HS Etiquette terminology - if I do this what are we called?

[Bang!Zoom!]

I'm about 89% sure right now we are going to be making a change, in about a week or so.

 

The kiddo's PS school experience isn't going so hot and is in deterioration at a furious pace.

 

I'm leaning toward changing "schools"- the "new" one is structured as two days on site, three days off for pure homeschooling flavor, but without the legal forms filled out for homeschooling....

 

In a legalistic sense, she would still be a PS student with full-time enrollment status.

 

So if we were to do this, what is our understood status...just for social/conversational purposes?

 

It is a true hybrid of styles, but I don't know what term would fit. I wouldn't want to offend by saying "we homeschool" when it's only part-time.

 

The other building is not a co-op, it has oversight by the PS district.

 

Would I just say, "Oh, we are mutts..":lol:

[Mama Geek]

I don't know what to call you, but I hope this solution will be much better for you than what you have been going through.

[Ellie]

I'd say go with what it really is: public school. You can clarify by saying that it's two days on campus, three days at home.

 

If you aren't having to comply with the homeschool law in your state, then your dd is a public school student. It's just clearer if you say it that way.

[TechWife]

Definitely public school.

[justasque]

What is it called in your state? If you can use the official legal name (like in PA we have public cyber-charter schools, homebound instruction, etc., which are publicly funded), that would be best. In a more colloquial sense (with non-homeschoolers, like the grocery check-out lady) you could say "we do a public school option where my dc go two days and do their assigned work at home with me for three days". It's cumbersome, but it makes it clear.

[Bang!Zoom!]

In conversation now if I say, "She is an afterschooler" people look at me like I have three heads. I think here, this board..is the only place anyone "gets" what that even begins to mean.

 

So thanks, I'm just going to stick with PS labeling and if I get any questions that are probing, I'll just say: "Google is your friend, lots of information online about it." And then drop it.

 

Thanks!

 

I think the "State" legal terminology for this program is ALE. It's an acronym for "Alternative Learning Environment."

 

If anyone is bored out of their mind today, here's a link to the FAQ for this PS ALE. :)

 

http://www.rsd.edu/homelink/about/faq/

Edited October 12, 2011 by one*mom

[chiguirre]

The 2-day a week school is called "university model" here. I think I'd say university model charter school and let the other person draw their own conclusions. Some hs groups welcome ps cyber-charter kids, some don't. You'll have to check locally to see if that's something you'd like to do for fieldtrips or park days.

[Bang!Zoom!]

I've gotten the impression by the Facebook page the Homeschool Association has set up that they are absolutely accepting of kids and families who attend this school.

 

There is such a huge range of home school families here - every possible combo I can mention from Thomas Jefferson style to WTM groups. (I haven't met any of them in person yet, but I see they are out there.)

 

There are 5 individuals on site there that help craft each learning program that is tailored to each child. I wrote ahead and asked if any of the 5 there were familiar with a Classical Model, or with WTM. I received an email yesterday that they would check about to be certain and respond back.

 

I haven't had any really good news in a while, so I am going to share a piece of good news now.

 

This place will tailor academic placement based on ability and individualize placement in each subject.

 

I'd be welcome to bring in say, SOTW and design a learning program together with them for the history section. We work together at whatever pace and level is appropriate in all subjects.

 

Can you believe that? I was absolutely stunned.

 

It does not go by age/grade level only. It goes by ability.

 

I had to re-read the email like 17 times as I thought I was having a delusion or hallucination.

 

We can use whatever materials or curricula we want.

 

Some of the classes there are providing textbooks.

 

Right now, as of today, she studies at school math and reading as 90 percent of the day. There is no Art, no History, etc. This is done because of the State testing. The school is bent on passing and producing percentiles for records.

 

The ALE we are exploring for example has American Girl as a one hour block for one semester for a history foundation. There's karate, cooking, sculpture, photography, EPGY math, drama, Lego Labs, dance, science, sports, STEM classes - there is just an insane amount of variation of experiences and courses there. Writing is offered by IEW for example. They also do Khan Academy as a choice.

 

It's a K-12 building.

 

We go on the 17th for an intro. We'll probably start on the 18th if I get my way.

 

And since I'm the MOM - lol - that's probably how it'll roll.

 

Parents are allowed in this building and are expected to pitch in.

[Tmhearn]

The term used here is "hybrid school."

[HS Mom in NC]

You are standing at "The Great Divide" in the HS community. You're going to get answers that basically fall into two categories:

 

1. HS is about location-if it's mostly at home it's HS.

2. HS is NOT about location-it's about parent led, parent funded, customized education.

 

Someone will inevitably respond to these generalizations with some variation on, "You can't go around making generalizations." I'm giving you the two camps and assuming you're smart enough to know there are always variations. Your OP indicates that you have probably run into people with opinions in the two camps because people in the variation category aren't usually the ones with the strong opinions.

 

Many of the people in this forum began their children in a ps environment and are willing to consider allowing their children to return there. Many have other children in ps and are only hsing some of their kids. Many are using ps online in their homes. They are more in the 1. category. Other HS communities online and IRL have a much larger percentage in category 2. You will need to be aware of this since you are concerned about the reactions of others.

 

The private school version of that here is "community school."

 

My personal take on the subject is:

 

What you are describing is public school. You're child is enrolled as a ps school student. The taxpayers are footing the bill for the staff and probably for materials. The government is ultimately in control of the content, schedule, curriculum, and teacher selection. Before you claim it's customized/individualized, ask this, "If I don't like what they're using for (insert academic subject here) can I replace it with the (insert the same academic subject here) curriculum of my choosing? Do I get to decide what is enough progress or is that ultimately approved by someone else?" If the answer is no, then I think your idea of customized/individualized is off.

 

You are not having to comply with hs law. You are not registered as a hser. You are not selecting the curriculum, the schedule, educational method, assessing what is adequate progress, etc. You are not paying 100% of the cost of the curriculum, materials, etc. HSLDA (not the only HS legal organiztion out there) will not accept your membership because you are indirectly taking government money and therefore, you are subject to government supervision.

 

In the end you can call yourself whatever you choose, but understand that whether you agree with them or not, there is a sizeable number of hsers that will not consider you a hser if you choose to label yourself as such. A few will be offended enough to say so.

[Crimson Wife]

The term used here is "hybrid school."

 

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

 

I wouldn't use the term "university model" because those are private Christian schools.

[Mergath]

There are a lot of people here that are vehemently anti-ps, to the point that if someone so much as gets a tax credit they wouldn't consider them hsers anymore. Don't let them get to you.

 

Don't worry so much about the labels. If it were me, I'd just say your kids go to a public school part-time, and homeschool part-time. But really, the program sounds great, I'm sure it will be a vast improvement. :001_smile:

[Ellie]

I wouldn't use the term "university model" because those are private Christian schools.

Exactly.

 

There's not a thing wrong with just saying what it is: she's enrolled in a public school that has two days on campus with the other days at home.

[Spy Car]

Would I just say, "Oh, we are mutts..":lol:

 

Well you sure as heck won't be an "after-schooler" anymore.

 

Don't even think about posting on that sub-forum, we won't have you! :D

 

And of course you will be a pariah with "homeschoolers."

 

You better beg for your own sub-forum, or you're toast :tongue_smilie:

 

Bill (who thinks it all gets a little silly)

[Ellie]

There are a lot of people here that are vehemently anti-ps, to the point that if someone so much as gets a tax credit they wouldn't consider them hsers anymore. Don't let them get to you.

At least for some of us, it isn't that we are anti-public school; it is that we have seen the problems when people enroll their dc in public schools while still calling themselves "homeschoolers." If your dc are enrolled in a public school, and you don't have to comply with whatever the homeschool laws are in your state, then you're legally not homeschooling. Those fine details do make a difference, and believe me when I tell you that the state knows the difference, too.

[Grover]

I don't know the answer to your question, but I sure wish there was an option like that here. I'm jealous.

[Bang!Zoom!]

Well you sure as heck won't be an "after-schooler" anymore.

 

Don't even think about posting on that sub-forum, we won't have you! :D

 

And of course you will be a pariah with "homeschoolers."

 

You better beg for your own sub-forum, or you're toast :tongue_smilie:

 

Bill (who thinks it all gets a little silly)

 

I need to send you flowers or something Bill, maybe a voucher for Amazon or something?

 

You made me laugh so hard I have tears rolling down my face here.

 

You are the best! Always say the perfect thing! :001_wub:

 

I've never had so much glee at the thought of being booted out!

[Lolly]

I like mutts. :D I get everyone confused all the time. In my state, we are technically and legally private schoolers. No one understand that because we are so obviously homeschoolers. Even my poor dh doesn't understand.:lol:

[EKS]

My younger son is enrolled in a similar program. We get no money for curriculum purchase and no lessons are planned for me. The school offers classes twice per week (afternoon only) that my son attends for social reasons. Legally my son is a full time public school student but for all practical purposes, I am homeschooling him. He is certainly not getting a public school education.

 

What you call yourself is partly based on the situation. In most circles, I say my son is homeschooled, because for all intents and purposes he is except for where the money goes (which is not anywhere near me).

[Veritaserum]

My kids attend a public charter school once a week for extracurricular classes (art, choir, dance, karate, theater, etc.). They do all their real school at home (math, language arts, history, science, etc.). I still call ourselves homeschoolers because I am doing the teaching for all of their academic subjects. "Dual enrollment" might work to describe what we are doing. Sometimes I say something like, "We homeschool on four days per week and they attend a charter school program on one day per week."

 

ETA: I plan and teach all of our home courses without any oversight from the charter school program. I can change things whenever I want without informing anyone.

Edited October 12, 2011 by Veritaserum

[JudoMom]

At least for some of us, it isn't that we are anti-public school; it is that we have seen the problems when people enroll their dc in public schools while still calling themselves "homeschoolers." If your dc are enrolled in a public school, and you don't have to comply with whatever the homeschool laws are in your state, then you're legally not homeschooling. Those fine details do make a difference, and believe me when I tell you that the state knows the difference, too.

 

What do you fear will come of it? I really don't understand, but it's probably because I didn't homeschool back in the day when it was just becoming legal. There is a different climate now, and there are a lot more options. My boys attend a program 1 day a week at public school, yet we are still legally homeschoolers even though my boys are home only 4 days a week and have to comply with all homeschool laws. My friend uses a K12 charter school and her kids are home with her 5 days a week, yet she's technically a public schooler and has to comply with the public school laws. She identifies as a homeschooler, because it would be silly and confusing not to.

[Bang!Zoom!]

I know that in the beginning on the 3 off days (or maybe 2, depends) we are going to be camping out at the library from open to 5 p.m. or so - and this just has to do with the kiddo and her personality. She doesn't always do so great in an "at home" setting.

 

She'll try to slack off, you know...goofing off on the internet or turning on the TV or such. Sometimes it can be a bit of a battle to get her to focus. She can't do that in the library. :) With her, the setting can be the make it or break it issue.

 

I've thought to myself, "So there we are, at the library, and someone asks or approaches us and says..' Oh homeschooling are you?'" - and then I stutter and stumble and don't know what to say or respond.

 

We sat together last night and just talked about the concepts and behaviors of "self-motivated" student work and what that means.

 

"Oh Mom, I can do that."

 

And Mom is thinking, uh huh..sure you can, as long as I'm in the margin of three feet in closeness...:glare:

 

She really does need a lot of oversight, guidance and interaction for some things..not all..but some.

 

I'll just sit and make meek puppy whining sounds if asked. If someone gets too close after asking that question, I'll start thumping my foot up and down like a dog does when you scratch behind their ears. :lol:

 

My understanding by reading the literature so far is this. The kids are expected to return X number of hours per week in study dependent on grade level. I believe for her (slated at 3rd grade as an example)- the expectation is 20 hours per week of study in her "written learning program." at 100% enrollment level.

 

If we did the 3 day plan, that only leaves a remainder of 2 hours of off-site work required.

 

These are just the minimums of course.

 

I probably should start a notebook of questions now for Monday. I really don't want any deal breakers to pop up after she is there because I forgot to ask or didn't understand something properly.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

I'm about 89% sure right now we are going to be making a change, in about a week or so.

 

The kiddo's PS school experience isn't going so hot and is in deterioration at a furious pace.

 

I'm leaning toward changing "schools"- the "new" one is structured as two days on site, three days off for pure homeschooling flavor, but without the legal forms filled out for homeschooling....

 

In a legalistic sense, she would still be a PS student with full-time enrollment status.

 

So if we were to do this, what is our understood status...just for social/conversational purposes?

 

It is a true hybrid of styles, but I don't know what term would fit. I wouldn't want to offend by saying "we homeschool" when it's only part-time.

 

The other building is not a co-op, it has oversight by the PS district.

 

Would I just say, "Oh, we are mutts..":lol:

 

I might call it something like a non-traditional public school, a charter school (if it is), a public home-study program, a hybrid school or whatever "official" label the district or state gives it.

 

I personally am uncomfortable calling something a homeschool if it is public school administered and controlled. Having said that, I have never considered that a limitation of fellowship. Some of the most delightful friendships we formed in Hawaii were with families using a local home study charter school. And in many cases, they were driving their kids' education as much as some of the families who fit the legal definition of homeschooling.

 

But there are times when the terminology matters.

[Riverland]

This is an interesting discussion. I appear to be from the same general area as the OP, and my dd spent the past 3 years at one of these schools; not the same one, but a similar one in a nearby city. Here's my take: While they may tell you that education is based on ability, they do still follow their school district guidelines. My dd was well prepared for high school Spanish year 3. The school district allowed her to take the pre-test, she passed it, then they denied her entrance due to her age. Instead, they allowed her to take year 1 and thought they were being extremely accommodating since she is still a year younger than other year 1 students in the school district. I took this to the top of the administration, and was still denied. They said I was free to use my school district provided allocation money to pay for private Spanish 3 classes, but she could not take it on campus.

 

We left. Yes, parents can provide their students with appropriate level of material at home or privately using ALE money. However, students are not allowed to take an ALE class at the school if it is outside of their grade level based on school district guidelines.

 

I am so happy to be free of the ALE. I no longer have to tailor my teaching to satisfy the required learning plans. I no longer have to tailor my teaching to satisfy the required standardized tests. Free of the red tape, we are having our best academic year ever.

 

FWIW, OP, I have heard through the homeschool community that homelink is a better environment for the parent/student than the ALE where we were involved. However, my overall experience was bad enough that I would not consider any ALE. As a full time ALE student, you are subject to all the public school requirements and all the ALE requirements (learning plans, meetings, etc). As a part time ALE student, you are subject to some of the public school requirements plus all of the homeschool requirements plus most of the ALE requirements. It was a mess that led to a reduced level of academics for my dd and a big headache for me.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

What do you fear will come of it? I really don't understand, but it's probably because I didn't homeschool back in the day when it was just becoming legal. There is a different climate now, and there are a lot more options. My boys attend a program 1 day a week at public school, yet we are still legally homeschoolers even though my boys are home only 4 days a week and have to comply with all homeschool laws. My friend uses a K12 charter school and her kids are home with her 5 days a week, yet she's technically a public schooler and has to comply with the public school laws. She identifies as a homeschooler, because it would be silly and confusing not to.

 

Homeschoolers have to follow certain sections of state law. In some cases it grants freedom (from state standards of learning or testing requirements), but in other ways it has requirements (annual proof of progress, portfolios, notice of intent, annual registration as a private school, specific courses of study, quarterly review, etc depending on the state). And there are restrictions (for example, my kids cannot participate in local public high school sports or extra curricular activities and many states will not accept high school coursework done at home for high school credit if you want to transfer to the public school).

 

There are also limitations to what the state may require. For example, I might have to keep immunization records, but there may be no requirement for them to be submitted to the state or district. I may have to keep a booklist, but not have to provide it. The state law might ask for date of birth, but not grade level.

 

When people provide the state information beyond what is required, it can create a situation where the state or district comes to expect that information. Or having gotten it from some families, they may ask for it from others.

 

The concern with charter schools is that if the term homeschool comes to encompass charter schools that supervise work at home, that the district or state will come to expect the same level of oversite of families who are homeschoolers under state law as they do with the charter at home students. Of course there are states with charters where this has not happened. But there are also states where principals and district officials have not reliably stayed within the legal requirements.

 

I don't dislike families who use charters or other public at home programs. And I'm happy to see them in homeschool tae kwon do or at field trips or at museum programs or what have you. I'd probably even advocate for my homeschooling coop making room for them if anyone were in that situation. But there may still be a legal distinction between the two cases.

[Bang!Zoom!]

That is awesome information Heather, thank you for sharing what you know and experienced.

 

I'd asked in my email if I were to bring in the most recent MAP testing results if that would move things along for placement in subjects; they responded that yes it would, and if I could bring in the strands for the results that would be even better.

 

Now what in the heck is "the strands" and how do I get those from her current school?

 

This stuff about "school district guidelines" is something I have to do a cram course on.

 

I don't know where this quirk fits into all of this or her placement, or if it won't even matter once I get there to poke about....she was qualified for GATE, but could not attend due to overcrowding.

 

I've been over to Hoagies and such to try to conceptualize where WA state is legally on either providing an IEP or other accommodation for kids that hit this gray area, and from what I can tell and have experienced it's basically a SOL situation.

 

With your Spanish illustration, this makes me wonder what they'll do in her stronger areas. I'm curious to see the range of options.

 

Heather, there is another ALE nearby (actually closer to me location wise) called MCP. It would be a lot easier for her to attend MCP; but something strikes me as "off" with it. I drove by MCP a few times, visited the website, met a family that was involved there and it was just a huge turn-off for me.

Edited October 12, 2011 by one*mom

[JudoMom]

Homeschoolers have to follow certain sections of state law. In some cases it grants freedom (from state standards of learning or testing requirements), but in other ways it has requirements (annual proof of progress, portfolios, notice of intent, annual registration as a private school, specific courses of study, quarterly review, etc depending on the state). And there are restrictions (for example, my kids cannot participate in local public high school sports or extra curricular activities and many states will not accept high school coursework done at home for high school credit if you want to transfer to the public school).

 

There are also limitations to what the state may require. For example, I might have to keep immunization records, but there may be no requirement for them to be submitted to the state or district. I may have to keep a booklist, but not have to provide it. The state law might ask for date of birth, but not grade level.

 

When people provide the state information beyond what is required, it can create a situation where the state or district comes to expect that information. Or having gotten it from some families, they may ask for it from others.

 

The concern with charter schools is that if the term homeschool comes to encompass charter schools that supervise work at home, that the district or state will come to expect the same level of oversite of families who are homeschoolers under state law as they do with the charter at home students. Of course there are states with charters where this has not happened. But there are also states where principals and district officials have not reliably stayed within the legal requirements.

 

I don't dislike families who use charters or other public at home programs. And I'm happy to see them in homeschool tae kwon do or at field trips or at museum programs or what have you. I'd probably even advocate for my homeschooling coop making room for them if anyone were in that situation. But there may still be a legal distinction between the two cases.

 

But wouldn't this require an actual change in law? The state can't just decide to require more of me because there is an actual law that says how much information I have to provide, etc.

 

Thanks for taking the time to answer :001_smile:.

[Riverland]

That is awesome information Heather, thank you for sharing what you know and experienced.

 

I'd asked in my email if I were to bring in the most recent MAP testing results if that would move things along for placement in subjects; they responded that yes it would, and if I could bring in the strands for the results that would be even better.

 

Now what in the heck is "the strands" and how do I get those from her current school?

 

This stuff about "school district guidelines" is something I have to do a cram course on.

 

I don't know where this quirk fits into all of this or her placement, or if it won't even matter once I get there to poke about....she was qualified for GATE, but could not attend due to overcrowding.

 

I've been over to Hoagies and such to try to conceptualize where WA state is legally on either providing an IEP or other accommodation for kids that hit this gray area, and from what I can tell and have experienced it's basically a SOL situation.

 

With your Spanish illustration, this makes me wonder what they'll do in her stronger areas. I'm curious to see the range of options.

 

Heather, there is another ALE nearby (actually closer to me location wise) called MCP. It would be a lot easier for her to attend MCP; but something strikes me as "off" with it. I drove by MCP a few times, visited the website, met a family that was involved there and it was just a huge turn-off for me.

nm

[Bang!Zoom!]

Heather, we should go have coffee if you are nearby. :)

 

Good luck with your day.

[Farrar]

Like others suggested, I would tell people she's in a hybrid public school, a non-traditional public school or something along those lines. If people want to find out what it means, they will. If they just want to be reassured she's getting and education, then the word "public" will probably soothe them, for better or worse.

[Spy Car]

I need to send you flowers or something Bill, maybe a voucher for Amazon or something?

 

You made me laugh so hard I have tears rolling down my face here.

 

You are the best! Always say the perfect thing! :001_wub:

 

I've never had so much glee at the thought of being booted out!

 

Funny your program is called ALE, as here in California it's "Better Educational Environment Rescheduling :D

 

Bill

[Bang!Zoom!]

Holy smokes Bill, it's a conspiracy!:D

[Sebastian (a lady)]

But wouldn't this require an actual change in law? The state can't just decide to require more of me because there is an actual law that says how much information I have to provide, etc.

 

Thanks for taking the time to answer :001_smile:.

 

Well (imo) yes and no.

 

There are already states and districts in which officials frequently or routinely ask for information beyond what the law requires. If you were living in an area that required you to get approval to homeschool or to have reviews of your progress by school officials, I think it could get uncomfortable to be telling the school officials that they are overstepping their bounds.

 

The other issue is that if districts get accustomed to receiving extra info (whether because people volunteer it, respond to extralegal requests or because public school students are labeled as homeschoolers) that is reflected if/when state laws are adjusted.

 

Just as an example, there were recently hearings in my state regarding homeschooler access to high school sports (in their district). There was testimony from homeschoolers, as well as representatives of school districts and teachers' unions. One part of the discussion was about how homeschoolers would certify that they were passing classes (there is a state no pass no play rule applicable to public school students). At the moment, homeschoolers are not required to take state Standards of Learning (SOL) exams or to follow the state SOL's. We are required to show proof of annual progress, which can be demonstrated via a nationally normed standardized test (such as SAT, CAT, or ITBS).

 

If there had been a situation where many students labeled as homeschoolers were taking the SOL exams, then it might have come about that the sports access hearing would have considered requiring this of any homeschooler who wanted to play sports. But because homeschoolers are not required to take this test, they instead considered other ways to demonstrate that homeschoolers were academically satisfactory (such as using the standardized test that are already widely used to demonstrate progress).

 

Little things here and there can add up. For example, in a non homeschooling instance, I was listening to the reporting of US Supreme Court oral arguments regarding the staff of a Lutheran school. One of the statements by one party was that the confusion in the case was what happened when a church got involved in what was the business of government, such as education. That made my ears perk up, because while I see many governments that are involved in education, I don't think that it is fundamentally or solely a government issue.

 

Similarly there was a homeschooling crisis in California a couple years back over a judge's ruling in a family court case that wasn't really about homeschooling at all. Legal concepts tend to bleed from one area to another. And precedents can stack up and influence the interpretation of law.

 

ETA: Alas, looking over the oral argument transcript, I'm not hearing the blurb that caught my attention last week. It may have been a public statement by one of the parties after arguments.

Edited October 12, 2011 by Sebastian (a lady)

[missmoe]

Many in my neck of the woods call that independent study. That terms covers the idea that one works at home (independently), but has a school overseeing the instruction.

[Brilliant]

When I talk to the general public, I tell them that we homeschool, or, that we homeschool through a charter school program. It's always very clear to them that we do the bulk of our schooling at home, despite the fact that a public charter school is holding our records.

 

You'll only find confusion or disagreement among certain dogmatic groups who won't let you be a member of their club anyway, so don't worry about it.

[Spy Car]

You'll only find confusion or disagreement among certain dogmatic groups who won't let you be a member of their club anyway, so don't worry about it.

 

The after-schooling community is sick and tired of being called "dogmatic." Sure we're strict—SOMEONE has to have standards.

 

And hey, we decided to accommodate the "before-schoolers"—and they are in whole other zip-code from us "after-schools." So much for being "dogmatic." Sheez! :D

 

We still need to boot One*mom. Can't be helped :tongue_smilie:

 

 

 

Bill

[Bang!Zoom!]

The after-schooling community is sick and tired of being called "dogmatic." Sure we're strict—SOMEONE has to have standards.

 

And hey, we decided to accommodate the "before-schoolers"—and they are in whole other zip-code from us "after-schools." So much for being "dogmatic." Sheez! :D

 

We still need to boot One*mom. Can't be helped :tongue_smilie:

 

Bill

 

You could sell tickets to your posts and raise some funds. I love that phrase. Long live the zip coders! :lol:

[Spy Car]

You could sell tickets to your posts and raise some funds. I love that phrase. Long live the zip coders! :lol:

 

Some people may recognize where I stole that phrase from ;)

 

Bill

[Bang!Zoom!]

:lol::lol:

 

Oh Lord Bill, your PM box is gonna go nuts.

 

I'm scared. :svengo:

 

This could turn into a Steven King novel in a matter of minutes. AGH!

[Word Nerd]

Some people may recognize where I stole that phrase from ;)

 

Bill

 

Oh yes. (Her kids are in private school now, interestingly enough.)

[Spy Car]

Oh yes. (Her kids are in private school now, interestingly enough.)

 

Seriously? That is too funny!!! :lol:

 

Bill

[HS Mom in NC]

I'm glad people are participating in this thread. This is a very important cultural component to the HSing community. It's best to have a handle on both sides of it if you're going to live in it.

 

The ultimate concern is legislative. Once a state decides on accountability measures for public school, ps students and the taxdollars that fund them, it matters if a person is or isn't a homeschooler. Mandatory testing, teacher certification, what tax dollars are spent on what curriculum and materials, etc. become important.

 

HSers are usually exempt from mandatory testing and government oversight. (A few states leave HSers behind in the "iron curtain" under government regulation.) It's much easier to avoid government intrusion than it is to repeal it after the fact. If you don't believe me, read up on HS history and you will see why people have had to get the government out are highly motivated to keep the government out. For people who don't care about keeping HS entirely private, it's no big deal. To those that have convictions about keeping their children out of government education, it's a very big deal. This is also true of people with political views with strong Libertarian or other strict Constitutional interpretations. Others just don't worry about that sort of thing very much.

 

The secondary issue is educational philosophy. Parent selected, taught, and controlled HS environments can be very different than a parent sending a child to a different teacher (not their parent) part-time for instruction in the classroom and supervising assignments at home part-time or getting full-time online instruction from a different teacher (not their parent) while the child is at home.

 

When it comes to "How do you teach a child ________________?" some people using ps/charter schools online haven't done the the vast majority teaching themselves, so they don't have an answer. When a private HSer asks, "Anyone have a curriculum/book recommendation for ______________?" Some using ps/charter online or part-time institutional schools have nothing to contribute because they haven't compared and selected materials themselves-they use what the school chose for them. They're not as experienced with blending methods and teaching strategies because some online or part-time institutional school options don't make room for that sort of thing. This would also apply to a private HSer using video instruction.

 

It's not true of all of them. Some parents have had to reteach things the kids didn't get when the government teacher taught it just like some ps parents do when their kids have homework questions, so there is some teaching from those parents, but maybe you can see why some HSers would see themselves as a different kind of teacher-parent than some ps/charter parents. Agree with it or not, there it is.

 

A few of the support groups my HS friends and I have belonged to were specifically geared to things like Classical Education or a specific curriculum (Konos, TWTM, Sonlight) so having people who don't use those materials around for discussions that are geared to using those particular materials is pointless. It's not necessarily an us vs. them thing. There are a couple of situations I have seen where it was us vs. them, but most of the time it isn't.

 

Social outlets for HSers are usually environments where these things matter the least.

[sassenach]

I quit reading the replies at some point, so 2 things-

 

You are standing at "The Great Divide" in the HS community. You're going to get answers that basically fall into two categories:

 

1. HS is about location-if it's mostly at home it's HS.

2. HS is NOT about location-it's about parent led, parent funded, customized education.

 

Someone will inevitably respond to these generalizations with some variation on, "You can't go around making generalizations." I'm giving you the two camps and assuming you're smart enough to know there are always variations. Your OP indicates that you have probably run into people with opinions in the two camps because people in the variation category aren't usually the ones with the strong opinions.

 

Many of the people in this forum began their children in a ps environment and are willing to consider allowing their children to return there. Many have other children in ps and are only hsing some of their kids. Many are using ps online in their homes. They are more in the 1. category. Other HS communities online and IRL have a much larger percentage in category 2. You will need to be aware of this since you are concerned about the reactions of others.

 

The private school version of that here is "community school."

 

My personal take on the subject is:

 

What you are describing is public school. You're child is enrolled as a ps school student. The taxpayers are footing the bill for the staff and probably for materials. The government is ultimately in control of the content, schedule, curriculum, and teacher selection. Before you claim it's customized/individualized, ask this, "If I don't like what they're using for (insert academic subject here) can I replace it with the (insert the same academic subject here) curriculum of my choosing? Do I get to decide what is enough progress or is that ultimately approved by someone else?" If the answer is no, then I think your idea of customized/individualized is off.

 

You are not having to comply with hs law. You are not registered as a hser. You are not selecting the curriculum, the schedule, educational method, assessing what is adequate progress, etc. You are not paying 100% of the cost of the curriculum, materials, etc. HSLDA (not the only HS legal organiztion out there) will not accept your membership because you are indirectly taking government money and therefore, you are subject to government supervision.

 

In the end you can call yourself whatever you choose, but understand that whether you agree with them or not, there is a sizeable number of hsers that will not consider you a hser if you choose to label yourself as such. A few will be offended enough to say so.

:iagree:

 

Is this school a charter school? It sounds like one. Hybrid is a good term. If this was a private school, I would call it a non-traditional private school.

 

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

 

I wouldn't use the term "university model" because those are private Christian schools.

 

The university model is not exclusive to Christians. Or private schools.

[Bang!Zoom!]

Nope, it's not charter. From my reading so far, it falls under a designation of what is called a P3. I assume that (P3) means from that area of reading it is a: Parent Partnership Program.

 

Here's a short clip from the FAQ:

 

What is a parent partnership program?

This model is often referred to as â€home schooling†by both parents and school staff. This should not be confused with “home based instruction†where the student is not involved with the school district. Although the vernacular term “home schooling†is often used by the public to refer to “home based instructionâ€, the two are not connected nor are they the same program. The P3 is peculiar to Washington State. Although some are only K-8 programs, the majority are K-12. This model is funded by ALE. Typically the parent is the primary instructor and the certificated teacher who manages the Written Student Learning Plan acts as a consultant. The district either furnishes the instructional materials or reimburses the parent for instructional materials they purchase. Instructional materials are provided in accordance with RCW 28A.320.230 (Assessing Alternative Schools, WALA 2009)

 

The funding of this site is far different than a charter system than I've seen. I've seen oversight of charters by universities and such, and I'm not currently up to speed on the charter movement now for a few years...I've done some reading about changes in the CA system of charters and the rapid changes there.

 

I don't believe Washington State has any charter schools at all. As in zero.

 

This system may be the closest they have to a charter at all.

[Brilliant]

nm

Edited October 13, 2011 by OC Mom
nm

[mcconnellboys]

Here such entities are called cottage schools....

[sbgrace]

Your own FAQ link says it is "often referred to as homeschooling" by teachers and staff. I'd call it whatever you think best fits what you're doing and I wouldn't further explain unless there was some reason to do it. It sounds (on paper anyway--if it's not what someone up-thread experienced in her program) like a really neat program to me.

[LibraryLover]

Funny your program is called ALE, as here in California it's "Better Educational Environment Rescheduling :D

 

Bill

 

 

Really? If so, that is fabulous! Where is the W I N E program? (We Increase Neural Experiences)

 

Whatever you call you it, it sounds like it could be a really nice experience. You can always change your mind. I think it's wonderul we have options that were never available to older hs familes.

Edited October 13, 2011 by LibraryLover

[Sebastian (a lady)]

Nope, it's not charter. From my reading so far, it falls under a designation of what is called a P3. I assume that (P3) means from that area of reading it is a: Parent Partnership Program.

 

Here's a short clip from the FAQ:

 

What is a parent partnership program?

This model is often referred to as â€home schooling†by both parents and school staff. This should not be confused with “home based instruction†where the student is not involved with the school district. Although the vernacular term “home schooling†is often used by the public to refer to “home based instructionâ€, the two are not connected nor are they the same program. The P3 is peculiar to Washington State. Although some are only K-8 programs, the majority are K-12. This model is funded by ALE. Typically the parent is the primary instructor and the certificated teacher who manages the Written Student Learning Plan acts as a consultant. The district either furnishes the instructional materials or reimburses the parent for instructional materials they purchase. Instructional materials are provided in accordance with RCW 28A.320.230 (Assessing Alternative Schools, WALA 2009)

 

The funding of this site is far different than a charter system than I've seen. I've seen oversight of charters by universities and such, and I'm not currently up to speed on the charter movement now for a few years...I've done some reading about changes in the CA system of charters and the rapid changes there.

 

I don't believe Washington State has any charter schools at all. As in zero.

 

This system may be the closest they have to a charter at all.

 

Just as a FWIW, home based instruction seems to have a particular meaning under Washington state law. But that isn't how the phrase is used in other states. For example in Virginia, home instruction is used in the law regarding parent directed "home schooling" while home based instruction is used in state educational materials and on some district websites as a synonym for home-bound instruction ie, instruction provided by the district by a certified teacher.

 

I would say that in general home schooling is in common use to mean parent directed, controlled and supervised. Though I'll admit that it may be a little nuanced in Washington because of the phrasing in the law.

[Alenee]

I'm about 89% sure right now we are going to be making a change, in about a week or so.

 

The kiddo's PS school experience isn't going so hot and is in deterioration at a furious pace.

 

I'm leaning toward changing "schools"- the "new" one is structured as two days on site, three days off for pure homeschooling flavor, but without the legal forms filled out for homeschooling....

 

In a legalistic sense, she would still be a PS student with full-time enrollment status.

 

So if we were to do this, what is our understood status...just for social/conversational purposes?

 

It is a true hybrid of styles, but I don't know what term would fit. I wouldn't want to offend by saying "we homeschool" when it's only part-time.

 

The other building is not a co-op, it has oversight by the PS district.

 

Would I just say, "Oh, we are mutts..":lol:

 

Are you sure about the bold? I believe you are still required to fill out the homeschool intent form...