Are you optimistic about the future of the US?

[lynn]

My bil is very gloom and doom with all that's going on economy, gas etc and really says some pretty scary things regarding the future of the US. I'd like to think that we will go through some tough times but the next president will see the need to make strong decisions for the future of the US as a country. I am curious as to what others think. I know life as we know it will change with the gas and food prices but stay optimistic and feel that it will all stabilize and life will go on.

[Plucky]

I think we may be in for hard times, maybe for 5-7 years. Until, we are able to find a good alternative energy source. I think most of it is cyclical.

[Julpost]

I'm afraid that we might be going the way of the roman empire....

but that's just me.

[Elaine]

I am a very "glass is half-full" kind of person and I tend to think that everything will be alright. :001_smile:

[newbie]

I think we may be in for hard times, maybe for 5-7 years. Until, we are able to find a good alternative energy source. I think most of it is cyclical.

 

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

Jet

[CLHCO]

I flip flop so badly on the issue my head has come loose.

 

On the one hand, I do not think either potential next president can do anything to fix it all with a wave of a wand. In fact, over-excessive attempts to "fix" it will likely make it worse. Some of the "fixes" of the great depression and the good ideas of the generation after that are biting us today.

 

If we can get a nice big wake-up call and get angry enough to get moving, I agree with the 5-7 years, though I personally think it's more like a 10-15 for something that could be very positive in the long run.

 

However, when people get scared they listen to the next sweet thing to tickle their ears and make it all better, or think of what group they can point fingers at to blame. We could become very vulnerable over the next 5-10 years to something that could look more like anything from the USSR to Nazi Germany. If that happens I'm thinking more like generations. That's the part that worries me. It's happened before and I don't think we dare assume it can't happen to us.

[caitlinsmom]

I think we are in for some really tough times...really really tough times. Freaks me out really.

[TXMomof4]

I flip flop so badly on the issue my head has come lose.

 

On the one hand, I do not think either potential next president can do anything to fix it all with a wave of a wand. In fact, over-excessive attempts to "fix" it will likely make it worse. Some of the "fixes" of the great depression and the good ideas of the generation after that are biting us today.

 

If we can get a nice big wake-up call and get angry enough to get moving, I agree with the 5-7 years, though I personally think it's more like a 10-15 for something that could be very positive in the long run.

 

However, when people get scared they listen to the next sweet thing to tickle their ears and make it all better, or think of what group they can point fingers at to blame. We could become very vulnerable over the next 5-10 years to something that could look more like anything from the USSR to Nazi Germany. If that happens I'm thinking more like generations. That's the part that worries me. It's happened before and I don't think we dare assume it can't happen to us.

 

I'm the same way. Some days I think we're a bunch of whiners and it will be fine. We just need to adjust our perspective. Other days I"m not so sure. Even if we have an amazing president (which seems unlikely for the next 4 years either way), we still have the House and Senate arguing about the color of the sky most days. I really believe that was Bush's biggest failing. He honestly thought since he did well working with both sides in TX, that he could apply the same principle in Washington. Obviously it doesn't work that way. Both sides are so darn sure their right that there is no give on anything of value. Hopefully, the powers that be will figure out that cutting off our nose to spite our face is not a strategy that has ever been successful. Of course, it's our job to keep these people in line, but how on earth is that supposed to *really* be accomplished? The old goats are there because they've always been there. I'm sick of it!

[Karen sn]

I think things are gonna get bad.

But maybe that's what it will take to make the necessary changes for a better world.

[clwcain]

We're sitting on twice as much oil as Saudi Arabia, and that doesn't include the Continental Shelf or ANWR.

 

Oil and gold are high because of a weak dollar and the impact of speculation.

 

The stock market is taking a beating because Wall Street traders fear Obama will win the election in November.

 

97% of mortgages are not in any stage of default.

 

Gasoline prices are high for several reasons, most having to do with no new refineries in over 30 years coupled with the Congressional Ethanol mandate.

 

Things are nowhere near as bad as the press wants them to be.

 

What? Me worry? :)

[ChristusG]

Honestly, I think things are just going to continue to decline. The Bible talks about things declining as the end times grow nearer....and I think that's the direction that we are headed.

 

It really freaks me out about how bad it could get before the Lord comes back.

[elegantlion]

I go back and forth on this one as well. It's hard to feel things are bad as I sit here on my laptop, while watching cable, sitting in the AC, and my frig is full of food I was able to buy at the store yesterday.

 

My mom grew up in the country just after the depression. They had no running utilities, an outhouse, my grandfather had to work out of town in order to keep a job to raise 8 kids. My grandmother walked and depended on family to get what they needed.

 

My mom had to move into town and work just to finish high school.

 

I think as a society we take a lot of things for granted and feel we are entitled to them. We may have to turn backward for a while to appreciate how far we've come.

[homeschoolmom]

Honestly, no.

 

I see a lack of work ethic, personal responsibility and frugality though in certain circles such as these I know others get this.

 

I think we'll have to hit rock bottom before REAL, effective changes occur and we're not there (as a nation) yet.

 

To me the proof that we still don't get it was the 'bailout that is not a bailout' of Bear Sterns. All that did was delay the inevitable at a cost. But that's my opinion and I am not an economist by trade.

[hillfarm]

I have a question for those of you who are concerned about the future. What steps have you taken or are you planning to take in order to deal with those potential problems?

 

We live on a small farm and have a garden, lots of fruit and nut trees, plenty of wild game, etc. Due to our rural location, I usually keep at least a 6 month supply of most things on hand to avoid extra trips to town, and usually have at least a year's supply of staple food items. But I really don't think that is enough. If we are looking at a 5-15 year haul, we need to be preparing for sustainability. All my bursting-at-the-seams pantry would do for me is give me a good amount of breathing room before I had to be completely self sufficient. What is the typical situation for most posters here?

[Amy loves Bud]

Not optimistic. But probably not what most would consider doom and gloom. In fact, I would bet that many of the people on this board would be happy if what I think is going to happen actually comes to be. I think we are looking at becoming a much more socialist society than we already are. That is pessimistic thinking as far as I'm concerned, but I know not everyone agrees. :)

 

I'm not worried about needing to be able to grow all my own food or to be able to barter for it, but I do think we have peaked as a society/economy.

[RoughCollie]

Here's an interesting article: 10 ways to prepare for a post-oil society,

by James Howard Kunstler

 

http://eartheasy.com/article_ten_ways_post_oil.htm

 

Trouble is, the suggestions are societal changes -- and we have a huge country in which making those changes will be very, very difficult, if they can be done at all. I question whether the majority of the people in this country will be willing to make these changes unless they are forced to. I have not met very many people IRL who are interested in this.

[Liz CA]

We're sitting on twice as much oil as Saudi Arabia, and that doesn't include the Continental Shelf or ANWR.

 

Oil and gold are high because of a weak dollar and the impact of speculation.

 

The stock market is taking a beating because Wall Street traders fear Obama will win the election in November.

 

97% of mortgages are not in any stage of default.

 

Gasoline prices are high for several reasons, most having to do with no new refineries in over 30 years coupled with the Congressional Ethanol mandate.

 

Things are nowhere near as bad as the press wants them to be.

 

What? Me worry? :)

I like to read encouraging things. I am rather curious about ANWR. I have done some research over the past weekend and it seems nobody can agree just how much oil is there.

I am hoping/praying someone comes up with a brilliant alternative that is environmentally friendly and inexpensive - should I have said instead "I am dreaming..."??

I live 45 minutes from the next town and every trip to work / stores / church is a major expense now.

[summer]

I truely believe that in the long run, we will be fine.

[Jean in Newcastle]

I think that God is in control for good or for ill.

[Guest Virginia Dawn]

I flip flop too. On one hand I don't think things will get as bad a they were during the depression any time soon. Maybe not even within my lifetime. But, TC: Things Change. That is what a very wise woman I knew always said. Life is not static.

 

I read my history. ;) Empires come and go, they change hands, they fade away, or they are destroyed. There are golden ages, there is unrest and upheaval. We've seen it happen many times, even in modern history. Why should we be immune?

 

Our perspective is so short sighted and narrow. We see where we are right now and how it is affecting us. There is a much bigger picture that is practically impossible for us to see. How can we truly know how our story fits into the history of the world?

 

There is an old song. "Everybody talks about a new world in the morning, a new world in the morning never comes." Sometimes it sounds pessimistic, but I think the (Christian) writer's point was that worrying about the future hasn't been proven to be effective, and may keep us from things that would have given meaning to our lives while we are here.

 

When I figure out how to put that philosophy into practice, I will share it with you. :001_smile:

[Renee in NC]

Things are bad from a small business perspective. Sales are down, businesses are closing, people are losing jobs. There are some parts of the country that are worse than others. No, most houses aren't in foreclosure, but the reality is that many people no longer have equity in their homes to borrow against. That's how our economy has been growing for the past 10 years.

 

I am less worried about the price of gas than I am about the MASSIVE drop in new home construction. We own a construction-related business. Our revenue has dropped 20% since last year (and I am thankful, because in FL it has been much, much worse.) We are just barely breaking even, but there is no money to pay us. We are looking at having to reduce one of our positions to part-time (we already did not replace someone who quit in January.)

 

Overall, I think the economy will bounce back eventually - I just think it is going to take awhile. Our nearest town to our home has lost more than a 1000 jobs in the last few months (and the population is about 8500.) In addition, the town lost a company that was using $100K worth of water per month! It may never bounce back.

[monk17]

I was eating at our local co-op yesterday and observed some disturbing signs. We have a buffet line that lets you weigh your food then pay at the cash register. There are small sample containers for you to try some food to see if it's to your liking. I observed a number of folks entering the store and purchasing nothing and then sampling the food several times. One was a Mom with a child. They did not have the appearance of folks living on the street. Living on the edge perhaps.

The other thing I've noticed is folks not driving to homeschool events for various reasons.

Government figures are one thing, folks scarfing a meal is another. I think we're headed for a severe recession. Blame it on a lot of things. Usually 4 to 5 years of war, according to most economist will take you to a recession. I think it's deeper and more fundamental.

I used to work for a large computer manufacturing company that also is the largest computer service company in the world. My friends from that company tell me that they are required to have at least 30% of there projects be outsourced to India.

That’s my 2 cents worth...

[Soph the vet]

We're sitting on twice as much oil as Saudi Arabia, and that doesn't include the Continental Shelf or ANWR.

 

Oil and gold are high because of a weak dollar and the impact of speculation.

 

Gasoline prices are high for several reasons, most having to do with no new refineries in over 30 years coupled with the Congressional Ethanol mandate.

:)

 

Well put. The latest US Geological Survey estimates enough oil for 30 years which would give us time to develop new energy technologies. This includes the large find under North Dakota. Drilling is the immediate answer for gas prices, IMO. Environmental regulations need to be reasonable, not ridiculous. Consumption needs to be more judicious, yes. And nuclear power needs to be explained better to the public so Chernobyl is not their first thought about it. France is 70-80% nuclear and we should look at how that is working for them.

I also agree with Julpost who said something about the Roman Empire, could be our time as the world's superpower is about done if we do not get some real leadership going in this country, balance the budget, stop depending on foreign lenders (at 3 billion dollars per day) and the younger generation (I am 40) needs to work harder and complain less and expect less entitlements. Churches, synagogues, mosques, and other faith-based groups need to step in and help instead of government with charitable giving of time, money and services which would lower the tax burden and decrease government spending. Government needs to be whittled back to it's constitutional responsibilities only and start being the servant of the people rather than the people serving the government.

If these things were to happen then I might have a brighter outlook for our nation.

[Remudamom]

I'm afraid that we might be going the way of the roman empire....

but that's just me.

 

 

I agree 100%! What makes us Americans think we're going to do better than any other society since the beginning of time? I'd rather live in the US than anywhere else, but basically I think we're arrogant butts that are going to get what we deserve sooner or later.

 

And I'm not worried about it even a little, all things work for good ya know!

[monk17]

Well put. The latest US Geological Survey estimates enough oil for 30 years which would give us time to develop new energy technologies. This includes the large find under North Dakota. Drilling is the immediate answer for gas prices, IMO. Environmental regulations need to be reasonable, not ridiculous. Consumption needs to be more judicious, yes. And nuclear power needs to be explained better to the public so Chernobyl is not their first thought about it. France is 70-80% nuclear and we should look at how that is working for them.

I also agree with Julpost who said something about the Roman Empire, could be our time as the world's superpower is about done if we do not get some real leadership going in this country, balance the budget, stop depending on foreign lenders (at 3 billion dollars per day) and the younger generation (I am 40) needs to work harder and complain less and expect less entitlements. Churches, synagogues, mosques, and other faith-based groups need to step in and help instead of government with charitable giving of time, money and services which would lower the tax burden and decrease government spending. Government needs to be whittled back to it's constitutional responsibilities only and start being the servant of the people rather than the people serving the government.

If these things were to happen then I might have a brighter outlook for our nation.

 

The French have a better nuclear energy program then us but it still has that nasty waste disposal problem. I'm not sure that's the long term solution. Side effects from Nuclear are pretty nasty even without a major accident.

 

The sooner gas goes to 10. a gallon the sooner we will look for alternatives. I've seen this movie from the 70's. Gas goes up and we have a flurry of alternative activity and then it dies down again. We need to set a course for energy policy similar to what we did with the sending a man to the moon. Scientific American showed a plan a few months ago to get 90% of the countries electrical needs from solar within 30 years.

 

Drilling for more is not the solution. Tesla said in the 1800's that we should abandon fossil fuel as an energy source.

 

Regards,

 

Mike

[Ellie]

This, too, shall pass. The U.S. is a great country, full of wonderful people and amazing natural resources. Yes, I am very optimistic.

[Robin in Tx]

This, too, shall pass. The U.S. is a great country, full of wonderful people and amazing natural resources. Yes, I am very optimistic.

 

 

Ditto what Ellie said. Of course, she and I are old enough to have weathered downturns like this before...

 

My dh and I said about a year ago that we needed to strap on our belts for a rough ride, with the big election coming up. Maybe I'll be proven wrong, but I think we'll all be surprised at how fine things seem by the end of November.

[ClassicMom]

are going to get worse. As people get scared, they do irrational things which will make our economy worsen. HOWEVER, I don't think that things will be as bad as all of the doom and gloom sayers out there make it sound.

 

I also agree with those that think that we are in the later stages of the end times. BUT I don't think it will be tomorrow either. There are many, many things that have to happen first. There are many to harvest yet and much has to happen in the political arena first.

 

So having said that, yes, it will get worse, but in increments. It is my opinion that as each economic woe hits us, the people will turn to the government for help and many will unfortunately not see that this is how we lose our freedoms, one at a time...ultimately leading to the end.

 

TOTALLY MY OPINION ONLY....:001_smile: Please don't throw darts.

[DollyM]

We're sitting on twice as much oil as Saudi Arabia, and that doesn't include the Continental Shelf or ANWR.

 

Oil and gold are high because of a weak dollar and the impact of speculation.

 

The stock market is taking a beating because Wall Street traders fear Obama will win the election in November.

 

97% of mortgages are not in any stage of default.

 

Gasoline prices are high for several reasons, most having to do with no new refineries in over 30 years coupled with the Congressional Ethanol mandate.

 

Things are nowhere near as bad as the press wants them to be.

 

What? Me worry? :)

 

 

:iagree::001_smile:

[Donna T.]

It really freaks me out about how bad it could get before the Lord comes back.

 

 

Right... but what many Christians don't seem to get is that the conditions which proceed His Coming will be manufactured by men. All that we are presently seeing is PLANNED. There are no accidents.

 

Never forget: Order out of Chaos.

 

That's what we are seeing. Created chaos so that the solutions can be imposed upon us.

 

I've pretty much gotten to the point where I sound like a broken record on this and I know I sound like a nut. But, God is waking some of us up. I don't even care about my reputation anymore. America is already gone folks... I'm sorry, but it's true.

 

So, I guess you could say I'm pessimistic (I prefer to think informed and realistic) about the future of America. I believe we will see more disasters (and, I don't blame those on God), more economic troubles, more food issues, more discord, anxiety, and eventually, a revolution. When we get to that point, they (they being the world governors - yes, we have those) will impose their solution. But, the important thing to know is that this is not God doing this to us. This is not His judgement on us (His judgement is coming, but this isn't it) which is what so many say. God isn't doing this. This is man-made.

 

And, we can't be provoked to revolution... we have to look up with expectation of deliverance. We have to live as pilgrims in this land. It's very important that we seek to live peacefully because civil unrest is the last stage of the plan and that's what will result in the solution.

[Soph the vet]

The French have a better nuclear energy program then us but it still has that nasty waste disposal problem. I'm not sure that's the long term solution. Side effects from Nuclear are pretty nasty even without a major accident.

 

I agree the waste disposal is a potential problem that is why I said we should look at how they are doing with it, meaning how are they handling their waste.

 

The sooner gas goes to 10. a gallon the sooner we will look for alternatives. I've seen this movie from the 70's. Gas goes up and we have a flurry of alternative activity and then it dies down again. We need to set a course for energy policy similar to what we did with the sending a man to the moon. Scientific American showed a plan a few months ago to get 90% of the countries electrical needs from solar within 30 years.

 

I read the SA article, they actually say 69% of electricity needs and 35% of overall energy needs. I am all for solar energy if it can truly be implemented. They are looking for 46,000 sq. miles of land for these photovoltaic farms in the desert SW and the use of cadmium which I understand is a rare resource. Along with 400 billion in subsidies they have many hurdles, also they will still be using natural gas to fuel their compressed air electrical storage, albeit less as they say. They also say Germany is looking at doing something similar, to this I would say that I know Germany is increasing its nuclear power along the lines of France as my dh is directly involved with this, just FYI.

 

Drilling for more is not the solution. Tesla said in the 1800's that we should abandon fossil fuel as an energy source.

I said drilling is the immediate solution for gas prices. Solar may be the long term solution. But people need to be able to feed their families and still drive to work. China is drilling 60 miles off the Florida coast and we are relying on Saudi Arabia. :confused: We are sitting on a wealth of oil that would give us time to develop the solar and other ideas yet we just let everyone else go at it instead.

[Soph the vet]

Right... but what many Christians don't seem to get is that the conditions which proceed His Coming will be manufactured by men. All that we are presently seeing is PLANNED. There are no accidents.

 

Never forget: Order out of Chaos.

 

That's what we are seeing. Created chaos so that the solutions can be imposed upon us.

 

I've pretty much gotten to the point where I sound like a broken record on this and I know I sound like a nut. But, God is waking some of us up. I don't even care about my reputation anymore. America is already gone folks... I'm sorry, but it's true.

 

So, I guess you could say I'm pessimistic (I prefer to think informed and realistic) about the future of America. I believe we will see more disasters (and, I don't blame those on God), more economic troubles, more food issues, more discord, anxiety, and eventually, a revolution. When we get to that point, they (they being the world governors - yes, we have those) will impose their solution. But, the important thing to know is that this is not God doing this to us. This is not His judgement on us (His judgement is coming, but this isn't it) which is what so many say. God isn't doing this. This is man-made.

 

And, we can't be provoked to revolution... we have to look up with expectation of deliverance. We have to live as pilgrims in this land. It's very important that we seek to live peacefully because civil unrest is the last stage of the plan and that's what will result in the solution.

 

I don't think you're a nut. If you are then I am :lol:!

[Margaret in GA]

yes, but...

 

1. It will be a long, long road. Check out this link to our federal debt:

 

http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

 

I mean, that's scary. Coupled with our individual lack of savings in this country and it's *really* scary. Read this excerpt from Christian Science Montior:

 

"Americans' personal savings fell to -0.5% last year, the first time since the Depression that the savings rate has been negative for a year"

 

2. When we emerge, we will no longer be the dominant power in the world. To me, that's a good thing. I'm kind of tired of the "Team America" approach we've had to solving the world's problems in the post-WWII era.

 

Hopeful,

Margaret

[Karenciavo]

Yes, I am optimistic. I am hoping whatever downturns our country experiences causes people to examine their lives. I love this stanza from The Rainy Day, a poem by Longfellow:

 

Be still sad heart and cease repining;

Behind the clouds the sun is shining,

Thy fate is the common fate of all,

Into each life a little rain must fall,

Some days must be dark and dreary.

[Melissa in CA]

America is already gone folks... I'm sorry, but it's true.

 

:iagree:

[JenneinCA]

As a country, yes, I am optimistic. As a country, we are going to need to get our priorities in order and then actually do something. But it isn't going to be easy and it isn't going to be fun. I think it will happen and after it is over we will be better off.

 

As a person, I am having a harder time being optimistic. I am working on getting our personal priorities in order and then actually doing something. But it isn't easy and it isn't fun. And I am discouraged by how much work it is going to take. I want an easier path and an easier solution. Unfortunately there isn't one and the only way to success is through hard work. And hard work is well... hard.

 

So yes, I am optimistic that it will get better, but I am dreading the hard work and sacrifice that it is going to take to get there.

[Robin in Tx]

Yes, I am optimistic. I am hoping whatever downturns our country experiences causes people to examine their lives. I love this stanza from The Rainy Day, a poem by Longfellow:

 

Be still sad heart and cease repining;

Behind the clouds the sun is shining,

Thy fate is the common fate of all,

Into each life a little rain must fall,

Some days must be dark and dreary.

 

 

See, Karen, how much more sophisticated you are than I? The lines that pop in my head when I think about things like this is from a country western song by Travis Tritt!! LOL!!

 

It's a great day to be alive,

I know the sun's still shining when I close my eyes.

There's some hard times in the neighborhood,

but why can't every day be this good?

 

It's a very unsophsticated song about simple pleasures and perspective. I particularly like the line about the sun still shining when I close my eyes. Yes, I get my inspiration from a country western song! LOL

 

I'm leaving now... before I die of embarrassment :)

[elegantlion]

See, Karen, how much more sophisticated you are than I? The lines that pop in my head when I think about things like this is from a country western song by Travis Tritt!! LOL!!

 

It's a great day to be alive,

I know the sun's still shining when I close my eyes.

There's some hard times in the neighborhood,

but why can't every day be this good?

 

It's a very unsophsticated song about simple pleasures and perspective. I particularly like the line about the sun still shining when I close my eyes. Yes, I get my inspiration from a country western song! LOL

 

I'm leaving now... before I die of embarrassment :)

 

I'll sing with you. I find that song uplifting as well.

 

"I might go get me a new tatoo, or take the ol' Harley on a three day cruise....."

[Marie in Oh]

that my family's particular future is still optimistic-- we have always been careful with our money, have more than most people, and my dh job is extremely secure. We are still very comfortable even with prices soaring.

 

However, I am not optimistic for the average American living in debt up to their eyeballs and never thinking that it is even a goal to own anything- house, car, nothing. I think that so many people are trying to fill their lives with stuff to be happy and they never will find happiness this way, and keep buying and buying and buying-- on credit no less. The economy will never be stable until people live withing their means and have goals to become independent of credit.

[Heather in the Kootenays]

and many of us are already working on some of the rest of them too. I see lots there that we as individuals and small groups can work towards. That's how change happens.

[Karenciavo]

LOL, hardly more sophisticated, just spending lots of time lately with school books from the 19th century.

 

See, Karen, how much more sophisticated you are than I? The lines that pop in my head when I think about things like this is from a country western song by Travis Tritt!! LOL!!

 

It's a great day to be alive,

I know the sun's still shining when I close my eyes.

There's some hard times in the neighborhood,

but why can't every day be this good?

 

It's a very unsophsticated song about simple pleasures and perspective. I particularly like the line about the sun still shining when I close my eyes. Yes, I get my inspiration from a country western song! LOL

 

I'm leaving now... before I die of embarrassment :)

[Sara R]

Not really--

 

I just heard that the International Energy Association (or some such agency) said that the world needed to invest $43 TRILLION into alternative energy. This is at a time when the worth of dollars are shrinking, when the US is already in debt $9 trillion and lots of supposed wealth is vanishing from the statements of corporations and people, as the value of real estate and real estate debt goes down--

 

I also read that the "recovery" after the 2001 recession was financed entirely by debt. If you take the GDP numbers and subtract the amount that people went into debt, we wouldn't have had growth for the past 7 years.

 

Yes, I think hard times are ahead. I hope I'm wrong.

[lynn]

that my family's particular future is still optimistic-- we have always been careful with our money, have more than most people, and my dh job is extremely secure. We are still very comfortable even with prices soaring.

 

However, I am not optimistic for the average American living in debt up to their eyeballs and never thinking that it is even a goal to own anything- house, car, nothing. I think that so many people are trying to fill their lives with stuff to be happy and they never will find happiness this way, and keep buying and buying and buying-- on credit no less. The economy will never be stable until people live withing their means and have goals to become independent of credit.

 

So true. Sadly many people have their identitiy in their "stuff" no matter that it was all purchased on credit that needs to be paid off. There's nothing wrong with having things you want as long as you can pay for it but most Americans never do pay for things because they get the new stuff before the old stuff is paid. I often wonder what would happen if the credit card companies started stopping peoples credit card use until they paid their balance down.

[Jill- OK]

See, Karen, how much more sophisticated you are than I? The lines that pop in my head when I think about things like this is from a country western song by Travis Tritt!! LOL!! :)

 

Robin...I love you. :D

 

(I love Karen, too, with the Longfellow and such, but I'm just sayin'...)

[Renee in NC]

So true. Sadly many people have their identitiy in their "stuff" no matter that it was all purchased on credit that needs to be paid off. There's nothing wrong with having things you want as long as you can pay for it but most Americans never do pay for things because they get the new stuff before the old stuff is paid. I often wonder what would happen if the credit card companies started stopping peoples credit card use until they paid their balance down.

 

Not all credit is from people buying stuff. We have a LOT of debt, but very little of it was spent on stuff. We spent too many years trying to make it on too little - as in below poverty level too little. I wanted to stay home, my dh wanted me to stay home, and it seemed to make sense (I had 6dc and 4 of those were 5 and under!) Now I realize how stupid that was!

 

Now we are paying the price. We haven't charged anything on the cards in more than 2 years, yet the balances have gone up, not down. The interest rates are in the high 20s, fees abound, and most are *still* at their limit. We'll be paying this off for the next 20 years!:D

[Sara R]

I often wonder what would happen if the credit card companies started stopping peoples credit card use until they paid their balance down.

 

I bet this is going to start happening within the next year or so. Banks have cut down dramatically on home mortgages, home equity lines of credit (even people who got lines of credit earlier without accessing them are getting that credit cut off because the equity has disappeared), and student loans. Credit cards are the only thing left. And so people are putting more and more purchases on credit cards. People were already spending beyond their means, but now inflation and economic slowdown is making it worse.

 

Not much of this will be fun to watch, but I have to admit that watching credit card companies get what's coming to them would be an exception. :)

[sdWTMer]

I am curious as to what others think. I know life as we know it will change with the gas and food prices but stay optimistic and feel that it will all stabilize and life will go on.

 

Because we are a resilient nation! We overcome. We will workout the problems, it will just take some time!

[Phred]

I've read through this entire thread... I'm sitting here shaking my head. I'm torn between wanting to slap around those that think somehow this is all a God mandated end-times festival and slapping silly those that think everything is just rosy. It's neither.

 

First off, oil. It's not the biggest problem we have by a long shot. It's just the most immediate to a lot of people. $5.00 a gallon gas is nothing compared to what most people in Europe already pay. And it's nothing compared to what we're going to pay. Everyone wants to live like an American. Only we can't afford a planet where everyone lives like an American. Heck, we can't afford a planet were all Americans live like Americans. But China and India are going to give it a shot anyway. They're going to start buying oil like crazy... and that's going to drive the price up, up, up. Then the dollar is starting to go down, down, down. Which makes the price seem like it's even more ridiculous. Since it's a global market, all oil sells for the same price whether it's drilled out of the ground here or in Indonesia. It wouldn't much matter how much oil we're sitting upon... unless we withdraw from that global marketplace and I don't see the oil companies doing that... do you?

 

Next, US dominance in the world... we're only as dominant as the world lets us be. Something George W. Bush had rudely shoved in his face. When everyone wants something from you, you're in charge. When they tell you to take a hike... you're the idiot in the corner. Then your only option is to kick their butt or shut up and go home. Bush tried to kick some butt in Iraq... didn't work. Now we're looked at as a bunch of ignorant fools. Way to go W.

 

About the comparison to the Roman empire. Something to be thought about. The Roman empire was pretty wimpy until it became a dictatorship. When the Caesars came along and started kicking butts and taking names, then the Romans became a world dominating power. You either bowed to their might or you were made to bow to their might. Before that they were just like us. They couldn't argue their way out of a paper bag. And don't think there aren't people who know this analogy and wouldn't have liked to proclaim W. emperor. 9/11 was the perfect excuse. We had people practically begging for it. Terrorism everywhere, the evil needs to be stamped out!

 

Next... end times. Whoo boy. It just frightens me that New York or some other city could go up in a nuclear fireball and about 30% of the population would look at that event and practically cheer because to them that would mean Jesus is just that much closer to appearing. Of course, he wouldn't show up, just as he didn't show up after 9/11. You can believe your deity is in charge of all this... but please don't abdicate your responsibility to the rest of us to do what you can to make this place livable while you're here.

 

Where are we really going? Nowhere fast if we keep up what we've been doing. The oceans are nearly fished out. We're changing the ecosystems of the seas so that fish populations may not be able to come back. We pretty much wiped out the orange roughy because we didn't realize that the fish we loved to eat had about an 80 year lifespan. We fished 'em out before they could spawn. That's just one tale of ocean woe. The deepwater fish, cod and the like... populations are all way, way down. The climate is changing... whether it's due to us or whatever it's changing. Freshwater is running out. Aquifers are empty. We're at 6 billion people headed for 9 billion people and we can't feed the six billion we've got. But here in the US we're more worried about which pastor the candidates are endorsed by than which problems they can fix. Just about everyone is overweight because we accept crap for food. HFCS is in everything... EVERYTHING...

 

But it's all ok because Costco will save me .40 cents on grape juice.

 

I'm just not optimistic we're going to be willing to endure the pain it's going to take to untangle our problems until we're already enduring pain that's worse.

[Marie in Oh]

Not all credit is from people buying stuff. We have a LOT of debt, but very little of it was spent on stuff. We spent too many years trying to make it on too little - as in below poverty level too little. I wanted to stay home, my dh wanted me to stay home, and it seemed to make sense (I had 6dc and 4 of those were 5 and under!) Now I realize how stupid that was!

 

Now we are paying the price. We haven't charged anything on the cards in more than 2 years, yet the balances have gone up, not down. The interest rates are in the high 20s, fees abound, and most are *still* at their limit. We'll be paying this off for the next 20 years!:D

 

You used credit to get you by when times were hard and now you are bailing yourselves out. You are being responsible and paying it off as best as you can and not acquiring more debt.

 

Most Americans are buying stuff on credit with no intention of ever paying it off. Many Americans have NO INTENTION of ever owning their house, their cars, their lawn mower, or their boat-- and the stuff in their closets, etc. Credit is free money a whole generation who want it and want it now. This is the biggest problem of the American economy, the reason there is a housing crisis, and the reason the dollar is failing. It isn't worth anything because people aren't spending cold hard cash for things, they are spending what they hope they will get. Big difference.

[Zoraida]

I think we are all a bunch of wimps who need stimulus checks to make us feel better. If our great grandparents and grandparents can survive the depression or the dust bowl period without any kind of stimulus package why can't we?

 

Blessings

 

Zoraida