Somebody tell me we're doing the right thing (FIL related)

[Lawana]

It's just so hard. We moved MIL into our house against her will because she was living in conditions not unlike you FIL's, only it was rats instead of bugs. And she was quickly spending her way into destitution while stockpiling stuff she never opened. She spent a month in an assisted living place while the worst of her anger simmered down a bit. I still am not sure it was the right thing to do

 

We can do no other than the best we can given the poor choices before us. You are a most loving, kind, wonderful person to care so much for your FIL. You whole family is lucky to have you.

[Grantmom]

Hugs to you and your family.  This is so, so hard.  But you absolutely are doing the right thing.  I had to do the same thing with my grandmother.  She did not want to come at all, but we just had to put her in the car and tell her she was coming with us for a "visit".  Then we went back later to clean out the house.  It is so, so hard, but in the end, know that he knows you love him and are doing the best for him.  I bet once he is there, in a nice, clean home, with things taken care of, and the love of the kids around him all the time, he will be much, much happier.  It is just hard to make the change.  I would help your DH see that it is absolutely not about him, and he needs to not take any anger from your FIL personally.  

 

:grouphug:

[eternalsummer]

I have to be quick, as Dad isn't taking the news well at all.

 

His nurse HAS been coming. Talked to her a few hours ago. He forgot. I would think that he was lying - but this, combined with the fact that he had stacks of forgotten very important bills (house taxes, etc), leads me to believe that he's becoming forgetful. I mean, my husband just took care of over 6K in "I forgot to send the check, but I wrote the check" bills this morning alone.

His nurse told me that they all adore FIL and it's hard to leave him every visit. He's been lying to them, as some suggested, and it does fit Dad's "MO" - he likes his independence. The nurse had no clue that he wasn't able to make it upstairs (in fact, she relayed that she'd asked him if he could do just that at every visit), had no clue he was peeing in a cup, and that he had declined any further home-care, although it had all been offered. 

She rearranged her regular visit to be here tomorrow, with Dad's social worker, instead of today (because we had taken the children out for a few hours today), so that she could speak with us. Her and the social worker are going to help make Dad comfortable for the trip and, hopefully, walk me through what needs to be done to set him up with home healthcare at our place. 

I'm not sure why we weren't called when he refused further help. I'm leaning more towards a miscommunication due to the nurse change, tough, and not negligence on their part. She seemed to sincerely enjoy Dad - and agrees that he needs to come with us. She said that she would get him whatever medication was needed for him travel safely with us and to last a bit after we arrive home. 

 

Dad yelled at DH over it all. I thought DH was going to cry. I've not seen DH cry more than once or twice in our entire marriage, but I've seen him completely breakdown and sob twice since we've been here. 

I'm trying to do a couple of things. A) take the blame so that, as some suggested, DH and his father can preserve their relationship, banking on his soft spot for me, and B) acknowledge how hard this is for Dad. When DH told me, in front of Dad, that Dad was "angry" about coming with us, I smiled at Dad and replied that I would be pretty darn angry about it, too, if I were in his shoes. Upthread it was suggested that I treat him a bit like a child - and that's what I would do with my children in a similar situation (having to do something that nobody wants to do, and is hard to do, does suck, and sometimes acknowledging those feelings helps). 

 

 

I don't know you at all, but I think you are just a wonderful person.  That is all.

[TammyS]

FYI - the chair up the stair thing might require a permit. You might want to call the company to find out. 

Are you and DH comfortable moving upstairs for a while?

 

Also, find out what is required in terms of upper body and core strength.  He may not be able to hold himself upright in a sitting position and balance while it takes him up. 

[TammyS]

 

 

Dad yelled at DH over it all. I thought DH was going to cry. I've not seen DH cry more than once or twice in our entire marriage, but I've seen him completely breakdown and sob twice since we've been here. 

I'm trying to do a couple of things. A) take the blame so that, as some suggested, DH and his father can preserve their relationship, banking on his soft spot for me, and B) acknowledge how hard this is for Dad. When DH told me, in front of Dad, that Dad was "angry" about coming with us, I smiled at Dad and replied that I would be pretty darn angry about it, too, if I were in his shoes. Upthread it was suggested that I treat him a bit like a child - and that's what I would do with my children in a similar situation (having to do something that nobody wants to do, and is hard to do, does suck, and sometimes acknowledging those feelings helps). 

 

I think you're doing exactly the right thing.  For all of you.  The next couple of weeks are going to be rough, but just keep swimming.  It won't always be like this.

[zoobie]

Anger is normal. It's part of anxiety and dementia. DH is going to have to get used to it. You can't always be the bad guy, and you're not the bad guy. You're going to be doing the majority of his care.

 

I'd have the nurse check for a UTI. They're less common in men, but they can do a number on elderly people. Major personality changes. If he's been holding it instead of going, plus less than hygienic circumstances...

[zoobie]

Marvelous Flying Marco + stair lift? ;)

[mysticmomma]

P

[prairiewindmomma]

A few tidbits from our experiences:

1. It takes 90-120 days to adjust to a big change like that.  Expect some unhappiness, and just roll with it.  Changes are very disorienting and frightening, and anger seems to be an easy emotion to express.

2. Hospice can provide a lot of equipment.  If you know already who you are going to use, ask about a hospital bed, commode, etc. rather than purchasing all of that with private funds.

3. You're doing a good thing. It may not always feel that way, but remember to find moments to enjoy in each day, even if that means a bit of respite care for you.  :grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

[TravelingChris]

I am so sorry that you are having to deal with this.  But you are doing a great job and I can tell what a caring person you are.  I hope you get good advice from the nurse, social worker and lawyer.  But you do need to get a general power of attorney.  You all need to be in charge of finances.  And you will have to do that soon since it may very well be that either he is becoming senile or the cancer has spread to the brain or some other medical reason for confusion and wrong decision making.  

[Tree Frog]

We can't have anything done before he arrives since he's coming home when we do. It's too long a car ride to go back to our home and then come back here that quickly, and there's no way I can travel by plane by myself, without DH, with The Marvelous Flying Marco.

I don't think Dad and DH riding alone together (if, say, me and the children went down before them, and DH rented a car for him and Dad) is a good idea. Dad is pretty darn angry right now. 

 

I think a commode in the room right away is a good idea. He'll probably be staying downstairs in the living room or in our bedroom (whatever his preference is) until we get the stairlift in, though, so hopefully we CAN have his things set up before he actually uses his upstairs bedroom. 

We have no room in our vehicle for more than luggage, but we'll have a family friend (who offered to help) send his favorite instruments - and I'll pack the family photographs and saint statues that seem dearest to him in his luggage for the trip up. 

 

Based on some of the things you've said, I think FIL may deteriorate faster than you anticipate. Some of it will be due to the move, but some of it is his illness/age. MIL became increasingly forgetful and had aches and pains that she couldn't explain/pinpoint just a couple of months before she passed away. I would plan to make your bedroom his bedroom until you assess what he needs and is capable of. It's entirely possible you'll get FIL to your house and discover, due to some unforeseen issue or rapid deterioration, that he won't be able to use the bedroom upstairs at all. What could you do to make your room a little quieter for him when other things are happening? White noise via a bathroom fan? Music? If he's at all hard of hearing, it could be a blessing in that he won't hear the commotion as easily.

 

I'm a little concerned about your other commitments, especially with The Marvelous Flying Marco. Caregiving will take most of your time and will interrupt all your thoughts. Will you be comfortable with FIL downstairs with access to the kitchen if you're not home or if you're upstairs? Or comfortable with him moving around without someone nearby in case he falls? Do you have firm enough furniture he can easily stand up from? One of my concerns with MIL, especially as she became more forgetful, was that she would use our gas stove and forget to turn it off when she was done or forget she had a pan on it. If she had moved here, I had planned to remove the knobs so she couldn't use them unless I was there. (She had admitted to forgetting a pan on the hot burner at her apartment, so my fear was real.) I think you're doing the right thing, but it's a very difficult decision! Also keep in the back of your mind it's ok for FIL to move to an assisted living facility (different than a nursing home) if things become overwhelming for you. Hospice should still be able to visit him there.

[catz]

:grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug: What a difficult situation.  I'm so sorry.

 

All I can say is, be ready for anything.  Watch your own stress levels and how this affects your children.  It is absolutely ok to decide a full time hospice would be a better fit.  It is physically very difficult to take on full time care of someone like this, let alone when you still have young children with big needs.  It is a lot to emotionally deal with a dying loved one and take on with all necessary their paper work/loose ends and be there for them emotionally without physically being in charge all day every day.  I don't think I'd immediately modify my home with a lift.  I'd give it a few weeks.   If he's stable for that time that might lead to a different plan than if he's failing quickly now. 

 

Many hugs.  Don't forget to take care of you.  :grouphug:

Edited June 1, 2016 by WoolySocks

[AimeeM]

Marvelous Flying Marco + stair lift? ;)

Right? That's what I said, lol. I can't think of an alternative, though. Not without seriously shorting the children (i.e. getting rid of chess club, playdates, playing downstairs, etc) since there is only one bedroom on the main level of the house and it's right smack dab in the middle of the action (and my house sees a whole lot of action).

[AimeeM]

I am so sorry that you are having to deal with this.  But you are doing a great job and I can tell what a caring person you are.  I hope you get good advice from the nurse, social worker and lawyer.  But you do need to get a general power of attorney.  You all need to be in charge of finances.  And you will have to do that soon since it may very well be that either he is becoming senile or the cancer has spread to the brain or some other medical reason for confusion and wrong decision making.  

DH is already on all of his bank accounts and has the legal ability to speak to his bill collectors, etc. Is that what you mean? 

[TravelingChris]

Yes , to start with.  It sounds like he has a financial power of attorney too.  The general does encompass financial but also living arrangements so I would talk to the lawyer and find out if you need that too.

[TammyinTN]

I have no advice, but big hugs and prayers for you....that's a tough situation to be in.   :grouphug:  :grouphug:

[TammyS]

Right? That's what I said, lol. I can't think of an alternative, though. Not without seriously shorting the children (i.e. getting rid of chess club, playdates, playing downstairs, etc) since there is only one bedroom on the main level of the house and it's right smack dab in the middle of the action (and my house sees a whole lot of action).

 

If you want to make the downstairs bedroom quieter for him, there are things you can do.  On his side, get some of that egg crate mattress pad stuff and tack it on his walls. Marvelous sound dampening. On the outside, put furniture against that wall.  If your floors are hard, put down some area rugs to dampen sound.  If they don't already, get the kids to go barefoot in the house.

 

Also, he may be less bothered by this stuff than you think.  It might even help him to have some life  around him.  As he deteriorates, he will become less aware of it anyway.

 

ETA: And, honestly, what FIL wants isn't the primary concern right now.  The primary concern is setting up your house in a way that makes caregiving as least difficult on your (there's no honest way to write easiest, because it will never be easy) as possible.  You just can't be trudging up and down stairs all the time.

Edited June 1, 2016 by TammyS

[brehon]

Oh, Aimee! How difficult for everyone! Of course your FIL is mad and of course your dh is near to tears. There is nothing about this situation that is or will be easy.

 

I was afraid your FIL might have some dementia based on some of what you wrote. Even early stage dementia can bring on anger like you wouldn't believe. As hard as it is your dh needs to understand this and not take it personally. And, although I understand why you're willing to be the fall guy right now, you can't continue in that role if you're the caregiver.

 

I'm afraid your FIL is frailer than anyone, perhaps even he, knows. Another poster had a very good thought about UTIs. Get him checked for one soon. Most elderly people are dehydrated anyway and a UTI just absolutely does a number on their entire body, including mentally. Many doctors I've talked to who specialize in geriatrics say that elderly + altered mental status (to mean not at the patient's normal baseline) = UTI even in the absence of a fever.

 

Given his forgetfulness and stubbornness please don't let him be in charge of his medications. I know, it seems counterintuitive. I understand he's very independent and doesn't want to be a burden. Just kindly and firmly take charge of them anyway. Trust me on this.

 

And don't forget your oxygen mask. Eat healthy, drink plenty of water, and get some time alone for you. Elder care is difficult enough and all consuming on its own; you also have three kids, at least one of whom is also difficult and all consuming in his own beloved way.

[Grantmom]

Also, is your FIL by any chance a veteran?  If so, contact the VA because they have money available for exactly this situation.

 

We also had home health, from a prescription from my grandmother's PCP, and they were able to come in a certain number of hours a week and do things like bathing, etc.  That didn't work for us because my grandmother had dementia and she would not let other people do things like that for her, but they did do some helpful things.

 

Lastly, yes, definitely get in touch with hospice now,  If the doctor will write a prescription now, then they are FAST!  Within 24 hours, we had a hospital bed and all kinds of other medical equipment that was all covered by Medicare.

 

Oh, one more thing, we had an aging services foundation in our town that provided some additional help.  Minor things, but it helped.

 

Good luck.  It is a big, big job.  I did this when my kids were young and it was very, very hard.  But at the same time, I told myself that I was glad my kids were seeing me caring for our elders.   :grouphug:

 

[Storygirl]

Is there another location where you can have the chess club? Maybe a community room in your neighborhood. Or the library? You may find as time goes on that hosting it in your home would work fine, but it may be a good idea to have it elsewhere for awhile.

 

I had my mom (with Alzheimer's) in my home for nine months when my kids were smaller. When friends would ask me how things were going, I would say that I was operating at a low level of stress constantly, with periods of great stress. I know you plan to hire some help, but I think it may be a bigger change for your family than you anticipate. I would try to cut back on play date and the chess club for the first month, at least, while your family finds a new norm.

[AimeeM]

So, this is where we are right now.

Last night all shades of Hades hit the fan when about a half dozen very loud Italian relatives found out we were planning to move Dad. All of a sudden there were cries of, "Don't leave us!" (to Dad) and then, to us, "You will KILL HIM taking him away from his friends and family like this!"

 

So and so called so and so who called another so and so and everyone came over. Under the guise of celebrating his birthday, of course, but what it really turned into was yelling, crying - and then laughing and hugging, then more crying, then more hugging. The only one on our side, actually, was DH's estranged younger brother, who apologized for being a butt for so many years and told the rest of the family (who called him into the situation thinking he could override us) that he would do whatever he could to help us with what we felt best.

 

And talk about the dramatics. Wowzers. Keep in mind that these suddenly concerned relatives I've never even met. At all. Not even once during ANY visit we've made to Dad, have I met any of these folks who came crying crawling out of the woodwork last night. I was actually cornered in the kitchen by Dad's 23 year old niece who decided to tell me exactly what needed to be done - and proceeded to demand that I do it. Generally very non-confrontational, I didn't realize that she would take offense to my, "Look, sweeheart ---." Honest mistake on my end, I reckon. 

One aunt was literally holding her hand to her chest at the threshold of the kitchen, hyperventilating, "I just CAN'T! I remember wheeeeennnn this was Mom-Mom's kitcheeeeennnnn and it was beautifuuuuulll," while refusing to step but a tiny toe into the area. 

Then there was the readily voiced concern that shouldn't I be awfully concerned that mental illness runs in my family, considering my mother has a mental illness? As in, my own mental health, because - you know - veiled insults and all. 

 

Oh, and we can't forget that Aunt V absolutely must have a certain bowl when Dad passes - because, yeah, that was a great thing to discuss last night.

 

So, the result?

 

Dad is staying here. For now. With caveats (big ones).

 

1. He agreed to a home health aid coming in twice daily, his nurse as his physician deems necessary, and the social worker whenever she feels like coming by.

2. I told the social worker that his meds have to be monitored to ensure they are taken correctly.

3. The carpet is being ripped up and a hospital bed and commode is being put in what is currently the dining room.

4. He is NOT allowed to fire anyone on his own. DH has to sign off on ANY changes to this plan. This has been put in his file.

5. If he defaults on this at all, or refuses treatment/entrance/etc, even ONCE, I am coming back to bring him home with me - the social worker will meet us there along with the nurse to medicate him and that's it. No bargaining. 

6. The house will be sprayed, but - frankly - it's likely the row home next door sending the bugs in, so he will have to agree to allow the house to be sprayed frequently. 

7. He already has friends, students, family, etc popping in every day, all throughout the day. If they see that something needs to be done, he cannot refuse it without checking with me and DH.

8. Dad goes to the hospital for 5 days to have the fluid in his legs taken care of. BIL will stay with him there (it's a rehab facility).

 

None of us are fans of this plan, and we don't think it'll work, but at least if it doesn't work out, Dad will know we tried. He wants to die where he grew up and we get that - so we'll try this. Once.

 

Edited June 2, 2016 by AimeeM

[mysticmomma]

:(

[Anne]

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug: :grouphug:  

 

Anne

[catz]

:grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug:   I think you're right to honor his wishes as long as possible.  I'm sorry you're going through all of this.

[lauraw4321]

Wow. And I thought southerners were dramatic. I'm so so sorry.

[Ethel Mertz]

Wow. Thinking of you Aimee and hoping/praying for the best outcome. But geez... I wonder how long it will take the relatives to fade back into the woodwork... 

[TravelingChris]

I hope this works out for the best.  

[monstermama]

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

I am so upset for you.  We had the Monday night quarterbacking with my gram, too.  Or course, when push came to shove, of all the people who had very strong opinions on what I should do, only two people actually stepped up to help.  Some of them I had to get quite rude with ("OK, then, great, when can you come do xyz with her?  Oh, really, you don't have time for that?" followed by "When was the last time you stopped by to visit with her, exactly?") Long story short - we knew within 2 weeks (and probably should've known within about 5 days) that it wasn't going to work out.  It sounds like he has a lot more community connections than she did, though, so I really do hope it works out for the best for you guys.   :grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

 

[Valley Girl]

I hope you have the phone number of each relative who objected so that they can be called to step up with visits, running errands, etc. to help. Seriously, I'd call them. "You were so against our moving Dad to our home, I just knew you'd want to do whatever you can to help."

 

Glad your BIL is backing you and offering real help. It would be nice if in this sad situation, that relationship could heal.

[matrips]

Honestly, I would let him stay in his home. Have him sign papers so you guys can pay his bills, hire help etc. your fil sounds really sick, and he is old. we moved my 87 yo dad three years ago. I thought it was the right thing. He died two months later. He didn't want to move but had zero people to care for him and was in a dive nursing home. He had moved himself from a good one because he said he didn't like it. But basically he didn't like anywhere that wasnt home and hated the food anywhere he went. Mom was by herself at home (he had been her caretaker). We were 1000 miles away. I just really believed if he had better care and we were close, everything would be better. But in reality, he was dying, I just didn't really know it. He hated the move, really hated it, didn't get better and died. He was also an Italian and just wanted to be home.

 

Your fil has friends and people that care for him around. That means a lot. I'd suggest taking over his accounts and hiring cleaning help/nursing aide to help him stay in his home. i do believe it's that important to him. I'm sorry it's not the answer you wanted. Just saying what I would do if I had another chance with dad.

[AimeeM]

Honestly, I would let him stay in his home. Have him sign papers so you guys can pay his bills, hire help etc. your fil sounds really sick, and he is old. we moved my 87 yo dad three years ago. I thought it was the right thing. He died two months later. He didn't want to move but had zero people to care for him and was in a dive nursing home. He had moved himself from a good one because he said he didn't like it. But basically he didn't like anywhere that wasnt home and hated the food anywhere he went. Mom was by herself at home (he had been her caretaker). We were 1000 miles away. I just really believed if he had better care and we were close, everything would be better. But in reality, he was dying, I just didn't really know it. He hated the move, really hated it, didn't get better and died. He was also an Italian and just wanted to be home.

 

Your fil has friends and people that care for him around. That means a lot. I'd suggest taking over his accounts and hiring cleaning help/nursing aide to help him stay in his home. i do believe it's that important to him. I'm sorry it's not the answer you wanted. Just saying what I would do if I had another chance with dad.

You don't understand. This has happened before. He fires everyone - and starts to decline all help (even from friends, relatives, etc) as soon as we leave, or never follows through with accepting the help after we leave.

He has friends and family, but if he doesn't let anyone do anything (which is his MO), we aren't going to let him die literally sitting in his own filth just because he doesn't want to move. Regardless, the social worker said that if this doesn't work out, she was already planning on calling the counsel on aging - who will force him to move, if he doesn't. We don't want it to come to that.

Edited June 3, 2016 by AimeeM

[AimeeM]

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

I am so upset for you.  We had the Monday night quarterbacking with my gram, too.  Or course, when push came to shove, of all the people who had very strong opinions on what I should do, only two people actually stepped up to help.  Some of them I had to get quite rude with ("OK, then, great, when can you come do xyz with her?  Oh, really, you don't have time for that?" followed by "When was the last time you stopped by to visit with her, exactly?") Long story short - we knew within 2 weeks (and probably should've known within about 5 days) that it wasn't going to work out.  It sounds like he has a lot more community connections than she did, though, so I really do hope it works out for the best for you guys.   :grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

I'm sorry you had to go through that :( It isn't any fun, I know.

 

He has community connections, but if he refuses the help (even from his community), it does him not a lick of good. I have the feeling we'll be called in about a month because he isn't cooperating.

[lmrich]

So sorry you had to deal with that craziness! I hope and pray that all of the dramatics and fireworks were because the people really want to help and get involved. 

[Joules]

Aimee, I am so, so sorry.  I know it will be so hard to leave him knowing this is likely temporary.  

 

I really hate people that know just the right thing to be done when *they* aren't the one doing it.  I don't know the age or tech level of the people you are talking about, but maybe you can do an e-mail loop or a facebook page, where every time someone visits FIL, they post with his mood and conditions.  A network of younger former students may be your eyes on the ground, in addition to the medical people.

 

You may already be on your way home, but can I make a suggestion for the junk?  Bug bombing would be more effective with less stuff.  Could you convince him to put a large bulk in storage "temporarily" so that things can be cleaned up?  It might make it easier for him to get around and for help to keep the place clean, if there is less clutter.  If someone local had the key, they could grab something for him if he really needs it.

 

[Mama Geek]

AImee, I think what Matrips was saying is that it is very possible that he will go down hill very quickly if forced to move.  I saw it happen with my grandmother when my mom moved her away from her home and friends.  I am not suggesting what you should do just be aware that it is a possibility that if you move him he will give up.   :grouphug:

[Joules]

AImee, I think what Matrips was saying is that it is very possible that he will go down hill very quickly if forced to move.  I saw it happen with my grandmother when my mom moved her away from her home and friends.  I am not suggesting what you should do just be aware that it is a possibility that if you move him he will give up.   :grouphug:

 

Just as a counter-point, keep in mind that he is going downhill very quickly *right now*.  If you move him, he might pass soon, but the same outcome is likely in his current situation.  His passing won't be *because* you moved him, it will be because he is very ill in hospice care, and it is inevitable.

 

All you and dh can do is find the best, safest way for him to spend these last days...that is a trade-off of  best medical and best emotional.  He is past the point of being able to make good decisions, so you guys have to make the best one you can...and, as someone told me, they all suck!

 

As stressful as it is, it is kind to let him try one last time.  Maybe he'll make it work with local help, but if not, and you have to move him, keep in mind that though he is losing his contacts there, he will be gaining every day with his grandchildren, you, and your dh, all of whom he loves very much.

 

ETA: :grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

Edited June 3, 2016 by Joules

[brehon]

Oh, Aimee, how awful! I've seen this and at one point cemented my reputation as the family bitch by doing *exactly* what Monstermama said.

 

I do hope the social worker and home health are on the ball because all these overly dramatic, "concerned" friends and relatives will NOT be the ones to call you. (As an aside, I'm Italian on my dad's side; I understand exactly the histrionics you and your dh put up with. 🙄)

 

I second the suggestion of decluttering by putting lots of stuff in storage. You'll still have an infestation in those boxes, etc (unless you can somehow fumigate them prior to putting them in storage), but your FIL's stuff will be safer from concerned friends and relatives. <ahem, just saying>

 

Good luck with everything.

Edited June 3, 2016 by brehon

[Scarlett]

It's just so hard. We moved MIL into our house against her will because she was living in conditions not unlike you FIL's, only it was rats instead of bugs. And she was quickly spending her way into destitution while stockpiling stuff she never opened. She spent a month in an assisted living place while the worst of her anger simmered down a bit. I still am not sure it was the right thing to do

 

We can do no other than the best we can given the poor choices before us. You are a most loving, kind, wonderful person to care so much for your FIL. You whole family is lucky to have you.

QFT

[Cascadia]

Aimee, I had a thought about how to help monitor the situation with FIL once you are back home. We have a doorbell called Ring that has a camera and records when the doorbell is pressed or when there is motion on our porch.  We are alerted on our smartphones when the doorbell rings, and we can also view the video. This could be a tool to help you monitor how often the professionals are visiting your FIL, and perhaps a way to call the bluff of all of those "concerned" relatives who descended on you the other day. (What? You say that you've been visiting Dad? You're not on the security camera.)  My DH installed ours very quickly and easily.

 

Good luck!

[Seasider]

Aimee, I had a thought about how to help monitor the situation with FIL once you are back home. We have a doorbell called Ring that has a camera and records when the doorbell is pressed or when there is motion on our porch. We are alerted on our smartphones when the doorbell rings, and we can also view the video. This could be a tool to help you monitor how often the professionals are visiting your FIL, and perhaps a way to call the bluff of all of those "concerned" relatives who descended on you the other day. (What? You say that you've been visiting Dad? You're not on the security camera.) My DH installed ours very quickly and easily.

 

Good luck!

That is rather brilliant.

[Supertechmom]

said very gently with hugs

 

If he is already thought to have prostate cancer in his bones, it may have already spread to his brain and his time is not long.    Get everyone's numbers including family and put a plan in place to check in with everyone everyday.   including those relatives that came out of the woodwork.   Calling them in the middle of the night to check on him is entirely appropriate.    Now that the agency has a face with the number and understanding that you are in charge, they will contact you about everything .  He won't be able to refuse care and fire people because he wants to.  You have basically stripped him of being in charge which is what was needed.  The above suggestions are great.  You can also put in a video camera to monitor him as well.  Those are't very expensive or hard to put in.My Fil had something similar and when it hit his bones, he was gone within 2 months.   I'm afraid your time with him is not long and moving him will only accelerate that time frame.    While he is in the hospital, can you get the scans done to see the progression of the cancer??  This is a really hard time and no matter which way you go, it will always feel wrong.   You can only do the what feels less wrong.  There is never a right it seems in these cases.

[AimeeM]

Aimee, I had a thought about how to help monitor the situation with FIL once you are back home. We have a doorbell called Ring that has a camera and records when the doorbell is pressed or when there is motion on our porch.  We are alerted on our smartphones when the doorbell rings, and we can also view the video. This could be a tool to help you monitor how often the professionals are visiting your FIL, and perhaps a way to call the bluff of all of those "concerned" relatives who descended on you the other day. (What? You say that you've been visiting Dad? You're not on the security camera.)  My DH installed ours very quickly and easily.

 

Good luck!

Do you know if any stores sell it store-front? We have to leave tomorrow! 

However, this is BRILLIANT. I can have a couple of the more reliable friends grab it and install it for us if it requires ordering.

 

I'm also planning on having the children of his neighbor (who have been reliably and very sweetly helping Dad with his trash cans, etc for a while now) take out the dog in the morning. Dad had already planned on giving their mom a key. 

[AimeeM]

said very gently with hugs

 

If he is already thought to have prostate cancer in his bones, it may have already spread to his brain and his time is not long.    Get everyone's numbers including family and put a plan in place to check in with everyone everyday.   including those relatives that came out of the woodwork.   Calling them in the middle of the night to check on him is entirely appropriate.    Now that the agency has a face with the number and understanding that you are in charge, they will contact you about everything .  He won't be able to refuse care and fire people because he wants to.  You have basically stripped him of being in charge which is what was needed.  The above suggestions are great.  You can also put in a video camera to monitor him as well.  Those are't very expensive or hard to put in.My Fil had something similar and when it hit his bones, he was gone within 2 months.   I'm afraid your time with him is not long and moving him will only accelerate that time frame.    While he is in the hospital, can you get the scans done to see the progression of the cancer??  This is a really hard time and no matter which way you go, it will always feel wrong.   You can only do the what feels less wrong.  There is never a right it seems in these cases.

Would we be able to prevent him from seeing the scans or being told what they show? I would like to see the scans, as would DH, but we don't want Dad to see him. He's depressed as it is. 

 

And he told DH last night that he's ready to go (to heaven, to be with his wife and parents). My heart hurts so bad right now (but is nothing, I'm sure, to what DH and his brother are feeling). This sucks monkey balls.

 

One amazing thing has come from all this. We've seen DH's estranged brother grow so much. Last night, the formerly money-hungry young man (who used to only come over to ask Dad for money), turned down cash offered. Dad always offers everyone cash, lol. 

Edited June 3, 2016 by AimeeM

[TammyS]

Well, now you've learned one of the other lessons of elder care.  No one gets told anything until it's already a done deal. 

 

I know it seems mean, but everyone will want input on the thing that they aren't doing.  It's just too much.  Eldercare is so, so hard. You simply can't have 10 people insisting on decision making power, too.

[monstermama]

Aimee, I had a thought about how to help monitor the situation with FIL once you are back home. We have a doorbell called Ring that has a camera and records when the doorbell is pressed or when there is motion on our porch.  We are alerted on our smartphones when the doorbell rings, and we can also view the video. This could be a tool to help you monitor how often the professionals are visiting your FIL, and perhaps a way to call the bluff of all of those "concerned" relatives who descended on you the other day. (What? You say that you've been visiting Dad? You're not on the security camera.)  My DH installed ours very quickly and easily.

 

Good luck!

 

Awesome idea!  They apparently carry them in store at certain Best Buys and Home Depots - you should be able to find ones locally.  They install just like a normal doorbell.  Besides the motion sensor, if someone actually rings the doorbell, it'll alert you on your phone and you can answer and speak to the person through the doorbell.  You do need to have wifi for it to work, though, so as long as FIL has that you should be set.

[AimeeM]

Well, now you've learned one of the other lessons of elder care.  No one gets told anything until it's already a done deal. 

 

I know it seems mean, but everyone will want input on the thing that they aren't doing.  It's just too much.  Eldercare is so, so hard. You simply can't have 10 people insisting on decision making power, too.

We didn't intend to tell everyone - only those directly involved. The ones who support whatever is best for Dad. Word got around. Quickly. 

[Supertechmom]

I'm pretty sure you can especially if the MD agrees that the news would be a negative to his health.  As a nurse, we keep all sorts of info from the patient in such situations when the md and POA and hospice agree.

 

Regarding the family.  I'm from a large large family...  Here's how I would handle it based on how I saw things done with both of my grandparents.  Someone has to be in charge.  Take the role.

 

Call another meeting.   Tell them anyone who wants a say on his staying had better show. Otherwise, he's moving with us.

 

Tell them when they get there.  You can't stay.  So in order for him to stay you have put the info in an earlier post in place.  But in order to make sure it happens, here is what you need.  Have a clipboard with the sign up list and pass it around.

 

1) One mass cleaning crew before you go.

 

2) someone to bring him his favorite meals - doesn't have to be the same person but someone in charge to make sure it happens

 

3)Someone to make sure he takes his daily meds.  The nurse can make a schedule and fill the pill box when she visits. The family just makes sure it is being done.

 

4)someone to oversee the dog/trash/mail schedule is being done.

 

5)check on the cleaning and making sure the staff is doing it

 

6)someone to be there when the nurse visits to get the low down in person as to what needs to be done

 

7) what else you need done to ensure he is taken care of. 

 

8) person to contact in the middle of the  night

 

Tell them to blame you for everything if FIL balks.   AimeeM said we must or she is going to take you to her house.   I saw this in action and it seems that family was just waiting on finding out what they needed to do.   Otherwise, not knowing, nothing was being done.    I think you would find ample people to help. Plus, FIL is only going to get weaker and be in less position to protest. He may enjoy the company.

 

Get everyone's phone number so you can call and check it was done.

 

At least that would give you some peace of mind and eyes to help you.

[Seasider]

I'm pretty sure you can especially if the MD agrees that the news would be a negative to his health. As a nurse, we keep all sorts of info from the patient in such situations when the md and POA and hospice agree.

 

Regarding the family. I'm from a large large family... Here's how I would handle it based on how I saw things done with both of my grandparents. Someone has to be in charge. Take the role.

 

Call another meeting. Tell them anyone who wants a say on his staying had better show. Otherwise, he's moving with us.

 

Tell them when they get there. You can't stay. So in order for him to stay you have put the info in an earlier post in place. But in order to make sure it happens, here is what you need. Have a clipboard with the sign up list and pass it around.

 

1) One mass cleaning crew before you go.

 

2) someone to bring him his favorite meals - doesn't have to be the same person but someone in charge to make sure it happens

 

3)Someone to make sure he takes his daily meds. The nurse can make a schedule and fill the pill box when she visits. The family just makes sure it is being done.

 

4)someone to oversee the dog/trash/mail schedule is being done.

 

5)check on the cleaning and making sure the staff is doing it

 

6)someone to be there when the nurse visits to get the low down in person as to what needs to be done

 

7) what else you need done to ensure he is taken care of.

 

8) person to contact in the middle of the night

 

Tell them to blame you for everything if FIL balks. AimeeM said we must or she is going to take you to her house. I saw this in action and it seems that family was just waiting on finding out what they needed to do. Otherwise, not knowing, nothing was being done. I think you would find ample people to help. Plus, FIL is only going to get weaker and be in less position to protest. He may enjoy the company.

 

Get everyone's phone number so you can call and check it was done.

 

At least that would give you some peace of mind and eyes to help you.

Hear that? It's the whirr of my printer and the zing sound of outgoing emails, sharing this awesome strategic plan. It is helpful not only for Aimee, but for all of us on the edge of eldercare.

 

Thank you, supertechmom!

 

ETA between supertechmom and cascadia's tip about the door camera, I personally feel much better equipped to manage elder care from a distance (a sad necessity in corporate-relocation society).

Edited June 3, 2016 by Seasider

[Cascadia]

Monstermama beat me to the reply about local stores. Home Depot and Best Buy were all that I came up with as well. I had been thinking about this thread and had the Ring idea while out running errands, and I was so excited to come home so that I could get online to tell you! We're all rooting for you and FIL out here in forum-land :)

[Cascadia]

Hear that? It's the whirr of my printer and the zing sound of outgoing emails, sharing this awesome strategic plan. It is helpful not only for Aimee, but for all of this on the edge of eldercare.

 

Thank you, supertechmom!

 

ETA between supertechmom and cascadia's tip about the door camera, I personally feel much better equipped to manage elder care from a distance (a sad necessity in corporate-relocation society).

 

 

Yep, I just copied that straight into Evernote!  We don't need it right now, but the possibility is looming ever closer.  Thank you, supertechmom!