Am I to hard on my kids??

[Trish]

I have now and will have in the future high expectations for our dd. She is 14 months old and has been able to go out to eat with us for at least 7 months without being a much of a disturbance to others. We expect her to not scream, to sit in her high chair, and to not make a mess. She does really well and we still do small corrections most of the time when we go out. We spent about 2 1/2-3 hours with my dh's colleagues for dinner at a restaurant. We walked her around now and then when she would get tired of sitting, but everyone remarked about how well she did. I know that there are people who think that we are too hard on her, but we are getting the results that we want and she still gets plenty of love and attention.

 

Enjoy this. Don't expect it.

[justamouse]

Enjoy this. Don't expect it.

 

Why not? My kids have all done the same. There's never been a time when we ALL didn't go out to dinner. When you put a lot of attention into them, and train them on how to behave in the situation, they enjoy it just as much as you do.

 

Even when the twins were 5 and dude was 4 and we had a baby, we would all go out to eat.

 

As to what Tibbie said-it's SO true.

 

I was just reading as to why some Germans aided Jews escaping and others fell under Hitler's spell. As they researched over time, they found that the children of the punitive parents were the ones that 'did what they were told' and became Hitler's soldiers. The ones who were raised with respect and with autonomy were the ones who showed courage in going against what was expected of them.

 

(did I just fulfill Goodwin's law?:001_huh:)

[Trish]

Why not? My kids have all done the same. There's never been a time when we ALL didn't go out to dinner. When you put a lot of attention into them, and train them on how to behave in the situation, they enjoy it just as much as you do.

 

Even when the twins were 5 and dude was 4 and we had a baby, we would all go out to eat.

 

As to what Tibbie said-it's SO true.

 

I was just reading as to why some Germans aided Jews escaping and others fell under Hitler's spell. As they researched over time, they found that the children of the punitive parents were the ones that 'did what they were told' and became Hitler's soldiers. The ones who were raised with respect and with autonomy were the ones who showed courage in going against what was expected of them.

 

(did I just fulfill Goodwin's law?:001_huh:)

 

14 months.

[angela in ohio]

The young man in this situation was avoiding taking the job task and actively disrespecting the boss's authority. It's not acceptable to say "I have to go play first" and then go play..boy was done playing; bball was across the yard on the ground and boy was being sent to get something mom needed. It's not acceptable to refuse the job in this circumstance as play at this age does not rank over giving mom a helping hand. It's the same disrespect as refusing to get in the car when the park play date is over, and running back for another turn on the slide...only at 15 it's age inappropriate.

 

I agree.

 

I think part of the problem is that we are all reading this situation differently. Many are assuming that he was in the middle of playing. I tend to think that the OP knows whether (1.) he has a problem in this area, and/or (2.) he was actually in the middle of playing or was done and just looking for an excuse. I expect dc to do things when asked, but I don't ask them when they are in the middle of things and I allow them to ask for a minute if necessary. But I know when they aren't really in the middle of something and are just stalling. By paying attention to dc, I have been able to nip these times in the bud, and it has led to a healthier relationship (they don't take advantage, and the situation doesn't escalate.)

[SKL]

so it's their house, their stuff, and they didn't have a problem with the little kids pulling out and playing with "their" things, but you did? why?

 

Just because nobody said anything, that doesn't mean they would be OK with the kids messing up the house.

 

When my kids were 2, we spent a few days at the home of a childless couple. The couple had displayed many breakable "pretties" within easy reach of toddlers. I told my kids "you may look, but don't touch." They listened. If they had not listened, I would have done something to make them listen. It's not up to other people to control my kids or even to babyproof their houses when we come over. I might like to be invited again someday, or at least to not be spoken of negatively by the person whose house my kids ransacked.

[justamouse]

14 months.

 

Yes, I understand that? I'm saying that my family did it, even with kids so closely spaced-that's what I was trying to show. If you plan it can be done and everyone can have a great time.

[Haiku]

I think grounding your son for a week for not asking "How high?" when you say "Jump!" is extreme. Who cares whether he takes one more shot before he gets the wheelbarrow? It sounds like you are way too caught up in perfect obedience and are not being completely reasonable.

 

As far as asking someone other than Dad whether they needed help ... well, your son did what you asked him to do. He asked whether they needed help. Yeah, he probably didn't follow the spirit of your request. Yeah, that's kinda obnoxious. Yeah, your dh could have asked him for help if he needed it. Again, I think you overreacted.

 

I wouldn't sweat the small stuff, were I you.

 

Tara

[Joyofsixreboot]

People comment on parenting all the time. The unsolicited advice is worth what you paid for it.:001_smile:

[Matryoshka]

Why not? My kids have all done the same. There's never been a time when we ALL didn't go out to dinner. When you put a lot of attention into them, and train them on how to behave in the situation, they enjoy it just as much as you do.

 

 

I had three girls in 2 1/2 years. They were always great at restaurants - I ate out a lot when they were little (and I didn't have to pay much to feed them yet :tongue_smilie:). I got compliments everywhere I went. People couldn't believe I could have pleasant meals out with friends with three toddlers in tow. Yes, I expected good behavior, taught them not to throw their food on the floor, did all the right things, and for me, it worked.

 

I still do not delude myself that if I had had a baby with sensory issues or colic or was super on-the-move wiggly any other number of issues I've seen in others' children, that I would have had the same results and that my girls were so well behaved in public 100% due to my brilliant parenting. It's not that I wasn't doing things right, it's that with some kids, even when you do things right, it doesn't work. I try not to assume when I see an out-of-control kid that it's just bad parenting - maybe that parent got handed a really challenging kid, and I should have some compassion.

 

And things change, even with the same kid. My youngest went everywhere with me till she was - oh, about 14 mos. She'd sit and listen like she was part of the conversation. Then, suddenly, she developed opinions about what she wanted. Oy. (This has not affected restaurant behavior, but all other sorts of compliance issues. And we are not softies, and we are consistent. The older two are nothing like her - maybe I let my guard down when I knew she was my last and started to think I knew what I was doing, and God said - HA! Not too late to teach you better!).

Edited September 8, 2011 by matroyshka

[cseitter]

Ok let me say this. My son has ALOT of time on his own doing his own thing. A majority of the time he cuts grass and plays basketball at the same time and no one says anything.... It takes him forever..... he cuts one strip and play BB takes another stripe and plays ball.

 

My DS is a fantastic kid. I LOVE being around him and he and I do alot together but when I see that work needs to be done that is what should be done. Play can come after especially if your family members are steady working and you are playing.

 

The example of the sticks... this was after the hurricane and the yard was a MESS branches, sticks, etc everywhere.... and he was playing BB while I was cleaning the yard and his dad was working on the generator. It just burned me up. He did get time off for good behavior. For my child 1 day doesn't cut it. He has actually laughed when I ground him for a day. The whole thing of him not doing what he is told got him cut from the BB team last year so I am really trying to teach him how to do better.

 

I appreciate all the advice. Yes I do micromanage at times ok maybe more often than not. DS has ADD so I have always stayed on top of him to get things done or they just wouldn't. He would "1 min" me to death. I think I will think about the way I work things out with him and have a talk with him and his father and see what they think.

 

I have asked him this in the past and he says I am hard sometimes but he likes when he gets off for good behavior....

 

Thanks for the insights! :grouphug:

[gardenmom5]

Just because nobody said anything, that doesn't mean they would be OK with the kids messing up the house.

 

.

The cousin was the one who told the op she thought she needed to go easier on her kids. It was her dad's house, she bought stuff for it. I'd say effectively the 'owner' did say something about it being okay.

[cseitter]

I agree that negotiating to prioritize the work load is a needed job skill.

 

The young man in this situation was avoiding taking the job task and actively disrespecting the boss's authority. It's not acceptable to say "I have to go play first" and then go play..boy was done playing; bball was across the yard on the ground and boy was being sent to get something mom needed. It's not acceptable to refuse the job in this circumstance as play at this age does not rank over giving mom a helping hand. It's the same disrespect as refusing to get in the car when the park play date is over, and running back for another turn on the slide...only at 15 it's age inappropriate.

 

Perhaps a consequence to be considered is getting his work papers and finding him a real part-time job. This way he'll come to understand that momma is not a b-*tch and the world really doesn't work the way he's thinking it does.

 

Funny you should say that he has an interview tomorrow! LOL

[BigMamaBird]

 

My goal in parenting ultimately is if my kids are away from me that they are well behaved, respectful and help out. My cousins are the first ones to tell me my kids are fantastic away from me and can come to their house anytime

 

:iagree: It sounds like you are doing a very good job at raising responsible people.

[gardenmom5]

I still do not delude myself that if I had had a baby with sensory issues or colic or was super on-the-move wiggly any other number of issues I've seen in others' children, that I would have had the same results and that my girls were so well behaved in public 100% due to my brilliant parenting. It's not that I wasn't doing things right, it's that with some kids, even when you do things right, it doesn't work. I try not to assume when I see an out-of-control kid that it's just bad parenting - maybe that parent got handed a really challenging kid, and I should have some compassion.

 

:grouphug: I wish more people were so understanding. It's amazing how many with easy children think they're brilliant parents and have all the answers.

[simka2]

Ok let me say this. My son has ALOT of time on his own doing his own thing. A majority of the time he cuts grass and plays basketball at the same time and no one says anything.... It takes him forever..... he cuts one strip and play BB takes another stripe and plays ball.

 

My DS is a fantastic kid. I LOVE being around him and he and I do alot together but when I see that work needs to be done that is what should be done. Play can come after especially if your family members are steady working and you are playing.

 

The example of the sticks... this was after the hurricane and the yard was a MESS branches, sticks, etc everywhere.... and he was playing BB while I was cleaning the yard and his dad was working on the generator. It just burned me up. He did get time off for good behavior. For my child 1 day doesn't cut it. He has actually laughed when I ground him for a day. The whole thing of him not doing what he is told got him cut from the BB team last year so I am really trying to teach him how to do better.

 

I appreciate all the advice. Yes I do micromanage at times ok maybe more often than not. DS has ADD so I have always stayed on top of him to get things done or they just wouldn't. He would "1 min" me to death. I think I will think about the way I work things out with him and have a talk with him and his father and see what they think.

 

I have asked him this in the past and he says I am hard sometimes but he likes when he gets off for good behavior....

 

Thanks for the insights! :grouphug:

 

My ds has adhd and impulse control issues. That said the above scenario with the mowing of the lawn would not happen! I have no problem with him saying, "Can I have 5min to finish my game and then I will mow the lawn?" Once the lawn is started...it will be finished (baring water breaks ;))

 

I might be wrong, but it sounds like he is getting away with some things, and then being micromanaged on others. You are getting no condemnation from me, because this is an area I struggle with. I can imagine that it is frustrating for both of you. :grouphug:

[cseitter]

See to me the lawn is where I give him some freedom. If he chooses to play BB and mow at the same time fine but he isn't going off and doing anything else until the lawn is done. So if it takes you 5 hours to mow you just wasted 5 hours. He did the same thing washing dishes. wash, rinse and dry (our dishwasher was broke) 1 dish at a time.

 

It took him FOREVER to do dishes. we tried to talk to him and tell him that there was a different way to do it but he kept on until he figured out for himself.

 

 

 

My ds has adhd and impulse control issues. That said the above scenario with the mowing of the lawn would not happen! I have no problem with him saying, "Can I have 5min to finish my game and then I will mow the lawn?" Once the lawn is started...it will be finished (baring water breaks ;))

 

I might be wrong, but it sounds like he is getting away with some things, and then being micromanaged on others. You are getting no condemnation from me, because this is an area I struggle with. I can imagine that it is frustrating for both of you. :grouphug:

[simka2]

See to me the lawn is where I give him some freedom. If he chooses to play BB and mow at the same time fine but he isn't going off and doing anything else until the lawn is done. So if it takes you 5 hours to mow you just wasted 5 hours. He did the same thing washing dishes. wash, rinse and dry (our dishwasher was broke) 1 dish at a time.

 

It took him FOREVER to do dishes. we tried to talk to him and tell him that there was a different way to do it but he kept on until he figured out for himself.

 

That makes sense. For me it is safety and wasting respources issue. Starting a mower over and over would use up a lot of gas ;).

[FlyingMOm]

I just want to warn you... we had a toddler girl who did really well at restaurants, too. Then we had DS... :lol: How a 14mo behaves is all in the personality... not much you can do.

 

I emphatically disagree. Of course personality & temperament play into it some but there IS lots that you can do to teach a 14 month old to have good behavior. (and for the record, I do have one child who is quite difficult so I do understand those children with difficult/high needs temperaments.)

 

Didn't want to derail the thread but did absolutely want to encourage the mama of the well-behaved 14mo. that she should keep doing whatever it is that she is doing that is turning out good results- good for you, mama!

Edited September 8, 2011 by FlyingMOm

[cseitter]

LOL... I am so dumb sometimes. I should have just talked to DS. I asked him to be really honest with and tell me if he felt I micromanaged him and was to hard on him. He said sometimes. So I asked for examples of when he felt that way.... the only one he could remember was when I yelled at him one day (it was a day DH and got into a HUGE fight and DS was in the wrong place at the wrong time). He didn't even remember the picking up sticks... says he knew he was wrong and was trying to get out of it.

 

So I explained that the Cousins say I was way to hard on them and it had been bothering me and I wanted to get his opinion on the subject. He started laughing and said well I guess compared to them you are REALLY strict cause they aren't strict at all and let their DD get away with everything even being mean to people.

 

I so I asked if there was anything he felt that I should do differently and then his mind started working and I said forget that I asked that...

 

So really I just needed to talk to my own kid (who knows he can talk to me and I won't get mad at him for it) to find out how he feels.

 

Thanks again for just being there when I needed it!

[cseitter]

That makes sense. For me it is safety and wasting respources issue. Starting a mower over and over would use up a lot of gas ;).

 

 

LOL we ask for gas money sometimes! :001_smile:

[Lang Syne Boardie]

 

I so I asked if there was anything he felt that I should do differently and then his mind started working and I said forget that I asked that...

 

 

:lol:

 

I'm glad the conversation went well!

[I.Dup.]

LOL... I am so dumb sometimes. I should have just talked to DS. I asked him to be really honest with and tell me if he felt I micromanaged him and was to hard on him. He said sometimes. So I asked for examples of when he felt that way.... the only one he could remember was when I yelled at him one day (it was a day DH and got into a HUGE fight and DS was in the wrong place at the wrong time). He didn't even remember the picking up sticks... says he knew he was wrong and was trying to get out of it.

 

So I explained that the Cousins say I was way to hard on them and it had been bothering me and I wanted to get his opinion on the subject. He started laughing and said well I guess compared to them you are REALLY strict cause they aren't strict at all and let their DD get away with everything even being mean to people.

 

I so I asked if there was anything he felt that I should do differently and then his mind started working and I said forget that I asked that...

 

So really I just needed to talk to my own kid (who knows he can talk to me and I won't get mad at him for it) to find out how he feels.

 

Thanks again for just being there when I needed it!

 

:thumbup:

 

I was going to agree with the others who said you don't sound too harsh. Yelling, anger, things like that are harsh. Having high expectations (without the yelling, anger stuff) is NOT harsh, IMO. It's love and teaching them how to be responsible human beings. Keep up the good work!

[Lolly]

I just want to warn you... we had a toddler girl who did really well at restaurants, too. Then we had DS... :lol: How a 14mo behaves is all in the personality... not much you can do.

 

So very true!

 

Yes, I understand that? I'm saying that my family did it, even with kids so closely spaced-that's what I was trying to show. If you plan it can be done and everyone can have a great time.

 

Or, you happened to have kids who were fairly easy. If you have a whole bunch, you sure did get lucky!!! I know a family who has a whole lotta kids. They are all unbelievably well behaved, always. Child #12...has thrown them for a loop. Just made me :D. They aren't quite as smug and looking down their nose at other people's children who aren't perfect angels any longer.:lol: Good parenting definitely helps, but there is a whole lot more personality involved than people with easy children understand sometimes. Especially at 14 mths old.

[Tangerine]

So very true!

 

 

 

Or, you happened to have kids who were fairly easy. If you have a whole bunch, you sure did get lucky!!! I know a family who has a whole lotta kids. They are all unbelievably well behaved, always. Child #12...has thrown them for a loop. Just made me :D. They aren't quite as smug and looking down their nose at other people's children who aren't perfect angels any longer.:lol: Good parenting definitely helps, but there is a whole lot more personality involved than people with easy children understand sometimes. Especially at 14 mths old.

 

:iagree: I have two very sweet and easy (thus far anyway!) kids. I know it is not my stellar parenting and high expectations that made them that way. They're just pretty easy kids. I have always told DH if we have more, we're pressing our luck and we'll get a dud. ;) Well #3 is on the way, so I guess we'll see soon enough.

[FlyingMOm]

I think you rock.

 

It is rare anymore that people respect others property and teach their dc the same. It is rare that people don't use the "well, he's a teen" excuse to let their ds goof around all day. Of course people will think you are too hard on your kiddos. They aren't used to seeing a parent parent.

 

Honestly, you should be given an award for teaching a young man to work before he plays. I can't imagine how much better off we all would be if more people worked to teach their dc this. And my dc know that if I say, "go ask if you can help," they better insist and help, not just ask and run off.

 

We spend a few weeks a year with dh's family (one stays with us, and the others all come here every day to see him.) Without fail, they tell me that I am too hard on my dc. They also comment proudly to other relatives about them, appreciate that we can go places with them without drama, and enjoy them immensely. :D

 

Just let it roll off your back. The proof is in the pudding, and it may take years before they see that you were right. :001_smile: My parents listened to it for years and years from my aunt. Of her two dc, one is in and out of rehab and the other lives in her basement with his gf and her baby. My db and I have stable happy families. Whenever I am tempted to buckle under pressure from the crowd, I remember how my parents stood up to it.

 

EXCELLENT! I totally agree!

[Lang Syne Boardie]

So very true!

 

 

 

Or, you happened to have kids who were fairly easy. If you have a whole bunch, you sure did get lucky!!! I know a family who has a whole lotta kids. They are all unbelievably well behaved, always. Child #12...has thrown them for a loop. Just made me :D. They aren't quite as smug and looking down their nose at other people's children who aren't perfect angels any longer.:lol: Good parenting definitely helps, but there is a whole lot more personality involved than people with easy children understand sometimes. Especially at 14 mths old.

 

:iagree: I have two very sweet and easy (thus far anyway!) kids. I know it is not my stellar parenting and high expectations that made them that way. They're just pretty easy kids. I have always told DH if we have more, we're pressing our luck and we'll get a dud. ;) Well #3 is on the way, so I guess we'll see soon enough.

 

Sometimes when people offer their perspective on a particular aspect of parenting, they are simply sharing the voice of experience. Sometimes philosophies, ideas, and results are the outcome of years in the School of Hard Knocks for Parents.

 

I know I've done my time in that school, and my training is not yet complete. I also know that my children are not 'easy,' nor did they hatch out of an egg or come out of a box in a fully-matured and easy-to-discipline state! My children and I have learned together. Isn't that true for every family? Do we all really have state our children's various labels, challenges, sins, and outrageous behaviors before we're allowed to talk about what we've learned? That would be a pretty long disclaimer, and I don't think it is necessary.

 

I'm not sure what is going on here lately. You can't talk about accelerated learners, even on the accelerated learners board, without being accused of bragging. You can't talk about parenting without being explained away as a person who obviously has 'easy' children.

 

Has everyone stopped studying Logic? Has critical thinking gone out of style?

[herbalgirl]

I think you are low expectations on the 'okay to say no if asked' for the 15 year old. That's the age where they should be realizing that 'asking= do now'. It's also a job skill..when boss asks you to move the crate, he's going to say 'joe, can you move that crate up against the wall?', and the response is not 'maybe, after I have my break'. Also at this age, anytime mama asks for help, it should be given immediately, 'cause mama has a lot of work to do and mama should be respected. Teen should know by now that he should step up and pitch in without being asked if parent is doing yard work, not play. Same with kitchen/cooking..no one at this age should be playing while mama is slaving on family chores.You might sit out in your lawn chair with a lemonade doing a crossword puzzle next time he's doing yard work to make the point.

 

With the downstairs biz, I'd be on Dad. Dad should be setting up boy for success here and have jobs for him as he works his way up from helper/parts runner to actually contributing.

 

:iagree:

[Lacie]

That's the age where they should be realizing that 'asking= do now'. It's also a job skill..when boss asks you to move the crate, he's going to say 'joe, can you move that crate up against the wall?', and the response is not 'maybe, after I have my break'. Also at this age, anytime mama asks for help, it should be given immediately, 'cause mama has a lot of work to do and mama should be respected. Teen should know by now that he should step up and pitch in without being asked if parent is doing yard work, not play. Same with kitchen/cooking..no one at this age should be playing while mama is slaving on family chores.

 

:iagree:

[Tangerine]

Sometimes when people offer their perspective on a particular aspect of parenting, they are simply sharing the voice of experience. Sometimes philosophies, ideas, and results are the outcome of years in the School of Hard Knocks for Parents.

 

I know I've done my time in that school, and my training is not yet complete. I also know that my children are not 'easy,' nor did they hatch out of an egg or come out of a box in a fully-matured and easy-to-discipline state! My children and I have learned together. Isn't that true for every family? Do we all really have state our children's various labels, challenges, sins, and outrageous behaviors before we're allowed to talk about what we've learned? That would be a pretty long disclaimer, and I don't think it is necessary.

 

I'm not sure what is going on here lately. You can't talk about accelerated learners, even on the accelerated learners board, without being accused of bragging. You can't talk about parenting without being explained away as a person who obviously has 'easy' children.

 

Has everyone stopped studying Logic? Has critical thinking gone out of style?

 

:lol: Just agreeing with a post there, Mom. Consider my knuckles thoroughly rapped.

[Annie Laurie]

 

With the 15yo: did it matter when he went to get the wheelbarrow? I try very hard to offer leeway to my teenager when possible, so that I can be obeyed without problems when necessary. I try to make it a rational relationship: if it matters that he does it now (unpack the dishwasher so that his brother can repack and I have space to make supper, for example) then I insist on it. If the leaves would still be there in thirty seconds after he took his basketball shot, and you were all having a relaxing weekend with family, then I would not have pushed it so hard. Our rule is that you can't disobey, but if you have a decent reason for doing something in a different way, I'm ready to listen (in most cases). "Mum, can I finish this chapter?" is usually fine, as is, "I've been planning this shot, is it okay if I make it before getting the wheelbarrow?"

 

 

I agree with this. But the OP's son didn't ask if he could take the shot and just have a few minutes, he told his mom to wait a minute. I think that comes across as disrespectful and might be why the OP reacted the way she did.

 

I have a son who could come across that way too, and I always called him on it and explained that I don't have a problem with him finishing something up, but it sounds more respectful if he asks me if it would hold anything up if he finishes this one thing he's doing, rather than him telling me to wait. The delivery makes a difference. And that's something I wanted my son to learn before he has a boss and other interactions where he needs to come across the right way.

 

It sounds like the OP was annoyed by her son's delivery so then just told him no. The problem is, at that age, then it becomes a battle of wills (her ds took the shot anyway), and I don't think it's a hill worth dying on.

 

With him going and asking if they needed help, that totally sounds like something my son would do, knowing if he asked the right person he'd be told he didn't need to help. So I'd just avoid that situation by asking myself if they needed son's help or finding out what jobs needed to be done and assigning him one. Let him know he's free to go out with the golf cart or whatever he wants, after he finishes his assigned job.

[lea1]

Well, since you asked, I do think your punishment was very harsh. It would have made more sense, and accomplished more, if you'd just had him pitch in and help with something else later. Grounding for a week....wow...I would reserve that for a really serious issue. Your son is past the age of being micro-managed. Give him some slack and work with him. He's not a little kid anymore.

 

:iagree: If you are not careful about the micro-management, he is going to become rebellious.

[justamouse]

So very true!

 

 

 

Or, you happened to have kids who were fairly easy. If you have a whole bunch, you sure did get lucky!!! I know a family who has a whole lotta kids. They are all unbelievably well behaved, always. Child #12...has thrown them for a loop. Just made me :D. They aren't quite as smug and looking down their nose at other people's children who aren't perfect angels any longer.:lol: Good parenting definitely helps, but there is a whole lot more personality involved than people with easy children understand sometimes. Especially at 14 mths old.

 

Umm no. I learned on my first. I made every mistake and more on him, parenting him the way many of you do here. The reason my others are so good? Because *I* changed my parenting.

 

Doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result? No. I made a 180 and went in a different direction. THAT made the difference.

 

Sometimes when people offer their perspective on a particular aspect of parenting, they are simply sharing the voice of experience. Sometimes philosophies, ideas, and results are the outcome of years in the School of Hard Knocks for Parents.

 

I know I've done my time in that school, and my training is not yet complete. I also know that my children are not 'easy,' nor did they hatch out of an egg or come out of a box in a fully-matured and easy-to-discipline state! My children and I have learned together. Isn't that true for every family? Do we all really have state our children's various labels, challenges, sins, and outrageous behaviors before we're allowed to talk about what we've learned? That would be a pretty long disclaimer, and I don't think it is necessary.

 

I'm not sure what is going on here lately. You can't talk about accelerated learners, even on the accelerated learners board, without being accused of bragging. You can't talk about parenting without being explained away as a person who obviously has 'easy' children.

 

Has everyone stopped studying Logic? Has critical thinking gone out of style?

 

Thank you. :iagree:

[higginszoo]

LOL... I am so dumb sometimes. I should have just talked to DS. I asked him to be really honest with and tell me if he felt I micromanaged him and was to hard on him. He said sometimes. So I asked for examples of when he felt that way.... the only one he could remember was when I yelled at him one day (it was a day DH and got into a HUGE fight and DS was in the wrong place at the wrong time). He didn't even remember the picking up sticks... says he knew he was wrong and was trying to get out of it.

 

So I explained that the Cousins say I was way to hard on them and it had been bothering me and I wanted to get his opinion on the subject. He started laughing and said well I guess compared to them you are REALLY strict cause they aren't strict at all and let their DD get away with everything even being mean to people.

 

I so I asked if there was anything he felt that I should do differently and then his mind started working and I said forget that I asked that...

 

So really I just needed to talk to my own kid (who knows he can talk to me and I won't get mad at him for it) to find out how he feels.

 

Thanks again for just being there when I needed it!

Yep. This is definitely a good approach. You may want to work with him on consequences when his actions cause issues for other people. Like when he fails to do something that needs to be done that then holds someone else up, talk him through the whole series of events and then have him put some input into a punishment that fits the crime both in scope and in service.

 

For instance, a friend's teenaged son recently slammed a door open in a fit of pique. The knob made a hole in the wall. He had to purchase repair materials and help his dad repair the hole. He knows that if it happens again, he will lose the use of the door (they'll store it in the garage). Because he wasn't allowed other activities until the wall was repaired, he missed a party he was hoping to go to. But once the hole was repaired, all was forgiven, the cost and time of repair, along with missing the party, was considered enough penalty for a momentary temper tantrum.

[Laura Corin]

I agree that negotiating to prioritize the work load is a needed job skill.

 

The young man in this situation was avoiding taking the job task and actively disrespecting the boss's authority. It's not acceptable to say "I have to go play first" and then go play..boy was done playing; bball was across the yard on the ground and boy was being sent to get something mom needed.

 

I would not have been pleased with direct disobedience.

 

My point was about the previous set-up: the leaf collection was not so urgent that one last shot at basketball would have been an inconvenience. If the parent had shown a little flexibility before, then the disobedience would not have arisen.

 

Laura

Edited September 8, 2011 by Laura Corin

[angela in ohio]

:grouphug: I wish more people were so understanding. It's amazing how many with easy children think they're brilliant parents and have all the answers.

 

And sometimes you put years of constant sweat and tears into shaping considerate and well-behaved children, and then people tell you it must be because they are easy. It's a two way street. ;)

[momma2three]

All I have to say is that if anyone thinks they have "the answer" to making sure your 14 month old is always behaved in public, no matter their innate personality, you should write a book: there isn't a parent who wouldn't buy it. :lol:

[Lawana]

My story about my dd was not that she is an easy child. It was more that we have worked with her and have high expectations for her behavior. Our families at least tend to think that we are too hard on dd, but then have commented on how well she does. I have known fairly large families where all the kids were usually well behaved both in public and at home.

 

As for more kids it took us 7+ years to have this one and considering I am 36 it is unlikely that we will have more although we would love to.

:DAll well and good. Until you have a child that at <less than or equal to> 14 months *does not* respond to being *worked on*. Really. At that age, personality of child has *a lot* to do with how they respond. It is very true that more babies would *behave* better with better parenting, but until you parent a child that just.does.not.respond to normal parenting, you may think *you* are a genius. I have a (step) granddaughter who is a perfect example of an average child that responds to parenting. She is a(n un)holy terror when out with her parents, but not so when out with me. (I babysat her 4-5 days a week from the time she was 8 weeks until 3.5 yrs.) Yet I am very aware of children that have been raised by parents with very high standards, who have also raised angel kids, that just.don't.respond.

 

Observing families with children that exhibit "better than average" behavior leads one to conclude what─that it may be environment *or* it may be genetics. It is entirely conceivable that all, say 8, kids from one family share the traits that allow them to respond to high expectations and normal parenting. Until you experience one of those children that are *not* responsive, do not presume that high expectations and normal parenting are always enough.

 

You are certainly to be commended for the parenting you provide. Many more children would benefit from such efforts. But do beware of thinking it is *all you*.

[Haiku]

Until you experience one of those children that are *not* responsive, do not presume that high expectations and normal parenting are always enough.

 

Having three kids who are not genetically related to one another sure drives that point home for me. Every day!

 

Tara

[Lawana]

I would not have been pleased with direct disobedience.

 

My point was about the previous set-up: the leaf collection was not so urgent that one last shot at basketball would have been an inconvenience. If the parent had shown a little flexibility before, then the disobedience would not have arisen.

 

Laura

Yes. 15 yos are plenty able to discern whether an order to do something "right now, no delay," is a genuine need, rather than an apparent power play on the part of the order-giver. I am not arguing the need for structure and chain-of-command. I have observed that many males need and respond to a clear chain-of-command structure. I do think, again based on personal observation, that teenage boys and their mothers have to work out how to address the issues of respect and obedience. Ideally, the relationships are cemented by age 12+, and the young male responds out of love and respect. Reality being what it is, there are times when a mother must require obedience from an otherwise reluctant son. There is, certainly, room for disagreement about what constitutes reasonable consequences for disobedience. First and foremost, expectations should be reasonable. My best wishes to you as you travel this complicated path.

[jujsky]

See to me the lawn is where I give him some freedom. If he chooses to play BB and mow at the same time fine but he isn't going off and doing anything else until the lawn is done. So if it takes you 5 hours to mow you just wasted 5 hours. He did the same thing washing dishes. wash, rinse and dry (our dishwasher was broke) 1 dish at a time.

 

It took him FOREVER to do dishes. we tried to talk to him and tell him that there was a different way to do it but he kept on until he figured out for himself.

 

OMG! My son is 8. That will be him 7 years from now. My husband refers to it as "passive avoidance." He will draw out the simplest tasks for-ev-er! We will explain to him that once it's done, he can go do x,y,and z, but it makes no differences. We punish him if he doesn't do things (I have a whole system where he loses tickets for behavior -- after losing 3, he loses his DS, after another 3 he loses TV, after another he loses Wii, etc) and that often doesn't work. He would literally rather sit there doing nothing than do something he doesn't want to do. There was a day last year where he flat-out refused to do his math, not because he didn't understand it, but because he didn't feel like it. He sat at that table from 10:00 AM until 8:30 PM only breaking for bathroom breaks, lunch, and dinner. People think I'm way too tough on him, but if I crack and budge just once on a rule, he will fight me even harder the next time. He is a wonderful, creative, affectionate boy and I love him with all my heart, but some kids need firm boundaries and consequences. I honestly got very frustrated reading some of these, "I just love my child and train them without discipline and they behave like angel," posts because that doesn't work with all children -- especially if a kid has ADHD, FAE, sensory issues, etc. It would work with one of my kids, but not with DS, and it sounds like it wouldn't work with yours either!

[Barb_]

I don't think anything you posted is unreasonable, but I think you may be setting up unnecessary power struggles. You can get the same result by eliciting teamwork and co-operation rather than ordering them around. Same result, different dynamic. Save the orders for when time is of the essence or danger is involved, or in the case of blatant carelessness, disobedience, etc. A good way to teach manners is to model them by treating kids politely.

 

Barb

[Barb_]

Sometimes when people offer their perspective on a particular aspect of parenting, they are simply sharing the voice of experience. Sometimes philosophies, ideas, and results are the outcome of years in the School of Hard Knocks for Parents.

 

I think maybe people are reacting negatively to statement such as:

My story about my dd was not that she is an easy child. It was more that we have worked with her and have high expectations for her behavior.

The comment came off as a little smug since the poster has the voice of just over a year's experience, having just barely enrolled in the School of Hard Knocks for Parents.

[gardenmom5]

And sometimes you put years of constant sweat and tears into shaping considerate and well-behaved children, and then people tell you it must be because they are easy. It's a two way street. ;)

and I was talking about very young children, who are greatly affected by both their personalities and neuorlogy, not older kids or even younger kids with NORMAL neurology.

 

A child can "look" normal, but not be "normal", but parents of "normal" kids can still make very snide remarks because the "normal-looking, but not" kid doesn't act "normal" for their age. Yes, some of those parents with neuro-typical kids think they're brilliant parents when they come face to face with parents of neuro-atypical kids because they can't "see" a difference.

[Free]

:iagree:

 

 

 

:iagree:

 

I have done the "No, I mean now," routine with boys who are just hitting puberty. I like to start that era with the understanding that I am not going to be walked upon just because their testosterone is surging.

 

OTOH, I hate to see a teenage boy cowed by his Mom. By age 14ish, my boys look like young men to me. I'd rather treat my boys with respect, and require respect in return, than to keep playing the authoritarian parent into the teen years. I think that is more conducive to preparing them for adult relationships of all kinds.

 

I want my boys to be respectful and kind to everyone, all their lives. I also want them to be very independent and good at keeping personal boundaries. I don't want them harassed by a coach or teacher, cowed by a boss, bullied by a neighbor, hen-pecked by a wife, or pushed around by their own children. I want them to be masculine and strong, like their father, but it is within my power to destroy that possibility if I treat them like tiny children or servants!

 

Mothers, especially homeschooling mothers, can build the future men of the nation, but only if we realize that's what we're doing. We can build, or we can tear down. If we're not careful, we might build subservient weaklings who are over-sheltered and tied to our apron strings long past the time that they should have begun conquering the world.

 

And then we'll wonder why our sweet boys who do everything we say are still living in our basements at age 25, suffering from "failure to launch."

 

Free men are not at the beck and call of anyone, not even their mother or their wife. (Free women aren't, either, but we're talking about males right now.) They should do their part in their families, homes, jobs, communities, and nation. Good men will voluntarily give their time and love to serve others. But it should be voluntary, or it is worthless.

 

Training time for children is nearly over by puberty. After that, modeling the behavior is much more effective than demanding it. Discussions are more valuable than punishments.

 

~mother of four sons

 

This is a lovely post! As a mother of a gentle 10yo boy I agree with every word you have said. I am going to save this post for inspiration.

[Lang Syne Boardie]

I think maybe people are reacting negatively to statement such as: The comment came off as a little smug since the poster has the voice of just over a year's experience, having just barely enrolled in the School of Hard Knocks for Parents.

 

:001_huh: Wow. I missed that. LOL

[Alice]

I haven't read all the replies.

 

My oldest is only 7 so I'm not someone who has been there done that with teens. That said, in general with discipline I'm a big believer in different expectations for different ages.

 

When I tell my 2 yr old to do something I want her to obey and I model that. Usually it's safety. No, don't touch the stove. Don't climb on the bookshelf. Don't run away in the parking lot. I need her to obey me quickly.

 

With my almost 8 yr old we have a rule that he is allowed to nicely ask for more time "Can I finish this chapter?" "Can we finish this game before starting school?" Etc. Now, the rule is that I can say no. Sometimes I have reasons I need him to stop what he is doing and do what I asked right away. Sometimes it's ok to wait. I try not to say no arbitrarily, just to show that I'm boss or to have him obey "first time" or just because it's convenient to me. But if there is a good reason I will say no and I'll tell him the reason. "No, I need you to come help me now because we need to leave in ten minute." "No, it's already well past your bedtime and we need to turn out the light."

 

I find that in general, if I'm being reasonable he is too. He doesn't push as much past that "one more minute" if I'm willing to give it to him and trust him. Sure, sometimes he does push and sometimes he whines but overall it works well.

 

With a teen, I'd imagine I'd be more inclined to allow them leeway if I thought they were being respectful. So if in the first example, he was being respectful and really just wanted to shoot the ball I'd have said yes. If I knew he was always trying to get out of stuff and it was more about an overall attitude or ongoing issue I might have said no. Once he shot the ball and disobeyed, I'd have been annoyed and I imagine some kind of punishment would have been forthcoming but I do think grounding for a week is a bit harsh. I'd have said something more like an extra chore.

[Little Nyssa]

I think the grounding for a week was way too harsh. I wouldn't have put any consequences at all. But I agree with your general approach. Imo Cousin has forgotten what it's like to have littles and she doesn't know what it's like to have more than one. So I would discount about 90% of what she said.

[Bang!Zoom!]

You asked <--emphasis on asked...

 

for advice on this thread...but when this originally came up with the cousin *offering* an opinion on your parenting style...were you in a position like this where you were asking in an active way?

 

Yes/No?

 

I gotta tell ya, I might have been raised weird or something..but no one ever would have gotten away with offering my parents any advice on how to raise their kids or punishments/corrections we were under.

 

That's totally out of bounds to go sticking one's nose in the business of others, especially their children. It is the epitome of bad manners as well as not knowing your place.

 

I'm of the same mindset when it comes to my children. Don't offer if not asked directly for advice.

 

You do what you want as a parent with your kids. If you'd of chose to donate all his video games to charity, that'd of been fine. These are YOUR children period.

 

----

 

About a year ago, we were in Portland. There is a submarine museum there. You can go right into it, crawl around and go on a tour. It's a docked sub, and it is incredibly cramped.

 

About a half an hour into the tour, someone in the group asked about the young men that traveled in this submarine.

 

The tour guide went on to say that the whole thing was operated by young men, some of them were of the age of 18. And I mean *just turned eighteen*.

 

Your boy is less than three years from that mark.

 

When you say jump, follow orders-you do him no harm.

 

He can learn respect and response in the home, or in the big world which is going to be much more harsh than removal of a video game.

 

He can also learn to set expectations of others by the examples you provide during times like this.

 

And again, since you asked...I offer the opinion you are fine and are no where near overly harsh.

 

If your cousin offered this "harsh mama" business unsolicited; get firm and tell cousin to go jump in a lake.

[Mama Geek]

Sheez, I was just trying to say that if you are doing something that works, don't worry about what other people think about it. It doesn't matter if the person is 14 months or 14 years old. You are never going to please everybody, some will think you are too harsh and some will think your too soft. That was really my only point. If only having 1 young child excludes me from being able to know that or to give that advice then there really isn't much point in me having a voice on this forum at all since I don't have a school aged kid or multiple kids for that matter.

[Barb_]

Sheez, I was just trying to say that if you are doing something that works, don't worry about what other people think about it. It doesn't matter if the person is 14 months or 14 years old. You are never going to please everybody, some will think you are too harsh and some will think your too soft. That was really my only point. If only having 1 young child excludes me from being able to know that or to give that advice then there really isn't much point in me having a voice on this forum at all since I don't have a school aged kid or multiple kids for that matter.

 

Actually your advice is sound and you are entitled to share your opinion. But I think it would have been better received by the board at large if you would have stopped at the bold and hadn't held your own parenting up as an example, citing results that really have yet to be tested.

 

Barb