Why must people be so incivil? Venty-vent-vent.

[Not_a_Number]

1 minute ago, Quill said:

Well, but she was about to crash into me. Had she stepped back one more step, her butt would have connected with the front corner of my cart. The only way I could have  eliminated the possibility would be if I had also backed up. 

I'd have probably shouted "Careful!" or something like that. 🤷‍♀️

I don't know if that scans as more polite to people, but that's what comes into my head! 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, LaughingCat said:

Interestingly, your point reminded me that it has not bothered me when the person asked in a manner that was asking for help, like "I'm sorry but I'm in a big rush and I only have 2 items, can I jump in front of you?"     

Unfortunately that has been the rare case.  Most times it has been "I only have 2 items, can I jump in front of you?"  said in a manner that said "It's my right to jump in front of you because I only have 2 items"    The one time I described above where I myself only had 2 items in my cart, the person even started to step in front of me as she asked ( before I said "No")    Maybe I just look like an easy mark to shorten their wait LOL  but I have MANY times stood behind people with very full carts with my 2 items and would never think to ask to jump in front of them since their time is just as valuable as my time. 

You should work on your RBF, lol! 

I have rarely been asked, but I usually offer if I notice, too. Anymore, there are tons of self-checkouts; most in-a-hurry people with a few items use those. 

[scholastica]

This exact scenario happened at Target today to my dh. Except he was the backer-upper. The woman said “Excuse me” to him. He was laughing when he caught up to me and relayed the story. ( I had shared  this thread and all the opinions to him last night.) He thoroughly enjoyed himself. We are in the Midwest. 

[DoraBora]

26 minutes ago, Quill said:

Well, but she was about to crash into me. Had she stepped back one more step, her butt would have connected with the front corner of my cart. The only way I could have  eliminated the possibility would be if I had also backed up. 

Next time, you could just stand there loudly saying "beep beep beep" until she stops backing up.

Then eye smile or say "I'm sorry", or whatever is regionally appropriate.  😀

[Kalmia]

I was born in Maine and my family goes back generations here. "Dear" (or) "Dee-ah" as it is pronounced is NOT generally meant as an insult of any kind or domination of any kind. People county to the islands use it as a term of endearment for friends or people in their family or as a friendly greeting in a commercial setting, "What can I get you, dear?". Men often call other men dear. I am sure there are instances when it has been used meanly, but it is not the norm and it is not the "bless her heart" of the north. 

Now if you are near the coast and someone calls you "numb" or a "dub" or "dubber" then you can be sure they don't think highly of your intellect. 

[GoodGrief3]

I grew up in Atlanta, went to college in Minneapolis, spent several years in New Mexico and on a reservation in Arizona, a couple years in DC, a good bit of time in Mississippi, Washington, Oklahoma, and New Jersey (longer than a vacation), and the last couple decades in the Far North :-) Have traveled to all but 2 states. Interesting to read everyone's perspectives!

My impression is that everywhere I go, people are people are people. Some chatty, some not. If you came here (or to Atlanta in the 70s-80s) and ran into my husband out and about, he'd go out of his way to avoid you. If you ran into me, I'd probably get your life story out of you. Sometimes there are cultural differences, especially in situations where people are hyperaware of being the subject of tourist curiosity. That was often true of Native people on the reservation where we lived, and I imagine plays a part with the Amish as well. Sometimes people are in a hurry or have things or their minds and just don't want to talk. Sometimes they are understandably cautious, especially if it's a male trying to chat up a female.

[Eos]

9 hours ago, Kalmia said:

I was born in Maine and my family goes back generations here. "Dear" (or) "Dee-ah" as it is pronounced is NOT generally meant as an insult of any kind or domination of any kind. People county to the islands use it as a term of endearment for friends or people in their family or as a friendly greeting in a commercial setting, "What can I get you, dear?". Men often call other men dear. I am sure there are instances when it has been used meanly, but it is not the norm and it is not the "bless her heart" of the north. 

Now if you are near the coast and someone calls you "numb" or a "dub" or "dubber" then you can be sure they don't think highly of your intellect. 

Yes, for sure a term of endearment (pun intended) more often than the mild put-down.  I don't think of it as especially mean, just a gentle reminder of who's who, if the situation warrants.

[Laura Corin]

11 hours ago, Quill said:

Well, but she was about to crash into me. Had she stepped back one more step, her butt would have connected with the front corner of my cart. The only way I could have  eliminated the possibility would be if I had also backed up. 

Yes, I would have backed up (checking behind me as I did it).  No skin off my nose to help someone who is being clueless.

[marbel]

10 hours ago, GoodGrief3 said:

My impression is that everywhere I go, people are people are people. Some chatty, some not. If you came here (or to Atlanta in the 70s-80s) and ran into my husband out and about, he'd go out of his way to avoid you. If you ran into me, I'd probably get your life story out of you.

Yep. I haven't lived as many places as you have but as an adult lived in the SF Bay Area, the Portland Oregon area, now live in the Philadelphia suburbs, and have spent a lot of time in different parts of the south.  There are friendly and unfriendly people in all places. 

I think at least part of our perception of friendly/unfriendly has to do with our own personality. I am a shy person who would like to be one of those people who chatted up others. But I can't bring myself to  do it. I will smile at people, maybe make a little comment if I can muster the strength, but my own natural reserve comes through. I also don't want to insert myself where I am not wanted. So I don't start up conversations with people I don't know and I probably don't look like I want anyone to talk to me.  But there is something about my face that attracts certain people - mostly women who by appearance or demeanor seem to be a little older than me, no matter what age I am - to tell me their life story while standing in a Walmart line. 

People had told me Philly is an unfriendly city, but in my experience it's not. People talk fast, and they have this aura of being aware they live in the only place worth living in*, but they are not unfriendly. And Philly is the only city in which someone has noticed my confused face when I am a little lost and offered to help direct me. 

 I used to know a guy - a pastor - who could talk to anyone, anywhere, and who attracted people to himself. Like, he'd go into a coffee shop with his bible and sit drinking and reading (silently), and within a few minutes had people - strangers - sitting with him talking.  He was the kind of person people talked to, and he would be that way  no matter where he lived. I bet he has never found a place he would consider unfriendly.

*in my experience, a high percentage Philly natives I've encountered have zero curiosity about other places and can't imagine living elsewhere, except maybe Florida. 

[Halftime Hope]

On 2/5/2021 at 7:36 PM, kbutton said:

I can’t tell you how many times I’ve tried to explain to people in the Midwest that they are not particularly inviting and friendly (but are polite), they don’t get it.

This is my son-in-law. Sigh. 

ETA -- took off too much info. 

 

 

Edited February 7, 2021 by Halftime Hope

[Scarlett]

2 hours ago, marbel said:

Yep. I haven't lived as many places as you have but as an adult lived in the SF Bay Area, the Portland Oregon area, now live in the Philadelphia suburbs, and have spent a lot of time in different parts of the south.  There are friendly and unfriendly people in all places. 

I think at least part of our perception of friendly/unfriendly has to do with our own personality. I am a shy person who would like to be one of those people who chatted up others. But I can't bring myself to  do it. I will smile at people, maybe make a little comment if I can muster the strength, but my own natural reserve comes through. I also don't want to insert myself where I am not wanted. So I don't start up conversations with people I don't know and I probably don't look like I want anyone to talk to me.  But there is something about my face that attracts certain people - mostly women who by appearance or demeanor seem to be a little older than me, no matter what age I am - to tell me their life story while standing in a Walmart line. 

People had told me Philly is an unfriendly city, but in my experience it's not. People talk fast, and they have this aura of being aware they live in the only place worth living in*, but they are not unfriendly. And Philly is the only city in which someone has noticed my confused face when I am a little lost and offered to help direct me. 

 I used to know a guy - a pastor - who could talk to anyone, anywhere, and who attracted people to himself. Like, he'd go into a coffee shop with his bible and sit drinking and reading (silently), and within a few minutes had people - strangers - sitting with him talking.  He was the kind of person people talked to, and he would be that way  no matter where he lived. I bet he has never found a place he would consider unfriendly.

*in my experience, a high percentage Philly natives I've encountered have zero curiosity about other places and can't imagine living elsewhere, except maybe Florida. 

I think it is the same with local phrases like Bless Your Heart and Dear.  Although I definitely have heard BYH used sincerely and snarky I have never heard it used viciously. Not with my family or friends at least.  

[Spryte]

19 hours ago, Tanaqui said:

There's nothing rude about asking for help.

There's also nothing rude about saying no.

If somebody asks, and you don't want to - say no!

Yes, I can’t recall exactly where we were traveling, but have a vague memory of running (literally) into a store to buy Benadryl for a kid having an allergic reaction, having that one item in hand, and asking a person in line if I could please go ahead of them, to get the Benadryl to my kid in the car with Dad faster.  Maybe they thought it was rude. I hope not.  If they’d said no, I’d have waited, of course.  It seemed silly not to ask, though, with a kid needing it.
 

We keep Benadryl, Pepcid and epipens in our carry cases but that one time it was all gone, or had fallen out of the emergency case.

[SKL]

About "you people are not friendly" ... I am thinking the word "friendly" means different things also.  I think that if someone said to someone in Ohio "you Ohio people are not friendly," that would be a self-fulfilling statement.  I for one would definitely go find something else to do rather than try to prove how friendly I am after that.

I think of friendly as someone who is warm around others, engages in considerate and kind give-and-take, appears open to a reasonable range of interactions.  I don't think it implies a certain quantity of chatting though.  I don't think you need to initiate conversation in order to be friendly.  Some people are both quiet and friendly.  It takes some people longer to warm up, but they can still be friendly if others can be patient.

So I am wondering ... what do others mean by friendly?

I would also note that if we're talking about people at work, they might get in trouble if they chat too much.  In a check-out line when people are waiting, I don't think that's the time to chat someone up.  But maybe that's my unfriendly side talking.  😛

[kbutton]

A friend posted this on FB today:

[Kassia]

22 minutes ago, SKL said:

  Some people are both quiet and friendly.  It takes some people longer to warm up, but they can still be friendly if others can be patient.

I would also note that if we're talking about people at work, they might get in trouble if they chat too much.  In a check-out line when people are waiting, I don't think that's the time to chat someone up.  But maybe that's my unfriendly side talking.  😛

This is a big issue for my dd.  She is an introvert and it takes her a while to warm up to people and she feels as if people think of her as unfriendly, when she's not at all.  

I always have people chatting to me in the checkout lane unless they are Amish (as I wrote earlier in the thread).  I don't mind, but sometimes people tell me way too many details about their family or life and I don't like that much.  A huge pet peeve of mine is when people comment on what's in my cart.  I don't know why that bugs me so much, but it does.  

DH works remotely for a company in another state.  When he has to go in, he gets annoyed by how much time is wasted with talking about nonwork stuff.  He's plenty friendly, but wants to get his work done and doesn't want to spend 45 minutes talking to someone when he should be working.

 

 

[Garga]

4 hours ago, SKL said:

 

So I am wondering ... what do others mean by friendly?
 

Friendly is when someone is alone and you’re in a group, and you noticed the person alone and let them know somehow that they’re welcome to join the group. Like the poster who was alone on the playground with her child and tried to talk to the other adults. Letting a person who is alone join in is friendly. Staring at them blankly and not engaging with them is unfriendly.

It’s looking out for people on the sideline and letting them know they can join if they want to. If they’re introverted or not in a social mood, that’s ok, but you extend the invitation in some way—maybe by saying something to them, or by giving them a friendly smile.  

Now of course this doesn’t happen anytime you’re out in public, but if they’re kinda looking your way and looking lonely, or if they give a tentative smile and seem like they want the invitation, then you find a way to make it.  This isn’t for someone who is clearly wanting to be left alone and you’re some weirdo stranger walking up to them.

So, if someone is on a subway listening to their ear buds, you leave them alone. But if you’re at some sort of church event and someone is just sort of sitting there alone looking around awkwardly, you can approach and give them your name and see if they want to talk. If they don’t respond, then you can say, “Nice to meet you,” and leave them alone. But if they were feeling lonely and didn’t know how to join in to established groups, then you open a little door for them.

Friendly is when you notice the people who look lonely and offer them a little lifeline. Then it’s up to them to take the lifeline or not.

Friendly is not staring blankly at people or past people. It’s giving them a little smile or nod or soft eye contact (not a hard glare) to acknowledge that they’re fellow human beings and not just objects in the surroundings. It doesn’t have to be over-the-top. 

Edited February 7, 2021 by Garga

[Garga]

Like, I don’t initiate chats with store clerks, but I infuse my voice with warmth when they say, “How are you today?” “Doing well. How are you?” If they want to keep talking, that’s fine. I don’t want to disrupt them at their job, though, so I will probably not talk much more unless they initiate it. When they say, “Have a nice day,” I’ll give a warm, “And you, too!” back.

To me, that’s friendly enough. They’re the ones at work, so I let them decide if they have time for a conversation or not. And if they want to talk, I’ll be warm toward them by my tone of voice and facial expressions.

I will not freeze someone out by being unresponsive if they try to talk to me. That’s really rude. If someone at the playground wanted to talk, I’d let them and I’d respond nicely to them. We don’t have to share our deepest secrets to each other, but I’ll be nice to them.

Edited February 7, 2021 by Garga

[SKL]

I smile at people all the time (nowadays I wave because uncovered smiling is illegal).  But I don't always initiate a conversation.  I assume people like their space when they're sitting alone at a park etc.  Probably because I find it refreshing to have breaks from people (introvert thing).  Of course if they are sitting right next to me, like when I used to watch my kids' gymnastics classes, then I'd say something rather than sit like a stone.

One thing I have always loathed is those professional networking things and similar, where you have to be with a hundred people with whom you have zero connection, and who may or may not be in competition with you (socially, professionally, etc.).  Because of my own lifelong awkwardness, I really try to reach out to any person who appears awkward in those situations.  Usually they are younger people, going through what I went through at their age.  It helps me and them.  But I can only do this with one or two people at any given event.  It can be incredibly draining for me to force conversation.

[Tanaqui]

2 hours ago, Seasider too said:

Oh my in that case I would have not only let you go ahead of me, I would have told you to skedaddle and I would have asked the cashier to add your Benadryl cost to the items I’m about to check out. 

I've covered people's groceries before. I'm happy to do it no matter what, but I hate when the cashier tries to cover the awkwardness by instructing them to thank me like they're a child and I'm a teacher. Sure, a thank you is nice, but if they don't say it spontaneously, why make it even MORE UNCOMFORTABLE for all of us? I like to believe I do nice things to be nice, not because I want thanks

[SKL]

8 minutes ago, Tanaqui said:

I've covered people's groceries before. I'm happy to do it no matter what, but I hate when the cashier tries to cover the awkwardness by instructing them to thank me like they're a child and I'm a teacher. Sure, a thank you is nice, but if they don't say it spontaneously, why make it even MORE UNCOMFORTABLE for all of us? I like to believe I do nice things to be nice, not because I want thanks

That would be awful.  I haven't experienced that.

I do feel super embarrassed when anyone pays something for me.  Especially if I don't have the opportunity to immediately "pay it forward."  Of course, in an emergency situation or when someone forgot their wallet, I would and have offered to do it.  But just randomly, I don't like it, and I assume I'm not the only one.

[Spryte]

16 minutes ago, Tanaqui said:

I've covered people's groceries before. I'm happy to do it no matter what, but I hate when the cashier tries to cover the awkwardness by instructing them to thank me like they're a child and I'm a teacher. Sure, a thank you is nice, but if they don't say it spontaneously, why make it even MORE UNCOMFORTABLE for all of us? I like to believe I do nice things to be nice, not because I want thanks

Yikes, that would be awkward.  
 

I’ve mostly experienced the paying for the next car phenomenon - in toll booths or Starbucks.  No contact at all.  And it’s fun to pay for the car behind us, to pass it on.

[Not_a_Number]

1 hour ago, Garga said:

Friendly is not staring blankly at people or past people. It’s giving them a little smile or nod or soft eye contact (not a hard glare) to acknowledge that they’re fellow human beings and not just objects in the surroundings. It doesn’t have to be over-the-top. 

Yeah, I was honestly talking mostly about basics like this one. 

 

1 hour ago, Garga said:

I will not freeze someone out by being unresponsive if they try to talk to me. That’s really rude. If someone at the playground wanted to talk, I’d let them and I’d respond nicely to them. We don’t have to share our deepest secrets to each other, but I’ll be nice to them.

OK, now I'm curious... do most people not chat at playgrounds? I don't always do it, but I certainly have done a fair amount of small talk at playgrounds. Like, asking people how old their kids are, and whether they live nearby. I've exchanged numbers very occasionally, and once we kind of became friends. But mostly it's just "Hi! How old's your kid? Ah-ha, mine is ... " 

[Not_a_Number]

8 hours ago, marbel said:

People had told me Philly is an unfriendly city, but in my experience it's not. People talk fast, and they have this aura of being aware they live in the only place worth living in*, but they are not unfriendly. And Philly is the only city in which someone has noticed my confused face when I am a little lost and offered to help direct me. 

I've had this happen in NY. I actually think a lot of the Northeast is like that -- lots of people are curt, but people will help you out if you need it. 

I had the opposite experience with Minneapolis -- everyone was super polite but no one would help me out if I needed it. Like, literally, my grocery bag broke in the elevator while I had a toddler in a carrier on my back, but no one helped me bring the items I was tediously bringing out one by one out of the elevator. I was being all flustered and saying "I'm really sorry! I'll be out really quick!" and people just stood around. 

Again, there was obviously a different culture about public engagement than the one I'm used to. But it was incredibly striking. 

[SKL]

3 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

Yeah, I was honestly talking mostly about basics like this one. 

 

OK, now I'm curious... do most people not chat at playgrounds? I don't always do it, but I certainly have done a fair amount of small talk at playgrounds. Like, asking people how old their kids are, and whether they live nearby. I've exchanged numbers very occasionally, and once we kind of became friends. But mostly it's just "Hi! How old's your kid? Ah-ha, mine is ... " 

As soon as my kids were big enough to play without a close-at-hand adult, I would take a walk around the perimeter or paths.  I was always so busy and on-task between work and family and house, I really needed that time to myself.  (Not to mention, it was often my only chance to do any exercise.)  I assume this is true of other moms too.  To be honest, I don't think it crossed my mind that the other moms at the playground might be in need of interaction.  The last thing I was in need of was more interaction.  😛

[Tanaqui]

1 hour ago, SKL said:

That would be awful.  I haven't experienced that.

I do feel super embarrassed when anyone pays something for me.  Especially if I don't have the opportunity to immediately "pay it forward."  Of course, in an emergency situation or when someone forgot their wallet, I would and have offered to do it.  But just randomly, I don't like it, and I assume I'm not the only one.

 

Oh, god, I agree with the bolded. I've only ever done it when somebody else clearly didn't have the cash, with the comment that they'd surely do it for me if the situation were reversed.

(Relatedly, it does no good to lecture people that EBT doesn't cover diapers. EBT probably ought to cover diapers, but at any rate, they need food AND they need diapers, so what are they going to do? They don't need you to talk at them for five minutes about this while you wait for a manager to come and void the purchase. This is almost all the times that I've paid for the person in front of me in a nutshell - buying diapers because EBT doesn't cover it. They would do the same for me.)

[Shoeless]

44 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

Yeah, I was honestly talking mostly about basics like this one. 

 

OK, now I'm curious... do most people not chat at playgrounds? I don't always do it, but I certainly have done a fair amount of small talk at playgrounds. Like, asking people how old their kids are, and whether they live nearby. I've exchanged numbers very occasionally, and once we kind of became friends. But mostly it's just "Hi! How old's your kid? Ah-ha, mine is ... " 

In my old neighborhood in the suburbs of Chicago, no, people did not chat at the playground. I loved everything about that neighborhood except how unfriendly people were.  

[kbutton]

3 minutes ago, MissLemon said:

In my old neighborhood in the suburbs of Chicago, no, people did not chat at the playground. I loved everything about that neighborhood except how unfriendly people were.  

It's rare here too. 

[Kassia]

49 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

 

I had the opposite experience with Minneapolis -- everyone was super polite but no one would help me out if I needed it. Like, literally, my grocery bag broke in the elevator while I had a toddler in a carrier on my back, but no one helped me bring the items I was tediously bringing out one by one out of the elevator. I was being all flustered and saying "I'm really sorry! I'll be out really quick!" and people just stood around. 

 

That is unbelievable.  I mean, that shouldn't be a regional thing...it should just be a human instinct to help someone in that situation.  😞 

[Not_a_Number]

Just now, Kassia said:

That is unbelievable.  I mean, that shouldn't be a regional thing...it should just be a human instinct to help someone in that situation.  😞 

Maybe they were just annoyed we lived in the building, lol. I have no idea. They might have been grumpy that we were temporary people with a baby. 

But it was really consistent with how things were in general, so I do think it had something to do with the "large bubble" people seemed to have in that region. 

(I have to admit, I did think it was really annoying. For one thing, even after I got out of the elevator, I had to get all of my darn groceries to my door all the way down the hallway.) 

[Not_a_Number]

13 minutes ago, MissLemon said:

In my old neighborhood in the suburbs of Chicago, no, people did not chat at the playground. I loved everything about that neighborhood except how unfriendly people were.  

Ooh. Interesting. DH went to grad school in Chicago and his sister lives there now (well, when she isn't around here because of COVID.) I wonder what they'd say about that? 

I've chatted to people at playgrounds in California and NY and Boston and Austin. I had the easiest time actually getting to know people in Boston and California, I think, although NY isn't bad. In Austin, people didn't think it was weird but didn't necessarily want to get to know me well. In Boston, I got invited for outings right after meeting people, lol. 

Oh, where we lived in Southern California, people were friendly but they were all nannies 😛 . That was its own kind of weird. 

[marbel]

I didn't find people chatted much in playgrounds when my kids were young, but part of that may have been the demographic. I had my kids late - I was 41 and 43 when they were born - so young moms probably assumed I was grandma and didn't want to talk to me.  

But I think that's another sad thing - most people really don't want to get out of their own age group when it comes to friendships. When my kids were little, my friends were the moms of kids their ages (I had met them at church or playgroups so there was a link, not randomly as at a playground), so I was ~8-15 years older than everyone else, but it didn't really matter because we were all in the thick of motherhood together.  But since moving away from there, I have found it's rare to have a wide age spread in a friend group. 

[SKL]

4 minutes ago, marbel said:

I didn't find people chatted much in playgrounds when my kids were young, but part of that may have been the demographic. I had my kids late - I was 41 and 43 when they were born - so young moms probably assumed I was grandma and didn't want to talk to me.  

But I think that's another sad thing - most people really don't want to get out of their own age group when it comes to friendships. When my kids were little, my friends were the moms of kids their ages (I had met them at church or playgroups so there was a link, not randomly as at a playground), so I was ~8-15 years older than everyone else, but it didn't really matter because we were all in the thick of motherhood together.  But since moving away from there, I have found it's rare to have a wide age spread in a friend group. 

As fate would have it, most of my kids' friends' moms (or guardians) are around my age.  (My kids were born when I was 40.)  Perhaps that is somehow connected to the fact that my kids went to a Lutheran school ... you have to be somewhat established financially before you can afford that.

I have had friends in a wide age range, but honestly, being a single work-at-home mom tends to limit the opportunity to make and nurture friendships, or really even think about them much.

[Shoeless]

41 minutes ago, Not_a_Number said:

Ooh. Interesting. DH went to grad school in Chicago and his sister lives there now (well, when she isn't around here because of COVID.) I wonder what they'd say about that? 

I've chatted to people at playgrounds in California and NY and Boston and Austin. I had the easiest time actually getting to know people in Boston and California, I think, although NY isn't bad. In Austin, people didn't think it was weird but didn't necessarily want to get to know me well. In Boston, I got invited for outings right after meeting people, lol. 

Oh, where we lived in Southern California, people were friendly but they were all nannies 😛 . That was its own kind of weird. 

Back when I lived and worked in the Chicago area, I was griping at a co-worker about how unfriendly my neighborhood was and I couldn't figure out what I was doing wrong. She asked exactly where I lived and then said "Oh yeah, there's a lot of Romanians there.  Forget about breaking into that clique". My friend was from Romania and traveled back often and said that everyone was rude and mean until she started speaking Romanian, and then the attitude shifted and they were nice.  Then again, if I'd lived under Ceausecu's leadership, I'd probably be pretty angry and bitter, too. 

A little south of Chicago, in Will county? Everyone was super nice.  Everyone was really nice in DuPage county, too.  

As for Austin, what you describe is similar to what I've seen here. People seem superficially friendly, but no one wants to get to know you well unless you can claim you are an Xth generation Texan and also go to their church.  You have to align perfectly for people here to really bring you into the fold.   

[Not_a_Number]

2 minutes ago, MissLemon said:

As for Austin, what you describe is similar to what I've seen here. People seem superficially friendly, but no one wants to get to know you well unless you can claim you are an Xth generation Texan and also go to their church.  You have to align perfectly for people here to really bring you into the fold.   

Austin is less set in its ways than small town Texas, I'd guess. However, it's true that the one woman who I wound up actually getting to know was of Eastern European extraction, lol. 

[Guest]

54 minutes ago, marbel said:

I didn't find people chatted much in playgrounds when my kids were young, but part of that may have been the demographic. I had my kids late - I was 41 and 43 when they were born - so young moms probably assumed I was grandma and didn't want to talk to me.  

But I think that's another sad thing - most people really don't want to get out of their own age group when it comes to friendships. When my kids were little, my friends were the moms of kids their ages (I had met them at church or playgroups so there was a link, not randomly as at a playground), so I was ~8-15 years older than everyone else, but it didn't really matter because we were all in the thick of motherhood together.  But since moving away from there, I have found it's rare to have a wide age spread in a friend group. 

I like having friends in different age groups but I havent had much opportunity over the years to set up such friendships. The majority have grown out of mom groups or homeschool communities. Typically the moms friend-up with others with kids near their kids ages, because the things they participate in suit their own kids ages. So, the mom with teens in robotics and homeschool band aren’t going to be going to GymJam with the moms of littles. And the moms with umpteen kids spanning several age groups don’t have time/bandwidth for friends. 

I do have one friend in my bunco group, which grew out of Mom’s group, who has one child, in her forties, so she is older than the rest of us. But she’s great! I don’t often think about the age discrepancy there. I do think it is harder to make mommy friends this way, though; it worked for her probably mostly because of the structure of the Mom’s group. 

[catz]

1 hour ago, Not_a_Number said:

Maybe they were just annoyed we lived in the building, lol. I have no idea. They might have been grumpy that we were temporary people with a baby. 

But it was really consistent with how things were in general, so I do think it had something to do with the "large bubble" people seemed to have in that region. 

(I have to admit, I did think it was really annoying. For one thing, even after I got out of the elevator, I had to get all of my darn groceries to my door all the way down the hallway.) 

That is weird.  That said, I could imagine something like that happening in a number of settings if the people about were childless professionals and just clueless as to how much something like that sucks. 

I don't know.  I've been treated crappy in every major city and had friendly helpful conversations in the same cities.  Ugh, I had a couple really rude interactions traveling on my own in Boston 15 months ago. I'm sorry you had a bad experience here.  I got called a stupid tourist in NYC with my teens for not getting out a cab fast enough.  But the same day, my daughter and I had a hilarious conversations about Parks and Rec with some random guy on the street.  If you were staying downtown, I don't think that is super child friendly.   That said, I regularly walk through a park just off downtown that regularly has hoards of chatting families with young kids every weekend, I actually avoid it when I don't want to be social.  LOL.  

One thing I've noticed over the years since I live in an urban neighborhood with lots of transplants is midwestern people can sometime read big city coastal curiosity as condescending and can quickly shut down if they pick up that tone.  I've actually seen that in other Midwestern cities too though.  Like we toured colleges in Chicago in February and my son and I were laughing listening to the interactions between the locals and those who flew in for the tours from warmer weather.  I also do think very small communities, buildings, blocks, etc can just have a certain vibe, like someone mentioned above in Chicago.  I really disliked the neighborhood I was in last actually and it was less than 10 miles from where we are now.  I emailed with a mom about neighborhood suggestions from a board a couple yeas ago and she landed in an area they might never leave now.  They connected with lots of people and resources immediately.  Sometimes luck just plays a part.  

[Not_a_Number]

3 minutes ago, FuzzyCatz said:

I don't know.  I've been treated crappy in every major city and had friendly helpful conversations in the same cities.  Ugh, I had a couple really rude interactions traveling on my own in Boston 15 months ago. I'm sorry you had a bad experience here.  I got called a stupid tourist in NYC with my teens for not getting out a cab fast enough.  But the same day, my daughter and I had a hilarious conversations about Parks and Rec with some random guy on the street.  If you were staying downtown, I don't think that is super child friendly.   That said, I regularly walk through a park just off downtown that regularly has hoards of chatting families with young kids every weekend, I actually avoid it when I don't want to be social.  LOL.  

Oh, I've had PLENTY of rude interactions in Boston and NYC 😛 . I'm not going to pretend people are polite in the Northeast. However, they do seem to be much more willing to engage with strangers. 

This pattern repeated itself basically everywhere I went -- people wanted to keep themselves to themselves. Like, it was clearly weird to smile to people and make eye contact unless you knew them. It's not like people were mostly jerks or impolite. They just... minded their own business and they read what I thought of as "friendly interactions" as someone being off or someone hitting on them (like @kbutton said.) 

It's possible there's a way to engage with people in public that they don't find alarming, and I just didn't hit the right notes for that. But I know that the usual things I did that worked in other places I've lived didn't work. 

I don't think it's easy to see the culture of the place you're from from the outside 🙂 . I've spent enough time listening to Russian people complain about Americans that I have the advantage of many possible vantage points (this is partially why I found that "are you in a bubble?" quiz so ironic.) So I mostly found our experience curious and culturally interesting. But it was VERY distinctive. 

[Shoeless]

It really is interesting how much "friendliness" can vary by area, right down to neighborhood. 

@Not_a_NumberI'm dying to know what Russian's say about Americans.  I had some Russian friends when I lived in Alabama, and I honestly can't say I understood what made them tick, lol. But they kept inviting me to gatherings so I kept showing up, lol. 

[Not_a_Number]

46 minutes ago, MissLemon said:

It really is interesting how much "friendliness" can vary by area, right down to neighborhood. 

@Not_a_NumberI'm dying to know what Russian's say about Americans.  I had some Russian friends when I lived in Alabama, and I honestly can't say I understood what made them tick, lol. But they kept inviting me to gatherings so I kept showing up, lol. 

Well, they complain about how all the smiling is fake and friendships are too surface-level, for one thing! That's a very standard Russian complaint. 

Last I checked, the men also thought that American men were absurdly unchivalrous, lol. But I don't know if that goes for all Russian men or not. 

Hmmmm, there are lots more things, but they are kind of... disjointed? It's going to be hard for me to make them add up into a cultural outlook, even though it feels like one in my head. 

[mom2scouts]

3 hours ago, SKL said:

As soon as my kids were big enough to play without a close-at-hand adult, I would take a walk around the perimeter or paths.  I was always so busy and on-task between work and family and house, I really needed that time to myself.  (Not to mention, it was often my only chance to do any exercise.)  I assume this is true of other moms too.  To be honest, I don't think it crossed my mind that the other moms at the playground might be in need of interaction.  The last thing I was in need of was more interaction.  😛

When I had my first baby, my dh had a long commute to work and was gone many hours. I didn't live close to family and didn't know many people in my town. I'd put the baby in the stroller and walk all over and later go to the playground desperately hoping to encounter another adult who would talk to me. I'm an introvert, but I still remember how lonely I was for adult interaction.

[Not_a_Number]

33 minutes ago, mom2scouts said:

When I had my first baby, my dh had a long commute to work and was gone many hours. I didn't live close to family and didn't know many people in my town. I'd put the baby in the stroller and walk all over and later go to the playground desperately hoping to encounter another adult who would talk to me. I'm an introvert, but I still remember how lonely I was for adult interaction.

Yeah, I'm also an introvert, but when we were in a city where I knew literally no one, I wanted to talk to people. Even in places we've lived, before the kids went to preschool, I simply didn't have enough social time to satisfy even my limited needs. (When the kids went to preschool, it became easy to make acquaintances and even friends. But that didn't happen until DD8 was 3.) 

[GoodGrief3]

19 hours ago, marbel said:

*in my experience, a high percentage Philly natives I've encountered have zero curiosity about other places and can't imagine living elsewhere, except maybe Florida. 

That has been my consistent experience with people from Chicago. Not necessarily the lack of curiosity about other places, but certainly the confidence that Chicago is the best place to be. And actually that is something I see in a lot of Minnesotans too, though they do it with more humility 🙂 

[Tanaqui]

Clearly, the folks in Philly and Chicago and I guess Minnesota are mistaken, probably because they don't get out much. They may think they're in the center of the world, but in NYC, we *know* we are - and we don't think about it very much!

[SKL]

LOL I guess I should be glad to live in the place that called itself "the mistake by the lake" and "the armpit of the nation" when I was growing up.  I've never heard anyone imply this is "the" place to live.

But honestly, it's not a bad place.  It has down-to-earth people, four seasons, arts, sports, higher education, world-class hospitals, reasonable traffic, and is pleasantly diverse in terms of culture and politics.  I am not saying it's the best, but it doesn't need the sympathy it often gets from other cities.  😛

 

[Kassia]

57 minutes ago, SKL said:

LOL I guess I should be glad to live in the place that called itself "the mistake by the lake" and "the armpit of the nation" when I was growing up.  I've never heard anyone imply this is "the" place to live.

But honestly, it's not a bad place.  It has down-to-earth people, four seasons, arts, sports, higher education, world-class hospitals, reasonable traffic, and is pleasantly diverse in terms of culture and politics.  I am not saying it's the best, but it doesn't need the sympathy it often gets from other cities.  😛

 

I live in the same area (moved up here for college, met DH, and never left).  It's an amazing place to live and I find people are generally nice.  

But four seasons???  Feels like winter, winter, winter, and a short summer.  😛

 

[Not_a_Number]

3 hours ago, Kassia said:

But four seasons???  Feels like winter, winter, winter, and a short summer.  😛

 

In my opinion, seasons are overrated. Give me California weather any day.

[Kassia]

2 hours ago, Not_a_Number said:

In my opinion, seasons are overrated. Give me California weather any day.

 

I grew up in S. FL where it was summer, summer, and summer lite all year.  I loved the change of seasons up here at first, but now I'm so over winter (we live in the snowbelt) and want to move.  I wouldn't want the heat and bugs all year round like in FL again though either.  Or the threat of hurricanes.

[ktgrok]

On 2/4/2021 at 8:29 PM, Joker2 said:

I’m with others that watch yourself would bother me. I wouldn’t react the way that person did though. I always say, “Excuse me” even if it’s someone else who is in the way.

yes

On 2/4/2021 at 6:56 PM, Pawz4me said:

Treading carefully here (and I did check to make sure it isn't a JAWM post) --

I think "watch yourself" is pretty darn aggressive phrasing. If someone said that to me under that scenario I wouldn't have been rude, and I would definitely have said a very sincere "Sorry!" But internally the "watch yourself" wording would have made me PO'd and I would have labeled you as very rude and would have probably gone several rows over to avoid encountering you again.

Same

On 2/4/2021 at 7:06 PM, prairiewindmomma said:

Other regional quirks:

1. Do you greet the checkout clerk?

2. Do you thank the checkout clerk when they hand you your receipt?

3. Are you obligated to empty the cart of trash even if you didn't put it there before returning it to the corral? ie--you inherited a cart with receipt tucked into the frame at the bottom--what do you do?

4. Do you ever aid someone else who is trying to pick out produce?

5. Do you feel guilty for not letting someone with 1-2 items behind you go ahead of you in line when you have a full cart? 

6. Do you make eye contact with strangers in the aisle and smile?

7. Do you small talk with people in line (strangers)?

 

Yes to all of the above. (and I pretty much always let the person with 1-2 items go ahead of me, unless I've got a crying baby with me). But I also almost let someone pass me in a race once because they seemed to really want to. so..there ya go, lol

[mom2scouts]

9 hours ago, Kassia said:

I live in the same area (moved up here for college, met DH, and never left).  It's an amazing place to live and I find people are generally nice.  

But four seasons???  Feels like winter, winter, winter, and a short summer.  😛

 

No no, it's short summer, almost winter, winter, and still winter.😂

[1234]

We lived in California a few years and then spent a decade in Florida. We missed the seasons a lot so moved to the Midwest about five years ago. We’re not tired of it yet and are actually thinking of moving toward Philly/NY in the next three years (we’re not exactly sure where yet but apparently we enjoy moving). 

The only place I’ve lived that I’ve thought pretty much everyone was rude was Iowa. I’m sure it was just our area and not the whole state but we only lasted a year and had to leave.