Has anyone followed the coverage of the murder of Amanda Blackburn in Indy?

[Word Nerd]

That link looks like a person collecting bits of newscasts and sermons and basically implying the pastor guy had something to do with it. Which, if he's 100% in the clear, is the nastiest thing I can think of. I might not think much of this pastor, but I think even less of this Amy Smith person.

 

I agree. This has nothing at all to do with the crimes committed.

[JustEm]

I don't know anything about his sermons and don't want to.

 

What bothers me is why there was an unlocked door at their home. If the husband went out for some kind of early morning workout, did he purposefully leave the door unlocked with his wife and child inside???

 

That, to me, is what's shocking.

Hmm I don't find it shocking. My entire childhood we never locked the back door. Now we lock the doors most of the time and always when leaving and before bed but if we leave it unlocked it's not a big deal.

[marbel]

I am unusual in my neighborhood in that I keep my front door locked all the time.  Most people do not.  My kids used to take care of a neighbor's dog and they just left the door unlocked while they were off at work all day. 

 

My back door is unlocked most of the time when we're home simply because of the dog going in and out throughout the day.   But I keep the front door locked. 

 

Still, if my husband left the house while I was awake, and for some reason didn't lock the door, it wouldn't bother me. 

[Word Nerd]

I don't know anything about his sermons and don't want to.

 

What bothers me is why there was an unlocked door at their home.  If the husband went out for some kind of early morning workout, did he purposefully leave the door unlocked with his wife and child inside???

 

That, to me, is what's shocking.  

 

In our area, it's the norm to leave doors unlocked, so that isn't shocking at all to me.

[BlsdMama]

If someone gets past our dogs, a lock won't stop them.  

 

 

Honestly, I wonder what the value is of bringing all the "other stuff" into the conversation.

 

A pregnant woman, a mama of a baby, a wife of a pastor, was brutally killed.  Her pastor husband is mourning.  I know  men who make incredibly crude remarks about their wives and (ahem) private lives.....   Incredibly poor judgement doesn't make one a killer.  Crude doesn't mean he deserves to mourn his wife.  And that poor mama... Her last hour must have been awful.  Why?  Why dig up dirt? Why gossip about it? What possible joy exists from dragging this family through the mud?  I don't get some people.

[albeto.]

In any case, I think the video I saw was a result of two things: the push that many churches have to 'be relevant' and do what it takes to get people there, and the trend that telling every little thing means you are 'authentic'.  Guess I was raised not to air every piece of dirty laundry I might have so I am not impressed when people overshare. 

 

I think that's just it. Younger generations increasingly don't equate sexual behavior with dirty laundry, or even necessarily intimate/private/sacred. It's a physical behavior. It feels damn good when done right. It need not have strings attached to be enjoyable and genuinely satisfying. Really. And following the success of Mark Driscoll, pastors who want to appeal to the younger generation increasingly use what seems to work. They know if the pews aren't filled when the older generation ages out, the church is in trouble. 

 

I think in large part it's because the traditional correlation between xianity and morality is suspect to the younger generation. They don't buy that argument. For one thing, the internet has lowered churches from this lofty place of honor, a beacon of moral stability and hope, to glass houses where people are continually caught with their pants down when they think no one is looking. Additionally, younger people know, and in many cases they are, members of the so-called dangers of society (LGBTQ, feminists, non-traditional, non-conformist, etc.). The old formula doesn't work; interpersonal relationships are more relevant than identifying and thwarting Satan's Grand Conspiracy. Hipster pastors are simply trying this version because there's a measure of success. 

[albeto.]

If someone gets past our dogs, a lock won't stop them.  

 

 

Honestly, I wonder what the value is of bringing all the "other stuff" into the conversation.

 

A pregnant woman, a mama of a baby, a wife of a pastor, was brutally killed.  Her pastor husband is mourning.  I know  men who make incredibly crude remarks about their wives and (ahem) private lives.....   Incredibly poor judgement doesn't make one a killer.  Crude doesn't mean he deserves to mourn his wife.  And that poor mama... Her last hour must have been awful.  Why?  Why dig up dirt? Why gossip about it? What possible joy exists from dragging this family through the mud?  I don't get some people.

 

Life is fragile. We have deceptively vulnerable bodies. Our skin isn't thick or prickly. Our bones can withstand only so much pressure. We're vulnerable to heat and temperature. Our organs require certain fuel, and even then can malfunction unexpectedly. When some tragedy strikes, I think some people look for clues to what "caused" it in hopes of feeling more in control of their own precarious existence. In other words, to identify what a victim did wrong and to correct it, encourages some to feel safer. 

[Joyofsixreboot]

Arrests have been made.

[unsinkable]

If someone gets past our dogs, a lock won't stop them.  

 

 

Honestly, I wonder what the value is of bringing all the "other stuff" into the conversation.

 

A pregnant woman, a mama of a baby, a wife of a pastor, was brutally killed.  Her pastor husband is mourning.  I know  men who make incredibly crude remarks about their wives and (ahem) private lives.....   Incredibly poor judgement doesn't make one a killer.  Crude doesn't mean he deserves to mourn his wife.  And that poor mama... Her last hour must have been awful.  Why?  Why dig up dirt? Why gossip about it? What possible joy exists from dragging this family through the mud?  I don't get some people.

 

How is watching his sermons "digging up dirt"? Or "dragging his family through the mud"?

 

It evovled in a very natural way. The crime occured and the family released statements from the church and pointed people toward their website, where the videos are of the sermons and questions and answers sessions.

 

I was surprised and shocked enough by the content that I wanted to know how common this was. The sexual messages to women is disturbing. 

 

None of this means that he doesn't get to mourn his wife. I don't know how that follows? 

[Garga]

We've had threads in the past about locked vs unlocked doors. In some areas everyone always locks their doors. In others, very few do. I've lived in both kinds of places. The fact that he left the door unlocked most likely means nothing.

 

But the idea that we're all talking about this man and critiquing his sermons that we've never even heard, while he's burying his murdered wife and baby feels icky. I can't imagine going through a tragedy and having strangers gossipping about me the entire time.

 

I think we should stop speculating. And I agree with others that unless we have more information about what exactly was in these sermons, then we're all reacting over something that might not be all that shocking anyway. The above post about their date night doesn't seem shocking to me, especially if it was part of a Q&A for a targetted group.

Edited November 23, 2015 by Garga

[Word Nerd]

But the idea that we're all talking about this man and critiquing his sermons that we've never even heard, while he's burying his murdered wife and baby feels icky. I can't imagine going through a tragedy and having strangers gossipping about me the entire time.

 

I think we should stop speculating. And I agree with others that unless we have more information about what exactly was in these sermons, then we're all reacting over something that might not be all that shocking anyway. The above post about their date night doesn't seem shocking to me, especially if it was part of a Q&A for a targetted group.

 

We're not all doing that, though. I think it's icky to examine the sermon content in the context of the murder. One has nothing to do with the other, and I agree with the PP that it feels like "digging up dirt" on a victim.

[gardenmom5]

I don't know anything about his sermons and don't want to.

 

What bothers me is why there was an unlocked door at their home.  If the husband went out for some kind of early morning workout, did he purposefully leave the door unlocked with his wife and child inside???

 

That, to me, is what's shocking.  

 

in some area's, people don't lock their doors.  don't know if that's one.

[Guest]

Locks keep honest people out. No rapist/murderer/robber will let a locked door stop them.

[unsinkable]

We're not all doing that, though. I think it's icky to examine the sermon content in the context of the murder. One has nothing to do with the other, and I agree with the PP that it feels like "digging up dirt" on a victim.

 

Amanda's murder is the event that made me go to the website. The statements made about her by her husband made me want to hear about their faith and beliefs.

 

That's the only connection.

 

Amanda is a blameless victim. Her husband and child are, too.

 

None of that changes what their church teaches.

[Laurie]

Locks keep honest people out. No rapist/murderer/robber will let a locked door stop them.

 

 

But if someone kicks in your door or breaks a window to gain entrance, you might hear it and have time to respond in some way rather than have someone possibly sneak up on you because he easily let himself in. 

 

[vonfirmath]

I saw a video from Oct. 27 and it wasn't what I was expecting. It was a Q and A session at their church, and questions had already been sent in via Twitter, I believe. It wasn't something *I* would attend, but I'm not their target audience anyway. 

 

I thought it was fine except for two little parts- one where Davey went on about how every man needs to protect against internet temptation. To that end, he has filters on all of his devices AND his wife and a trusted pastor friend receive a weekly list of every website he's accessed. Well...that sounds like overkill unless a guy has had a problem with porn.

 

Some men do not think it is overkill.  My sister's husband does this. No problems with porn. But he feels it is appropriate levels of openness and accountability for him. He was a pastor for a while though is currently not. But even when not a pastor, this is what they choose to do as a family.

[zoobie]

I hadn't heard of it until this post, but from scanning the online articles and blogs, people are talking about him because they suspect he was somehow involved. They apparently both spoke about their marriage being bad (seems she wanted to leave but they had moved away from her family support network?), sex frequently discussed as being obligatory and demanded. He's been making lots of public appearances and doing interviews on the heels of her death, which he's using to promote his business/ministry. The implication from the online articles is that at best, he's a narcissist with inappropriate boundaries on sex, and at worst, set up people to murder his wife for the life insurance money.

 

ETA: she was raised in a purity-focused religion and professed that she did not kiss until marriage, similar to the Duggars. These hyper-focused-on-sex religions are so strange to me.

Edited November 23, 2015 by zoobie

[Word Nerd]

Amanda's murder is the event that made me go to the website. The statements made about her by her husband made me want to hear about their faith and beliefs.

 

That's the only connection.

 

Amanda is a blameless victim. Her husband and child are, too.

 

None of that changes what their church teaches.

 

I was primarily referring to Amy Smith, who is also using the Amanda Blackburn hashtag to promote her blog posts about Davey. She also links to a different blog that implies he hired the gang member who's been arrested to kill her.

[lovinmyboys]

Locks keep honest people out. No rapist/murderer/robber will let a locked door stop them.

Well, no locked door is going to stop someone who is determined to rape/murder/rob a particular person, but it does quite well at stopping random robberies. Most robberies are crimes of opportunity. It is a lot easier to get away with the crime if you just walk in a house, rather than having to break a window or a door.

 

What really surprised me, was that this happened around 7:00 in the morning-a time that someone was likely home and neighbors would be leaving for work, etc.

[Outdoorsy Type]

Bringing up the other stuff feels icky, like asking why a girl was alone dressed like xxxx and maybe it was her fault. Just. Yuck.

[MercyA]

And I agree with others that unless we have more information about what exactly was in these sermons, then we're all reacting over something that might not be all that shocking anyway. The above post about their date night doesn't seem shocking to me, especially if it was part of a Q&A for a targetted group.

 

I watched clips from some of the sermons. People are not overreacting. It makes me very concerned for the state of the church in America.  

 

Regardless of my strong disagreement with the type of teaching Pastor Blackburn did, I am so sorry for him, as a fellow human being, for the loss of his wife and for his son in the loss of his mother.

[DawnM]

That link looks like a person collecting bits of newscasts and sermons and basically implying the pastor guy had something to do with it. Which, if he's 100% in the clear, is the nastiest thing I can think of. I might not think much of this pastor, but I think even less of this Amy Smith person.

 

Sorry, I posted all that before am coffee, I have deleted my post and I have sent you a PM asking you to delete my quoted post.

 

Editing again because I really don't understand why you won't honor my request here or on PM to delete my post.  

Edited November 25, 2015 by DawnM

[unsinkable]

I was primarily referring to Amy Smith, who is also using the Amanda Blackburn hashtag to promote her blog posts about Davey. She also links to a different blog that implies he hired the gang member who's been arrested to kill her.

 

Thanks for the reply.

[Annie G]

Some men do not think it is overkill.  My sister's husband does this. No problems with porn. But he feels it is appropriate levels of openness and accountability for him. He was a pastor for a while though is currently not. But even when not a pastor, this is what they choose to do as a family.

 

Davey was saying that every man needs this accountability and that's what I disagreed with. But he said other things that I disagreed with too- like every couple should be in counseling.  That's why it's great there are so many different churches- we can all find one that speaks to us. 

 

 

I'm glad for his sake and Amanda's family's sake that the police have arrested suspects.  Even though the police had cleared him, I'm sure there are people who didn't believe he was innocent.  That must be an awful thing to live with. 

[8circles]

I watched a few minutes of a couple sermons & the Q&A (skipping around a bit).  I think he's creepy, possibly a narcissist, chauvenist, teaches bad theology, and is extremely irritating.  I saw a few comments about sex, but nothing specific about his wife like people are saying.  It might be there & I didn't see it.  If it is, could you please tell me which sermon & around which minute mark so I can hear it?  

 

I think these topics are 100% inappropriate for a sermon during Sunday morning worship.  I have no problem with these topics being discussed within the church, maybe during a class or Bible study or in a small group.  I don't agree with that church's view of men & women and probably a host of other things.

 

 

[Guest]

FYI--my FB page is full of Christian homeschool moms talking about Davey's "heart for Jesus". Maybe he is crazy or maybe he is crazy like a fox.

[MercyA]

I saw a few comments about sex, but nothing specific about his wife like people are saying.  It might be there & I didn't see it.  If it is, could you please tell me which sermon & around which minute mark so I can hear it?  

 

PM'ing you.

 

ETA: Your box must be full. The message wouldn't go through.

Edited November 23, 2015 by MercyA

[8circles]

PM'ing you.

 

ETA: Your box must be full. The message wouldn't go through.

 

Sorry, that happens fast.

 

I cleared some space.  Thank you. :)

[lexi]

Can you PM me as well? Thank you.

[mom2scouts]

They have arrested four suspects involved in the robbery group. She was raped before she was shot in the head and there appears to be DNA evidence. The murder suspect is only 18. :sad:

[MercyA]

Can you PM me as well? Thank you.

 

Sure, will do.

[foxbridgeacademy]

I don't know anything about his sermons and don't want to.

 

What bothers me is why there was an unlocked door at their home.  If the husband went out for some kind of early morning workout, did he purposefully leave the door unlocked with his wife and child inside???

 

That, to me, is what's shocking.  

Here in Indiana we often pride ourselves on the fact that it's safe enough to leave your doors unlocked.  I've lived in several other towns/states and locked up at least every evening, back home now and the door will often go unlocked for several days.  Sad, not shocking.

[lovinmyboys]

They have arrested four suspects involved in the robbery group. She was raped before she was shot in the head and there appears to be DNA evidence. The murder suspect is only 18. :sad:

I have only seen that 3 were arrested. Two have been charged and one is being held on unrelated charges.

 

No sexual assult charges were filed. I'm not sure if it was a wrong account that she was raped or if there is another reason they didn't file charges for that. Maybe those charges will come later? Or will be filed on the third suspect?

 

I believe the DNA came from a sweater they stole from a different house and was found in the abandoned stolen car (from another different house).

[MercyA]

Just wanted to clarify something. I saw things in his sermons that I would consider to be indiscreet, coarse, and insensitive. However, I didn't see anything (in the limited amount I watched) that I would consider to be heretical or doctrinally unsound. I think it was likely a case of wanting to be relevant/edgy/authentic and going overboard with that.

 

I'll need to bow out now. 

 

 

[Catwoman]

Locks keep honest people out. No rapist/murderer/robber will let a locked door stop them.

I disagree. Many break-ins are crimes of opportunity. An unlocked door is an opportunity.

 

A locked door is more of a nuisance to deal with, and it's a lot easier to be noticed and caught when smashing a window or kicking in a door than it is to quietly and discreetly stroll into an unlocked house.

[Laura Corin]

I don't know anything about his sermons and don't want to.

 

What bothers me is why there was an unlocked door at their home. If the husband went out for some kind of early morning workout, did he purposefully leave the door unlocked with his wife and child inside???

 

That, to me, is what's shocking.

We don't lock doors in daytime unless everyone is out. Husband certainly doesn't lock the doors when he naps alone in the house.

[Joyofsixreboot]

http://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/timeline-the-murder-of-amanda-blackburn

 

I haven't listened to the sermons. They had nothing to do with the crime. A friend of mine knew her slightly. Very sad.

[BlsdMama]

I disagree. Many break-ins are crimes of opportunity. An unlocked door is an opportunity.

 

A locked door is more of a nuisance to deal with, and it's a lot easier to be noticed and caught when smashing a window or kicking in a door than it is to quietly and discreetly stroll into an unlocked house.

 

 

And big or loud, barking dogs are a deterrent.  I remember a couple years ago when there was a very violent criminal in Oregon.  He did away with an older couple and a young man, and if I remember correctly, his own father, and was traveling either from CA or to there.  At any rate, he said he was specifically looking for homes without dogs to keep attention away from himself.

 

I've been grateful for our monsters ever since then.