May home educated children be different socially?

[Laura Corin]

Please note that I'm not talking about HE children being anti-social or awkward: Calvin is reasonably friendly and Hobbes is intensely social. I'm just wondering if some may not be quite so socially competitive.

 

Calvin just put himself forward to be chosen for the next worldwide scout jamboree. There was a group selection day and he was not chosen; the other HE child was also not chosen. One of the scout leaders (who was not involved in the choosing but received a report afterwards) said that Calvin and the other HE child were not chosen because they were 'too quiet'. He didn't himself refer to their being HE, but I was wondering if HE children (at least those in small families) may not get so much practice at making themselves heard.

 

Laura

[smrtmama]

I think it comes down to the children's personalities, how they're educated and parented, etc. more than anything else. My kids don't have any problems making themselves heard, but they're both naturally outgoing. It was actually a bad year of public school (our last before we pulled him to home educate) that made my oldest more shy and quiet -- we've since deprogrammed him from that. ;)

[Sputterduck]

I sure hope my son is different socially. But, anyway, he's loud and *never* stops talking. That's the exact opposite of me and I went to school. Kids have a variety of different personalities regardless of where they are schooled.

Edited February 17, 2010 by Sputterduck

[Rosy]

I'm sure there are differences. The school environment tends to demand conformity, particularly during the middle school/jr. high years. Homeschoolers have more freedom to be themselves without fear of ridicule. I think they also are effected by their parents' strengths and weaknesses more than schooled kids, just because they spend more time with their parents.

 

I think if I had concerns about my kids being socially passive, I would put them in activities that are more collaborative in nature and where they had opportunities to take leadership. Something where speaking out and taking initiative is encouraged. Karate has been great for my DD in that area, marching band did it for me.

[melissel]

I think it comes down to the children's personalities, how they're educated and parented, etc. more than anything else. My kids don't have any problems making themselves heard, but they're both naturally outgoing. It was actually a bad year of public school (our last before we pulled him to home educate) that made my oldest more shy and quiet -- we've since deprogrammed him from that. ;)

 

I tend to agree. PS certainly didn't do anything for me in terms of making me comfortable with speaking out. I learned the opposite: Don't draw attention to yourself lest you become a target! I'm also an introvert. I believe it has much more to do with personality than anything else.

[Stacy in NJ]

He may just be quieter by nature.

[Barb_]

I will agree with the others. Some of my children speak up and others hang back. Those who are inclined to assert themselves tend to be more likely to do so as a result of home education, IMO. Those who aren't comfortable speaking up wouldn't have learned to do so as a result of brick and mortar school either.

 

Barb

[Haiku]

I went to public school and was fairly quiet and non-social. My little kids have always been homeschooled and have no problems making themselves heard (and they are not biologically related). I think it's personality more than anything else.

 

Tara

[Impish]

I sure hope my son is different socially. But, anyway, he's loud and *never* stops talking. That's the exact opposite of me and I went to school. Kids have a variety of different personalities regardless of where they are schooled.

:iagree:

[WiseOwlKnits]

I don't think so. I spend most of my life IRL as an introverted wall-flower. My DD, on the other hand, NEEDS social interaction, never stops talking, and has never met someone she didn't like. LOL!

[jail warden]

I will agree with the others. Some of my children speak up and others hang back. Those who are inclined to assert themselves tend to be more likely to do so as a result of home education, IMO. Those who aren't comfortable speaking up wouldn't have learned to do so as a result of brick and mortar school either.

 

Barb

 

:iagree: I have one child who speaks out what he thinks all the time and at times I think speaks more so sometimes because he's not scared of being ridiculed. I have another child who doesn't talk much in public(doesn't stop her at home!), but she just doesn't feel comfortable with strangers.

 

I have to agree with some of the others too, my first thought when I read the thread was, "I sure hope so!"

[KidsHappen]

For the most part, I think it is due to innate personality but coming from smaller family unit may also contribute. I know in this household, if you want to be heard, you have to learn to speak up and advocate for yourself.

[Merry]

being too "quiet". By it, does he mean that the boys don't talk enough, speak up in group situations, or work well with others, or what? That might give you a better picture of how your boys are being perceived by the others.

[lisamarie]

I think it's definitely just personality. I am an introvert and pretty shy in public despite going to PS, private school, and college. Nothing beat the shyness out of me.:tongue_smilie:

 

My kids, on the other hand, are so social that it still amazes me that they're my kids. My girls especially talk to anyone and everyone and have never, ever played the shrinking violet around strangers (both a good and bad thing). I don't think it's a PS vs HS issue. My DD4 has a hard time playing with the girls her age from our church because they are all extremely shy and my DD overwhelms them. So my DD is mostly friends with the boys and a few other girls both older and younger than her who are also very outgoing.

[HSMom2One]

I was educated in ps, and although I had the personality to do it, I did not learn to address groups of people skillfully or effectively. That came much later when I was in college. Interestingly, neither of my parents were confident public speakers, and out of their three children I am the only one that has done any speaking or teaching on a regular basis.

 

My dd, on the other hand, is not only hs'ed - she is the only student in our academy. Yet she is very skilled at speaking out in group discussions and making presentations before others. She is mostly around adults every day, so this may be part of the reason, along with the fact that I have been working with her on how to address others with success. But more than anything, I do attribute her personality as the main reason for this.

 

I agree with the other posters that state it is personality more than anything that makes the difference. I would only add that how we train them to speak at home as well as other situations we put them in contributes to it all as well.

 

Another important thought is that in your case it was up to one individual to make the decisions that were made, and he may have been influenced by a certain bias or even mood that day. Perhaps it would be a good idea to compare this situation to others as a final observation about your child.

 

Blessings,

Lucinda

[Daisy]

Well, I wish someone would label my son as "too quiet." :lol::lol:

 

My daughter on the other hand is very shy and quiet, except at home.

 

I think it is mostly personality, but the variety of life experiences do play a part.

 

My children are shy in a new situation. I'm the same way. So I suppose children who aren't exposed to new environments and experiences very often, would struggle more socially. I think this is true of the child regardless of their education.

[Starr]

Quiet or not is not really the issue in my opinion. I do think often they don't know what it takes for certain things to happen. PS has it's own secret handshake.

[PineFarmMom]

I have such a wide range of personality types in my homeschool that I'd be hard pressed to say any one of their quiet or loud personalities stems 100% from being home educated.

 

The positive social aspect of homeschooling is one of the things, after many years of doing this, that I see the fruits of.

 

I would have rather been shot than lead anything when I was in ps. I didn't want attention called to me in any way. I was very insecure about those types of things. My older ones are definitely different!!!

Edited February 17, 2010 by Texas T

[Guest Katia]

Quiet or not is not really the issue in my opinion. I do think often they don't know what it takes for certain things to happen. PS has it's own secret handshake.

 

I agree with this. Totally.

[6packofun]

I think that many homeschooled kids, including my own, don't feel the need to be in the spotlight or put on what seems to be an outgoing personality but is really just a competition to be noticed. Think about it...based on student-teacher ratio alone, our HE kids don't have to fight to be noticed in a sea of look-alikes. So, they approach social situations in a different manner. It can come across as quiet or shy or less assertive than society seems to approve of, but we know the difference. ;)

 

My middle dd, 12, IS somewhat reserved and that's her personality. We just switched churches and making new friends is somewhat painful for her. lol I kept noticing that she was having trouble jumping in to conversations and putting herself out there and tried to coach her on that when she said, "Mom, I'm really just trying to be polite. They are all talking at once and I don't want to interrupt and annoy them!" ROTFL! That made me laugh and I told her, "TRUST me, if talking loudly over one another is how they socialize, no one is going to care if you thrust your .02 in once in a while!" hehe

[Splungeman]

I wouldn't worry about that. Benjamin Franklin spoke very little in the Continental Congress. When he did speak, people listened. Thomas Jefferson spoke with his pen. (I'm on a Founding Father roll, I know...only because I just finished reading about them!) Don't let your kids think that because they weren't loud or outspoken that it will make them less successful. I think it is a kind of virtue in of itself. :001_smile:

[In The Great White North]

Calvin just put himself forward to be chosen for the next worldwide scout jamboree. There was a group selection day and he was not chosen; the other HE child was also not chosen. One of the scout leaders (who was not involved in the choosing but received a report afterwards) said that Calvin and the other HE child were not chosen because they were 'too quiet'.

 

I didn't realize that being a loud-mouth was a requirement for Jamboree? How about age, rank, dedication, competence and the Scout Law?

 

Do they have any idea what they've let themselves in for, if they've picked the loudest boys in the troop?

[Tea Time]

Please note that I'm not talking about HE children being anti-social or awkward: Calvin is reasonably friendly and Hobbes is intensely social. I'm just wondering if some may not be quite so socially competitive.

 

Calvin just put himself forward to be chosen for the next worldwide scout jamboree. There was a group selection day and he was not chosen; the other HE child was also not chosen. One of the scout leaders (who was not involved in the choosing but received a report afterwards) said that Calvin and the other HE child were not chosen because they were 'too quiet'. He didn't himself refer to their being HE, but I was wondering if HE children (at least those in small families) may not get so much practice at making themselves heard.

 

Laura

 

In the small town we lived while homeschooling, one thing that everyone looked forward to was when Missoula Children's theater would come to town. Naturally only the kids that were interested in being on stage would go to the auditions, but in our town, that was always a lot of kids, both from public school and many of the homeschoolers. The leaders, of course, did not know which was which when they did their selections for parts. The homeschoolers were always very well represented. I would even say they tended to dominate for some reason. Probably because instead of just being "loud" they were also attentive, respectful, and they interacted well with kids of varying ages. All important qualities for a successful children's theater production.

 

So, no, I don't think there is anything inherently suppressive about homeschooling that would make a child less likely to be chosen for something that does require an outgoing/outspoken personality. I agree with what others have said that a bad experience in public school could result in an outgoing person becoming more introverted.

 

BTW, most the more introverted children I know that are homeschooled are pretty darn comfortable with themselves too, and they don't seem to need to be "fixed" either, which is also very healthy. It takes all kinds!

[Liz CA]

IMHO, it really comes down to individual personality. My ds was so "social" and constantly up front everywhere, no amount of homeschooling would have changed that.

He did attend PS for the first 4 years of school - but I still think it is primarily his nature just as it is the nature of some people to be a little quieter. Nothing wrong with that.

[Cricket]

I spend most of my time trying to get my dc to stop talking! :lol: I think they are more outgoing and friendlier and more confident because they are at home instead of being out of their comfort zone all day long. A lot of it is probably personality too. We tried to create an environment where the kids aren't afraid to speak up. Sometimes I think we did too good of a job with that. :glare:

[katilac]

I do think that hs kids are often different socially, but I don't think that translates into quiet or non-competitive. Like others, I think that's more personality, plus some self-selection - - quiet kids often have more trouble dealing with the noisy, chaotic environment in many schools, and thus may be a bit more likely to consider hs'ing. I think that coming from a small, quiet family is a more important 'nurture' factor than attending school or not.

 

I think that a pushy social mentality does help in certain very short-term situations, like when there is a call for volunteers from the audience at a show or performance of some kind. When the chooser says "Don't shout or jump up, just raise your hand" the pushy kids usually don't believe him :D. They jump up, shout, and get chosen. A few times, I have actually witnessed adults asking my children if they want to have some small privilege (carrying a banner, helping with a 'fun' chore), and then turn around and give the privilige to a pushy kid who screams "I'll do it, me, me, me!" before my kids even take a breath to answer, lol. I think that institutional school fosters that kind of pushiness, but lots of schooled kids aren't pushy, and plenty of hs'd ones are.

 

In a situation where kids have the chance to perform and be evaluated over time, I think that type of pushiness is less important (if the leaders in question have any experience). I'd probably want to hear what they meant by "too quiet" in this situation. If he performs all his Scout tasks very well, but is "too quiet" to offer to help other Scouts learn them, that might be a valid consideration. We don't do Scouts, but I'm imagining that one of the biggest purposes of a world-wide jamboree would be for Scouts to meet, interact with, teach and learn from others. If two kids are roughly equal in other respects, the ability to make one's self heard in a crowd might be the deciding factor.

 

For the record, I have two kids, one who is often described as "too quiet" and another who is oftened described as a pistol, a firecracker, a real piece of work . . . well, you get the idea. The "quiet" one is by far the most competitive and confident; my chatterbox often doubts her abilities and gets stage-fright. Quiet does not necessarily equal shy, and chatty doesn't equal confident. If they both have a performance, and you ask if they are nervous, my social girl will tell you yes, and explain why at GREAT length. My quiet one will glance up from her book just long enough to say, "Why should I be nervous? I know what I'm doing." Which, btw, is the actual response she gave to me right before she went on tv with her strings group when she was 8, lol!

 

Whatever a kid's innate personality, learning to put themselves forward in a positive way is a skill well worth teaching. Kids often need help seeing the difference between being polite in a social situation (no, really, after you), and managing themselves in a group or competitive setting. They may need to learn and practice some polite phrasing: No, Kyle, she asked me to carry the banner. Yes, I do think I'm the best choice to attend this event, and here's why. Excuse me, Ms. Smith, but only kids who have earned their Barracudda Badge are supposed to be picked for camp.

 

I'm not going to teach the other kind of pushiness, even tho' it means my kids get out-shouted by their nice-but-pushy cousins everytime the grandparents ask what they want to do, or where they want to eat, lol.

[Peela]

Please note that I'm not talking about HE children being anti-social or awkward: Calvin is reasonably friendly and Hobbes is intensely social. I'm just wondering if some may not be quite so socially competitive.

 

Calvin just put himself forward to be chosen for the next worldwide scout jamboree. There was a group selection day and he was not chosen; the other HE child was also not chosen. One of the scout leaders (who was not involved in the choosing but received a report afterwards) said that Calvin and the other HE child were not chosen because they were 'too quiet'. He didn't himself refer to their being HE, but I was wondering if HE children (at least those in small families) may not get so much practice at making themselves heard.

 

Laura

 

Lol, I think it's just personality. Both my kids are "out there" socially and dd15 is on 3 Scout committees (she is in Venturers now) and has been chairman of her group the last 6 months....no one would call her quiet and she is often asked to do things. It's just her personality, and she also volunteers for a lot- the adults can rely on her, she is well organised and responsible and relates well to adults. When she first joined Scouts, at age 10.5, she was the only girl and she didn't care at all! (Scouts is for both sexes here)

Ds14 is much less a leader type personality than his sister, and his adult leaders want him to be a Patrol Leader and he actually doesnt want the responsibility and is happy to stay an assistant! But he is certainly not quiet- he has been in plenty of trouble and been a rather mischevious influence on other Scouts- he is out there in a different way to his sister (be careful what you wish for- extroverted kids who get chosen for things can definitely be intense to live with!).

I am fairly introverted but their dad is a way out there extrovert so while both can handle their own company, both have strong social tendencies- but I do feel it is their personalities.

[Miss Sherry]

Please note that I'm not talking about HE children being anti-social or awkward: Calvin is reasonably friendly and Hobbes is intensely social. I'm just wondering if some may not be quite so socially competitive.

 

Calvin just put himself forward to be chosen for the next worldwide scout jamboree. There was a group selection day and he was not chosen; the other HE child was also not chosen. One of the scout leaders (who was not involved in the choosing but received a report afterwards) said that Calvin and the other HE child were not chosen because they were 'too quiet'. He didn't himself refer to their being HE, but I was wondering if HE children (at least those in small families) may not get so much practice at making themselves heard.

 

Laura

This is just my personal opinion and I may be wrong, but I think how social a person is, is based more on personality traits and learned behaviors from those they grow up with than whether they are homeschooled or p.s. I think most of the social habits learned at p.s are negative and detrimental to their well being. I believe being able to interact in a group of people of mixed ages, such as happens in families, and churches, and many work places, is much healthier and better serves a child in adult life than the "social skills" learned from being with 30 or more children the same age as you for hours each day.

[LibraryLover]

My hsers are very quiet. I see a lot of their hsing friends are much more outgoing, and I always saw hsing kids as more outgoing. Yet not mine. My hsers are very introspective people, and not the types to call attention to themselves. I used to be a little surprised, maybe a bit concerned..kind of...but not really. They are lovely people and they will never be called obnoxious. lol But I do notice other hsers in our group are far, far more chatty, just in general and jump to answers questions etc. My hers are not like that. They are not shy, but they are quiet. When they are very comfortable, they are very participatory, but in a very understated way.

Edited February 18, 2010 by LibraryLover

[KJB]

This is a timely question for me since I just returned home from a weekend in Pisa, Italy where my 13 yo daughter attended a Girl Scouting conference.

 

My daughter wanted to sightsee (we were in Pisa, and an hour away from Florence!) and many of the other girls wanted to fix their hair, talk about Italian boys looking at them, gossip about other girls from other troops, and just in general be teenagerish. Many argued with their mothers (one kept hitting her mother and wiped her mouth on her mother's blouse!) and my dd was the only girl who put her sleeping bag beside her own mom's when it was time to sleep.

 

We went into Pisa and the other girls bought brand name knock-off purses with their money where my daughter spent her money to climb the tower. In Florence, the other girls wanted to visit street vendors where my daughter wanted to go into museums and take photos. The other girls seemed annoyed that my daughter wanted to go into the Cathedral and museums.

 

Overall, my daughter read her book a lot. She ended up meeting some girls from the Netherlands and befriending them, but the vast majority of the other girls had radically different interests.

 

My daughter isn't really shy, but she isn't typical/normal. She is different and she is quiet in these types of groups. She doesn't want to talk boys, hair, pop-culture, etc. Unlike some of the girls we traveled with, my daughter won't just go along with the group when the conversation/activity turns to something she isn't interested in. My daughter will withdraw and isolate herself and do her own thing instead.

 

After my recent experience looking at her in comparison with her peers, I have a better understanding of why. I guess I tend to do the same thing, although I am capable of speaking forever about inane topics if forced. :D

 

FWIW, I think learning to go with the flow a little is a good skill to have even if the crowd is boring you to death. I know some of her behavior was anti-social. I'm just not sure how to work on this with my dd. Frankly, I kind of like that she doesn't care if she doesn't fit.

[lulubelle]

I think it's a combination of many things. My mom took care of my kids last weekend and I got the sense from her afterwards that she thinks my kids are "different". Different from their cousins that she see's a lot. She said she was surprised how the boys could have played outside in the woods all day. They created their own play with building bridges with sticks and other things. And she thinks my older son speaks like a little adult. I think the main difference is simply in the amount of time they are read to. Both me and my husband read to them a great deal. It builds great imagination, patience, and a great vocabulary. These qualities would stand out when compared to the average child going to public school. Parents of public schooled children tend not to have the time to read to their kids as much. Plus, HE kids tend to have a great deal of dialogue going on between parents and siblings and there is not as much need for them to be heard in their age group.

[ChristusG]

I don't think that home schooling has anything to do with it. I was never homeschooled a day in my life and I was always the kid who never spoke to a teacher unless I was asked a question, sat in the back of the class, and really didn't have any friends. I was just quiet. Still am.

 

My DD5 is like that as well....but worse, I think. She has some anxiety issues. DD2 seems to be a bit more outgoing. Mind you, she's still shy but less so than DD5.

[johnandtinagilbert]

I haven't read the other posts, but I keep reading the title of thread and saying, "Yes. Thank God."

 

Kids will be kids, but still, "Yes. Thank God."

 

Enough said.