Bringing up the "S" word...

[Kay in Cal]

Socialization.:(

 

OK, so my 6yo ds is... awkward. Geeky. He comes by it naturally. He also is one of those kids with a raft of "maybe" issues--ADHD, SID, etc, etc. He's super smart, accelerated learner, and communicates and speaks beyond his years. All of which makes interaction with other kids iffy at best.

 

So yesterday at Karate--he did well in class. Other than frustrating some of the older and more able kids with his awkwardness ("I have to be HIS partner?"), he behaved and listened well. Of course, he doesn't seem to mind or notice being the odd one out. Which is good for his self esteem, I guess, but he totally misses all the social cues, and the fact that he is a non-stop talking extrovert doesn't help.

 

As we were leaving I overheard the following conversation:

 

Ds: "I'm the master of fire type Pokemon!"

Boy (maybe 9 or so): "Yeah, whatever."

Ds: "Really! I love to play Pokemon... I enjoy the card game and the video game and I play it on my DS too. Do you play Pokemon?"

Boy: "Yeah. I did. It was stupid."

Ds: "No, it isn't stupid! It's the best game ever! I'm on level 49 right now with my Charizard.... (technical info about pokemon here)"

Boy: "Who cares. I beat the whole game."

Ds: "I'm still playing it... most recently I beat gym master (more info about game)"

Boy: "I beat the whole game 12 times."

Ds: "That's very impressive! Have you ever faced gym master (continuing to talk)"...

 

at this point the boy has turned his back, and is walking out the door while ds is still talking to him (we're all leaving after class), and I have to take his hand to keep him from following the boy and continuing the "conversation". When I try to explain that responses like "whatever" and "who cares" are social cues that people are not interested and don't want to talk to you, he is shocked and almost in tears on the way home...

 

My dh keeps saying that when he was 6 he already had lots of friends, many of whom he still knows and is in contact with. Our ds just doens't have friends--we do Karate 4 times a week, church once a week, swimming twice and homeschool playgroup once (though we've missed for a while). And while ds loves to play, there haven't been any friendships developed. Our neighborhood itself doesn't have any other homeschoolers, or really any kids who play outside at all (we live in townhomes in Los Angeles).

 

Part of me thinks that school would just make him more socially awkward and let him realize how different he is, which he doesn't really "get" yet. He'd have the same struggles, but be unhappy. My dh believes that he needs to meet other weird little kids like himself--and that would happen in school, and he's not sure how else to make it happen.

 

Argh! Advice! Advice!

[astrid]

I've probably missed your posts before but this is the first time I've seen your name pop up and I just wanted to tell you that I've missed your "face." :)

 

No advice re: your sweet boy, but he sounds simply wonderful, and unique in his own way.

 

Anyway, just wanted to say hello!

[Angela in TN]

My oldest ds (8) is the exact same way Kay that exact type of thing has happened to him many times and he will follow after the person still talking! He does not pick up on social cues and often will stand as close as he can to someone when talking. BTW he is HUGE pokemon fan and jumps at the chance to talk to anyone about it. This is our 1st year hs'ing so he did have socialization at school for the first 3 years and it didn't change who he is. He loves being with other kids and just recently at some homeschool groups he said that people act like he's invisible and he got a little teary. He is a funny kid but can be awkward socially and physically but there are a few kids who get him and luckily one lives down the street. I don't know that any of this helped but I don't know that sending him to school would change who he is really. Just be on the look out for things he might be interested and where he might meet like minded kids, lego league or jr. lego league if he's into building. I do understand though, to bad we don't live closer!

[Old Dominion Heather]

First of all my oldest is slightly socially awkward. Not quite to the extent that you are describing, but close. He has one good friend, but he is really "best friends" with his little brother.

 

1. It takes lots of down time playing to make friends, in my opinion. Could you start actively hunting for a kid with similar interests and then start inviting said kid over to play...often? The karate class sounds like fun, but your son is unlikely to meet anyone with similar interests there... not that it isn't valuable... (more on that in a minute). You might try a co-op class or a science museum class, etc... The going on and on about a topic doesn't strike me as that unusual, I think it is pretty age appropriate. Most nine year olds are not likely to give a six year old the time of day. Could you move him to a class with kids who are six and seven? There may still be social differences, but they won't be AS pronounced as in a mixed age setting. There is as much age difference between this other kid and your son as between your ds and a three-year-old.

 

2. One of the best things that we have let our oldest do was play football on a community team. Now the practice schedule nearly killed us (four nights a week and games on Saturday). He felt VERY awkward for the first few weeks, but as he gained skill he gained social awareness. The coaches, because of the nature of the sport, worked VERY hard to develop a team spirit, and my son was accepted because he was a "Raider" whether he was a great player or not. The team and coaches recognized that every member of the team had value... even the star quarterback was dependent on his blockers. It taught ds to see that a team can be brought down by one player's off day and yet you can have your personal best game ever and still lose. He is not great friends with any of these boys, but we occasionally see them in the community and they are always happy to see each other. A few have become good friends.

 

Because they were all on the same team, they (the boys) had a vested interest in helping the weaker players get better. There was no scorn for the kid who got knocked down, instead they would coach each other, explain to the weaker player how to tackle better ("Try hitting me lower, next time!"), get away from a block, etc... I'm not sure you would get that sort of "team" spirit on a individual sport like swimming or karate where they are all together, but in a competitive way.

 

One of the main things I wanted ds to get out of the football experience, besides camaraderie, was the experience of losing and coming back from a loss. He has always been very careful not to attempt things at which he felt he might fail. This allowed the experience but without making it all about his own personal failure. He didn't lose the game, his team lost the game. He was not alone in his loss. He was able to observe how the other boys reacted to a loss (and a win) and we talked about appropriate reactions in the group. It also helped me to see that some of ds's reactions that I had thought were inappropriate, were actually age-on target. He was not the only kids who cried after a loss, probably three quarters of the boys did. Having him in this very heterogeneous (and yet homogeneous) group helped me to gauge my own expectations of him.

 

Whew... I didn't mean to write a book.

[Danestress]

Honestly? I think school can be a pretty stressful place for the "odd man out" and I would delay it as long as I could while providing a less stressful education. You give your son opportunities to meet a lot of other kids. If no friendships develop, your son might be fine for now with just what he has.

 

I personally wouldn't want my 6 year old to have to cope with a kid telling him that what he is enthusiastic about is "stupid" and I wouldn't want my child to learn to treat others the way the 9 year old did. It's soul killing. So if I were you, I think I would listen to DH, partly agree, nod understandingly, but make the case that I want to wait.... that no one needs major rejection at six ... that there is plenty of time for it later. And that your son will mature over time and the eventual transition to school will be easier then if that's the decision you and DH make.

[Janet in WA]

Sounds so like our middle son. He has Asperger's, and you might consider researching that.

 

But you know what? Our son was in a public school through 3rd grade, and it was a nightmare. The kindest thing we did for him was to bring him home. I'm sure that if he'd never been to school, I'd have had the same doubts you have -- as would my dh. But we've BTDT and know better.

[Joanne]

Part of me thinks that school would just make him more socially awkward and let him realize how different he is, which he doesn't really "get" yet. He'd have the same struggles, but be unhappy. My dh believes that he needs to meet other weird little kids like himself--and that would happen in school, and he's not sure how else to make it happen.

 

Remember, "school" is the default, looming, ever present solution over homeschoolers.

 

When you cast a critical eye at "school" as the solution here, it doesn't hold up. More exposure to kids and less social coaching will not make your son appear normal in the ways that matter to our current group of elementary aged kids. You can't "sink or swim" a child into being cool (by today's standards for cool).

 

You've got a unique child who needs a higher level of social coaching. School would be a nightmare for him (and therefore you).

[momo4]

In your case I think as he gets older and with clues from mom and dad he will do much better with social situations. I think as long as you are helping him understand social cues in a kind and loving way, then it is okay for him to feel hurt. Sometimes life lessons do hurt, but they are important to learn.

 

One of mine is a social butterfly. He can make friends anywhere. His brother is much more reserved. I am very thankful to see that the ds who is more reserved makes friends as well, just not with everyone.:) I coached them about their social skills very differently. PS wouldn't have.

 

All this to say that I don't think school is a great way to socialize kids. It is better to be socialized at home with love, acceptance and kind instruction. It took me years to recover from the socialization school gave me!!! I didn't pull out of my shell until college.

 

Kids are merciless, it would be like throwing him to the wolves. A friend of mine struggles with a ds who sounds a lot like your son. He is in private school and to this day (6th grade) he struggles to find friends. She has mentioned that she is thankful for the relationship my ds has with him, because my ds accepts him for who he is.

 

By the way, I have met lots of socially awkward, intelligent, public schooled adults. I really don't think public school is the answer. Be on the look out for others who share his interests and try to connect with them. Then at least they can both be excited by the topic of conversation.

 

Hugs to you, this sounds heart breaking.

[Pam "SFSOM" in TN]

Remember, "school" is the default, looming, ever present solution over homeschoolers.

 

When you cast a critical eye at "school" as the solution here, it doesn't hold up. More exposure to kids and less social coaching will not make your son appear normal in the ways that matter to our current group of elementary aged kids. You can't "sink or swim" a child into being cool (by today's standards for cool).

 

You've got a unique child who needs a higher level of social coaching. School would be a nightmare for him (and therefore you).

 

Yep. Don't go there. Just do what you have to do to find more age-mates, even if the age-mates are not intellectual equals.

 

BTW, that's how 9 y/o's treat 6 y/o's in this big wide world. "Don't bother me, kid." You've got lots of role-playing to do. And he's smart. He can do this. You just might need to be more deliberate about it.

[Mrs Mungo]

Yep. Don't go there. Just do what you have to do to find more age-mates, even if the age-mates are not intellectual equals.

 

BTW, that's how 9 y/o's treat 6 y/o's in this big wide world. "Don't bother me, kid." You've got lots of role-playing to do. And he's smart. He can do this. You just might need to be more deliberate about it.

 

I agree with this.

[cin]

My daughter is the same way. I think she is ADD, adn I'm not sure if that has anything to do with it. She is also 6 yo. She takes over any play situation and totally misses social cues. She tells STUPID jokes and thinks other kids are laughing because the joke is funny (other homeschool kids!) but they are laughing becuase it is so senseless. We've tried to talk to her about her behavior, but I think that she will have to learn the hard way. It took us 3 years to teach her to NOT interrupt. I hope that as she matures her beuavior will too.

 

Hugs,

[Liz CA]

Socialization.:(

 

 

 

Part of me thinks that school would just make him more socially awkward and let him realize how different he is, which he doesn't really "get" yet. He'd have the same struggles, but be unhappy. My dh believes that he needs to meet other weird little kids like himself--and that would happen in school, and he's not sure how else to make it happen.

 

Argh! Advice! Advice!

 

your ds is a *weird little kid*. I have met a few homeschooled or PS that would fit this description. Six is really young to recognize social cues especially for the extrovert. An introvert *seems* to fit in better because they are quiet and let it all happen around them.

I agree with Danestress that a six year old does not need the rejection that could happen in a school setting.

Obviously he is smart and eloquent. Just because some other kids he talks to are not as outgoing or eloquent does not mean your ds is the odd one. Eventually, he'll find his place. I would encourage him to pursue something he enjoys (if it's worthwile, I have always had a strained relationship with Pokemon) the rest will fall into place.

[dirty ethel rackham]

AMEN! AMEN!! AMEN!!

 

From a formerly dorky (okay, still dorky), totally inept at social cues kid who went to school. I may have learned that I was a dork, misfit, whatever, but school did not help me learn how not to be that way. It only reinforced feelings of worthlessness which led to major depression issues as an adult.

[Melinda in VT]

Kay, I have a dd in ps who has some similar issues. Personally, for her, I feel that having interaction with kids is important. In order for her to be successful in life, she is going to have to *learn* to pick up on those social cues. She needs lots and lots of practice. I don't think she is going to grow out of this on her own without experience. In our case, I can't provide enough interaction outside of school, so school is important for her. It helps that we have a great school with small classes, and she actually gets help with social skills at school. I don't think school is necessary or good for all kids with these issues.

 

I also recommend the book The Unwritten Rules of Friendship. It provides great tips for coaching your kids on the things you thought you'd never have to spell out. (For example, "If no one is looking at you or asking you questions, that means no one is listening. If no one is listening, STOP TALKING." I had to use this one on my Pokemon son just today.)

[Kanga]

Search for hs kids who have at least one parent who is an engineer ;) My dc seemed to have advanced social skills while we were only socializing with test pilots and engineers...then we moved to a community with a shocking lack of scientists and engineers. We have had to teach them to use one syllable words when talking with their peers. We have also encouraged them to develop some interests (basketball, American Idol, etc.) that are more common to teenagers (my dd was saddened to learn that not all teens were as passionate about particles as she is) so that they would have something to talk about with the kids at Church.

[readwithem]

I'm so glad to see you over here as well!

 

And agreeing that it's typical behavior from a 9 yo to a 6 yo.

 

Your ds's enthusiasm is priceless. Nurture that. :) You'll be glad you did when he's 14. :)

[Plaid Dad]

I'm by no means an expert on this, but have you had him evaluated for a spectrum disorder? He sounds like the people (mostly adults) I've known who had Asperger's.

 

Whether or not that's what's going on, I don't think this is a result of homeschooling. It really sounds to me like something that needs special attention and would not be made better by spending many hours a day in a classroom. At home you can give him one-on-one coaching in the social situations he's in regularly.

 

Best of luck to you. I also have a "quirky" kid and I know how hard it can be to discern what is the result of environment, including home like, and what is just the child's temperament.

[Novafan]

Honestly, I think that other boy was a jerk to your son and HE is the one with the social problem. Why would someone talk to your DS like that? That makes me sad.

 

Your DS6 would get along FABULOUSLY with my DS7.5. I chuckled as I read the conversation because I knew all of the Pokemon terminology from my own boys.

 

Anyway, my DS7.5 has been given the same reaction from other children too, but I SWEAR, it's not him. I do think my DS7.5 can be very, ummmm, overbearing and enthusiastic and that sometimes rubs other children the wrong way when they aren't interested in what my DS has to say, but OTHER children should react so rudely as a response.

 

Socialization.:(

 

OK, so my 6yo ds is... awkward. Geeky. He comes by it naturally. He also is one of those kids with a raft of "maybe" issues--ADHD, SID, etc, etc. He's super smart, accelerated learner, and communicates and speaks beyond his years. All of which makes interaction with other kids iffy at best.

 

So yesterday at Karate--he did well in class. Other than frustrating some of the older and more able kids with his awkwardness ("I have to be HIS partner?"), he behaved and listened well. Of course, he doesn't seem to mind or notice being the odd one out. Which is good for his self esteem, I guess, but he totally misses all the social cues, and the fact that he is a non-stop talking extrovert doesn't help.

 

As we were leaving I overheard the following conversation:

 

Ds: "I'm the master of fire type Pokemon!"

Boy (maybe 9 or so): "Yeah, whatever."

Ds: "Really! I love to play Pokemon... I enjoy the card game and the video game and I play it on my DS too. Do you play Pokemon?"

Boy: "Yeah. I did. It was stupid."

Ds: "No, it isn't stupid! It's the best game ever! I'm on level 49 right now with my Charizard.... (technical info about pokemon here)"

Boy: "Who cares. I beat the whole game."

Ds: "I'm still playing it... most recently I beat gym master (more info about game)"

Boy: "I beat the whole game 12 times."

Ds: "That's very impressive! Have you ever faced gym master (continuing to talk)"...

 

at this point the boy has turned his back, and is walking out the door while ds is still talking to him (we're all leaving after class), and I have to take his hand to keep him from following the boy and continuing the "conversation". When I try to explain that responses like "whatever" and "who cares" are social cues that people are not interested and don't want to talk to you, he is shocked and almost in tears on the way home...

 

My dh keeps saying that when he was 6 he already had lots of friends, many of whom he still knows and is in contact with. Our ds just doens't have friends--we do Karate 4 times a week, church once a week, swimming twice and homeschool playgroup once (though we've missed for a while). And while ds loves to play, there haven't been any friendships developed. Our neighborhood itself doesn't have any other homeschoolers, or really any kids who play outside at all (we live in townhomes in Los Angeles).

 

Part of me thinks that school would just make him more socially awkward and let him realize how different he is, which he doesn't really "get" yet. He'd have the same struggles, but be unhappy. My dh believes that he needs to meet other weird little kids like himself--and that would happen in school, and he's not sure how else to make it happen.

 

Argh! Advice! Advice!

[Amy in NH]

I agree with Plaid Dad. That was actually the first thing that popped into my head when I originally read the OP, and then I stewed on it for a while before I came back to post. The lack of understanding social cues, along with the intense interest in a topic even when being brushed off, made me suspicious.

 

I also agree with the other posters that PS is not the solution to his socialization, or lack thereof. I was an odd-man-out in elementary school, and being forced to spend time "socializing" with my PS peers did not make me more normal. It made me hate school, though. It also got me beat up at recess. Yes, there were one or two other kids who were weird like me and actually liked reading and math. But it wasn't worth knowing them to have gone through the torture of PS. And I don't know any of my K-12 school mates now. Lifetime of school-mate camaraderie that your dh is wistful about may not be an option for your son.

[melissel]

AMEN! AMEN!! AMEN!!

 

From a formerly dorky (okay, still dorky), totally inept at social cues kid who went to school. I may have learned that I was a dork, misfit, whatever, but school did not help me learn how not to be that way. It only reinforced feelings of worthlessness which led to major depression issues as an adult.

 

Aw, Ellen, from one former dork (OK, still a dork) to another, I send you (((HUGS))). I had the same kinds of experiences :(

 

Everyone else, thanks for this thread. We had a rough, awkward play date this morning that had me thinking some of the same thoughts :o

[Chris in VA]

I would agree with Plaid Dad and investigate this further.

Also, do you have any social skills groups near you? It's a wonderful form of therapy where kids get extremely explicit instruction in how to handle social interaction. They can practice on each other, and take the lessons into other social settings (including home). I would go in that direction before I'd put ds in school. He's getting to the age, shortly, where kids can get very mean to those who are not aware of things like social cues.

My own ds isn't on the spectrum, but probably would be if they'd extend it a couple of feet! lol We've had to tell him things like, "Conversation is like tennis--when someone serves you the ball, you hit it back, like this..." and go on to give examples of conversing behaviours.

And, just fwiw, 9yo's can be so, well, nasty. Not all of them, for sure, but it is a common problem as preadolescence turns the corner to adolescence.

My heart goes out to you--

And finally, don't let your dh call him weird. It may seem like strange behaviour, but, as you know, God created your ds. Weird or not, he's to be valued, and calling him weird will be devastating, should he ever overhear. Esp. from Dad. Not a rebuke, just a caution.

[amy g.]

My oldest has Asperger's and I sometimes worry that people will think she is odd because she is home schooled. I know it is not true, because I have 3 other children who have always been home schooled, and they are social geniuses! Their dad is an engineer too.

 

What I did was put her in social situations where I would be there to give her hints and prompts.I taught her preschool class, and never missed a Girl Scout meeting Even now, she is 13 and dh or I even attend Sunday School and youth group with her to give her reminders.

 

She has really gotten better, but some days, she will regress if her food, sleep, exercise ratio gets out of balance. I make social opportunities a priority, because it is her weakest area.

 

I have a friend whose 7 year old is profoundly gifted. She does a great job keeping him challenged academically, but I really wish she gave him more coaching on his social skills. I'm afraid that they are really going to limit him if they don't get some attention.

 

I've told my son that it is okay to tell him, "I'd have a lot more fun if you'd try to use your indoor voice." or "I really like it when we take turns instead if your always being in charge."

 

It takes a ton of repetition, but I really think that kids like this can learn to see situations from the other kid's point of view.

[dirty ethel rackham]

Gee, thanks Melissa. I guess I was a late bloomer at the well-adapted thing, LOL!

[Kelli in TN]

I am not going to comment on the questions concerning a diagnosis for him, I don't know enough to say anything about that.

 

But I do have to say this, whoever your son is at home is who he will be at school. School is full of geeks and freaks. And the social climate in school is awkward, artificial and mostly unkind.

 

Let that baby develop at home, in the safety of your and your husband's love and guidance.

 

I have some quirky kids and we do a lot of role playing. Lots and lots and lots of role playing and talking out the possibilities. Lots of "if/then" conversations.

 

It gets easier, it really does.

[Michelle T]

As others have said, and I am very, very gently echoing: he sounds just like all the Aspie kids I know. I'm not sure if you have already had him evaluated for this, I know you have been wondering about him for quite some time.

 

As to "meeting other weird kids" in school, sure, he'd meet a bunch. And he would also see how "weird kids" are treated by the more "normal" kids, and that is not very nicely. I'm sure you remember school days, and how dreadful it was for the geeky, unpopular kids. Were they treated well or accepted? Not in my school, and I was one of those kids. Plus, there is no guarantee that just because two kids are weird, they are going to like each other.

 

My guy is 11.5, as you know, and definitely quirky. He is somewhat intolerant these days of younger kids, and gets annoyed by them (didn't used to be like this) otherwise I'd suggest getting them together. There are plenty of quirky kids in our homeschool group up here in Valencia, and plenty of them are younger boys. I know it's a drive for you, but we do have other members coming up from the valley.

 

A couple resources - get the wonderful book called "Quirky Kids" by Dr. Perri Klass out of your library. The best book on kids who are "different" but not easily classified.

 

My DS has an appointment on Friday with a child psychiatrist in Encino who is supposed to be really great with quirky kids. Being referred by our doctors at Valencia Pediatrics. The psychs name is Dr. Douglas Sears. We are seeing him for medication evaluation, as well as hopefully gaining some insight to DS's issues. I'll let you know what I think of Dr. Sears after our appointment.

 

Glad you are back on the boards! How is Doug? All recovered?

Michelle T

[Fourmother]

My oldest ds with Asperger's Syndrome was just like this. When he was in elementary school we had a routine of discussing each day's social interactions before homework time. (I wasn't aware of homeschooling at the time, nor was I in a position to make it feasible had I known. So I advocted for him as best I could within the IEP process.) Eventually, we placed him in a private school designed for kids with high functioning Autism and Asperger's Syndrome. This school treated social skills as any other subject, like math, language arts, PE, etc. Just like most of us don't inherently know how to do algebra or calculus without intense and regular instruction, some folks need to learn social skills the same way. DS will be 21 yo next month, and with time he has improved his ability to read and respond to social cues.

 

Having gone through the awkward teen years with my Aspie son, I would also encourage you to intensify your chosen method of social skills instruction during this time. Interacting with the opposite sex can be trying for the average teen. Kids who experience difficulty reading social cues can have a horrendous time during adolescence. (Trust me, I know of which of I speak!)

[Barb_]

 

Part of me thinks that school would just make him more socially awkward and let him realize how different he is, which he doesn't really "get" yet. He'd have the same struggles, but be unhappy. My dh believes that he needs to meet other weird little kids like himself--and that would happen in school, and he's not sure how else to make it happen.

 

Your instincts are spot on (which I'm sure you knew, but it's nice to hear, right?). A child like this needs social teaching the way you'd teach Math or Science. Although it's more unusual in a girl, my oldest daughter was this way. Interestingly enough, girls seemed to have a little more patience with her than I'm sure boys would have, but they still liked to mess with her...tease her and tell her blatently false things to scare her and make her cry because she took everything at face value. Adults seemed to find her charming rather than pedantic because aspergerish tendencies look a little different on a girl than a boy, yet everything you've said is familiar.

 

Being home allowed Meg to venture out into the world in small doses, then retreat when it became too much. I would help her come up with things to say to people to break the ice or have something to talk about. Like you with your son, I'd have to teach her social cues...but the good news is, over time she got it. She still has issues, but sees them for what they are. Rather than seeing herself as defective or the rest of the world as mean, at 17 she can understand irony, sarcasm, fantasy, and body language better than most people because she's had to work so hard at it.

 

Now, since females are naturally more hard-wired for communication maybe it was easier for me to teach her than if she had been born male. So take what I'm saying with a grain of salt. But my advice is not to give up. He was born, not made the way he is. Practice every day. Encourage him. As my daughter says, homeschooling doesn't make people weird...weird people homeschool :p

 

Barb

[wide eyes & laughter]

Plus, honestly, some of the best parenting advice I've ever rec'd is that children are weird. (This from a mom of 10 children, given to me when I expressed concern over my son's social awkwardness.) I've come to see that my friend was right and I was so thankful she said that.

 

I've come to see that social awkwardness is in all children. What I've noticed with many ps kids is they all resemble each other in the ways they talk, look, dress. Blah, blah. *So* that makes them "cool" and those (thank GOD there are some still) outside their cookie-cutter mold, social misfits? Are you saying you wished your son was more like the other kid? Cuz I hope not.

 

Kids don't "miss" social cues unless they've first been taught to look for them, btw. The way I read your post, I would have been very happy to have had a son so confident in what he likes that he didn't even notice the other kid "dissing" him. Honest.

 

Even though my heart hurts sometimes in similar situations my dc are in, I try to detach that b/c I'm trying so hard to teach them to "stand alone".

 

Btw, I grew up as a shy kid until 7th grade or so (public school kid) and I was very popular. Begged my mom for brand name clothes so I could be "cool". What a waste! I'm now a Thrift store shopper and pay attn to quality clothing, not brand names....

 

At times, I feel myself having to resist the urge for my kids to be "cooler", I admit. But I'm always glad when I do resist that urge. I want more for them than what I settled for as a kid and young adult.

 

Anyway, just my 2 cents.

[Doran]

AMEN! AMEN!! AMEN!!

 

From a formerly dorky (okay, still dorky), totally inept at social cues kid who went to school. I may have learned that I was a dork, misfit, whatever, but school did not help me learn how not to be that way. It only reinforced feelings of worthlessness which led to major depression issues as an adult.

 

 

I'm glad you're here, Ms. Rackham! When I read stuff like this, or like Kay's OP, it makes me want to go back to school as an adult in a kid's body just so that I could befriend the dorky people I probably dissed as a kid thinking it was the cooler of the options. I tried so hard to fit in to my "normal" group, and didn't...quite. I just might have fit better with the computer geeks, except that we didn't have computers back then! :rolleyes: I think school, for many...okay, most...is just awkward. Way too many egos and personalities running around, and eventually you toss in hormones - the end result just is NOT pretty!

 

Kay, suggest that your dh try to remember all the kids he went to school with that were a little like your own ds. Ask him if he ever witnessed one way that "school" served them socially? I have clear memories of the kids that marched to different drummers in school. Perhaps he does, too. My memories tell me that those "weird little kids" are more tormented in school than anywhere.

 

Not sure whether your schedule allows for this or not, but maybe you could try to enroll your ds in some activities that might appeal to kids "like him". If he is intelligent beyond his years, might he enjoy a chess club, or a math camp (forgive me if this sounds like I'm pigeonholing him!), a computer class, or an art class? Maybe even some kind of after school program that would expose him to a wider reach of kids without the "all or nothingness" of school enrollment. I'm thinking that his unique talents just don't shine in karate and swimming, and while those things are good experiences for him, maybe he needs a program with other kids who are in it for the brains. None of this excuses the rudeness of the kids he's interacting with right now, and it doesn't mean you don't have an ongoing role as social teacher for your child, but it might help YOUR son find some buddies.

 

 

((((Kay))))

 

 

Doran

[Kay in Cal]

We've pretty much considered EVERYTHING in terms of our ds, but he doesn't seem to meet all the criteria of Aspergers or another form of autism--I think primarily because he communicates very well and is so outgoing. Yes, he's 6, but he converses easily as fluently (vocabulary and diction-wise, but not picking up on social cues) as many teens that I know. He'll strike up conversations with anyone from the cashier at the grocery store to waiters to people walking by on the street... which, of course, is part of the problem. Other kids see his very gregariousness as being odd.

[Jean in Newcastle]

I know it's been said before. But I really think that these other kids are the unsocialized ones. I look at how I want my kids to be as adults. Do I want them to be people who can acknowledge and talk to one and all? Yes! Do I want them to be passionate about their interests? Yes! At some point (later than age 6 IMO) you can start teaching him about the "know your audience" rule.

[Laura Corin]

Sounds very like Calvin at that age. When he was six he went round telling everyone in his Montessori class about his birthday party (I learned about this later) and then didn't invite any of them. He needed a lot of coaching in social skills - the whole process was one of specific learning, rather than instinct, for him.

 

He doesn't have Aspergers - his interests are intense but varied and he has real conversations. He was just socially clueless and needed help with the niceties.

 

For him, I think homeschooling has been the best thing. It has allowed him to work on his social skills in measured doses, without being overwhelmed by the cruelty of other children. He's now eleven, and does pretty well socially. He is becoming thoughtful, considerate and able to handle social situations.

 

Best wishes

 

Laura

[talexand]

Sorry, I didn't read all the replies but I was struck by the conversation because it is exactly what my six year old would say to another child. In fact he would have had been most likely to have it at Taekwondo. He wouldn't have it with his regular friends, its more of a way to fish for something he has in common with another boy and a way to show off. Other 6 year olds often take it just fine and dish it back as well, older kids not as much.

 

My kids have never really made friends at Taekwondo. They have friendly aquaintences but not close friends. They do have friends that they met in similar situations though. But the friendship really only became solid from repeated playdates. At that age, it helped if I became friends with the Mom and were likely to follow up consistently. My older son calls his own friends now and sets things up. He's 9, but I know this is also part of his personality.

[Kanga]

Not every kid with poor social skills is on the autism spectrum! Some are just geeks in training;) I read somewhere that only 10% of the population are socially gifted, 10% have socialization problems, and the rest of us are somewhere in between and could benefit from a little instruction.