Elder care/companion type a few times per week

[DawnM]

So, I am starting to think ahead.  I was looking for a care facility for my dad near me.  He wants to move to NC now that mom is gone.  We will be looking at summer most likely, unless he can get help to pack up without us.

However, he told us he no longer wants to live in a facility (they had their own house in a retirement community with graduated care should they have needed it).  He wants to just live in an apartment.

That is nice and all, but I think he needs little more than living on his own.

Is there such a thing as a caregiver who comes in maybe 10-12 hours per week, maybe 4 hours at a time, to sit and talk, help with mail, bills, maybe light cleaning, and any care he should need while there? I just know I can't devote 10-12 hours per week to go help him.  But I would feel better if we could hire someone to do it.

What would this person's title be and are there agencies for this?

(this is just one of the ideas we are floating around.)

ETA:  In the OP I said this is just one idea.  I wanted specifics about this particular idea so we can make an informed decision.  I do not EVER want someone to pay his bills or handle his finances.  We have that covered.  I can understand the concern, but I am putting t his here, in the OP, because it seems to have gotten lost in the shuffle and people keep commenting on it.  

Edited December 24, 2019 by DawnM

[catz]

Honestly, I would not encourage you to go this route. You will absolutely need to be more hands on if he goes in this direction.  The retirement communities with stepwise care available have so many social events and check ins built in, if he's in one now and it's been going well I'd be hesitant just to let him move anywhere.  My grandmother insisted on living alone for so long, her mental and physical condition actually improved when she moved to the retirement facility because she was busier and more engaged. There's also no guarantees on how long he can just be in apartment.  

Since he just lost his wife, I think it's probably hard for him to wrap around wanting to engage in the community or wanting that support.  I would not let him make a snap decision on this.  He really may feel differently in 6-12 months.    

[DawnM]

21 minutes ago, FuzzyCatz said:

Honestly, I would not encourage you to go this route. You will absolutely need to be more hands on if he goes in this direction.  The retirement communities with stepwise care available have so many social events and check ins built in, if he's in one now and it's been going well I'd be hesitant just to let him move anywhere.  My grandmother insisted on living alone for so long, her mental and physical condition actually improved when she moved to the retirement facility because she was busier and more engaged. There's also no guarantees on how long he can just be in apartment.  

Since he just lost his wife, I think it's probably hard for him to wrap around wanting to engage in the community or wanting that support.  I would not let him make a snap decision on this.  He really may feel differently in 6-12 months.    

 

Well, I am not the one requesting it.

And I told him I would look into it.  

[prairiewindmomma]

There are such things. Services ran about $25/hr.

“ In home adult care” is a relevant search term. Our local county on the aging had brochures with agencies listed. While “Home Instead” and a few other agencies are national chains, most of the better ones, IMO, are local.

They do everything from driving to doctor appointments to meal prep to light cleaning to companionship.

 

Edited December 23, 2019 by prairiewindmomma

[Scarlett]

My. MIL gets help with my FIL (late stage Alzheimer’s).  I believe she is getting around 25 hours a week of help.  They do whatever she needs.  Read to him, help bath him, take him to get chicken fingers from Burger King, ( his favorite treat), light housekeeping, fixing a meal, just whatever.  She is doing a lot better about making good use of them, and yesterday she was gone from the house nearly the entire day.  

However,  she is still there with him anytime they are not.  He cannot be left alone at this stage. 

I think it will all just depend on your dad’s level of independence. 

[Scarlett]

5 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

There are such things. Services ran about $25/hr.

“ In home adult care” is a relevant search term. Our local county on the aging had brochures with agencies listed. While “Home Instead” and a few other agencies are national chains, most of the better ones, IMO, are local.

They do everything from driving to doctor appointments to meal prep to light cleaning to companionship.

 

Yep.  The agency she is using specializes in Alzheimer’s care.  Cost is $18. But she is in LCOL area.  

[Scarlett]

10 minutes ago, DawnM said:

 

Well, I am not the one requesting it.

And I told him I would look into it.  

Right.  This is a tough stage because you can’t just take over even if that is what he needs.  The closer the apartment is to your home the better. 

[katilac]

3 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

There are such things. Services ran about $25/hr.

Cost will vary by region; it wouldn't cost anywhere near that much in my neck of the woods. My cousin is in a wheelchair and needs some medical things done plus help eating, toileting, etc, and those people still only make $10-$12 hour. Our state minimum wage is the federal minimum. 

[mlktwins]

Dawn, my dad is 84 and we just moved him from his home of 50+ years to an apartment building.  It was built in 2006 as an older people's apartment complex (wide building hallways with rails, wider entrances to each apartment, low light switches, doorways and halls wider within the apartment.  Lots of activities.  It is no longer just for elderly, but most of the people are still elderly.  There is nursing care, etc.  My dad is fully independent in his apartment (2 bedroom) with a full kitchen, laundry, and 2 bathrooms.  I made sure his master bathroom had a step in shower and not a tub to step over.  The 2nd bedroom is his office for now, but can be a caregivers room if needed at some point.  

There is someone who lives in the building who offers to drive people places ($15 an hour).  There is a hairdresser, church, etc. there.  He is busy most every day with card games and bingo, which he loves.  He no longer drives and we have not used the service there.  I get him out to all his doctors appointments (which are not that many at the moment) and to grocery shop, eat lunch, etc. once or twice a week.  I have someone come in to clean every 2 weeks - that is $70 a visit here.

He probably should be thinking about assisted living, but he is a no go (it was tough to get him to move from his house in the first place) and I think he would not do well there.  So...it is what it is until it isn't anymore!

When all this came about and he had PT 3 times a week and a bunch of doctors appointments to figure out what was going on, I about killed myself getting him everywhere and doing so much for him everyday.  All while homeschooling 8th graders and trying to manage my household.  I finally hired a company to help take some of the burden off to take him to PT 3 times a week.  Most places I talked to want at least 4 hours a day to make it worth their while.  This was $25 an hour by the way.  And...I still needed to be involved in all of that -- calling to make sure he was ready because they were on there way, getting status reports on the appointments, etc).  But...I wasn't driving him.

We are getting to the point where I need to have someone to come in and do things for/with him.  He isn't taking his medicine despite me calling him everyday to remind him.  He tells me he takes it and I go over and he hasn't been taking it all the times he told me he did.  I think it would be nice for someone to come in and cook for him.  He needs someone to get him exercising.  He doesn't want to pay for any of it -- why do that when he has me for free (seriously what he said).  I just can't for much longer -- not with homeschooling twins through high school and trying to get myself healthy.

The assisted living facility next to my dad's apartment is lovely and he would never need to leave there.  But...it is about $6000/month if he is still in fairly good shape.  And...the cost goes up each year (for everyone) and will also go up the more care he requires.

I don't know what to tell you.  It is a sucky place to be in -- for him and for you.  Good luck with it all!

 

[prairiewindmomma]

The people only make $10-12/hr (or less), but the agency will charge that much. It goes to their overhead (insurance bonds, staffing an office, etc) and profit.

Edited December 23, 2019 by prairiewindmomma

[mlktwins]

2 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

Right.  This is a tough stage because you can’t just take over even if that is what he needs.  The closer the apartment is to your home the better. 

Yes!  I moved my dad from 20 minutes away (that was on a day with no rush hour - each way usually ended up 45 minutes -- I live in Northern VA) to a place that is 10 minutes from me (traffic is light to his place).  Game changer for me!!!

[Scarlett]

5 minutes ago, mlktwins said:

Yes!  I moved my dad from 20 minutes away (that was on a day with no rush hour - each way usually ended up 45 minutes -- I live in Northern VA) to a place that is 10 minutes from me (traffic is light to his place).  Game changer for me!!!

Exactly.  20-30 min away seems close ( especially compared to AZ to NC)but it is a looomg ways when you have to stop what you are doing and go there several times a week, unplanned.  

[katilac]

45 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

The people only make $10-12/hr (or less), but the agency will charge that much. It goes to their overhead (insurance bonds, staffing an office, etc) and profit.

Oh yes, definitely. A lot of people around here hire on their own if there's not medical stuff involved. You can still do a background check. I recently discovered that, while agencies do run background checks, it doesn't mean that everyone they hire has a 'clean' background check. It just means they don't have anything that the agency considers disqualifying, which might vary a lot from what you as an individual would consider disqualifying. 

Each method (hiring on your own or using an agency) has different hassles. If my parents needed help of that sort, I'd be inclined to go through my social circle first and try to hire somebody I know or who is one step removed. I'd still run the background check. Yes, there are hassles involved with hiring people you know, but I'd do in with the idea of both sides trying it on a trial basis. If you know of any possible people who actually live in apartments or very near them, I'd be looking at those particular apartments! The closer someone is geographically, the more likely they are to take and keep a part-time job like that. I mean, it's not something I would ever look for, but I'd be open to 10 hours per week if the person was in my neighborhood, kwim? 

I just bought my parents an Amazon Echo Show and Echo Dot for Christmas. They are very close to me and even closer to my sister, but these will help in other ways. I'm going to set them up so they can call any of our cell phones just by saying, Alexa, call katilac. This will help if they fall or if they just feel too weak to get up. Their house is small so I think the two devices will cover it, but I can add another cheaply enough. We can also video call each other directly, which gives more info than a phone call if something seems off. There's also a drop-in feature I hope they let me activate, where I can drop-in visually if I can't contact them. 

Someone was just telling me that an Apple watch can be very useful. It has fall detection: if you fall hard, it opens an alert and you can answer "I'm okay" or "SOS." If you don't answer or don't seem to be moving, it sends a message to your emergency contacts. That's pretty cool and something I will consider for future, but they aren't at a high fall risk (other than being 80, lol) and I don't think they would wear/use it at this point. 

I agree with getting him absolutely as close to you as possible. Don't go for the nicer apartment that's even 5 minutes further away. Go for the acceptable apartment that's really, really close. 

[Ottakee]

I just caution you about having someone else help him with bills, etc. Many seniors lose a lot of money that way.  Dishonest workers can take advantage.

[katilac]

5 minutes ago, Ottakee said:

I just caution you about having someone else help him with bills, etc. Many seniors lose a lot of money that way.  Dishonest workers can take advantage.

If he needs help paying bills, I would want to be on his account and have him set up for online payments as much as possible. That makes it easier for you to both help him make payments and to keep an eye on the account. 

[mlktwins]

21 minutes ago, katilac said:

If he needs help paying bills, I would want to be on his account and have him set up for online payments as much as possible. That makes it easier for you to both help him make payments and to keep an eye on the account. 

Yes to this! I do all that for dad and would not turn that over to anyone else.  A friend does elder care and the women she is helping now lost $40k to the person that was helping her before.  So sad...

[matrips]

There is ‘companion care’ at the lowest level.  So no bathing, diapers, transfers, or even pushing a wheelchair.  Companion care here ran around $22/hour through an agency.  And yes, there are agencies.  Just google elder home care for your area.  

One of mom’s companions kept insisting on her hiring her privately to ‘save’ money.  But this companion seemed a bit off.  I told mom she needed the safety of an agency and to not be the employer. You would then need to watch for payroll taxes and what happens if they get hurt while helping your dad.

i also used Shipt to order and deliver the groceries to her.

i was joint with survivorship on her bank account and paid all her bills, mostly online.

i wish I had insisted on a fall alert.  She was stubborn.  And therefore lost her independent apartment when she fell in the shower and wasn’t found for over 24 hours. That did her a major setback. 😞

there was a huge difference in convenience when mom lived to within 7 minutes of us versus 20 minutes.  It doesn’t seem like much difference but it is, when you have kids and your own regular busy life.  So the closest you can get him is my recommendation. 

I’d also still check out the facilities near you.  You want to have a short list ready and researched.  It’s not fun to try and look during an emergency situation. Alf’s have varying levels of care. I did not know that the first time. She finally ended up in an Alf with the highest level of care.  They could do anything but medical care like IVs.  And when she was bedridden at the end, they acted like a nursing home for her, even though they didn’t have to.  They took good care of her.

That will also be the time to update his will, insurance and that kind of stuff.  

I’m glad he’ll be near you.  

 

[fairfarmhand]

When hiring someone you do get what you pay for. Don’t go too cheap. Ask for recommendations.

[mumto2]

Bills should be handled by a family member.
 

My mom’s caregivers/companions came through a county agency that was somehow connected with the meals on wheels for that county.  There was a sliding income based scale for payment but everyone qualified.

 

[Lanny]

IMO him living in an apartment, by himself, is potentially catastrophic for him. He needs, IMO, to be in an Assisted Living community of some kind. He needs more than an apartment, but less than a Nursing Home at this time. Hopefully, that will continue. Good luck to him!  I hope he will continue to be active.

[Selkie]

We went through this recently with a relative and had a very difficult time finding good in-home caretakers. The agencies here have high turnover rates because they pay so little, so it was a constantly changing cast of characters (some of them not so great😬). Because they are perpetually understaffed, there were days when they would call at the last minute and say they didn't have anyone to send over. Very frustrating. If it were my dad, I would be strongly encouraging him to move into an assisted living facility. Good luck!

[DawnM]

I appreciate your concern about finances, but we never, ever intended anyone but my dad and my accountant husband to handle the money.  

And I appreciate your concern about talking him into a facility instead.  We are still having those discussions.  He does not need a nursing home at this time.  A retirement facility (like he has lived in for the past 20 years),. maybe, but I am not sticking him in a nursing home at the moment.

I really am just asking about in home care for right now.  

 

[Ottakee]

4 minutes ago, DawnM said:

I appreciate your concern about finances, but we never, ever intended anyone but my dad and my accountant husband to handle the money.  

And I appreciate your concern about talking him into a facility instead.  We are still having those discussions.  He does not need a nursing home at this time.  A retirement facility (like he has lived in for the past 20 years),. maybe, but I am not sticking him in a nursing home at the moment.

I really am just asking about in home care for right now.  

 

I know that some in our area have levels of care and if they live there for 3+ years they will accept Medicaid as payment....which is nice if the money might run out.

[catz]

I just think it's so much easier transitioning later if the have step wise care in place somewhere.  I am specifically NOT talking about nursing homes.  Like my mother has a free standing home in a gated retirement community with all sorts of amenities.  Many just related to social and activities.  The most care related thing she's involved in right now are exercise groups.  They do weekend trips, theater productions, community band, woodworking groups. etc etc et.  But there are easy hook ins to transition to nursing care in place and then in nursing facilities on site and health care within a mile.  

Just expect to be way more hands on and on call if you make another choice and be prepared to transition to another living situation because changes can happen quickly.  I also think it can be hard to anticipate social needs, especially so soon after a sudden loss.  My father died very suddenly too and I was glad my mom didn't make any snap decisions at that time.   I agree with going through an agency over employing someone independently unless they have sparkling references you know personally.

[MaBelle]

My dil does this for an older woman here.  She works M-Sat, noon  to five.  I'm not sure how much she gets, but she is family to this couple.  Of course, we are a small community and we all know each other, and each other's families.

[City Mouse]

Where I live the county has several Senior Citizen Centers (one in each town). It provides a hot lunch M-F at the center and delivered meals for those who can’t travel. Cost is based on income. Low income seniors get meals for free, others are asked to pay $2.00. There are field trips and assistance with travel to medical appointments. Some in home services are provided to those who qualify (based on income, living situation, and physical abilities). There is a “chore guy” who will do yard work and light home repairs. There is a housekeeping service which can include cleaning, laundry, washing dishes, cooking, errands. They do not provided medical/health care type services (no bathing, dressing, giving medicine, stuff like that).

[DawnM]

53 minutes ago, Dotwithaperiod said:

After finding your local home health care companies, google the heck out of them for reviews. If possible, try to find individuals who have used them. In our experience, there are employees who are very popular/trusted, and others who definitely aren’t.  Maybe you could visit a senior activity center, or a church with a lot of elderly. My friend’s mom used one company and was able to give us so much info, sort of like Rate-My -Prof, lol. My mom’s church also gave us trusted names. We also spoke with a social worker connected to the local nursing homes who was able to give her opinion about which care giver company was better.

I’m honestly jealous that your father is asking for help. After doing everything I can think of, my mom balked at all of it, so she’s in a huge house, alone, 2000 miles away, and I spend hours each week checking on her and coordinating with my husband’s sister to take her grocery shopping. Her refusal to “waste money” is driving me insane.

 

He isn't!  He is insisting he can be alone, no prob, no care, etc.....I am looking up some sort of companion for him to go in. 

[mlktwins]

46 minutes ago, DawnM said:

 

He isn't!  He is insisting he can be alone, no prob, no care, etc.....I am looking up some sort of companion for him to go in. 

 Yep, this is my dad.  I think someone posted above about the social piece, but my dad was becoming a hermit in his home.  He loves that he has social options at his new place.  He can play games most of the day or be in his apartment by himself when he needs a break.  Some of the elderly people have lived there for a while and they have companion care instead of moving to assisted living.  Much cheaper.

My dad finally chose to move, but he really didn’t have a choice 😜!!

 

 

[DawnM]

12 minutes ago, mlktwins said:

 Yep, this is my dad.  I think someone posted above about the social piece, but my dad was becoming a hermit in his home.  He loves that he has social options at his new place.  He can play games most of the day or be in his apartment by himself when he needs a break.  Some of the elderly people have lived there for a while and they have companion care instead of moving to assisted living.  Much cheaper.

My dad finally chose to move, but he really didn’t have a choice 😜!!

 

 

 

that is the kind of place my dad is in now.  We will see.

[Scarlett]

1 minute ago, DawnM said:

 

that is the kind of place my dad is in now.  We will see.

So he wants to go more independent than he is now?  

[DawnM]

3 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

So he wants to go more independent than he is now?  

 

He has been in the independent portion, in his own house.  But she mentioned socials and where he is now has them as well.  So, he won't be more independent, he just thinks he does fine where he is, being independent, and wants to do that.  He says he only moved to a retirement facility with graduated care for my mom's sake.  

[Scarlett]

22 minutes ago, DawnM said:

 

He has been in the independent portion, in his own house.  But she mentioned socials and where he is now has them as well.  So, he won't be more independent, he just thinks he does fine where he is, being independent, and wants to do that.  He says he only moved to a retirement facility with graduated care for my mom's sake.  

Ah.  I see.  Ok. 

[J-rap]

My MIL did something like what you're talking about for a few years.  It worked out really well for her and the family.  She had a home-aide who came around 10 hours a week.  Initially, she helped with smaller things like what you're talking about.  Over time, she came more hours and helped with more.  If you go through an actual respected agency, it saves you the work of interviewing and they'll generally find a replacement if the aide can't come one day, etc.  But, they are generally more expensive too, and require a minimum number of days or hours.

If you go with someone independently, it won't cost as much, and you can work out an agreement on hours together.  

However, you have to be a lot more careful (if you do it independently).  Word of mouth is best for that, which is what my dh's family did.  Even if it's a friend of a friend of a friend.  Or recommended by your church, etc.  I know of some nursing students who look for part-time jobs like that too.  Here, the cost is $15 - $30 for an independent aide, and at least $35 if you go with an agency.

 

[Carol in Cal.]

Around here they call it home care.  Usually there is a minimum visit of 4 hours.  There are licensed and unlicensed agencies.  The unlicensed ones are much cheaper.

The main thing is to get a referral to someone specific.  This is helpful because this is someone who is building a reputation and cares what you will think of them, and knows that if you find out that they are stealing or cheating on the bills, the person who referred them to you will also hear about this.  There is a tremendous amount of cheating in this industry.  It is important for your dad to keep track of their comings and goings, and to let you know if there are discrepancies between his journal and your bill.  Also, it is important to stash valuables so as to avoid putting out temptations.  I have personally known of caregivers claiming that someone refused a visit at the door when it was not true, and then charging for that visit at 4 hours minimum rate.  I have known of things being stolen, pretty commonly.  It is easy to get away with this kind of thing because often the patient is a little bit confused anyway and so in a he said/she said scenario unless there is an able bodied witness the agency person gets the benefit of the doubt.  

When my mother needed care after a very serious fall and rehab, i got tons of good referrals for nursing homes, assisted living, and rehab, but nothing but complaints about home care.  I have reluctantly concluded that it is almost impossible to find good, reliable, honest home care around here, which is really very troubling.

[Laura Corin]

7 hours ago, Dotwithaperiod said:

 

I’m honestly jealous that your father is asking for help. After doing everything I can think of, my mom balked at all of it, so she’s in a huge house, alone, 2000 miles away, and I spend hours each week checking on her and coordinating with my husband’s sister to take her grocery shopping. Her refusal to “waste money” is driving me insane.

Yes, my mother's refusal to accept help caused much, much more hassle in the end.

[Laura Corin]

6 hours ago, Dotwithaperiod said:

Oh well, then my sympathies. My mother says the same. She did not like living with me for a few months after her husband passed, and demanded I take her back to her home, but since then she’s done nothing but complain. She’s stubborn as anything. I’ts miserable trying to decide when it’s time to declare that she doesn’t have the final say in how she lives.

For us, we weren't able to do anything until she and her house became a physical danger to her and the old person in the next attached house (undiscovered gas leak, catastrophic wiring, etc.) and she also ended up in hospital. It's miserable, I'm sorry.

[Melissa in Australia]

13 hours ago, mlktwins said:

Yes to this! I do all that for dad and would not turn that over to anyone else.  A friend does elder care and the women she is helping now lost $40k to the person that was helping her before.  So sad...

This happened to my MIL last year. she had an agency that was sending in workers to assist her. She is 97, completely blind and  has had a few strokes. several thousand dollars went missing and all her jewelry, including her wedding ring, some family heirlooms like  a crest ring that had been in the family since the 14th century etc. 

she is now in assisted living

[Melissa in Australia]

I worked in aged home based  care before homeschooling. Here in Australia it is an income based sliding scale with the government helping low income elderly . The view in Australia is that it is cheaper in the long run for society to assist people to live in their own home for as long as possible. I worked for the local Regional Health ( hospital)  . I would go and shower clients, clean their house, take them shopping and do meal preparations. It was not my job to make sure they had taken their medication .

 Here it is called Home and Community Care services. I was a personal carer (that was job description and what I was trained for)

[TechWife]

On 12/23/2019 at 10:33 AM, FuzzyCatz said:

 

Edited December 26, 2019 by TechWife

[Ali in OR]

We have in-home care for our disabled adult daughter and we use a local agency to provide care givers. Most of their business is elder care, but they also do younger folks (even some minors) with disabilities. The cost is roughly twice what it would be if we found our own caregivers, but that would be very difficult for me. It's a high turnover industry and the agency keeps a steady stream of trained, background-checked caregivers available. And if a caregiver is sick or can't get here for any reason, they provide a sub. This is essential for me to be able to work. I think it's the best situation possible for dd. She still lives at home with her family; we're best at catching changes in her health, making adjustments in her care, etc. We've been happy with her caregivers. They're her age, take her out for activities, keep her entertained and happy, etc.