Do you let your 12yo hang out at the mall?

[Tracy in Ky]

Or your 10-11yo? My ds was invited to go to the mall with another boy (age 12) today. My dh said no way right off, but then the 12yo tried to convince him to let him as another girl (age 11) that we know is also going (among others.)

 

They were going to "hang out" at the mall (and these are homeschooled kids.)

 

Is this normal?

 

I don't even let my 15 yo hand out at the mall :)

[iquilt]

One of our local malls has banned the practice all together; you must be accompanied by an adult in order to even be at the mall. Others have not done that and are over run by unsupervised 10+ yo's. I'm not exactly sure what it is they do while they are roaming the mall together.

[Renee in NC]

I did when I was 12. We took the bus to the mall, and then rode it back home again. BUT, that was a *very* long time ago! Times have changed. Mine haven't ever even asked to go to the mall by themselves (they're 12 and 13).

 

Oh I did too! My father would give me money for shopping and 50 cents for the bus. I would get on the city bus near our house, transfer downtown, and take the bus to the mall in another state! We lived in Cincinnati and the mall was in KY. I rode the city bus *everywhere* I wanted to go.

 

However, I would *never* let my dc do that! My 16yo could go now, but I don't think he would. He took the Greyhound from here to St. Augustine a couple of times (it's about 60 miles north) and he told me never again. He *paid* me to take him to St. A when he was here a couple of weeks ago!:lol:

[laughing lioness]

No way. The last town we lived in had a terrific drug problem (it was part fo the drug corridor from Mex to CO) and my dh, who is in the know about these things, was aware that the mall was a key distribution point. I imagine it might be the same elsewhere. We just never did the mall thing with our older kids and it's not something we'll start with our younger ones.

[HayesW]

NO NO NO NO NO!

My oldest will be 11. I can see how, in another year or two, I MIGHT let my child and one other childwander the mall WHILE I WAS THERE and meet up with me after an hour or hour and a half. Maybe.

[Renee in NC]

NO NO NO NO NO!

My oldest will be 11. I can see how, in another year or two, I MIGHT let my child and one other childwander the mall WHILE I WAS THERE and meet up with me after an hour or hour and a half. Maybe.

 

I don't have a problem with him wandering around by himself at stores. We have been to the mall once in the past year (except for a couple of trips to Sears particularly.) I am not worried about his getting kidnapped, but rather what kind of trouble he could get into in a group. This child is particularly peer-focused and I don't want to encourage that.

[elegantlion]

Kids still hang at the mall? Our mall does not allow groups of more than 3 kids to wander together. They even have the security on the Segway.

 

As a mall-rat of the 80s (my first jobs were at the mall), even I'd have reservations about letting a 12 year old loose on the mall. I do see the desire from a social standpoint. You're 12, too old for McDonald's playland, too young to drive and face it hanging out at someone else's house is not always the most exciting thing.

 

Looking back I learned how to socialize at the mall and not really in school. It was a generational rite of passage where I lived. There really were no other places to socialize in our part of town. It also helped me realize I did have good head on my shoulders, for the most part. We never shoplifted, we bought albums (I miss cover art, btw), and we knew which kids had a bad reputation. We avoided them. The most obnoxious thing we did was read dirty greeting cards at Spencer's.

 

As for the safety many of those issues can come into play while you're at someones house. As a teen I was offered drugs in the basement of a teen's house while the mother sat upstairs. There are plenty of way to get into trouble (or run into it) while not at the mall.

 

I realize it's not the 80s and I think it would depend on the dynamics of your mall. The question I would ask myself is 1. is my child mature enough to recognize danger and follow my rules? 2. Do I know trust the child they are going with? 3. Does my child have a way to contact me? 4. Do they have any money to buy something to eat? 5. Do I trust my child to make good choices?

 

For our mall, 12 would be too young.

[BeckyFL]

It would be a "no" here too.

[Love2Smile]

They could be robbed, bullied, assaulted, abducted, persuaded by a friend or acquaintance to shoplift, or dared to do any number of completely stupid things. Kids that age just aren't that aware of their surroundings and they don't naturally consider how vulnerable they are to any sort of predator (and I don't necessarily mean sexual predator). How many kids walk around either focusing on texting or talking on the phone and aren't paying attention to who and what is around them? They could get into trouble all right--trouble of their own making, or trouble thrust upon them. There is just NO way I'd allow my 12 year old, or even older child, hang out at the mall. When my dd is old enough to drive, then she may shop at the mall, but I'd strongly encourage her to "hang out" somewhere else.

:iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree:

[Mom22ns]

No, nope, no way, absolutely not.

 

My kids are 13 and 11 and if they wanted to browse a store while I was in another nearby store, I would probably say yes. They haven't asked yet. I would not let them go just to hang out. To me there is nothing to do but find ways to get in trouble in that scenario. It may be normal - but it isn't for us.

[Ferdie]

I wouldn't let my 13 year old go to the mall without an adult present.

 

My oldest has gone to the movies with a friend without an adult. The theatre is located in an outdoor mall. I drop them off at the door and watch them walk inside. They take a spare cell phone and call me when the movie is over. They are not allowed to leave the building.

 

My oldest two also go to our local community center during the summer without an adult. I drop them off and watch them walk inside. They are not allowed to leave the building without me. They went a few times last year and had a great time.

[Rhonda in TX]

No way.

[Orthodox6]

To me, it is but a vacuous activity. Nor is it safe anymore.

[s0nicfreak]

I would. I remember being 12, and wanting to "hang out" away from parents - and not to " exhibit behavior that peers might find cool or funny but that I shouldn't exhibit in front of parents." By 12, if you've taught your child correctly, they won't do things like that. And if you know your child's friends, you'd know if they were the type to do things like that.

 

And it's a myth that things are more dangerous than they use to be... it's just that you hear about kidnappings and etc. more nowadays.

[5LittleMonkeys]

And it's a myth that things are more dangerous than they use to be... it's just that you hear about kidnappings and etc. more nowadays.

 

Since we are more aware of the bad things that can happen wouldn't it make more sense to take more precautionary measures than our parents did to prevent it from happening to our dc?

 

How many times have you heard a distraught parent on the news or in a newspaper make the statement, "I just never dreamed it would happen to our family." or "She was only out of sight for a few minutes..."

 

My dc have a whole lifetime of getting to hang out away from me ahead of them. And since when is something your dc want equate to something they need or is good for them?

 

My dc live very full, happy, exciting lives...I don't think not getting to hang out at the mall is going to emotionally scar them.

[newbie]

no

[s0nicfreak]

Since we are more aware of the bad things that can happen wouldn't it make more sense to take more precautionary measures than our parents did to prevent it from happening to our dc?

Well IMO it means we should teach our children how to deal with situations, how to function without a parent there - because at some point you won't be there at all; when they're 18 you may not be in another part of the mall, or nearby and able to come pick them up if they call, and the same dangers that are there at 12 are there at 18. You may say you can do this without actually letting the child go out, but can you effectively teach math by only telling the child about it, and never letting them solve a math problem on their own?

 

My dc have a whole lifetime of getting to hang out away from me ahead of them.

And if they don't learn how to do that while you are still there for them to call to for help, or to correct them when they do something wrong, odds are they will either not be able to deal with it, or go wild once they get to hang out on their own (like all the wild & crazy college students who are suddenly on their own for the first time).

 

And since when is something your dc want equate to something they need or is good for them?

They need to learn to function without a parent there. Some off time is good for them.

[gingersmom]

Not a chance. Then again she has no desire to do so.

 

My daughter has gone downtown with friends a handful of times. She said it was boring (our downtown is all of 2 blocks).

 

The middle school kids on Friday walk (about 2 minutes) to downtown and hang out at Starbucks, Dunkin Donuts and Haagen Dazs for about and hour or so and then they all disperse.

[swellmomma]

NOPE! I think I was 15 or so before I was allowed to go to the mall myself. My rule will be when you have a job and can pay for items there you may go, until that day I am not dropping my kid off at the mall to be one of those idiot teens that make going to the mall stressful for the rest of us.

 

ETA: My concern is not for their safety, it is for the pack mentality that kids/teens get into when together that makes them act like a bunch of morons. I do not want my kid sitting around the mall, cussing, and spitting and loud. Being bored with just sitting, so trying smoking, shoplifting etc. THese are all the things that worry me. If they have their own money to actually shop there fine, but the mall is not designed to be a place to "hang out". Even if my children acted perfectly and never did any of that stuff, there is the issue of guilt by association. If their friend is caught shoplifting, it will not matter if they are or not, they will be busted with teh friend. If the friend is caught with drugs on their person, same thing etc. Without adult supervision or at the very least a clear purpose in why they are there etc then there is potential for more issues that can have long term consequences for them. All for what? A chance to hang out at the mall? NOt worth it.

Edited April 19, 2010 by swellmomma

[Brindee]

I do however feel that as my children get older I need to put them in situations to foster some independence and to make them feel like I trust them to be responsible. I think teenagers crave that.

I think it's safer for children, even as they get older to know what to do in different situations, but that doesn't mean I need to take them to the mall and leave them alone to figure that out! They can get the independence in other ways.

 

The answer here to the OP's question is NO!!! I've heard so many stories of kids getting in trouble, and even disappearing from malls, etc., that I don't feel I want to put my kids in that situation.

 

I've told my kids that I trust them explicitly. They're all 3 good, responsible kids. It's the other people, unknowns, that I don't trust! They all totally understand that and have had no problems with it. When friends have asked they'll answer, "No, I'd rather not go, thanks." If the kids push as to why, they'll answer that it's not that safe, and they'd rather do something where they're less likely to get in trouble. Then they ask their friends to play a game of soccer or basketball (in the boys' case) instead. They KNOW I trust them, cuz I tell them I do. They are more responsible, because they know dh and I trust them!

[Colleen in NS]

By 12, if you've taught your child correctly, they won't do things like that. And if you know your child's friends, you'd know if they were the type to do things like that.

 

And it's a myth that things are more dangerous than they use to be... it's just that you hear about kidnappings and etc. more nowadays.

 

They need to learn to function without a parent there. Some off time is good for them.

 

Do you have any kids age 12 or older?

 

I find that kids mature at different rates. I've read on here of 12 yo that can do things that my 12 yo can't do yet, and things that my 12 yo can do that other 12yo can't do yet. For instance, I can't let him babysit right now, even though he is legally allowed to be left alone at home. He's not ready for that responsibility yet. Sure, he will need to learn to function in life without us someday, but I don't think that means he should be allowed right now to babysit or "hang out" in a shopping mall with other kids. IMO, freedoms come in small doses, as maturity is proven in various situations, and as we think there is a reasonable assurance of safety.

 

There is also the aspect that 11-probably 16? yo kids are going through enormous changes, and this can cloud their abilities to make good decisions. I believe I need to closely coach my kids through life situations - not just dump them and see if they sink or swim. If I'm 90% sure they will swim well, OK. If not, I coach - I do not throw them in.

 

For me to drop my 12 yo off at one of our local malls to "hang out," no matter with whom, it would be subjecting him to temptations far greater than he could handle right now. For that matter, I actually hope my son will continue, as an adult, to shop at thrift stores instead of malls! :lol: And, yes, we have had kidnappings and assaults at our local malls. It's not worth it. At all. I'll find other ways to teach my kids independence over a period of years. It doesn't matter to me that my kid isn't ready to shop at the mall just because he's 12. And I've taught him the best I have been able to up to now, and plan to continue.

[littlebug42]

Mine aren't that old yet but the answer would be no. I was not allowed to do such things until I was 16 and even then, hanging out at the mall was a useless activity. I know that nothing ever good came from abundant free time with a bunch of teenagers when I was that age and my daughters will not be taking part either. At 16, I will reevaluate.

[5LittleMonkeys]

Well IMO it means we should teach our children how to deal with situations, how to function *without a parent there - because at some point you won't be there at all; when they're 18 you may not be in another part of the mall, or nearby and able to come pick them up if they call, and the same dangers that are there at 12 are there at 18.

 

Are you saying you should put your dc in potentially harmful or hazardous situations in order to teach them how to deal with them and hope nothing bad happens before they learn the lesson? I'm sure you've taught your kids not to do drugs without actually putting the drugs in front of them. There are many things we can teach our dc without hands on experience. Comparing teaching math to this is comparing apples to oranges. I prefer a more controlled way of teaching my dc how to deal with friends that behave badly, obnoxious but un-harmful strangers and the dangers of drugs and alcohol. My two oldest girls have taken a self defense class every year for the past 3 years but I don't toss them out on the corner in the bad part of town at night to test their know-how.

 

As for the age difference between 12 and 18...it's huge. I was way more emotionally mature at 18 than I was at 12. I could handle most undesirable situations and was a better judge of character, had a very defined sense of right and wrong and was resourceful enough to take care of myself when I was 18. I managed all of that without ever being dropped off at the mall to hone those skills.

 

I don't understand your point of view but you are entitled to it. I guess we will have to agree to disagree.

[Daisy]

No. Mostly because I see absolutely no point in going to the mall to "hang out." It is annoying to other shoppers and is pointless.

 

Additionally our mall is not a safe place. We've had gang shoot-outs that resulted in innocent bystanders being shot and killed. No thanks. I only go to the mall maybe twice a year.

[Mad Jenny Flint]

He is a very responsible kid, very eager to please, etc. I have offered to take him to the mall to meet a friend for a movie and a bite to eat at the food court, from x time to x time (no more than 3 hours) at some point in the future, if he wants to do that.

 

I also have an 11 yod. She is a bit less responsible, but still a very good kid. I would never in a million years leave her at the mall, or anywhere, for any purpose.

 

This will sound very sexist- but I would be more protective of my dd, no matter her age. I just think young (read: teen) girls are more of a target. My son is nearly 6 ft. tall and would likely be able to handle himself within the confines of the mall building. I think a girl could be dragged anywhere.

[Renee in NC]

He is a very responsible kid, very eager to please, etc. I have offered to take him to the mall to meet a friend for a movie and a bite to eat at the food court, from x time to x time (no more than 3 hours) at some point in the future, if he wants to do that.

 

I also have an 11 yod. She is a bit less responsible, but still a very good kid. I would never in a million years leave her at the mall, or anywhere, for any purpose.

 

This will sound very sexist- but I would be more protective of my dd, no matter her age. I just think young (read: teen) girls are more of a target. My son is nearly 6 ft. tall and would likely be able to handle himself within the confines of the mall building. I think a girl could be dragged anywhere.

 

When my oldest was 14, I did the drop him off for the movie and pick him up after the movie. As far as I know, he actually went to the movie.;) Then it was movie and to "walk around some" probably at 15. That was the "big" mall - there was a smaller, local mall that was walking distance from his girlfriend's house and they went over there regularly.

 

Now, at 16, he can go to the mall if he wants. However, he is very mature and has never given us a reason to doubt him. He isn't much of one to "hang out" at the mall anyway.

[Perry]

 

And it's a myth that things are more dangerous than they use to be... it's just that you hear about kidnappings and etc. more nowadays.

 

I believe that we're actually safer now than in the past. But I also think that it's possible that this is a result of parents supervising their children more closely now.

Edited April 20, 2010 by Perry

[Matryoshka]

I have two 11 1/2 yos. No way no how over my dead twitching body.

 

For all the reasons others have mentioned. And with other kids that age, it just magnifies unwanted adolescent behavior that one kid alone wouldn't dream of doing without an audience of peers. And what are they supposed to be doing there? Shopping? For what? I think it also glorifies shopping and "hanging out" as worthwhile pastimes. I do not want to give my kids the idea that shopping is some kind of recreational pursuit.

 

ETA: And as far as teaching my kids to function on their own, I sent my 11yo last summer to Germany, where she boarded a public bus every day all by herself, got off and walked a few blocks to school in a city she'd never been to before. She did that fine. But she had a destination and a purpose - loitering in the mall has neither.

Edited April 20, 2010 by matroyshka

[Tap]

By 12, if you've taught your child correctly, they won't do things like that. And if you know your child's friends, you'd know if they were the type to do things like that.

 

 

LOL you can't gauge what a child will and won't do by what they have been taught. Why else would PKs have the rep that they do? I was raised in a Christian home, attending a Christian School and knew that shoplifting was wrong, it doesn't mean that I kept my hands to myself. It was a control issue for me. I could have whatever I could fit in my sleeve. That is a lot of power for a kid to realize they have.

 

I was a kid that grew up fast because my parents gave me a lot of freedom, 'because they could trust me'. LOL I was much more street smart than a lot of my friends because I was the baby of a big family. I learned a lot by listening to my older sisters talk half the night away (they always thought I was asleep). I knew how not to get caught and how to get out of it if I did.

 

Even at almost 40, my siblings don't believe the stories I tell about when I was a teenager. They all thought I was very, very innocent and naive. I was very, very good at playing that role, so I never even got noticed.

 

 

 

Oh, and as far at the friends go....I corrupted many, many a friend along the way. The parents never suspected I was the bad seed. I was kinda an Eddy Haskle in a dress, with Southern manners that made parents coo.

[Janet in Toronto]

I would have. At 12, my DS was taking public transit to school on his own and back (45 minutes each way for bus/subway/streetcar). He also walked to the barber to get his hair cut on his own, and walked the dog in our urban neighborhood. But he didn't have any interest in hanging out at malls at that age. I have great faith in his ability to make good decisions. He is now 15 (and I have an older son who is 18). For the past couple of years, he hangs out with his friends from Japanese language school after class on Saturday and they wander around Chinatown, get some lunch, and then he comes home on the subway.

 

Perhaps things are different up here in Toronto, but for us, the benefits of this kind of independence outweigh any risks (in our mind).

[Wheres Toto]

At 12 I would let me dd walk around the mall with friends if I was there as well (usually sitting with a book at the food court). This is also probably the age I first let her go to the movies without me - dropped off at the door and picked up at the door at a movie theatre not attached to a mall or anything else so there was no where else to go.

 

She's almost 16 and I've been dropping her at the mall for about a year I think. Usually she has a reason to be there even if its just "shopping". She does love to shop. She knows she is not to leave the mall for any reason, has her cell phone to call me if needed, they all need to stay together. She also knows that I will continue to trust her unless she gives me a reason not to. And if she gives me that reason she will find herself as restricted as a 5 year old.

 

My dd has been a competitive dancer since she was 4. They pick up a lot of responsibility at these things, mommy can't follow them around the whole day (parents aren't allowed backstage) - from the beginning she needed to be in the right place at the right time, staying with her group, pay attention to her teachers, work well with her team, cooperating with getting ready, taking care of her costumes, getting back to the dressing room after her routines. As she got older, the responsibility increased - getting herself ready, hanging up her costumes, being backstage at the right time. Not to mention paying attention in school and keeping her grades up, scheduling her time so her homework got done (even with practices 3-4 nights a week) otherwise she wouldn't be allowed to dance. She often gets fed up with how immature some of the kids her own age act. Not that she doesn't have her moments and she definitely acts like a teenager when she's with her friend, but most of it is harmless goofiness.

[Lizzie in Ma]

I see kids this age at the mall and they are just flirting and goofing off and texting. It's not how I want my kids to use their time. I don't want them flirting and loitering. Just my $0.02.:001_smile:

 

:iagree::iagree:

UNder absolutely no circumstances would I allow it. There is no good there.

[lynn]

With everyone carrying a cell phone today and if I or another parent were staying at the mall then yes.

[s0nicfreak]

Are you saying you should put your dc in potentially harmful or hazardous situations in order to teach them how to deal with them and hope nothing bad happens before they learn the lesson?

No, I'm saying the mall isn't all that dangerous. Your front yard is probably more dangerous than the mall.

 

I'm sure you've taught your kids not to do drugs without actually putting the drugs in front of them.

Yes, but I don't keep them locked in the house, and odds are they will encounter someone with drugs at some point outside.

 

It was a control issue for me. I could have whatever I could fit in my sleeve.

Well my kids know if they want something, they can just ask for it, and it will be bought for them. Also they understand what stealing is (and that it hurts people), and they wouldn't want it done to them (and I teach them about karma) so...

 

If they were to steal something, sure, they'd lose the privilege of going to the mall. But I'm not going to assume they're going to do something wrong and take away privileges before they've even gotten them.

[Guest Jennymom74]

No---I would never let mine roam the mall.....and they are 13 and 14...

[Gretchen in NJ]

No.:D

[Haiku]

I don't even let my 15 yo hang out at the mall :)

 

:iagree:

 

Tara

[Mrs Mungo]

It depends on the child, it depends on the mall. But, generally speaking, not at 12.

[Mrs Mungo]

No, I'm saying the mall isn't all that dangerous. Your front yard is probably more dangerous than the mall.

 

Whose front yard? Which mall? This is a crazy generalization. I guarantee my front yard is immensely safer than our mall, which is in the downtown area of a large tourist city with tons of homeless people.

[s0nicfreak]

Whose front yard? Which mall? This is a crazy generalization. I guarantee my front yard is immensely safer than our mall, which is in the downtown area of a large tourist city with tons of homeless people.

Talk about generalizations... what is dangerous about homeless people?

The mall has walls to protect you from cars, your yard has what, a fence if that? A drunk driver could drive through the fence and run you over.

The mall has lots of people around that you can call out to for help if someone runs up and grabs you. Your front yard has your family, which is a lot less people and may not be in arms reach. A car could drive up, someone could pull you in, and speed off.

The mall also may have security guards and cameras.

[5LittleMonkeys]

No, I'm saying the mall isn't all that dangerous. Your front yard is probably more dangerous than the mall.

 

Well, so far this year there has been one girl attacked in the bathroom at our mall and another girl raped behind a dumpster. One was 16 and the other was 14. To date I'm not aware of any incidents in my front yard.

 

I'm curious where you live that you feel your mall is safer than your front yard.:confused: :confused:

 

Yes, but I don't keep them locked in the house, and odds are they will encounter someone with drugs at some point outside.

 

My kids (always with some form of adult supervision .. and we have become very good about blending into the background as to not cause embarrassment and to give them their space) go to youth events, movies, skating, birthday parties, the pool, the rec center...yeah, I WISH I could keep them locked in the house. Yes, they may encounter someone offering them drugs in the future and I am confident through my guidance and our million discussions about it they will make the right choice (same argument about not needing hands on experience to learn a lesson)...but I don't want them to have to make that choice when they are this young so I limit there exposure to situations that it is more likely to happen.

 

 

This really has been a very interesting thread to read and I have enjoyed debating against another point of view. :D Thanks to the op! I have to go chain my dc to their beds now and install video surveillance in the front yard.:lol::lol::lol::lol:

[s0nicfreak]

To date I'm not aware of any incidents in my front yard.

Doesn't mean there weren't any.

 

I'm curious where you live that you feel your mall is safer than your front yard.:confused: :confused:

Near Chicago.

You guys do realize all those "dangerous" people from the mall could just as easily come to your front yard, right?

[Jean in Newcastle]

Talk about generalizations... what is dangerous about homeless people?

 

 

I've worked with homeless people for many years. Many of them are suffering from untreated mental illness, alcoholism and drug use. Many of them are kind, generous people. Many of those same kind, generous people (but not all) could attack you the next minute because of the untreated mental illnesses, and drug use.

[s0nicfreak]

I've worked with homeless people for many years. Many of them are suffering from untreated mental illness, alcoholism and drug use. Many of them are kind, generous people. Many of those same kind, generous people (but not all) could attack you the next minute because of the untreated mental illnesses, and drug use.

But that's not homeless people, that's mentally ill people, drug addicts, and alcoholics that happen to be homeless. And which can come to your front yard as easily as they can come to the mall.

[Mrs Mungo]

Talk about generalizations... what is dangerous about homeless people?

 

The ones that hang out downtown, here (as opposed to those who live on the beach in family groups), are mostly drug addicts and/or mentally unstable. Two tourists have been killed down in Waikiki in the last year. One woman was killed by a man who had been released from prison the day before.

 

The mall has walls to protect you from cars, your yard has what, a fence if that? A drunk driver could drive through the fence and run you over.

 

Actually, many of the malls here do not have enclosed walls and are in busy areas with high traffic. Neighborhoods here, in contrast, tend to have very curvy streets and have lots of cars parked on the street. You

 

The mall has lots of people around that you can call out to for help if someone runs up and grabs you. Your front yard has your family, which is a lot less people and may not be in arms reach. A car could drive up, someone could pull you in, and speed off.

The mall also may have security guards and cameras.

 

Just because they could help you, doesn't mean they will. The woman who was killed, that I mentioned earlier? Several people witnessed him choking her.

[s0nicfreak]

Actually, many of the malls here do not have enclosed walls and are in busy areas with high traffic. Neighborhoods here, in contrast, tend to have very curvy streets and have lots of cars parked on the street.

That's a strip mall, not a mall. And, ok, instead of just being hit by a car, they can have another car pushed into them.

[Jean in Newcastle]

But that's not homeless people, that's mentally ill people, drug addicts, and alcoholics that happen to be homeless. And which can come to your front yard as easily as they can come to the mall.

 

Most of those mentally ill people, drug addicts and alcoholics are homeless precisely because of their mental illness, drug habits and alcoholism. And no, they can't come to my front yard as easily. They would have to walk a long ways. There are reasons that homeless people tend to congregate in certain areas - that is where they can find food and shelter and even clothing from shelters etc. - even if they don't choose to use them all the time.

[Mrs Mungo]

double post

Edited April 20, 2010 by Mrs Mungo

[Mrs Mungo]

That's a strip mall, not a mall. And, ok, instead of just being hit by a car, they can have another car pushed into them.

 

No, it's not a strip mall, it's a mall. But, it's an open-air mall. Obviously, this sort of concept wouldn't work in Chicago. It is common in Hawaii. Many of the hotel lobbies don't have walls, they are open-air. Many restaurants have huge sliding doors that they close at night, but during the day they are open-air.

 

You want to conclude that your front yard is inherently more dangerous than a mall, that's your decision to make. I have reached a different conclusion based on my life experiences and my personal knowledge of my surroundings.

[Tap]

 

Well my kids know if they want something, they can just ask for it, and it will be bought for them. Also they understand what stealing is (and that it hurts people), and they wouldn't want it done to them (and I teach them about karma) so...

 

If they were to steal something, sure, they'd lose the privilege of going to the mall. But I'm not going to assume they're going to do something wrong and take away privileges before they've even gotten them.

 

I had plenty of money, I didn't have to shoplift, I just did. My parents would have thought the same as you....they would have stopped me from going to the mall if I was caught shoplifting...I wasn't caught, that is the point. I knew it hurt people but as a young kid, I didn't really think it through. It wasn't until I was older and more mature that I started thinking more about the consequences. Isn't that why kids are considered a juvenile for most crimes until they are older teenagers. Because they don't really have the mental capacity to consider all the ramifications of their actions. Isn't this part of the definition of maturity? For a person to see how their actions affect not only them but to consider their actions and make decisions based on their own desires and the world around us at the same time? At 12 I was street smart, not mature.

 

I am not saying that kids shouldn't be given the opportunity to prove themselves honest. All I am saying is that I am not going to let my kids wander the mall for hours, with that much temptation in front of them, for absolutely no benefit. There are so many other places kids can hang out that have all the same benefits as the mall, without the potential issues. The pool, the library, each other's houses, going to the movies, the ball field, the park, going for a walk in neighborhoods, etc. My kids have freedom, just not where temptation is soo enticing.

 

When ds 15 was about 12-13 I let him start going to the game store on his own while I was at the mall, then over time he was able to go between a couple of stores. I wouldn't let him wander the mall for hours on his own but he was allowed freedom if he had a destination and he stayed there. But one important thing, it that ds doesn't like 'stuff'. He lives, very, very simple. For years, I have said he could be a monk because he is happy to have his bed, a blanket and his bible.....well okay, now he would want his laptop too. :lol:

 

DD11 loves 'stuff' and she saves everything! She can have 12 of something, and still want more. She isn't ungrateful, and she spends her own money on her treasures, but she is always wanting more. I would worry more about her being tempted because of this basic personality difference.

 

 

Can I ask why you homeschool? What are your reasons for choosing this method of educating your children? Was none of it preventative of the issues some children face in school?