CC- would this bug you or am I being too sensitive?

[bethben]

Our church played clips from another PG-13 movie - this time the Lord of the Rings series - during church and there is no kids church, just nursery care. Not nice clips, but pretty graphic evil monster type clips. I spent most of the sermon outside with another homeschooling mom and two of her younger boys. #3ds is pretty visual and we keep him away from that type of stuff because it can give him nightmares. This has happened before (and we went through the right channels but pretty much got told, "there's a point to the movie clip, it's OK") - at least we got a warning beforehand this time. As in, "clips shown today may be disturbing for younger children." Yes, the clips had a point - this time spiritual warfare, but I don't like going to church only to be warned that the sermon may not be for little eyes. Big sigh...My husband doesn't see it to be too big of a deal since there is a good point made. I have trouble with all those little early elementary kids in there seeing it.

 

Beth

 

If I am being too sensitive, let me know- I won't be miffed.

Edited August 5, 2012 by bethben

[NotSoObvious]

I can't help but respond even though I'm not Christian (but we do go to church).

 

This would be a BIG deal for me. I don't let my kids watch movies like that and I have a daughter who is terrified of most movies. I can't imagine knowing that she was attaching those fearful feelings to a church service!

 

Fear or not, my kids aren't allowed to watch pg13 movies, so why would I want them seeing clips?

 

I don't think you are being sensitive at all. fWIW, my family could not attend a church that did this because of my dd.

[marbel]

My opinion - not only are you not being too sensitive, but movie clips don't belong in a worship service. Before or after, but not during the actual worship. Just my opinion. ;)

[Kathleen in VA]

My opinion - not only are you not being too sensitive, but movie clips don't belong in a worship service. Before or after, but not during the actual worship. Just my opinion. ;)

 

:iagree:I'd be looking for another church. Who cares if the clip is relevant to the message? Movies during a worship service? Not at all appropriate - I don't care what movie you're talking about.

[ThisIsTheDay]

I don't believe you are being too sensitive. Considering there is no where else for the kids to go, I would also be upset that my pastor somehow felt this was appropriate for the service.

 

I admit, I have a hard time with many kinds of videos often shown in church. I prefer that the teachings be directly from the Bible. Obviously, there are some that would be entirely appropriate, but I don't think we need pop culture images shown to prove any point on spiritual warfare. (Sigh. Yes, I can head toward legalism, so I'll stop.)

[hsmom2011]

My opinion - not only are you not being too sensitive, but movie clips don't belong in a worship service. Before or after, but not during the actual worship. Just my opinion. ;)

 

 

:iagree: I would not be happy about this at all. :glare:

[PeacefulChaos]

Our church played clips from another PG-13 movie - this time the Lord of the Rings series - during church and there is no kids church, just nursery care. Not nice clips, but pretty graphic evil monster type clips. I spent most of the sermon outside with another homeschooling mom and two of her younger boys. #3ds is pretty visual and we keep him away from that type of stuff because it can give him nightmares. This has happened before (and we went through the right channels but pretty much got told, "there's a point to the movie clip, it's OK") - at least we got a warning beforehand this time. As in, "clips shown today may be disturbing for younger children." Yes, the clips had a point - this time spiritual warfare, but I don't like going to church only to be warned that the sermon may not be for little eyes. Big sigh...My husband doesn't see it to be too big of a deal since there is a good point made. I have trouble with all those little early elementary kids in there seeing it.

 

Beth

 

If I am being too sensitive, let me know- I won't be miffed.

 

Well, I don't know.

I can see both sides. On one hand, I can see where this could be bothersome to those with young kids. In this case, I think it was a great idea to have the warning before the video clips. Were the clips throughout the service, or together in a montage that you could go out for and then come back in for the sermon itself? If it was a one time thing/montage, then I see no problem with it, as it did have a good point. (Note: I wouldn't have a problem with it, personally, if it was throughout if the scenes were more child appropriate. However, I think that it would be more mindful of the staff/pastor if they would limit the stuff that isn't appropriate for children to a shorter clip.)

Now, I can also see the other side. I personally don't think that pastors should have to 'dumb down' their sermons because of kids in the audience. (This is why I actually don't prefer family-integrated services personally.) So I can see where, if there is a point to be made that is a good one to those who are not children, it is unfortunate to have to edit that point for the sake of the children there.

So I guess I'm kind of up in the air. Clear as mud? :)

[Mrs Mungo]

If they want to continue with those types of messages, then I think they need a separate children's church. You can't keep forcing the moms to go stand outside with the kids, that is stupid.

[PeacefulChaos]

My opinion - not only are you not being too sensitive, but movie clips don't belong in a worship service. Before or after, but not during the actual worship. Just my opinion. ;)

 

We did this on Easter of 2011. We sang the song that is being played with the video (the choir) as the video played. It was beautiful. Maybe not everyone's cuppa, but it was amazing, IMO. :leaving:

[Annie G]

My opinion - not only are you not being too sensitive, but movie clips don't belong in a worship service. Before or after, but not during the actual worship. Just my opinion. ;)

 

:iagree: It's just not necessary.

[Aggie]

IME and IMO, if this is the only way a pastor can make the sermon interesting/educational/visual to the congregation, you need a new church or a new pastor.

 

I haven't let my ds see LOTR because he's not old enough to read and understand the books, so a LOTR clip would infuriate me for several reasons.

 

Too bad there aren't any examples of spiritual warfare in the Bible the pastor could have used.:glare:

[Kathryn]

If they want to continue with those types of messages, then I think they need a separate children's church. You can't keep forcing the moms to go stand outside with the kids, that is stupid.

 

:iagree:

[bethben]

I thought it would be one clip and then return to the sermon. So we all returned to the sermon. 10 minutes later, another clip. So, I just stayed out because I didn't want to be so disruptive getting up and down. It doesn't happen that often, but I am spitting mad and don't have anywhere to go with it.

Beth

[Laurie4b]

Are there just very few young families in the church? If other parents chose to let their kids stay in the service, then you have to respect their parenting decisions. If there were only two of you in the lobby and a bunch more in the service, then your kids may well be more sensitive than most to the actual clip shown.

 

If your dh doesn't think it's a big deal, I think you should go with that.

 

If there were childcare options and if there was warning beforehand, I would have no problem with it. I would also not have a problem with clips from a PG 13 movie being shown if the actual clips were G rated. I would probably be somewhat annoyed if I felt it was best for my kids to leave in a similar situation, but I wouldn't campaign over it.

 

I can see some significant spiritual illustrations that could be drawn from LOTR; however, monsters are generically scary to most children, so it seems inconsiderate of the children present to do so. I do think that sometimes there are things that need to be talked about in church (porn use, for instance) that are not for little ears and in that case a warning is appropriate. But generally, children should not have to be excluded from a service. So if that gets to be a pattern, then I would take it up through appropriate channels again.

[applesing]

You are not being too sensitive, and the movie is rated PG-13 for a reason! We are very careful, too, about what movies our children watch, and this would definitely upset me! Furthermore, our opinion is that worship time should be family time, so even if there is a "children's church" offered, the worship service should not be rated PG-13.

 

The minister at our previous church used to show similar clips during the sermon, and it was one of the reasons we left and found a new church.

[jujsky]

I'm not Christian, but I'd have a problem with it too. Heck, not everyone even allows their children to watch TV or movies. LOTR is NOT for small children. We didn't let DS watch it until this year and we only let him watch it because he likes scary things and doesn't get nightmares easily. Couldn't the pastor/priest/whatever make the spiritual warfare point in a different way?

[PeacefulChaos]

I thought it would be one clip and then return to the sermon. So we all returned to the sermon. 10 minutes later, another clip. So, I just stayed out because I didn't want to be so disruptive getting up and down. It doesn't happen that often, but I am spitting mad and don't have anywhere to go with it.

Beth

 

I would just contact the pastor. Even if other kids are sitting in and watching PG13 clips, that isn't something that the church should be leading the way with, kwim?

I'd just say something about how I didn't feel that it was appropriate for my children, and I wouldn't have minded leaving service for a short video and returning, but was disappointed to have to miss an entire service because of the videos being spread throughout. I'd mention that maybe, in the future, could the video clips either be more family friendly OR could they all be put together into a clip at the beginning of service?

And then go from there. I hate to see how quickly a lot of people jump to leaving a church. No offense to anyone here - I am just of the mindset that you stick it out and try to work it out for as long as you can. If it gets to the point where you just can't anymore, then you start thinking about moving on. And doing it quietly. :)

[mom4him]

Our church played clips from another PG-13 movie - this time the Lord of the Rings series - during church and there is no kids church, just nursery care. Not nice clips, but pretty graphic evil monster type clips. I spent most of the sermon outside with another homeschooling mom and two of her younger boys. #3ds is pretty visual and we keep him away from that type of stuff because it can give him nightmares. This has happened before (and we went through the right channels but pretty much got told, "there's a point to the movie clip, it's OK") - at least we got a warning beforehand this time. As in, "clips shown today may be disturbing for younger children." Yes, the clips had a point - this time spiritual warfare, but I don't like going to church only to be warned that the sermon may not be for little eyes. Big sigh...My husband doesn't see it to be too big of a deal since there is a good point made. I have trouble with all those little early elementary kids in there seeing it.

 

Beth

 

If I am being too sensitive, let me know- I won't be miffed.

 

I would not be impressed. There may be a spiritual point made but how many 4/5/6/7/8/etc. will really get that point.:tongue_smilie:

 

My dh wouldn't be bothered by it either though.

[FaithManor]

If they want to continue with those types of messages, then I think they need a separate children's church. You can't keep forcing the moms to go stand outside with the kids, that is stupid.

 

 

I completely agree with Mrs. Mungo!

 

One time, one time only, a pastor of a church we attended wanted to show a video clip that he felt had meaning to tie in to his sermon, but he was smart enough to show it to the choir one night at rehearsal to see what we thought. Here's the synopsis:

 

We thought it was completely inappropriate for children under the age of 13 and when he began to bristle a little, we said fine, you go ahead and show it, but rehearsal ends here because none of us will be there to sing that Sunday. I had three young boys at the time and many of the choir members were parents of young children or grandparents of young children. We were unanimous that we would all stay home from church that day if he insisted on showing it.

 

He didn't show it.

 

The choir sang that morning.

 

If the powers that be cannot understand that it is inappropriate to cover information not suitable for children, then they have to do it a different event and offer childcare or they have to start a children's worship service. However, they should also note that not every parent wants their children to worship independent of their parents so they will still need to give a heads up that this is coming so parents have time to leave the auditorium/sanctuary. Should it become an every Sunday morning occurence, I would guess they will lose a lot of attenders.

 

Faith

[Mergath]

Okay. I'm not Christian, so maybe I'm missing some really obvious point, but how in the world does the LotR movie connect to anything Christian? Does Revelations talk about the four Orcs of the Apocalypse? Do some people find themselves possessed by Ring Wraiths? Is liberalism dangerous because you don't want to end up as a bunch of Ent-huggers?

 

I don't get it. :001_huh:

[mrsrevmeg]

I'd be looking for another church. Who cares if the clip is relevant to the message? Movies during a worship service? Not at all appropriate - I don't care what movie you're talking about.

I agree with that. When we go to a church our focus should be on God and His glory. We go to worship, praise, and learn, not to be entertained. There are many ways to make a message relevant to the hearers without the use of pop culture.

[Sparkle]

My opinion - not only are you not being too sensitive, but movie clips don't belong in a worship service. Before or after, but not during the actual worship. Just my opinion. ;)

 

Agree 100%.

 

Heck, I haven't even seen LOTR myself because I hate seeing violence in movies. I know I'm a minority, but still, I would think church would be a safe place where I wouldn't encounter that.

[mommy5]

I agree with that. When we go to a church our focus should be on God and His glory. We go to worship, praise, and learn, not to be entertained. There are many ways to make a message relevant to the hearers without the use of pop culture.

 

:iagree: There was a time when I thought that it would have been fine to show it ... now I think we should be focusing our worship on God and God alone. Not distracted by movies or fun pop culture "stuff". We don't need to add anything to the Gospel to make it more interesting and more relevant.

[ErinE]

IME and IMO, if this is the only way a pastor can make the sermon interesting/educational/visual to the congregation, you need a new church or a new pastor.

 

I can't stand the over-use of visuals. In one church we briefly attended, the pastor flashed a picture of OBL on the screen. I found it off-putting and inappropriate; why allow such evil to intrude on the church's message?

 

ETA: OBL is Osama Bin Laden

 

Okay. I'm not Christian, so maybe I'm missing some really obvious point, but how in the world does the LotR movie connect to anything Christian? Does Revelations talk about the four Orcs of the Apocalypse? Do some people find themselves possessed by Ring Wraiths? Is liberalism dangerous because you don't want to end up as a bunch of Ent-huggers?

 

Tolkien deliberately wrote LOTR as a christian and Catholic story.

Edited August 5, 2012 by ErinE

[PeacefulChaos]

I can't stand the over-use of visuals. In one church we briefly attended, the pastor flashed a picture of OBL on the screen. I found it off-putting and inappropriate; why allow such evil to intrude on the church's message?

 

 

 

Tolkien deliberately wrote LOTR as a christian and Catholic story.

 

OBL? (Sorry, just curious as to what that is.) :)

[Mergath]

 

 

 

Tolkien deliberately wrote LOTR as a christian and Catholic story.

 

Seems to me there's a heck of a lot more Norse mythology in there than Christian mythology.

[PeacefulChaos]

Seems to me there's a heck of a lot more Norse mythology in there than Christian mythology.

 

It is a lot of Norse mythology.

I honestly don't see the Christian thing so much - don't get me wrong, I love the movies, but I just don't see it in any grand Christian context. The biggest thing I notice is the good winning out over evil, but that could be found anywhere. :tongue_smilie:

[*********]

Our church played clips from another PG-13 movie - this time the Lord of the Rings series - during church and there is no kids church, just nursery care. Not nice clips, but pretty graphic evil monster type clips. I spent most of the sermon outside with another homeschooling mom and two of her younger boys. #3ds is pretty visual and we keep him away from that type of stuff because it can give him nightmares. This has happened before (and we went through the right channels but pretty much got told, "there's a point to the movie clip, it's OK") - at least we got a warning beforehand this time. As in, "clips shown today may be disturbing for younger children." Yes, the clips had a point - this time spiritual warfare, but I don't like going to church only to be warned that the sermon may not be for little eyes. Big sigh...My husband doesn't see it to be too big of a deal since there is a good point made. I have trouble with all those little early elementary kids in there seeing it.

 

 

Beth

 

If I am being too sensitive, let me know- I won't be miffed.

 

Didn't read other replies.

 

Um, no, you're not being too sensitive. That's absurd.

 

Yanno, IMHO.

[Mrs Mungo]

You are not being too sensitive, and the movie is rated PG-13 for a reason! We are very careful, too, about what movies our children watch, and this would definitely upset me! Furthermore, our opinion is that worship time should be family time, so even if there is a "children's church" offered, the worship service should not be rated PG-13.

 

Well, I was thinking more of my pastor having a series of sermons on sex in marriage. I actually had another WTMer's dd along with us the morning that series started because she had spent the night, lol. It was definitely PG-13, but our church has a children's church *and* the pastor gave an advanced warning before the sermon.

[bethben]

We've been there and done that---there is no talking to leadership at this point. It's a worldview difference on raising children that will remain unresolved. The first time this happened was with the opening scenes from one of the Batman movies- you know the scene where batman's parents get shot in front of him? We brought it up then and were basically told they wouldn't change it and our kids were going to get that stuff anyway when they got to high school. So, it's something we've got to deal with alone.

Beth

[6wishes]

It's a hard spot they put you in to not have child care, then play inappropriate scenes from a movie not for a child's eyes. I would say good for you on trying to go up the chain the first time around, and good for them for at least putting out this warning the second time around. However, if they are going to continue playing movie clips, and you're not ok with this, and you have voiced your concerns, you and dh now have a decision to make on whether you stay. I can understand once in a while to support a point, but not a graphic, scary clip that would for sure scare children in the service. It seems a lot of churches now do this sort of thing..all part of that "seeker sensitive" service:tongue_smilie:?

[ErinE]

Seems to me there's a heck of a lot more Norse mythology in there than Christian mythology.

 

It was influenced by many different stories, but Tolkien made it clear in letters that it was a Christian story.

 

For PP, OBL is Osama Bin Laden. Got lazy typing...

[PeacefulChaos]

We've been there and done that---there is no talking to leadership at this point. It's a worldview difference on raising children that will remain unresolved. The first time this happened was with the opening scenes from one of the Batman movies- you know the scene where batman's parents get shot in front of him? We brought it up then and were basically told they wouldn't change it and our kids were going to get that stuff anyway when they got to high school. So, it's something we've got to deal with alone.

Beth

 

Hmm. Well, if they aren't willing to at least make things more accommodating even by compromise, then I agree with the PP that it may be time to look at whether or not you should stay there.

You may decide to. There may be tons of positives to go along with a few negatives. I don't think there are any perfect churches out there, by any means! :tongue_smilie: There just comes a point when you have to decide, I guess.

[mommaduck]

My opinion - not only are you not being too sensitive, but movie clips don't belong in a worship service. Before or after, but not during the actual worship. Just my opinion. ;)

:iagree:

 

Do it during a group or something...some other time, some other place. As part of the service or sermon or whatever, NO!

[Chris in VA]

If they want to continue with those types of messages, then I think they need a separate children's church. You can't keep forcing the moms to go stand outside with the kids, that is stupid.

 

:iagree:

[TravelingChris]

One of the churches we were member of had powerpoint presentations. I loved them- they helped me pay attention. I think I had the best attention span at that church. I don't know if he ever put up a photo of Sauron or Golem. I could see the use of modern cultural references to make the Biblical message more visual. On the other hand, that church had nursery and children's service for anyone under 9. I wouldn't have any problems having 9 year olds see LOTR- I think I took my youngest to the movie when she was 7 or 8 (second movie because I thought she may have been too young when the first came out and then she saw that on DVD).

 

BUt then I am a fan of children's services so that more serious topics can be discussed.

[NanceXToo]

I'm not Christian, I don't go to church (or any religious type services), and I do not think you are being overly sensitive. In a place where children under age 13 are known to congregate, NO-ONE other than a parent has a right to decide to expose them to scenes from PG-13 or R rated movies. Not appropriate, and yep, I'd be ticked off (whether it was a church, a school, a camp, or whatever).

[mjselmk]

I'm not religious, nor do we attend church but I would be peeved. It is totally inappropriate to show violence and frightening images to young children, regardless of the message that is intended. My 5 year old son is particularly sensitive and would have been beside himself.

[Kathryn]

I agree with that. When we go to a church our focus should be on God and His glory. We go to worship, praise, and learn, not to be entertained. There are many ways to make a message relevant to the hearers without the use of pop culture.

 

:iagree: I can't think of any reason it would be necessary to show this. A few times, our former priest talked about movies. A few times, we were told that younger children might want to be sent to childrens chapel during the sermon. But, those times were for a Biblical topic, not a pop culture viewing. We go to church to worship and learn about our religion, not to expose ourselves or our children to pop culture.

 

I'm not Christian, I don't go to church (or any religious type services), and I do not think you are being overly sensitive. In a place where children under age 13 are known to congregate, NO-ONE other than a parent has a right to decide to expose them to scenes from PG-13 or R rated movies. Not appropriate, and yep, I'd be ticked off (whether it was a church, a school, a camp, or whatever).

 

:iagree:

[Cricket]

:iagree:I'd be looking for another church. Who cares if the clip is relevant to the message? Movies during a worship service? Not at all appropriate - I don't care what movie you're talking about.

 

:iagree: I'd say it is time to find another church. Leaders in a church should be fostering unity among the body, not making it necessary for parents with young children to be getting up and down to leave the service. And if the pastors value the ability to play movie clips (and disturbing ones at that) during a service over members of the body, then that is tragic.

 

I know it is becoming a popular practice but it is still surprising to me that any pastor would think he is helping to preach the Gospel by showing clips of Hollywood movies. The Gospel is powerful enough on its own, imo. If a pastor can only use movies as examples, then he should probably spend a little more time studying the Bible and less time watching movies. If you are really into movies, then start a group to watch and discuss movies--there's value in that--but keep them out of the worship service. Good grief!

 

I'm feeling very opinionated today. :001_smile:

[Bonkers247]

I would be bothered by this, too. Our ex-church wanted to show the crucifixion scene from The Passion of Christ. I raised a stink about it. The kids were going to be in there for it and I didn't think it was appropriate.

[Vanna]

Our church played clips from another PG-13 movie - this time the Lord of the Rings series - during church and there is no kids church, just nursery care. Not nice clips, but pretty graphic evil monster type clips. I spent most of the sermon outside with another homeschooling mom and two of her younger boys. #3ds is pretty visual and we keep him away from that type of stuff because it can give him nightmares. This has happened before (and we went through the right channels but pretty much got told, "there's a point to the movie clip, it's OK") - at least we got a warning beforehand this time. As in, "clips shown today may be disturbing for younger children." Yes, the clips had a point - this time spiritual warfare, but I don't like going to church only to be warned that the sermon may not be for little eyes. Big sigh...My husband doesn't see it to be too big of a deal since there is a good point made. I have trouble with all those little early elementary kids in there seeing it.

 

Beth

 

If I am being too sensitive, let me know- I won't be miffed.

 

 

IMO, no, you are not being too sensitive. I think it would be totally fine for you to find a new church that doesn't show video clips during worship services (there are many, many of them out there).

[bethben]

They did show scenes from the Passion of the Christ - every Easter it seems. My daughter loves reading about Jesus dying on a cross but seems to be more obsessed with the blood aspect of it - to the point that she plays Jesus dying on the cross with her friends and she needs "chalk blood" for the realistic aspect of it (try explaining that to the neighbors!). The children's books we read to her are very tame in the blood aspect.

 

Beth

[Soror]

Personally I don't have a problem w/ LoTR that in itself wouldn't bother me. However, I don't think it appropriate in church and especially when the pastor is deliberately ignoring the thoughts and opinions of the members.

[MiniBlondes]

Hmmm, I wonder if we go to the same church. :001_huh:

 

Would this happen to be a multi-site campus church?

[bethben]

Nope- we're small town MN. There are sister churches, but I have no idea what they do.

Beth

[LucyStoner]

I am not even vaguely conservative and I would not be ok with this. Not P-13 for kiddos and frankly not with videos during a sermon at a church service. The pastor where we go is very compelling, insightful and engaging without movies of any kind. I would be looking elsewhere.

[besroma]

My opinion - not only are you not being too sensitive, but movie clips don't belong in a worship service. Before or after, but not during the actual worship. Just my opinion. ;)

 

:iagree:I'd be looking for another church. Who cares if the clip is relevant to the message? Movies during a worship service? Not at all appropriate - I don't care what movie you're talking about.

 

 

In complete agreement.

[bethben]

This is also me...I hate leaving churches - so does my husband. I'm not sure what's going on and I'm not sure it's going to be better anywhere we go. I'm starting to wonder if homeschooling and protecting children's innocence for the most part is soooooo off the beaten path, we will never fit in anywhere and I should just count my losses and move on. We live in a small college town and our church is considered fairly conservative because we have the gall to believe that the Bible is God's word. I haven't felt we were that counter cultural until this past year or so. I don't want to hide in a homeschool bubble world.

 

Just so you know - my 12 year old has seen LOTR only because my husband felt he was ready. We decided to show him those movies because he could handle them. He stayed in church today because he had already seen them. I don't like someone else - especially a church deciding for us when our children can handle seeing disturbing images. We have TVs, but will watch programs (like the Olympics for example now) with the remote in hand because the station's ads for upcoming programing is so violent at times.

 

Beth

Edited August 6, 2012 by bethben

[Remudamom]

You don't watch movies during church service. IMO that's one of the many things wrong with churches today, and why we drive three hours round trip on Sundays to attend our church.