wuhan - coronavirus

[Pen]

36 minutes ago, Carrie12345 said:

I feel ridiculous not sharing the name, but I don’t know if the attachment was meant to be confidential, and I want to cover my butt while also sharing the “tone”.

A chain store company based in Texas has restricted travel for its employees. Along with pushing for virtual meetings and what not, employees who intent to take personal travel by air or cruise (domestic or otherwise) are being told to report their plans, and then remain home afterwards while the company decides what to do with them.

The company is a client of... uh... someone I know.

 

I keep following graph of cases outside China climbing and silently swearing to myself, and saying it’s too fast, it’s too fast, it has to be slowed down, it has to be slowed down. I think it’s a mantra now. 

I think in countries like USA and Australia that pride themselves on individual freedoms, rules coming from bosses may be extremely helpful.

 

Similar would be to respond to efforts like petition at UofWashington , and PROACTIVELY  move to nearly 100% online.

mantras:

we have to slow this down

let’s be PROACTIVE about managing this

 

 

 

Edited March 3, 2020 by Pen

[regentrude]

14 hours ago, Pen said:

I wonder what would happen if in a carefully planned way all nonessential services were to shut down in Washington, Oregon, California for 14 days at the same time.  

You would have riots. Because many people cannot afford to go without their paycheck for two weeks.

Edited March 3, 2020 by regentrude

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Harpymom said:

I've been lurking on this thread for a while but my irritation level has recently increased.  My dd23 is on a Fulbright in Switzerland.  All Fulbrighters and ETAs in Europe are supposed to be attending a 5-day conference in Berlin at the end of this month, dd is both participating and performing at it.  Not cancelled.  700 people are expected to attend, then fan back out to their respective countries.  Dear State Department, we get that your policy must follow official decrees, but really?  One of my worries is that Switzerland might decide to close the border that weekend and not let her back in the country.  She's also Type 1 diabetic.  She has far better health insurance there than here, so I'm also worried that they will just decide to send them all home at some point.  Thanks for listening to my worries, dh doesn't follow any news and so isn't noticing any of this.

How very stressful for you! My dd is in France until May - well, that’s the plan, anyway - and I do wonder what might happen at that point. I don’t know if or how long she could be prevented from returning to the US. She is also tentatively planning to travel around with her bf after her job ends; as it is, that plan may have to change. They were intending to go to Italy, Greece and Croatia. They have not put money down on anything yet, thankfully. 

[Pen]

10 minutes ago, regentrude said:

You would have riots. Because many people cannot afford to go without their paycheck for two weeks.

 

That’s a good argument  for employers shifting things and requiring things rather than government 

[regentrude]

1 minute ago, Pen said:

That’s a good argument  for employers shifting things and requiring things rather than government 

but that's limited to few white collar jobs. Sure, if you're a programmer, you can work from home - but you could probably also buffer a pay less period. If you're a waitress, supermarket stocker, gas station cashier, you can do neither.

[Pen]

3 hours ago, Ausmumof3 said:

CGTN:  Mei Zhongming, deputy director of ophthalmology of #Wuhan Central Hospital, died of the novel #coronavirus on March 3, at age 57 Mei was a colleague of Dr. Li Wenliang and the third doctor to die fighting in the frontline against #COVID19 disease in Wuhan Central Hospital

 

Both doctors were ophthalmologists ? I wonder if the up close face to face while examining eyes—and perhaps not realizing that eye patient is sick led to much exposure?

[Pen]

1 minute ago, regentrude said:

but that's limited to few white collar jobs. Sure, if you're a programmer, you can work from home - but you could probably also buffer a pay less period. If you're a waitress, supermarket stocker, gas station cashier, you can do neither.

 

No. In the situation that @Carrie12345 posted about I see no reason that would have to be limited to white collar workers.  Travel, sanitation procedures, social distancing while at work could all be mandated and enforced. 

Rules about stay home if sick (not entirely helpful with asymptomatic spread ) could be put into place—I am pretty sure that would be more cost effective to an employer than having most of a whole workforce infected

etc

[Ausmumof3]

how did China handle it?  

4 minutes ago, regentrude said:

but that's limited to few white collar jobs. Sure, if you're a programmer, you can work from home - but you could probably also buffer a pay less period. If you're a waitress, supermarket stocker, gas station cashier, you can do neither.

For what it’s worth in Italy the supermarkets and gas stations were considered essential services so it would only be the waitress in trouble.

I tend to think the solutions etc if we find we need these measures will be better worked out by individual businesses and employees based on the nature of their work.  Maybe with support from gov departments as needed.

[regentrude]

4 minutes ago, Pen said:

No. In the situation that @Carrie12345 posted about I see no reason that would have to be limited to white collar workers.  Travel, sanitation procedures, social distancing while at work could all be mandated and enforced. 

Rules about stay home if sick (not entirely helpful with asymptomatic spread ) could be put into place—I am pretty sure that would be more cost effective to an employer than having most of a whole workforce infected

But our  conversation started based on your suggestion to shut down all nonessential services. Not to use common sense measures for disease prevention while maintaining those services. Of course one can do the above.

Edited March 3, 2020 by regentrude

[Ausmumof3]

5 minutes ago, Pen said:

 

Both doctors were ophthalmologists ? I wonder if the up close face to face while examining eyes—and perhaps not realizing that eye patient is sick led to much exposure?

Yes I suspect that’s possibly as it’s transmissible that way.  That said toward the peak of the epidemic doctors from all kinds of specialties were getting put on the job due to shortages so they may have been working in care for Covid patients.

[Ausmumof3]

28 minutes ago, Pen said:

 

I keep following graph of cases outside China climbing and silently swearing to myself, and saying it’s too fast, it’s too fast, it has to be slowed down, it has to be slowed down. I think it’s a mantra now. 

I think in countries like USA and Australia that pride themselves on individual freedoms, rules coming from bosses may be extremely helpful.

 

Similar would be to respond to efforts like petition at UofWashington , and PROACTIVELY  move to nearly 100% online.

mantras:

we have to slow this down

let’s be PROACTIVE about managing this

 

 

 

Part of the reason the growth curve looks so steep is because other countries are doing widespread testing.  It has probably been growing for a little while but we are just now detecting all the cases.  It may not be spreading at that rate.

[Renai]

34 minutes ago, Pen said:

 

I keep following graph of cases outside China climbing and silently swearing to myself, and saying it’s too fast, it’s too fast, it has to be slowed down, it has to be slowed down. I think it’s a mantra now. 

I think in countries like USA and Australia that pride themselves on individual freedoms, rules coming from bosses may be extremely helpful.

 

Similar would be to respond to efforts like petition at UofWashington , and PROACTIVELY  move to nearly 100% online.

mantras:

we have to slow this down

let’s be PROACTIVE about managing this

 

 

 

 

3 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

Part of the reason the growth curve looks so steep is because other countries are doing widespread testing.  It has probably been growing for a little while but we are just now detecting all the cases.  It may not be spreading at that rate.

Yes, this is what I also think is happening. The cases are already there, but more are being detected because of more testing.

[Pen]

15 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

Part of the reason the growth curve looks so steep is because other countries are doing widespread testing.  It has probably been growing for a little while but we are just now detecting all the cases.  It may not be spreading at that rate.

 

It may be spreading faster

 

but it is an apparent ~ 3 day doubling for confirmed cases...

and it may be an ~3 days doubling, but with higher numbers of cases total due to lack of testing.  The numbers include South Korea where a lot of testing is being done and where the cases are probably being identified much better  

USA and Australia and Iceland etc cases are just blips compared to South Korea, and some other in Asia exclusive of Mainland China cases.

 When (if?) USA really gets testing there may be a sudden sharp rise looking like much faster growth than a doubling every 3 days, is what I personally expect.

I may be wrong, of course, but I really do think the cases are doubling approximately every 3 days.  (With many unidentified, but still tripling.  It was also the mainland China pattern prior to heroic lockdown measures.) 

 

anyway, I guess “time will tell”

Edited March 3, 2020 by Pen

[Acadie]

This may have been mentioned, but it's deeply disturbing to me that the CDC removed the number of people tested in the US from their website.  Now they only show the number of positive tests. I'm posting the article below because it includes images of the figures on their website both before and after the change.

We've seen how withholding and concealing information delays effective response and endangers people, in the way Chinese authorities handled the outbreak in the beginning. The number of people tested is crucial epidemiological information. 

Care to join me in calling your representatives in Congress today? Why was the number of people tested removed from the CDC website, when we need more information and more testing, not less? 

https://www.rawstory.com/2020/03/cdc-removes-number-of-people-tested-for-coronavirus-from-government-website-as-death-toll-increases/

“Americans are dying,” Rep. Mark Pocan (D-Wis.) wrote in a letter to CDC director Robert R. Redfield. “We deserve to know how many people have been tested. This is unacceptable."

His letter cited comments Sunday by Scott Gottlieb, the former commissioner of the Food and Drug Administration, who said the number of coronavirus cases in the United States could really be in the “hundreds or low thousands.”

Given this possibility, Pocan said, “knowing that CDC testing is keeping pace with the likely number of cases is imperative to maintaining public trust.”

Edited March 3, 2020 by Acadie

[Pen]

1 minute ago, Acadie said:

This may have been mentioned, but it's deeply disturbing to me that the CDC removed the number of people tested in the US from their website.  Now they only show the number of positive tests. I'm posting the article below because it includes images of the figures on their website both before and after the change.

We've seen how withholding and concealing information delays effective response and endangers people, in the way Chinese authorities handled the outbreak in the beginning. The number of people tested is crucial epidemiological information. 

Care to join me in calling your representatives in Congress today? Why was the number of people tested removed from the CDC website, when we need more information and more testing, not less?

https://www.rawstory.com/2020/03/cdc-removes-number-of-people-tested-for-coronavirus-from-government-website-as-death-toll-increases/

 

I’d be happy to join you in that.

also in complaining to CDC in a “contact us” way if possible

also in a call to Pence and Brix’s message taking lines to voice opinions, if there are any.

[Acadie]

17 minutes ago, Pen said:

 

I’d be happy to join you in that.

also in complaining to CDC in a “contact us” way if possible

also in a call to Pence and Brix’s message taking lines to voice opinions, if there are any.

 

These are excellent ideas, thank you!

[Bambam]

1 hour ago, Jentrovert said:

I've been lurking on this thread, and appreciate all the info. I rarely watch the news (frankly, this thread seems more informative.)

I've been wondering how you all stock up on prescription meds. I see it mentioned on lots of lists. It sometimes takes days for me to even get my regular month's worth filled. How are you getting EXTRA? (Not talking about narcotics or anything like that, I understand not being able to get extra of that.) Are you asking your doc to write 6 month scripts? 

Our insurance covers 3 month prescriptions. Usually you can refill them roughly 5 days in advance, so you go pick them up then. Over a year, you are roughly 20 days saved. Not great, but sometimes that's all you can get. 

[Fawnmoscato]

So, we are all getting sick here at my house. Of course, it mimics the symptoms perfectly. I can say with almost 100% certainty it is NOT Covid-19. But my question is, would you quarantine like it is? On the off chance that it could be? 

[Katy]

10 minutes ago, Fawnmoscato said:

So, we are all getting sick here at my house. Of course, it mimics the symptoms perfectly. I can say with almost 100% certainty it is NOT Covid-19. But my question is, would you quarantine like it is? On the off chance that it could be? 

 

Well we've been wondering the same thing.  DH has been leaving for work, though after a meeting this morning is planning on working from home.  But the kids & I have been home.  We're all driving each other crazy.

[HeartString]

1 hour ago, Ausmumof3 said:

how did China handle it?  

Everything that I have read says that the Chinese government “strongly encouraged” employers to provide full pay for quarantined workers. Which in China is more than just a little encouragement.  It would be far different in the US.  You can’t collect unemployment if you aren’t “willing and able” to work, which you wouldn’t be during a quarantine.  We’re looking at people really hurting. That’s before we get to the reports of testing costing individuals between $1000-$3000, or the fact that a 2 week hospital stay, with isolation protocols would bankrupt most families. 
 

[Katy]

Multiple news sites state the Pope tested negative for coronavirus and only has a cold.
 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-pope-health/pope-tests-negative-for-coronavirus-italy-report-says-idUSKBN20Q0K0

[Penguin]

This thread is the main place I go to keep up with the COVID-19 news, and I am deeply grateful to all of you for your updates. 

Anyone want to chime in with what you would do to prep a kid in a dorm?

I am currently on a MD-NC-OH-MD road trip, and will give some shopping reports:

I live in a medium-sized city in MD. I did my stocking up before the weekend hit, and had no problem getting what I wanted. But by Friday, supplies were looking alarmingly low. I picked up extras of some of the cleaning and disinfecting essentials so that I could bring them to my YA-son-#1 in NC.

Except for hand sanitizer, I needn't have bothered.  I took him grocery shopping yesterday. The only the only thing that was out was hand sanitizer. Bleach, TP, pasta, canned beans, isopropyl alcohol...those shelves were a bit dented but that was the only sign. This is central NC.

I don't have him fully stocked for two weeks, but I at least know he could stay home sick for a few days and not have to leave the house. I have tried to impress up on him not to let himself get down to the last roll of TP or the last pack of ramen!

Mid-week, I will be heading to OH. I will have to stay in a hotel. It will be interesting to see if anything seems different than usual at the hotel.

I'll be picking up YA-son-#3 and bringing him home from college for spring break. I intend to send him back to Ohio fully  somewhat prepared to be quarantined in his dorm room. Ugh. What is going to happen once someone in a dorm tests positive?! I shudder to think about it. We can't put two weeks of food in a dorm room, and they all share a bathroom anyway.

Well, I'll do what I can. He already has a robust sickness and first aid supply kit because that's just the way I am wired. I wanted him to be able to manage the flu completely alone. I have thought of a few things to add, and no doubt some things will need replenishing. 

While in Ohio, I will buy the few things that I think might be hard to source in Maryland. And we will stick those in his dorm room before heading home for spring break.

 

My mom is 83 and lives alone in NC, but she does not live near my son. She is with me now in NC, and she will be with me in MD for the next few weeks. I have mixed feelings about this. If she stayed home, she would be around a lot less people. DH goes to work every day, and his building is normally a revolving door of people who have been traveling for work. But she lives alone, far from the rest of us. Under normal circumstances, I always feel safer having her with me.

YA-son-#2 is in the Netherlands. I have given him some advice. That is all I can do.

But the truth is that I have very little control over the YAs. I have failed to even convince all of them to get flu shots. 

My family has always considered me a bit of an alarmist, but they mostly humor me. I've always tried to be prepared for natural disasters, getting snowed in, etc. However, I fall short in many ways and am trying to rectify that now.  Sheesh, I find it stressful to feel responsible for people in five different residences across three states and two countries!!! I'm trying to resign myself to knowing that I am doing everything I can for my immediate family. But that that still leaves us, as a group, pretty far from the ideally prepared.

 

 

Edited March 3, 2020 by Penguin

[Pen]

43 minutes ago, Acadie said:

 

These are excellent ideas, thank you!

 

I just went to cdc site and a pop up asking for feedback on the site came up

I will use that as one place to comment and request statistics on number of people tested

maybe I’ll also find a contact us 

[Arcadia]

2 hours ago, Carrie12345 said:

A chain store company based in Texas has restricted travel for its employees. Along with pushing for virtual meetings and what not, employees who intent to take personal travel by air or cruise (domestic or otherwise) are being told to report their plans, and then remain home afterwards while the company decides what to do with them.

The company is a client of... uh... someone I know.

https://www.sfchronicle.com/business/article/Coronavirus-Salesforce-Twitter-bar-workers-from-15099281.php

“Salesforce and Twitter have barred most employees from flying for business within the United States — moves that could herald a wider impact on domestic air travel.

Salesforce, San Francisco’s largest private employer, announced Monday it is restricting “all but the most critical domestic travel,” in addition to other precautions, due to coronavirus concerns. Twitter made a similar move over the weekend, and Amazon has done so, too.”

[itsheresomewhere]

2nd case in NY confirmed 

[Arcadia]

WHO report 40pages pdf 

 

Report of the WHO-China Joint Mission on Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)
https://www.who.int/docs/default-source/coronaviruse/who-china-joint-mission-on-covid-19-final-report.pdf

A guy summarized on. Reddit, this is just a portion of his summary https://www.reddit.com/r/China_Flu/comments/fbt49e/the_who_sent_25_international_experts_to_china/

 

“Here are some interesting facts about Covid that I have not yet read in the media:

• When a cluster of several infected people occurred in China, it was most often (78-85%) caused by an infection within the family by droplets and other carriers of infection in close contact with an infected person. Transmission by fine aerosols in the air over long distances is not one of the main causes of spread. Most of the 2,055 infected hospital workers were either infected at home or in the early phase of the outbreak in Wuhan when hospital safeguards were not raised yet.

• 5% of people who are diagnosed with Covid require artificial respiration. Another 15% need to breathe in highly concentrated oxygen - and not just for a few days. The duration from the beginning of the disease until recovery is 3 to 6 weeks on average for these severe and critical patients (compared to only 2 weeks for the mildly ill). The mass and duration of the treatments overburdened the existing health care system in Wuhan many times over. The province of Hubei, whose capital is Wuhan, had 65,596 infected persons so far. A total of 40,000 employees were sent to Hubei from other provinces to help fight the epidemic. 45 hospitals in Wuhan are caring for Covid patients, 6 of which are for patients in critical condition and 39 are caring for seriously ill patients and for infected people over the age of 65. Two makeshift hospitals with 2,600 beds were built within a short time. 80% of the infected have mild disease, ten temporary hospitals were set up in gymnasiums and exhibition halls for those.

• China can now produce 1.6 million test kits for the novel coronavirus per week. The test delivers a result on the same day. Across the country, anyone who goes to the doctor with a fever is screened for the virus: In Guangdong province, far from Wuhan, 320,000 people have been tested, and 0.14% of those were positive for the virus.

• The vast majority of those infected sooner or later develop symptoms. Cases of people in whom the virus has been detected and who do not have symptoms at that time are rare - and most of them fall ill in the next few days.

• The most common symptoms are fever (88%) and dry cough (68%). Exhaustion (38%), expectoration of mucus when coughing (33%), shortness of breath (18%), sore throat (14%), headaches (14%), muscle aches (14%), chills (11%) are also common. Less frequent are nausea and vomiting (5%), stuffy nose (5%) and diarrhoea (4%). Running nose is not a symptom of Covid.

• An examination of 44,672 infected people in China showed a fatality rate of 3.4%. Fatality is strongly influenced by age, pre-existing conditions, gender, and especially the response of the health care system. All fatality figures reflect the state of affairs in China up to 17 February, and everything could be quite different in the future elsewhere.

• Healthcare system: 20% of infected people in China needed hospital treatment for weeks. China has hospital beds to treat 0.4% of the population at the same time - other developed countries have between 0.1% and 1.3% and most of these beds are already occupied with people who have other diseases. The most important thing is firstly to aggressively contain the spread of the virus in order to keep the number of seriously ill Covid patients low and secondly to increase the number of beds (including material and personnel) until there is enough for the seriously ill. China also tested various treatment methods for the unknown disease and the most successful ones were implemented nationwide. Thanks to this response, the fatality rate in China is now lower than a month ago.

• Pre-existing conditions: The fatality rate for those infected with pre-existing cardiovascular disease in China was 13.2%. It was 9.2% for those infected with high blood sugar levels (uncontrolled diabetes), 8.4% for high blood pressure, 8% for chronic respiratory diseases and 7.6% for cancer. Infected persons without a relevant previous illness died in 1.4% of cases.”

 

[Twolittleboys]

8 minutes ago, itsheresomewhere said:

2nd case in NY confirmed 

 

Apparently no travel history, other than to Florida...

[Pen]

2 hours ago, regentrude said:

But our  conversation started based on your suggestion to shut down all nonessential services. Not to use common sense measures for disease prevention while maintaining those services. Of course one can do the above.

 

I may have thought you were replying to a different post than you thought you were replying to.

 I am not wedded to some idea l post about and don’t assume that some idea I express on one post applies to every subsequent post. This is a rapidly developing and changing world situation, a rapidly developing long thread, and my own thoughts too are rapidly developing and changing

 

eta: I almost posted about the idea of having a two week west coast states modified lock down something like”okay bad idea” when I read some replies to it, but I didn’t because I am not sure what future will bring.  Anyway I very much back burners that thought in my own mind at least for now

 

 

Edited March 3, 2020 by Pen

[Paige]

We cannot get extras of some medications. DD has a mail delivery injection that we have to reorder every other week at the latest. If mail or production is disrupted there's nothing we can do. I guess she'd go without and we are fortunate that it's not anything life threatening. I know there are many prescriptions that are either too expensive or controlled for people to get more than 1 month at a time. Maybe my parents could order 3 months of the $400 a month drug my mom uses but they couldn't afford $1200 at once.

I'm seeing my asthma doctor today for a regularly scheduled appointment. I wonder if he'll say anything about covid-19 or send me home with different meds. It is disturbing that steroids, which are my go to drugs, are specifically not recommended for this virus. 

 

[Acadie]

1 minute ago, Paige said:

 

I'm seeing my asthma doctor today for a regularly scheduled appointment. I wonder if he'll say anything about covid-19 or send me home with different meds. It is disturbing that steroids, which are my go to drugs, are specifically not recommended for this virus. 

 

 

I didn't know this and would love more information, as dh has asthma. I thought I'd heard some patients were getting steroids to bring down inflammation in the lungs.

[Arcadia]

Buzzfeed news and BBC Persian

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/matthewchampion/coronavirus-iran-mps-covid-19

https://mobile.twitter.com/bbcpersian/status/1234794390239006722
“Twenty-three Iranian MPs have so far tested positive for the novel coronavirus, the country's deputy speaker said Tuesday.

Abdolreza Mesri told Iranian state television that that the MPs had contracted the virus through contact with their constituents. Iran's parliament has 290 seats.”

[Arcadia]

Cross post 

(ETA: Updated 15 minutes ago

NASHVILLE, Tenn. -- Tornadoes ripped across Tennessee early Tuesday, shredding at least 40 buildings and killing at least 19 people, police said.)

 

AP news https://apnews.com/795688aab981d4e8220042c20e095b55

“NASHVILLE, Tenn. (AP) — Tornadoes ripped across Tennessee early Tuesday, shredding at least 40 buildings and killing at least nine people. One of the twisters caused severe damage across downtown Nashville.

Daybreak revealed a landscape littered with blown-down walls and roofs, snapped power lines and huge broken trees, leaving city streets in gridlock. Schools, courts, transit lines, an airport and the state capitol were closed, and some damaged polling stations had to be moved only hours before Super Tuesday voting began. 

“Last night was a reminder about how fragile life is,” Nashville Mayor John Cooper said at a Tuesday morning news conference.”

Edited March 3, 2020 by Arcadia

[MEmama]

17 minutes ago, Acadie said:

 

I didn't know this and would love more information, as dh has asthma. I thought I'd heard some patients were getting steroids to bring down inflammation in the lungs.

I’d like to know more too. DS has asthma and I worry most about him. He is prone to bronchitis and relies on his steroid inhalers. 

He has a check in with his asthma specialist in a couple of weeks. I’ll be sure to ask about the steroids and any additional precautions he can take or needs to be aware of. 

[Sneezyone]

2 hours ago, Pen said:

I get tp on automatic delivery from Amazon once every 4 months. Shortly before becoming aware of this whole novel Coronavirus issue I was kicking myself for not having skipped a delivery because I’d gotten ahead.  Then when thoughts of stocking up on things started my thought was “well, at least I’m good on TP!”

 

Same. I've had all of our supplies for a month. I can only hope my family in WA did likewise b/c I think they are getting close to taking bigger precautions there.

[Pen]

UK (NHS?) was supposed to reveal an action plan (or something like that) to public yesterday, but I haven’t seen anything to say they did or what plan is.

[Penguin]

@Quill Did you notice anything different in the airports or on the plane on the return leg of your trip?

As far as I can tell, only one flight attendant in the whole world has been diagnosed with the virus. This surprises me. 

We are still planning to go to the Netherlands in May. At the moment, my main concern is both DH and I getting stuck there. I've decided not to think about it until we get closer. We bought our tickets in January, and I was afraid to peek at the fares for fear that I would see my ticket now at half price. But somebody here posted about ticket prices to London going up, and that made me curious enough to look. Economy class prices to Amsterdam were unchanged as of a few days ago. Business class prices were a lot lower than normal, but certainly still way too high for my budget. However, I have heard that people are getting very cheap upgrades to business class at the gate. I definitely plan to try for that.

[Arcadia]

From BBC https://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-51716375#post_5e5e66444958db067adf09a2

“President Macron has announced that the government will requisition the production of face masks, and all existing stocks, in order to distribute them to health professionals and French people affected by coronavirus.

France's Health Ministry said on Tuesday that the number of confirmed coronavirus cases has reached 204. French media are reporting a fourth death from the infection.”

[Arcadia]

Twitter https://mobile.twitter.com/DHSCgovuk·

“1h

 

UPDATE on coronavirus (#COVID19) testing in the UK:

As of 9am 3 March 2020, a total of 13,911 people have been tested: 13,860 negative. 51 positive.

For latest information visit: https://gov.uk/coronavirus”

[Arcadia]

From BBC https://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-51716375#post_5e5e66444958db067adf09a2

“Posted at 5:435:43

A German cruise ship is being held in Norway due to fears of virus infections on board. 

The Aida Aura has requested a delay in its departure from the Norwegian city of Haugesund for at least 24 hours after two German passengers were suspected of having coronavirus. 

About 1,200 passengers are on board the vessel, local media report. 

There are currently 32 reported cases in Norway. 

On Tuesday, Norway's top health official said the country was entering a "new phase". 

"We must expect a greater risk of local spread in some places," Dr Bjorn Guldvog said, adding: "We need close co-operation with the population on how we will continue to work on this."”

[Pen]

@Penguin -tag, edit is done

Quote

As far as I can tell, only one flight attendant in the whole world has been diagnosed with the virus. This surprises me. 

 

It surprises me too.  My thought was they are young and perhaps not an age that tends to show symptoms.  And no one is testing them unless clearly very sick wiling hospital quality symptoms. ???

 

I’m going to return and use edit to reply to the message below. 

1 hour ago, Penguin said:

This thread is the main place I go to keep up with the COVID-19 news, and I am deeply grateful to all of you for your updates. 

Anyone want to chime in with what you would do to prep a kid in a dorm?

 

 

Talk about the situation and make sure he understands the concept of doubling and how what looks small can rapidly become catastrophic 

He is unlikely to get a serious devastating disease himself given current information on age status for it unless he has some comprbid condition.

but doing his part to help in the virus slow down is important in general

and not bringing it home (or wherever) to more vulnerable people is important 

2 ways that can happen -

1 getting sick himself and transmitting via infection 

2 carrying it as a living finite, on hands, shoes, clothing, hair, belongings etc

 

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Except for hand sanitizer, I needn't have bothered.  I took him grocery shopping yesterday. The only the only thing that was out was hand sanitizer. Bleach, TP, pasta, canned beans, isopropyl alcohol...those shelves were a bit dented but that was the only sign. This is central NC.

I don't have him fully stocked for two weeks, but I at least know he could stay home sick for a few days and not have to leave the house. I have tried to impress up on him not to let himself get down to the last roll of TP or the last pack of ramen!

 

Water just in case.  Jar of peanut butter or similar that’s not a common allergy? 

Vitamins.   Maybe herbals?

Also stress sleep, nutrition, etc

 

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I'll be picking up YA-son-#3

 

Similar as for #1

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and bringing him home from college for spring break. I intend to send him back to Ohio fully  somewhat prepared to be quarantined in his dorm room. Ugh. What is going to happen once someone in a dorm tests positive?! I shudder to think about it. We can't put two weeks of food in a dorm room, and they all share a bathroom anyway.

 

They may be as much at risk from hugs and close contact as from bathroom.  Do bathrooms get cleaned by university staff?  If kids do it themselves that’s going to make it more risky.  If staff does it and kids add to it that would be better.

mmaybe contribute some cleaner wipes to bathroom? Or for sons to use when they go in?

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Well, I'll do what I can. He already has a robust sickness and first aid supply kit because that's just the way I am wired. I wanted him to be able to manage the flu completely alone. I have thought of a few things to add, and no doubt some things will need replenishing. 

While in Ohio, I will buy the few things that I think might be hard to source in Maryland. And we will stick those in his dorm room before heading home for spring break.

 

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My mom is 83 and lives alone in NC, but she does not live near my son.

 

My mom is 86 alone in NC.  And we are now closed relatives and all the way across country in Oregon.  

 

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YA-son-#2 is in the Netherlands. I have given him some advice. That is all I can do.

 

Then you have done what you can.

And if so, let it be. 

Give it over to universe or God or something like that. 

 

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My family has always considered me a bit of an alarmist,

 

I believe the Covid-19 is a serious threat. 

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but they mostly humor me. I've always tried to be prepared for natural disasters, getting snowed in, etc. However, I fall short in many ways and am trying to rectify that now.  Sheesh, I find it stressful to feel responsible for people in five different residences across three states and two countries!!! I'm trying to resign myself to knowing that I am doing everything I can for my immediate family. But that that still leaves us, as a group, pretty far from the ideally prepared.

 

 

 

 

They are adults. You can help. You can talk. You can suggest.  You can even say something like “you cannot come home unless_____” in Order to protect your own health.    

But they will need to decide much.

 

if your mother is willing to be at your house, and you have beds etc available to do that with out stress, that would be better than at a distance I think. The reality, I think, is that the Covid-19 may well kill both of our in their 80’s mothers.  Even if they try to isolate themselves. Dying with family around/available would probably be better than all alone, imo.  But the choice should probably be up to your mother to stay in her own home if she prefers that. 

Edited March 3, 2020 by Pen

[Guest]

33 minutes ago, Penguin said:

@Quill Did you notice anything different in the airports or on the plane on the return leg of your trip?

As far as I can tell, only one flight attendant in the whole world has been diagnosed with the virus. This surprises me. 

We are still planning to go to the Netherlands in May. At the moment, my main concern is both DH and I getting stuck there. I've decided not to think about it until we get closer. We bought our tickets in January, and I was afraid to peek at the fares for fear that I would see my ticket now at half price. But somebody here posted about ticket prices to London going up, and that made me curious enough to look. Economy class prices to Amsterdam were unchanged as of a few days ago. Business class prices were a lot lower than normal, but certainly still way too high for my budget. However, I have heard that people are getting very cheap upgrades to business class at the gate. I definitely plan to try for that.

There were noticeable differences, yes. At CDG, most of the food service workers in the airport wore masks. No flight attendants wore masks, though. Many, many travelers wearing masks. For re-entry to the US, I was asked if I had at any point been in China. (It was sort of laughably absurd when I said I had been to France, Germany and Austria and then they asked this question about China! It was like, oh yeah, I forgot, we took a quick trip to China also!) 

On the return flight, my seat mates disinfected their area with wipes, which made me feel better and less ashamed that I was planning to do so, too. Also, once back in Dulles, a friendly co-traveler offered doses of hand sanitizer to everyone near him getting on the terminal bus. 
Also, just anecdotal note: at Costco Sunday, an employee was offering to wipe down carts as we entered. I happened to bring my own wipes with that plan anyway, but I don’t remember them ever doing that before. 
I wish you luck planning your trip. I have a ton of anxiety about my daughter’s travel plans because she doesn’t worry about it as much as I do. In that sense, I almost hope she is prevented from going to Italy by the government, or else decides that it isn’t worth it if all major sites and museums are closed. It would make the decision for her and make it less likely she will be impacted by the virus. 
Even just the question of spreading in France itself gives me anxiety. I’m doing all the worrying for both of us. 😒 It’s my special talent. 

[Pen]

3 minutes ago, Quill said:

There were noticeable differences, yes. At CDG, most of the food service workers in the airport wore masks. No flight attendants wore masks, though. Many, many travelers wearing masks. For re-entry to the US, I was asked if I had at any point been in China. (It was sort of laughably absurd when I said I had been to France, Germany and Austria and then they asked this question about China! It was like, oh yeah, I forgot, we took a quick trip to China also!) 

 

Europe has been a Back door way of entering USA (and probably Australia) from China. 

 

[Pen]

 

5 minutes ago, Quill said:

On the return flight, my seat mates disinfected their area with wipes, which made me feel better and less ashamed that I was planning to do so, too. Also, once back in Dulles, a friendly co-traveler offered doses of hand sanitizer to everyone near him getting on the terminal bus. 

 

I think being the person willing to speak up, to make a post about it to an FB group, to use the sanitizer is important in allowing others to feel safe to do the same!

That seat mate and some of those others seem worth emulating.  I probably should have done something like that at DMV yesterday. 

 

It is hard to be willing to seem different. 

 

 

 

 

[TravelingChris]

10 hours ago, Pen said:

 

1) I think you could launder some types of reusable bags

2) no idea but I think dealing with mail as a fomite is worth thinking about.  Also other papers we get: receipts, documents etc.  

I only use store bags because that is one thing I have read in numerous places about not using reusable bags for grocery shopping due to my health issues.

[Penguin]

@Quill I share your ability to worry for everyone! I, of course, have been dealing with having a YA child overseas for many years. 
 

Here are some of my pre-virus tips that still apply:

Whenever I go out of town, I bring my passport. I want to be able to get to my son if necessary without having to go home and fetch my passport.

Learn as much as you can about how the health care system and insurance works in the country of residence and within the EU. I don’t rely on my YA to be tuned into that.

I have tried to ensure that my YA has access to emergency funds (i.e., my money!) through as many channels as possible.

HTH

[Carrie12345]

Took ds to a ped appointment this morning. Tons of signs up about the virus in addition to the usual “wear a mask for cough/fever”. Meanwhile, the unmasked receptionist was coughing all over everything. 

[TravelingChris]

5 hours ago, Ausmumof3 said:

Iran reported 835 new cases and 11 new deaths.  Total 2336 cases and 77 deaths.

I haven't read all the posts but Fox news  was reporting that  in Iran, 22 parliament members have it.  They are totally lying about how many cases and deaths they have.

https://www.foxnews.com/health/iran-says-77-dead-amid-2336-cases-of-new-coronavirus

[TravelingChris]

3 hours ago, Pen said:

 

Both doctors were ophthalmologists ? I wonder if the up close face to face while examining eyes—and perhaps not realizing that eye patient is sick led to much exposure?

No. these were the doctors who figured out that there was a new virus out there.  They were infected before China had acknowledged the virus at all

[JustEm]

4 minutes ago, Carrie12345 said:

Took ds to a ped appointment this morning. Tons of signs up about the virus in addition to the usual “wear a mask for cough/fever”. Meanwhile, the unmasked receptionist was coughing all over everything. 

 

I would have been inclined to walk right out the door. Not for fear of this virus but because that is incredibly irresponsible during flu season. 

I have a newborn so we are at the ped more frequently right now for non illness related check ups, she actually has an appointment on Fri. I'm so paranoid of any coughing or illness in the waiting area that I've requested they just take us right back to a room once we get there, which they have done. So, I'd completely be the person asking the receptionist to put a mask on and also mentioning to the nurse or Dr that the receptionist should have one on.

They have one exam room that they specifically don't use for sick patients so infants and immunocompromised patients have an extra layer of protection.

[gardenmom5]

1 hour ago, Arctic Mama said:

I think this is because they’ve also lived through many more pandemic crises (bird flu and swine flu, anyone?) and disasters than the younger contingent, and are also at that age where confronting mortality and illness is a lot more commonplace for them than their children just because of their age.  I’d absolutely expect a more measured response or slower panic from older people.  Denial is where I begin to worry.
 

Of course the downside to this tendency is realizing that they do indeed need to take some precautions, but trying to figure out which ones are sensible for their situations is a lot of planning and reasoning not all of them may be up for.  That’s where I think it is really helpful for us who are younger and maybe researching this more to step in and help them a bit.

but they haven't lived through the 1918 Spanish flu pandemic, and that's what epidemiologists are comparing the potential of this one to.