Outdoorsy Type Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 a middle aged man without kids hanging out in the kids section of a library, and asking little boys (who don't have a parent standing close by) to play chess with them? I walked into the kids area, went to grab a few books I needed on a certain topic but let my almost 8yo "loose" to browse for his own books because it's what I would consider a fairly safe area. Except this time I heard him talking about making chess moves and it occurred to me that I hadn't seen any other children his age in this area. When I walked back out of the aisle I saw it was about a 50yo man who looked fairly intelligent. I called my child to me and told him we had to go to the adult section of the library, and then told the librarian about him. Security made him leave the section and he left the library completely. We had a major discussion in the car about not talking to/playing with adults we don't know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leav97 Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 9-10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catwoman Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 It would rank pretty high on my creep-o-meter... maybe about a 13 on the 1-10 scale. It could be completely innocent, but I would never take that chance. You did the right thing by reporting him immediately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsinkable Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 11 Men should know better than to do this. If he wants to play/teach/mentor young people, he should do it thru an established program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsmith Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Definitely a 10! That would have freaked me out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elegantlion Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 10 and up, and I'm not that creeped out by many things. The fact he completely left the library when asked to leave would make me more leery. At least you alerted the librarians and hopefully they will be on the watch out should he return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trresh Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 A total 10 but I'm the paranoid type. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXBeth Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 It depends. If the chess boards belong to the library and are set up in the children's section, I don't think it's weird that the guy was hanging out there and asking whoever came by (including kids) if they wanted to play chess. If the guy brought his own chess board and decided to set it up in the kids' section, a little creepier, but it still wouldn't really bother me. I don't know why. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeeBeaks Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 A 1 without further information. Was he browsing the shelves? Could he be picking out books for his child or grandchild? Some of my children's peers have much older parents. Was the rest of the library full and he sat in there? That happens a *lot* in our little library. So just an adult male, older male or any other person in the children's section does not at all set off alarms for me without further information. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outdoorsy Type Posted December 9, 2011 Author Share Posted December 9, 2011 Okay that makes me feel validated in how freaked out I am right now. He was playing chess with the guy for a few minutes before I realized it. No idea what he told this guy, and this is my 7yo who doesn't understand social norms/cues. :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristyB in TN Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 I'm not paranoid at all and am very practical...this was a either a stupid man or a sick one. You did the right thing. You may have save a child from a terrible nightmare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outdoorsy Type Posted December 9, 2011 Author Share Posted December 9, 2011 This is a library owned chess board, and it's normal for kids to play together. That's my sons favorite part of the library. From what I can tell, this guy was sitting by the boards waiting for children to walk by. I wouldn't have minded if I were standing next to my kid and he asked to play. I wouldn't have minded if it were in the general area of the library. I think I'm more paranoid because there have been predators at our local kids play areas. (McD's CFA) that have preyed on children who were playing in the room without parents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Dominion Heather Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 A 1 without further information. Was he browsing the shelves? Could he be picking out books for his child or grandchild? Some of my children's peers have much older parents. Was the rest of the library full and he sat in there? That happens a *lot* in our little library. So just an adult male, older male or any other person in the children's section does not at all set off alarms for me without further information. I agree. This by itself would not freak me out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Dominion Heather Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 This is a library owned chess board, and it's normal for kids to play together. That's my sons favorite part of the library. From what I can tell, this guy was sitting by the boards waiting for children to walk by. Maybe he just wanted to play chess. I really hate that, when it comes to men, we always think the worst first. It makes me sad for my sons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalanamak Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 I'll say 5, because I could have seen my father doing that. I could see my oblivious husband doing that. He loves to play chess with kids, and can barely read. If he was forced to wait at the library for something, I could certainly see him doing that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spaceman Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 5? It wouldn't outright alarm me, but I'd keep in eyeshot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsinkable Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Maybe he just wanted to play chess. I really hate that, when it comes to men, we always think the worst first. It makes me sad for my sons. The world $uck$. Last summer, some people from this board told me that they wouldn't help a teen girl who asked to borrow a cell phone because she was sick. This was my DD. The people had bad experiences with teen girls faking illness to commit crime. I understand why the people said it but believe me it has given me some sleepless nights wondering if she ever has another seizure alone, in public, if anyone will help her. ETA: It was also mentioned that it was suspicious that a teen girl didn't have a cell phone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennsmile Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 In our library children under the age of 10 have to be supervised. Granted I may be in the childrens room but they may be out of sight. They have a chess set in the lobby area so if a guy was in the kids section trying to play a game I would be freaked out. Last time I went it was quiet in the Children's room no librarian but usually there is one if not 2 in that room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
butterflymommy Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Without more information-- 1. Your son might have missed out on a free grandmaster lesson! If the board is library owned and already set up in plain view, I don't see any concern at all. The poor guy, I feel bad for him being chased out of the library! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennsmile Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 The world $uck$. Last summer, some people from this board told me that they wouldn't help a teen girl who asked to borrow a cell phone because she was sick. This was my DD. The people had bad experiences with teen girls faking illness to commit crime. I understand why the people said it but believe me it has given me some sleepless nights wondering if she ever has another seizure alone, in public, if anyone will help her. How awful. Just so you know there are good people in the world. When my brother was in a neighbor hood far from his home(as in another state), he was struck by lightning and complete strangers came to his aid and did CPR till the ambulance arrived. So I pray if your daughter ever finds herself in need help will be there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Element Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 I'll say 5, because I could have seen my father doing that. I could see my oblivious husband doing that. He loves to play chess with kids, and can barely read. If he was forced to wait at the library for something, I could certainly see him doing that. :iagree:5 here, too. However, I only allow my dc to be in situations with a creepiness factor of ZERO, so I think you did the right thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest submarines Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 (edited) This is a library owned chess board, and it's normal for kids to play together. That's my sons favorite part of the library. From what I can tell, this guy was sitting by the boards waiting for children to walk by. I wouldn't have minded if I were standing next to my kid and he asked to play. I wouldn't have minded if it were in the general area of the library. I think I'm more paranoid because there have been predators at our local kids play areas. (McD's CFA) that have preyed on children who were playing in the room without parents. I'd say about 3. I'd introduce myself, hang around and observe, and later discuss with DS about how he felt about the encounter, and proceed from there. It was an otherwise safe area, you were there. I would let my child to finish the game (if no other red flats were raised). Maybe the man was waiting for his son or niece there? Saw another chess lover, offered to play a game to pass his time? It is not like he tried to lure your son away from the library, or suggested anything inappropriate. Protecting the Gift by De Becker is a must to read. Teaching children not to ever talk to adults puts them into a greater risk. Edited December 9, 2011 by sunflowers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsinkable Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 How awful. Just so you know there are good people in the world. When my brother was in a neighbor hood far from his home(as in another state), he was struck by lightning and complete strangers came to his aid and did CPR till the ambulance arrived. So I pray if your daughter ever finds herself in need help will be there. Thanks Was your brother OK? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer3141 Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Without more information-- 1. Your son might have missed out on a free grandmaster lesson! If the board is library owned and already set up in plain view, I don't see any concern at all. The poor guy, I feel bad for him being chased out of the library! :iagree::iagree: I think it was odd and I most likely would have gone up to the man and introduced myself and my son and gotten a feel for his intentions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest submarines Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 The world $uck$. Last summer, some people from this board told me that they wouldn't help a teen girl who asked to borrow a cell phone because she was sick. This was my DD. The people had bad experiences with teen girls faking illness to commit crime. I understand why the people said it but believe me it has given me some sleepless nights wondering if she ever has another seizure alone, in public, if anyone will help her. ETA: It was also mentioned that it was suspicious that a teen girl didn't have a cell phone. :grouphug: The world has turned into something completely and utterly bizarre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unsinkable Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 :grouphug: The world has turned into something completely and utterly bizarre. Indeed. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMamaBird Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 I'd say about a Creeper Level 8. He MIGHT have been a perfectly harmless gentleman, but I wouldn't have let my kids play alone with him. No way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outdoorsy Type Posted December 9, 2011 Author Share Posted December 9, 2011 Thanks for the suggestion about Protecting The Gift. I'll have to check it out.:) FWIW I wasn't the one who chased the guy out. I asked the librarian if he came in with a child because he seemed to be alone, and she called security because he wasn't supposed to be there. It's a rule listed on the board outside the room that you must be with a child to go in the children's area. I actually did stand close by and listen /observe the situation for about a minute, and never could hear the man talking. Just DS replying to him. That's when I talked to the librarian who was nearby. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 I do not find this particularly creepy and I think it is really sad that people who want to interact with children are automatically viewed with suspicion, especially men. I can think of many innocent reasons why the man asked children to play chess. He may have wanted to play, or teach them, or miss his own children whom he lost through death or divorce or growing up. And he also may have been not quite as a dept at reading social clues and have no idea that he is viewed as a creep. Some adults may be socially awkward and because of that feel more at ease with children. If I would have been at the library and my son had shown an interest, I would have encouraged him to play while I browsed books - a public library is a pretty safe place. It's not as if he asked the kid to get in his car and play chess at his home, is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalanamak Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 :iagree:5 here, too. However, I only allow my dc to be in situations with a creepiness factor of ZERO, so I think you did the right thing. Well, my 5 was an average between 1 and 10. I've never been in a zero situation in my life. So, 10 for some guys, 1 for others. It would depend on the situation! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 It's a rule listed on the board outside the room that you must be with a child to go in the children's area. . Really? That seems ridiculous to me - it would mean that a parent is not even allowed to go in and pick up books for a sick child at home, or that a childless aunt is not allowed to browse to find a book her niece might like. I often stop by the library on my own and get books for my kids. I would be seriously offended if somebody told me I was not allowed to do this because the kids were not with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluegoat Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 I'd say about 3. I'd introduce myself, hang around and observe, and later discuss with DS about how he felt about the encounter, and proceed from there. It was an otherwise safe area, you were there. I would let my child to finish the game (if no other red flats were raised). Maybe the man was waiting for his son or niece there? Saw another chess lover, offered to play a game to pass his time? It is not like he tried to lure your son away from the library, or suggested anything inappropriate. Protecting the Gift by De Becker is a must to read. Teaching children not to ever talk to adults puts them into a greater risk. :iagree: I think teaching kids not to speak to adults is a good way to end up with a very weird and anti-social society. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluegoat Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Really? That seems ridiculous to me - it would mean that a parent is not even allowed to go in and pick up books for a sick child at home, or that a childless aunt is not allowed to browse to find a book her niece might like.I often stop by the library on my own and get books for my kids. I would be seriously offended if somebody told me I was not allowed to do this because the kids were not with me. I sometimes go there to get books for myself too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalanamak Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 I think it is really sad that people who want to interact with children are automatically viewed with suspicion, especially men. It is sad, but I understand the anxiety. Hubby said that for the miserable year between his divorce and meeting me, he was so lonely for "family" company, he used to spend evenings searching through the infants clothes at Goodwill etc, just to be around mothers and children. I recall a story in Roughing It where men lined up outside a shack to peek in and see an actual (matronly) WOMAN cooking. It had been months and months since they'd even seen a woman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outdoorsy Type Posted December 9, 2011 Author Share Posted December 9, 2011 You know you are right that I do go sans kids sometimes and pick up books for them or for a class. The librarian just seemed worried about the guy and said he wasn't allowed to be there. Maybe that is why I started getting a bit more concerned. Her reaction makes me wonder if he had been told not to be there before. She thanked me for telling her before I left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reign Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 (edited) Totally a 10. Super creepy. I think its fine to be in the room. But seeking out kids to play with is a bit much. Edited December 9, 2011 by reign Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murphy101 Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Maybe he just wanted to play chess. I really hate that, when it comes to men, we always think the worst first. It makes me sad for my sons. Me too. :( If I didn't get a sicko vibe, I'd rate that a neutral 5 and stick around to see the game. With a sicko vibe, I don't care what he was doing, that's the end of that. Sadly, my 17 year old enjoys a casual game of chess and I can easily see him doing that. Dh and I have had to explain to him that though there is nothing wrong with him, our society is crazy screwy in its view of men. :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murphy101 Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 You know you are right that I do go sans kids sometimes and pick up books for them or for a class. The librarian just seemed worried about the guy and said he wasn't allowed to be there. Maybe that is why I started getting a bit more concerned. Her reaction makes me wonder if he had been told not to be there before. She thanked me for telling her before I left. I'd bet money women without children would be allowed. It's because he was a man. Which isn't to say he didn't need watched or wasn't messed up. Simply saying I bet a woman wanting to engage kids in a public use chess game wouldn't have creeped anyone out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest submarines Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 You know you are right that I do go sans kids sometimes and pick up books for them or for a class. The librarian just seemed worried about the guy and said he wasn't allowed to be there. Maybe that is why I started getting a bit more concerned. Her reaction makes me wonder if he had been told not to be there before. She thanked me for telling her before I left. She probably reacted to your reaction. With all the fear of men who interact with children, she thouht that it was better to be safe, than make another patron uncomfortable. Totally PC approach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outdoorsy Type Posted December 10, 2011 Author Share Posted December 10, 2011 [quote name=Martha;3396933 Sadly' date=' my 17 year old enjoys a casual game of chess and I can easily see him doing that. Dh and I have had to explain to him that though there is nothing wrong with him, our society is crazy screwy in its view of men. :( I'm sure my 7yo is going to be like that, too. He is very social, but immature for his age and doesn't understand boundaries and social cues. He loves people and is very trusting. It makes me sad that I have to worry for his safety now, and sad again that someone might think he is a creep when he is older. :001_unsure: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K&Rs Mom Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 FWIW I wasn't the one who chased the guy out. I asked the librarian if he came in with a child because he seemed to be alone, and she called security because he wasn't supposed to be there. It's a rule listed on the board outside the room that you must be with a child to go in the children's area. I would hate this policy. I go to the library to get school stuff, sometimes with the kids, sometimes without. The original situation wouldn't have bothered me, especially if I was in the same room. I encourage my kids to talk to strangers (actually based on Protecting the Gift), just not to go anywhere with them. If someone (regardless of gender) wanted to play chess, I'd be glad they could learn something and be part of the community. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
In2why Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 Maybe he just wanted to play chess. I really hate that, when it comes to men, we always think the worst first. It makes me sad for my sons. I agree. I believe in being cautious, but this is a public library and a public chess board. I would be curious and introduce myself to the man, have a conversation, thank him for playing chess with my son, and keep an eye out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outdoorsy Type Posted December 10, 2011 Author Share Posted December 10, 2011 She probably reacted to your reaction. With all the fear of men who interact with children, she thouht that it was better to be safe, than make another patron uncomfortable. Totally PC approach. I can see your view point, but I wasn't overly freaked out when I asked her about the guy. It was more that I was looking for a book and heard DS talking. I couldn't find the book on the topic I wanted and walked back to the librarian desk, which is about 20 feet from the chess table and asked the librarian for help locating said book. She was searching for the book when I inquired, and when she looked up at the guy she seemed worried. That said, I do believe it is possible that he was harmless. I admit that all the talk in the news about pervs scouting out/talking to boys makes me worry more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 a middle aged man without kids hanging out in the kids section of a library, and asking little boys (who don't have a parent standing close by) to play chess with them? . . . . I called my child to me and told him we had to go to the adult section of the library, and then told the librarian about him. Security made him leave the section and he left the library completely. . I hope security got a description and notified the police. I'd be checking the SO database. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Dominion Heather Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 If someone (regardless of gender) wanted to play chess, I'd be glad they could learn something and be part of the community. Yes! I'd be pleased they were interacting in the community. My kids would be ecstatic that someone wanted to play chess. Maybe you could have tried just taking to the man yourself? After all, talking to strangers is a very good thing and a good way to stay safe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elizabeth in MN Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 I have a friend, who is a father and in his fifties. His oldest is thirteen and the youngest just eight weeks old. Now, he would talk with kids and would offer to teach them card tricks, but he'd do it with parental consent first. Said friend looks "weird" because he has advanced Rheumatoid Arthritis and uses a walking stick. He also looks scruffy as all get out, but that's because he does historic re-enacting as part of home schooling the kids. My Mom is in her late sixties and would do all the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalanamak Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 After all, talking to strangers is a very good thing and a good way to stay safe. My son almost always asks me, later in the car, how I knew I could talk to that particular stranger. I point out appropriate behavior, other people in the area, etc. and all the other cues we use. Very important to learn, I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Lulu* Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 Based on your OP I'd say a 4 or 5. Based on the info. that the chess boards belong to the library, a 2. Based on the fact that the library has some asinine rule about the children's section I'm back to a 5. Without being there to see the man's demeanor myself, it is hard to know if there was something *off* about his actions. And, FTR, I cannot see how it is even legal to restrict adult access to books in a library. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SweetMissMagnolia Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 :iagree: totally creepy.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
In2why Posted December 10, 2011 Share Posted December 10, 2011 Really? That seems ridiculous to me - it would mean that a parent is not even allowed to go in and pick up books for a sick child at home, or that a childless aunt is not allowed to browse to find a book her niece might like.I often stop by the library on my own and get books for my kids. I would be seriously offended if somebody told me I was not allowed to do this because the kids were not with me. I only bring the kids maybe once a month and I go every week. This is one of my alone times to browse and enjoy my love of books. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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