Why do discussions seem to be limited to "public school" and exclude private school?

[HeidiKC]

ETA: Think I should clarify that I don't mean this to be a discussion of whether or not public schools are worse than private (some are, some aren't)...I mentioned that below because I thought MAYBE that's why people refer to "public school", implying that other private/parochial schools are markedly different. I am just trying to understand why the distinction in almost any discussion here regarding what I consider to just be "school".

 

I have always been perplexed and confused about this. A recent thread made me wonder again. It asked how many homeschoolers are homeschooling after having pulled their kids from public school? What about those of us who have pulled our kids from private/parochial school for probably similar reasons? Some of these reasons might be academic, social, learning difficulties, problems with teachers, allergies, just not liking the atmosphere or curriculum or assignments. These things apply to all schools, not just public schools.

 

I guess the only thing I can think of is that some Christians don't like the public school influence, but I don't know how it would be that different from a secular private school. Or maybe it is because some perceive public school as inferior to private schools? But several of the public school systems in our area are fantastic, and I'd guess maybe better than my kids' Catholic school (that is a very good school, "blue ribbon award", excellent test scores, etc.). So I'm not understand lumping all public school as bad or different from private.

 

So do people have a different perception of public vs. private/parochial? I just don't get asking questions about "public school" instead of just "school". Do most people assume private/parochial schools wouldn't drive them to homeschool or something? Genuine curiosity, nothing rude meant by this. I just don't get it. It's almost like a difference in vocabulary. I don't even think in terms of "public school", I just think "school". Is "public school" mainly a term used by conservative Christians? Sorry if I sound dumb, this is all just news to me. When I see discussions about "public school" and a lot of what is being said certainly applies to our reasons for homeschooling or situation, I want to say: "yeah, me too. But ds went to a Catholic school, does that count?!"

Edited June 15, 2012 by HeidiKC

[TravelingChris]

If my dd wanted to go to either Public school here or private school here, we would have let her. The high school she would have gone to is a good school as is the even closer private school. She wanted to be home because with her giftedness and LD, one on one tutoring is best. SHe also goes to classes with other kids and so has that experience too. But she has been adamant that for the very important subjects for her- math and science, she wants to do them at home so she can really learn it well. It has nothing to do with bad schools locally.

[HeidiKC]

If my dd wanted to go to either Public school here or private school here, we would have let her. The high school she would have gone to is a good school as is the even closer private school. She wanted to be home because with her giftedness and LD, one on one tutoring is best. SHe also goes to classes with other kids and so has that experience too. But she has been adamant that for the very important subjects for her- math and science, she wants to do them at home so she can really learn it well. It has nothing to do with bad schools locally.

 

Right, but so I'm just confused about why people discuss public schools instead of schools in general.

[marbel]

My guess is that for most people, public school is the default choice and what most (Americans, anyway) think first when they think of school at all. Anyone educating their kids outside the public school system is counter-cultural, with homeschooling perhaps being the most counter-cultural of all.

 

Thinking about my own experience, I know very few homeschoolers who ever pulled their kids out of any type of private school. I know some Catholic homeschoolers who never went to school, but none who went to Catholic school and then were homeschooled. My experience isn't a very big sample, of course. ;)

[LucyStoner]

I think people likely say public school because that is the "largest show in town." 9 in 10 kids who attend school in the US attend a public school.

 

Some people homeschool because private school is not an option.

 

Still other people may just have a strong distaste for public school because of their philosophical issues with government funded things in general.

 

I totally get that private and public schools can have many of the same issues that might get someone thinking about homeschooling. I would say just speak up on those threads when you feel like it.

 

While my son did attend school for 2 years, we have since come to the conclusion that for him it was not that these particular schools were so bad, it is that he is best off being homeschooled. So I don't talk a lot about school because at this time it is not an alternative that we would consider (public or private) and it's been 2 years so the anger at those schools he did attend is just not part of our lives anymore.

Edited June 15, 2012 by kijipt

[HeidiKC]

My guess is that for most people, public school is the default choice and what most (Americans, anyway) think first when they think of school at all. Anyone educating their kids outside the public school system is counter-cultural, with homeschooling perhaps being the most counter-cultural of all.

 

Thinking about my own experience, I know very few homeschoolers who ever pulled their kids out of any type of private school. I know some Catholic homeschoolers who never went to school, but none who went to Catholic school and then were homeschooled. My experience isn't a very big sample, of course. ;)

 

OK, that makes sense! And I guess you're right - I've never know anyone other than myself who pulled kids from Catholic school to homeschool! Kind of interesting. I wonder why that is? I suppose it is mainly the bad public schools that kids are pulled from, and there aren't as many bad Catholic/private schools.

 

But it isn't just kids that are pulled from school. It seems like any time there is any discussion about school (what time kids get home, friends from school), it is more often than not referred to as "public school". I dunno, I guess it doesn't matter. I've just always been perplexed by it!

[HeidiKC]

I have no experience with private schools. So what can I really say about them?

 

That said, when I am comparing homeschooling with schooling I mean public or private schooling. It's not an omission for any reason other than I don't bother to list all possibilities.

 

Right - that's why I just say "school/schooling" - it includes all. No reason to list all possibilities. I don't get only saying "public school".

 

I'm sure there are many more important things going on in the world, or even that I should do around here like fold the laundry! Thanks!

[GSOchristie]

I always call it "traditional school" to mean public, private, charter, etc.

[Bluegoat]

I think it is a lot harder to generalize about private schools. There are private schools that offer a pretty good classical education, ones that are arts based low key schools, religious and secular, sports based schools, ones for kids with learning issues, ones with classes of 20 and ones with mixed age classes of 10...

 

But most people don't even have all those choices near them, even if they could afford them. And the reasons for liking or not liking such a school could vary pretty widely.

[angela in ohio]

I think many people say public school when they mean school in general. And in some places, there are no private schools (my hometown, for example,) so that wouldn't even be on their radar.

[LisaKinVA]

In our area, private schools aren't an option. The only one I would be willing to send our children is 45 minutes away *and* $22,000 a year per student. It's homeschool or public school. There are other private schools, but they are Abeka or BJU only types of schools...and honestly, if I'm going to do all Abeka or BJU, I can do it for much less than the private schools.

[Ellie]

In most cases, I think it's just easier to write "public school" than "private or public school." :-)

 

I also took my dd out of a private Christian school to begin homeschooling. She was there because Mr. Ellie and I have no faith in the public school system. However, many of the reasons I prefer homeschooling have to do with the one-on-one of homeschooling versus the group-think/instruction of *any* age-segregated classroom situations, public or private.

 

Using "public school" instead of also including "private school" doesn't bug me. I have other issues. :D

[Avila]

OK, that makes sense! And I guess you're right - I've never know anyone other than myself who pulled kids from Catholic school to homeschool! Kind of interesting. I wonder why that is? I suppose it is mainly the bad public schools that kids are pulled from, and there aren't as many bad Catholic/private schools.

 

But it isn't just kids that are pulled from school. It seems like any time there is any discussion about school (what time kids get home, friends from school), it is more often than not referred to as "public school". I dunno, I guess it doesn't matter. I've just always been perplexed by it!

 

I pulled my oldest from Catholic school to homeschool, and so did one of my best friends. So now you know you are not alone. :001_smile:

 

Where we were before, there were not very many school options, and when our parish school did not work for us, homeschool was the only option left that we felt comfortable with. Public school in that district was not an option.

 

Catholic school where I am now seems great, but it is three times more expensive! I would be working full time just to afford three kids in elementary. And there is no possibility of us affording Catholic high school. So in this area, private schools are often ruled out on cost alone. It doesn't matter how great the school is if no one can afford to send children to it.

[lionfamily1999]

My guess is that for most people, public school is the default choice

... ;)

This

 

I think it is a lot harder to generalize about private schools.

 

And this.

 

Public school is standard, there is very little choice involved. Private schools run the gambit, if they're in the area and you have the money you can choose what sort of education your child gets, this makes it closer to hsing, imo. Even as a card carrying PTA mom and constant volunteer I just had to go along with what the ps system wanted to do. I couldn't even request what teachers ds and dd had. The private school a few blocks from my house lets parents decide what their kids are doing and when you volunteer you actually get to have a vote in what and how things are done. Even in less democratic private schools parental control and choice is pivotal in what your child does, because you get to choose the school with a curriculum that works best for your child.

 

Imo, it is choice that separates the two.

[catz]

In most cases, I think it's just easier to write "public school" than "private or public school." :-)

 

:iagree: I don't think it's an intentional oversight. Like the general public, when people start looking at schools, most kids attend a public school. My oldest attended 2 years of public school. We looked at about 20 schools, public and private, trying to figure out a good fit for him but then came around to homeschooling. We're secular, and other than a smaller class size, I didn't see any huge advantage to the private schools in our area compared to our high achieving public school for our son who needs to be quite accelerated (in some areas, but is age level in other areas). There was some additional enrichment (music, art, language), but we tend to provide that anyways and they usually aren't as high quality as going out and having something like private music lessons anyway.

 

In many ways, public schools are better locally for out of the box learners (gifted or LD). I know families locally who've pulled from PS or private school to homeschool for various reasons.

Edited June 15, 2012 by kck

[TravelingChris]

I have known quite a lot of homeschoolers who came from private schools to homeschooling. Without thinking too much, it is more than ten. Now I have been homeschooling for 18 years and in many locations, so I do know more homeschoolers than the average person. But I do know people who have left Catholic schools, Christian schools, Lutheran schools, and private schools with no religion involved.

[AndyJoy]

I think people refer to "public school" because it is the default, easy-to-abbreviate choice with which most people have some personal experience.

 

I personally am planning to homeschool for reasons that would preclude private school as well. When I am discussing this with people I will explain my objections to refer to "brick-and-mortar" or "traditional" school because if I generalize and say PS, I would get a lot of, "Well why not ABC Christian School or XYZ Prep School?" responses. Some of my reasons are due to the core of the schooling style, not just the student climate (which isn't necessarily much better at private school IME).

[Heidi @ Mt Hope]

My guess is that for most people, public school is the default choice and what most (Americans, anyway) think first when they think of school at all. Anyone educating their kids outside the public school system is counter-cultural, with homeschooling perhaps being the most counter-cultural of all.

 

 

:iagree: And I agree with a pp that public schools are easier to generalize than private schools. Everyone has public schools available to them. Not everyone has private schools available or could afford them, not to mention that the quality (and focus) of private schools vary widely.

 

My sister pulled her kids out of a local private school when they were in 3rd and 5th grades. She felt that it was expensive and so time-consuming for how ineffective it was. She was having to work one-on-one with her youngest in the evenings on multiple subjects that he was struggling with (not to mention that he was a hands-on sort of boy who wasn't cut out for sitting in a desk all day) and add subjects to challenge her oldest, but they were both tired after full days of school. And the transportation, paperwork, volunteer hours, and all the other miscellaneous duties were ridiculous.

[HeidiKC]

I always call it "traditional school" to mean public, private, charter, etc.

 

yes, this makes sense.

[HeidiKC]

In most cases, I think it's just easier to write "public school" than "private or public school." :-)

 

Right, I wasn't hoping people would write "private or public school". I just don't get why they specify "public" instead of just plain old "school". I'm not saying it even really bugs me, I'm just trying to understand why public is being specified to the exclusion of others. I think this thread is helping. My intention is not to criticize anyone for saying "public school", I just want to understand why. Thanks to all, I think I'm getting it now.

Edited June 15, 2012 by HeidiKC

[Ellie]

Right, I wasn't hoping people would write "private or public school". I just don't get why they specify "public" instead of just plain old "school". I'm not saying it even really bugs me, I'm just trying to understand why public is being specified to the exclusion of others. I think this thread is helping. My intention is not to criticize anyone for saying "public school", I just want to understand why. Thanks to all, I think I'm getting it now.

"Public" isn't being specified to the exclusion of others. :) We don't think you're criticizing anyone. :) And you know what? Some people think "homeschool" if you just say "school." Really. Go figure.:confused:

 

And more people have withdrawn their dc from public school than public school; public school is also the norm for people who don't homeschool. It's just more natural to say "public school." :)

[Parrothead]

I've seen other than homeschooling described as public school, brick and mortar school, outside school, and others. I think public school is just what most people will default to so they don't have to type out every option available.

[Spy Car]

I'm just happy when people don't call it "institutional" school :D

 

Bill

[Reeciecup]

I think people say it because it's simpler. If you just said "school" people might be offended because homeschooling is school. So they have to differentiate from home school, and it's easier to default to public school. It's the most common place to get an education, so that's what people think about. Sometimes it's just PS which could mean public or private, but my mind goes straight to public when I see that.

[Dmmetler]

I use PS just as a shorthand for traditional school. Actually, I pulled my DD from parochial school (LCMS), and another family in my homeschool group pulled their children from a Catholic parochial school. Really, the reasons we pulled our kids weren't any different than those who pulled their kids from public school, except that I HAVE noticed we have an easier time buying homeschool curriculum, because private school tuition makes Sonlight Box day look cheap!

[Jean in Newcastle]

Right - that's why I just say "school/schooling" - it includes all. No reason to list all possibilities. I don't get only saying "public school".

 

I'm sure there are many more important things going on in the world, or even that I should do around here like fold the laundry! Thanks!

 

Because school/schooling includes homeschool. Brick and mortar school would probably say it best, though our home is in a building!

[angela in ohio]

Because school/schooling includes homeschool. Brick and mortar school would probably say it best, though our home is in a building!

 

Yep.

[AuntieM]

Well, here's a theory from another angle:

Some people don't want to bash their own exit plan.

 

I know many, many hsers who decide they either can't or don't want to continue home schooling, and send their children on to private school. For many this is the plan all along, to school at home for a spell and then transition them to a more traditional school setting. So it would be disingenuous to bash private schools. However, many of these same people have already determined that public school would never be an acceptable option for their families (for whatever reason), so speaking out against that system is okay.

 

For whoever's counting, I also know several families who have pulled kids out of private school to begin home schooling. I also know families that bounce their kids between public and private schools, mostly for sports opportunities offered by the larger schools.

[Tarreymere]

If I thought about it at all I guess I thought that maybe since people have to pay out of pocket for a private school that the private school would be more likely to try and meet the needs of the students enrolled there. Or that since parents pay the school directly they would have more influence over what goes on at the school.

 

 

As opposed to my experience of public school which has been more of a 'what we offer is what your kid needs and we know better than you what that is' kind of thing.

 

 

The public schools I attended as a child were not good schools, and the public schools in the area I now live in are not good schools. There are very few private schools in my area and the only one I am familiar with was not very good academically and though small it seemed a lot of kids were enrolled because they had gotten into trouble at the public school or were expelled. I haven't had a chance to form an opinion on B&M schools in general really, since I've never had any experience with good ones. I've just spent a lot of time trying to avoid bad ones and my only real options (besides moving) have been cyber schools and homeschooling.

[HeidiKC]

I think people say it because it's simpler. If you just said "school" people might be offended because homeschooling is school. So they have to differentiate from home school, and it's easier to default to public school.

 

YES! This is a great explanation and I think you're exactly right!

[Lang Syne Boardie]

Well, here's a theory from another angle:

Some people don't want to bash their own exit plan.

 

Interesting theory!

[Farrar]

I've worked in public and private schools... I think they operate with marked differences. At the private school where I worked, if we needed to make an allowance for a specific child, situation, or family, then we were free to do so. In public schools, they often are simply not. In the private school where I worked, if we saw that the curriculum wasn't working, we could change it. If parents gave input, we could take it or not. Public schools are so large and ruled by so many layers of bureaucracy... they just have so little control over anything.

 

I don't think this means that public schools are worse (some of that bureaucracy is a safeguard against idiocy) necessarily. But it does mean that public school means a certain sort of school and private school can mean almost anything, from a tiny, liberal one room school of expedition learning and no grades to a huge, traditional, religious school where everyone sits in rows and recites lessons.

 

I'm just happy when people don't call it "institutional" school :D

 

Bill

 

I never hear people call it that here though! I wish. That would be my preferred term! :D

[Ellie]

If I thought about it at all I guess I thought that maybe since people have to pay out of pocket for a private school that the private school would be more likely to try and meet the needs of the students enrolled there. Or that since parents pay the school directly they would have more influence over what goes on at the school.

:lol::lol::lol:

 

There may be *some* private schools that do that, but for the most part, no, they don't. None of the above.

 

 

As opposed to my experience of public school which has been more of a 'what we offer is what your kid needs and we know better than you what that is' kind of thing.

Which is what most private schools do. They figure that people choose them because they like how the school is run, or what instructional materials or methods are being used; otherwise, they'd choose a different school.

[fhjmom]

I always call it "traditional school" to mean public, private, charter, etc.

 

I also tend to use the term "traditional school" when the discussion would apply to any B&M classroom setting. DS did attend a private Christian school before we started homeschooling and many of his classmates are now also homeschooling. I am not anti-traditional-schooling at all, I just feel like we have to opportunity right now to do something that fits our family better.

[fhjmom]

:lol::lol::lol:

 

There may be *some* private schools that do that, but for the most part, no, they don't. None of the above.

 

 

 

Which is what most private schools do. They figure that people choose them because they like how the school is run, or what instructional materials or methods are being used; otherwise, they'd choose a different school.

 

I agree! One of the main reasons we decided to homeschool was that the private school that DS attended did not want to accept DD because of her hearing loss (even though she was mainstreamed, on age level, and the public school would provide additional support). Private schools are not under the same obligation to accept students with learning differences, disabilities, etc. not make any accomodtions for students. I have found that private schools are actually much more likely than public schools to expect students to "fit their mold". Public schools are required to try RTI, evaluate for disabilities, and they also are more likely to offer gifted and talented tracks as well.

[Tarreymere]

:lol: Guess that private schools haven't figured out basic business precepts yet, like 'the customer is always right'. Seems counterintuitive, doesn't it?

[Mommy22alyns]

I haven't read any comments, but I just say "public school" because it's simpler than always saying "public/private school."

[Mama Geek]

There is a difference between public and private schools. I would consider in general that the private schools are better than the public schools. I don't think much of education degrees, I have seen too much in college. That doesn't mean that there aren't great teachers with education degrees, there are and I have some really great friends that are teachers that I highly respect. I am sure there are some things that a good private school could offer that dh and I won't be able to, but I think there is so much more that dh and I can offer dd than a private school can.

 

I have an engineering degree with lots of experience in the workforce. Dh and I are both strong in science and math, we have read a ton on many and various topics throughout our lives, we travel we meet lots of different people. We have lots of hobbies that we enjoy and want to expose her to. I really don't have a desire to go back to the stress of working and a good percent of money that I would earn would to to a private school. I would much rather stay home with dd and school her. If I had the opportunity for her to go into one of the feeder schools for Harvard or Yale on a free ride, would we take it? We would at least consider it. Since that is not likely to happen our plan is to homeschool until she starts college.

[Dealea86]

I haven't read the replies, but my DH went to a private school for middle school. He unequivocally states that a Christian private school is not any better than public school as far as peer influence goes. There was a lot of bad stuff going on in his private school. And while the academics were good, the academics in his public high school were pretty good, too.

 

In other words, in his mind (and he's experienced both) public and private both have their downsides. If we had to put kids in school, he'd prefer a private school... but it would only win out because our public schools aren't that great here.

[Crimson Wife]

We will likely do private school (either online or classroom-based) for my kids' high school. The main problem I have with PS is the lack of academic rigor in most, and that isn't an issue in the private schools we are considering. Our zoned middle and high schools also have problems with gangs and a high rate of teen pregnancy, and the private schools we are considering don't have those either. The same selectivity in admissions that allows for rigorous coureswork also tends to keep out the gang members and future teen moms.

[Spock]

Right, but so I'm just confused about why people discuss public schools instead of schools in general.

 

I don't say "school" when I mean public/private/institutional/group school, because that implies that homeschool isn't "real" school, and my kids get enough of that attitude in Sunday School and from my husband's sisters. For me, "school" means "whatever form of education the family has chosen or defaulted to", and thus doesn't really narrow anything down. I do often say "public school" as shorthand for "school outside the home involving students from several families", and I suspect that most of the time when you see the word on homeschool forums that is the way it is being used.

 

(Some unschoolers and probably some other homeschoolers don't like referring to what they do as "school", so they would mean "group school" when they use the word.)

 

I would feel free to respond with your experiences on threads asking about public school experience, reasons for leaving/supplementing, etc. Most of the time private school experiences are relevant to those questions, and if they are not the original post will probably make that clear by what is being asked.

[kalanamak]

Thinking about this, I assume that public schools are a bit more uniform, and that private schools vary more. Some are religious, some are "progressive", some are Prep schools, etc. It is harder to generalize.

 

 

I may be wrong, but that is the underlying assumption I work with.