Kate CA Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Feel free to elaborate if you like. I am curious what others here think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I think Obama will win. However, I'm skeptical that our system will allow a fair election. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karen sn Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I think Obama will win. However, I'm skeptical that our system will allow a fair election. I think Obama will get more votes and that McCain will win because we haven't had a real election in years. It's just my OPINION (no bashing please and asking me for my "proof"). I think when Bush Sr. lost against Clinton the stage was set for making sure that our votes don't really count. The last two elections have shown us that! I will vote, but I know the machines are not going to count my vote. Who wants to place bets? Florida will be in the news again for botching yet another election! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gandpsmommy Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I think Obama will get more votes and that McCain will win because we haven't had a real election in years. It's just my OPINION (no bashing please and asking me for my "proof"). I think when Bush Sr. lost against Clinton the stage was set for making sure that our votes don't really count. The last two elections have shown us that! I will vote, but I know the machines are not going to count my vote. Who wants to place bets? Florida will be in the news again for botching yet another election! I'm not sure about whether elections have been fixed, but dh and I watched a documentary about it that was downright scary. I wish I could remember the title of it. It was very frightening to see how easy it was to fix a voting machine so that no matter what votes were entered the final print-out showed whatever results the person making the print-out desired. Maybe it will be on again soon since it's election season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erica in PA Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I can't bring myself to vote. Right now the trend is toward Obama. I think his party is very unified behind him and will be hard to beat. But I hold out hope that people will look beyond the presentation and looks and style, and think about his record, and how his lack of experience and lack of proving himself could be a real risk for our country at an already difficult time. Much as people may like and admire him personally, he has not proven himself as a leader, and it's really all about *hoping* that he will be able to become what he says he will. He is not that yet. John McCain has been the leader that he is now, for years and years. He has proven himself as a leader. While I *like* Obama as well, I sincerely hope that he is not elected president. Erica Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Country Mouse Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I think Obama will win. Unless, as others have mentioned, something really funky happens with the election process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ma23peas Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I think Obama will win. However, I'm skeptical that our system will allow a fair election. I am on the same page with you as far as fair election...I think McCain will win because I do not believe the 'polls' are reflective of our country..my grandmother who is 83 has never been polled in her life, (we had this discussion one night with family) nor has any of my relatives that live in a fairly rural family...also in order to be polled you have to be home to answer the phone....so then you have to consider your population really hitting the 'heart of America'...I think this election will teach us something about those polls....And many have caller ID and will NOT answer if they see it is a pollster because they don't trust their questions or would just rather not answer. Where I believe the elections aren't fair is on the Democratic side...do we remember Gore's lawyers fighting to throw out the military votes on technicalities? Now you can register and vote the same day, these officers mailed their ballots in 30 days beforehand but the state stamped the postmark and even though the ballots came in BEFORE the election Gore's attorneys argued that their votes can't count. HUH?? I guarantee you if the chances were that 80% of that military vote would have been for HIM he would have had his lawyers lay off... Then we have the anti-capitalist group called ACORN.. "The radical anti-capitalist group ACORN was busted again this week for turning in bogus voter registration applications- this time in Michigan." "Obama’s ties to Acorn — arguably the most politically radical large-scale activist group in the country — are wide, deep, and longstanding." So, while it may not be the Democratic party going out there and getting homeless people to vote and urging them to vote Obama...it certainly is the liberal left leaning groups that are so Anti-capitalist and more socialist that will do ANYTHING to insure they win this time... I don't like it. Tara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lynn Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I'm not saying a thing......:lurk5: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Academy of Jedi Arts Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 McCain had a chance before he picked Palin. It was really sad watching him in the debate last night. I used to really like that man at one time. I think at one time he could have stood up to his handlers and made some positive changes in America. I am not counting anything out though. Bush's people fixed an election and many of those same people are working for McCain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ma23peas Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Bush's people fixed an election and many of those same people are working for McCain. Ah, show me some facts, atleast I showed FACTS to support the liberal left illegally trying to cast votes....This is reckless, inflammatory, and irresponsible unless you have evidence to back it up... Where are the ACORN groups that helped Bush fix the election? The MEDIA claimed Florida for Gore which had a huge impact on voters, people were still heading to the voting stations and heard on the radio that Gore had won so they turned around and did not cast their vote...you don't call that stealing votes? Tara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Academy of Jedi Arts Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Ah, show me some facts, atleast I showed FACTS to support the liberal left illegally trying to cast votes....This is reckless, inflammatory, and irresponsible unless you have evidence to back it up... Where are the ACORN groups that helped Bush fix the election? The MEDIA claimed Florida for Gore which had a huge impact on voters, people were still heading to the voting stations and heard on the radio that Gore had won so they turned around and did not cast their vote...you don't call that stealing votes? Tara I did not see any facts in your post. I even re-read it to double check. But in case you don;t have time to Google, here are some quick links I pulled up in about 20 seconds to get you started. http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-rich29mar29,0,3371050.story?coll=la-opinion-rightrail http://www.iwilltryit.com/fixed1.htm http://english.pravda.ru/mailbox/22/101/399/14556_ballots.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelli in TN Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 McCain had a chance before he picked Palin. It was really sad watching him in the debate last night. I used to really like that man at one time. I think at one time he could have stood up to his handlers and made some positive changes in America. . :iagree: I liked Sarah Palin, a lot, for about a week. Then I got to know her. And the more I see of her and the more I hear her (not hear ABOUT, but hear her) the less respect I have for Mr. McCain for putting her on the ticket. I never paid attention to Biden because the old Kelli ignored all Democrats (except Lowe Finney, the one Dem I voted for in my 20+ years of being a grownup). But now, the more I see and hear Biden and the more I see and hear ABOUT Biden the more respect I have for Mr. Obama for putting him on the ticket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJN Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 stands for, but honestly, Obama scares me. With the economy we have right now and the plan Obama has, I think we'll see a worse economy if Obama is elected. You can't raise taxes in a bad economy. Even though he *says* he's not going to raise taxes, I don't believe him or any other Democrat for that matter. Read what Dave Ramsey says about Obama's plan if you don't agree. JMHO, Molly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camy-7 boybarians 1 lady Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Oh, Kate. I'm so discouraged and frustrated over this whole Republican campaign. It is a joke. As a Republican, I am thoroughly irritated over our candidate. However, God is in control, and that encourages me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mamagistra Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I'm not sure about whether elections have been fixed, but dh and I watched a documentary about it that was downright scary. I wish I could remember the title of it. It was very frightening to see how easy it was to fix a voting machine so that no matter what votes were entered the final print-out showed whatever results the person making the print-out desired. Maybe it will be on again soon since it's election season. Was it Hacking Democracy? We saw it, too. And shuddered. :glare: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mamagistra Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I am not counting anything out though. Bush's people fixed an election and many of those same people are working for McCain. :iagree: And infallible computerized voting will save us all... :rolleyes: Sigh. Just sigh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CactusPair Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 probably obama, for which i am relieved. back in jan. i almost chose mccain in the primaries (i am a democrat, but have went with the "other side" before). i used to have a lot of respect for him. i like him as a senator better than as a candidate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I think this race is way to close to call. I have no doubts Obama will win the popular vote, but that's not how we elect presidents. There 8 states that are "real" toss-ups: Nevada Colorado Missouri Indiana Ohio Virginia North Carolina Florida If McCain wins all these States, he wins the election. And these are all states he was ahead in at one time, and are somewhat "naturally" Red States. Assuming all the Obama leaning States do vote Obama, the loss of any single one of the above would mean defeat for McCain. A loss in Nevada (5 electoral votes) would actually result in a 269-269 tie, which would send the decision to the House of Representatives (which almost assuredly will be Democratic). It ain't over yet. But the options for a McCain victory are narrowing. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kate CA Posted October 8, 2008 Author Share Posted October 8, 2008 Oh, Kate. I'm so discouraged and frustrated over this whole Republican campaign. It is a joke. As a Republican, I am thoroughly irritated over our candidate. However, God is in control, and that encourages me! Me too on both counts! :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jugglin'5 Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I think if McCain had opposed the bailout he would have won handily. None of my friends are happy about it at all, and they are die-hard Republicans for the most part. I am disgusted. I can't and never would vote Obama, and now I can't vote for McCain. Bleh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donna T. Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I think McCain will win because he was endorsed by the Rothschilds and has received funding (illegally by the way) from them. And, they have a whole lot more clout that we do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teamturner Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 stands for, but honestly, Obama scares me. With the economy we have right now and the plan Obama has, I think we'll see a worse economy if Obama is elected. You can't raise taxes in a bad economy. Even though he *says* he's not going to raise taxes, I don't believe him or any other Democrat for that matter. Read what Dave Ramsey says about Obama's plan if you don't agree. JMHO, Molly I agree! I voted that I think Obama will win and that definitely scares me too. I find it interesting that all this "change" he wants to bring about will cost a lot of money and we just don't have it. So what campaign promises can he actually fulfill? We just cannot afford bigger government right now. The next President needs to bring spending way, way down. As a long time Republican, the thing I'm most unhappy about Bush is how he allowed spending to get out of control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tricia Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I am thinking McCain will win. I too agree with some of you about the validity of our voting system. We are for Ron Paul here. He most likely won't win but at least I will be able to feel that I am being true to self.:bigear: Tricia http://www.mommyx12.blogspot.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Hood Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 Can't vote. I just don't know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6packofun Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 Obama. It's no surprise that the exact states that currently have voter registration fraud investigations just happen to be the same states where he's suddenly getting a little surge. LOL Please. The election process in this country is more disappointing than our choice of candidates this year! And I think it needs to be overhauled so that NO party has an advantage in any way through these tactics. I live in OH and am disgusted. Enough said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jojomojo Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 (edited) I am on the same page with you as far as fair election...I think McCain will win because I do not believe the 'polls' are reflective of our country..my grandmother who is 83 has never been polled in her life, (we had this discussion one night with family) nor has any of my relatives that live in a fairly rural family...also in order to be polled you have to be home to answer the phone....so then you have to consider your population really hitting the 'heart of America'...I think this election will teach us something about those polls....And many have caller ID and will NOT answer if they see it is a pollster because they don't trust their questions or would just rather not answer. Hey, I've been polled! More than I care for. It was truly bizarre too. They called with "positive McCain questions" first....nothing too detailed serious (basically, are you voting for McCain). Then I believe the same polling company called several times more, so I answered questions with the next call. They were agree/disagree questions. The person would say "Obama said such and such...." (all positive things he has promised and it dragged on and on) and I would have to agree or disagree. Then they would move to McCain statements and it was ALL very negative things that he has been accused of or has been said about him. Basically, by answering their questions I would be made out to be a crazy right wing republican that doesn't believe in all these great things Obama will do for our country, but yet I am fine and dandy with *insert negative thing (true, twisted or false) about McCain*. I stopped answering their questions after that, but they kept calling and calling. I had to get a bit rude with them to stop calling me with their partisan polls. So, basically...all that to say I don't care what the polls say :tongue_smilie: I don't know who will win though. I don't trust fairness in either party really (not necessarily distrust for the candidates themselves though....well, at least McCain lol). I don't trust the media at all (and their part in it all is way too big). Elections seems to be one big crapshoot, but I try to do my part :glare: Edited October 9, 2008 by jojomojo simple grammar sometimes escapes me lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mom to Aly Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 I think Obama will get more votes and that McCain will win because we haven't had a real election in years. It's just my OPINION (no bashing please and asking me for my "proof"). I think when Bush Sr. lost against Clinton the stage was set for making sure that our votes don't really count. The last two elections have shown us that! I will vote, but I know the machines are not going to count my vote. Who wants to place bets? Florida will be in the news again for botching yet another election! Ah, the Stalin quote: It's not the people who vote that count. It's the people that count the votes. Yes, I refused to call Bush "President" when he illegally took office during his first term. But then he was elected! I've never gotten over that one! I'm afraid to say it now, because I think I might jinx it--but I don't see how McCain can win--I won't say who will win, because I've decided I can jinx it--buy you know who should!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herbalgirl Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 I just have a feeling McCain will, especially with Palin now on the ticket. I think she will be appealing to women who may not have had any interest with McCain thus far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brigitte Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 I am voting for McCain, but I think Obama will win. Since I am trying to look at the brighter side of things these days, I think if Obama wins it won't be so bad. It will give the Republicans 4 years to find a good, solid candidate and to get their act together. Perhaps it will be the wake up call the Republicans need to get back on track. Of course, I still want McCain to win, but I think it will take a small miracle. :tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 Hey, I've been polled! More than I care for. It was truly bizarre too. They called with "positive McCain questions" first....nothing too detailed serious (basically, are you voting for McCain). Then I believe the same polling company called several times more, so I answered questions with the next call. They were agree/disagree questions. The person would say "Obama said such and such...." (all positive things he has promised and it dragged on and on) and I would have to agree or disagree. Then they would move to McCain statements and it was ALL very negative things that he has been accused of or has been said about him. Basically, by answering their questions I would be made out to be a crazy right wing republican that doesn't believe in all these great things Obama will do for our country, but yet I am fine and dandy with *insert negative thing (true, twisted or false) about McCain*. I stopped answering their questions after that, but they kept calling and calling. I had to get a bit rude with them to stop calling me with their partisan polls. So, basically...all that to say I don't care what the polls say :tongue_smilie: I don't know who will win though. I don't trust fairness in either party really (not necessarily distrust for the candidates themselves though....well, at least McCain lol). I don't trust the media at all (and their part in it all is way too big). Elections seems to be one big crapshoot, but I try to do my part :glare: Sounds like you've been the victim of "push polls". These aren't "real" polls conducted by the media, although they attempt to appear to be, instead they are nefarious attempts to influence votes by framing questions (usually unfairly) to try to break down a persons trust in their candidate. Usually these push-polls are operated outside official campaigns (for deniability purposes) but they are entirely partisan operations. Pretty slimy, but an all too common feature of politics these days. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cindyinTexas Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EV14xqelWxY Will Biden actually vote for Obama? Our economy right now cannot support on the job training. I feel like most are voting for an American Idol contestant. I cringe when someone says Obama is likable. This is not a beauty contest. If you plan to vote, you should research each candidate and make your own choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pam "SFSOM" in TN Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EV14xqelWxY Will Biden actually vote for Obama? Our economy right now cannot support on the job training. I feel like most are voting for an American Idol contestant. I cringe when someone says Obama is likable. This is not a beauty contest. If you plan to vote, you should research each candidate and make your own choice. You betcha! True. I've been saying that for a few weeks now. and... You betcha!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jami Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 I think if McCain had opposed the bailout he would have won handily. None of my friends are happy about it at all' date=' and they are die-hard Republicans for the most part. I am disgusted. I can't and never would vote Obama, and now I can't vote for McCain. Bleh.[/quote'] Yep. "Bleh" pretty much says it all for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pam "SFSOM" in TN Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 Ah, show me some facts, atleast I showed FACTS to support the liberal left illegally trying to cast votes....This is reckless, inflammatory, and irresponsible unless you have evidence to back it up... Where are the ACORN groups that helped Bush fix the election? The MEDIA claimed Florida for Gore which had a huge impact on voters, people were still heading to the voting stations and heard on the radio that Gore had won so they turned around and did not cast their vote...you don't call that stealing votes? Tara As an aside,Richard Hand was one of my bible professors at BJU back in the day. The author linked in the previous sentence, Rick Davis is McCain's campaign manager and director & corporate officer of the firm Davis Manafort, obviously doesn't mind that Tucker Eskew is now part of the McCain campaign. I just shudder when I remember what he did to McCain SC in 2000. It was disgusting, appalling, and deeply evil, IMO. This former intern to Lee Atwater learned his political lessons well. And now he's Gov. Palin's top campaign adviser. Strange bedfellows. As to the media? Well, we've always had a problem with a free media talking out and projecting winners of elections on the east coast and lowering turnout on the west coast. Is that "stealing" votes? I'm more of a mind that it's the rough that comes with the smooth when you have a free press. First amendment lover that I am, I'm loathe to say "shush" to the press, even when they do something I don't care for. Freedom isn't always pretty, and it isn't always neat and tidy. I do think in a geographically large country like ours, we need to remind people that it ain't over til the fluffy lady sings. Remind them over and over. Perhaps that's a task a free press might consider taking on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pam "SFSOM" in TN Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 Hey, I've been polled! More than I care for. It was truly bizarre too. They called with "positive McCain questions" first....nothing too detailed serious (basically, are you voting for McCain). Then I believe the same polling company called several times more, so I answered questions with the next call. They were agree/disagree questions. The person would say "Obama said such and such...." (all positive things he has promised and it dragged on and on) and I would have to agree or disagree. Then they would move to McCain statements and it was ALL very negative things that he has been accused of or has been said about him. Basically, by answering their questions I would be made out to be a crazy right wing republican that doesn't believe in all these great things Obama will do for our country, but yet I am fine and dandy with *insert negative thing (true, twisted or false) about McCain*. I stopped answering their questions after that, but they kept calling and calling. I had to get a bit rude with them to stop calling me with their partisan polls. So, basically...all that to say I don't care what the polls say :tongue_smilie: I don't know who will win though. I don't trust fairness in either party really (not necessarily distrust for the candidates themselves though....well, at least McCain lol). I don't trust the media at all (and their part in it all is way too big). Elections seems to be one big crapshoot, but I try to do my part :glare: Yep, Spy Car's right: You've been push polled. Shame on them. But that's not the same as a legitimate poll. A legitimate poll from a legitimate organization that cares about reliability (and who hopes to sell themselves as accurate and reliable) will be very neutral. You'll be able to tell the difference EASILY. Really. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pam "SFSOM" in TN Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 I am voting for McCain, but I think Obama will win. Since I am trying to look at the brighter side of things these days, I think if Obama wins it won't be so bad. It will give the Republicans 4 years to find a good, solid candidate and to get their act together. Perhaps it will be the wake up call the Republicans need to get back on track. Of course, I still want McCain to win, but I think it will take a small miracle. :tongue_smilie: Dh thinks the best of all possible outcomes is that there are opposite parties in power in the Congress and the White House. He insists that it doesn't matter which is where, as long as one is a watchdog for the other. His view is that trouble always happens when too much power is concentrated in one party. I find that viewpoint interesting. Not sure how it bears out in reality, but I do find it worth thinking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jojomojo Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 Yep, Spy Car's right: You've been push polled. Shame on them. But that's not the same as a legitimate poll. A legitimate poll from a legitimate organization that cares about reliability (and who hopes to sell themselves as accurate and reliable) will be very neutral. You'll be able to tell the difference EASILY. Really. :001_smile: Either way though, the effect is, as a Republican having received those offensive calls, I have absolutely no interest in participating in any polls (I received about 5 or 6 calls, I believe only 4, maybe 5, was from that one company). Like stated above, there are definitely cohort effects concerning who pollsters actually get feedback from (even with legitimate ones). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pam "SFSOM" in TN Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 Either way though, the effect is, as a Republican having received those offensive calls, I have absolutely no interest in participating in any polls (I received about 5 or 6 calls, I believe only 4, maybe 5, was from that one company). Like stated above, there are definitely cohort effects concerning who pollsters actually get feedback from (even with legitimate ones). Yeah, I know. I hear you. Jewish voters in Florida felt the same way last month, and if I were in your (or their) shoes, I'd definitely not want to answer my phone for awhile, either. I wonder how the change to cell phones affects the accuracy of polling nowadays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KidsHappen Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 I am thinking McCain will win. I too agree with some of you about the validity of our voting system. We are for Ron Paul here. He most likely won't win but at least I will be able to feel that I am being true to self.:bigear: Tricia http://www.mommyx12.blogspot.com It is not even an option for us here in TN. We could write him in but it would be an automatic throw away vote. I am really torn about what to do. I have always voted Libertarian but I really don't like Barr. I have been seriously considering not voting for the first time since I have been eligible. :glare: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aggie Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 It's difficult to tell, but the media has a lot of people believing that Obama has won already. Amazing that newsreaders can know that! If he does win, and if the Congress has a Dem majority, and if they are able to put all his plans in action and not raise taxes on 95% of the people, where is the money going to come from? Well, they'll tax businesses. Businesses, as we know, are in business to make money. To make a profit. If that profit is taxed more, the business will most likely raise the price of their product or service so their profits don't drop. Don't think for a minute that they are going to, out of the goodness of their hearts, take that loss. If you were in business to support your family or employees or shareholders, what would you do? You would be forced to raise the price of your products. We have dear friends who own a dairy farm. On paper, they probably make $300k/yr. When their taxes are raised because they now are *wealthy*, why, they'll just pass that savings on to the consumer. In my little corner of the world, we pay nearly $5/gal for milk now. What will it be when the dairy is taxed more? When 'windfall' profits on oil companies are taxed, the oil companies will raise the cost of gas. We've already seen what happens when petro products go up....*everything* goes up. Food didn't go up because farmers were taxed, it went up because of the cost of transportation. They'll also tax the rich, right? Isn't it ironic that Obama is rich and he's going to tax himself? And that the rich congressmen and women are going to vote YES to that? They will make sure that they don't have to pay taxes on their money. If they wanted to give their money to the government, they would have done so already. Obama says he's going to *ask* the top 1% to pay more taxes. Is he in that top 1%? I doubt it. :glare: My dh and I don't mind paying our fair share of taxes. We don't. We are happy to pay for a strong military, and to pay our President (although we're not thrilled with the retirement benefits of the President and Congress;) ). But more government programs means more tax dollars from someone. Nothing will be free. Your federal income taxes *may* not go up, but something will, probably the cost of goods and services that we enjoy now. I have no doubt that Obama's heart is in the right place in that he wants everyone to enjoy success and happiness. His methods, if implemented, will be disastrous. IMO :) Cheers and Have a Good Day, Aggie ps....This is interesting.. http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=75586 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astrid Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 I'm not sure about whether elections have been fixed, but dh and I watched a documentary about it that was downright scary. I wish I could remember the title of it. It was very frightening to see how easy it was to fix a voting machine so that no matter what votes were entered the final print-out showed whatever results the person making the print-out desired. Maybe it will be on again soon since it's election season. And trained election moderator, I take exception to the insinuation that the pollworkers are fixing the printouts. In the machines we use, that is not possible. They have to buttons....."yes" and "no." All we can do is tell the machine to print out the total. I've been to extensive training on these machines (as well as the old lever machines) held by our Secretary of State, and in my opinion, there is MUCH more room for human intervention with the old lever machines. I cannot speak to any other kind of voting machine, because I've only had experience with the old lever machines and now the new diebold tabulator machines, as that is what our state required. And hey, I"m a Democrat, so believe me, I could cry "foul" just as loudly as the rest of you after witnessing the 2000 and 2004 elections. But a lot has changed since then, specifically because of those issues. astrid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melissa in FL Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EV14xqelWxY Will Biden actually vote for Obama? Our economy right now cannot support on the job training. I feel like most are voting for an American Idol contestant. I cringe when someone says Obama is likable. This is not a beauty contest. If you plan to vote, you should research each candidate and make your own choice. Cindy, Did you see this one? I like what Biden says here even better! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3VBAbqjhvA&feature=relatedBiden interview Melissa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LilyK Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 I have no doubt that Obama will win this election. Those of you who think that the Republican party rigs all the elections in a mass, diabolical conspiracy, rest assured. Your man will win. I will issue a public apology on this board if he doesn't. The state of the economy makes it near impossible for anybody in Bush's party to win. Perhaps, rightly so. But you combine that with the "media's little darling" treatment he has gotten from the MSM, and he is a slam dunk. Mark my words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pam "SFSOM" in TN Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 But you combine that with the "media's little darling" treatment he has gotten from the MSM, and he is a slam dunk. Mark my words. Mmmm, well. It's funny how two perfectly intelligent, rational people (that is, you and me :D) can see the same mainstream media in such completely different ways. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mamagistra Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 And trained election moderator, I take exception to the insinuation that the pollworkers are fixing the printouts. In the machines we use, that is not possible. They have to buttons....."yes" and "no." All we can do is tell the machine to print out the total. I've been to extensive training on these machines (as well as the old lever machines) held by our Secretary of State, and in my opinion, there is MUCH more room for human intervention with the old lever machines. In the documentary I saw (Hacking Democracy), the chips in the computerized voting machines were hackable by an outsider. Also, the machines could be altered to register the wrong vote (i.e. you vote Obama, but the computer tabulates a vote for McCain). The chips for these machines were prone to interception and tampering. It had nothing to do at all with the poll workers themselves, IIRC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peek a Boo Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 And trained election moderator, I take exception to the insinuation that the pollworkers are fixing the printouts. In the machines we use, that is not possible. They have to buttons....."yes" and "no." All we can do is tell the machine to print out the total. I've been to extensive training on these machines (as well as the old lever machines) held by our Secretary of State, and in my opinion, there is MUCH more room for human intervention with the old lever machines. I cannot speak to any other kind of voting machine, because I've only had experience with the old lever machines and now the new diebold tabulator machines, as that is what our state required. And hey, I"m a Democrat, so believe me, I could cry "foul" just as loudly as the rest of you after witnessing the 2000 and 2004 elections. But a lot has changed since then, specifically because of those issues. astrid You really don't need to take exception --it wasn't a personal jab at you, just a statement of facts that have happened before. each state can choose its own machines [does anyone have a state-by-state list??], and not every pollworker is honest --they are people, and fallible. There are quite a few people out there who simply refuse to acknowledge when they or another are actually breaking the law. they will justify the illegal actions of themselves or another because they truly believe that it ISN't wrong or even "illegal." I'm sure that many pollworkers are ethical people. It only takes a few bad apples to spoil the rep for an industry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cathmom Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 I am undecided. Neither of them is going to do what I want. McCain will probably be more on the side of things I approve of. So I will most likely vote McCain even though I won't be happy doing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colleen Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 Our economy right now cannot support on the job training.I feel like most are voting for an American Idol contestant. I cringe when someone says Obama is likable. This is not a beauty contest. Hehehe...what an interesting choice of words.;) You betcha! True. I've been saying that for a few weeks now. and... You betcha!! This soccer mom hears what you're sayin' and I'm agreein' with ya.:D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gandpsmommy Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 And trained election moderator, I take exception to the insinuation that the pollworkers are fixing the printouts. In the machines we use, that is not possible. They have to buttons....."yes" and "no." All we can do is tell the machine to print out the total. I've been to extensive training on these machines (as well as the old lever machines) held by our Secretary of State, and in my opinion, there is MUCH more room for human intervention with the old lever machines. I cannot speak to any other kind of voting machine, because I've only had experience with the old lever machines and now the new diebold tabulator machines, as that is what our state required. And hey, I"m a Democrat, so believe me, I could cry "foul" just as loudly as the rest of you after witnessing the 2000 and 2004 elections. But a lot has changed since then, specifically because of those issues. astrid I'm sorry, Astrid, I used poor phrasing. Debra has it right; it wasn't the pollworkers or the person who actually printed out the result who tampered with the votes, it was hackers changing the results so that when the printout came out it reflected the hacker's decision instead of the voters'. I didn't mean to insult people such as you who work hard to help election day go smoothly! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gandpsmommy Posted October 9, 2008 Share Posted October 9, 2008 Was it Hacking Democracy? We saw it, too. And shuddered. :glare: That was it, Debra. It was quite disturbing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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