What does your young adult do in the area of chores

[Scarlett]

5 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

Gently... When you are at the point where you are upset about a soup bowl being left in the kitchen sink, the problem is bigger than household chore distribution.

It seems like you are keeping score of every little thing, and that’s not healthy for any of you.

I am not upset by the soup bowl. It is a cumulative situation.  

[Scarlett]

4 minutes ago, fairfarmhand said:

So much of this is just how you ask it. For my dd18, I’d simply pop in her room and say “oh I see you forgot to put your soup bowl in the dishwasher. Please take care of that before you go to bed. Thanks sweetie!” 
 

it would be a reminder that “you’re an adult! Don’t create work for other people if you an help it!”

some may say “how long does it take to put a stupid bowl in the dishwasher? Why not do it yourself?” Which is a valid point that I do get. But those things pile up in my head and I get resentful, so it’s better to ask my kids to do thier part than for me to explode or stew in resentment. 

Right if I had seen it last night I would have asked him to put it in the dishwasher.  I saw it at 6 am but I didn’t want to wake him over it.  

[Scarlett]

3 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

Yes, and if all three of them were in the kitchen when the dss left his bowl in the sink, a friendly reminder to rinse it and put it in the dishwasher would have been an easy solution... and then it should be forgotten, not remembered as another little reason for resentment toward the kid.

I didn’t see it last night.  And Cat no many how many times you say it I do not have some deep seated resentment toward dss and I do not ‘keep track’ of all his faults.  But it does add up.  All I really want is my house to be neat and clean.  

[fairfarmhand]

1 minute ago, Scarlett said:

I am not upset by the soup bowl. It is a cumulative situation.  

That’s what I figured. It would be so hard to not be frustrated when 1. Finances dictate I must work more than I want. 2. I’d rather BE HOME doing the housework myself the way I want it done 3. I’m tired and my house, which I love and want to enjoy, is messy and dirty. 4. One adult in the house doesn’t care (it’s not personal but still irritating)
 

so yes, time to readjust chore expectations and I’d  have to remind myself that 1-3 aren’t all that one persons fault.

[Scarlett]

Just now, fairfarmhand said:

That’s what I figured. It would be so hard to not be frustrated when 1. Finances dictate I must work more than I want. 2. I’d rather BE HOME doing the housework myself the way I want it done 3. I’m tired and my house, which I love and want to enjoy, is messy and dirty. 4. One adult in the house doesn’t care (it’s not personal but still irritating)
 

so yes, time to readjust chore expectations and I’d  have to remind myself that 1-3 aren’t all that one persons fault.

Yes, true.  

[alisoncooks]

40 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

A list like this would overwhelm you? That seems weird to me.  Especially when you say you are the organized one in your family.

Yes, but I don't have lists of chores I must do daily. Laundry is done as needed. I dust and vacuum on the weekend. Kitchen and dishes are cleaned as they are dirtied. I'm sure we just approach it differently.

And maybe you haven’t been following along but he already has been given the responsibility of cleaning the bathroom He uses once a week.  He does not do it less reminded.  
I'd clean it myself and send him a bill. He'll either take over cleaning or decide that it's not worth his time. (And if it's not worth your time, bring someone in to do it and he can pay.)

You think we should not do chores we care about?  The one I would give up is planning meals, buying food and picking it up and cooking most meals.  I do that for the two men in my house.  Not for me.  

I don't see porch plants as a household chore. They seem more as a personal hobby, which is the responsibility of the hobby-holder. Maybe I'm wrong. I have one plant; I water it. 

Responded in quote. 

Edited September 23, 2020 by alisoncooks

[Catwoman]

1 minute ago, Scarlett said:

I am not upset by the soup bowl. It is a cumulative situation.  

But that’s part of the problem. You ARE keeping score or else you wouldn’t have even thought to mention the soup bowl. If you are at the point where a soup bowl is something you notice, that’s a sign that there is a real problem here.

 

 

Just now, Scarlett said:

Right if I had seen it last night I would have asked him to put it in the dishwasher.  I saw it at 6 am but I didn’t want to wake him over it.  

Who would ever even think to wake a kid to tell him he forgot to put his soup bowl in the dishwasher? The idea that this even occurred to you is kind of disturbing.

 

1 minute ago, Scarlett said:

I didn’t see it last night.  And Cat no many how many times you say it I do not have some deep seated resentment toward dss and I do not ‘keep track’ of all his faults.  But it does add up.  All I really want is my house to be neat and clean.  

You’re keeping track of soup bowls, Scarlett. And you seem to find fault with almost everything your dss does. You don’t even seem to realize that you do it, but you do, at least when you post about him here on the forum.

I can understand wanting your house to be neat and clean, and I can also understand that you want your dss to pitch in and help, but he’s your son, not an employee, and you seem to be judging him awfully harshly. You are even resentful of the way the kid spends his free time. Is your dh as angry with him as you are?

The three of you really need to sit down and get on the same page with all of this before you finally lose your patience. If you need your dss to help out more around the house in order to not be upset so often, your dh needs to either back you up or take over those responsibilities himself so you don’t have to do the extra work. 

I don’t like seeing you so upset over this — and this isn’t a new thing, so of course you are noticing more and more little annoyances, and of course they seem bigger than they are because it’s cumulative. But you need to stop keeping score and have a family discussion about all of this before you end up blowing your top and saying things you will regret later. 

[*Jessica*]

I don’t think your list for today is unreasonable at all for an adult who lives in your home rent free.  I do think a conversation about division of labor amongst the 3 of you is in order, though. 

[Catwoman]

20 minutes ago, fairfarmhand said:

That’s what I figured. It would be so hard to not be frustrated when 1. Finances dictate I must work more than I want. 2. I’d rather BE HOME doing the housework myself the way I want it done 3. I’m tired and my house, which I love and want to enjoy, is messy and dirty. 4. One adult in the house doesn’t care (it’s not personal but still irritating)
 

so yes, time to readjust chore expectations and I’d  have to remind myself that 1-3 aren’t all that one persons fault.

This is so true. 

Also, with everyone working full time or almost full time hours, maybe it’s time to relax the standards a little bit. Maybe the house doesn’t have to be quite as spotless as usual, and some of the chores can wait for a day when everyone can pitch in together to do them — more like a teamwork approach than a “here’s your list” approach. 

Also, though, with everyone working more than ever and no little kids in the house, there is also less opportunity for the house to get messy, so it probably still looks pretty good. If a few extra days pass between dusting or sweeping or vacuuming, it might not make a noticeable difference, and it could free up more of Scarlett’s time so she would feel like she had some time to herself to do things she likes, instead of feeling like she is going from one full time job outside the house to a second full time job at home.

She shouldn’t have to feel that she has no time for herself.

Edited September 23, 2020 by Catwoman
Stupid typo

[Scarlett]

1 minute ago, Catwoman said:

But that’s part of the problem. You ARE keeping score or else you wouldn’t have even thought to mention the soup bowl. If you are at the point where a soup bowl is something you notice, that’s a sign that there is a real problem here.

 

 

Who would ever even think to wake a kid to tell him he forgot to put his soup bowl in the dishwasher? The idea that this even occurred to you is kind of disturbing.

 

You’re keeping track of soup bowls, Scarlett. And you seem to find fault with almost everything your dss does. You don’t even seem to realize that you do it, but you do, at least when you post about him here on the forum.

I can understand wanting your house to be neat and clean, and I can also understand that you want your dss to pitch in and help, but he’s your son, not an employee, and you seem to be judging him awfully harshly. You are even resentful of the way the kid spends his free time. Is your dh as angry with him as you are?

The three of you really need to sit down and get on the same page with all of this before you finally lose your patience. If you need your dss to help out more around the house in order to not be upset so often, your dh needs to either back you up or take over those responsibilities himself so you don’t have to do the extra work. 

I don’t like seeing you so upset over this — and this isn’t a new thing, so of course you are noticing more and more little annoyances, and of course they seem bigger than they are because it’s cumulative. But you need to stop keeping score and have a family discussion about all of this before you end up blowing your top and saying things you will regret later. 

This thread was a request For how others do it. That helps me.  I can see that other moms are bothered by this stuff and that dss’ behavior is pretty normal. I agree a discussion of division of labor is in order. That is what this thread is about.... and the soup bowl came to my mind because Someone  asked me if he cleans up after himself in the kitchen and my mind went to the most recent situation. 

You think I am the only person to ever think of waking a kid up to do a chore he failed to do? Smh. Cat you and I do not see this kind if stuff the same clearly. And you do not have an accurate view of my feelings toward or my relationship with dss.  I don’t complain about everything he does. I post when I am frazzled and need help so that I don’t express my anger toward him. 

[Scarlett]

2 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

This is so true. 

Also, with everyone working full time or almost full time hours, maybe it’s time to relax the standards a little bit. Maybe the house doesn’t have to be quite as spotless as usual, and some of the chores can wait for a day when everyone can pitch in together to do them — more like a teamwork approach than a “here’s your list” approach. 

Also, though, with everyone working more than ever and no little kids in the house, there is also less opportunity for the house to get messy, so it probably still looks pretty good. If a few extra days pass between dusting or sweeping or vacuuming, it might not make a noticeable difference, and it could free up more of Scarlett’s time so she would feel like she had some time to herself to do things she likes, instead of feeling like she is going from one full time job outside the house to a second full time job at home.

She shouldn’t have to feel that she has no time for herself.

Last night dh and I  were discussing the list of weekly chores.  We came up with sweeping/vacuuming twice a week and mopping once. And we both agree that it needs it more than that but that we would except that since everyone is working so much.

[fairfarmhand]

Just now, Scarlett said:

This thread was a request For how others do it. That helps me.  I can see that other moms are bothered by this stuff and that dss’ behavior is pretty normal. I agree a discussion of division of labor is in order. That is what this thread is about.... and the soup bowl came to my mind because Someone  asked me if he cleans up after himself in the kitchen and my mind went to the most recent situation. 

You think I am the only person to ever think of waking a kid up to do a chore he failed to do? Smh. Cat you and I do not see this kind if stuff the same clearly. And you do not have an accurate view of my feelings toward or my relationship with dss.  I don’t complain about everything he does. I post when I am frazzled and need help so that I don’t express my anger toward him. 

I have thought of it. But like you, I didn't do it. We all have goofy thoughts when we're tired and frazzled and everything that everyone does is annoying. The important thing is to catch ourselves before we take out our frustrations on those around us, which, I think you're doing. And your thread was a cry for help on "Are my expectations reasonable for a young adult?" But yes, it's clear your family is struggling for now and I know you guys will get through this. I know I get excessively mentally nitpicky with my people when I'm under stress, especially about my house, which I am similarly particular about. Doesn't mean my people ever know that, because I tend to keep it in my head, but the resentment is real and frustrating.

[Catwoman]

6 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

This thread was a request For how others do it. That helps me.  I can see that other moms are bothered by this stuff and that dss’ behavior is pretty normal. I agree a discussion of division of labor is in order. That is what this thread is about.... and the soup bowl came to my mind because Someone  asked me if he cleans up after himself in the kitchen and my mind went to the most recent situation. 

[b]You think I am the only person to ever think of waking a kid up to do a chore he failed to do? Smh[/b]. Cat you and I do not see this kind if stuff the same clearly. And you do not have an accurate view of my feelings toward or my relationship with dss.  I don’t complain about everything he does. I post when I am frazzled and need help so that I don’t express my anger toward him. 

Well, you’re certainly the only person I know who would ever consider doing such a thing. It seems so petty, mean, and unnecessary. It was a SOUP BOWL. I know you didn’t actually do it, but who would even think to wake up a kid to have him move his soup bowl from the sink to the dishwasher? And even if it was a more important chore, I would never wake someone up at 6am to do it. I wouldn’t want someone to do that to me, and I would give that same respect to anyone else.

Edited September 23, 2020 by Catwoman

[Catwoman]

1 minute ago, Scarlett said:

Last night dh and I  were discussing the list of weekly chores.  We came up with sweeping/vacuuming twice a week and mopping once. And we both agree that it needs it more than that but that we would except that since everyone is working so much.

That seems like a good start! Hopefully, you will be able to find other things you can cut back on, as well. Even a little time saved here and there will add up!

[fairfarmhand]

Just now, Catwoman said:

Well, you’re certainly the only person I know who would ever consider doing such a thing. It seems so petty, mean, and unnecessary. It was a SOUP BOWL. Who would even think to wake up a kid to have him move his soup bowl from the sink to the dishwasher? And even if it was a more important chore, I would never wake someone up at 6am to do it. I wouldn’t want someone to do that to me, and I would give that same respect to anyone else.

Lots of us have mean thoughts all the time. 🙂 I know I do. But I never follow through on them. I'm deep down a pretty nasty person, if you took me by my thoughts and impulses when I'm stressed out. Thankfully I don't act them out. 

[TechWife]

Our situation is a little different. Although he lives with us, my 23 yo ds has his own apartment within our house. He is responsible for keeping it up. He does his own laundry. He has a shop in our garage he is responsible to keep clean. I'd like it to be cleaner, but it is  his equipment, not mine, so I leave it to him. He does okay, not perfect. I don't worry about it. He eats dinner with us nightly and after dinner he puts his dishes in the sink or dishwasher.

[mumto2]

My young adults have been vacuuming the house daily since Covid to reduce allergies........one takes care of the ceramic tile areas.  Dd spends 10 minutes wandering around dusting.  Ds takes care of maintaining our bikes.  Both help on other tasks as needed.

[Catwoman]

9 minutes ago, fairfarmhand said:

Lots of us have mean thoughts all the time. 🙂 I know I do. But I never follow through on them. I'm deep down a pretty nasty person, if you took me by my thoughts and impulses when I'm stressed out. Thankfully I don't act them out. 

LOL! You seem pretty nice to me! 

I keep thinking that the kid isn’t too bad, because at least he brought the soup bowl from the table to the kitchen sink. It’s not like Scarlett found the soup bowl sitting on the kid’s nightstand and it was all moldy and furry and gross. 🤮 Yeah, he didn’t put it in the dishwasher, but he probably felt like he was being helpful by putting it in the sink. 

It seems like there is a lot of miscommunication going on, and I do think they need to talk about it as a family. There are only three people living in that house, so it shouldn’t be that difficult to get on the same page. Also, I’m not sure how large the house is, but I’m having a hard time imagining how there is so much housework and yard work that Scarlett and her dh seem to have to spend all of their free time doing chores.

Edited September 23, 2020 by Catwoman
I can’t type!

[Loowit]

I don't know if this will help or not, but I have put together a spreadsheet (sharable on google drive) with a  tab for each day, plus a bonus tab for chores that earn rewards.  Each of us, me and DH included, have column that lists daily tasks we have to complete.  I can add on bonus things if there is a one time thing that needs to be done, but for the most part we have a weekly routine, including one day a week that each of us has off from chores.

[Scarlett]

8 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

LOL! You seem pretty nice to me! 

I keep thinking that the kid isn’t too bad, because at least he brought the soup bowl from the table to the kitchen sink. It’s not like Scarlett found the soup bowl sitting on the kid’s nightstand and it was all moldy and furry and gross. 🤮 Yeah, he didn’t put it in the dishwasher, but he probably felt like he was being helpful by putting it in the sink. 

 

This happen maybe 2 months ago. All of this I found in his room. 

[Catwoman]

1 minute ago, Scarlett said:

This happen maybe 2 months ago. All of this I found in his room. 

 

And you took a picture of it and saved it??? 

[Scarlett]

3 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

 

And you took a picture of it and saved it??? 

I took a picture of it and sent it to him. I said in a text this is unacceptable. And no I did not save it but when you were talking about the moldy bowl it reminded me of it and I looked in my text to him and it was still there. Why do you pick on me about things like that?

I was responding to you saying at least I did not find it on his nightstand with mold in it. I wanted you to understand that situation has happened also. It’s not like I showed it to all of his friends or put it on Facebook. I took a picture and sent it to him and his dad in a group text so that I would not speak angrily to him about it in person. He was not home when I found it

[Tanaqui]

Quote

Inappropriate to ask someone who is home while I am at work to put a load of clothes from the washer to the dryer?  Why? Rarely do ask that of him but it helps me get okay.  And I would do it for him if he asked. I don’t get why you think that is inappropriate. 

Because it's your laundry, and you are capable of doing your own laundry.

It's reasonable to ask him to take a share of the household chores. It's reasonable to ask him to clean up after himself. It even would be reasonable to ask him to do your laundry if you really couldn't for some reason.

It's not reasonable to ask him to take care of your personal chores, and it's especially not reasonable to spring it on him at the last minute - this isn't like you discussed it and he agreed to handle all the laundry and so now you're letting him know you have a load in, or even like you said "Hey, Stepson, I'm going to be out late tomorrow and I don't think I can get my clothes done - mind moving them to the dryer for me?" You just sent him this list, including your personal hygiene tasks, with no warning.

[Tanaqui]

10 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

This happen maybe 2 months ago. All of this I found in his room. 

 

I routinely bring up more dishes than this from my mother's room and her office space at the end of every workday, and I admit, it seems like I spent an hour a week reminding the kids to either hand me their dishes or bring them to the sink themselves.

I know it's annoying, god do I ever, but you seem to think it's amazingly bad and... it's really not? It's a little bad.

Quote

So how would you handle a 19 year old who did nothing unless asked?

I already answered this, but to recap, I would not talk about the weekly chores with only one of the two other adults in the household and then write out a list for the third adult to do. I'd arrange a time that was mutually agreeable to all adults, and we'd all sit together and talk about it and divvy it up like adults.

Because he *is* an adult. He's not a little child who has to be managed, and he's not your housekeeper either. If you want him to start acting like an adult with equal share in the household then you really need to stop treating him like he isn't.

And that means you start by talking about the chores with him. Not assigning them - talking about them, and finding some equitable way to share the work that makes everybody satisfied.

[Catwoman]

13 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I took a picture of it and sent it to him. I said in a text this is unacceptable. And no I did not save it but when you were talking about the moldy bowl it reminded me of it and I looked in my text to him and it was still there. Why do you pick on me about things like that?

I was responding to you saying at least I did not find it on his nightstand with mold in it. I wanted you to understand that situation has happened also. It’s not like I showed it to all of his friends or put it on Facebook. I took a picture and sent it to him and his dad in a group text so that I would not speak angrily to him about it in person. He was not home when I found it

Holy Over-the-Top, Batman!

You actually took a picture of a few dishes and sent them to both him and your dh??? Seriously??? You were so angry that you couldn’t let it go without sending a group text with a photo of the heinous offense? And really, that was enough to make you concerned that you might get angry with him in person so you had to send the text instead? Sure, I can see being a little annoyed about it, but taking a picture and using it to shame the kid and rat him out to his father was way over the top. What did you expect your dh to do about it? Did you think he would get angry with his son because he left a few dishes in his room? I can’t figure out your motivation at all. 

You’re not just keeping score; you’re collecting evidence and presenting your case against the kid!

Not for anything, Scarlett, but your reaction to very minor offenses is pretty extreme. 

In all seriousness, have you considered family counseling? Because it seems like you guys might need it. 

[Catwoman]

20 minutes ago, Tanaqui said:

Because it's your laundry, and you are capable of doing your own laundry.

It's reasonable to ask him to take a share of the household chores. It's reasonable to ask him to clean up after himself. It even would be reasonable to ask him to do your laundry if you really couldn't for some reason.

It's not reasonable to ask him to take care of your personal chores, and it's especially not reasonable to spring it on him at the last minute - this isn't like you discussed it and he agreed to handle all the laundry and so now you're letting him know you have a load in, or even like you said "Hey, Stepson, I'm going to be out late tomorrow and I don't think I can get my clothes done - mind moving them to the dryer for me?" You just sent him this list, including your personal hygiene tasks, with no warning.

 

12 minutes ago, Tanaqui said:

 

I routinely bring up more dishes than this from my mother's room and her office space at the end of every workday, and I admit, it seems like I spent an hour a week reminding the kids to either hand me their dishes or bring them to the sink themselves.

I know it's annoying, god do I ever, but you seem to think it's amazingly bad and... it's really not? It's a little bad.

I already answered this, but to recap, I would not talk about the weekly chores with only one of the two other adults in the household and then write out a list for the third adult to do. I'd arrange a time that was mutually agreeable to all adults, and we'd all sit together and talk about it and divvy it up like adults.

Because he *is* an adult. He's not a little child who has to be managed, and he's not your housekeeper either. If you want him to start acting like an adult with equal share in the household then you really need to stop treating him like he isn't.

And that means you start by talking about the chores with him. Not assigning them - talking about them, and finding some equitable way to share the work that makes everybody satisfied.

 

I agree completely, and you said it much better than I did!  🙂 

[Tanaqui]

4 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

I agree completely, and you said it much better than I did!  🙂 

 

Aw, thanks, I do try. Actually, looking around my room I see I have a couple plates in here I have to bring down to the sink myself! Somehow, dishes stuck in my room never bother me as much as dishes stuck in everybody else's room. I wonder why that is....

But I had better bring these plates down now so none of the kids can get annoyed at me next time I go on a dish hunt. It's so frustrating to be accused of hypocrisy, especially when it's true.

[DawnM]

6 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

Holy Over-the-Top, Batman!

You actually took a picture of a few dishes and sent them to both him and your dh??? Seriously??? You were so angry that you couldn’t let it go without sending a group text with a photo of the heinous offense? And really, that was enough to make you concerned that you might get angry with him in person so you had to send the text instead? Sure, I can see being a little annoyed about it, but taking a picture and using it to shame the kid and rat him out to his father was way over the top. What did you expect your dh to do about it? Did you think he would get angry with his son because he left a few dishes in his room? I can’t figure out your motivation at all. 

You’re not just keeping score; you’re collecting evidence and presenting your case against the kid!

Not for anything, Scarlett, but your reaction to very minor offenses is pretty extreme. 

In all seriousness, have you considered family counseling? Because it seems like you guys might need it. 

 

I have to agree with you on this one.   Our house is often messier than this and my 22 year old routinely keeps dishes up in his room.   

This is the same step son you were mad at for drinking $2 worth of milk and eating $5 worth of steak, right?  

[Selkie]

17 minutes ago, Tanaqui said:

I know it's annoying, god do I ever, but you seem to think it's amazingly bad and... it's really not? It's a little bad.

Dh and I just had a conversation about this a couple days ago. We were talking about how annoying it is that our cereal bowls and spoons and Yeti cups have mysteriously dwindled in the months that all three kids have been home - and we know there is a pile of them somewhere in the kids' rooms, or maybe in their cars.🙂 They all claim to know nothing about the whereabouts of these items, but they are good kids overall and I'm not going to get too worked up about something so minor.

[Scarlett]

I really wish those of you who already have such a poor opinion of me and my relationship with my stepson would stop posting to me. It’s not helpful. 
if you don’t mind dishes being left in bedrooms great. But I do. And my feelings are just as important as everyone else’s.

Thank you to those of you who have been kind to me and giving me constructive suggestions and also helped me to see I am not alone in this situation.

 

[theelfqueen]

We dont allow food or drink in bedrooms, including ours - so we don't have dishes in bedroom issues ... I still find crap in my 19 year olds room all the time. Candy wrappers and soda bottles and who knows what and it does bother me and we do argue about it. I feel it is disrespectful of us to ignore the rules that have always existed in the home.  And he leaves his shoes all over not in the shoe cubby where the rest of us keep our shoes which makes me crazy. And he leaves jackets and bags on chairs which we have never done... And his laundry piles up like crazy.

And I have woken him up when he left the front door locked coming in late at night.

So yeah, this is an issue in my house. My older son didn't really ever live at home after 18 and my 19 year old's habits make it very hard for me to live harmoniously with him. 

I've found short term solutions but they don't stick... it's better for a week then falls away and I am annoyed again. 

[Jentrovert]

My thoughts are all over the place on this.

I think you guys have wildly different ideas about what constitues an acceptabe level of clean and tidy. It is your house (and dh's) so you get to set the rules. However, assuming you don't want to drive him out and into a perhaps less favorable situation overall, it will need to be negotiated and compromised a bit. 

How about you choose the 2 things that are most important to you, insist those must be done, and decide to accept whatever is done on his own on the rest? Like, maybe leaving dishes out anywhere is your hill to die on. Make it clear that this is the case, and let him focus most of his "household chores" energy on those couple of things.

I do think it is a bit much to text that list. It would be better to have a set, previously agreed upon list, and then offer to help him set up reminders himself.

Since he's an adult, it's basically to me like he is a renter and you're just choosing not to have him pay rent. You wouldn't expect a renter to spend time helping you mow. You wouldn't text a renter a random list of household things to do daily. You *would* expect them to confine their stuff to their room and bath, and leave the common areas as they found them. You might, depending on agreement, have a previously discussed additional weekly chore or something. 

I will say, too, that I completely understand the irritation when you (and dh) are working hard on weekends and it seems like he's just doing nothing. I have finally realized, though, that the fact that someone seems to have a different work ethic than me doesn't necessarily mean it's a character flaw. People have different priorities. You chose to own a home instead of renting, for example. So you chose the home maintenance. He's choosing to rent a room. At this time in his life, he prefers the free time to the maintenance. Not saying he should never help out, obviously that would be a kind thing to do. Just saying I don't see that he's obligated, unless it's an agreed upon condition of his rent.

Maybe it would make more sense for him to pay rent (reduced if you like) and have an actual in writing agreement on what's required. Or, maybe he has a base rent and penalties if the agreed upon things aren't done?

At minimum, it sounds like there needs to be a family meeting to agree on requirements, and then post that in writing.

[Tanaqui]

Quote

if you don’t mind dishes being left in bedrooms great. But I do. And my feelings are just as important as everyone else’s.

Nobody has said your feelings aren't important.

But I want you to seriously think about this. You dislike the dishes being in his room. Got it, nobody likes that. You took a picture of it and showed not just him, but his dad. You never deleted the picture off your phone... and you remembered the picture was there six months later, so you chose to post it, airing your dirty dishes for the world to see.

Is there no step in this chain of events that seems a bit excessive to you? At no point did you stop and consider "Maybe this is a bit much" or say "Well, some people's kids are on drugs, and mine is a little untidy, I guess it could be worse"?

Your feelings are important. Would you like it if somebody posted a picture of your messy room on the internet, and talked about you this way? As recent posts have shown, none of us here is *that* anonymous - which means our kids and stepkids aren't either. Did you consider your stepson's feelings?

[DawnM]

1 hour ago, Scarlett said:

I really wish those of you who already have such a poor opinion of me and my relationship with my stepson would stop posting to me. It’s not helpful. 
if you don’t mind dishes being left in bedrooms great. But I do. And my feelings are just as important as everyone else’s.

Thank you to those of you who have been kind to me and giving me constructive suggestions and also helped me to see I am not alone in this situation.

 

 

I don't think it is about a poor opinion or attacking, but it seems you post the issue as being the dishes, or not having a job, or food, or whatever, and many of us are saying that we don't think those things are the actual issue.   

[Scarlett]

2 minutes ago, Tanaqui said:

Nobody has said your feelings aren't important.

But I want you to seriously think about this. You dislike the dishes being in his room. Got it, nobody likes that. You took a picture of it and showed not just him, but his dad. You never deleted the picture off your phone... and you remembered the picture was there six months later, so you chose to post it, airing your dirty dishes for the world to see.

Is there no step in this chain of events that seems a bit excessive to you? At no point did you stop and consider "Maybe this is a bit much" or say "Well, some people's kids are on drugs, and mine is a little untidy, I guess it could be worse"?

Your feelings are important. Would you like it if somebody posted a picture of your messy room on the internet, and talked about you this way? As recent posts have shown, none of us here is *that* anonymous - which means our kids and stepkids aren't either. Did you consider your stepson's feelings?

As for posting in this thread I do consider it safe enough here to ask for help. And if someone e were mean enough to track down my dss and tell him about  this thread I would own it. I have not said anything here that I have not said to him before.
I believe texting him the picture of the dishes I retrieved from his room was exactly the way to handle that situation. He And I communicate a lot via text. He came home and cleaned up his mess and apologized to me and said he would not do that again. So I consider that a success.
as is normal with these type of threads even those who disagree with me so forcefully like you and Cat help me to solidify my own positions on these matters.

You have been increasingly rude to me lately and I’m not sure why.

 

[Scarlett]

1 minute ago, DawnM said:

 

I don't think it is about a poor opinion or attacking, but it seems you post the issue as being the dishes, or not having a job, or food, or whatever, and many of us are saying that we don't think those things are the actual issue.   

Well you can think what you want but I can assure you that I am capable of identifying what bothers me. I don’t like a messy house and I do not like people who do not work.

Edited September 23, 2020 by Scarlett

[Joker]

I have an 18 and 20 year old living at home right now and I really don’t require anything of them.

They do their own laundry and keep their shared bathroom as clean as they want it (I seriously never go in there so don’t keep track of how dirty it gets before they clean it 🤫).  I honestly rarely even step foot in their rooms upstairs so I have no idea what might be hiding but they look rather clean whenever I do pop in. Neither of them work but are full time college students (all online at the moment though). They help with things when asked and don’t complain about it. Ds has been helping dh with some home improvement stuff whenever he’s asked. 

Mostly they just clean up after themselves and dh and I feel that’s enough. Dh and I would be doing the rest of the cleaning/chores whether or not they were living here and next fall neither will probably be here anyway. 

[katilac]

33 minutes ago, Jentrovert said:

 Since he's an adult, it's basically to me like he is a renter and you're just choosing not to have him pay rent. 

This really does not compute with me. He's just like a renter, except he's not paying rent? 

[DawnM]

4 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

Well you can think what you want but I can assure you that I am capable of identifying what bothers me. I don’t like a messy house and I do not like people who do not work.

 

Or not having a job, or eating too much, or coming home late, or walking too loudly.   

I am saying you have started so many threads about the things about this step son that bother you.

[Pawz4me]

DS21 lives at home and I don't really ask him to do anything beyond keep his own room reasonably tidy. He works almost full time and I don't. So I have no problem doing his laundry and whatever else. I'm going to be cleaning/cooking/running the dishwasher/whatever other chores need doing anyway, and it's not like one more person makes a significant difference in any of it. I'm sure I'd think differently if I were working outside the house, though.

[Tanaqui]

20 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

Well you can think what you want but I can assure you that I am capable of identifying what bothers me. I don’t like a messy house and I do not like people who do not work.

He does work. ~30 hours a week. That may not be full-time, but it's not nothing either.

[Tanaqui]

Quote

You have been increasingly rude to me lately and I’m not sure why.

Disagreeing with you is not the same as being rude. Pointing out your problematic behavior and posting is also not the same as being rude.

I am sure you would much rather talk about how rude I am, or how mean everybody is to you. It's always comforting to turn the conversation from our own faults and shortcomings to the perceived wrongs of other people.

[freesia]

Isn’t the reason he is home is his shift hasn’t started and he works evenings so his mornings are like your nights?  I totally agree that he should do things around the house, I don’t agree he is sitting in his room doing nothing ( except on Saturday.)

Maybe your family should make a list if the chores that are necessary to run a house. I would encourage you to go out of your comfort zone and figure out what is necessary for basic sanitation—what he would have to do if he had his own place.  From this and other threads I know that your standards are really high. I would discuss with him how the three of you should split those basic tasks.  I would communicate that these are things that just happen on top of work.  You could also make a list of the extras so he would know what would bless you.  Have him be part of the how we split these things and make sure they get done. I would not include his room other than food ( but we’ve discussed this before.) Somethings you expect are just not obvious, and he may just not remember them ( I know that is frustrating!)

Ask him how he wants it handled when he doesn’t do his chore. Cultivate an attitude of TeamScarlettFamily.  Even my neatest teen tends to only focus on her specific things and is still developing the idea that we are all in this together and some things need to just get done for the good of all.  Specific jobs that are directly tied to reasonable standards and have obvious reasons to get done and that he is part of the decision process may be your best bet. 

Maybe he could cook on Saturday as one of his jobs—wasn’t he a chef?

[Catwoman]

39 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

As for posting in this thread I do consider it safe enough here to ask for help. And if someone e were mean enough to track down my dss and tell him about  this thread I would own it. I have not said anything here that I have not said to him before.
I believe texting him the picture of the dishes I retrieved from his room was exactly the way to handle that situation. He And I communicate a lot via text. He came home and cleaned up his mess and apologized to me and said he would not do that again. So I consider that a success.
as is normal with these type of threads even those who disagree with me so forcefully like you and Cat help me to solidify my own positions on these matters.

You have been increasingly rude to me lately and I’m not sure why.

 

You really need to start adding JAWM to your thread titles if you can’t handle constructive criticism.

OR...

Maybe, instead of deciding that any criticism should “solidify your own positions” that you were right all along, you might consider being open to the possibility that perhaps some of those consistent criticisms (which have been made over and over again by many posters over a very long period of time) might actually have some merit. 

You seem to want to play the victim here, but no one here has said that you shouldn’t sit down with your family and iron out a solution to the problems you’re having. No one has said that you should be doing all of the housework. Everyone has said that it’s fine to ask your stepson to pitch in. Nobody wants to see you feeling frazzled or exhausted! 

You are so busy convincing yourself that you are right and everyone else is wrong, that you seem completely blind to the number of times you have complained about your stepson for all kinds of minor issues — and this has been going on for a long time. It’s hard not to feel sorry for the kid because he sounds like such a nice young man. He has a job, and he seems to be doing the best he can to be a good son. You seem so frustrated and angry over what seem to be such little things, and I hope you can find a way to lighten up a little and to lower your expectations a bit — for your own sake as much as for your stepson. I also hope that you and your dh are able to get on the same page about the household chores, so you can both sit down with your stepson and come up with a plan that will satisfy all of you. 

Honestly, Scarlett, everyone here wants things to work out between you and your stepson. I know you don’t believe that, but we really do. 

 

 

[Catwoman]

53 minutes ago, freesia said:

Isn’t the reason he is home is his shift hasn’t started and he works evenings so his mornings are like your nights?  I totally agree that he should do things around the house, I don’t agree he is sitting in his room doing nothing ( except on Saturday.)

Maybe your family should make a list if the chores that are necessary to run a house. I would encourage you to go out of your comfort zone and figure out what is necessary for basic sanitation—what he would have to do if he had his own place.  From this and other threads I know that your standards are really high. I would discuss with him how the three of you should split those basic tasks.  I would communicate that these are things that just happen on top of work.  You could also make a list of the extras so he would know what would bless you.  Have him be part of the how we split these things and make sure they get done. I would not include his room other than food ( but we’ve discussed this before.) Somethings you expect are just not obvious, and he may just not remember them ( I know that is frustrating!)

Ask him how he wants it handled when he doesn’t do his chore. Cultivate an attitude of TeamScarlettFamily.  Even my neatest teen tends to only focus on her specific things and is still developing the idea that we are all in this together and some things need to just get done for the good of all.  Specific jobs that are directly tied to reasonable standards and have obvious reasons to get done and that he is part of the decision process may be your best bet. 

Maybe he could cook on Saturday as one of his jobs—wasn’t he a chef?

I think these are great suggestions. 🙂 

[Scarlett]

2 hours ago, Tanaqui said:

He does work. ~30 hours a week. That may not be full-time, but it's not nothing either.

And I am not complaining about the current 30 hours per week.  I thought Dawn was referring to the times he wasn't working and dh and I were definitely not ok with that.

[Scarlett]

1 hour ago, Catwoman said:

You really need to start adding JAWM to your thread titles if you can’t handle constructive criticism.

OR...

Maybe, instead of deciding that any criticism should “solidify your own positions” that you were right all along, you might consider being open to the possibility that perhaps some of those consistent criticisms (which have been made over and over again by many posters over a very long period of time) might actually have some merit. 

You seem to want to play the victim here, but no one here has said that you shouldn’t sit down with your family and iron out a solution to the problems you’re having. No one has said that you should be doing all of the housework. Everyone has said that it’s fine to ask your stepson to pitch in. Nobody wants to see you feeling frazzled or exhausted! 

You are so busy convincing yourself that you are right and everyone else is wrong, that you seem completely blind to the number of times you have complained about your stepson for all kinds of minor issues — and this has been going on for a long time. It’s hard not to feel sorry for the kid because he sounds like such a nice young man. He has a job, and he seems to be doing the best he can to be a good son. You seem so frustrated and angry over what seem to be such little things, and I hope you can find a way to lighten up a little and to lower your expectations a bit — for your own sake as much as for your stepson. I also hope that you and your dh are able to get on the same page about the household chores, so you can both sit down with your stepson and come up with a plan that will satisfy all of you. 

Honestly, Scarlett, everyone here wants things to work out between you and your stepson. I know you don’t believe that, but we really do. 

 

 

I can handle constructive criticism.  But when Cat says, 'hey at least it wasn't a moldy bowl in his bedroom that would be gross' and I reply with already been there and your next comment is OMG YOU TOOK A PICTURE AND SAVED IT!  AND YOU SHOWED YOUR DH!  It gets weary.  I feel like I have to defend every move I make.  

And I did not say that 'any' criticism solidifies my position. I said some do.  For instance I believe I handled the dishes in his room correctly.  And so far in these last 2 months or so since that incident (for which he apologized to me) there has not been that problem. And I don't believe it is 'inappropriate' for me to ask him to move my clothes to the dryer once in a blue moon.  I do it for him.  And I didn't want to just assume he wouldn't need the machines today and have him surprised by clothes in the washer.  I do favors for him all of the time.  We have no issue in that area.  

I don't just say negative things about him.  I mean, how would you know any of the good things about him that you listed above if not for me telling you?  I have bragged on him for a lot of things.  And at the same time I am allowed to be annoyed that he disrespects the standards of the house, even if you and whoever else thinks those standards are ridiculous.  

[Scarlett]

2 hours ago, Tanaqui said:

Disagreeing with you is not the same as being rude. Pointing out your problematic behavior and posting is also not the same as being rude.

I am sure you would much rather talk about how rude I am, or how mean everybody is to you. It's always comforting to turn the conversation from our own faults and shortcomings to the perceived wrongs of other people.

I don't think you are rude because you are disagreeing with me.  I think you are just rude to me in general.  You don't really get to decide my behavior is 'problematic'.  Families are different.  No one here thinks it is inappropriate to ask another person to move their laundry.  Yet you were very dogmatic about that.  As if I had broken some big rule.  And everyone is not mean to me.  It is consistently the same few.  I try to ignore but I am not that great at that.

[hippiemamato3]

Pretty much just what he's asked to do, which I'm ok with.  I do occasionally mention the dishes he has in his room, but he makes very little mess otherwise, and when I point them out he brings them out.

 He's just finished high school (age 17) and is working about 20 hours a week. 

Edited September 23, 2020 by hippiemamato3

[Scarlett]

2 hours ago, freesia said:

Isn’t the reason he is home is his shift hasn’t started and he works evenings so his mornings are like your nights?  I totally agree that he should do things around the house, I don’t agree he is sitting in his room doing nothing ( except on Saturday.)

Maybe your family should make a list if the chores that are necessary to run a house. I would encourage you to go out of your comfort zone and figure out what is necessary for basic sanitation—what he would have to do if he had his own place.  From this and other threads I know that your standards are really high. I would discuss with him how the three of you should split those basic tasks.  I would communicate that these are things that just happen on top of work.  You could also make a list of the extras so he would know what would bless you.  Have him be part of the how we split these things and make sure they get done. I would not include his room other than food ( but we’ve discussed this before.) Somethings you expect are just not obvious, and he may just not remember them ( I know that is frustrating!)

Ask him how he wants it handled when he doesn’t do his chore. Cultivate an attitude of TeamScarlettFamily.  Even my neatest teen tends to only focus on her specific things and is still developing the idea that we are all in this together and some things need to just get done for the good of all.  Specific jobs that are directly tied to reasonable standards and have obvious reasons to get done and that he is part of the decision process may be your best bet. 

Maybe he could cook on Saturday as one of his jobs—wasn’t he a chef?

True today he went in to work at 4 so of course I don't expect him to wake up at 6 and spend the entire day slaving away on chores. I mean I don't expect that even on his days off.  But Monday he was off.  Which is what I was first discussing in this thread.  But even when he works I do expect him to pitch in and do a thing or two to help the house smoothly just like his dad and I do every night after we get home from our full time jobs.