Would you move from the suburbs to NYC?

[Aspasia]

DH has been offered an amazing job opportunity in midtown Manhattan. At first, we were just 100% stoked and assumed we would take it. I started looking at apartments and thinking about downsizing and I was really energized by it all. We LOVE New York City. I have been obsessed with it my entire life. I've wanted to live there since I was ten years old. 

 

But then I woke up a few hours ago (middle of the night) in a panic, sick to my stomach. The weight of this decision suddenly became just crushing. It's a HUGE lifestyle change for us. We live in a big house, with a big yard, on a culdesac. I have an amazing kitchen, with a laundry room right next to it. I have a big garden, the produce from which I freeze in a big chest freezer downstairs. My kids have a play set and a sandbox right in their backyard. We just bought a really great basketball hoop. They can play outside all day while I work in the house.

 

Are we crazy to leave this for a teeny tiny apartment in a big city, where my kids only get outside when I take them?

 

Here are my pros and cons:

Pros of moving to NYC

-Um...it's NYC! We love it! Living there has always been one of my dreams!

-Living in NYC would be an amazing adventure for our family--all the culture, the art, the music, the sights, the history, the food, the people, etc.

-The job is a step in the right direction for dh's career. 

-Right now he works in DC and we live far outside of it. His commute is a really big negative when it comes to our current quality of life. In NYC, we would live much closer, so we'd see him a lot more. We have been talking about moving in 2-3 years (when we could make more money on our house) for this reason.

-So many resources for homeschooling.

-So many resources for EVERYTHING.

-NYC is its own playground--we wouldn't need to have all the toys and fun right on our own property.

-We could spend our weekends doing fun family activities instead of yard work.

-We'd have a much smaller environmental impact (no car, smaller space, etc.)

-I wonder if cleaning would take up less of my time--we wouldn't have as much stuff, there wouldn't be as many places for children to strew it, and hey, one bathroom (maybe two) vs. four. FOUR. Who needs four bathrooms to clean, am I right?

-We could get away from our jerky next door neighbors who yell at our kids for playing outside. (This has been a huge source of stress for me. Huge.)

-We've actually been talking for the last few months about wanting to downsize a bit. This house is ridiculous.

 

Cons

-We didn't mean downsizing to three tiny bedrooms and a one-butt kitchen!

-We love our house. It's too big, but I've poured my heart into making it our home, and we love it here.

-We've only been here two years. We're not upside down in our loan, by any means, but it was a new construction home and we have put a LOT of money into things like a deck, fence, garden, play set, landscaping, fruit trees, appliances, furniture, etc. We wouldn't be able to recoup all that money. (Obviously, we thought we'd be staying here for awhile when we did those things.) 

-Um...laundry (though I have seen a few rentals with in-unit laundry)

-No Costco or Target. That's a big one.

-I'd have to actually walk my dog, instead of just letting him outside (this could probably be a pro, too--haha!)

-Homeschooling seems a lot harder in NY than it is in Virginia.

-I love my garden so much. Gardening is super healthy for me (though I imagine I would get involved with a community garden in NYC).

-It just seems like the logistics of daily life would be harder--laundry, grocery shopping, kids playing outside, etc. 

 

Mostly I just worry about getting there and then fantasizing about the ease of suburban life. But I wonder if the benefits of the experience would make it worth it.

 

Does anyone have experience? Insight? I know it happens in the other direction a lot--NYC to the suburbs. Maybe there's a reason for that?

 

 

 

[3 ladybugs]

I would go in a NY minute! 

 

There are stores like Costco and Target that are not far off of transit lines that you can get to. It is an island but it isn't the moon. I actually remember that there was a shuttle to Target when they first came to the area from the city. I assume that it isn't there now, but there has to be one not far off. And I KNOW there is Costco's not far from the transit line. I will be at one later today!

 

Laundry - From what I have heard (as I didn't live in NYC) they have reasonable laundry services that will pick up and drop off your laundry. So you may actually end up doing NO laundry and just paying people to do it. I guess this is fairly common as when I would go to the city often this is what people told me... unless they were pulling my leg. 

 

Garden - you can always container garden. No you don't get as much food, but you do get a release when you need it. :)

 

Logistics are what you make of them. Kids will adapt. You will figure out tricks to making things work. From what I understand in NYC (I lived in Cambridge, MA and this wasn't true) people go grocery shopping more often but buy WAY less food. Much like the what I am told the European system is like. So you go shopping for 1-2 days worth of food then eat that and get more. So you may find you don't need Target or Costco. Though I can tell you that there is a K-Mart in Penn Station. You will find your favorite park and go there and probably bring your schooling with you, that way older children can study while younger ones play. 

 

Good luck! I wish I was moving to the city! ;)

[Aspasia]

Thank you so much, 3 ladybugs! That is a good perspective for me to hear.

 

And look what I found! http://www.thelaundrycenter.comThey pick up, wash, fold, and deliver??? I think I'm sold on NYC already!

[3 ladybugs]

Yeah not having to do laundry would be a huge perk for me too! 

[abba12]

I'd go. I love the idea of city living, just can't afford to live there! lol. 

 

The perks are huge, and the downsides you list are mostly adaptable

[Alessandra]

Oh, my, what a tough decision. Your house and garden sound fabulous, and I can how difficult it would be to leave them for a smaller space. Even if you were in NYC suburbs, it could be hard to find as much space.

 

But also think about what your kids will be like in two years, five years. The swingset may lose its appeal, lol.

 

NYC is a wonderful place for kids to grow up. Zillions of activities. But be aware that things are more competitive and crowded. Be prepared to sign up for activities as soon as the registration opens, for example. As kids get older, they can become independent, take public transportation.

 

Would you be homeschooling? If not, check out the website, Inside Schools. If you can get ahold of New York magazine, you can get an idea of some current things going on. Random link popped up:

 

http://nymag.com/family/kids/

 

I would not, however, worry about Target, Costco, or laundry. Most apartment have machines in basement, or even small machines in apartment. As for stores, plenty to choose from, and many deliver. You will find whatever you need, just don't expect to buy it all in industrial sized quantities, lol.

 

Sorry, I am on a phone and can't see any siggy info you may have.

[Mama Geek]

I would not live near New York City, that would be a nightmare for me.  That being said, yes I have downsized and adjusted to small space apartment living.  Dh contracts we have a  nice home that we are not in but maybe a couple of months a year.  We spend lots of time in hotels or if the job is long enough apartments.  If I didn't mind the thought of it being NYC, yes I would do it.

[madteaparty]

Midtown is within easy (easy defined as around 1 hour)!of various towns in the boroughs like Astoria, Forest Hills (if you live near the E line) etc. I worked in midtown for many years and did not find it a pleasant place to live. You'd have to pay for parking too if you are living in Manhattan (or deal with opposite side parking when in the boroughs).

We left the city for a rural area (skipped the burbs altogether) but no one does what we do ;) DH commutes still. I can honestly say I've done more NYC things now that we no longer live there.

That said, we'll have to move back for high school most likely. We will make the most of it then but it's not my first choice, because been there, done that, and the moment we can leave again, we would.

[madteaparty]

Yeah not having to do laundry would be a huge perk for me too!

I feel like it gets never done the way one wants it though. Either it reeks of detergent and softener, or I always suspect hot water was not used for the whites. Yes, I am a control freak with the laundry. I went back to doing my own. The folding is amazing though, will admit to that.

[Carrie12345]

No.

I didn't even read your whole post.

 

Dh has worked mostly in NYC for 15 years.  We've lived 2+ hours away for a decade.

(He only goes in a couple of times a week on average now, but there were periods where it was daily or near-daily.)

I love NY, but it is not the lifestyle for us.  We like our woods and forest animals and peace and quiet.  The kids like their country freedoms.  And I like not being poorer than I actually am.

[Carrie12345]

 

 

-Homeschooling seems a lot harder in NY than it is in Virginia.

 

 

Live across the bridge and homeschooling will be even easier than in Virginia.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Not NYC in particular no. 

 

Really I love cities, but I don't get the allure of NYC. 

 

 

[catz]

I would! I don't know if I'd want to be there permanently, but I think it is a great opportunity!

 

I live in an urban neighborhood now. I could totally imagine moving to a downtown condo on a light rail line to retire.

[gingersmom]

My brother and his wife are in NYC with their young daughter (moving to Hong Kong but if come back will go back to NYC). My mother grew up in NYC. I lived in NYC for many many years.

 

Laundry services will lose some of your items and return some that don't belong to you (in my experience). Nannies and housekeepers hog all the washers/dryers during the day. I did laundry at midnight.

 

Target and Costco are around 125th street and very very popular. Have you ever been to Fairway Market?

 

What if you decide to stop homeschooling. Have you looked at public or private schools and costs?

 

Activities for kids in NYC are abundant but cost $$$$.

 

Have you priced a 3 bedroom? You do realize your neighbors are more than likely to complain about some noise from your kids. Or the overflow of kids stuff that gets left outside apartment doors.

 

My mother moved back 30 years ago and would never leave. My brother and his wife have both been ther 25 years and love it. I liked it but realized living in a large apartment building was not my cup of tea.

 

Eta: I had a terrace ( not tiny things you see, brick enclosed, really rare) I gardened, had a grill, picnic table and park bench. It was huge! My dogs thought it was a backyard. Extremely rare to find though.

[AngelaNYC]

I've lived in NYC my whole life and it's been nothing but wonderful.  It got even better when I started homeschooling and I got to go places and do things I never knew about.  The homeschool scene is incredibly active here, too.  

 

Are you planning on living in Manhattan or one of the other boroughs (Queens?  Brooklyn?).  I live in Queens and it's got a way more suburban feel to it.  I have a backyard, front patio, garage, and washer and dryer in my house.  We've had a garden in the backyard - some in the ground, some in containers (zucchini, eggplant, peppers, herbs - even watermelon, lol), a sandbox, and a pool.  I can walk to everything and Manhattan is a 15-minute train ride.  My apartment (2nd-floor of a 2-family home) is cozy for the 5 of us, but we love it.  The kids always say they would never live in any other city.  

 

I go to Costco and Target all the time.

Homeschooling requires some paperwork, but it's not a big deal and it's worth it.

Daily life seems easier for me here in the city than for my mom way out in suburban Long Island.  

Ask me questions.

 

[madteaparty]

My brother and his wife are in NYC with their young daughter (moving to Hong Kong but if come back will go back to NYC). My mother grew up in NYC. I lived in NYC for many many years.

 

Laundry services will lose some of your items and return some that don't belong to you (in my experience). Nannies and housekeepers hog all the washers/dryers during the day. I did laundry at midnight.

 

...

 

Activities for kids in NYC are abundant but cost $$$$.

 

Have you priced a 3 bedroom? You do realize your neighbors are more than likely to complain about some noise from your kids. Or the overflow of kids stuff that gets left outside apartment doors

To add to this great post; you may end up paying a small fortune in rent and still deal with vermin and whining neighbors. You will smell the dinner everyone on the building is cooking. Anything mildly interesting is a line and/or a bunch of $$$ to pay for. The line to just enter trader joes on the weekend extends outside in the pavement(or used to). Then you wait again to pay. No matter how much $ you make, you will be the poorest person around and wonder where you went wrong (ok, I'm partly joking with this last one. Maybe it was just me ;)

[lovinmyboys]

I, too, would love to live in NYC. Dh could transfer there with his job anytime he wants. He is a federal government employee though and I just don't feel that he would make enough to make it worth it for our family of four kids. The people in his job (that we know) commute like 2hrs each way everyday. I'm guessing if they could afford to live in Manhattan near the job they would.

 

I'm guessing your Dh will make enough it may be worth it to you. Your kids will have different experiences than now, but I think it would be good different.

 

One thing to consider if you will be homeschooling there is that you will likely spend time at home. Will it drive you crazy to be in a small space with your kids several hours a day? Obviously you can go out a lot, but sometimes everyone may be stuck inside. We stayed in a 2 bedroom tiny apartment visiting Dh in a different big city for a couple of months. It was really good in some ways (less cleaning, less stuff), but by the end I was ready to come home where the kids have a basement and backyard to play in. It may have been different if that was our actual home.

 

If this has been a dream of yours, I think you should go for it.

[Amira]

I'm not a suburb person and would always choose to live in the city if it allows a shorter commute. Moving from the outer suburbs of DC to urban NYC is definitely something I'd want to do. I don't like being in an urban environment all the time and it takes forever to get out of a big city and away from all the people, but I've found that its more important to me to make daily life the best we can. I dislike dealing with driving everywhere in the suburbs or when we're rural, and I really dislike it when someone in the family has a long commute so living in a city where the commute is short and where I can walk or take public transportation to all the things works really well for me. For me, the logistics of daily life are actually easier in a city than the suburbs and I love not having to rely on Costco and Target. I can walk to small neighborhood places instead and it's so much more pleasant.

 

I miss having a garden, a lot. But it's a trade I'm more than willing to make. We had a spot in a community garden when we lived in Seattle and that was lovely. Get on the waiting list ASAP.

 

Cleaning a smaller space takes a lot less time. A huge amount less time. I cannot even being to express how much I am looking forward to moving to a two-bedroom apartment from a five-bedroom, six-bathroom house in a few weeks. It can be the most wonderful thing to downsize. But you really do have to get rid of the stuff. Dealing with too much stuff in a small space is not freeing.

[Alessandra]

I've lived in NYC my whole life and it's been nothing but wonderful. It got even better when I started homeschooling and I got to go places and do things I never knew about. The homeschool scene is incredibly active here, too.

 

Are you planning on living in Manhattan or one of the other boroughs (Queens? Brooklyn?). I live in Queens and it's got a way more suburban feel to it. I have a backyard, front patio, garage, and washer and dryer in my house. We've had a garden in the backyard - some in the ground, some in containers (zucchini, eggplant, peppers, herbs - even watermelon, lol), a sandbox, and a pool. I can walk to everything and Manhattan is a 15-minute train ride. My apartment (2nd-floor of a 2-family home) is cozy for the 5 of us, but we love it. The kids always say they would never live in any other city.

 

I go to Costco and Target all the time.

Homeschooling requires some paperwork, but it's not a big deal and it's worth it.

Daily life seems easier for me here in the city than for my mom way out in suburban Long Island.

Ask me questions.

It sounds wonderful! I remember when Queens was not everyone's first choice, now it seems like the new frontier.

[Aspasia]

My brother and his wife are in NYC with their young daughter (moving to Hong Kong but if come back will go back to NYC). My mother grew up in NYC. I lived in NYC for many many years.

 

Laundry services will lose some of your items and return some that don't belong to you (in my experience). Nannies and housekeepers hog all the washers/dryers during the day. I did laundry at midnight.

 

No! I thought it sounded so dreamy!

 

Target and Costco are around 125th street and very very popular. Have you ever been to Fairway Market?

 

Phew!

 

What if you decide to stop homeschooling. Have you looked at public or private schools and costs?

 

Haven't looked at public schools. Wouldn't do private.

 

Activities for kids in NYC are abundant but cost $$$$.

 

Have you priced a 3 bedroom? You do realize your neighbors are more than likely to complain about some noise from your kids. Or the overflow of kids stuff that gets left outside apartment doors.

 

We have priced them. And we could possibly even get a 4-bedroom. I've definitely thought about the noise and neighbor complaints. That's one of my big worries. Forgot to list it in the cons. DH said that it hopefully wouldn't be a problem during the day because most people would be at work, right?

 

My mother moved back 30 years ago and would never leave. My brother and his wife have both been ther 25 years and love it. I liked it but realized living in a large apartment building was not my cup of tea.

 

Eta: I had a terrace ( not tiny things you see, brick enclosed, really rare) I gardened, had a grill, picnic table and park bench. It was huge! My dogs thought it was a backyard. Extremely rare to find though.

 

[ErinE]

I have four children, two old enough to manage parts of the city on their own. I would not do it except for a short time commitment (one year or less). My comments are based on my experience living in NYC with one child and the middle of Boston with multiple children.

 

Pros:

* Convenience-Everything is readily available. The museums are so much fun. Every ethnicity is represented in the various restaurants. Clothes were one of the few items that were cheaper so long as you waited for the discount sales.

* Fun- living in NYC was a wonderful experience. We were always busy; there's an activity, street fair, museum event, etc. every weekend. I'm grateful we had the chance to live there. I would spend hours just walking around the different areas.

* Urban/Suburban- Battery Park City has a suburban feel. I still have friends living there and their kids enjoy it. It's very expensive though.

 

Cons

* Expensive - Everything costs more: food, housing, transportation. We lived in a one-bedroom. Two bedrooms were barely within our price range; the only people I knew with three bedrooms either lived way out in the boroughs or were extremely wealthy. We were so careful with our funds and yet we still barely kept our head above water financially.

* Transportation-you have four children (three small). You most likely won't be able to get a cab to just pick you up. How will you juggle car seats? You will need to haul a double-stroller up and down subway stairs while keeping track of all four kids; subway elevators are either broken or smell so bad you gag. If you go shopping, you will need to pay to have the items delivered or figure out someway to carry bags, kids, stroller, etc. With four kids, I wouldn't live in NYC without a car so you'll need to factor in the cost of parking.

* No free time- You will have very little, unless you find a nanny (very expensive) or can get a daycare (expensive and long waiting lists). You must be with the kids at parks; you won't be able to just send them outside to play. I would not discount this benefit.

* School - we left NYC just when oldest DS was getting to school age. If you'd like public or private school as a backup to homeschooling, keep in mind it's competitive. I was shocked at the tests and evaluations schools required from young children, and I really disliked the condescending attitude from administrators (probably justified given the number of parents competing for spots). You really will be very lucky if you get into a good elementary school; good middle and high school are even more difficult get into.

[madteaparty]

If you can afford a 4 bedroom in NYC then most of my comments would not apply to that experience. Oh, and you can always fresh direct everything :)

[ErinE]

I forgot to add you need to include the NYC income tax for any budgets you create.

[JFSinIL]

With the ages of your kids, I would stay put for a couple more years at least. How long is the commute to NYC from where you are?  For years hubby had over an hour commute (walk to train, train, walk to office) door to door from our house in Elgin to his office in downtown Chicago.  Being able to read or listen to podcasts (or nap) on a train makes longish commute tolerable.  Driving would not be near as good.

[lmrich]

YES! I would love a new adventure. How long are you talking about living there? You could always do it for a year and then reevaluate it. 

[kewb]

Yes. In a ny minute. Although, I live in the burbs close to nyc so I get the best of both worlds.

[wapiti]

We were just there with our six kids.  NYC is great fun when you're prepared to spend, which we did, being on vacation.  My two cents:  if I absolutely had to live in Manhattan, it would probably be on the Upper West Side and as close to the park as possible.  I would not want to live in midtown with a family.  In your shoes, with four young kids, I'd definitely be exploring commute times and communities outside of Manhattan.

 

Consider transportation costs in your calculations.  Can you wrangle the four kids by yourself on the subway?  Down the steps?  For us, with 8 people, we would need two taxis so we took the subway quite a bit, though that's still over $20 for a one-way trip (IIRC, $22-24, depending) so round-trips add up fast.  One slice of pizza x8, >$25.  Stopping for an ice cream cone, >$30.  Some of this isn't much more than anyplace else, but not eating at home because it was a vacation, it was more noticeable.  That dinner out with our friends plus our kids was suddenly >$250 (though it was yummy).  Box of cheerios at the corner market, $6.50.

 

Budget for summer escapes.

 

Even with all the downsides, if it's important for your dh's career, I'd definitely do it.  It would be an interesting experience, especially if it's only for a few years.

 

Eta, looking at the ages of your kids, there's an issue with the dog-walking.  There's a choice to be made, either leaving them in the apartment for 10 minutes or taking them all with you if your dh isn't home.  Ugh.  That'll get easier in a couple years when the oldest can be in charge for a few minutes.  I have no idea what most New Yorkers would do in that situation (other than the fact that there are dog walkers).

[gardenmom5]

I can only share the experience of a young woman of my acquaintance.  she received her MS degree from a school in NYC.  she loved  living in the city. she took a job in the city (different borough)  she said living in the city as a non-student wasn't as fun. (and much more expensive.)  she's also single, and has no children.

[AHASRADA]

I have no familiarity with NYC, but I did move from the rural area I grew up in to my "dream" city, the city I would have loved to live in for college, the city that I never could have imagined having the opportunity to live in full time, and that dream came true!

 

We looked at several places in the heart of the city, excited by the prospect of walking to all amenities, taking public transport, the thrill, the adventure...

 

But then my practical side took hold. I had 2 kids aged 10 and 7 at the time. They had never been without a yard, without a safe, quiet street to ride their bikes, without space to stretch out a bit and store all their beloved toys.

 

So, we decided to play it safe. We still downsized, from a full-sized house to a townhouse-style duplex, from an enormous yard with 2 sheds and a swingset to a small deck and yard. We traded a quiet, village life to an established suburb, where the kids can both ride their bikes safely and walk to a few amenities, where the city can be accessed by public transport within 20 minutes, but we can retreat from the hustle and bustle when we feel the need.

 

The drastic lifestyle change can seem exciting, but I found it more realistic and palatable to compromise on mid-sized living quarters just outside the city. Best of both worlds, IMHO.

[Halcyon]

I grew up in NYC and homeschooled my kids there--we left 5 years ago due to the cost of living. 

 

IF you can afford it, NYC is an absolutely fantastic place to homeschool. The rich resources are beyond compare. The Museum of Natural History, the Met, Central Park, outdoor concerts, incredible human diversity on every single block, amazing food, incredible people, opportunities for your kids at museums, the Botanic Gardens etc (if you can afford them, again)...Now that my son is a teenager I truly wish we could live there again--at 13, he is old enough to travel on the subway, visit museums, have more independence, and that would be a tremendous plus for him,

 

Homeschooling, law-wise, in NYC is super easy. It's made out to be harder than it is, but really, once every quarter you mail in a straghtforward form and that's it. Is it annoying and bureaucratic? Yes. Do they sometimes lose your form? Yes (use registered mail or drop it off yourself). Do they sometimes contact you for failing to submit when you already have? Yes. (Ask me how I know). But really, don't let that dissuade you. There are people who can help you out there, and many resources.

 

The homeschool group there is called NYCHEA and it has tons of fun activities for all ages. I met some wonderful moms through that group, and my kids had friends from the group that they still talk about, 5 years on. 

 

So what are the cons? Cost. NYC is incredibly expensive, so I hope your DH is making a very good salary. $150,000 is nothing there, and unless he's being provided with an apartment, it won't go far. Our tiny 2 bedroom (800 sf) in Battery Park CIty (granted, a great place to live--you should consider looking there--quick subway ride to midtown) is renting for $3,500 a month now. Buying an apartment was out of the question for us--easily expect to pay $1.2 million on the island. 

 

Brooklyn is also a wonderful place to live, and again, parts of it are a very easy commute to midtown. There are a TON of kids in places like Park Slope, Carroll Gardens and Brooklyn Heights, but expect to pay similar rents to Manhattan.

 

What else is a con? Having a car is very expensive--garaging it will cost you $500 a month easy and so that was out of the question for us when we lived there. Which meant subways, to everything, all the time. WHich meant lugging kids' athletic gear, lugging groceries, etc. Now they have Amazon Prime and FreshDirect--groceries delivered right to your door, which most NYers now use. Get a doorman building or your stuff can't be delivered unless you are there! THe weather in the winter is pretty cruddy--and given that you have to slog through in, kids in tow, to get to any events you want to go to--it can be hard.

 

But the rich cultural experiences will ABSOLUTELY be worth it. Yes, you will have to downsize TREMENDOUSLY. But you're right in that most of the time you are not in your apartment--you're out and about, you're in the children's parks with tons of other people, you're at museums, you're trying that awesome new Pakistani restaurant down the block....

 

I say go for it. 

 

 

ETA: just saw the ages of your kids. YOu will definitely need to find someone to help you out. I think lugging 4 kids around the city, on the subway, will be very, very hard--stroller for the little, maybe for the 4 yo (there's a TON of walking in nyc and my son used a stroller til he was 6 as we walked upwards of 3-4 miles a day). If you can hire a pt sitter, then you can take the two olders out on day trips sometimes without the younger ones, which will make your life a lot easier. Be prepared to spend $20 an hour for a sitter. Sigh. It all seems to come down to money. 

 

[Halcyon]

I've lived in NYC my whole life and it's been nothing but wonderful.  It got even better when I started homeschooling and I got to go places and do things I never knew about.  The homeschool scene is incredibly active here, too.  

 

Are you planning on living in Manhattan or one of the other boroughs (Queens?  Brooklyn?).  I live in Queens and it's got a way more suburban feel to it.  I have a backyard, front patio, garage, and washer and dryer in my house.  We've had a garden in the backyard - some in the ground, some in containers (zucchini, eggplant, peppers, herbs - even watermelon, lol), a sandbox, and a pool.  I can walk to everything and Manhattan is a 15-minute train ride.  My apartment (2nd-floor of a 2-family home) is cozy for the 5 of us, but we love it.  The kids always say they would never live in any other city.  

 

I go to Costco and Target all the time.

Homeschooling requires some paperwork, but it's not a big deal and it's worth it.

Daily life seems easier for me here in the city than for my mom way out in suburban Long Island.  

Ask me questions.

 

 

I second this--living in Queens or somewhere just outside manhattan would be my suggestion--more space but still easy to get into the city. 

[Aspasia]

YES! I would love a new adventure. How long are you talking about living there? You could always do it for a year and then reevaluate it. 

 

That's kind of how I want to approach it. We'll go in planning to give it a couple years and then go from there. 

 

We were just there with our six kids.  NYC is great fun when you're prepared to spend, which we did, being on vacation.  My two cents:  if I absolutely had to live in Manhattan, it would probably be on the Upper West Side and as close to the park as possible (e.g. we stayed on 81st St btw Central Park West and Columbus; there's a playground a block away in Central Park - the distance would be critical IMO).  I would not want to live in midtown with a family.  In your shoes, with four young kids, I'd definitely be exploring commute times and communities outside of Manhattan.

 

Yeah, I'm mostly looking at the Upper West Side, Upper East, and some outer boroughs.

 

Consider transportation costs in your calculations.  Can you wrangle the four kids by yourself on the subway?  Down the steps?  For us, with 8 people, we would need two taxis so we took the subway quite a bit, though that's still over $20 for a one-way trip (IIRC, $22-24, depending) so round-trips add up fast.  One slice of pizza x8, >$25.  Stopping for an ice cream cone, >$30.  Some of this isn't much more than anyplace else, but not eating at home because it was a vacation, it was more noticeable.  That dinner out with our friends plus our kids was suddenly >$250 (though it was yummy).  Box of cheerios at the corner market, $6.50.

 

We intend to try and go carless (which is why we're leaning toward Manhattan), so hopefully that $600+ that we spend on car payment and insurance and gas will offset the cost of the subway. And I guess homeschoolers are eligible for student Metro cards? 

 

As for eating out, even now, any eating out, even at a place like Chipotle, costs at least $30-$40. We're used to that. It adds up with a big family. And that's why we rarely eat out. ;)

 

Budget for summer escapes.

 

Even with all the downsides, if it's important for your dh's career, I'd definitely do it.  It would be an interesting experience, especially if it's only for a few years.  My dh grew up in Manhattan in a not-so-nice area and the environment was generally pretty miserable.  The bright spot for him was attending Hunter College High School, which changed everything.

 

Eta, looking at the ages of your kids, there's an issue with the dog-walking.  There's a choice to be made, either leaving them in the apartment for 10 minutes or taking them all with you if your dh isn't home.  Ugh.  That'll get easier in a couple years when the oldest can be in charge for a few minutes.  I have no idea what most New Yorkers would do in that situation (other than the fact that there are dog walkers).

 

Yeah, I will likely have to bring everyone with me, at least once a day. But that would probably be good for all of us!

[Aspasia]

I've lived in NYC my whole life and it's been nothing but wonderful.  It got even better when I started homeschooling and I got to go places and do things I never knew about.  The homeschool scene is incredibly active here, too.  

 

Are you planning on living in Manhattan or one of the other boroughs (Queens?  Brooklyn?).  I live in Queens and it's got a way more suburban feel to it.  I have a backyard, front patio, garage, and washer and dryer in my house.  We've had a garden in the backyard - some in the ground, some in containers (zucchini, eggplant, peppers, herbs - even watermelon, lol), a sandbox, and a pool.  I can walk to everything and Manhattan is a 15-minute train ride.  My apartment (2nd-floor of a 2-family home) is cozy for the 5 of us, but we love it.  The kids always say they would never live in any other city.  

 

I go to Costco and Target all the time.

Homeschooling requires some paperwork, but it's not a big deal and it's worth it.

Daily life seems easier for me here in the city than for my mom way out in suburban Long Island.  

Ask me questions.

 

I love this post so much! I will definitely come to you with my questions. Thanks so much for offering. :)

[Aspasia]

I second this--living in Queens or somewhere just outside manhattan would be my suggestion--more space but still easy to get into the city. 

 

I'm torn about it, because I'd rather just not have a car. Angela, do you guys drive?

 

And we'd like to keep dh's commute to 30-40 minutes or less. I'm so over this 3-hour daily commute!

[Library Momma]

What about Connecticut.  If you can afford a 4 bedroom in Manhattan you can definitely afford towns with a close NYC commute like Greenwich or Cos Cob.  A plus is that homeschooling is super easy in CT and all of those museums and NY spots are just a short train ride away.  You would also have the beach access CT affords.  NJ is another option.

[scholastica]

I grew up in New York and totally agree with my Dad when he says that it's a great place to be from. I would never live there again. My dh had an opportunity to go there for work and I said no. We still have extended family there, but no-one in my immediate family lives there. It's a great place to visit, but, for me, it's too crowded, smelly, noisy, expensive, etc. I don't even go visit very often. I now live in the Midwest and enjoy it. The only thing I miss is the beach, which my dh plans on moving me to eventually. Having lived also in the Southeast, I would pick that over NYC any day.

 

Good luck with your decision.

[Alessandra]

I grew up in NYC and homeschooled my kids there--we left 5 years ago due to the cost of living.

 

IF you can afford it, NYC is an absolutely fantastic place to homeschool. The rich resources are beyond compare. The Museum of Natural History, the Met, Central Park, outdoor concerts, incredible human diversity on every single block, amazing food, incredible people, opportunities for your kids at museums, the Botanic Gardens etc (if you can afford them, again)...Now that my son is a teenager I truly wish we could live there again--at 13, he is old enough to travel on the subway, visit museums, have more independence, and that would be a tremendous plus for him,

 

Homeschooling, law-wise, in NYC is super easy. It's made out to be harder than it is, but really, once every quarter you mail in a straghtforward form and that's it. Is it annoying and bureaucratic? Yes. Do they sometimes lose your form? Yes (use registered mail or drop it off yourself). Do they sometimes contact you for failing to submit when you already have? Yes. (Ask me how I know). But really, don't let that dissuade you. There are people who can help you out there, and many resources.

 

The homeschool group there is called NYCHEA and it has tons of fun activities for all ages. I met some wonderful moms through that group, and my kids had friends from the group that they still talk about, 5 years on.

 

So what are the cons? Cost. NYC is incredibly expensive, so I hope your DH is making a very good salary. $150,000 is nothing there, and unless he's being provided with an apartment, it won't go far. Our tiny 2 bedroom (800 sf) in Battery Park CIty (granted, a great place to live--you should consider looking there--quick subway ride to midtown) is renting for $3,500 a month now. Buying an apartment was out of the question for us--easily expect to pay $1.2 million on the island.

 

Brooklyn is also a wonderful place to live, and again, parts of it are a very easy commute to midtown. There are a TON of kids in places like Park Slope, Carroll Gardens and Brooklyn Heights, but expect to pay similar rents to Manhattan.

 

What else is a con? Having a car is very expensive--garaging it will cost you $500 a month easy and so that was out of the question for us when we lived there. Which meant subways, to everything, all the time. WHich meant lugging kids' athletic gear, lugging groceries, etc. Now they have Amazon Prime and FreshDirect--groceries delivered right to your door, which most NYers now use. Get a doorman building or your stuff can't be delivered unless you are there! THe weather in the winter is pretty cruddy--and given that you have to slog through in, kids in tow, to get to any events you want to go to--it can be hard.

 

But the rich cultural experiences will ABSOLUTELY be worth it. Yes, you will have to downsize TREMENDOUSLY. But you're right in that most of the time you are not in your apartment--you're out and about, you're in the children's parks with tons of other people, you're at museums, you're trying that awesome new Pakistani restaurant down the block....

 

I say go for it.

 

 

ETA: just saw the ages of your kids. YOu will definitely need to find someone to help you out. I think lugging 4 kids around the city, on the subway, will be very, very hard--stroller for the little, maybe for the 4 yo (there's a TON of walking in nyc and my son used a stroller til he was 6 as we walked upwards of 3-4 miles a day). If you can hire a pt sitter, then you can take the two olders out on day trips sometimes without the younger ones, which will make your life a lot easier. Be prepared to spend $20 an hour for a sitter. Sigh. It all seems to come down to money.

It's too hard to edit quotes on iPad, but I wanted to highlight the part about Battery Park City. I am a former Upper East & West sider (before kids). I remember when *I* was a young kid how much I loved getting out of the city in the summer. There were just so many buildings and so few trees. Battery Park City did not exist when I was growing up, but it is a great area -- it feels so open and breezy, lots of sky, trees, greenery, and the river of course. Center of the city, but not hemmed in. So, if you can afford it, worth a look.

 

Someone mentioned eating out costs. This may just be me, but I find simple food is comparable or cheaper in NYC than in my NJ suburb. By simple, I mean bagels, Ceasar said type things at places with a counter and tables.

[Home'scool]

I have always been up for a big adventure when it comes to moving, and I always told my husband that I would be willing to move wherever he needed in order for him to be successful in his career. I'm a kind of "make it work" type of person.

 

That being said, I think I would hate living in NYC. I just went there a few months ago for vacation. The crowds! The prices of everything! The noise!! I would live in other cities in a heartbeat, but NYC is unlike most. 

 

What really got to me, though, were the people. Any time I needed to ask directions or something I would be met with such suspicion and literally no help. People are very guarded (and rightly so - it is NYC) but my sister and I are two 50 year old ladies who were obviously tourists! No one was friendly at all. Everyone walks in their own little bubble, and when you approach and say "excuse me?" they would jump as if shocked and immediately back away. Then I would say "I was just wondering if we keep walking on this street will we reach such and so" and they would mumble something or just shake their head or whatever and then close down into their own bubble again. 

 

I think NYC can do that to you because it is so fast paced with everyone rushing to get where they need to be. New Yorkers pride themselves on being brusk and hurried. I would not like to change into that just to survive there.

[Sarah CB]

I would do it in a second.  I love big cities and I think it's a total adventure to live in one.  We moved to London, England when my eldest was five and my second child was ten months old.  We lived there for two years and had a fantastic time.  Just the museums and galleries alone were worth it, but there was so much more to explore.  

 

Then we lived in BC where we had a huge house with an acre yard.  I am not a big gardening person and was always thinking about things I'd rather be doing than weeding.  Now we live in Newfoundland - we've downsized the house and the yard we have now can be mown in 15 minutes.  I love it.  

 

If my dh had the opportunity to work in NYC I would be totally on board.  One of my worries when we lived in BC was that we would get stuck in the same place doing the same thing for the rest of our lives - I want to expose my kids to different cultures and different cities.  

[Sarah CB]

 

 

 

ETA: just saw the ages of your kids. YOu will definitely need to find someone to help you out. I think lugging 4 kids around the city, on the subway, will be very, very hard--stroller for the little, maybe for the 4 yo (there's a TON of walking in nyc and my son used a stroller til he was 6 as we walked upwards of 3-4 miles a day). If you can hire a pt sitter, then you can take the two olders out on day trips sometimes without the younger ones, which will make your life a lot easier. Be prepared to spend $20 an hour for a sitter. Sigh. It all seems to come down to money. 

 

I disagree.  I lived in London and when my third was born I was traipsing around the city with a newborn, a two year old and a six year old.  We had an amazing time.  I had the baby in the carrier, my two year old in the stroller, and my five year old hanging on to the stroller.  I went all over the city by myself - on and off tubes, up huge long escalators or down big flights of stairs, through crowds, wherever.  I loved every minute of it.  And there were such fun things for the little kids to do - great parks and playgrounds, fun hands-on exhibits at museums for very little kids.  It was fun.  

[whitestavern]

Live across the bridge and homeschooling will be even easier than in Virginia.

 

This would be the case if you decided on CT also.

[WinsomeCreek]

Yes. I moved four kids from the country to the city (seattle area, in our case). We downsized to nearly 1/5th our prior living space. I am a nature loving introvert and ... I am LOVING it!!! Shopping is actually easier, except for bringing groceries up to the apt, however I have used the grocery delivery service when the kids were sick and would use it again for convenience. Costco has a cart that works well for towing grocery bags and kids.

 

We took the four kids to Manhattan for a week earlier this year. I was surprised to find the metro easy to use and rather safe feeling. I would not take a car to NY. I also felt like the city was extremely kid friendly with activities everywhere. I didn't want to leave. On the other hand, you have more little ones. The stroller was necessary for the baby, but it was a hassle to take. My next oldest was old enough to get around on his own. You will need a hand on your 3 yo, right? I also had the help of my older kids. If I were in your shoes I would spend less on housing and have a nanny.

 

This is probably more unique to our situation, but my kids had not made great friends in the half decade we lived in the countryside. They have already found kindred spirits in the city. I suspect it's a matter of numbers and having more people to interact with, but it has been extraordinary.

 

Can you go for a week or two with all of the kids? Get a feel for what life might be like before making such a huge commitment?

[WinsomeCreek]

I have always been up for a big adventure when it comes to moving, and I always told my husband that I would be willing to move wherever he needed in order for him to be successful in his career. I'm a kind of "make it work" type of person.

 

That being said, I think I would hate living in NYC. I just went there a few months ago for vacation. The crowds! The prices of everything! The noise!! I would live in other cities in a heartbeat, but NYC is unlike most.

 

What really got to me, though, were the people. Any time I needed to ask directions or something I would be met with such suspicion and literally no help. People are very guarded (and rightly so - it is NYC) but my sister and I are two 50 year old ladies who were obviously tourists! No one was friendly at all. Everyone walks in their own little bubble, and when you approach and say "excuse me?" they would jump as if shocked and immediately back away. Then I would say "I was just wondering if we keep walking on this street will we reach such and so" and they would mumble something or just shake their head or whatever and then close down into their own bubble again.

 

I think NYC can do that to you because it is so fast paced with everyone rushing to get where they need to be. New Yorkers pride themselves on being brusk and hurried. I would not like to change into that just to survive there.

I'm sorry you had this experience. Ours was not at all like that. We found people to be friendly and helpful. Maybe having kids helped? Maybe it was where we went? Maybe it was Dh, who has a knack for putting people at ease?

[AngelaNYC]

I'm torn about it, because I'd rather just not have a car. Angela, do you guys drive?

 

And we'd like to keep dh's commute to 30-40 minutes or less. I'm so over this 3-hour daily commute!

 

We have a car.  If we lived in Manhattan we wouldn't.  We actually could do without one here in Queens since everything is in walking distance and buses and trains are everywhere if we needed it.  

 

It gets tiresome hearing NYC being called rude, super expensive, super crowded, smelly, noisy, etc.  If it were this bad, no one would live here.  I work for the cable company and I see first hand the amount of people moving here from the rest of the country, and it's a lot.  Probably because it's awesome here.   :)  

 

http://www.huffingto..._n_5521913.html

 

http://www.timeout.c...-country-073015

 

http://www.businessi...he-world-2015-1

 

It was also voted as the greenest city a few years ago.  

[madteaparty]

We have a car. If we lived in Manhattan we wouldn't. We actually could do without one here in Queens since everything is in walking distance and buses and trains are everywhere if we needed it.

It gets tiresome hearing NYC being called rude, super expensive, super crowded, smelly, noisy, etc. If it were this bad, no one would live here. I work for the cable company and I see first hand the amount of people moving here from the rest of the country, and it's a lot. Probably because it's awesome here. :)

http://www.huffingto..._n_5521913.html

http://www.timeout.c...-country-073015

http://www.businessi...he-world-2015-1

It was also voted as the greenest city a few years ago.

Well, it is that smelly, noisy etc. I mean that's factual. One can admit that and still enjoy living there.Surely waking down a sidewalk around this time of year you wouldn't disagree? And recent surveys show that people's perceived quality of life has declined (I still listen to WNYC;) People move there because certain jobs can only be had there. They move in and out in about equal numbers. A whole class of first year attorneys or investment bankers move in, another class of 6th years moves to Westchester. Well- worn path both ways ;)

[madteaparty]

If you are moving to Queens there's a Costco in Long Island City but you need to drive here. Quirky little sculpture park next door.

[MEmama]

I'm sorry you had this experience. Ours was not at all like that. We found people to be friendly and helpful. Maybe having kids helped? Maybe it was where we went? Maybe it was Dh, who has a knack for putting people at ease?

That was our experience, too. We've only been once, when DS was not quite 5. It was awesome. We found the people to be so kind--we took a stroller because we knew we'd be walking so much, and every time we used the subway people would offer us their seats. Everyone we talked to was really helpful about giving directions or whatever. Maybe it was the weather--60's in January!!--or maybe we got lucky, but we were pleasantly surprised.

 

I'm not sure if I'd move there or not. I've long fantasized about retiring there, but the longer I live in a small town and the mre introverted I seem to get, the less sure I am that I could handle the constant noise and people. However, I think under the right circumstances (quiet apt and unlimited funds lol) it might be really wonderful.

 

We rented center city apartments on our trip to Europe this summer and I could easily see myself living that lifestyle. But those cities weren't NYC or anything like it. The area would have to be just right.

[Tanaqui]

I'm torn about it, because I'd rather just not have a car. Angela, do you guys drive?

 

Even if you live on Staten Island (hi!), you can get by without a car. Mind, I wouldn't want to try that on the South Shore, unless I was, like, right next to the train (our *only* train, but at least it's free and mostly runs on time), because Staten Island has awful bus service and, did I say, only one train, but you can do it.

 

I'm sorry you had this experience. Ours was not at all like that. We found people to be friendly and helpful. Maybe having kids helped? Maybe it was where we went? Maybe it was Dh, who has a knack for putting people at ease?

 

Maybe it was her. Most people I know fall all over themselves to give directions to tourists (if they know the directions in the first place, that is), and when I'm telling people how to get from here to there there's usually a second or even a third person helping out or telling them a better route. My guess is something in her "excuse me" screamed "do you have a minute for Greenpeace?" or else she was asking for help in a strange, roundabout way that made it unclear what she needed. Or perhaps she was going to strange and obscure places and nobody *could* help her.

 

I've been to other places. Never saw such rude people in my life as when I'm visiting my grandmother in California.

[gingersmom]

If you are moving to Queens there's a Costco in Long Island City but you need to drive here. Quirky little sculpture park next door.

It is the most crowded Costco I have ever been to. Between parking and then trying to find a cart. Too much madness for me.

 

My Costco now is empty empty. I love it!

[Farrar]

I live in an inner city, but NYC intimidates me. I think I'd do it, but I second the suggestion to live in Brooklyn or Queens or something. City living is expensive. But I've always heard that there's a great NYC homeschooling community and the resources are excellent.