What would you call dd this fall? (grade level question)

[ravinlunachick]

My youngest dd, Boo, is most definitely ready to start formal schooling. She's been hanging around at the table with us, doing the occasional worksheet and a HWT preschool book at her own request. She knows all her letters and sounds, can read CVC words, and is beginning to want to write words. Last night, she wrote the word "RAVIOLI" on a piece of paper and told me it was her supper request. :laugh: She can count to 12, and is starting to develop an idea of the concept of addition. I've recently introduced her to c-rods.

 

Anyway, I need to decide what to call her. We're sort of unintentional homeschoolers; we began with the idea that we would get my oldest caught up and then send her back, but now it's obvious that homeschooling is without a doubt the best option for her, so it looks like we're in this for at least the next few years. Little dd has a late birthday (mid-Nov.), so she wouldn't be eligible for public kindergarten until August of 2014. I can only imagine how far ahead of "letter of the day" she'll be by then, so we're probably also committing to at least a few years of hs'ing for her as well.

 

I know that for many here, grade level labels are arbitrary and flexible. Boo tells people now that she is a preschooler, and she keeps asking when she can be homeschooled liked Bug. I know it would make her over the moon happy to be able to say she's a kindergartener, and the work she'd be doing would be K-level, after all. The thing is, if/when she makes the transition to ps, her birthday will put her a full grade level behind, and I'm not sure we could do anything to change that, even if we wanted to.

 

So, do I just tell her she's a 4-K'er? She's also begging to start Girl Scouts in the fall, and Daisies have to be 5 or in Kindergarten. If she's homeschooled, I can say she's in kindergarten so she can start in September with everyone else.

[athena1277]

I have several friends whose children have October birthdays, which would make them miss the K cutoff date by a few weeks. Since they are homeschoolers and felt like the child was ready, they started them in K at 4yo/almost 5yo. They are all doing well with school a few years later. I would start her in K. You can always slow down if it becomes too hard for her.

[Wheres Toto]

I usually call the kids what they would be according to state law, even though they may be working at a different level.

 

Double check with Daisy's because most of the programs around here (Girl Scouts, Boy Scouts, 4-H) will go by what grade they would be in according to state law.

[ravinlunachick]

The subject has come up before in our troop (allowing girls in a technically too-old level), and our council has said it's up to the troop leaders' discretion, assuming the gap isn't too wide. Our troop leader has said she'd be fine with it, if I wanted to go ahead and start Boo in September.

[Ali in OR]

We state their grade as what they would be in public school. That doesn't mean she's not homeschooling yet, that doesn't mean she does pre-K level work. Keep moving at her pace. But as they get older and there are age requirements for sports leagues and other activities, it's nice to be with your age and grade peers. My youngest is a December birthday and has been home schooled since her sister was in K, so she was 2, almost 3 when we started. She was a preschooler for 3 years! Now she is a 4th grader, just like all of her soccer teammates. She does well in her schoolwork, she is confident, and we have no regrets with not pushing her to be a young 5th grader.

[Starr]

NY has a December cut off date. ;) She'd be one of the young ones in her class here. I wouldn't worry about going to ps. You will have to work that out as it comes in any event.

[Farrar]

Go by her grade legally. She's a whiz now, but some kids slow down the rapid learning (and others don't). If you ever have to send her to school, you don't want to have to "demote" her. And for the vast number of activities, like sports, swimming, gymnastics, Sunday school, etc. it'll be required or better or both for her to be with her age mates.

 

Of course, academically, do whatever you like.

[SKL]

I would put her as a Kindergartener starting next fall. If she is way ahead of her age peers when she starts public school, maybe a school will accept her a year ahead. You might have to get the gifted people to get involved. If you think this may not be possible, tell your daughter that some kids do KG for two years. It's true, right?

 

If you're thinking of saying she's finishing KG in June 2013 and then going into 1st later in 2013, I think that would be somewhat of a stretch as far as getting others to recognize this.

 

FWIW, my daughter with a January birthday just turned 6 and is in 1st grade. She is well advanced (compared to 1st graders) in all academic areas, especially reading. She would have done fine academically in 2nd grade, but for us, a one-year acceleration seemed to be in our best overall interest.

[momofkhm]

I have several friends whose children have October birthdays, which would make them miss the K cutoff date by a few weeks. Since they are homeschoolers and felt like the child was ready, they started them in K at 4yo/almost 5yo. They are all doing well with school a few years later. I would start her in K. You can always slow down if it becomes too hard for her.

 

:iagree: This is my youngest. He missed the state cut-off by a week. But he was ready and so I started him. He is the youngest in all his classes that I can say how old he is. Our co-op uses the cut-off date so he always has a year of classes that are "young" for him before he can move on.

[Ottakee]

I would call her a Young 5 which is what they do for the kids with late birthdays before they are the age for K. It gives them an extra year for maturity. You can certainly TEACH her at her level. I know in K at my neice's school they are way beyond the letter of the week and doing some solid reading and writing.

 

My worry would be that as she gets older the maturity level of the kids will be a year or more beyond her. I know it is a long ways off but would you rather have her be the older child in her grade/class/activity or one of the very youngest?

 

It can also be harder if they graduate at 17 and have 6 months or so before they turn 18 as many jobs, etc. limit to 18 and above.

 

It is also much easier to put her ahead a grade years down the road than it would be to have to hold her back for academic or social reasons.

 

There are many kids in the public schools that enter school reading, writing, etc. so it isn't just homeschool kids that are "ahead"----and often times by 4th/5th grade things really level out.

[twoxcell]

Call her preK and then do whatever level of work she needs. I have a dd with an Oct. 31st b-day. I started K work with her a year before PS cut off but I'm keeping her with her PS grade level label.I figure it gives more wiggle room.

[ravinlunachick]

That's an excellent point about the leveling out! I hadn't even thought about social issues down the road.

 

I have a late December birthday myself, but kindy wasn't required back in the Dark Ages, so I just started K-5 in January and only did half a year. I spent a long time being bored out of my skull. I was always the youngest kid, and I graduated at 17, like someone above mentioned. However, I grew up mostly around adults and no peers outside of school until I was ~9 or so. I always felt older than my age. I could see Boo being the same way, as she is always determined to be around her big sister and do whatever the bigger kids are doing at the park or whatever.

 

But....that could end, or come back to bite us in the you know what. Hmmm. I will talk to dh about the possibility of doing two years of kindergarten here at home. She's young enough that I don't think she'd object, as long as she was being challenged.

 

Oh, and to answer a previous question, I'm talking about just continuing on with our informal sorts of lessons until August 2013, and then telling her she's a kindergartener. She's not in any sports or lessons of any sort yet, so if we did the two years of K, that would level it out for those purposes.

[*Jen*]

My daughter was at this point this year. We called her Pre-K even though she is doing K/1st grade work. But for things like Sunday School and sports we go by the state cutoffs so she is in pre-school 4 / pre-k classes this year and next fall will move into the Kindergarten classes.

[Dmmetler]

I would stick with what she is according to the state. My DD was actually formally early entered into K (late Nov birthday) with a waiver from our local PS and a gIEP, so legally she's a 3rd grader. However, extracurricular activities and anything designated for homeschoolers tends to automatically place her by age-so considered her a kindergartner even when she'd finished K in PS, and now, refuse to let her take 3rd-5th grade classes at age 8. And for academic competitions, which DO go by grade level, being grade skipped means she's always competing with kids who are a year or more older.

 

 

You can, and should, teach her where she is-but the disadvantages of officially skipping outweigh the advantages unless a DC is going to be in a brick and mortar school setting. If DD were to go back to PS tomorrow, I'd be glad that she was in 3rd grade instead of 2nd for academic reasons. But as a homeschooler, that doesn't apply.

[myfunnybunch]

I voted Cupcake. :p

 

I was in the same position with my oldest son, and had the same dilemma. In retrospect, it didn't really matter what we called it at that age. You really can call it Cupcake Level if you want.

 

When my son would have started kindergarten with the same-age neighbor kids, we started consistently saying he was a kindergartener, even though academically, he was working between K to 3rd grade level, depending on the subject. Choosing a grade level was helpful at that point, as so many non-homeschool extracurriculars use grade levels rather than age for eligibility and placement. But before then, it really didn't matter what we called it. I think we called it K4 the one time we wanted to sign up for a science class

 

Cat

[Luanne]

I don't think school cut-off dates are worth too much. There is the assumption that all 5 year olds are in exactly the same place and that definitely is not the case. I personally wish I could start a school where children are excepted into K a the point in which they are ready. This may be age 4 or it might not be until age 7. It differs from child to child. I don't think children should automatically be grouped with the exact same age all the time anyway. Part of school is to learn how to live in real life, not just to educate the child. I don't know anyone who works with only their exact same age.

[Mélie]

Unless you're absolutely convinced that she will always be better off with kids a year older, I would call her "Pre-kindergarten" or "Junior Kindergarten" in the fall and not start her in Girl Scouts until the following fall. I'm not sure how the age groups work, but I would try to have her with her age peers for activities that aren't academic. With a birthday in November, she'll be on the older end, but definitely not the oldest, which I think is preferably to always being the very youngest by several months.

[Ellie]

If she is not kindergarten age this fall (according to her date of birth and the cut-off in your state), then no, you cannot say that she's a kindergartener. And if you fudge and say she is so that she can join a GS troop, then she'll probably be considerably younger than most of the other girls, yes?

 

But that has nothing to do with what she's capable of learning. Why would you think that you have to say that she's a kindergartener in order to teach her the things she's eager to learn? :confused1:

 

I'm a firm believer in using grade-level labels according to whatever the cut-off is in one's state while at the same time teaching whatever the children are able and ready to learn. The first has to do with the way that children are grouped for activities such as Sunday school or scouts or sports; the second has to do with actual teaching and learning and is not related to the first at all.

[catz]

I'd use the state level cut off for grade naming purposes and use whatever materials academically that makes sense. I call my kids 3rd and 6th graders but they're both working well ahead of that in some areas. And my 6th grader has a fall birthday. I will not push them ahead unless I'm absolutely certain they're going to be fully ready for an early college experience. I assume they'll dual enroll as high schoolers at some point and it's not uncommon for GT homeschoolers to do that locally starting at 8th or 9th grade.

[SKL]

As far as the social apect, I think it could go either way. November isn't that late of a birthday IMO. If most of her friends are already older than she is, then I don't see it hurting her to hang with kids a little older. I think this is something for the child's mom to resolve based on observation of how the kids relate.

 

My dd was not allowed to participate in "school age" gymnastics classes until she was a month shy of 6yo, despite being in the 1st grade. They did let her attend school-age class for make-ups a little early. I didn't see any difference between her and the slightly older kids.

 

I don't agree that it's best to be the oldest in the class/group, based on my own and my kids' experience. But I may be in the minority on that view.

[Crimson Wife]

I would call her either pre-k or K4 this fall and K5 when she's legally old enough to enroll in PS K. Teach her using whatever level materials are appropriate for each subject.

 

My kids have fall birthdays just before the cutoff (which was then Dec. 2nd). Both were ready to start K at not-quite-5 because they were reading. However, only my girl was ready to move on to 1st at not-quite-6. My DS needed to do a "transition" year between K & 1st. Mostly because of lagging fine motor skills and a short attention span. For the purposes of our cover school, it was technically repeating K but I just continued on where he was.

 

If I could run my year Jan-Dec rather than Aug-Jul then I would've promoted him to 1st in Jan '12 and 2nd this month. But because of the cover school's calendar, he won't be officially in 2nd until this fall.

[Kathryn]

Both of mine miss the cutoff by not much. I'd call her K4 and that's what I plan on doing with with my next son. With my first, I called him K a year early, and first a year early. This year, we decided to call him what he'd be in school age wise, so it's his second first grade year, even though his academics moved on to second grade.

[QueenCat]

I can only imagine how far ahead of "letter of the day" she'll be by then, so we're probably also committing to at least a few years of hs'ing for her as well.

 

 

Kindergarten tends to focus on reading, not letters of the day. I've taught pre-k and assisted in kindergarten classes. Children who did not know their letters and sounds on the first day of kindergarten were considered "behind" by our county's standards. Basic reading skills were expected by the end of the year.

[blondeviolin]

My son is in the same position. We call this year "Junior K" because he bristles at the thought of being called "preschool." His main focus right now is becoming a more fluent reader. Like another poster, he would be better placed if the school year ran from Jan-Dec. Luckily for him, he is both ahead and homeschooled, so he can "level up" when appropriate.

 

His issue is compounded by the growing disparity between him and his agemates.

[ravinlunachick]

I don't think school cut-off dates are worth too much. There is the assumption that all 5 year olds are in exactly the same place and that definitely is not the case. I personally wish I could start a school where children are excepted into K a the point in which they are ready. This may be age 4 or it might not be until age 7. It differs from child to child. I don't think children should automatically be grouped with the exact same age all the time anyway. Part of school is to learn how to live in real life, not just to educate the child. I don't know anyone who works with only their exact same age.

 

I wish the same thing. While I think it's generally true that kids with late birthdays are somewhat behind their peers (particularly boys, IME), I don't think it's a Law of the Universe or anything, as it is often treated.

 

 

If she is not kindergarten age this fall (according to her date of birth and the cut-off in your state), then no, you cannot say that she's a kindergartener. And if you fudge and say she is so that she can join a GS troop, then she'll probably be considerably younger than most of the other girls, yes? But that has nothing to do with what she's capable of learning. Why would you think that you have to say that she's a kindergartener in order to teach her the things she's eager to learn? :confused1: I'm a firm believer in using grade-level labels according to whatever the cut-off is in one's state while at the same time teaching whatever the children are able and ready to learn. The first has to do with the way that children are grouped for activities such as Sunday school or scouts or sports; the second has to do with actual teaching and learning and is not related to the first at all.

 

I don't think I have to say she's a kindergartener in order to teach her at her level. Calling her that would simply have some benefits for the short term. :)

 

I didn't mean for the "letter of the day" comment to come off as snarky as it may have sounded. It's not that I think I have Einstein on my hands, but I'm intimately familiar with the local public school's K-4, K-5, and 1st grade curriculum, as I taught for 8 years before ds was born. While it's true that K-5'ers are expected to know their letter names and sounds, beginning literacy is still a huge chunk of the first half of the year, and unless something unexpected happens between now and 2014, Bug will most likely be beyond even what they do at the end of the year by the time she's eligible for ps kindergarten. Sure, there's always a range of levels, but IME, the kids who are so far ahead of their peers academically tend to get ignored; the teachers do their planned units and teach to the middle while helping the bottom catch up. That is by far the focus. It's the rare situation where a teacher would devote extra effort to a kid already had all those basic skills down.

 

Crimson Wife, I too wish the years ran Jan-Dec. Of course, if ps were off the table for good, I'd have the freedom to do that.

[MissKNG]

 

Little dd has a late birthday (mid-Nov.), so she wouldn't be eligible for public kindergarten until August of 2014.

 

 

Personally, I go by what she would be in ps and according to the above, I would call her PreK. In my state (NY), she would be a K'er since we have a December 1st cut off.

[Pamela H in Texas]

A couple thoughts:

• First, I'd generally go based off her birthday and the school's cut off.
  
• Second, she is not advanced for a kid in HeadStart here (count to 30, read/write all letters and "key" words, some sight words, try to sound out/segment, etc).
  
• Third, Kindy is definitely not letter of the week in PS here (by November, they should be able to do 30 sight words, sounding out words, and writing 3-6 sentence paragraphs)
  

 

The main thing is that you can teach her whatever you want whenever you want and she is ready.

 

As for what to call her? I'd call her a pre-K'er.

 

I scrolled up a little. There is no real reason you can't go Jan to Dec, btw. The great thing is that with homeschooling, you call the shots :) Oh, and I also like the Junior Kindergarten thing. I have one who would be red-shirted if he attended school for a few reasons so saying jr and sr kindy is pretty cool.

[SKL]

A couple thoughts:

• First, I'd generally go based off her birthday and the school's cut off.
  
• Second, she is not advanced for a kid in HeadStart here (count to 30, read/write all letters and "key" words, some sight words, try to sound out/segment, etc).
  
• Third, Kindy is definitely not letter of the week in PS here (by November, they should be able to do 30 sight words, sounding out words, and writing 3-6 sentence paragraphs)
  

The main thing is that you can teach her whatever you want whenever you want and she is ready.

 

As for what to call her? I'd call her a pre-K'er.

 

I scrolled up a little. There is no real reason you can't go Jan to Dec, btw. The great thing is that with homeschooling, you call the shots :) Oh, and I also like the Junior Kindergarten thing. I have one who would be red-shirted if he attended school for a few reasons so saying jr and sr kindy is pretty cool.

 

I agree to some extent with the bolded. But if the child is already reading a bit at just 4yo without having much instruction, to me it seems likely she will be years ahead in reading by fall 2014. It's not clear where the child will end up in math, but that's because she hasn't been taught yet. To me, being old in the class is fine if you're average or below, but if you're way above average, there might be an advantage to being on the young side. The opportunity for social growth can balance out the lack of academic challenge.

 

I think it is a good idea to check out what kids are doing at each grade level based on your state's standards. In my state, kids are generally expected to start reading in KG, but many are promoted to 1st without really being readers. I hear people in other districts describing much easier or much more rigorous standards.

[SKL]

 

Sure, there's always a range of levels, but IME, the kids who are so far ahead of their peers academically tend to get ignored; the teachers do their planned units and teach to the middle while helping the bottom catch up. That is by far the focus. It's the rare situation where a teacher would devote extra effort to a kid already had all those basic skills down.

 

 

 

This has been true for my dd. There is no teaching at her ability level, but at least, being accelerated a year, she is occasionally exposed to something she hasn't seen before. She also has access to a better range of books for independent reading.

 

I am also very glad that she doesn't have to deal with some of the "age-appropriate" disruptive behaviors that are common in the grade below her. I don't think she's missing anything by not having to listen to other kids cry and whine and have potty accidents.

[Pamela H in Texas]

I would go check out the school and what they are doing in Kindy if the child is going to end up there. My experience is that the teachers in kindy are more than capable of accomodating K-3 learning levels within the classroom and do it well at that. And if a child is gifted, one grade skip likely isn't going to be all that helpful since kiddo will continue picking up things faster and easier than the average student. And if the kid isn't going to school, then why does it even matter? At home we can do whatever level of work we want regardless of what we call it.

 

I'm talking from experience. I had a child starting algebra at 7. A school couldn't have accomodated that and a seven year old is not an 8th grader. I messed with calling her different grades at different times, but in the end? It didn't really work out to pick a grade until middle school AGE. I should have just called her her age-based grade until then. Same with my kid who was "behind." If I had just waited until he was 12 to pick a grade level, I would have saved myself a lot of grief.

[ChristusG]

I always say my kids are whatever grade level they'd legally be in if they went to PS. This leaves no confusion when putting them in classes at church or extracurricular activities. They can work at whatever level they need to at home.

[Zebra]

I wanted to have my daughter go "gradeless" too, but it just became too much of a thing. She's signed up for classes through the city, and they always want to know her grade level. I also figured that if she couldn't be homeschooled for some reason in the future, legally she would have to go to public school and it just makes more sense to say she's whatever grade level the ps says she is.

 

Even though I hate going along with the ps on anything, I think this is one area where it just makes life easier.

[JessReplanted]

I have always just gone by the child's age - I think it is the easiest solution. So, I'd call your daughter a preschooler, even if she's doing K work.

[MFA323]

We call our dd6 a K-er this year. She turned 5 in July of 2011, so she made the cut-off last year and was doing K work last year. We wanted to give her the benefit of an extra year of maturity compared to her classmates in college and if we ever do PS. She is doing Singapore Math 2A, reading chapter books, and excelling at ancient Greek using a college text, but we call it Kindergarten. She knows that most other kids her age are in 1st and that her academic level is way beyond K, but she doesn't care. We have talked with her about why we made our decision.

I certainly wouldn't push your dd ahead. I was hs'ed and started college classes at 14. I went away to college at 17. I was ready academically, but I wish I'd waited. I didn't get into trouble or anything, but I would have had a better experience if I hadn't always been younger and less mature than everyone else.