Update, She got the job!

[saraha]

Dd23 is an aspie. She has an associates+1 degree in paralegal and is currently studying two languages and minoring in business away at school. She did not want to go back to the grocery store for the summer and the lawyer she worked for before doesn’t need her. So I suggested she send out cold letters asking the law offices in our area if they were interested in a summer intern with xyz qualifications and experience. She got one rejection letter and didn’t hear from anyone else.

Now, she did not ask me for any help with this, and I didn’t offer because she does not take any kind of suggestions from me well. Constructive criticism is taken very personally when it comes from me, and usually ends in a negative interaction. One of the letters she mailed from school was returned here yesterday. I can see why she didn’t get any feed back. I haven’t opened it but it was in a standard sized envelope (not business sized) and the addresses were hand written. Her handwriting looks like a third grader. Like seriously, if I got that in the mail I would absolutely have just pitched it without another thought. I’m really hoping that happens, if she applies at any of these places again, I dont want them to remember her. 
 

Part of this is my fault. I obviously didn’t teach her how to send business correspondence. But I’m also baffled that she would look at this and think it’s remotely professional. I mean, she got an associates in business something, worked in a law office along side a cousin who invested a lot of time in her. I was gobsmacked when I saw the envelope. She even put her name as Name A. 🤦‍♀️ 
 

If I ask dh he is going to say do not bring it up. Let it go. But, she is not a learns from mistakes easily kind of person. I know in her mind, there is something wrong with all these people who don’t want to hire her after seeing her credentials. I feel like it would be kinder to point it out and reteach, but I also know from history that she absolutely hates when I’m “being helpful” without being asked. But there are obviously so many things she doesn’t know and apparently doesn’t know to ask or double check about. 
 

So, bring it up or no?

 

Update: She got an email this morning offering an interview!!! The office is a one man band that opened 2.5 years ago. The lawyer is four years older than dd and graduated from the college she currently attends!

Edited May 10 by saraha

[SKL]

I wouldn't tell her you saw what she did.  But I'd suggest sending out another round of letters (isn't this still normal procedure?), and casually add something like:  "Do you have enough business envelopes?  Printer working well?"  "I remember those days of having to buy just the right kind of resume stationery."  "Do you have a prof or friend who could review your letter for positive impact?"  "I hear there's a website now called [resume.com?] that will practically write your letter for you!"

It's pretty normal to get a very low % of positive response to cold letters.  I'd tell her that too, so she doesn't get discouraged and is willing to try again.

[Arcadia]

Is there someone else that could bring it up, like a sibling or your husband? My kids have their associate degree in computer science and their introduction to engineering class (community college) teaches them how to draft a resume and various business correspondence. DS19 has to take a technical writing upper division class (required for all engineering school students) that would cover similar. Maybe someone could tell her to seek help at her school’s career center instead of saying her handwriting looks childlike and unprofessional.
 

My husband and I come from families that have different opinions about opening children’s letters. I would be very upset if my parent opened my letter unless I tell them to e.g. I help DS19 open letters from the bank or the government just in case it needs immediate attention, and he is okay with that. My in-laws however think that they have rights as parents to open their kids’ (and kids’ spouses) letters to read. So depending on what is typical in your household, opening her letter might evoke hurt feelings. 

[City Mouse]

 knowing how to send letters by mail is not a skill that a lot of young people have since most everything is done electronically these days. My DH works with an organization that provides scholarships to youth and has specific requirements as to what students need to send them by mail, or drop off in person. I hear him complain year after year about the kids who can’t follow directions and only want to submit things by email.

That being said, if your DD tends to not have a positive response when you offer assistance, I wouldn’t bother saying anything. Maybe just send her a link to a website or blog post that addresses that issue. Perhaps her college has a job placement service that could help her.

[saraha]

She definitely said she used the career center to help her with the resume, but I think from conversation the envelope just contains a cover letter and contact info. She probably could have gotten help with the actual mailing if she had thought to ask. Career services even has a wardrobe of clothes you can borrow for interviews.

 

[SKL]

Another thought is to broaden her target audience.  Even though she's training to be a paralegal, her skills would probably be useful in any office.

[Pawz4me]

I don't have any real advice, but I want to agree with those who say that mailing business correspondence and addressing envelopes are things that many younger people have little or no experience with. My oldest DS is in his upper 20's, has a degree from a public ivy, and has held a high paying job in finance for quite a few years, including manager level for the past year or so. And he still calls/texts me for advice when he has to mail something. It's just not something he's had to do very much. So if I were you and I approached her to offer help I'd definitely do it from a "I know this is something people your age don't have to do much" perspective.

[saraha]

27 minutes ago, Arcadia said:

o depending on what is typical in your household, opening her letter might evoke hurt feelings. 

I am dying of curiosity, but won’t open it. 

30 minutes ago, SKL said:

It's pretty normal to get a very low % of positive response to cold letters.  I'd tell her that too, so she doesn't get discouraged and is willing to try again.

I have been telling her it was a long shot all along, so hope that helps the disappointment. 

[Arcadia]

7 minutes ago, saraha said:

She definitely said she used the career center to help her with the resume, but I think from conversation the envelope just contains a cover letter and contact info

With job applications going mostly online, the career centers are not going to think about advising students on how to address an envelope. In fact, the posters I see around my local community college campuses only mentioned help with resumes and mock interviews. Cover letters are already not something that is thought about by the career center. However, when my DS19 did his internship application online while at community college, he has to write a paragraph on why he wants that internship. My husband had to do internship interviews and he received soft copies of resumes with cover letters from his HR department for the undergraduates he was interviewing. 
 

Since she has worked at a law firm before, maybe someone can hint that documents mailed out by law firms are the baseline standard when applying for her internships. I am sure the envelopes from law firms, banks and colleges look professional. 

[saraha]

Now I’m obsessing over what else I haven’t specifically taught her that might hold her back 🙄

I did remember to ask when she started if her interview clothes still fit.

Being a mom of an adults is so much harder than children. Especially since society seems to have so much more openness to differences in children, but not so much in college and adults

[Arcadia]

9 minutes ago, saraha said:

Now I’m obsessing over what else I haven’t specifically taught her that might hold her back

Eye contact, firm handshake are things that are at the top of my mind when it comes to first impressions. @Lawyer&Mom anything you might want to suggest since you are a lawyer and autistic? 

[Innisfree]

Is there a career counseling service where you could offer to pay for one visit, “just to get whatever pointers they can offer,” so the criticism isn’t coming from you? Maybe even something online?

My dd has said that at her college career center, most of the employees are students, often younger than she is. They’ve been given some introductory advice to allow them to help other students with basic tasks, but they don’t have the experience or insight of an adult with real job experience, nor do they have the self confidence or tact to help someone like your dd see what she’s doing wrong. It’s possible to get past them and deal with the actual adult staff, but it takes a bit of persistence and an understanding that it’s necessary. So, maybe going back to the career center with a determination to deal with someone with real experience would help. 

[Katy]

I’d have her contact temp agencies in your area. They’ll bring her in for skills tests, interview on the spot, and either send in for an in-house interview or just place her as a temp immediately. 

[Bootsie]

I teach in a top business school which prides itself in devloping professional skills in addition to academic work, and I doubt the vast majority of them would even know what you mean by a business envelope.  They can write an email with all kinds of flowery language; they can develop a resume that makes it sound like their two-week summer babysitting job was time spent being the CEO of a multi-national corporation; they can put together a fancy PowerPoint presenation, but they wouldn't know how to write a simple business letter, address an envelope, or answer a phone call.  I find it appalling, but your daughter is not alone in not having these skills.

With my young adult children I try to approach situations like this with, "Let me know if you would like my help.  You know even after I have spent years as a professional, I still asked DH or Colleague X to look over my application for XYZ.  I find it always helps to have a second set of eyes to spot things I missed on my own."

[saraha]

29 minutes ago, Bootsie said:

I teach in a top business school which prides itself in devloping professional skills in addition to academic work, and I doubt the vast majority of them would even know what you mean by a business envelope.  They can write an email with all kinds of flowery language; they can develop a resume that makes it sound like their two-week summer babysitting job was time spent being the CEO of a multi-national corporation; they can put together a fancy PowerPoint presenation, but they wouldn't know how to write a simple business letter, address an envelope, or answer a phone call.  I find it appalling, but your daughter is not alone in not having these skills.

With my young adult children I try to approach situations like this with, "Let me know if you would like my help.  You know even after I have spent years as a professional, I still asked DH or Colleague X to look over my application for XYZ.  I find it always helps to have a second set of eyes to spot things I missed on my own."

This makes me feel a little better about my part. 

Would it have been better to try to contact these places through electronic means? I have been a sahm mom my entire adult life, so my advice to her could have been completely outdated 

[Arcadia]

6 minutes ago, saraha said:

Would it have been better to try to contact these places through electronic means?

How close are you to that cousin she understudied at the law firm? I would ask that cousin if you are close. For cold calling, it is hard to tell if a letter or email would be a better option and there is no harm doing both (not taking into account the cost of sending a letter).  Many people get lots of work emails. I get lots of emails related to my volunteer work. A letter would get more attention in this case but could also be thought of as just another spam. 
My friend’s son is a freshman and he sent out a few hundred internship applications and is still sending more with no response. It does take some luck and some connections. 

[dsmith]

My ds 25 aspie can be the same way with me. If it's something I deem important, I will bring it up in a similar way to this, based on what it's dealing with: "There's something I noticed, and I would like to talk to you about it, but I don't want you to think I'm criticizing you. It's something that I had trouble with until my mother taught me how to do it when I worked for her as a teen. It's pretty common for people not to know this. Can I show you what I'm talking about?" I really have to emphasize that it is a common thing that people need to learn and that it's not a big deal if he hasn't learned it yet, etc. I try not to sound like I'm giving him a lecture, and I have to watch my tone of voice. He is overly sensitive to a stern sounding voice or anything remotely sounding like criticism. I have to remind my husband not to sound like a strict school master when he is working with him lol. Dh doesn't mean it, but he has a deep serious voice when dealing with work issues, and ds does not respond well.  

[prairiewindmomma]

How aspie are we talking?  There's lots of the 'tism genetically in my extended family, and yet all sorts of personalities and ability to receive information/perspective take despite the struggle/etc.   For some in the family, doing socratic thinking style discussions are helpful. "So, what kind of criteria do you think law offices use to sort through applications? What kinds of skills do you think they need to have? How did your office mail letters when you worked last summer?"

In the offices I worked in in the age of the dinosaurs, people would hand drop off resumes (looking shiny in suits) and we regularly got dozens of unsolicited resumes every spring with people looking for intern or other work.  Some offices circle filed them (straight into the trashcan), others kept them in a folder if they looked especially promising.  Cold soliciting is not effective. 

Does she have a linked in profile? Does she have a good resume key worded to make it past AI sorting? Has she been applying online via LinkedIn or Indeed or wherever? She has better luck finding a job there.  

If you are in a small town, and it's only small town offices around, then you need to work your friends and family connections.  It's much more likely for her to be hired based on a word of mouth referral to the local office.  Can she reach out to who she worked for last summer and see if they have any ideas of who might be hiring? Is there a posting board near the clerk's office? (The tiny county courts often have them....still....because the older attorneys are single man shops who don't know how to use LinkedIn.)

All of that said......if she doesn't receive criticism and learn from it, and doesn't have the skills she needs.....what are her longterm employment plans? That's honestly the bigger concern.

[MEmama]

1 hour ago, saraha said:

so my advice to her could have been completely outdated 

I'm very open with my autistic 21 yo that although I can help with some things job related, I don't and **can't** know how things work today. So we'll help with his CV and cover letters, but I do suggest he ask his friends to look them over because even our best advice is 30 years old. It's a different world, and we adults need to internalize that. No one cares about envelopes or handwriting in 2024, those just aren't a thing.

Honestly, DS goes to YouTube to learn about such things, and I think it's for the best. I remember how out of date my parents were, and there's no sense in pretending we understand what the modern world expects for our kids.

[bolt.]

I kind of think that she doesn't need help with this.

"Our world" with judgement of professional competency being attached to trivial things like the quality of one's handwriting and the size of one's envelopes is very much fading away. Your concern reads a lot like a baby boomer asking how a person could possibly get a good job if they choose to have a tattoo. The answer is that the person doing the hiring is very likely to also have a tattoo and not care in the slightest. Similarly, while a law office may well contain a number of people of our generation who might respond negatively to "snail mail under-competence" -- it's not likely that those people are front-desk or mailroom people. The people who actually handle her envelope probably have poor handwriting and are missing data about business-mail social clues too.

A cold letter campaign was a long shot to begin with.

Also, anyone who hires your child, will thereafter be the people who employ her. It's not in anyone's best interests if her approaches to getting a job, generating first impressions etc. are based on 'teamwork' (with mom) if she's going to have to do the job thereafter on her own steam. They deserve to understand the strengths and weaknesses she brings to the table. She deserves an employer who hasn't had their expectations raised above a level that she can maintain. If they need their employees to do business mail, they will either ask if she has that skill or train her -- the same as any other skill.

It's okay for her to work hard to get jobs through transparency and genuine qualification. Beyond support and a few tips and reminders -- you don't need to go further and help her make herself out to be someone she's not. Her best jobs will be the ones that hire her for who she is.

[Annie G]

I would probably start with having a conversation around the fact that cold calling didn’t yield results and ask what her next step is going to be.  If she’s living with you, is there an expectation that she’s going to be gainfully employed? (In our house that’s how it worked, but our youngest two needed the scaffolding when they were still young adults.)

I’m not sure I’d worry about how she went about it this time since it was such a long shot anyway. Looking for actual job listings and applying for them likely won’t require mailing anything.

[Rosie_0801]

I think you should give her the option of ignoring you.

[gardenmom5]

You've received some good suggestions.
Not a job, but . . . at a dog and pony for a college that requires handwritten essays (to remind the committee the students are people), one speaker shared how one applicant owed his acceptance to including a word processed letter.

I would say something, I like the "assumption" she's doing a word processed letter - she should be doing one anyway.
Is there anything through the career center at her school for help with jobs?  though many internships are already filled.

[Clarita]

5 hours ago, saraha said:

Would it have been better to try to contact these places through electronic means? I have been a sahm mom my entire adult life, so my advice to her could have been completely outdated 

Honestly, I don't hear a lot of cold calls working at all. I know it's a thing and some one out there has gotten a job that way, but I also know companies who don't look at cold calls at all (emails/letters direct to trash). Especially companies who weren't even going to post a listing because they can't handle the number of applicants. 

If you don't know anyone it's look for openings apply, if there's some contact information on there follow up on it. The best method though would be to ask the cousin to keep their ears and eyes opened for opportunities, maybe not at their firm but anything else. Of course all the while look for openings to apply. Keep in touch with her favorite classmates, in case they get a job. If she is close with any professors ask them if they know anyone.  

100% to what @bolt.said above, too. I would leave her to presenting herself in the best manner she can. It's better for you to help with the connections than for you to help her be someone she isn't. (Although I worked in an industry that was very accepting of neuro-divergent folks. My companies would offer communication classes that discussed how far away you should stand from a person while talking.)

[BusyMom5]

7 hours ago, saraha said:

Now I’m obsessing over what else I haven’t specifically taught her that might hold her back 🙄

I did remember to ask when she started if her interview clothes still fit.

Being a mom of an adults is so much harder than children. Especially since society seems to have so much more openness to differences in children, but not so much in college and adults

Yesterday mine called- on her way to an interview- to tell me a firm she interviewed with last week just called to make an offer!  She's so excited,  she just going to call and cancel this interview... the one she is literally driving to.  I'm like NO!!!!!  You don't have an official offer letter, you've signed nothing, and the interview starts in an hour.  Highly unprofessional!!!  So she went.  But if she hadn't called me first, she would have canceled an interview within an hour of the appointed time.  

Also I had a group of 25 high schoolers write letters recently.  They can barely write legibly, and all but maybe 4 or 5 did not know how to address an envelope.  I wrote the address on the board and just assumed they would know how.  I was wrong.  

I think for a lot of things like this, they were probably shown at some point, but it didn't stick or they just don't consider how things look to others- more like oblivious.

[saraha]

Dd lives in another state while in college. She was throwing a Hail Mary to find an summer internship locally instead of spending the summer working at the grocery store. She isn’t ready to graduate yet, she has one semester plus two classes left.
We both knew it was a long shot, the five lawyers within a decent drive from our house are all one man bands, one of which is the cousin she worked for last summer who, because of his health, has scaled back his practice significantly and just really can’t use her but said he would give her a good, honest reference, which we both appreciated. Like you said, she doesn’t want to over sell herself and disappoint. 
 

I feel much better knowing she is not alone in the business letter dept. I totally recognize that my experience of “how business should be done” could be/is outdated, which is one of the reasons why I was wondering if I should bring it up. You guys have made me feel much better.

ETA: she has applied on indeed for remote paralegals, but I think the part about summer work stuffs it up. She almost applied to a lawyer in the next county but cousin advised her not to, so she didn’t. Last year, in one of her business classes they covered marketing themselves and spent a chunk of time helping them set up linked in and how to maintain it. She does a great job of social media hygiene too I think

Edited May 2 by saraha

[Bootsie]

9 hours ago, saraha said:

This makes me feel a little better about my part. 

Would it have been better to try to contact these places through electronic means? I have been a sahm mom my entire adult life, so my advice to her could have been completely outdated 

I think most contact is through electronic means.  For at least the past 10 years, every hiring committee I have been on has only accepted electronic materials.  Many employers require that contact be made through the company's portal rather than mailing (snail or email) an individual.  A smaller firm may be different.  For the most part, the potential employer will respond electronically so it is easier for them to receive the initial contact electronically.  An older employer may like a properly typed/mailed letter (and a sender would definitely stand out as different) but I don't know of anyone in the business world who would expect to be contacted that way.  

I can't remember the last time I received a piece of "real mail" at work.  And, I have not used a piece of letterhead paper since before COVID--I do not know where I would even find some in our office.  Things really have changed that much. 

 

 

[Arcadia]

40 minutes ago, Bootsie said:

And, I have not used a piece of letterhead paper since before COVID--I do not know where I would even find some in our office. 

Whoever prints the acceptance letters that get mailed out has letterhead paper.  

[bolt.]

15 hours ago, Arcadia said:

Whoever prints the acceptance letters that get mailed out has letterhead paper.  

Really? Is letterhead paper even still a thing? What stops people from just having a 'letterhead' graphic that they add to documents before they print them -- if that's what they need. Letterhead seems extremely inconvenient... unless a company just has hundreds of bundles of it that they've already pre-bought.

[Lawyer&Mom]

On 5/2/2024 at 8:55 AM, Arcadia said:

Eye contact, firm handshake are things that are at the top of my mind when it comes to first impressions. @Lawyer&Mom anything you might want to suggest since you are a lawyer and autistic? 

Goodness, I was a lawyer for years and years before I was diagnosed, so I wasn’t consciously aware of what I needed to do to fit in, or where I may have had deficits.  Can’t go wrong with a firm handshake, and eye contact can be faked.  (Look at their nose or forehead and it’s close enough.)  I would say that my government role is very neurodiverse, filled with attorneys that might not be able to thrive in a law firm.  But our hiring is just as difficult as anywhere.

[Clarita]

5 hours ago, bolt. said:

21 hours ago, Arcadia said:

Whoever prints the acceptance letters that get mailed out has letterhead paper.  

Really? Is letterhead paper even still a thing? What stops people from just having a 'letterhead' graphic that they add to documents before they print them -- if that's what they need. Letterhead seems extremely inconvenient... unless a company just has hundreds of bundles of it that they've already pre-bought.

Definitely some places have templates you can just grab that prints out like "company letterhead". I never knew of the special stash of letterhead at any company, but occasionally I'd have to make a document using some special templates. Not that I ever wrote a letter in my career, but I still had to write some official documents. 

[Bootsie]

5 hours ago, bolt. said:

Really? Is letterhead paper even still a thing? What stops people from just having a 'letterhead' graphic that they add to documents before they print them -- if that's what they need. Letterhead seems extremely inconvenient... unless a company just has hundreds of bundles of it that they've already pre-bought.

Old-fashioned letterhead was special not simply because of the graphic on it but because it was printed on higher-quality, bond paper rather than copy paper.  In fact, many companies would have a special watermark on the paper.  The color of paper also set a tone--was it ecru, off-white, crisp white, etc (and always matched the envelope).  It reflected corporate culture and gave a sense of permanence.

In an office where a number of people share a printer, however, letterhead can be incovenient because you have to go stack it in the printer and hope no one else sends something through the printer until you have been able to print what you wanted on the letterhead.  

[Arcadia]

12 minutes ago, Bootsie said:

Old-fashioned letterhead was special not simply because of the graphic on it but because it was printed on higher-quality, bond paper rather than copy paper.  In fact, many companies would have a special watermark on the paper.  The color of paper also set a tone--was it ecru, off-white, crisp white, etc (and always matched the envelope).  It reflected corporate culture and gave a sense of permanence.

@bolt. This. In fact most of my kids acceptance letters have come in brightly colored envelopes bearing the school logo. It is a great but simple marketing gesture to make the recipients happy. Getting an acceptance letter in a normal plain white envelope on typical 70g printer paper doesn’t look appealing. 
 

Where I used to work, the paper was 80g or more often 100g with the company logo as a watermark. We had a department printer dedicated for printing letters to clients. When I was in college (90s), resumes were sent in conqueror 100gsm paper (https://conqueror-paper.co.uk/High-White-Wove-100gsm-Bespoke-250)

[Lawyer&Mom]

2 hours ago, Arcadia said:

Where I used to work, the paper was 80g or more often 100g with the company logo as a watermark. We had a department printer dedicated for printing letters to clients. When I was in college (90s), resumes were sent in conqueror 100gsm paper (https://conqueror-paper.co.uk/High-White-Wove-100gsm-Bespoke-250)

I only printed a few resumes in law school and still had an almost full box of that paper… kids found it during lockdown and *loved* it for watercoloring!

Edited May 4 by Lawyer&Mom

[bolt.]

2 hours ago, Arcadia said:

@bolt. This. In fact most of my kids acceptance letters have come in brightly colored envelopes bearing the school logo. It is a great but simple marketing gesture to make the recipients happy. Getting an acceptance letter in a normal plain white envelope on typical 70g printer paper doesn’t look appealing. 
 

Where I used to work, the paper was 80g or more often 100g with the company logo as a watermark. We had a department printer dedicated for printing letters to clients. When I was in college (90s), resumes were sent in conqueror 100gsm paper (https://conqueror-paper.co.uk/High-White-Wove-100gsm-Bespoke-250)

Wow. My kid got "acceptance" emails that were basically nothing more than links to student portal software -- where all the info on becoming a student was.

[Clarita]

3 hours ago, Bootsie said:

In an office where a number of people share a printer, however, letterhead can be incovenient because you have to go stack it in the printer and hope no one else sends something through the printer until you have been able to print what you wanted on the letterhead.  

I would assume HR would be the ones with access to the special paper and usually HR and accounting have their own printers because they print a lot and they have to print stuff that can't be seen by everyone.

[Arcadia]

40 minutes ago, bolt. said:

Wow. My kid got "acceptance" emails that were basically nothing more than links to student portal software -- where all the info on becoming a student was.

What my kids got from one of the colleges. I just white out personal info

Envelope 

Letter

[SKL]

10 hours ago, Lawyer&Mom said:

I only printed a few resumes in law school and still had an almost full box of that paper… kids found it during lockdown and *loved* it for watercoloring!

LOL I think I still have a stock of "resume paper" from those days!  It was such an expensive commodity for students.

I am so glad most of that is in the past.  I almost forgot all the fuss over letterhead.  Yay for computers making things easier!

[Bootsie]

10 hours ago, Clarita said:

I would assume HR would be the ones with access to the special paper and usually HR and accounting have their own printers because they print a lot and they have to print stuff that can't be seen by everyone.

It is not just HR and accounting that print out stuff that can't be seen by everyone.  IME universities are an odd place because there are people wandering in and out of offices all of the time--students, potential students, staff, faculty.  We have a hallway of faculty and staff (about 10 people) who share a printer located at the end of the hallway to which I have to print exams, letters documenting academic dishonesty, grade reports,  the department admin prints acceptance letters into certain programs or scholarship awards, etc--some info protected by FERPA, some I don't want others to see. We recently built a new building and the consultants decided we needed collaborative work spaces, which put most of our adminstrative assistant's desks and computers walkways--this may work well in a bank or law firm where there is limited access to the building by outsiders.  But we have night and weekend classes with students and the public wandering in and out of the building--it has been a security nightmare.  

[Bootsie]

1 hour ago, SKL said:

LOL I think I still have a stock of "resume paper" from those days!  It was such an expensive commodity for students.

I am so glad most of that is in the past.  I almost forgot all the fuss over letterhead.  Yay for computers making things easier!

I am not sure once you account for ink costs how much cheaper it is today.  Printing "letterhead" has become so easy that receiving something on "letterhead" is meaningless today.  It is very easy for someone to print forged "letterhead".  Students can easily print "letterhead" on which they can make up an excuse and it looks so official because it is so easy.  

[SKL]

16 minutes ago, Bootsie said:

I am not sure once you account for ink costs how much cheaper it is today.  Printing "letterhead" has become so easy that receiving something on "letterhead" is meaningless today.  It is very easy for someone to print forged "letterhead".  Students can easily print "letterhead" on which they can make up an excuse and it looks so official because it is so easy.  

Hard copies are needed less and less in the business world.  Even "wet signatures" are becoming unusual.  I probably use my printer less than once a month (for work and personal combined).  I am happy to save a tree.  😛  In my young adult years, having to print stuff would have meant making a trip to the copy shop, which meant using not only ink and paper, but gas and a good chunk of time.  Sometimes it was very impractical even though Kinko's had long hours.  Yet another example of what "kids these days" can take for granted.  🙂  Of course that was still an improvement over having to type my 22-page bar application on pink paper in triplicate.  God forbid a typo occurred.

I am not sure what "excuse" you are referring to above.  I think it's great if it's easy for young (and old) people to do what needs doing.  Dare I hope that they use the saved time to do something productive?  😛

ETA maybe by "excuse" you meant a doctor's letter for getting out of class, or something like that?  Yeah, I can see how kids could get away with stuff more easily ... not that they didn't figure out ways before.  😛  Darn kids trying to get out of getting an education.

Edited May 4 by SKL

[Clarita]

30 minutes ago, Bootsie said:

It is not just HR and accounting that print out stuff that can't be seen by everyone.  IME universities are an odd place because there are people wandering in and out of offices all of the time--students, potential students, staff, faculty.  We have a hallway of faculty and staff (about 10 people) who share a printer located at the end of the hallway to which I have to print exams, letters documenting academic dishonesty, grade reports,  the department admin prints acceptance letters into certain programs or scholarship awards, etc--some info protected by FERPA, some I don't want others to see. We recently built a new building and the consultants decided we needed collaborative work spaces, which put most of our adminstrative assistant's desks and computers walkways--this may work well in a bank or law firm where there is limited access to the building by outsiders.  But we have night and weekend classes with students and the public wandering in and out of the building--it has been a security nightmare.  

Oh my, that seems like trouble.

[Clarita]

11 hours ago, Arcadia said:

What my kids got from one of the colleges. I just white out personal info

Envelope 

Letter

I probably got something like that but I was too busy being happy about the word ACCEPTED, none of it registered.

[Arcadia]

1 hour ago, Clarita said:

I probably got something like that but I was too busy being happy about the word ACCEPTED, none of it registered.

Kids get the email notification first. Mail comes about a week later. So the anticipation was more of what swag if any will be in the welcome/acceptance  letter.

[Irish]

Congrats on her interview!

[BusyMom5]

Congrats on an interview!  It's so hard to find a job when you live rural. I've got one job hunting right now and we've only found 2 places that said they were possibly hiring for summer.  She's open to anything!  Applied to a bank and Subway, lol!  

[saraha]

1 hour ago, BusyMom5 said:

Congrats on an interview!  It's so hard to find a job when you live rural. I've got one job hunting right now and we've only found 2 places that said they were possibly hiring for summer.  She's open to anything!  Applied to a bank and Subway, lol!  

Yeah, it is! If this doesn’t work, she’ll be working at the grocery store with her sister!

[Hannah]

All the very best for her interview!!

[Harriet Vane]

I really hope she gets it!

[saraha]

She got the job!!!!