lewelma Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Math is about problem solving. Algorithms need to be learned, but the end goal is to apply math to real world or theoretical situations Math is about communication. You need to teach your student to be able to speak and write using mathematical language. Math is hard work. You need intensity of focus and lots of effort. Your student must put in the time. Math work needs to be checked and corrected immediately. This will really help with learning efficiently. Math tests are sometimes about speed. Math is not. Math needs to be tidy. You are more likely to get a problem right if it is tidy. Please help me fill in this list, Ruth in NZ edited to add: I just realized that this might come across snarky to the OP of the previous thread. This is not my intent. What I would like is to draw out our combined knowledge and make a thread that newbie homeschoolers could use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FO4UR Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Arithmetic needs to be efficient and accurate. Arithmetic is not the sum total of math. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmmetler Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 In many cases, calculators hurt more than help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quark Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Math is beautiful. Math is all around you. Disillusioned with why you are learning math? Look at origami and math, looks at fractals, use math to understand why small dogs overheat much faster than most larger dogs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcadia Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 That Math is not a big scary monster :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quark Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Oh and something that really clicked for me when DH explained it (because I'm a language person). Math is a language. It needs practice, needs to be used daily. Math is a language of science as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quark Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 I wish Lockhart's Lament was required homeschool reading too. Sorry for the repeated posts. For a non-mathy person I seem to love math posts, weird. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodland Mist Academy Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Math is beautiful. One day I commented that a math problem was beautiful. Lily scoffed and glared. A few weeks later she exclaimed, "I found one! It's a beautiful problem!" I love that memory. :001_wub: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 There are different ways to approach math for different kids. There are so many wonderful curricula out there for different types of math learners and teachers. Math can be a really fun and creative subject. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quark Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 I wish more homeschoolers knew that there is a movement/ curriculum/ yahoo group called living math where the combined efforts of interested persons are helping more and more children to love math. And that this love can come about more naturally (and be spurred by even non-mathy parents) by simply adding a few math lit books to your basket when you are next at the library then reading the books together when you get home. http://www.livingmath.net https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/LivingMathForum/conversations/messages Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootAnn Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 There is math in art and art in math. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 By the way, maybe about a year ago, I was having a conversation with another homeschooler, a former math teacher, about math, and he said that he felt like homeschoolers just didn't have a handle on math and didn't think much about math and I was like, good grief, get over to the WTM forum and you'll see some serious math education thinking. This forum seriously rocks math. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmilyGF Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 People solve problems, not computers. Scientists and mathematicians don't start solving tricky problems until they have an idea of the answer in their head - otherwise a simple, miscoded line, can "cause" amazing "results" that will ruin their reputation. Similarly, don't start a tricky problem without estimating an answer. Emily Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 There can be several correct solutions to one problem. Some will be more beautiful and elegant than others. Math does not come in neatly wrapped one year packages labeled "algebra" or "geometry". Math is organic, all parts interacting with one another. Compartmentalizing hurts more than it helps. With a well designed math curriculum, it is possible to avoid calculator use in math courses throughout high school. If the answer is 25*pi, that is exact and preferable for use in subsequent parts of the problem. Punching it into a calculator and rounding to 78.53 is an inelegant crutch. Ditto for sqrt(2) and the like. It is possible to use normal English sentences to talk about math problems. In fact, a problem is only truly understood if the student can narrate his solution in plain English. Do not assume the solution manual is always correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbmamaz Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 idk, where I'm at right now is - keep reviewing until they get it. My sr, who has struggled with math since we started in 8th, is taking a self pace 'college algebra' MOOC . . I KNOW this is stuff we covered. He still doesnt remember it. Sigh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wapiti Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 RR's lecture on problem solving (transcript and/or video); whenever I'm in need of inspiration, I read or watch it again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quark Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Math does not come in neatly wrapped one year packages labeled "algebra" or "geometry". Math is organic, all parts interacting with one another. Compartmentalizing hurts more than it helps. I had to like this, quote it and bold it too. Okay I'm going to underline it as well. I agree so wholeheartedly. It took me a while to come to terms with this when we moved to the US. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lewelma Posted January 9, 2014 Author Share Posted January 9, 2014 It is possible to use normal English sentences to talk about math problems. In fact, a problem is only truly understood if the student can narrate his solution in plain English. This is key. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wapiti Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 I wish Lockhart's Lament was required homeschool reading too. For those who might enjoy further discussion of this, it can be found in these and other old threads: http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/12963-a-mathematicians-lament-have-you-read-it/ http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/13029-from-the-general-board-a-mathematicians-lament/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dana Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Notation is VERY important in math. Math notation is similar to the structure of an English sentence or a paragraph. You wouldn't accept a sentence with words all over the page. Similarly with math. (Drives me batty...but this is all students and not just homeschooled students.) There isn't such a thing as a math brain any more than there's a reading brain. Barring learning disabilities, numerical literacy and basic arithmetic and algebra are just as possible to learn for anyone as basic literacy - and as important IMO. (Now yes, there are people who see math and are pretty amazing, but that's different than what I'm talking about.) Mnemonics can be helpful - but it's critical to understand what they mean. Some do much more harm than good (I'm talking specifically about FOIL here, but there are other problems.) Reading math (like science) can take a LONG time to understand. You can't read it at the same pace as you read English. And you HAVE to read with pencil in hand, working out any steps in a problem or explanation to understand what's going on. Just reading the pages doesn't mean you've understood it. Understanding a concept doesn't mean you have mastery of it. It takes enough practice to master it. That practice is ESSENTIAL. How much practice is needed may vary from student to student. I use the analogy of learning to drive manual transmission or parallel park... I understood the concept, but it took PRACTICE to be able to do it well. Same with math. Math can be incredibly fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lang Syne Boardie Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 If you are the teacher, you can't expect your child to understand the lesson if you don't understand the lesson. Unless you're a mathematician or scientist or other kind of expert, this can mean two things:1. Either you need to learn the lesson before teaching it, or2. you might not be the teacher. Concerning #1: If you find yourself methodically working through an arithmetic or Algebra text one lesson ahead of your student and practicing teaching the concepts before he wakes up for school, you won't be the first homeschooling Mom to do that. I did it, when the approach that was best for my child was different from what I had learned in school.Concerning #2: There's nothing wrong with not being the teacher if that's your reality or preference. Know when to hire a tutor or find a class. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8filltheheart Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 That having an answer explained to you so that you understand how a problem was solved is not the same thing as your being able to solve the problem. Having your student explaining how to solve a problem with a couple of different approaches completely different from how you taught them is one of the great joys of knowing that you have taught your student to think about math and something you will not experience if you think that a computer is a great math teacher and grader and you are unnecessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Critterfixer Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 That learning math is hard work for some of us, teachers and students alike. Patience and time may be better than bright, shiny new curriculum. Although a lot less fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lewelma Posted January 10, 2014 Author Share Posted January 10, 2014 That learning math is hard work for some of us, teachers and students alike. Patience and time may be better than bright, shiny new curriculum. Although a lot less fun. And in a similar vein (as I am dealing with this with my younger), sometimes the problem lies with student's attitude and not with the curriculum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garddwr Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Oh and something that really clicked for me when DH explained it (because I'm a language person). Math is a language. It needs practice, needs to be used daily. Math is a language of science as well. I opened this thread and started reading, and thought I should contribute "math is a language" Then I saw you beat me to it :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scbusf Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 I :wub: this thread. In addition to homeschooling my kids, I teach math at a community college. It's so wonderful to find people who get it. I love you all :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LivingHope Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 The older I get the more I love math...it keeps me young. (I am trying to keep up with my children in AOPS.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScoutTN Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 One day I commented that a math problem was beautiful. Lily scoffed and glared. A few weeks later she exclaimed, "I found one! It's a beautiful problem!" I love that memory. :001_wub: This happend to me too!! :thumbup1: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haiku Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 That your ability to understand math (or not) does not define you as a person. That sometimes it will take you longer to get to a certain level than your friends, and that's ok. Math is not a race. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linders Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Showing your answer without showing your work doesn't demonstrate how brilliant you are, it raises the question whether you understood what you were doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deee Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 "Math does not come in neatly wrapped one year packages labeled "algebra" or "geometry". Math is organic, all parts interacting with one another. Compartmentalizing hurts more than it helps." This! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrysalis Academy Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 I am posting with the caveat that I am not talking to anyone here: I am talking to homeschoolers I meet IRL: Yes, you do actually have to teach your children math. You owe them this. You can't just wait until your child decides that maybe they want to learn math. You can't just assume that they will never need math, so you don't have to bother. Math opens doors to *so many things* in life. By choosing not to teach your children math, you are ensuring that those doors won't open easily for your children. Or maybe not at all. Please don't make this decision for them. Please teach them the basics, or give them access to a teacher. Let them decide for themselves *when they are old enough to understand the consequences of their decision*. Please don't close this door in their faces. That is all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsquirrel Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Don't assume that because a student is having difficulty that a different curriculum will help. Try to stick with one. But, sometimes, switching is for the best. Challenge yourself as a teacher. Are you being the best teacher you can be? Spend the occasional evening watching youtube videos of math teachers teaching what you will be teaching. You might learn something. Or you walk away feeling very good about yourself. It's a win either way! If your student is up to it, challenge him or her. Sometimes the safe choice isn't the best choice. If they are getting most questions correct, and it comes easily, step it up a notch. And don't ignore the benefit of a challenging review. Adding in a challenging math supplement but using it a year 'behind' can be a great way to revisit old skills. (Sorry, all my best ideas are very utilitarian. I am not skilled in math, but to my great surprise I was able to be an adequate math teacher. It has been a combination of my own hard work and optimism to the point of foolishness) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tabinfl Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 A math PhD once told me that one of the wonderful things about mathematics is "being able to apprehend the truth yourself, without having to take anyone else's word for it." Whether it's how many apples they'll have after Johnny gives them two more, or how much money they'll need to buy treats for all of their friends, or some complex proof perhaps understood only by themselves and their thesis advisors, I think it's a great reason for me to make sure they have at least the basic tools in their heads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
................... Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Great thread. I read Lockhart's Lament, as recommended by a very well educated friend with a highly regarded Math degree...working at a highly regarded company.... and it just left me shrugging my shoulders because it was so unrealistic. Anyway....I have to get a handle on getting more involved in my son's math, big time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twigs Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Thanks to all for posting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silver Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Arithmetic is not the sum total of math. Going from this... Please, please do not allow your child believe they are "bad" at math if they have a hard time memorizing their facts. Math is so much more than the addition and multiplication tables! (Says the lady with multiple math degrees that still doesn't have instant recall of 8x7.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quark Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 I thought of another... If you have a math-loving child and have access to a math circle, give the circle a whirl. Not all circles are created equal but a good one can challenge your child and expose him/ her to things even curriculum like AoPS doesn't. It could also show your child who his/ her true math peers/ betters are. What are math circles and how to find a circle near you: http://www.mathcircles.org/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quark Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Great thread. I read Lockhart's Lament, as recommended by a very well educated friend with a highly regarded Math degree...working at a highly regarded company.... and it just left me shrugging my shoulders because it was so unrealistic. Anyway....I have to get a handle on getting more involved in my son's math, big time. Perhaps that's why it needs to be re-read regularly? :P Or forget Lockhart and read a math biography? :) Why people who dedicate their lives to math do it. What drives them? What were they like as kids? Their stories (and other good, non-math biographies too of course) hold life lessons for a lot of us, potential math-majors or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serenade Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Math is about problem solving. Algorithms need to be learned, but the end goal is to apply math to real world or theoretical situations Math is about communication. You need to teach your student to be able to speak and write using mathematical language. Math is hard work. You need intensity of focus and lots of effort. Your student must put in the time. Math work needs to be checked and corrected immediately. This will really help with learning efficiently. Math tests are sometimes about speed. Math is not. Math needs to be tidy. You are more likely to get a problem right if it is tidy. Please help me fill in this list, Ruth in NZ edited to add: I just realized that this might come across snarky to the OP of the previous thread. This is not my intent. What I would like is to draw out our combined knowledge and make a thread that newbie homeschoolers could use. Thank you for this. I'm going to have my older son read it. Maybe he'll even believe it if he hears it from someone other than me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idnib Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Document your thinking. It will be easier to figure out where you went awry later if you hit a dead end. It's also easier if you need to walk away from a problem and come back later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vonfirmath Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 What Spycar said Incremental stages btwn K and 3rd grade: www.k-5mathteachingresources dot com quark=Spycar? Its not in the name history? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Math success is not to be measured on number of problems solved per hour. Sometimes less can be more. (My DS spent one hour solving a single problem this morning, and I am extremely proud of him: he began the problem 30 minutes into his required math hour and did not quit when the hour was up; he refused to look at the hint; he tried out different approaches, drew and re-drew the figure instead of staring at the problem. This was far more valuable than cranking out an entire page of easy problems.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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