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Neighbor Kid WWYD


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Basic facts:

 

1. I was just putting laundry in the washer and discovered that 3 of dd9's underwear have been cut thong-style.

 

2. About two weeks ago, dd9 had asked if she could recycle some old socks by cutting off the bands to use as hair band/scrunchies. Her neighbor friend was over that day and her friend did cut some of dd9's good socks up. I did not discipline at that time but did tell both girls not to do that again. (These underwear would have to have been cut since then because of our washing schedule.

 

3. We don't have a lot of money - we're not destitute but we don't have a lot of extra either. But really it isn't about the money so much as the destruction of perfectly good things.

 

4. The neighbor girl comes over almost every day. Most days they play outside or in their "clubhouse" (our garage). On very rainy days, they play in either one of their bedrooms.

 

5. Dd9 is adamant that her friend did the cutting while dd9 was in the bathroom (and thus didn't see).

 

6. Dd9 is not known as the most truthful person in the house but I told her that if I found out that she was lying, that she would have an extra consequence. I also told her that I would have to ban her friend from playing in her room and that I would not do that if it was dd9's fault and not her friend's. Dd9 is still adamant.

 

WWYD:

 

Do I ask the neighbor girl's parents and/or the neighbor girl what happened? (We're friendly but I wouldn't say that we're really friends, if you know what I mean. )

 

Do I just quietly not invite the neighbor girl inside anymore? The girls would still play outside and in their clubhouse (garage).

Edited by Jean in Newcastle
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I would just not have the girl in my house any more.

 

This, at least not for a while.

 

Maybe I'm just an untrustworthy person when it comes to my kids, but I never trust my DS when he tells me that a friend did something without his knowledge. My take on it is either that 1) he knew and is lying or 2) he should have been paying better attention or 3) he should have brought the situation to my attention right away if his friend was doing something he objected to and that he knew would get them in trouble. So I'll give DS consequences for things that happen when a friend is over even if he claims that he didn't know/didn't do it.

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I wouldn't talk to the girl's parents. They will likely think it is a "small" thing and that you are overreacting (not that *I* think you are).

 

I would:

 

1) Ban any cutting of any material whatsoever. No scissors. I would make sure they did not have access to scissors. I would also state the new rule upfront.

 

2) Ask DD if there is a significance to HOW to the underwear was cut. Do one or both girls aspire to such a style? (Translate: Do they like to play being skanky?! And yes, I think 9yos thinking about thongs is skanky. So shoot me!) If so, that would be of more concern to me than the $$$ of having to replace the garments! Otherwise, I would probably sigh, deduct the $$$ from DD's allowance to replace the undies, and move on.

 

3) Supervise more. I would set myself an alarm for every 15 min to wander in there and see what they are doing. Or, I would require them to play where I could see them.

 

If these measures don't work, then I would stop having the neighbor over.

Edited by WTMCassandra
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I would probably let the girl come over but absolutely no more unsupervised time. The bedroom door stays open and you check often or they play out in th living room or somewhere where you can see. No more clubhouse either.

 

I'd also explain to them why, that clothing is being destroyed and you can no longer trust the two of them (because it IS the two of them) alone.

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I would assume that my child was either not telling the truth and did cut it, or knew that it had been cut, as it was put in the hamper modified.

 

If money were a big deal, I would have said child pay for a new pack of underwear and then allow her to say something to the other child. (This would tell me immediately what happened.)

 

In my house, I would tell the child not to do it again and then buy new underwear later. It would annoy me, but I wouldn't spend much time worrying about it.

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I would sit both of them down together and explain that you have found some clothing that had been cut. Tell them you are not looking for who did it or any explanations. Explain that you don't want to see it happen again and if it does, there will be no more playing inside. If they begin to point fingers, explain again that you are not looking for who did it, or to punish, but you just wanted to inform them.

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I am not sure what I would do in this circomstance but at our house the bedrooms are to sleep in and store their clothes. The toys and things that they play with are in our living area. It is a jungle most of the time but I know what they are doing and what is going on with friends. Just the way we live.:001_smile:

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I wouldn't talk to the girl's parents. They will likely think it is a "small" thing and that you are overreacting (not that *I* think you are).

 

I would:

 

1) Ban any cutting of any material whatsoever. No scissors. I would make sure they did not have access to scissors. I would also state the new rule upfront.

 

2) Ask DD if there is a significance to HOW to the underwear was cut. Do one or both girls aspire to such a style? (Translate: Do they like to play being skanky?! And yes, I think 9yos thinking about thongs is skanky. So shoot me!) If so, that would be of more concern to me than the $$$ of having to replace the garments! Otherwise, I would probably sigh, deduct the $$$ from DD's allowance to replace the undies, and move on.

 

3) Supervise more. I would set myself an alarm for every 15 min to wander in there and see what they are doing. Or, I would require them to play where I could see them.

 

If these measures don't work, then I would stop having the neighbor over.

 

 

:iagree: And wow. :001_huh: The undie thing would freak me out.

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2) Ask DD if there is a significance to HOW to the underwear was cut. Do one or both girls aspire to such a style? (Translate: Do they like to play being skanky?! And yes, I think 9yos thinking about thongs is skanky. So shoot me!) If so, that would be of more concern to me than the $$$ of having to replace the garments! Otherwise, I would probably sigh, deduct the $$$ from DD's allowance to replace the undies, and move on.

 

 

 

At first this was my thought too and then I thought that the other girl's mom may wear this kind of underwear to prevent pantylines, so it might not have anything to do with being skanky.

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I would just address it with both girls at once in a way that doesn't really name names. "Girls I was really annoyed about the cut up underwear I found. There is not to be any more cutting up of clothing - or anything else without permission. Do you both understand that? Don't make me have to bring this up again. Got it?"

 

But part of it is that you have to decide what you really want anyway. If you don't really like this child spending so much time at your house and are looking for an excuse to cut back on that, you have found it. If you actually think your daughter benefits from having a friend over a lot, then I would not want to over- react. Does your daughter need this friend in her life? Does your family function better when she's got that social outlet, or would you really like more time without stray kids?

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I would tell both girls:

 

"I don't want to know what happened. What's done is done. But so you are both very clear on the rules in this house, you have lost privilege of scissors in the bedroom & they may only be used under supervision now. If anything is cut-up, destroyed, or mistreated, you will not be able to play inside any longer. It's going to be a hot summer, so please make good choices from here on out. I know you both will do that. Hug."

 

If they try to bring up what happened in the past, I would cut them off and simply tell them there is no need to discuss that, as it's already passed. You just want them to have a clear understanding about future choices.

 

 

Susan

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I would want to talk to the parents but would probably feel as you do-not sure since you aren't toooo friendly kwim? I would probably do the NO unsupervised play--no scissors--and if things still happend I wouldn't invite her over anymore....good grief!!!! wonder if she's doing that stuff at her own house or if her parents know......UGH!!!! :glare: I always tell my son that if he tells me the truth it'll be less severe than if I find out later that he was lying.......

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At first this was my thought too and then I thought that the other girl's mom may wear this kind of underwear to prevent pantylines, so it might not have anything to do with being skanky.

 

Well, yet even so, I would be uneasy with the girls putting that much focus on underwear in their play. I would ask them to choose another "game," even if this is the motive. That kind of thing is too private to "play" with friends, IMO.

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I would let dd9 know that she is no longer allowed to have friends over without direct supervision until she earns back your trust. Whether or not she was holding the scissors, she is responsible for what her friends do in your house unless said friend is tying up and gagging your dd to perform the mischief, and then yr dd runs and tells you about it afterward. (In which case said friend is no longer allowed over).

 

The bathroom story doesn't sound believable IMO, but I wouldn't get into it with her. Just let her know she is responsible for her friend's actions, and she must supervise her friend if friend is not responsible.

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Well, yet even so, I would be uneasy with the girls putting that much focus on underwear in their play. I would ask them to choose another "game," even if this is the motive. That kind of thing is too private to "play" with friends, IMO.

 

In our house, the socks are in the same drawer with the underwear. If they were given permission to cut socks, it was most likely happenstance that the underwear came upon their attention. I'm not saying that I or anyone can know, but I'm just saying it doesn't necessarily have to be something unsavory and I definitely wouldn't walk into the situation assuming so.

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I would just address it with both girls at once in a way that doesn't really name names. "Girls I was really annoyed about the cut up underwear I found. There is not to be any more cutting up of clothing - or anything else without permission. Do you both understand that? Don't make me have to bring this up again. Got it?"

 

But part of it is that you have to decide what you really want anyway. If you don't really like this child spending so much time at your house and are looking for an excuse to cut back on that, you have found it. If you actually think your daughter benefits from having a friend over a lot, then I would not want to over- react. Does your daughter need this friend in her life? Does your family function better when she's got that social outlet, or would you really like more time without stray kids?

 

 

Danestress nailed it for me. My kids know that scissors and markers are for paper only unless I have given permission otherwise. Even my 6y is clear on that. Cutting clothing would be a huge violation of the rule. That would be my focus. I am not hesitant AT ALL to lay down the rules of my house to children with a scissors problem! LOL

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I would definately mention it the next time the girl comes over----but be careful so if the little girl mentions it to parents that she didn't feel "attacked" that would be my only issue with talking to her...but I'd definately state that there would be NO MORE CUTTING clothing allowed at your house and make sure both girls understood it......

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I would assume that my child was either not telling the truth and did cut it, or knew that it had been cut, as it was put in the hamper modified.

 

If money were a big deal, I would have said child pay for a new pack of underwear and then allow her to say something to the other child. (This would tell me immediately what happened.)

 

In my house, I would tell the child not to do it again and then buy new underwear later. It would annoy me, but I wouldn't spend much time worrying about it.

 

I gently pointed this out to dd. She cried and said that the "real story was that she did know but was embarrassed to tell me." (This is more believable to me because my dd is terribly embarrassed if you even say the word "bottom":D)

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At first this was my thought too and then I thought that the other girl's mom may wear this kind of underwear to prevent pantylines, so it might not have anything to do with being skanky.

 

This is very possible. Their clothing choices for their dd (who is 7 btw) is much older than I would choose even for my dd. (No judgment there if the neighbor does wear thongs - just pointing out that our clothing choices are much more fuddy duddy.)

 

In our house, the socks are in the same drawer with the underwear. If they were given permission to cut socks, it was most likely happenstance that the underwear came upon their attention. I'm not saying that I or anyone can know, but I'm just saying it doesn't necessarily have to be something unsavory and I definitely wouldn't walk into the situation assuming so.

 

This is our house too. I think (hope!) that the underwear was just collateral damage because of the socks.

 

A general reply to those posts on supervision issues: Yes, I have been concerned about the friendship in general because the friend has introduced dd9 to the concept of crushes and boy craziness in general (and yes, I said that the friend is 2 years younger. . .) Because of my own health and stamina and the noise of the girls I just cannot handle having them play in the same room as me. I think play will be outside. (I chuckled at the comment about a hot summer, Susan, our weather has been under 70 degrees for over 190 days!)

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I would just address it with both girls at once in a way that doesn't really name names. "Girls I was really annoyed about the cut up underwear I found. There is not to be any more cutting up of clothing - or anything else without permission. Do you both understand that? Don't make me have to bring this up again. Got it?"

 

But part of it is that you have to decide what you really want anyway. If you don't really like this child spending so much time at your house and are looking for an excuse to cut back on that, you have found it. If you actually think your daughter benefits from having a friend over a lot, then I would not want to over- react. Does your daughter need this friend in her life? Does your family function better when she's got that social outlet, or would you really like more time without stray kids?

 

I would tell both girls:

 

"I don't want to know what happened. What's done is done. But so you are both very clear on the rules in this house, you have lost privilege of scissors in the bedroom & they may only be used under supervision now. If anything is cut-up, destroyed, or mistreated, you will not be able to play inside any longer. It's going to be a hot summer, so please make good choices from here on out. I know you both will do that. Hug."

 

If they try to bring up what happened in the past, I would cut them off and simply tell them there is no need to discuss that, as it's already passed. You just want them to have a clear understanding about future choices.

 

 

Susan

 

:iagree:

 

I would also have them keep the door open from now on.

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I gently pointed this out to dd. She cried and said that the "real story was that she did know but was embarrassed to tell me." (This is more believable to me because my dd is terribly embarrassed if you even say the word "bottom":D)

 

That's cute! My boys love saying all the names they can think of for "bottom" because they think it's hilarious.:tongue_smilie:

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Cutting underwear, to me, is very, very weird. I wouldn't let them play unsupervised -- no bedroom and no clubhouse. I'd talk to my dd about thongs and what they mean and try to get information about why two 9 year old girls are cutting underwear. Seriously, maybe I'm hyper sensitive, but 9 year olds cutting underwear into thongs creeps me out.

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I wouldn't talk to the girl's parents. They will likely think it is a "small" thing and that you are overreacting (not that *I* think you are).

 

I would:

 

1) Ban any cutting of any material whatsoever. No scissors. I would make sure they did not have access to scissors. I would also state the new rule upfront.

 

2) Ask DD if there is a significance to HOW to the underwear was cut. Do one or both girls aspire to such a style? (Translate: Do they like to play being skanky?! And yes, I think 9yos thinking about thongs is skanky. So shoot me!) If so, that would be of more concern to me than the $$$ of having to replace the garments! Otherwise, I would probably sigh, deduct the $$$ from DD's allowance to replace the undies, and move on.

 

3) Supervise more. I would set myself an alarm for every 15 min to wander in there and see what they are doing. Or, I would require them to play where I could see them.

 

If these measures don't work, then I would stop having the neighbor over.

 

:iagree: You're not the only one who finds that skanky. I don't even let my 2 year old DD wear halter tops because I think it looks inappropriate. Like, too grown up or something.

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I would probably let the girl come over but absolutely no more unsupervised time. The bedroom door stays open and you check often or they play out in th living room or somewhere where you can see. No more clubhouse either.

 

:iagree:And I would be wondering about why a 9yo girl would cut underwear into a THONG????

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I would just address it with both girls at once in a way that doesn't really name names. "Girls I was really annoyed about the cut up underwear I found. There is not to be any more cutting up of clothing - or anything else without permission. Do you both understand that? Don't make me have to bring this up again. Got it?"

 

But part of it is that you have to decide what you really want anyway. If you don't really like this child spending so much time at your house and are looking for an excuse to cut back on that, you have found it. If you actually think your daughter benefits from having a friend over a lot, then I would not want to over- react. Does your daughter need this friend in her life? Does your family function better when she's got that social outlet, or would you really like more time without stray kids?

:iagree:

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A general reply to those posts on supervision issues: Yes, I have been concerned about the friendship in general because the friend has introduced dd9 to the concept of crushes and boy craziness in general (and yes, I said that the friend is 2 years younger. . .) Because of my own health and stamina and the noise of the girls I just cannot handle having them play in the same room as me. I think play will be outside. (I chuckled at the comment about a hot summer, Susan, our weather has been under 70 degrees for over 190 days!)

 

For the reasons above, I would severely limit the amount of time they are together in or out of doors.

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:iagree:And I would be wondering about why a 9yo girl would cut underwear into a THONG????

I have seen in stores some underwear for kids that is nearly thongs. I also have some dear Christian friends who wear thong underwear because they find them more comfortable. I can believe that the other girl has seen them on a parent or an older child and went from there. I was wearing adult clothing at age 9. But who knows what they were really thinking. When I look back at myself in those years I am nearly embarassed LOL.

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I would just address it with both girls at once in a way that doesn't really name names. "Girls I was really annoyed about the cut up underwear I found. There is not to be any more cutting up of clothing - or anything else without permission. Do you both understand that? Don't make me have to bring this up again. Got it?"

 

But part of it is that you have to decide what you really want anyway. If you don't really like this child spending so much time at your house and are looking for an excuse to cut back on that, you have found it. If you actually think your daughter benefits from having a friend over a lot, then I would not want to over- react. Does your daughter need this friend in her life? Does your family function better when she's got that social outlet, or would you really like more time without stray kids?

 

One final reply to this: My dd9 is the extrovert in the family. She already finds life difficult because it doesn't revolve around friends 24/7. So yes, she does need social outlets. I have started taking her to the Y almost everyday and putting her in their "Adventure Zone" everyday where she has fun playing tag, board games etc. with adult supervision while I exercise. But this girl is the only other girl even close to her age in the neighborhood. She would find it very difficult if I banned the friendship totally.

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2) Ask DD if there is a significance to HOW to the underwear was cut. Do one or both girls aspire to such a style? (Translate: Do they like to play being skanky?! And yes, I think 9yos thinking about thongs is skanky. So shoot me!) If so, that would be of more concern to me than the $$$ of having to replace the garments! Otherwise, I would probably sigh, deduct the $$$ from DD's allowance to replace the undies, and move on.

 

3) Supervise more. I would set myself an alarm for every 15 min to wander in there and see what they are doing. Or, I would require them to play where I could see them.

 

If these measures don't work, then I would stop having the neighbor over.

 

I agree. It's skanky and not standard 9 year old behavior.

 

Alley

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DO you know if the underwear were specifically cut to be thongs, or did they surrender their elastic to hair ties too?

 

 

It wouldn't creep me out, it was just an older kid version of dress up. They were trying to be creative and a misguided plan evolved. Stupid yes, but honestly pretty innocuous. Kids have cut on clothing for every generation I have been alive.

 

T-shirts with fringed bottoms tied with beads.

Maddona and Cyndie Lauper style shirts

Ripped/cut jeans

Half shirts

Cut-offs (jeans cut into shorts)

......

 

If they want to play fashion designer, maybe do a flash-back party with the two of them and let them make one of the above, with some old clothes. Sewing jeans into purses or t-shirts into bags are both pretty easy. Even if it isn't a purse they would use for every day, it can make a cute library bag.

 

I am sure you have already dealt with dd on the isssue, and unless you are Certain the other girl was holding the scissors at some point, I woldn't call the other parent. BUT I would tell dd, that if it happens again, you will be having not only a phone conversation with the mom, but a full sit down with all the parents and the girls, to decide who was going to pay for replacing these damaged items and to finally find out who-did-what cutting. I would let her know that the damaged undies will be saved as evidence to show the parents if this meeting happens. That would bring shear terror to my dd12 and would make sure it never happened again. I would suggest to dd12 that she also inform her friend (both of whom know the whole truth of the situation) of the upcoming meeting if it does happen.

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I agree. It's skanky and not standard 9 year old behavior.

 

Alley

 

Why is it skanky? I don't wear thongs myself, because I don't find them comfortable, but many non-skanky friends of mine wear thongs because they find them more comfortable and don't get panty lines.

 

I guess I'm just not sure why thongs themselves would be skanky, any more than claiming that choosing bikini-style undies over "granny panties" is skanky. I'm a fan of granny panties, myself, but, again, with nearly all women I know, the underwear they choose is more of a comfort issue.

 

If they were going to be showing off the undies, then, yes, that might indicate a problem (not a problem I'd identify as "skankiness" in girls that age, though). But, if they were simply emulating a more "grown up" style of underwear, I don't really think it indicates a problem--the cutting of clothing without permission is a problem, of course--and I certainly don't think we should be calling the behavior of 7- and 9-year-old girls "skanky" under any circumstances.

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I would tell my daughter to tell her friend that she is not allowed to cut or otherwise deface or destroy ANYTHING of hers or ANYTHING in the house again without implicit permission from you under your strict orders and to tell her that "my mom said if she finds anything like this again, we will not be allowed to play together in my house anymore."

 

Then, follow through. If it happens again, the kid is not allowed in your house anymore.

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In my house, I would tell the child not to do it again and then buy new underwear later. It would annoy me, but I wouldn't spend much time worrying about it.

 

I would make my child pay the replacement cost of the undies and tell him/her that when you have guests over you are, to an extent, responsible for their behavior.

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In that case I'd just leave it. She can wear the "new' unders without complaint of wedgies also. Those seem the natural consequences.

 

That is fabulous!

 

Perhaps the word "skanky" goes a little past the mark - while not a personal fan, I know plenty of non-skanky women who prefer thongs - but I would have concerns about age appropriate ideas. Even in the very best possibility of how this played out, what 7 year old thinks about panty lines?

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Admittedly, the word "skanky" derailed the conversation. I was trying to say that I find it concerning that a 9 year old would be attracted to this sort of thing. I have 8 year olds who have no idea what a thong is.

 

Now, maybe the 9 year old has older sisters which totally changes things I guess. But I'm aiming toward a wholesome upbringing -- something I didn't have -- with my kids.

 

I also think that why adult women use thongs is not germane to the discussion. Hopefully adult women have totally different reasons for wearing thongs: for men, for pantylines, whatever.

 

But a 9 year old??

 

Also, it's my understanding that having material go up where it's not supposed to can lead to infection and problems. So I don't think this is a good natural consequence at all.

 

It's easy to read from this post that I'm a prude. I'm totally not, but at the same time, I want my kids to be kids. There's plenty of years for the rest of it.

 

Alley

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But, if they were simply emulating a more "grown up" style of underwear, I don't really think it indicates a problem--the cutting of clothing without permission is a problem, of course--and I certainly don't think we should be calling the behavior of 7- and 9-year-old girls "skanky" under any circumstances.

 

Maybe I'm being dense, but how do these girls know what thongs are at this age??

 

I didn't bring up "skanky" -- but I did in a knee jerk fashion agree with it. Rather than skanky, this behavior is probably more just curiosity.

 

Still, if the neighbor kid did this and for some reason I think she did, then yes, I think this is "off" behavior.

 

Again, where do these girls learn about thongs at this age??

 

Alley

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Maybe I'm being dense, but how do these girls know what thongs are at this age??

 

 

Alley

 

Both of my dds know what a thong is by simply seeing them in stores and asking. I told them and explained why some women prefer them. I don't think there has to be anything weird going on for young girls to know about thongs.

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This, at least not for a while.

 

\.

 

:iagree: I would also make it crystal clear, shy or not, my kid was wrong not to show it to me at least as soon as the other child left. I would also be wonder how long dd was in the bathroom that the other child had time to cut three pair. Sounds a little fishy.

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Only read page one....

 

I would put on my 'I am the scary authority figure' face, have them sit on the couch where I can glare at them at the same time and tell them that this will not happen again. It is unacceptable.

 

I wouldn't even offer a punishment* just the cold hard fact that it will not happen again. I would do my best to look very angry, disappointed, and all around scary.

 

 

*I've found with older ds that for some reason punishments mean he can bargain (or decide if something is worth the punishment). No more threats or warnings. Now, when he says, "What will you do if it happens again?" I say, "Whatever seems right at the time." It's working thus far.

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Both of my dds know what a thong is by simply seeing them in stores and asking. I told them and explained why some women prefer them. I don't think there has to be anything weird going on for young girls to know about thongs.

 

My sons know what thongs are because I own them, I wear them on a semi-regular basis, and they see the laundry. They help sort and fold the laundry. I especially wanted to agree with the bolded statement above.

 

They are just underwear. Wearing a pair or being aware of their existence doesn't seem skanky to me in the least. That is certainly not the first adjective that comes to my mind when I see a pair of thong panties.

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Maybe I'm being dense, but how do these girls know what thongs are at this age??

 

The other girl is seven. Maybe her mom wears thongs and gets dressed in front of her. My mother used to sometimes get dressed around us, especially when we were that age; I knew what her underwear looked like. Heck, I sometimes come out of the bathroom in my underwear after a shower when my 7-year-old is around; I just don't think it's a huge issue.

 

If the mother (or older sister) of this girl wears thongs, then that's probably what she thinks grown-up underwear looks like. Little girls like to do grown-up things. I liked to wear high heels when I was seven. I wasn't thinking, "Wow, these shoes will make me look sexy and my legs look shapely." It was just what grown up women wore, and kids like to play at being grown up.

 

Many women wear thong underwear, for a variety of reasons, from wanting to look sexy to just finding them more comfortable. I don't find it at all unusual that a young child has a mom who would wear thongs, or that, if that was the case, they'd know what thong underwear looked like.

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My sons know what thongs are because I own them, I wear them on a semi-regular basis, and they see the laundry. They help sort and fold the laundry. I especially wanted to agree with the bolded statement above.

 

They are just underwear. Wearing a pair or being aware of their existence doesn't seem skanky to me in the least. That is certainly not the first adjective that comes to my mind when I see a pair of thong panties.

 

Good point about the laundry. I fold the laundry in front of my kids, too, so they know what my underwear looks like that way.

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