my husband and younger DD. My older DD has the unique (and IMO worse) struggle of dealing with younger sister passing her up academically. I think on the Suck-Scale, that would suck worse.

 

Having said all that, I'm sorry your kids are struggling :(

[Maus]

Ai, ai, ai. I have so many thoughts going through my head right now that it's hard to pick one.

 

I don't think the general public is particularly well educated about learning disabilities, or Aspergers, or Autism, etc., but they are considerably more educated on those things than they are about giftedness, being twice exceptional, Over-excitabilities, etc. Wouldn't it be wonderful if they were at least that knowledgeable about the latter?

 

There is a boy who attends church with us who is a couple of years older than my son. This boy has Aspergers. He gets away with all kinds of stuff, including bullying, because he has Aspergers. My son leaves class with his hands over his ears because the noise level got too high, and he "has a behavior problem." We have a similar situation at co-op.

 

I don't have a need to say, "I'm sorry. The noise hurts his ears because he's gifted," but I would like to be able to say, "I'm sorry. The noise hurts his ears because he has a sensory over-excitibility," and have it generate the same sympathy and semi-understanding the other boy's mother gets when she says, "He doesn't know his boundaries. He has Aspergers."

 

Or to have his teachers say, "Let's watch the noise level," to the class instead of, "If your son can't behave, you'll have to remove him from this class," to me, which happened at co-op.

 

I really don't care if anyone besides me knows if he's smart or not. I just want to be able to name what's happening, and have that be an acceptable reason to work with him, accommodate him, help him.

Edited February 16, 2012 by Maus

[Greta]

I read an edition of Orson Scott Card's Ender's Game that had author's notes in the back that had some very unique insights. For those unfamiliar - the book is about some extremely gifted children.

 

in the author's notes, he received many snarky and denigrating comments from teachers of "gifted" children about how little he understood these children. He ALSO included some notes from gifted teens thanking him for "getting" them when no one else did.

 

I was thinking about this today too! I read that book years and years ago, and it was always one of my favorites. I recently bought a newer edition for my daughter, and found the author's notes really fascinating.

 

 

Yes, there are objective standards by which we define academic giftedness. I'm not disputing that at all. It's just that whether your child is gifted or not has become fodder for the Mommy Wars and it seems like far more children are being labeled by the parents (not necc. on this forum!!) as gifted than is statistically possible. That's why I feel cynical about this issue.

 

I think there's definitely some confusion about the term. *I* take it to mean a certain IQ. I don't know exactly what that IQ is, but a really uncommonly high IQ! But I know parents who will use the term if their child is ahead one grade level in one subject, or if their child is in the honors program at school. I don't think that's what it means. But they clearly do.

[Maus]

I think there's definitely some confusion about the term. *I* take it to mean a certain IQ. I don't know exactly what that IQ is, but a really uncommonly high IQ! But I know parents who will use the term if their child is ahead one grade level in one subject, or if their child is in the honors program at school. I don't think that's what it means. But they clearly do.

To add to the confusion, different I.Q. tests give you different scores. See the chart here at Hoagies.

 

The following is probably how most would define it, as it matches up pretty well with the old Stanford-Binet they've used to test I.Q. for decades:

 

Mildly Gifted -- 115 to 129

Moderately Gifted -- 130 to 144

Highly Gifted -- 145 to 159

Exceptionally Gifted -- 160 to 179

Profoundly Gifted -- 180

 

(The article where I found that chart is at: http://giftedkids.about.com/od/gifted101/qt/IQ_scores.htm )

 

The so-called gifted programs in public schools tend to best accommodate those whose I.Q.s fall between 115-140, which is about the same range that most of the highly-publicized successful "genius" entrepreneurs tend to fall into. It's also about the range defined as "socially optimal intelligence." (That range is 125-150.)

[Greta]

To add to the confusion, different I.Q. tests give you different scores. See the chart here at Hoagies.

 

The following is probably how most would define it, as it matches up pretty well with the old Stanford-Binet they've used to test I.Q. for decades:

 

Mildly Gifted -- 115 to 129

Moderately Gifted -- 130 to 144

Highly Gifted -- 145 to 159

Exceptionally Gifted -- 160 to 179

Profoundly Gifted -- 180

 

(The article where I found that chart is at: http://giftedkids.about.com/od/gifted101/qt/IQ_scores.htm )

 

The so-called gifted programs in public schools tend to best accommodate those whose I.Q.s fall between 115-140, which is about the same range that most of the highly-publicized successful "genius" entrepreneurs tend to fall into. It's also about the range defined as "socially optimal intelligence." (That range is 125-150.)

 

Thank you for this information! I honestly didn't know, but would have guessed that "gifted" classifications would have started at 140 or higher.