When a friend's child is disrespectful towards you

[Marie131]

What do you do?

 

I had a friend over last week, she has a dd who is 4. Her dd was not only mean to my kids, but disrespectful t/w me (eg. repeatedly stuck her tongue out at me, spat at me and screamed at me while I was talking to her mom). Her mom didn't do anything, IMO, to stop her dd's behavior. This type of behavior went on for about 3 hours.

[SKL]

I would not do anything. I would feel for the parents who have to figure out how to deal with that child.

 

She may have issues that are not visible to outsiders.

[kitten18]

I would not do anything. I would feel for the parents who have to figure out how to deal with that child.

 

She may have issues that are not visible to outsiders.

I agree, though if it was really that bad I probably wouldn't have had them stay for 3 hours.

[Joanne]

What do you do?

 

I had a friend over last week, she has a dd who is 4. Her dd was not only mean to my kids, but disrespectful t/w me (eg. repeatedly stuck her tongue out at me, spat at me and screamed at me while I was talking to her mom). Her mom didn't do anything, IMO, to stop her dd's behavior. This type of behavior went on for about 3 hours.

 

 

The behavior of that level went on without intervention for 3 hours? And you didn't say anything or cut the visit short after the second episode?

[RoughCollie]

First time, I would tell kid to treat me politely and explain exactly what I meant. Second time, I would tell Mom and kid to pack it up. Time to go home.

[Melissa in Australia]

depending on the situation I might completely ignore the child, or give the child scathing glares. :glare: :glare: :glare: or tell the mother not to feel embarrassed about disciplining their child in my house. In the situation you outlined I would ignore the tongue poking and possibly the screaming but would have difficulty with the spitting at me.

 

sometimes I might tell the child that we don't do that in this house Example: we had a homeschool family visit.They had 5 girls aged between 7-14. I served a very large platter of cake. After they hogged into it they then started to scrape any spilt icing off the platter and generally lick the platter clean. To me this is bad manners. and I removed the platter and told the kids that we don't behave that way in this house.

[RoundAbout]

I wouldn't do anything, but just wouldn't invite them over again.

[thebacabunch]

I can't imagine what you could have said or done. You can vote with your presence. If you don't like being around an obnoxious 4 year old, decline the next invitation.

[LibraryLover]

4 yr olds make me laugh. I don't know that I have ever met a normally developing 4 yr old who wasn't good for a smile or chuckle.

 

3 hours is quite a long time for spitting etc., even for atypical children. I would have to see the video to comment on that.

[redsquirrel]

With a 4 year old? I would have said "In this house, we ask for things politely" or whatever. At this point, stuff like that comes out of my mouth without even thinking about it. I say it to other people's kids all the time, lol. My other big one is "How would you say that in a politely" I think I have said that to my DH without thinking :laugh:

[Seasider]

I would ignore the child's behavior towards myself. However, being mean to my children in their own home gets one reprimanded or shuffled out. Home should always feel like a place of protection , IMO.

[Word Nerd]

4 yr olds make me laugh. I don't know that I have ever met a normally developing 4 yr old who wasn't good for a smile or chuckle.

 

How does this help in the OP's situation? This 4-year-old doesn't sound particularly amusing or delightful.

[LibraryLover]

How does this help in the OP's situation? This 4-year-old doesn't sound particularly amusing or delightful.

 

 

I did wonder why the OP let her kids suffer for 3 hours.

 

I really would like to see the security cam on that, for sure.

[Marie131]

Thanks for the feedback, now I'll tell you what I did and please tell me if it was appropriate or not and how to proceed from here.

 

After it was apparent that this behavior was going to continue, I attempted to redirect the child's focus onto a solitary activity (coloring). The behavior continued, so I figured she must have a need that wasn't being met so I went and talked to my kids to see if she was possibly feeling excluded. I arranged for a group activity that they could enjoy together. She didn't want to participate and they left soon after.

 

This is my best friend so I can't just not have them over. My mother thinks I should talk to my friend about it (my kids were beginning to copy the behaviors, but I nipped it in the bud), but I feel that in doing so would likely not go over well and be a friendship ender which is not at all what I want.

[Alte Veste Academy]

What do you do?

 

I had a friend over last week, she has a dd who is 4. Her dd was not only mean to my kids, but disrespectful t/w me (eg. repeatedly stuck her tongue out at me, spat at me and screamed at me while I was talking to her mom). Her mom didn't do anything, IMO, to stop her dd's behavior. This type of behavior went on for about 3 hours.

 

I am struck by the "IMO" part. Are you saying mom did something but not enough to stop her DD's behavior? Did she try at all, even if not sufficient to your own standards? Or did she completely ignore the poor behavior as if it wasn't happening? What did she do? What I would do would be somewhat dependent on that answer.

 

My first thought though, given that mom is my friend, is to ask her if she's OK, if she needs a cup of tea or a day off. LOL

[DianeW88]

I would have reprimanded her once it was clear her mother wasn't going to do it. "I'm sorry, honey, you'll need to say that again nicely." "Sweetie, in my house, you don't act that way with another grown-up. Let's try again." "If you can't speak in a soft voice, you'll need to go into another room while I talk with your mom." "We don't interrupt here. You need to wait your turn." "If you spit at me or anyone else again, you'll go home. That is not allowed in my house, and I won't put up with it."

 

I would be very firm with her, and if mom didn't take the hint or the brattiness didn't stop, then I'd ask them to leave. I wouldn't expose my kids to that nonsense and let them think it was acceptable behavior on any level. And I wouldn't invite them over again.

[Alte Veste Academy]

This is my best friend so I can't just not have them over. My mother thinks I should talk to my friend about it (my kids were beginning to copy the behaviors, but I nipped it in the bud), but I feel that in doing so would likely not go over well and be a friendship ender which is not at all what I want.

 

Your mom is right. I don't quite get this. She's your best friend and you can't talk to her about parenting and its challenges? Totally not my way with friends. LOL

[Hannah]

Second time, I would tell Mom and kid to pack it up. Time to go home.

 

I find these kind of questions really interesting from a cultural point of view. Here, I wouldn't ask people to leave. You wait for them to go (which does mean sitting up way past your bed-time if you have inconsiderate guests). I'd be very uncomfortable asking someone to leave my house (unless I never want to see them again). But, if a 4-year old was being rude to me in my own house and the mom did nothing, I'd probably kneel down to the 4yo's level, look her square in the eyes and tell her that we speak politely in this house and that I don't allow anyone to be rude to me. And I'd repeat it until the mother got the message. That would probably be more socially acceptable here...

[fairy4tmama]

With a 4 year old? I would have said "In this house, we ask for things politely" or whatever. At this point, stuff like that comes out of my mouth without even thinking about it. I say it to other people's kids all the time, lol. My other big one is "How would you say that in a politely" I think I have said that to my DH without thinking :laugh:

:iagree: This exactly and if mom didn't begin to take ownership of correcting her childs behaviour I don't think I would continue to socialize. I have no problem gently correcting a childs behaviour but it is tedious to be the only one doing so ALL.THE.TIME. I get paid good money to provide child care :leaving:

[Word Nerd]

Do you see them often? Has this been a problem before?

[LibraryLover]

I would have reprimanded her once it was clear her mother wasn't going to do it. "I'm sorry, honey, you'll need to say that again nicely." "Sweetie, in my house, you don't act that way with another grown-up. Let's try again." "If you can't speak in a soft voice, you'll need to go in another room." "We don't interrupt here. You need to wait your turn." "If you spit at me or anyone else again, you'll go home. That is not allowed in my house, and I won't put up with it."

 

I would be very firm with her, and if mom didn't take the hint or the brattiness didn't stop, then I'd ask them to leave. I wouldn't expose my kids to that nonsense and let them think it was acceptable behavior on any level. And I wouldn't invite them over again.

 

 

One has to wonder why this didn't happen.

 

One of my friends has a child w/ sensory issues. There was a day I had to pack my kids into the car to get to an appointment. I gave my friend a spare key and asked her to lock the door behind her when they left.

 

If I hadn't had to leave, I would have asked my friend how I could help. I just don't see the need to engage for hours.

[Marie131]

Your mom is right. I don't quite get this. She's your best friend and you can't talk to her about parenting and its challenges? Totally not my way with friends. LOL

 

How do you bring it up w/out hurting feelings? I know I wouldn't like my friends criticizing my parenting.

[LibraryLover]

How do you bring it up w/out hurting feelings? I know I wouldn't like my friends criticizing my parenting.

 

 

How hard is it to bring up the obvious? The child was miserable for 3 hours. You are her friend. Ask her how she felt about the spitting etc.

[laundrycrisis]

With behavior this extreme, I would assume there is possibly a developmental or some other issue going on with the child. As a friend, I would bring it up. I would first want to know, gently, if this mother has concerns about her child's behavior. If she truly hasn't noticed and has no concerns, it's time for a wake up call. If she is well aware and doesn't know how to begin looking for help, or is already getting help for the child, she is in need of support and understanding.

 

In the future I would put very short limits on the amount of time this child could be around mine...but still offer the friend support.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

I think I learned this phrase in La Leche League or somewhere. Or maybe it was Miss Manners? Anyway, here's a line for when you don't want to criticize or step in to parent somebody else's child for whatever reason but you have to ring down the curtain on a bad performance in your own home:

 

"Thank you for coming to see me, but I think this must not be a very good day for a visit. I hope to see you again another time when we all feel more like visiting!" And walk them to the door, smiling but firm. The most I would add if the Mom protested would be to say that I understand little ones can be tired and fussy sometimes, mine certainly have had those days, see you soon, goodbye.

[SKL]

I have two kids who were (are) extremely late bloomers when it comes to social graces. It is not because I don't try. I don't really know what it is. I've been told by my friends that *I* am obnoxious because I correct my children so much in social situations.

 

They would never spit at anyone (and certainly would not get away with it if I saw that). They don't set out to be rude and nasty, but they don't seem to have any sense. Mostly they just won't speak when spoken to. Once they did finally start speaking, I was probably a little more lax than some would have been, if only because I preferred somewhat impolite speech to just sitting and staring or walking away when an adult was addressing them. I would give correction or lame excuse so the other adult knew I didn't like what I was seeing even though I couldn't fix the problem then and there.

 

If your friend's child is 4 and she's your best friend, this couldn't be the first time you've been with the child, right? If they think you are used to the child and her behaviors, they probably didn't feel the need to fuss about it at your house.

[LibraryLover]

I think I learned this phrase in La Leche League or somewhere. Or maybe it was Miss Manners? Anyway, here's a line for when you don't want to criticize or step in to parent somebody else's child for whatever reason but you have to ring down the curtain on a bad performance in your own home:

 

"Thank you for coming to see me, but I think this must not be a very good day for a visit. I hope to see you again another time when we all feel more like visiting!" And walk them to the door, smiling but firm. The most I would add if the Mom protested would be to say that I understand little ones can be tired and fussy sometimes, mine certainly have had those days, see you soon, goodbye.

 

 

Except...if it was my best friend as the OP stated, I would be a bit more invested in helping.

[Alte Veste Academy]

How do you bring it up w/out hurting feelings? I know I wouldn't like my friends criticizing my parenting.

 

Your question confuses me, really. Because I have so many more questions. Like this one...

 

Do you see them often? Has this been a problem before?

 

You say she is your best friend. Presumably you spend a great deal of time with her. Do you talk about life? About parenting? Your kids' personalities? Does she say her DD is tough? Easy? Was she tired that day? Is she usually like that? If she's been like that always, it's really hard to imagine it hasn't come up.

 

I'm just saying this conversation would have been evolving through the years with my best friend, you know? I know all my friends' struggles, including the ugly details. If I knew things were perfectly peachy but she was a pill that day, I would probably gently correct but mostly let it go as a bad day. If I knew things were usually rough... I don't know. I'd have had that conversation with my friend already. But, yeah, I would correct.

 

For what it's worth, I think you handled it very well. I just don't understand why the lack of conversation.

[SKL]

OK, after thinking about it some more, I recall some things I've said in cases like that.

 

"Are you tired, little sweetie?" "Do you think she might be coming down with something?" "I wonder if she is bothered by my ___." "Would she feel better if you held her perhaps?" Lets the mom know something isn't right without accusing anyone of bad parenting or plain old badness.

[Marie131]

Do you see them often? Has this been a problem before?

 

Normally we do spend a fair bit of time together, but my baby is a preemie so we need to be careful about germs. She and her dd have had a lot of illnesses so we hadn't seen them for nearly 4 months. Her dd has had behavioral issues, but not this extreme.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

I wish security cam vids came along with these sorts of OPs.

 

Security cam videos! LOL I cannot imagine how we could ever bring these threads to an end if we had actual evidence to dissect. It would be worse than the People's Court.

[LibraryLover]

Normally we do spend a fair bit of time together, but my baby is a preemie so we need to be careful about germs. She and her dd have had a lot of illnesses so we hadn't seen them for nearly 4 months. Her dd has had behavioral issues, but not this extreme.

 

 

So you can't phone/text her?

[Marie131]

So you can't phone/text her?

 

huh? Of course we phone/text.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

huh? Of course we phone/text.

 

So why not call and say, "Cornelia, it was so nice to finally get together with you today, but I want to ask you about something. I'm sorry if this is none of my business, but are you concerned about little Prunella's spitting at people when she's angry? Did we do something to upset her? I've had unusual behavior issues with my kids, too, I guess all parents do, but I just wanted to know if you want to talk about what happened with the kids' playtime today."

[jeninok]

I would have said something like "Oh sweetie, at our house we do do not spit!"

or "Can you say that again using your friendly words" or "My goodness! that really hurts my ears, I wont be able to understand what you are asking for unless you use your inside voice!"

 

I actually told my DS and DH to please use their friendly words this morning. They were bantering and it was about to take a turn for the ugly, so I intervened in my most syrupy sweet firm voice.

[KungFuPanda]

 

 

I find these kind of questions really interesting from a cultural point of view. Here, I wouldn't ask people to leave. You wait for them to go (which does mean sitting up way past your bed-time if you have inconsiderate guests). I'd be very uncomfortable asking someone to leave my house (unless I never want to see them again). But, if a 4-year old was being rude to me in my own house and the mom did nothing, I'd probably kneel down to the 4yo's level, look her square in the eyes and tell her that we speak politely in this house and that I don't allow anyone to be rude to me. And I'd repeat it until the mother got the message. That would probably be more socially acceptable here...

 

I feel exactly the way you do about guests. I've never asked anyone to leave. It wouldn't be socially acceptable where I'm from and I can't shed those manners because I live somewhere new. That said, I don't generally invite inconsiderate people to my home so it's not really an issue.

 

As for the children of guests, I have NO problem parenting a child in my house. I would have told the little girl that we don't yell or spit in this home. If she NEEDED to act like that, I'd ask her to go outside or save it for her house. If she can't be trusted to be nice in the playroom, then she'll just have to sit with the boring moms until she can act like a person.

 

Nobody has ever taken offense at me correcting their kids. My son was enough of a maniac when he was little that I don't think anyone feels judged by me :-/ It does help that he's a completely respectable citizen now. I think it gives people hope :-)

[Marie131]

With behavior this extreme, I would assume there is possibly a developmental or some other issue going on with the child. As a friend, I would bring it up. I would first want to know, gently, if this mother has concerns about her child's behavior. If she truly hasn't noticed and has no concerns, it's time for a wake up call. If she is well aware and doesn't know how to begin looking for help, or is already getting help for the child, she is in need of support and understanding.

 

In the future I would put very short limits on the amount of time this child could be around mine...but still offer the friend support.

 

I think I'm going to do something like this. She had expressed concerns about the tongue stiicking out behavior before, I brushed it off not realizing how extreme it was (I won't do this again!). Maybe I can bring it up and help her come up w/ some strategies and offer some support. They have had a hard year, which I'm sure the child has felt too.

[Alexigail]

This depends a great deal on your relationship with your friend etc. With my best friend, I would correct her child without hesitation and I'd hope that she would do the same for mine. But that's not how all friendships work. I would hope that it wouldn't be a "deal breaker" in your friendship to bring this kind of thing up. There are lots of ways of bringing this up without being confrontational. I agree with the person above who suggested that you begin by asking how things are going and offering your support.

If her child has behavioral issues, it's possible that ignoring it is part of their strategy for dealing with it. In that case you'd have to find a balance between how they are raising their kid and what you can and can't put up with under your roof. It's possible that you'll have to make plans without kids for awhile.

[Catwoman]

This is my best friend so I can't just not have them over. My mother thinks I should talk to my friend about it (my kids were beginning to copy the behaviors, but I nipped it in the bud), but I feel that in doing so would likely not go over well and be a friendship ender which is not at all what I want.

 

Here's the problem I'm seeing -- you're choosing your best friend over your own kids. Your friend's child was mean to your own children in your own home... and you said nothing, because you didn't want to hurt your friend's feelings? :confused:

 

I'm sorry, but your priorities are in the wrong place.

 

If this woman is truly your "best friend," there should be no need to walk on eggshells around her. She saw everything her dd did, and she did nothing about it. Her dd was mean to your children and blatantly rude to you, and yet she ignored it... and she ignored it for 3 hours.

 

That's not how a best friend treats her best friend. She was way out of line.

 

I don't mean to sound harsh, but I think it's ridiculous that you allowed that little girl to behave as she did with your own kids, and I think it was horrendously rude of your friend to have permitted her child to behave so absymally toward you and your kids.

 

Why are you so worried about her feelings? She clearly wasn't worried about yours.

 

If you don't say anything about it, the behavior is never going to change. And if you do say something about the child's behavior and you lose the friendship as a result, I have some news for you -- she was never much of a friend in the first place. If you can't be open and honest with her, or even have a disagreement with her without worrying that the friendship will end, she's not your friend.

 

Seriously.

 

I'm not saying that you should be mean or nasty about it, but you can politely tell your friend that you didn't want to say anything in front of her dd, but that the dd's behavior was unacceptable, and that in the future, you need her to step in and put a stop to it, because you're not willing to allow her dd to be mean to your kids or rude to you.

[gardenmom5]

1) she's four - baring developmental delays, I can cut slack for what kids know of appropriate behavior especially in this day and age when parenting is done by terrible tv programs.

2) if mommy won't (or doesn't know how to) correct her, I would. "we don't ___ in our house."

3) I will then tell her how to get what she wants. "if you would like to ___, you need to ___". stated positively so she knows what behavior will get he what she wants.

4) if mommy complains you've corrected her charmer (or it continues with no sign of her trying to improve her behavior), I would suggest perhaps darling is overtired and in need of a nap and that we'd get together another time.

 

 

eta: I also have to limit how long other children can be at my house. My son doesn't not handle the stimulation well. however . . .. I've encountered alot of adults who are so "desperate" for adult conversation (or free babysitting) they don't care and overstay and I have to push them out. overstaying free babysitting do not get invited back to play.

[Mom0012]

Normally we do spend a fair bit of time together, but my baby is a preemie so we need to be careful about germs. She and her dd have had a lot of illnesses so we hadn't seen them for nearly 4 months. Her dd has had behavioral issues, but not this extreme.

 

In this case, I would just hope that it was a bad day for the 4 yo and that things will go better next time. If it continues, then I honestly don't know what I would do other than to redirect the little girl myself and see how the mom handles it. Some people don't mind that at all and others get really riled by it. In general, I do not like redirecting other people's children when the mom is present, but I don't see what choice you have if this behavior continues and the mom does nothing. Gosh, I can remember my sister letting my niece walk all over my new couches with dirty shoes and just holding my breath because I knew that my sister wasn't going to like me saying anything to her dd. She didn't really leave me much choice, though.

[jelbe5]

I would have verbally corrected the little girl, modeling for the little girl's mother (as said in a pp "In this house we are kind to each other, we don't scream at adults, we don't stick out our tongue" etc.). This way the parent would be made aware of the behavior and would see correction.

 

Perhaps the mother is overwhelmed with the little girl and unsure of what to do. However, if this continued I would limit get togethers - maybe just try to visit with said friend when someone else is available to watch the kids.

 

I re-read the post and see you indicate this little girl has had behavior problems in the past and this has been a hard year for your friend. There is more going on here than you know about. It might be time to talk to your friend about your concerns and how you may be supportive.

[trlt]

I find these kind of questions really interesting from a cultural point of view. Here, I wouldn't ask people to leave. You wait for them to go (which does mean sitting up way past your bed-time if you have inconsiderate guests). I'd be very uncomfortable asking someone to leave my house (unless I never want to see them again). But, if a 4-year old was being rude to me in my own house and the mom did nothing, I'd probably kneel down to the 4yo's level, look her square in the eyes and tell her that we speak politely in this house and that I don't allow anyone to be rude to me. And I'd repeat it until the mother got the message. That would probably be more socially acceptable here...

 

We wouldn't ask people to leave either. I wouldn't even consider it. I would have spoke with the friend's daughter and said, "In our home we don't....."

[hillfarm]

Sometimes you just have to cut the ties. We have some neighbors - we love the parents, despise the kids. They are rude, unruly, demanding, basically terrible to be around. We definitely chose not to subject our dd to them and we don't like being around them ourselves. Dh, especially, has no tolerance for such behavior.

 

I would LOVE to be closer to the mom. We live in a rural area and friends are "scarce as hen's teeth" (meaning very hard to find) here. But the price of putting up with her horrible children is just too much. She and her husband are well educated, have important roles in the community, and come from a fairly stable family dynamic. I just can not comprehend why they have accepted their children's awful behavior.

 

Sadly, the only times we see them is when they swing by to drop something off quickly or when we go over to visit them briefly at their house. The older of the two boys has gotten better since he has been in school. The younger one (around 3rd grade or so) is still a terror. We ran into them at a parade last year and even the older one (12yo) still has room for improvement. During the 10 minutes we spent chatting with his mother, he interruped doznes of times, tugged on her, whined, complained, damaged the wall of a brick planter, and pouted. Such an improvement from the way he used to be! :bored:

 

It breaks my heart that we can't be friends with this family. But I am constitutionally unable to stomach the abuse, of those parents, dh and I, or my dd.

[treestarfae]

You two couldn't find an activity for the kid to do in the whole 3 hours? Why didn't you just find something do with her with her since she obviously wanted attention?

[Impish]

I would've corrected the child, since according to you, her mother didn't.

 

"I'm sorry, we do not allow spitting in this house. If you do it again, you'll have to go home."

 

And follow through.

 

I'm not allowing that sort of behaviour in my home, around my kids.

 

Since this is your best friend, I'm assuming if there were any SN, you would be aware of it, and have stated so.

[Soror]

With my good friends it is expected we discipline each others kids as needed. At the age of 4 I can see ignoring some behavior when it is someone else child but from what I understand of what you say I would have corrected her myself. Although some parents may be ok with children acting in a certain way I won't allow people to be mean to myself or my kids and would move us away as needed. I would not physically intervene though, except to stop a kid from hitting. I would verbally let them know it was not acceptable and would certainly have a discussion with my friend. It is a normal thing to do though in my circle when you are struggling with certain behaviors and it wouldn't seem awkward to me. I would use a script similar to one said earlier and have a whole lot of empathy in there, parenting is hard and it helps imo to share your own struggles when talking to someone else about their own.

[8circles]

This situation just seems so strange.

 

The tongue pocking & screaming I've encountered. Either they were distractable or the mom was too embarrassed to stick around much. I think if this were a friend and me we would have ended-up laughing (in that not-really-funny-but-parenting-sucks-sometimes way) and just playing with the kids, skipping any adult conversation until things settled down.

 

The spitting? I just can't imagine this in a normally-developing 4 year-old. I mean, was there actually spit flying out of her mouth or do you mean like blowing a raspberry in the air? If it were actual spit, I think I would have been horrified and reacted much like if she had vomited & started cleaning it up really thoroughly. That's gross.